Parallels, VMware, bootcamp or ?

[bjjp2]

Switched to Macs a couple of years ago and very happy, but I miss playing games that are only available for Windows. Would like to install Windows 7 on an iMac (or possibly a new Macbook) solely for the purpose of playing games. What's the best way to do it? Confused by all the options.
Thanks.

[1ofthedavids]

Switched to Macs a couple of years ago and very happy, but I miss playing games that are only available for Windows. Would like to install Windows 7 on an iMac (or possibly a new Macbook) solely for the purpose of playing games. What's the best way to do it? Confused by all the options.
Thanks.

It depends how intense your games are. If you're playing something like Sims or Solitaire, VMWare Fusion, Parallels, or VirtualBox would work fine. If you play games that are a bit more strenuous, Boot Camp is the best option since it runs natively instead of being virtualized.

[dkeninitz]

It depends how intense your games are. If you're playing something like Sims or Solitaire, VMWare Fusion, Parallels, or VirtualBox would work fine. If you play games that are a bit more strenuous, Boot Camp is the best option since it runs natively instead of being virtualized.

^ This. As for Parallels vs. VMWare, I prefer VMWare. It works amazingly well.

[LAS.mac]

Keep in mind that BootCamp and Virtural Box are free. And in VB you don't need to install windows, thus you don't have to buy a license.
BootCamp has, for me, tue disadvantage to require a reboot befor/after run it. Whereas the other run in a window inside mac OS.

[Disarm]

Keep in mind that BootCamp and Virtural Box are free. And in VB you don't need to install windows, thus you don't have to buy a license.
BootCamp has, for me, tue disadvantage to require a reboot befor/after run it. Whereas the other run in a window inside mac OS.

That is a small price to pay though. If you can sit at a red light, you can wait 45 seconds for the computer to re-boot.

[Vudoo]

I have bootcamp set-up and installed VMWare to use the bootcamp partition. If I need all the resources, I'll bootcamp it. If not, I'll just open up VMWare.

[bjjp2]

Keep in mind that BootCamp and Virtural Box are free. And in VB you don't need to install windows, thus you don't have to buy a license.
BootCamp has, for me, tue disadvantage to require a reboot befor/after run it. Whereas the other run in a window inside mac OS.

Why don't you need a license to install Windows under VB?

[MythicFrost]

Parallels have OK graphics performance, if you don't mind playing the (list of tested games) on medium/low (sometimes) high settings. If you want to play something that isn't on the list it may or may not work.

Boot Camp is your best option for gaming - that's what I do.
Parallels/VMWare are good for convenient gaming - you don't have to reboot, but you will get a little less performance I think and a lot less graphics performance. Oh and your comp has to have enough RAM/CPU/GFX MEM to dedicate to the Virtual Machine

Kind Regards

[viccles]

I am also in the same boat. Will VMWare 2 run Windows 7 ok? I know there is a new one being released sometime soon but I want to install my windows ASAP. Mainly will be using it to run word and SPSS (statistics program) and I don't want to have to boot into Windows.

[ravenvii]

I am also in the same boat. Will VMWare 2 run Windows 7 ok? I know there is a new one being released sometime soon but I want to install my windows ASAP. Mainly will be using it to run word and SPSS (statistics program) and I don't want to have to boot into Windows.

I do suggest you wait nonetheless. The new version coming soon supports Windows 7.

[viccles]

I do suggest you wait nonetheless. The new version coming soon supports Windows 7.

Looks like it comes out not next week, the week after. I can wait. I have been told that virtual box is a good alternative? I'm just a bit wary of programs you don't go buy at the store (I know next to nothing about this stuff)

[ravenvii]

Looks like it comes out not next week, the week after. I can wait. I have been told that virtual box is a good alternative? I'm just a bit wary of programs you don't go buy at the store (I know next to nothing about this stuff)

Yes, VirtualBox is a perfectly good alternative, and supports Windows 7 and Snow Leopard right now. The only things VMWare/Parallels are better at currently are graphics acceleration and user friendliness (not saying that VirtualBox is not user friendly, just that VMWare and Parallels has a more idiot-proof install process).

