Apple fails to support small user communities - so I'm leaving

[jacobj]

iTunes music store has just been launched across Europe, including the UK. I have been waiting a year for this and so, when I got home from work, I eagerly opened iTunes and started the whole event. I had to update my Apple ID so that it could be used with iTunes music store and what so I find?
My UK post code is not accepted.
There are only 90,000 people here, but with the other Channel Islands, of which we form part, the total population is around 180,000. OK this is only 0.30% of the UK's population and we are slightly out of the loop in terms of legislation and government, but we are none the less part of the UK and all copyright laws that apply there apply here.
If the fault lays at the door of the record companies my issue would be less, but I still detest the fact that Apple makes no mention of us on their iTunes site, nor in their online help, nor do their support team know anything of us.
I have had so many issues with Apple recently, but this is the one that has convinced me that my next computer will be a PC. I hope that all their users eventually leave them and that the company fades into the history books, because style and gadgets are not the whole thing: support for a loyal customer base should surely be the other.

[Darwin]

Have you made a complaint?

Apple maybe to blame and it might not be, but I would let them know

I don't see them missing out a set of Post Codes for the hell of it

If they don't give an answer then you can walk away knowing that you reported the problem :(

[Krizoitz]

First, there is a difference between not supporting a group they have promised to and not providing a service that they never promised to you.

Apple would LOVE to offer the iTMS to more people. Why? It generates revenue, it generates brand recognition, it promotes iPod sales. I don't understand where people get this idea that Apple is doing things to HURT their sales. And its not like they are doing things like some companies where its screw the customer to increase profits.

Apple isn't some monolithic company like Sony and its not like they just have to ship a generic product to one more market. There is a ton of legal wrangling that goes on. PLUS they have to put in the infrastructure.

You want Apple to bring you the iTMS, well so does Canada, and Japan, and the rest of Europe and Australia, etc. Not to mention that they still have this little computer selling buisness going on the side.

Remember the .com boom? Everyone jumped in feet first and it all collapsed. Apple is taking a nice methodical approach, expanding as they have the opportunity/money/market. Apple will expand when they can as fast as is responsibly able to do so. They have a responsibility to their shareholders not to make stupid mistakes that will cost the company big.

Certainly if you aren't satisfied changing to PC is an option, just be warned, from someone who works in a cross platform environment, being able to buy online music isn't going to outweigh the costs. I guess its your call though, its your money

[Balin64]

... And send it to you....

OR:

Why don't you just go to the shop and buy it?

At least give this some time. It may get figured out.

The UK and Europe is somewhat behind in what Apple offers... of course. But it is not always Apple's fault: most likely it is on your end!

And before you fire back: I have lived on Cow's Lane in Dublin and Aldwich and The Strand in London: I know what I'm talking about.


Be patient grasshopper.

Or Move.

Blah.

[Coolvirus007]

I've lived in the UK for 3 years and believe me, they (UK companies in general) have A LOT of problems. This small iTunes buisness isn't a big concern. If your having trouble coping with the iTunes music store, try dealing with BT to upgrade your telephone line so you can use broadband.

And by the way, which brand of PC are you going to switch.

[Belly-laughs]

Type in a different postcode, NN4 1ZY, say. It worked for me.

[winwintoo]

You shouldn't have to use a fake post code to circumvent Apple's apparent oversight in designing their store.

This lack of customer service seems to be rampant in Apple lately and almost made me want to switch and might yet.

I recently had dealings with Apple customer service and got no satisfaction what so ever from them. After going through several layers of intermediaries before I could finally talk to "customer service" I got to speak to a dolt whose lack of voice inflection made me want to climb through the phone line and strangle him. He kept saying "I'm sorry you're having this trouble" but with absolutely no emotion in his voice, in effect conveying to me that he (and therefore Apple) could care less if I was having trouble.

Apple better smarten up - if they treat their loyal customers like this, I shudder to think what new switcher must think.

Take care, M

[matthew24]

So you are willing to become a Windows sufferer because of ITMS not being available?

*********** Real Weird. *************

I came from the darkside and ain't never going back.

[Sayer]

It's funny everyone automatically blames Apple for all problems. Why is no one pointing fingers at the music labels or rights holders?

All of the restrictions come directly from the music labels/rights holders, not Apple.

What Apple does is negotiate the best terms it can given the restrictions put on *them* to sell you music files. Steve Jobs is quoted as saying he wants ALL music on iTMS.

So this puffed up hissy fit is really misplaced. Why is that?

Maybe you just wanted attention for your "brave" decision. Geeze, it's just a computer. Go get a DELL or something and shut up about it already.

[Macdantheman07]

just because iTunes isn't available in your area (for odd some reason), doesn't mean you have to give up ever buying a mac. I mean, thats just stupid. First of all, you don't even know if this postal code issue is their fault, second of all they will still sell you a computer, third of all most of the world still doesnt have iTunes, and finally, Windows sucks. I believe one user said before that Apple isn't in the business to shut people out, it is in the business to make money and get brand and mind share. They will try their hardest to bring their service to you.

