My first app with xcode - critisism

[tominated]

Hi
I just made this app with xcode after reading a tutorial on o'rielly's mac dev center about how to make a web browser. i customised it a bit, and would like to know if it is any good. it is my first [working] program, so be nice

[Soulstorm]

It doesn't open for me on my iMac G4 OS X 10.4.8. It bounces a few times and it quits.

This is from the crash reporter at Console:

**********

Host Name: ioannis-sotirious-imac
Date/Time: 2006-11-26 10:36:23.582 +0200
OS Version: 10.4.8 (Build 8L127)
Report Version: 4

Command: Tominator Browser
Path: /Users/soulstorm/Desktop/Tominator Browser - beta 1.1.app/Contents/MacOS/Tominator Browser
Parent: WindowServer [65]

Version: ??? (1.0)

PID: 228
Thread: 0

Exception: EXC_BAD_ACCESS (0x0001)
Codes: KERN_PROTECTION_FAILURE (0x0002) at 0x00000000

Thread 0 Crashed:
0 <<00000000>> 0x00000000 0 + 0
1 ...urcompany.Tominator Browser 0x000025d4 start + 60

Thread 0 crashed with PPC Thread State 64:
srr0: 0x0000000000000000 srr1: 0x000000004000d030 vrsave: 0x0000000000000000
cr: 0x42000442 xer: 0x0000000000000004 lr: 0x000000000000272c ctr: 0x0000000000000000
r0: 0x000000000000272c r1: 0x00000000bffffba0 r2: 0x00000000a0001fac r3: 0x0000000000000002
r4: 0x00000000bffffc5c r5: 0x00000000bffffc68 r6: 0x00000000ffffffff r7: 0x0000000000000000
r8: 0x0000000000000000 r9: 0x0000000000000000 r10: 0x0000000090001520 r11: 0x00000000a00061ec
r12: 0x0000000000000000 r13: 0x0000000000000000 r14: 0x0000000000000000 r15: 0x0000000000000000
r16: 0x0000000000000000 r17: 0x0000000000000000 r18: 0x0000000000000000 r19: 0x0000000000000000
r20: 0x0000000000000000 r21: 0x0000000000000000 r22: 0x0000000000000000 r23: 0x0000000000000000
r24: 0x0000000000000000 r25: 0x0000000000000000 r26: 0x00000000bffffc58 r27: 0x000000000000000c
r28: 0x0000000000000002 r29: 0x00000000bffffc5c r30: 0x00000000bffffc68 r31: 0x00000000000025ec

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0x908dc000 - 0x908dcfff com.apple.CoreServices 10.4 (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreServices.framework/Versions/A/CoreServices
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0x90b6e000 - 0x90b80fff libauto.dylib /usr/lib/libauto.dylib
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0x90ec4000 - 0x90f44fff com.apple.CoreServices.OSServices 4.1 /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/OSServices.framework/Versions/A/OSServices
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0x914f6000 - 0x914f6fff com.apple.ApplicationServices 10.4 (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/ApplicationServices
0x914f8000 - 0x91530fff com.apple.AE 1.5 (297) /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/AE.framework/Versions/A/AE
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**********

Host Name: ioannis-sotirious-imac
Date/Time: 2006-11-26 10:36:37.917 +0200
OS Version: 10.4.8 (Build 8L127)
Report Version: 4

Command: Tominator Browser
Path: /Users/soulstorm/Desktop/Tominator Browser - beta 1.1.app/Contents/MacOS/Tominator Browser
Parent: WindowServer [65]

Version: ??? (1.0)

PID: 231
Thread: 0

Exception: EXC_BAD_ACCESS (0x0001)
Codes: KERN_PROTECTION_FAILURE (0x0002) at 0x00000000

Thread 0 Crashed:
0 <<00000000>> 0x00000000 0 + 0
1 ...urcompany.Tominator Browser 0x000025d4 start + 60

