PDA

View Full Version : Someone explain to me the reason for the Apple TV...




mpb2000
Sep 1, 2010, 04:24 PM
What market is Apple trying to get into here? You can rent TV shows for $1 and movies for $5, or you can buy them and stream them to your Apple TV (but you have to have your computer on to do so). There isn't enough there to replace your cable company. I can just DVR anything on TV for the $5/month to go form a cable box to a DVR. You can stream Netflix, but almost everything does that (PS3, Xbox, most new bluray players, or you could just connect your computer to your TV). You can buy a bluray player for a little bit more than Apple TV and get an unlimited rental plan from netflix and use their streaming capabilities. I pay $15/month for Blockbuster online for unlimited rentals/in-store exchanges (better for me than Netflix since I have a Blockbuster 1/2 mile from my house and I was grandfathered into the unlimited in-store exchanges). At $5 a movie rental, I would only be able to rent 3 movies a month for the same price with Apple TV. Then there's Redbox: $1 per movie, or a little more for bluray. I just don't understand where this product fits...



NT1440
Sep 1, 2010, 04:26 PM
Hint, its not for people that already own all that crap. ;)

Simplicity is key, which is why apple has been marching forward in just about every front they've stepped into. Notice how they still acknowledge that this whole market needs to mature, hence why its still "a hobby."

miles01110
Sep 1, 2010, 04:28 PM
I just don't understand where this product fits...

Then don't buy it. I don't know or care how or why it fits into someone's life, because it doesn't fit into mine.

aristobrat
Sep 1, 2010, 04:38 PM
I pay $15/month for Blockbuster online for unlimited rentals/in-store exchanges (better for me than Netflix since I have a Blockbuster 1/2 mile from my house and I was grandfathered into the unlimited in-store exchanges).
Oh, that company that's expected to file for bankruptcy this month?

I just don't understand where this product fits...
The only thing that Apple's been clear about in regards to AppleTV is that they (Apple) don't have a definite plan for it. Nobody's hit a home-run when it comes to boxes like that. Even though it was never a hit, the people that owned AppleTVs apparently loved them, and Apple took their feedback and created this new version.

Did you see the part of the keynote where a lot of AppleTV customers never even figured out how to sync theirs with a computer? The new AppleTV seems aimed at THOSE people, not folks like you.

MacRumorUser
Sep 1, 2010, 04:46 PM
I want one for the bedroom. That way I can load a movie onto my iPhone or iPad and using airplay send it to my 32" tv and watch it on big screen without setting up any other bits n bobs. Simplicity.

Plus that price point makes Impulse purchase less of a big deal. :)

mpb2000
Sep 1, 2010, 04:51 PM
Hint, its not for people that already own all that crap. ;)


But that's my point. You could just buy a bluray player and sign up for netflix/blockbuster and save a bunch of money.

Oh, and I am well aware of Blockbuster's financial state, aristobrat, as is everyone else. Their demise has been predicted for, what, 5 years? In the meantime, I'll keep my awesome rental plan, and downgrade to netflix if/when Blockbuster finally does go under.

And miles, I'm not curious as to the exact niche Apple is looking to fill. Thanks for you insight, though.

gcmexico
Sep 1, 2010, 04:52 PM
I'm going to have to agree, the appletv is now mostly for the basic consumer, who just wants 1 click to watch...for people running full fledge media servers, with tons of movies, tv shows, video podcasts, netflix, huluplus...u still need a mini server with plex (now plex 9)...and still no answer for streaming movies you buy itunes to any apple device anywhere in the world...that would be revolutionary

kernkraft
Sep 1, 2010, 04:54 PM
Hint, its not for people that already own all that crap. ;)

Simplicity is key, which is why apple has been marching forward in just about every front they've stepped into. Notice how they still acknowledge that this whole market needs to mature, hence why its still "a hobby."

I think Apple should find a different hobby, like gardening. Or extreme kick-box.

NT1440
Sep 1, 2010, 04:56 PM
I think Apple should find a different hobby, like gardening. Or extreme kick-box.

Well thats great. I'm sure they'll be glad to make the millions they already do on ATV from just a hobby.

