I am Disappointed in the New Apple TV

WizardHunt · Oct 1, 2010

Hi Everyone,
I wanted to post my feelings on the new Apple TV. I had been using the older Apple TV and was very pleased with the performance of it. However whenever a company comes out with a new version, usually it performances better or has more features.

Well I own a Pioneer HD Plasma 50 inch TV and it displays 1080i. With my old Apple TV, it allows me to display the Apple TV content at a full 1080i which is a awesome picture. I use a HDMI hookup with audio cables with the older Apple TV. It works great. I stream everything so I don't use the hard drive inside the Apple TV.

Now to the New Apple TV. It is smaller that is great, but there are no audio connections at all which forces you to use the HDMI to hear audio. But if your TV receiver does not allow the sound with your HDMI then you are left with no sound only picture.

But the biggest complaint that matters to me is it only wants to connect at 720p option only. There is no adjustment to make or force it to go to 1080i. To me the picture quality between is 720 and 1080 is a big deal to me. So I took it off my system and put back my original Apple TV.

I would have liked to have the Netflex Movie Rentals but not that big of deal. So I will either keep it until I upgrade my TV or put it on Ebay for $89. I am deeply disappointed in how this turned out.

So with no sound from my Pioneer HD Plasma TV, and no 1080i is a no brainer for me to not install the new Apple TV.

Just to let you know, I am aware that you have to configure each unit connected to your TV, like DVR, VCR, ATV, etc, that you must tell it to use the HDMI connection for audio, which I did and still no sound in any of my units, so I am forced to use analog audio unfortunately.

Maybe it will work better when I buy my next TV. Mine is about 7 years old. Pioneer HD Plasma model # PDP5045 retail price MSRP $9000.00 but of course they came down in price and at the time I found mine on the internet for $5000.00. Thank God, now they all came down in price.

Anyway this is my opinion of the new APPLE TV.

On a 1-5 star rating I would have to rate it a 2 out of 5. On my older ATV I would rate it 4 out of 5 stars. Big difference.

Gromet · Oct 1, 2010

The New Apple TV has an optical out port on it so you can go to you reciever with the optical out and not have to depend on the HDMI for audio.

-Gromet

philipk · Oct 1, 2010

WizardHunt said:
But the biggest complaint that matters to me is it only wants to connect at 720p option only. There is no adjustment to make or force it to go to 1080i. To me the picture quality between is 720 and 1080 is a big deal to me. So I took it off my system and put back my original Apple TV.... Pioneer HD Plasma model # PDP5045

You have a very good early model plasma set.

That said, it must do a poor job up converting a 720p signal for the original ATV to look better.

The ATV HD signal is only 720p. For it to play on your 1080i native set it must be up converted. Using the original ATV, that unit is up converting to 1080i. Using the new ATV, the television is doing the up converting. Thus the original ATV does a better job.

Sorry to hear that you are having a problem.

One more thing to consider, is your Pioneer really 1080i native? Most early plasmas were 720p native that down converted the 1080i signal. Check your owner's manual.

WizardHunt · Oct 1, 2010

Gromet said:
The New Apple TV has an optical out port on it so you can go to you reciever with the optical out and not have to depend on the HDMI for audio.

-Gromet

Yes I am aware of the optical option but I only have one connection for my optical and that is from my TV Receiver's optical out to my 5.1 speakers. So I can not hook up just the ATV just to the optical or I will not hear sound from my blu-Ray player, dishnetwok and DVD player.

GTDaveMac · Oct 1, 2010

To most people and for most content 720p is the same as 1080i, if not better.

http://www.highdefinitionblog.com/?page_id=88

It's not the same as most people's complaint of no 1080p. (which I take the opinion the difference is not worth the bandwidth depending on size of your tv and how close you view it.)