Thread 0 crashed with PPC Thread State 64:
srr0: 0x0000000000000000 srr1: 0x000000004000d030 vrsave: 0x0000000000000000
cr: 0x42000442 xer: 0x0000000000000004 lr: 0x000000000000272c ctr: 0x0000000000000000
r0: 0x000000000000272c r1: 0x00000000bffffba0 r2: 0x00000000a0001fac r3: 0x0000000000000002
r4: 0x00000000bffffc5c r5: 0x00000000bffffc68 r6: 0x00000000ffffffff r7: 0x0000000000000000
r8: 0x0000000000000000 r9: 0x0000000000000000 r10: 0x0000000090001520 r11: 0x00000000a00061ec
r12: 0x0000000000000000 r13: 0x0000000000000000 r14: 0x0000000000000000 r15: 0x0000000000000000
r16: 0x0000000000000000 r17: 0x0000000000000000 r18: 0x0000000000000000 r19: 0x0000000000000000
r20: 0x0000000000000000 r21: 0x0000000000000000 r22: 0x0000000000000000 r23: 0x0000000000000000
r24: 0x0000000000000000 r25: 0x0000000000000000 r26: 0x00000000bffffc58 r27: 0x000000000000000c
r28: 0x0000000000000002 r29: 0x00000000bffffc5c r30: 0x00000000bffffc68 r31: 0x00000000000025ec

Binary Images Description:
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0x918c6000 - 0x918e7fff com.apple.LangAnalysis 1.6.1 /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/LangAnalysis.framework/Versions/A/LangAnalysis
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0x91991000 - 0x919a5fff com.apple.speech.synthesis.framework 3.3 /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/SpeechSynthesis.framework/Versions/A/SpeechSynthesis
0x919b3000 - 0x919f5fff com.apple.ImageIO.framework 1.5.0 /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/ImageIO.framework/Versions/A/ImageIO
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0x95bfe000 - 0x95c94fff com.apple.JavaScriptCore 418.3 /System/Library/Frameworks/WebKit.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/JavaScriptCore.framework/Versions/A/JavaScriptCore
0x95cd1000 - 0x95fddfff com.apple.WebCore 418.21 /System/Library/Frameworks/WebKit.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/WebCore.framework/Versions/A/WebCore
0x96166000 - 0x9618ffff libxslt.1.dylib /usr/lib/libxslt.1.dylib
0x96a8c000 - 0x96a8dfff com.apple.zerolink 1.2 (3) /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/ZeroLink.framework/Versions/A/ZeroLink

**********

Host Name: ioannis-sotirious-imac
Date/Time: 2006-11-26 10:42:53.708 +0200
OS Version: 10.4.8 (Build 8L127)
Report Version: 4

Command: Tominator Browser
Path: /Users/soulstorm/Desktop/Tominator Browser - beta 1.1.app/Contents/MacOS/Tominator Browser
Parent: WindowServer [65]

Version: ??? (1.0)

PID: 258
Thread: 0

Exception: EXC_BAD_ACCESS (0x0001)
Codes: KERN_PROTECTION_FAILURE (0x0002) at 0x00000000

Thread 0 Crashed:
0 <<00000000>> 0x00000000 0 + 0
1 ...urcompany.Tominator Browser 0x000025d4 start + 60

Thread 0 crashed with PPC Thread State 64:
srr0: 0x0000000000000000 srr1: 0x000000004200f030 vrsave: 0x0000000000000000
cr: 0x42000442 xer: 0x0000000000000004 lr: 0x000000000000272c ctr: 0x0000000000000000
r0: 0x000000000000272c r1: 0x00000000bffffba0 r2: 0x00000000a0001fac r3: 0x0000000000000002
r4: 0x00000000bffffc5c r5: 0x00000000bffffc68 r6: 0x00000000ffffffff r7: 0x0000000000000000
r8: 0x0000000000000000 r9: 0x0000000000000000 r10: 0x0000000090001520 r11: 0x00000000a00061ec
r12: 0x0000000000000000 r13: 0x0000000000000000 r14: 0x0000000000000000 r15: 0x0000000000000000
r16: 0x0000000000000000 r17: 0x0000000000000000 r18: 0x0000000000000000 r19: 0x0000000000000000
r20: 0x0000000000000000 r21: 0x0000000000000000 r22: 0x0000000000000000 r23: 0x0000000000000000
r24: 0x0000000000000000 r25: 0x0000000000000000 r26: 0x00000000bffffc58 r27: 0x000000000000000c
r28: 0x0000000000000002 r29: 0x00000000bffffc5c r30: 0x00000000bffffc68 r31: 0x00000000000025ec