[Andy348]

Go for Parallels. It doesn't take long to start up/shut down and its cheap.

[MythicFrost]

I like Parallels 4.0, I'd wait for Parallels 5.0 but that may be a long wait - so you might want to get VMWare 3.0 - apparently it supports Aero in Windows 7 and Vista? does it also support the Flip 3D or whatever it's called?

Kind Regards

[viccles]

I think I might give Virtualbox a try, I really only do want Windows to be able to use SPSS mainly and perhaps word.

[MythicFrost]

Maybe Crossover for Mac might work with the particular programs you want to use?

Kind Regards

[viccles]

Maybe Crossover for Mac might work with the particular programs you want to use?

Kind Regards

Excuse my ignorance but I have never heard of Crossover for Mac?

[MythicFrost]

Crossover for Mac (http://www.codeweavers.com/products/cxmac/)
Always remember - Google is your buddy :)

Dad tried the trial and said it didn't work properly for him, but the programs he tried and wanted to use were not on their compatible programs list, but I've never tried it or used it myself.
Maybe download the trial and see how it runs for you. Personally I'd wait for Parallels 5.0 but if you can't then maybe wait for Fusion 3.0.

Kind Regards

[Buzz Bumble]

Excuse my ignorance but I have never heard of Crossover for Mac?

You don't want to hear about it either. It's hopeless.

CrossOver lets you run Windows applications in Mac OS X without actually having to install Windows ... and because it doesn't have Windows installed it's not really compatible with the Windows applications, unless your needs are EXTREMELY simple (it might just about run Mine Sweeper correctly). There's also a special version for gaming ... God help gamers trying to use it.

Don't waste your time with CrossOver (or any other WINE-based product). Use a proper product like VMWare, Parallels, BootCamp, VirtualBox with a real, licensed version of Windows instead, and save yourself a ton of headaches.

[MythicFrost]

You don't want to hear about it either. It's hopeless.


Good to know haha, I just thought it might be useful (having never used it), guess not :D

[viccles]

You don't want to hear about it either. It's hopeless.

CrossOver lets you run Windows applications in Mac OS X without actually having to install Windows ... and because it doesn't have Windows installed it's not really compatible with the Windows applications, unless your needs are EXTREMELY simple (it might just about run Mine Sweeper correctly). There's also a special version for gaming ... God help gamers trying to use it.

Don't waste your time with CrossOver (or any other WINE-based product). Use a proper product like VMWare, Parallels, BootCamp, VirtualBox with a real, licensed version of Windows instead, and save yourself a ton of headaches.

Yep, I've purchased a real copy of Windows 7 (an oem one) and am waiting for it to arrive but just am unsure whether to use VMWare or Virtualbox.

[MythicFrost]

I thought we had to wait until 22nd of Oct before we can purchase it?

Kind Regards

[Buzz Bumble]

You can probably pre-order Windows 7, just like you could with Snow Leopard.


I think VirtualBox is free, so you could download that and try it, but it is shareware / freeware, so it's not as user-firendly to set-up (or as someone said above, not as idiot-proof). VMWare, Parallels, and BootCamp are "proper" products by professional companies. :)

[viccles]

I guess I'll try Virtualbox first, and if that doesn't work I'll buy VMWare Fusion 3 when it comes out in 2 weeks

[xyzmax]

Does VirtualBox need to install window os first in order to work? Or can I just install window programs? Thanks,

[ravenvii]

You can probably pre-order Windows 7, just like you could with Snow Leopard.


I think VirtualBox is free, so you could download that and try it, but it is shareware / freeware, so it's not as user-firendly to set-up (or as someone said above, not as idiot-proof). VMWare, Parallels, and BootCamp are "proper" products by professional companies. :)

VirtualBox is as "proper" as the others. VirtualBox is not shareware or freeware, it is an open source project.