Also, the digital optical out is onboard, and you can get a cable for a couple bucks online at places such ad monoprice.com

If your TV has Hdmi, it should have a digital audio in. If that digital audio is not optical, there is a converter for a nominal price.
http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...=10423&cs_id=1042302&p_id=2948&seq=1&format=2

Digital audio is superior to coax (RCA) as RCA doesn't pass Dolby 5.1 audio. If your tv or receiver doesn't have digital audio, there is an analog converter at monoprice for $25.
http://www.monoprice.com/products/p...=10423&cs_id=1042302&p_id=6884&seq=1&format=2

GTDaveMac · Oct 1, 2010

WizardHunt said:
Yes I am aware of the optical option but I only have one connection for my optical and that is from my TV Receiver's optical out to my 5.1 speakers. So I can not hook up just the ATV just to the optical or I will not hear sound from my blu-Ray player, dishnetwok and DVD player.

Just saw your last post... So why not hook up your apple tv to your receiver?

WizardHunt · Oct 1, 2010

philipk said:
You have a very good early model plasma set.

That said, it must do a poor job up converting a 720p signal for the original ATV to look better.

The ATV HD signal is only 720p. For it to play on your 1080i native set it must be up converted. Using the original ATV, that unit is up converting to 1080i. Using the new ATV, the television is doing the up converting. Thus the original ATV does a better job.

Sorry to hear that you are having a problem.

One more thing to consider, is your Pioneer really 1080i native? Most early plasmas were 720p native that down converted the 1080i signal. Check your owner's manual.

I checked my manual and it is a full 1080i native but since it is older there is no 1080p.

philipk · Oct 1, 2010

I just did a Google search, you set has 1280 × 768 pixels which means that it is 720p native.

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/p...1/189562688PDP5045HDOperatingInstructions.pdf

page 71

A 1080i would have a 1,920 x 1,080 resolution.

There must be some other issue as a native 720p signal to a native 720p should give the best picture.

With the original ATV set to 1080i the follow happens with your plasma set.

ATV up converts 720p to 1080i.

The Pioneer down converts 1080i to 720p and plays the video.

With the new ATV the following happens.

ATV sends a 720p signal to the Pioneer that plays it without any conversion.

WizardHunt · Oct 1, 2010

GTDaveMac said:
Just saw your last post... So why not hook up your apple tv to your receiver?

Well it is hooked up to the TV receiver. It uses 2 hdmi inputs one which is the ATV but still no sound. I can't figure out why. The other hdmi is hooked to a hdmi switch box that operates my blu-Ray player, my PS3, my dish network, and my DVD player/recorder. They too must have their own audio as the hdmi sound is not working on them either. Very frustrating. I use a audio switch box for all the others except apple.

tripjammer · Oct 1, 2010

WizardHunt said:
Hi Everyone,
I wanted to post my feelings on the new Apple TV. I had been using the older Apple TV and was very pleased with the performance of it. However whenever a company comes out with a new version, usually it performances better or has more features.

Well I own a Pioneer HD Plasma 50 inch TV and it displays 1080i. With my old Apple TV, it allows me to display the Apple TV content at a full 1080i which is a awesome picture. I use a HDMI hookup with audio cables with the older Apple TV. It works great. I stream everything so I don't use the hard drive inside the Apple TV.

Now to the New Apple TV. It is smaller that is great, but there are no audio connections at all which forces you to use the HDMI to hear audio. But if your TV receiver does not allow the sound with your HDMI then you are left with no sound only picture.

But the biggest complaint that matters to me is it only wants to connect at 720p option only. There is no adjustment to make or force it to go to 1080i. To me the picture quality between is 720 and 1080 is a big deal to me. So I took it off my system and put back my original Apple TV.

I would have liked to have the Netflex Movie Rentals but not that big of deal. So I will either keep it until I upgrade my TV or put it on Ebay for $89. I am deeply disappointed in how this turned out.

So with no sound from my Pioneer HD Plasma TV, and no 1080i is a no brainer for me to not install the new Apple TV.

Just to let you know, I am aware that you have to configure each unit connected to your TV, like DVR, VCR, ATV, etc, that you must tell it to use the HDMI connection for audio, which I did and still no sound in any of my units, so I am forced to use analog audio unfortunately.