Binary Images Description:
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0x914f6000 - 0x914f6fff com.apple.ApplicationServices 10.4 (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/ApplicationServices
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... And this is from the console.log
ZeroLink: could not load .o file: /Users/thomasbrunoli/Tominator Browser/build/Tominator Browser.build/Debug/Tominator Browser.build/Objects-normal/ppc/main.ob
Nov 26 10:36:41 ioannis-sotirious-imac crashdump[232]: Tominator Browser crashed
Nov 26 10:36:42 ioannis-sotirious-imac crashdump[232]: crash report written to: /Users/soulstorm/Library/Logs/CrashReporter/Tominator Browser.crash.log
ZeroLink: could not load .o file: /Users/thomasbrunoli/Tominator Browser/build/Tominator Browser.build/Debug/Tominator Browser.build/Objects-normal/ppc/main.ob
Nov 26 10:42:57 ioannis-sotirious-imac crashdump[259]: Tominator Browser crashed
Nov 26 10:42:58 ioannis-sotirious-imac crashdump[259]: crash report written to: /Users/soulstorm/Library/Logs/CrashReporter/Tominator Browser.crash.log

[tominated]

it looks like it has something to do with that zero link thing, i'll try and fix it. it could also have something to do with maybe you not having webkit?

[tominated]

try using this version

[HexMonkey]

It still doesn't work. Is your build configuration set to Deployment (Project > Set Active Build Configuration > Deployment)?

[iMeowbot]

Still crashing with the address at zeroes, so who knows why. Are you setting it up for a deployment build and all that dreary business?

[Eraserhead]

It still doesn't work. Is your build configuration set to Deployment (Project > Set Active Build Configuration > Deployment)?

It's now (Project > Set Active Build Configuration > Release) ;)

[HexMonkey]

It's now (Project > Set Active Build Configuration > Release) ;)

I thought something didn't look right; I had an older project open at the time so it used the old configuration names.

[psychofreak]

Yep..doesn't work for me either

[tominated]

if this doesn't work, i don't know what will
here it is (http://heartlessclan.110mb.com/Tominator%20Browser.zip)

[psychofreak]

if this doesn't work, i don't know what will
here it is (http://heartlessclan.110mb.com/Tominator%20Browser.zip)

It doesn't!

[iMeowbot]

Still trouble :(

I tried running the executable inside the bundle just for kicks, and get:

ZeroLink: could not load .o file: /Users/thomasbrunoli/Tominator Browser/build/Tominator Browser.build/Release/Tominator Browser.build/Objects-normal/ppc/main.ob

…so it still looks as though this may still be the development build (as in options, not location).

[tominated]

DAMNIT!!!
stupid xcode...

...maybe i should go back to doing flash and html
still looks as though this may still be the development build
do you think it would have anything to do with that zero link feature?

[Eraserhead]

do you think it would have anything to do with that zero link feature?

Yes, as iMeowbot said in the post above yours, set the build correctly and we'll be happy to have a play.

[maxrobertson]

It wouldn't open for me either

[elppa]

if this doesn't work, i don't know what will
here it is (http://heartlessclan.110mb.com/Tominator%20Browser.zip)

Does it open on your computer.

Surely you can tell?

[Eraserhead]

I have an idea, post the whole Xcode project folder in a zip and we'll compile it ourselves, if it won't fit on the forums try using YouSendIt (http://www.yousendit.com/), or something.

[tominated]

Does it open on your computer.

Surely you can tell?

it works fine on my imac.
i'll post the xcode project folder asap

[tominated]

here is the folder (http://www.filecrunch.com/file/6xd)
can someone have a look at it and see what i am doing wrong?

[HexMonkey]

The build configuration is still set to Debug, which prevents it working on any other computer. You need to chose Project > Set Active Build Configuration > Release and then rebuild.

[tominated]

The build configuration is still set to Debug, which prevents it working on any other computer. You need to chose Project > Set Active Build Configuration > Release and then rebuild.

i did that already, but i'll re-check

EDIT: i checked and it was already release, now what?