Seriously people, don't like it, don't buy, don't crap on the millions of AVERAGE (read NOT FORUM NERDS) consumers who buy and love apple products for what they are.

JSMencer
Sep 1, 2010, 04:59 PM
I think apple tv is a great idea. Yes it needs a little work, but I preordered one simply to be able to stream movies i have on my computer or rip to my computer to my tv. its all about simplicity. I think there is a niche for the product, and it won't be for everyone, I however am very excited for the product.

VirtualRain
Sep 1, 2010, 05:02 PM
There's no doubt that AppleTV is completely hobbled and at the mercy of the licensing deals Apple is able to get from the networks who are all scared to death at the prospect of disrupting their very lucrative legacy revenue streams.

I'm sure if Apple had it their way, none of us would need satellite or cable TV and a PVR.

The whole idea of pumping crap into my house by cable or satellite 24/7 and me having to setup a PVR (worth several hundred $) to capture it so I can then view it later in today's world is just archaic. Apple is on the right track, but the networks are stuck in the pre-internet era.

aristobrat
Sep 1, 2010, 05:04 PM
But that's my point. You could just buy a bluray player and sign up for netflix/blockbuster and save a bunch of money.
Right, so that covers movies, if you don't mind signing up for a recurring monthly subscription to have them mailed to your house (which doesn't serve people who just occasionally want to watch a movie), or if you don't mind doing the legwork and randomness of going out to a Redbox to fetch it yourself. There are going to be some people that like the immediacy and simpleness of being able to sit down on the couch on a Saturday night, turn on the AppleTV, and be able to watch the movie they want (not what just happens to have been mailed to them, or available to rent locally).

And if they also go out and get a DVR, they're covered for TV shows. As long as they remembered to program the DVR to record every single show they could possibly want to watch, and the DVR never misses recording an episode.

And if they went out and ponied up for one of the new networked TVs that does the DLNA stuff, they can install and configure some obscure software on their Mac that gets their music, photos and videos from their computer out to their TV?

There have always been "other solutions" for what the AppleTV has done. I see it SUPPLEMENTING cable TV, bluray players and DVRs, ... not replacing any of them.

NT1440
Sep 1, 2010, 05:04 PM
There's no doubt that AppleTV is completely hobbled and at the mercy of the licensing deals Apple is able to get from the networks who are all scared to death at the prospect of disrupting their very lucrative legacy revenue streams.

I'm sure if Apple had it their way, none of us would need satellite or cable TV and a PVR.

The whole idea of pumping crap into my house by cable or satellite 24/7 and me having to setup a device to capture it so I can then view it later in today's world is just archaic. Apple is on the right track, but the networks are stuck in the pre-internet era.

Amen brother. It's always been the providers holding back technology on this front. Just look at the CRAP DVR players that cable companies rent to you, HUGE, loud, slow, terrible UI.

Maybe they'll get it sooner or later, as a few are now investing in making their boxes not horrendous.

VirtualRain
Sep 1, 2010, 05:10 PM
Amen brother. It's always been the providers holding back technology on this front. Just look at the CRAP DVR players that cable companies rent to you, HUGE, loud, slow, terrible UI.

Maybe they'll get it sooner or later, as a few are now investing in making their boxes not horrendous.

Our only hope is to prove Apple is on the right track and the networks are laggards by getting on board... I intend to buy an Apple TV and start watching some programs on it. I may even cancel my cable at some point and sell my DVR, and if I can't get what I want legally via AppleTV or OTA, there's always other means.

Mykald
Sep 1, 2010, 05:10 PM
As someone who doesn't have a blu-ray player, and whose HDTV is 720p the apple tv is great for me. Of course I could hook my laptop up to my TV to stream netflix or youtube or iTunes, but apple tv simplifies that for me at a very reasonable price. So, while I understand some people do not need the apple tv, thus they don't see the reason for the apple tv, but some of us find the product to be exactly what we need, thus a mighty fine reason for the apple tv.

bobr1952
Sep 1, 2010, 05:12 PM
Hint, its not for people that already own all that crap. ;)

Simplicity is key, which is why apple has been marching forward in just about every front they've stepped into. Notice how they still acknowledge that this whole market needs to mature, hence why its still "a hobby."