If you are never going to buy a mac, you have to ask yourself: "Can I stand this utter Windows crap? Can i stand talking to Dell tech support people in bloody India?(many more questions...)" Lack of iTunes is a bad reason to stay PC.

DONT EVER SAY THAT APPLE DOESN'T CARE ABOUT SMALL COMMUNITIES, because they were once the major suppliers to schools THROUGHOUT THE WORLD. SCHOOLS ARE SMALL COMMUNITIES! Children are the future and Apple helps build the future.

[russed]

I have had so many issues with Apple recently, but this is the one that has convinced me that my next computer will be a PC. I hope that all their users eventually leave them and that the company fades into the history books, because style and gadgets are not the whole thing: support for a loyal customer base should surely be the other.

so what are these many issues that you have been having?

[jemeinc]

I'm curious why your location says Jersey- yet you are complaining about Apple UK... PS... What are some of the other "many issues" you've been having with Apple ?...

[NusuniAdmin]

Id say I have more of a chance of leaving than you,

#1, that whole tech service problem. I sent my dual in for repairs got the wrong one back, sent that back and got my dual back with no video or ram cards or hd's, and finally the 3'rd time got it back but it did not boot. Finally the 4'th time i got it back perfectly fine and apple gave me a gift certificate and did not charge for the repairs

#2, panther in my opinion is an absolute pos os. If tiger is not any better there is a good chance i will use YDL for my home stuff (right now i have ydl running as my fileserver) and use tiger for my programming. I really definitly hope tiger will implement the supposed disability junk cause if it supports speach recognition throughout the whole os, no matter what i will switch to it. This whole kill your hands from typing and moving mouse is geting terrible. If that came true id probly lose my gut cause id probly walk around while talking instead of sitting.

those 2 reasons are major ones for me. I could have avoided #1 if i had more time to repair it myself, but i didnt.

And another kinda reason, #2.5 (lol), Apple needs to majorly improve its virtual memory and make the system use less memory. I have 352 megs of memory. When i boot my beige in ydl 3.01 it has 300 left (thats with all the all the eye candy on). On os x no matter what it always uses at least 100 megs of memory. When i do get to virtual memory on ydl is runs literaly 99% of the regular speed because it was written so well. OS x...well it runs like 85% of the speed if im lucky. I think the VM was just thrown together by apple or the developers. Why make people buy 500 dollars worth the ram when they can just add or remove some code?

[flyfish29]

detest[/B] the fact that Apple makes no mention of us on their iTunes site, nor in their online help, nor do their support team know anything of us.
I have had so many issues with Apple recently, but this is the one that has convinced me that my next computer will be a PC. I hope that all their users eventually leave them and that the company fades into the history books, because style and gadgets are not the whole thing: support for a loyal customer base should surely be the other.

Damn those apple people, they don't mention my name either in their support. :D

nO seriously, I respect your decision to change (don't agree, but respect that it is your decision) However, you don't think you will have issues with customer service on the PC side...come on be real. There are millions if not billions of PC users out there and you actually think you will be more than a number in a sea of users? You have a better chance of Steve J calling your home than getting recognized by the PC world.

Look into why you are not supported before jumping to conclusions...mistake, legal issues you don't know about, etc. could be the reason...find out before blaming apple.

If you don't look into it then Bon Voyage and we will see you in a few years when you realize the PC world is not going to be any better, but in fact much worse.

Respectfully,

[bousozoku]

I'm curious why your location says Jersey- yet you are complaining about Apple UK... PS... What are some of the other "many issues" you've been having with Apple ?...

He's on the island of Jersey, not in New Jersey in the U.S.A.

jacobj:

It could be a clerical error--that someone didn't enter all of the postcodes. If you don't let Apple know, they'll never correct it. Things do happen and rolling out a project for 3 different countries at the same time is a lot of work. It may just be that someone missed them--the sheet with those postcodes could have fallen on the floor and no one saw.

Let them know.

[iJon]

well please do let us know how your loyal support with dell or compaq go.

iJon

[g4cubed]

[QUOTE=NusuniAdmin]Id say I have more of a chance of leaving than you,

#1, that whole tech service problem. I sent my dual in for repairs got the wrong one back, sent that back and got my dual back with no video or ram cards or hd's, and finally the 3'rd time got it back but it did not boot. Finally the 4'th time i got it back perfectly fine and apple gave me a gift certificate and did not charge for the repairs QUOTE]

How much was the gift cert. for?
I started out on a mac AppleII thru my PPC 6300, I switched to winblows, then back for the Cube. I had a Compaq that was sent in 5 times before getting it right and I got nada, not even "we're sorry".
So, not that what happened was a good thing, at least they gave you something for the trouble. :D

[Bakey]

I'm curious why your location says Jersey- yet you are complaining about Apple UK...