[HexMonkey]

i did that already, but i'll re-check

EDIT: i checked and it was already release, now what?

Sorry about that, it appeared to be in the Debug configuration when I opened it.

Looking more closely at the project, it appears you've altered the build settings manually. Try the following:

In Xcode, select the project ("Tominator Browser") in the Groups & Files list
Get Info on the project (command-I) and select the Build pane
Select "Release" from the Configuration menu
Find the ZeroLink setting and delete it (it should go from bold to plain text when you do this)
Clean the active target (Build > Clean)
Rebuild the project (using the Release configuration)
The application that's created in the build/Release/ folder within your project folder will then (hopefully) work on other computers

[tominated]

does this (http://www.filecrunch.com/file/6yd) work?
you need to put the http:// bit before the web address

[HexMonkey]

It looks the same to me; the zerolink setting is still on for the Release configuration when it should be off. If I turn it off and build using the Release configuration, I can get it to run on other computers, but without any of the images (they aren't included in the project you uploaded and I have to delete the references in Xcode to get it to compile).

Follow the steps from my previous post and upload the application that's created in the Release folder.

[tominated]

i followed those steps exactly though?! i'll try once more
EDIT: ok i realised i didn't follow them properly
this (http://www.filecrunch.com/file/6yk) better work

[Markleshark]

i followed those steps exactly though?! i'll try once more
EDIT: ok i realised i didn't follow them properly
this (http://www.filecrunch.com/file/6yk) better work

Yup. That one works for me. Well done on the first app.

Now you have the framework... Graphical work is next, cuz its kinda ugly. And I had to play with all the buttons to actually find out what the did... But it works, so well done on that. :)

Oh, and you have to put 'http://' so id either get that to correct its self orrrrr, have it auto filled.

Also, I found a strange bug, when you goto full screen the big 'T' logo thingy reappears over the webpage your looking at...

[tominated]

Yup. That one works for me. Well done on the first app.

Now you have the framework... Graphical work is next, cuz its kinda ugly. And I had to play with all the buttons to actually find out what the did... But it works, so well done on that. :)

Oh, and you have to put 'http://' so id either get that to correct its self orrrrr, have it auto filled.

Also, I found a strange bug, when you goto full screen the big 'T' logo thingy reappears over the webpage your looking at...

oh.... i'll fix that.
it's supposed to go away when you load a page :o
i have this cool interface that looks good, that i made in fireworks, but i don't know how to get it to work. if you want i'll post the image

[tominated]

the t goes away on my machine
i dunno what's wrong.

should i get rid of that t thing all together?

[iMeowbot]

the t goes away on my machine
i dunno what's wrong.

Try to use the scroll wheel, or to click a link anywhere except the outer edges of the window. You'll see what's happening, the image (though invisible) gets in the way of mouse events. If you grab the window corner and resize it, the big T will reappear and you can see what's up.
should i get rid of that t thing all together?
That might not be a bad idea for now, while you are still beating the program into submission. The eye candy can always go back later. If you want to keep it, you might instead write a simple Web page that displays the image (or perhaps, a nice little intro/welcome message), stuff that inside your bundle, and load that as the default start page. That way you wouldn't have a different type of resource to deal with.

[tominated]

If you want to keep it, you might instead write a simple Web page that displays the image (or perhaps, a nice little intro/welcome message), stuff that inside your bundle, and load that as the default start page. That way you wouldn't have a different type of resource to deal with.

That's what i was thinking i would do. maybe in the next version

[elppa]

It runs.

There are a couple of problems with it though.


[1] Sometimes (don't know why) you can't click on any links, and you have to switch out of the browser, then come back before it will let you click them.

[2] It won't let me scroll using two fingers on my Trackpad, unlike like every other application in Mac OS X.

But it's a good first effort - keep trying.

BTW I typed this in Tominated.

Good Things:

[1] It uses a tiny amount of memory - about 1/5 less than Safari on my machine.
[2] I has less rendering bugs than IE!