I was wondering the same thing and your response seems as good as any--I guess if you can do all those things already, this is not a product you need. :)

idunn
Sep 1, 2010, 05:14 PM
Save your $99 and go to Amazon video on demand. Likely already built into your new HDTV. Or one of the many other video services Apple is supposedly competing with.

This new ATV offers nothing new, no advantage that I can see, and several distinct negatives, such as the inability to purchase content. If Mr. Jobs was wondering why the original ATV never took off, sure to be perplexed why this fails. With good reason.

Sigh . . .

NT1440
Sep 1, 2010, 05:15 PM
Our only hope is to prove Apple is on the right track and the networks are laggards by getting on board... I intend to buy an Apple TV and start watching some programs on it. I may even cancel my cable at some point and sell my DVR, and if I can't get what I want legally via AppleTV or OTA, there's always other means.
Apple is by no means the only company trying to advance this field.

Milfin
Sep 1, 2010, 05:19 PM
As someone who doesn't have a blu-ray player, and whose HDTV is 720p the apple tv is great for me. Of course I could hook my laptop up to my TV to stream netflix or youtube or iTunes, but apple tv simplifies that for me at a very reasonable price. So, while I understand some people do not need the apple tv, thus they don't see the reason for the apple tv, but some of us find the product to be exactly what we need, thus a mighty fine reason for the apple tv.

AHH ..
sitting here at work trying to figure out the wow factors with the new ATV.
It'll be good for people that have not made any investments towards a workaround solution for a great media experience.

I already invested in hardware for a storage solution.
Netflix is good but I have a dvd player/ps3/wii/xbox that does that now.

Let me know if there's additional features in the new ATV compared to old.

jason2811
Sep 1, 2010, 05:32 PM
This product was basically made for ME:

- Netflix is my primary source of TV/movie entertainment (except for shows such as Entourage and TrueBlood that I stream off of MegaVideo once per week)
- I NEVER buy DVDs. I usually watch a movie once and that is it. I have about 25 DVDs that I've never re-watched. I also don't trip DVDs or download movies from iTunes.
- I use Blockbuster occasionally. But since it is going out of business it is nice to be able to turn on ATV and pick a movie that was just released on DVD and watch it instantly.

The product is for people like me who like to consume one-time, rather than own.

DaveGee
Sep 1, 2010, 05:53 PM
Let me know if there's additional features in the new ATV compared to old.

Sure... It's running iOS and will be the odds on favorite to be the 1st set top box to run the apps being developed by the like of HBO, FiOS, DirecTV, TW and maybe even Cablevision as all as the host of apps being worked on right this minute by just about every major cable channel... As for not buying content this is an issue that will soon be resolved once the NC facility goes live.

I also find it amusing that people think Apple WANTS to have a subpar catalog of watered down HD movies... NOBODY has digital 1080p movies available for streaming over the internet ... not legally anyway. And for that matter .. Unless you've broken the DMCA you wouldn't have any 1080p content to stream locally either, unless you shoot lots of 1080p home movies. Now if that's the case Apple is probably thinking you're very much in the minority.

GermanSuplex
Sep 1, 2010, 06:06 PM
But that's my point. You could just buy a bluray player and sign up for netflix/blockbuster and save a bunch of money.

Say I read up on a show like Dexter, Lost or Bones. Yeah, I could go to the store, or get online, buy the Blu-Ray or DVD.... or I can get on iTunes and watch them, in HD quality, commercial free, and have the option to rent them or buy them to watch over and over.

On this same device, I can stream all of my DVD and CD encodes and have my entire library digitized and streamed to my HDTV with a great interface.

I use an iPad. I use an iPhone. I have a PC. I enjoy watching movies and TV shows. I bought Netflix for cheaper viewing of older titles like Futurama and Beavis and Butthead which I don't own. And now, I can use all these devices along with the Apple TV....