Maybe it will work better when I buy my next TV. Mine is about 7 years old. Pioneer HD Plasma model # PDP5045 retail price MSRP $9000.00 but of course they came down in price and at the time I found mine on the internet for $5000.00. Thank God, now they all came down in price.

Anyway this is my opinion of the new APPLE TV.

On a 1-5 star rating I would have to rate it a 2 out of 5. On my older ATV I would rate it 4 out of 5 stars. Big difference.

Get with the times...this is 2010...You TV is 7 years old! WOW that is pretty incredible! Get a new HDMI 5.1 or 7.1 receiver!
Pioneer makes some good ones that are not that expensive.

The new AppleTV is way faster than the old one.

You only need HDMI in this day and age.

tripjammer · Oct 1, 2010

WizardHunt said:
Well it is hooked up to the TV receiver. It uses 2 hdmi inputs one which is the ATV but still no sound. I can't figure out why. The other hdmi is hooked to a hdmi switch box that operates my blu-Ray player, my PS3, my dish network, and my DVD player/recorder. They too must have their own audio as the hdmi sound is not working on them either. Very frustrating. I use a audio switch box for all the others except apple.

7 years ago they did not have HDMI! Are you sure it is not DVI? or is your TV a 2004 or 2005 model?

trip1ex · Oct 1, 2010

The problem here is the user. Next time don't order a product that doesn't have the ports/specs that you need for the equipment in your home.

YOu have nothing to be deeply disappointed about except yourself.

And btw, you can return the ATV and get a full refund.

philipk · Oct 1, 2010

trip1ex said:
The problem here is the user. Next time don't order a product that doesn't have the ports/specs that you need for the equipment in your home.

YOu have nothing to be deeply disappointed about except yourself.

And btw, you can return the ATV and get a full refund.

Agreed.

Though he didn't ask, I would recommend that he set his original ATV to 720p output. That will probably give him the best possible picture as it is native to his set.

mchalebk · Oct 1, 2010

WizardHunt said:
Well it is hooked up to the TV receiver. It uses 2 hdmi inputs one which is the ATV but still no sound. I can't figure out why. The other hdmi is hooked to a hdmi switch box that operates my blu-Ray player, my PS3, my dish network, and my DVD player/recorder. They too must have their own audio as the hdmi sound is not working on them either. Very frustrating. I use a audio switch box for all the others except apple.

If that manual that someone linked to earlier is for your TV, the audio should be working for all the HDMI inputs. Since it isn't working for any of them, I would suggest making sure you've set up the audio for your HDMI inputs correctly (I think I saw that it can be set to Auto, Digital or Analog).

Also, if that manual is correct, this TV is (as already mentioned) 720p native, not 1080i.

dagomike · Oct 1, 2010

It would be helpful it the TV model was listed. You also say TV receiver, but the lingo is that means two different devices, a TV and A/V receiver.

Anyway, it sounds like your setup may be too dated for the Apple TV limited connectivity. You were obviously on the bleeding edge back in the day, but as a result the I/O isn't very typical today. It could be possible your equipment is malfunctioning or set up incorrectly.

GFLPraxis · Oct 1, 2010

I like 720p better than 1080i, personally.

1080i has a higher pixel-count resolution, but it interlaces the images of the video, essentially flickering back and forth between 60 half-frames per second (odd lines, then even lines, odd lines, then even lines) and really only showing you 30 full pictures per second.

720p shows you 60 pictures per second. So motion looks cleaner and smoother.

It's a tradeoff between clarity of motion and pixel count. 1080p definitely will look better for still pics, but 720p arguably looks better for movies. Personally, I prefer 720p.

1080p, meanwhile, has 1080i's pixel count and 720p's cleaner motion. But you have an early model HDTV that doesn't have 1080p.

BoulderBum · Oct 1, 2010

Your TV is getting a bit long in the tooth and technology is beginning to pass it up. It's not a reason to be disappointed in the Apple TV, but maybe a reason to be disappointed in the aging equipment.