[Eraserhead]

It doesn't seem to work at all on my Intel Macbook, the browser loads but you can't type in addresses, and the big T won't go away

[Markleshark]

oh.... i'll fix that.
it's supposed to go away when you load a page :o
i have this cool interface that looks good, that i made in fireworks, but i don't know how to get it to work. if you want i'll post the image

Yeah, post it, why not. I wants to see what it looks like. ;)

[SpaceMagic]

This is truely impressive - well done. It's a lot faster than Safari for me, which is kind of amusing but then I suppose Safari has a lot of features, whereas this has nothing.

List of things to be done :)

1. Make buttons more obvious as to what they are/do.
2. Let me select all in the address bar
3. Address bar - i don't want to type http://
4. Scrolling by mouse or two fingers just doesn't work? No idea why.
5. Javascript links don't seem to work - odd!

That's just a minimum :p You could do bookmarks, etc... anyway... what you've done so far is truely impressive as I cannot do a thing in Xcode much to HexMonkey's dismay.

[Clydefrog]

opened for me:) pretty slick

[Josias]

That is really slick. Faster than FireFox and same speed as Safari!:eek:

Of course the things other people have pointed out, but also:
http://img356.imageshack.us/img356/6453/billede1ul2.png

[tominated]

It doesn't seem to work at all on my Intel Macbook, the browser loads but you can't type in addresses, and the big T won't go away

you have to put the http:// bit at the start of the addy

[tominated]

5. Javascript links don't seem to work - odd!


The reason javascript links don't work is because that requires quite abit of code. i'll fix that in the next version
if you download it from macupdate.com it doesn't have that massive t orb.

[neonblue2]

So you finally got it working. Good for you, especially since you're 2 years younger than me and we live in the same country. I better start making my mark on the net before all these young fellows take over. ;)

[tominated]

So you finally got it working. Good for you, especially since you're 2 years younger than me and we live in the same country. I better start making my mark on the net before all these young fellows take over. ;)

i can tell you now, it's pretty hard to overtake me, as i am getting better everyday. i have won 3 high destinctions in a row with 100th percintile on all of them in the Australasian computer comp
...next year i'll win

[neonblue2]

i can tell you now, it's pretty hard to overtake me, as i am getting better everyday. i have won 3 high destinctions in a row with 100th percintile on all of them in the Australasian computer comp
...next year i'll win

Unfortunately they don't offer the the same tests they did back in primary school at the high school I go to. The last time I did the computer test was Yr6 I think and I got something good but I can't remember. And you've got it a bit luckier than me (and unluckier in some other ways) because you live in a capital city on the east coast.

[jeremy.king]

This thread gave me a giggle...Especially since reading this Digg "article" yesterday.

http://underthesunz.blogspot.com/ (See #1) :eek:

[Markleshark]

This thread gave me a giggle...Especially since reading this Digg "article" yesterday.

http://underthesunz.blogspot.com/ (See #1) :eek:

lmao. That is genius stuff, nice link.

[tominated]

http://static.flickr.com/102/309308063_d138ac1c84_d.jpg
here is the prototype for the next version. anybody know how to do this?
btw: it mysteriously dissapeared from mac update. get it here (http://thomasbrunoli.awardspace.com/downloadsandpics/downloadsandpics.html)

[aquanutz]

the dmg file that i grabbed doesn't seem to want to mount.

Other than that, your progress seems to be impressive. keep up the good work!

[tominated]

the dmg file that i grabbed doesn't seem to want to mount.

where did you get the .dmg file?

[AutumnSkyline]

whoa, its like having a mini dock, but I would try it somewhere else, because my dock would appear (I fully expand my web browser it bugs the PISS out of me when it isnt :) but its a good idea. I would try it appearing out the top though : ) and have it so that the sides expand from it would be cool too, maybe designing a cool heart or star bubble for favorites to balance the other side out (it only has three bubbles). The gripper is also a cool idea. Overall it is a very good project : )

[tominated]

whoa, its like having a mini dock, but I would try it somewhere else, because my dock would appear (I fully expand my web browser it bugs the PISS out of me when it isnt :) but its a good idea. I would try it appearing out the top though : ) and have it so that the sides expand from it would be cool too, maybe designing a cool heart or star bubble for favorites to balance the other side out (it only has three bubbles). The gripper is also a cool idea. Overall it is a very good project : )

thanks.
now to find out how to do this in xcode!:D

[AutumnSkyline]

thanks.
now to find out how to do this in xcode!:D

Yes that is the tricky part. I have a question actually, It gives you a date/time thingy in the script toolly thing (really bad terminology because its still early) I was wondering if you happened to know how I could make that appear at waking from sleep or startup of the computer?? finder>apps>applescript>example scripts>info scripts