Please, please, please, please tell me you're joking!!! :rolleyes:

[NusuniAdmin]

How much was the gift cert. for?
I started out on a mac AppleII thru my PPC 6300, I switched to winblows, then back for the Cube. I had a Compaq that was sent in 5 times before getting it right and I got nada, not even "we're sorry".
So, not that what happened was a good thing, at least they gave you something for the trouble. :D

it was only for 20 dollars. I think it was an attempt to avoid a lawsuit over their tech support (the people on the phone were @$$e$ too). They already have enough lawsuits going on. But at least they did not charge me for the service.

[Flowbee]

I have had so many issues with Apple recently, but this is the one that has convinced me that my next computer will be a PC. I hope that all their users eventually leave them and that the company fades into the history books, because style and gadgets are not the whole thing: support for a loyal customer base should surely be the other.

You're absolutely right. Apple treats its customers like crap. Switching to Microsoft is like finding a new best friend. If you ever have any problems with their software or services, you just call them up and they make everything better for you. Their motto truly is: "The customer is always right." Microsoft even sent me a birthday card this year, and a realy nice fruit basket after I spent 45 minutes on the phone with their technical support trying to get my computer to recognize my camera. They were really sorry I was having problems and promised to fix their OS as soon as they could.

Oh yeah, and Microsoft's Jersey Music Store really rocks!!

[bousozoku]

Please, please, please, please tell me you're joking!!! :rolleyes:

He's not likely to be joking. Geography doesn't matter. :D You know that people on the east coast of the U.S.A. around New Jersey tend to simply call it Jersey, right? :D I still do, when I'm talking with people in the states.

[mainstreetmark]

I'm sure all you guys will find plenty of support, nestled comfortably in the bosom of Microsoft.

"My postal code doesn't work in a service that's less than 24 hours old. Apple sucks". Get lost, then, we don't want you.

"Panther is a crappy OS because it doesn't have total speech recognition. Apple sucks.". You can get lost as well. Go use XP which has zero speech support, and I wasn't aware Yellow Dog had any speech support either.

Honestly, you people must all have pretty great lives to have these problems be so serious.

[vga4life]

Please, please, please, please tell me you're joking!!! :rolleyes:

Why would he be? The States of Jersey isn't part of the UK! It's a self-governing island with a "special relationship" with the UK. Sure, the Queen (God Shave Her!) is the Sovereign (represented by the lieutenant Governor), and the Dean, Bailiff, and Attorney General are all Crown-appointed. Nonetheless, it's not part of the UK, or a colony of same. Acts of the UK parliament do not apply to Jersey except by consent.

See http://www.gov.je/island/about.asp for the full, boring details.

[Thirteenva]

well please do let us know how your loyal support with dell or compaq go.

iJon

LOL! AMEN!


BYE BYE!

[aloofman]

iTunes music store has just been launched across Europe, including the UK. I have been waiting a year for this and so, when I got home from work, I eagerly opened iTunes and started the whole event. I had to update my Apple ID so that it could be used with iTunes music store and what so I find?
My UK post code is not accepted.
There are only 90,000 people here, but with the other Channel Islands, of which we form part, the total population is around 180,000. OK this is only 0.30% of the UK's population and we are slightly out of the loop in terms of legislation and government, but we are none the less part of the UK and all copyright laws that apply there apply here.
If the fault lays at the door of the record companies my issue would be less, but I still detest the fact that Apple makes no mention of us on their iTunes site, nor in their online help, nor do their support team know anything of us.
I have had so many issues with Apple recently, but this is the one that has convinced me that my next computer will be a PC. I hope that all their users eventually leave them and that the company fades into the history books, because style and gadgets are not the whole thing: support for a loyal customer base should surely be the other.

Get off your high horse. Jersey is used as a tax shelter for numerous international financial operations and its legal system is only partly related to the UK's. In addition to the fact that the number of potential iTunes users in the Channel Islands is very small, Apple would probably have to negotiate legal rights directly with the local government. If they considered it at all, they probably figured it was not worth it. You've chosen to isolate yourself on a tiny island that gets to pick and choose which parts of British law apply to it, so I'd say the lack of an iTunes music store there is not a major issue for the people of Jersey or Apple.

[JDOG_]

panther in my opinion is an absolute pos os. If tiger is not any better there is a good chance i will use YDL for my home stuff...

...This whole kill your hands from typing and moving mouse is geting terrible. If that came true id probly lose my gut cause id probly walk around while talking instead of sitting.

Panther is definitely not a p.o.s. OS, try running something in 2004 (Windows XP) that came out in 2001 that's based off of the same core coding from something in 1995...

If you like Windows more than switch back, but you can't honestly call Panther a POS when comparing it to Windows. The CTRL+ALT+DEL factor is off the charts.

[musicpyrite]

Your getting pissed at Apple because their music store doesn't work?

Well if you have that kind of attitude when you switch over to a PC,

you won't need iTMS, you'll need Kazaa.

[NusuniAdmin]

Panther is definitely not a p.o.s. OS, try running something in 2004 (Windows XP) that came out in 2001 that's based off of the same core coding from something in 1995...

If you like Windows more than switch back, but you can't honestly call Panther a POS when comparing it to Windows. The CTRL+ALT+DEL factor is off the charts.