And to another poster above, VirtualBox is a virtualization program, just like VMWare and Parallels. In other words, yes you install Windows (or any other OS) on it.

[Buzz Bumble]

VirtualBox is freely downloadable and made by a group of basically hobbyists in their spare time. It is Freeware by very definition of the term. There are also a few other such applications around.

Parallels Desktop and VMWare Fusion are made by professional companies and are "proper" products. BootCamp is also a professional product, but isn't the same "application to run Windows" software.

[thermodynamic]

Switched to Macs a couple of years ago and very happy, but I miss playing games that are only available for Windows. Would like to install Windows 7 on an iMac (or possibly a new Macbook) solely for the purpose of playing games. What's the best way to do it? Confused by all the options.
Thanks.

Personally, Parallels is said to be more powerful, but when reading user reviews/comments, there is a LOT of consistency regarding stability and usability. I still get lured by the claim of higher performance, but re-reading any number of review sites where end users who've done the hard work all make the same complaints. That's a red flag.

If you need raw power, use BootCamp. However, VMWare Fusion 2 suits my few needs very nicely indeed. VMWare's been around. It's immensely simple to install and it doesn't act up when installing client OSes. You get what you pay for. :) Which is a silly statement; Parallels is only $10 less...

Then again, apart from a huge selection of games, my Mac does everything Windows does - only far better. And I only play one game, anyway... :D

[balamw]

VirtualBox is freely downloadable and made by a group of basically hobbyists in their spare time. It is Freeware by very definition of the term. There are also a few other such applications around.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VirtualBox

There are two versions of Virtualbox, the GPL one which is Open Source and the PUEL version which adds a few features and is distributed and licensed by Sun Microsystems, far from a bunch of hobbyists. The company that originally wrote VirtualBox, Innotek, also wrote key sections of Microsoft's Virtual PC solutions. Sun of course is famous today for Java and OpenOffice.

NOTE: You don't get USB device support or built in remote desktop protocol in the Open Source version. Here is a link to the Sun version http://www.sun.com/software/products/virtualbox/

EDIT: Since the OP is interested in games, I suggest the OP go with Boot Camp and then see how the reviews of Parallels 5 and VMWare Fusion 3 turn out when those products are released. As I understand it VBox is not as finely tuned for graphics as the other two are, yet. But the price is definitely right!

B

[dyn]

VirtualBox is freely downloadable and made by a group of basically hobbyists in their spare time. It is Freeware by very definition of the term. There are also a few other such applications around.

Parallels Desktop and VMWare Fusion are made by professional companies and are "proper" products. BootCamp is also a professional product, but isn't the same "application to run Windows" software.
I agree on the fact that Fusion and Parallels are more what you can call "proper products". I disagree on how you define "proper products".

VirtualBox is not made by basically a group of hobbyists in their spare time. Sun is the big company behind VirtualBox now and they are quite experienced in the virtualisation world. They are the driving force behind VirtualBox now. It is not entirely freeware since you need to have a license if you want to distribute the software (if you want to roll out VirtualBox on your network you need to have such a license, however, if you allow users to install VirtualBox themselves you do not need this license). The license you get with the freeware version is rather nice. As long as you are the user that is actually using the computer, you're allowed to install and use VirtualBox on the computer. This means you can install it on any machine you have. Most others like VMware don't allow this and require you to buy 1 license (or a license pack if I'm correct) for each computer you're using/installing it on.

The reason why I don't call VirtualBox a proper product has got something to do with the experience of the VirtualBox people (not being Sun), their support (guest OSs), features, stability and the horrible GUI. Fusion feels a lot more solid, has more (useful) features (especially regarding graphics and interaction between host and guest OS), has a lot more support for various OSs (guest), has an easy to use GUI (no need to import cd/dvd images before you can use them, no gazillion different windows) and is made by a company that has years and years of experience with virtualisation. Parallels is on par with Fusion though I don't really like to virtualise something like FreeBSD with Parallels since it seems more error prone than Fusion. Fusion and Parallels also seem to be a lot faster than VirtualBox.