[tominated]

Yes that is the tricky part. I have a question actually, It gives you a date/time thingy in the script toolly thing (really bad terminology because its still early) I was wondering if you happened to know how I could make that appear at waking from sleep or startup of the computer?? finder>apps>applescript>example scripts>info scripts

1. I have no idea what you are talking about
2. I didn't/don't use applescript

[camomac]

i followed those steps exactly though?! i'll try once more
EDIT: ok i realised i didn't follow them properly
this (http://www.filecrunch.com/file/6yk) better work

for some reason that link doesn't work anymore...??

[iBookG4user]

for some reason that link doesn't work anymore...??
this (http://dl029.filefactory.com/dl/f/0d9558/b/5/h/ecdc1a8cafb7fe3b/) is the direct link to the file, there were two, one if you clicked the big "T" and the other if you clicked "Tominated Browser" (or something similar to that).

[tominated]

if you want the newest version, get it here (http://thomasbrunoli.awardspace.com/downloadsandpics/downloadsandpics.html)
I always post new versions on my website first
I have changed the buttons and i have added a help window

[Nuc]

if you want the newest version, get it here (http://thomasbrunoli.awardspace.com/downloadsandpics/downloadsandpics.html)
I always post new versions on my website first
I have changed the buttons and i have added a help window
Somethings wrong with your .dmg file. It wouldn't mount...

Nuc

[neonblue2]

Somethings wrong with your .dmg file. It wouldn't mount...

Nuc

I second that

[tominated]

Somethings wrong with your .dmg file. It wouldn't mount...

Nuc

i'll post it as a zip file then. 5mins max b4 it will be up

Grab it from HERE (http://tominatedsoftware.110mb.com/sw/) now

[Mac Player]

-The interface is horrible.
-Requires u 2 type "http://".

[caveman_uk]

Tominated, I had a look at your source code. I've got a couple of style comments. You may think I'm being harsh but trust me, it will help as the app gets bigger.

1) Learn to indent your code. It will make it easier to read as it gets more complex. The tab key is your friend.
2) Don't do this

id myDocument = [
[NSDocumentController
sharedDocumentController]
openUntitledDocumentOfType:
@"DocumentType"
display:YES];

It shouldn't all be on separate lines. If it does get overlong at least indent it.

Also, your 'Controller' object has memory leaks - wv and md are never released.

BTW, it's odd people say it's faster than Safari as it's using the exact same WebView control that Safari does...:rolleyes:

[lexus]

Why would anyone download a random app, it probably has security risks.

[tominated]

i didn't do the code, i copyed it of a macdevcenter tutorial.
i don't really undrstand it either. oh well, i am gonna get a couple of books to teach me how to use objective-c

[tominated]

w00t! i figured out how to get the itunes style interface and I added a print button! get it here.
(http://tominatedsoftware.110mb.com/sw)
BTW: i't a bit unstable when it comes to sites with tons of pop-ups.

[elppa]

w00t! i figured out how to get the itunes style interface and I added a print button! get it here (http://tominatedsoftware.110mb.com/sw).

BTW: i't a bit unstable when it comes to sites with tons of pop-ups.

I'd be quite happy if they put favourites in a HUD (that's "Heads Up Display" for the uninitiated!) for Safari.

It would be convenient. The current set up is great for editing and organising bookmarks - but it is not so good to jump between them.

[tominated]

I'd be quite happy if they put favourites in a HUD (that's "Heads Up Display" for the uninitiated!) for Safari.

It would be convenient. The current set up is great for editing and organising bookmarks - but it is not so good to jump between them.

that's what i am planning to do. by the time i am finished, it should be as good as, if not better than, safari

[neonblue2]

i didn't do the code, i copyed it of a macdevcenter tutorial.
i don't really undrstand it either. oh well, i am gonna get a couple of books to teach me how to use objective-c

After looking at it I thought so, I've done exactly the same thing.