Panther is a pos in my opinion. I have yet to see it run any faster or be any more user friendly in my opinion.

[jemeinc]

Please, please, please, please tell me you're joking!!! :rolleyes:

Nope... I was dead serious, that's why I asked... Guess I'll have to study up on my UK Geography... lol.. ehhh, maybe not... lol...

[yoda13]

Panther is a pos in my opinion. I have yet to see it run any faster or be any more user friendly in my opinion.

Can't comment on other OS, but xBench scores were faster on my systems after I installed on Panther, versus previous scores when I had Jaguar on the systems

[jemeinc]

He's on the island of Jersey, not in New Jersey in the U.S.A.


Thanks... Figured it was something like that- that's why I asked...

[Jovian9]

You're absolutely right. Apple treats its customers like crap. Switching to Microsoft is like finding a new best friend. If you ever have any problems with their software or services, you just call them up and they make everything better for you. Their motto truly is: "The customer is always right." Microsoft even sent me a birthday card this year, and a realy nice fruit basket after I spent 45 minutes on the phone with their technical support trying to get my computer to recognize my camera. They were really sorry I was having problems and promised to fix their OS as soon as they could.
Oh yeah, and Microsoft's Jersey Music Store really rocks!!

I had problems with my refurbished 1GHz 17" PowerBook. They did not send me a flower basket and birthday card though:( They sent me a brand new 1.33GHz 17" PowerBook and an extra 512MB RAM chip. That added up to over $1000 in price difference b/t what I bought and what they gave me. Sure beats a fruit basket and birthday card.
Oh yeah, my last PC (Compaq Presario) had problems recognizing a memory card reader and a brand new Epson printer. I called Compaq and they said it was Windows ME. I called Microsoft and they said it was Compaq and that ME combined with Compaq combined with an AMD processor would cause some USB peripherals to go unrecognized and never be able to be used. I didn't get an apology, birthday card, or gift certificate from Microsoft for the worst OS ever written.
My Compaq broke down on me 2X in 8 months. Both times I had to drive it to a local repair place that would then send it off and I got it back in 2 weeks. Apple has a box to me the next day for any repairs I've ever had done and has the product back, by mail, in a week (with the exception of the 17" PowerBook (above) b/c they sent me a BRAND NEW better better specs one instead.
I've never had OS problems with Apple....so no comparison to make there with the OS support vs Microsoft.

I'm pretty sure that qualifies as good-caring customer service on Apple's behalf.

[1macker1]

Can I have your mouse and keyboard? :)

[Koodauw]

Blah, if this is why you're on a soap box.... I wish this was my biggest problem.

[quagmire]

That is a bummer that you had a problem with itunes. Going to windows won't solve your problems. You will be running from them. Instead of telling apple you run to gates to save you.

Now a off topic, When he does make the switch and goes to a windows forum the people there will say," Welcome to the light. Macs are inferior. Glad you came when you did."

[technocoy]

a culling of pansy, mommy whining punk asses that BOO HOO everytime they have a problem because apple is out to get them and ruin everything good in their life. GOOD-RIDDANCE. good luck in the perfect windows world where everything happens instantly when you think about it and everything is really beautiful and is made with the morphing ergonomics that fit to every pansy ass user that comes along in this day and age yelling ME ME ME ME!!! nothing bad should EVER happen to me. especially not being able to acces a music store in it's infancy!!!! AAAAAAHHHHHHH.

good bye, don't let the door hit you on the way out.
:) :D :) :D

[seraphnyc]

Id say I have more of a chance of leaving than you,

#1, that whole tech service problem. I sent my dual in for repairs got the wrong one back, sent that back and got my dual back with no video or ram cards or hd's, and finally the 3'rd time got it back but it did not boot. Finally the 4'th time i got it back perfectly fine and apple gave me a gift certificate and did not charge for the repairs

#2, panther in my opinion is an absolute pos os. If tiger is not any better there is a good chance i will use YDL for my home stuff (right now i have ydl running as my fileserver) and use tiger for my programming. I really definitly hope tiger will implement the supposed disability junk cause if it supports speach recognition throughout the whole os, no matter what i will switch to it. This whole kill your hands from typing and moving mouse is geting terrible. If that came true id probly lose my gut cause id probly walk around while talking instead of sitting.

those 2 reasons are major ones for me. I could have avoided #1 if i had more time to repair it myself, but i didnt.

And another kinda reason, #2.5 (lol), Apple needs to majorly improve its virtual memory and make the system use less memory. I have 352 megs of memory. When i boot my beige in ydl 3.01 it has 300 left (thats with all the all the eye candy on). On os x no matter what it always uses at least 100 megs of memory. When i do get to virtual memory on ydl is runs literaly 99% of the regular speed because it was written so well. OS x...well it runs like 85% of the speed if im lucky. I think the VM was just thrown together by apple or the developers. Why make people buy 500 dollars worth the ram when they can just add or remove some code?

As for number 1, damn that does suck... but at least they did not charge you and gave you a gift certificate. Had they done neither... there is a REAL reason to be pissed. But at least the made up by not charging the arm and leg it would have cost you had they not made the error.