Despite all this I like VirtualBox. It's a free and open source product which works quite well and can take on the big guys (VMware, Parallels, Microsoft) quite well. I think the competition needs to watch out for VirtualBox. If all you need to do is run Windows (and don't need fancy 3D graphics) than VirtualBox clearly takes the lead as it does it well but at no cost as opposed to the competitors. If you want to do a bit more you might be better of with Fusion or Parallels.

[Johnchapin]

What a struggle to get a decent image editor for a Mac. I really don't get it :confused: Lots of photo organizers out there, but the photo editors are sad.

I got Crossover for JASC Paint Shop Pro. I had heard that PSP 7 is compatiable. I only have CD's for PSP 6 & 8. (I must have upgraded 6 to 7 on-line.)

Don't even mention Corel (PSP 10 and beyond) :mad:, just the good old JASC :) For the criticisms look up Corel Paint Shop Pro on Wikipedia :mad:

Anyway, it has been a big struggle to get PSP 6 or 8 to work with Crossover, and I have given up :(

Plan B was to try Pixelmator. I might as well have signed up for a course in Chinese, and I'm too old for that :(

So Plan C is Boot Camp, Parallels, or VM. Thank you all for your comments on those :)

[Buzz Bumble]

What a struggle to get a decent image editor for a Mac. I really don't get it :confused: Lots of photo organizers out there, but the photo editors are sad.

iPhoto. Photoshop Elements. GraphicConverter. :)

[RickaG1]

It's been out for a couple of days. See my other post for issues installing the "upgrade" to Windows 7 from XP, and the solution.

Ricka

[Johnchapin]

iPhoto. Photoshop Elements. GraphicConverter. :)

Sorry, but iPhoto is very inadequate.

Photoshop Elements strikes me as a lead-in to buy the full version. A Wiki review is full of terms like targets enthusiasts, lacks many features that make it useful, cannot, without using a third-party plug-in, simplified, excludes, eliminates completely, simplified versions, and non-experts. I'm just an old grouch, but Adobe is not much above Corel on my list of preferred vendors.

Thank you for mentioning GraphicConverter. I had missed that one and it has possibilities. The user manual is one of the best for any software. Still, the reviews have the editing part as not ready for prime time.

So from reading this thread, I think the solution is to load Boot Camp and Paint Shop 8. The thing that has held me back from that is fear of performance issues, installing XP on a Mac :eek: :eek:, and to show my ignorance, fear of having to install the usual Windows routine of antivirus, firewall, antispyware, etc. I assume if you don't use the dark side for a browser, it's OK, but don't know for sure. Maybe they could make a good Mac TV ad on that theme :)

[Buzz Bumble]

Sorry, but iPhoto is very inadequate.

Photoshop Elements strikes me as a lead-in to buy the full version.

Thank you for mentioning GraphicConverter. I had missed that one and it has possibilities.

So from reading this thread, I think the solution is to load Boot Camp and Paint Shop 8.

There are others around. My monthly Mac magazine occasionally reviews one, but I can't recall any names. Try doing a search for "image editor", "photo editor", or similar at places like VersionTracker.com (http://www.versiontracker.com).

Scanners and cameras also often come with software of their own.

[Buzz Bumble]

I've never used it, but as far as I understand it from magazine tutorials, Photoshop Elements has almost everything Photoshop does with the exception of some expensive filters and "pro" tools. It may have a "beginners" mode that simplfies everything which can be turned off to make it a "real applciation".

Another option is Adobe FireWorks, although I don't know if you can buy that separately or only as part of the Adobe CS bundles ... it's also aimed more at web design.

There's also another shareware application I remembered stumbling across years ago and put in my Bookmarks. It's called Pixel (http://www.kanzelsberger.com/pixel). I'm not sure if it's still being updated (the downloads are dated 2009), but could be worth a try.