It's bound to happen sometime and probably with more and more devices.

It may sting to say this, but the 50" plasma you can buy for $800 today will probably have better picture quality than the TV you originally bought for $10,000. It will certainly have better connectivity!

That said, playback with the old Apple TV was never 1080p/i, it had a "1080i" setting, but that wasn't for video playback.

Also, you can consider buying an A/V receiver with analog outputs and surround sound speakers if you don't want to replace your TV.

dagomike · Oct 1, 2010

BoulderBum said:
Also, you can consider buying an A/V receiver with analog outputs and surround sound speakers if you don't want to replace your TV.

FWIW, it may also be able to upscale it to your liking.

LinMac · Oct 1, 2010

Am I the only one painfully disappointed in the new AppleTV?

DELETE THIS POST.

I did not write my post to be buried into another thread.

KeithJenner · Oct 1, 2010

LinMac said:
Content - Everyone has compared the AppleTV to the iPod and I think that is a fair comparison. Apple has released a media consumption device with a very nice interface and generally well thought out design with a fatal flaw: expensive or non-existent content. Where the iPod could accept ripped CDs or illegally downloaded MP3s directly or converted in seconds, the AppleTV has no such mechanism for DVDs or illegally downloaded video media. You buy from iTunes or convert via third party software.

You do realise that the ability to play illegally downloaded MP3's wasn't a specific feature of the iPod?

If you want for a device like Apple TV to be as easy to convert DVDs to as it is for CDs then you need to take that up with the film industry rather than Apple.

LinMac · Oct 1, 2010

KeithJenner said:
You do realise that the ability to play illegally downloaded MP3's wasn't a specific feature of the iPod?

If you want for a device like Apple TV to be as easy to convert DVDs to as it is for CDs then you need to take that up with the film industry rather than Apple.

Sorry Keith, I am unable to continue the discussion of this topic due to the moderator actions. Thank you for your reply anyway.

WizardHunt · Oct 1, 2010

philipk said:
I just did a Google search, you set has 1280 × 768 pixels which means that it is 720p native.

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/p...1/189562688PDP5045HDOperatingInstructions.pdf

page 71

A 1080i would have a 1,920 x 1,080 resolution.

There must be some other issue as a native 720p signal to a native 720p should give the best picture.

With the original ATV set to 1080i the follow happens with your plasma set.

ATV up converts 720p to 1080i.

The Pioneer down converts 1080i to 720p and plays the video.

With the new ATV the following happens.

ATV sends a 720p signal to the Pioneer that plays it without any conversion.

Ok, I checked on the page you said, and you are right the pixels are 1280 x 768. However my model is the PDP-505PU but is the same. So I stand corrected on this. But why does my TV display show 1080i on the display? When I connect some games it shows 720 and boy what a difference in quality.

WizardHunt · Oct 1, 2010

tripjammer said:
Get with the times...this is 2010...You TV is 7 years old! WOW that is pretty incredible! Get a new HDMI 5.1 or 7.1 receiver!
Pioneer makes some good ones that are not that expensive.

The new AppleTV is way faster than the old one.

You only need HDMI in this day and age.

Are you kidding me? Get with the times???? Not everyone can just go out and buy a new HD Plasma every couple of years. TV's should last 10 years minimum or longer. My next one I plan to have all the HDMI plugins I need at that time that I make the next purchase.

WizardHunt · Oct 1, 2010

tripjammer said:
7 years ago they did not have HDMI! Are you sure it is not DVI? or is your TV a 2004 or 2005 model?

Sorry about that, I checked my receipt and I did buy it in 2005 early May.

WizardHunt · Oct 1, 2010

trip1ex said:
The problem here is the user. Next time don't order a product that doesn't have the ports/specs that you need for the equipment in your home.

No the problem is not the user! This was ordered in 2005, not 2010. Back then HD was new, and this was the top of the line at that date. My next purchase will work out fine for me. But not until this TV dies, or I decide to move it to the bedroom.

I am Disappointed in the New Apple TV

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