As for number 2... dude... are you serious? You think you will be able to walk around and talk to a windows box while it accurately does everything you tell it to? Walking while talking may not help your gut much, now treadmill while talking can help alot. Apple has perhaps some of the best Handicap accessability in an OS at this point. No doubt it could be better, but try to walk and talk to a windows computer... not fun, not productive and BARELY works.

As for 2.5, there is a HUGE difference between OS X and YDL. I do like YDL and ran it in place of OS 9 until OS X came out. Main stream application support and an easy to use interface mixed with the backbone of BSD is a hell-uva thing. YDL is lacking those, you can run mac-on-linux but your results will vary. For the reasons mentioned, except for number 1 which is irritating but cost you time not cash, you'd be better off staying with the Mac.

A friend of mine just bought a Dell with XP Pro on it. The damn thing sucks... it crashed 8 times while setting up user accounts for the very first time. Windows Explorer crashed while trying to autoload thumbnails from a floppy (&CD) the first time, and has done so since. He had to re-install the OS twice before it began to behave and then, within the last 2 days he has called me for tech support 5 times, all for things that an OS should have no problem doing. I use a Mac at home and would NEVER think of switching to the PC... expecially for something as trivial as iTMS not working in the UK (BTW iTMS for the PC won't do it either if the Mac version won't) or there not being full voice recognition support. No way... no how.

Think what you will, but know the truth. You now have the information to make up your own mind.

S.

[bertagert]

I have had so many issues with Apple recently, but this is the one that has convinced me that my next computer will be a PC.

I just switched for the same reason! The only problem is, itunes on a PC still doesn't let the Jersey crowd in. Neither does Napster. Or OD2. Looks like you'll have to do things like you always have till Jersey gets itunes in October.

[technocoy]

what mac are you running and how much will you be selling it for? i may buy it just to ease the transition for you... does it have problems as well? or is it just the music store that makes you want to leave? If it's a g4 AGP or higher i may just purchase it from you for a reasonable price. let me know.

thanks,
technocoy

[quagmire]

I just switched for the same reason! The only problem is, itunes on a PC still doesn't let the Jersey crowd in. Neither does Napster. Or OD2. Looks like you'll have to do things like you always have till Jersey gets itunes in October.

Are you going to switch back soon? Had any problems with windows that pisses you off more then apple? I had and thats made me switch back o apple. Being a windows user for 5 years, and getting crappy service made me switch back to mac.

[OldManJimbo]

I know exactly what you mean and how you feel - I once bought a package of English Muffins and after leaving the darn things out all night, they had the unmitigated gaul to get stale - so I decided to never again speak ENGLISH because if the English can't make a muffin that will not get stale when left out overnight, I don't want anything to with them. Nevermind that I cant speak any other languages - I can still write notes to people.

Suggestion - when you dump Apple and go to PC and then get frustrated with the PC world - you can grab a pencil and paper. I understand the pencil and paper guild on your little island is quite user friendly

[cr2sh]

my next computer will be a PC. I hope that all their users eventually leave them and that the company fades into the history books, because style and gadgets are not the whole thing: support for a loyal customer base should surely be the other.

Before wishing you fairwell, I feel it my duty to point out the irony of your post.

Loyalty? Where exactly can I find this "loyalty" of yours?

Whatever.. you are obviously oblivious to what the PC world has in store for you. Don't let the door hit you on your way out.

[bousozoku]

Nope... I was dead serious, that's why I asked... Guess I'll have to study up on my UK Geography... lol.. ehhh, maybe not... lol...

Maybe if he'd said Isle of Wight, you wouldn't have been confused?

Just think, where did they get those Jersey cows? :D

[parrothead]

Please, please, please, please tell me you're joking!!! :rolleyes:

Well, you know that americans tend to be the worst people in the world about geography. :rolleyes:

edit: note, I did not mean for this to be a dig on you, jemeinc, just stating a known fact. I am sure it is not your fault no one ever taught you English geography.

[7on]

Panther isn't a POS OS. It may be a memory hog, but not a POS. I do wish OSX wouldn't use 100MB of memory. Which under the minimum requirements leaves you with less than 28MB to open stuff in.

[Belly-laughs]

Panther is a pos in my opinion. I have yet to see it run any faster or be any more user friendly in my opinion.

You should try OS9.

[wide]

yeah!! switch to a PC dude! i'm serious, if you are unable to take ****ty customer service, maybe you aren't made for a Mac :(

apple has some of the worst customer service i have ever encountered.

also, PCs are not all that bad. the main reason that they are so unreliable is because there are so many viruses and spyware and adware for PCs that do not affect apple computers. windows is an OK operating system. granted, panther is better but it is not microsoft's fault that their OS is the most used in the world, and that hackers in almost every nation want to make viruses for Windows just because it is the most used. hackers that design viruses are @$$holes who set out with the goal to make PC users piss their pants and switch over to Mac. hmmmm...maybe all of these viruses are really programmed by apple to aid their "switch" campaign....