If you only watch a few shows on cable TV, then you probably don't have a need for this. If you don't watch a crapload of television but just pick and choose random titles here and there, Netflix or Hulu is probably good enough. If you enjoy watching a large range of stuff, what you want when you want, then the ATV and purchasing/renting gives more or added flexibility.

mpb2000
Sep 1, 2010, 06:30 PM
This product was basically made for ME:

- Netflix is my primary source of TV/movie entertainment (except for shows such as Entourage and TrueBlood that I stream off of MegaVideo once per week)
- I NEVER buy DVDs. I usually watch a movie once and that is it. I have about 25 DVDs that I've never re-watched. I also don't trip DVDs or download movies from iTunes.
- I use Blockbuster occasionally. But since it is going out of business it is nice to be able to turn on ATV and pick a movie that was just released on DVD and watch it instantly.

The product is for people like me who like to consume one-time, rather than own.

If Netflix is your primary source of TV and movies, why wouldn't you just buy a Netflix-enabled bluray player for $40 or $50 more than Apple TV? Then you can use Netflix for mailed DVDs/blurays and streaming to your bluray player. And you're covered for the 25 DVDs you own and Blockbuster that you use occasionally.

mpb2000
Sep 1, 2010, 06:38 PM
Say I read up on a show like Dexter, Lost or Bones. Yeah, I could go to the store, or get online, buy the Blu-Ray or DVD.... or I can get on iTunes and watch them, in HD quality, commercial free, and have the option to rent them or buy them to watch over and over.

On this same device, I can stream all of my DVD and CD encodes and have my entire library digitized and streamed to my HDTV with a great interface.

I use an iPad. I use an iPhone. I have a PC. I enjoy watching movies and TV shows. I bought Netflix for cheaper viewing of older titles like Futurama and Beavis and Butthead which I don't own. And now, I can use all these devices along with the Apple TV....

If you only watch a few shows on cable TV, then you probably don't have a need for this. If you don't watch a crapload of television but just pick and choose random titles here and there, Netflix or Hulu is probably good enough. If you enjoy watching a large range of stuff, what you want when you want, then the ATV and purchasing/renting gives more or added flexibility.

I watch a large range of stuff, from movies to lots of different TV shows, in the manner you describe. That is exactly why Apple TV would not work for me. If you found Lost and decided you wanted to watch the show from start to finish, you could rent every episode (121), assuming they're all available, for $121 from Apple TV. You can buy the entire series on DVD for $150 (or less if you buy it used and you can sell the set when you're done with it and make most of your money back). Or you can stream them all to a Netflix-enabled bluray player (again, only $40 or $50 more than the price of Apple TV) for the price you already pay for your Netflix service.

I'm not trying to tell anyone not to get Apple TV. By all means, go right ahead, enjoy it. I just don't see how the "pay per view" model works when there are services that offer unlimited rentals that you can stream in the exact same way (ie Netflix).

MUBiomed
Sep 1, 2010, 06:44 PM
I have a mac mini running SL that I have been using as an HTPC (minus the pc of course). Obviously it does not have hdmi out (its the last gen). Are the rental prices for movies/tv going to be the same ones available in the itunes store.

To be plain and simple is there any reason whatsoever to get this since I have the mac mini there. I am only interested if the pricing/no commercials tv shows are going to be any different from what I will be able to rent in itunes right on the mac mini.

jason2811
Sep 1, 2010, 07:00 PM
If Netflix is your primary source of TV and movies, why wouldn't you just buy a Netflix-enabled bluray player for $40 or $50 more than Apple TV? Then you can use Netflix for mailed DVDs/blurays and streaming to your bluray player. And you're covered for the 25 DVDs you own and Blockbuster that you use occasionally.

Because I want to be able to rent new releases instantly. Blockbuster near me is shutting down making it difficult to get new releases.

idunn
Sep 2, 2010, 12:56 PM
If you have a new HDTV, chances are you already have this. On-demand, 1080p, streaming movies and TV titles. No subscription required. All you need, other than the enabled HDTV, is a decent broadband connection:
http://www.vudu.com/product_overview.html

I haven't yet had the chance to try this. Sounds like anyone serious about their media may wish to. It is called Vudu.

87vert
Sep 2, 2010, 01:41 PM
To be plain and simple is there any reason whatsoever to get this since I have the mac mini there. I am only interested if the pricing/no commercials tv shows are going to be any different from what I will be able to rent in itunes right on the mac mini.

Not really this device is for people who don't already have a setup or want something that is easier to use.

The only reason I could think would you can probably sell the mini buy the aTv and make some profit.