[Belly-laughs]

What bank is your credit/debit card with? If if it s a UK bank, just type in a different postcode in the registration form and get on with it. It won´t bother Apple, it won´t bother your bank and you can stop complaining.

Switchin´ to something better? Huhu...

[James L]

iTunes music store has just been launched across Europe, including the UK. I have been waiting a year for this and so, when I got home from work, I eagerly opened iTunes and started the whole event. I had to update my Apple ID so that it could be used with iTunes music store and what so I find?
My UK post code is not accepted.
There are only 90,000 people here, but with the other Channel Islands, of which we form part, the total population is around 180,000. OK this is only 0.30% of the UK's population and we are slightly out of the loop in terms of legislation and government, but we are none the less part of the UK and all copyright laws that apply there apply here.
If the fault lays at the door of the record companies my issue would be less, but I still detest the fact that Apple makes no mention of us on their iTunes site, nor in their online help, nor do their support team know anything of us.
I have had so many issues with Apple recently, but this is the one that has convinced me that my next computer will be a PC. I hope that all their users eventually leave them and that the company fades into the history books, because style and gadgets are not the whole thing: support for a loyal customer base should surely be the other.


ANALOGY:

"This cup holder in my BMW won't hold my super sized slurpee... it sucks. I'm going to sell this piece of **** and by a yugo."

Dude, if this is your biggest problem then your life is pretty good. Have fun with Dell and M$, I am sure your life will be problem free.

On the topic of customer support, it is all in how you approach them. I have had Apple replace an entire computer before, at no cost to me, for a relatively small problem that they technically didn't even have to fix under warranty. Not only did they address the problem, they replaced the entire machine! Apple's customer service was rated number one in a recent PC mag poll... Dell's customer service center is in India I think. Have fun.

Oh ya, and don't let the door hit you on.....

[bertagert]

Are you going to switch back soon? Had any problems with windows that pisses you off more then apple? I had and thats made me switch back o apple. Being a windows user for 5 years, and getting crappy service made me switch back to mac.
Quag,

I was completely kidding around with my post. I should have marked it with sarcasm tags. Sorry. What I was saying is, for him to switch to windows isn't going to help him download songs from any of online music services any faster. These comapnies are setting up shop in places where money can actually be made. If, and I really don't know the population of Jersey, the population is less than 10 million people, there really wouldn't be any reason to open another store for such a place. He'll just have to get his music the old fashion way, no matter if he's on a mac or a pc.

[bousozoku]

I just switched for the same reason! The only problem is, itunes on a PC still doesn't let the Jersey crowd in. Neither does Napster. Or OD2. Looks like you'll have to do things like you always have till Jersey gets itunes in October.

What happens when that doesn't work either? It sounds as if moving house is the only solution.

[NusuniAdmin]

What is with everyone bashing me for hating panther? A bet a lot of you hate os 9...but i happen to like it. Am i allowed to bash you?

[quagmire]

What is with everyone bashing me for hating panther? A bet a lot of you hate os 9...but i happen to like it. Am i allowed to bash you?

I think alot of people(inluding me) liked OS for what is was. We just didn't like it for what it did. It crashed alot. With Panther and Jaguar I never had crash. With Jaguar I had a couple app crashes but, luckly we have force quit. I think XP is pos. I think windows itself is pos. If longhorn ever comes out it is going to be pos. It is just a copied version of Mac OS X.

[jemeinc]

[QUOTE=

I am sure it is not your fault no one ever taught you English geography.[/QUOTE]



No actually it probably was...lol... I'm American through & through & sometimes tend to forget I'm reading stuff from all over the world... When I saw Jersey my first thought was naturally, 'what exit?'...lol... I still get a laugh out of the original response saying "please,please,please,please, tell me you're kidding" lol... Yeah, riiiggghhht, sorry for the initial reaction being the Jersey just outside of New York- a slightly more relevant version, imho...I'll try to keep up from now on, lol...

[Krizoitz]

apple has some of the worst customer service i have ever encountered.
Is that why they are consistently ranked as one of the best in customer service and satisfaction?


also, PCs are not all that bad. the main reason that they are so unreliable is because there are so many viruses and spyware and adware for PCs that do not affect apple computers. windows is an OK operating system. granted, panther is better but it is not microsoft's fault that their OS is the most used in the world, and that hackers in almost every nation want to make viruses for Windows just because it is the most used. hackers that design viruses are @$$holes who set out with the goal to make PC users piss their pants and switch over to Mac.

First, those viruses exploit gapping holes that Microsoft leaves in their OS either because they don't care or because they are to incompetent to write a good OS. It IS Microsofts fault. Thats like saying its not a companies fault if they leave some of the doors open all night long and people come in and steal their stuff. Its the theifs fault for stealing it, so obviously the company isn't to blame for allowing them in.
Second, have you ever met a virus programmer? I have, and I can tell you that none of them or the ones they know are Mac fans. They write viruses because they want screw with other people, or for noteriety, or just because they can.

[Krizoitz]

I love when people rant about something that they don't understand...

Apple needs to majorly improve its virtual memory and make the system use less memory. I have 352 megs of memory. When i boot my beige in ydl 3.01 it has 300 left (thats with all the all the eye candy on). On os x no matter what it always uses at least 100 megs of memory. When i do get to virtual memory on ydl is runs literaly 99% of the regular speed because it was written so well. OS x...well it runs like 85% of the speed if im lucky. I think the VM was just thrown together by apple or the developers. Why make people buy 500 dollars worth the ram when they can just add or remove some code?

You obviously don't understand just what virtual memory entails. First in any modern OS virtual memory is ALWAYS on, there is no reason not to have it on. Second, if you aren't running other programs you WANT the OS to use as much memory as possible. That means that it isn't wasting time swapping between disk and memory. A proper modern OS utilizes all resources to the fulllest if it can, it shouldn't be wasting memory. As soon as more programs need memory the kernal will start paging memory to more programs in order to keep things going (I think OS X using paging for its VM scheme). Third, given that you can't turn VM off on OS X how can it run at 85%?

[NusuniAdmin]

I love when people rant about something that they don't understand...



You obviously don't understand just what virtual memory entails. First in any modern OS virtual memory is ALWAYS on, there is no reason not to have it on. Second, if you aren't running other programs you WANT the OS to use as much memory as possible. That means that it isn't wasting time swapping between disk and memory. A proper modern OS utilizes all resources to the fulllest if it can, it shouldn't be wasting memory. As soon as more programs need memory the kernal will start paging memory to more programs in order to keep things going (I think OS X using paging for its VM scheme). Third, given that you can't turn VM off on OS X how can it run at 85%?

When the pageouts start because i run out of memory the whole system slows to around 85% of the normal speed, ydl and many other linux distro's do not do this and actually run at nearly their regular speed

[Chip NoVaMac]

Maybe if he'd said Isle of Wight, you wouldn't have been confused?

Just think, where did they get those Jersey cows? :D

No, then he would think of North Carolina and Kitty Hawk :D

[Chaszmyr]

Nope... I was dead serious, that's why I asked... Guess I'll have to study up on my UK Geography... lol.. ehhh, maybe not... lol...

Didn't you ever wonder why its called NEW Jersey? :p

[bousozoku]

No, then he would think of North Carolina and Kitty Hawk :D

I hope not.

Isn't Kitty Hawk where they have birds that prey on cats? :D Do they have indians in Indiana? I've heard a few things that make me wonder.

[jemeinc]

Didn't you ever wonder why its called NEW Jersey? :p


LOL... In a word— NO...

[nelwd]

Hi

Try putting in your post code all in lower case. I could not login into ITMS UK, from the Isle of Man, until i used lower case for my post code then i could. strange but true. The IOM is also not part of the UK, but a Crown Dependancy, just like Jersey, so if we have it, i guess you will have to.

[Earendil]

When the pageouts start because i run out of memory the whole system slows to around 85% of the normal speed, ydl and many other linux distro's do not do this and actually run at nearly their regular speed

I don't know much about Linux. I do know that Linux is faster under some system intensive processes. I also know that the reason we have RAM is because it is a helluva lot faster than a HD. That is a pretty pure and simple fact. No VM will EVER be as fast as RAM.

Also, VM on a computer with a 4200RPM drive, like my laptop, is going to be slower than VM on a 7200rpm drive, like my mom's PowerMac.

If you are getting "nearly regular speed" from Linux while VM is active, than you aren't using memory intensive tasks. If you are getting good speeds, then why even buy RAM? go out and get a bigger HD, it's a lot cheaper than a 512mb stick...

Tyler
Earendil

[jemeinc]

Hi

Try putting in your post code all in lower case. I could not login into ITMS UK, from the Isle of Man, until i used lower case for my post code then i could. strange but true. The IOM is also not part of the UK, but a Crown Dependancy, just like Jersey, so if we have it, i guess you will have to.


The "Isle Of Man" — is that in Manhatten?... lol... Just kidding guys- poking a little fun at my expense- no need to roast me - unless of course you'd like to...lol...

[mymemory]

iTunes music store has just been launched across Europe, including the UK. I have been waiting a year for this and so, when I got home from work, I eagerly opened iTunes and started the whole event. I had to update my Apple ID so that it could be used with iTunes music store and what so I find?
My UK post code is not accepted.
There are only 90,000 people here, but with the other Channel Islands, of which we form part, the total population is around 180,000.


have you heard about ITMS for any South American country? we are not even mentioned, we do not exist AT ALL!

Now you have a taste of what it feel to be segregated.

[whooleytoo]

No actually it probably was...lol... I'm American through & through & sometimes tend to forget I'm reading stuff from all over the world... When I saw Jersey my first thought was naturally, 'what exit?'...lol... I still get a laugh out of the original response saying "please,please,please,please, tell me you're kidding" lol... Yeah, riiiggghhht, sorry for the initial reaction being the Jersey just outside of New York- a slightly more relevant version, imho...I'll try to keep up from now on, lol...

Yeah, why is "New Jersey" shortened to "Jersey", but "New York" isn't.. In fact, sometimes, it's even lengthened to "New York New York"... :p

[Maxx Power]

You shouldn't have to use a fake post code to circumvent Apple's apparent oversight in designing their store.

This lack of customer service seems to be rampant in Apple lately and almost made me want to switch and might yet.

I recently had dealings with Apple customer service and got no satisfaction what so ever from them. After going through several layers of intermediaries before I could finally talk to "customer service" I got to speak to a dolt whose lack of voice inflection made me want to climb through the phone line and strangle him. He kept saying "I'm sorry you're having this trouble" but with absolutely no emotion in his voice, in effect conveying to me that he (and therefore Apple) could care less if I was having trouble.

Apple better smarten up - if they treat their loyal customers like this, I shudder to think what new switcher must think.

Take care, M

I agree with you 200%. I had my share of severe dissappointments and feel of being ripped off with their highly concentric and arrogant customer services agents. All apple have is their loyal customer base, and nothing else. I have never seen another company that screws over its biggest user-base, or their biggest retail channels (used to be the independent stores see the whole story http://www.tellonapple.org/ ). They should be dishing out their anguish of not being able to get more of the market on the competition, not making their user-base pay high royalty fees and crazy margins, and plus, asking 50 big ones for a phone call is just plain cranialrectosis.

[parrothead]

Yeah, why is "New Jersey" shortened to "Jersey", but "New York" isn't.. In fact, sometimes, it's even lengthened to "New York New York"... :p


Well, New York, New York is actually a proper way to describe the city of New York in the Stae of New York. There is actually much more to New York (state) than that big city! :D

[MrSugar]

I love when people rant about something that they don't understand...



You obviously don't understand just what virtual memory entails. First in any modern OS virtual memory is ALWAYS on, there is no reason not to have it on. Second, if you aren't running other programs you WANT the OS to use as much memory as possible. That means that it isn't wasting time swapping between disk and memory. A proper modern OS utilizes all resources to the fulllest if it can, it shouldn't be wasting memory. As soon as more programs need memory the kernal will start paging memory to more programs in order to keep things going (I think OS X using paging for its VM scheme). Third, given that you can't turn VM off on OS X how can it run at 85%?

Thanks for the explination. I personally found it very informative =)

[bousozoku]

I don't know much about Linux. I do know that Linux is faster under some system intensive processes. I also know that the reason we have RAM is because it is a helluva lot faster than a HD. That is a pretty pure and simple fact. No VM will EVER be as fast as RAM.

Also, VM on a computer with a 4200RPM drive, like my laptop, is going to be slower than VM on a 7200rpm drive, like my mom's PowerMac.

If you are getting "nearly regular speed" from Linux while VM is active, than you aren't using memory intensive tasks. If you are getting good speeds, then why even buy RAM? go out and get a bigger HD, it's a lot cheaper than a 512mb stick...

Tyler
Earendil

You're right there. Linux is still fairly small, unless you use a GUI and I understand the minimum requirements (from some Linux user's article) is 192MB which is higher than Mac OS X although recommendations are about the same.

Laptop users are definitely at a disadvantage on the page out writes. Someone mentioned recently that 5400 rpm drives are as quick on reads as 7200 rpm drives. Even though I find that difficult to believe--people may not noticed the difference but that's another story--they're not that quick on writes almost any time.

[jacobj]

You've chosen to isolate yourself on a tiny island that gets to pick and choose which parts of British law apply to it, so I'd say the lack of an iTunes music store there is not a major issue for the people of Jersey or Apple.

I started this thread off ages ago, and admit that I was more than a little hot headed.. just the dissapointment I suppose.

I am interested to see so many knowledgable people about, all of whom seem to be a little interested in Jersey. I was a little disturbed by the guy that posted information on the Jersey constitution..

Anyway.. as for the above quote: I am a little appalled: one has to assume that you assume that people aren't actually born in Jersey. I lived in London for 3 years, but chose to leave the City for a quieter life and start a family. When making that decision I decided to return home, to Jersey, the place where I was born and raised.

I love the fact that people seem to assume that we are all a bunch of money grabbing, law waivering fools. The truth is that the majority of people living in Jersey believe that the place is poorly managed and would like to see it changed.

In response to the other questions re what Apple actually did so poorly, I can't be bothered to go into it, but I will say that I have bought an iBook, PowerBook, iPod 2nd gen, Airport, numerous peripherals etc.. I have had few issues with the products themselves, and, to be honest, when I have had they have been rectified reasonably well: the issues I do have is the crap tracking system and case information site they have. It doesn't bloody work, nor does their delivery tracking sytem. As someone said above, you sometimes have to go through 3 or 4 different people before you get someone who can a) make a decision and b) has access to all the systems they need to help.
Someone also mentioned Dell's support line, which is manned and operated in India: the same is true of Apple (at least in the UK).

Anyway, my apologies for inciting so much reaction and the good news is that, having calmed down, the truth is I would rather eat off my own feet that return to a MS system.

OK.. enough said

PS... I just bought Airport Express and the iPod 4th gen 40gb...