back to the mac disappointing

[hoefler]

was it just as disappointing for you guys?

the most i was hoping for a 10.6.5 update because of the graphic card problems i'm having. not a word!

So is this going to get fixed or what? or did i actually payed 5000$ for a computer with a faulty graphics card here?:confused:

also New OS and all they can talk about is the appstore :confused:

oh and mbair looked sweet, but pricing sucks bigtime and core2duo - its almost 2011

[scottsjack]

Exactly!

To repeat myself from the Back to The Mac thread most of the Mac stuff was family-friendly, good-times stuff. My Macs aren't family computers with all kinds of cool and groovy kiddy stuff so a bit of performance info would have been nice.

The Finder's options are still weak, causing one to need third party add-ons, no all Apple software is multi-core friendly and Windows still does a far better job of making window adjustments flexible and easy.

The SJ/JI perversion for thinness seems to stress form over function. Both the mini and the MBA are less than modern computers from a performance pov.

If the mac as a pro machine concept falls apart next year at least Mac Pros make really great Window 7 machines.

[psychometry]

was it just as disappointing for you guys?

the most i was hoping for a 10.6.5 update because of the graphic card problems i'm having. not a word!
Apple events are pretty much in-person press releases meant to showcase their upcoming products. Why on earth would they talk about bugfixes?

So is this going to get fixed or what? or did i actually payed 5000$ for a computer with a faulty graphics card here?:confused:
I'm sure it'll get fixed but you won't hear about it in a press release.

[G4er?]

The SJ/JI perversion for thinness seems to stress form over function. Both the mini and the MBA are less than modern computers from a performance pov.


I would say that function is suffering because of form. Like putting the SD slot on the back of the mini just so the look on the front isn't disrupted. That's not what Mac's used to be about. It used to be, They Just Work. Now it's They Mostly Work (except when some feature interferes with the way we want it to look).

[kingtj]

As someone already said, this event was held to promote the new iLife '11 suite primarily, on the software side, and the Macbook Air update on the hardware side. Neither of those things targets hard-core "power users" directly. The new OS X Lion preview was just that; a sneak peek at things that aren't finished yet - just so people are aware that Apple's still doing things with OS X and not ONLY doing iOS stuff (as so many people keep claiming lately!).

I thought the concept of combining all the "screen management tools" like Expose, Dashboard and Spaces into a unified "Mission Control" was a GREAT idea, and should increase productivity for "power users" of the Mac along with everyone else.

Supporting the App Store for OS X could become a REALLY big thing, but as usual - most people don't seem to be able to take a long-term view of anything innovative? The mere fact that Apple allows developers to split profits 70% to 30% and the App Store handle update management for the users who purchase their app means it'll generate a considerable amount of interest in developing new software for the platform. (Look how many people wrote games and apps for the iPhone/iPad who weren't coding an OS X equivalent. Many of them will make the transition if it's as easy as porting it and submitting it the way they're already accustomed to doing now.)

As we all know from our computer history - Windows dominated the market because it managed to get the vast majority of the software coded for the platform. At the end of the day, the BEST operating system in the world is pretty useless to people if the apps aren't there to run on it!


was it just as disappointing for you guys?

the most i was hoping for a 10.6.5 update because of the graphic card problems i'm having. not a word!

So is this going to get fixed or what? or did i actually payed 5000$ for a computer with a faulty graphics card here?:confused:

also New OS and all they can talk about is the appstore :confused:

oh and mbair looked sweet, but pricing sucks bigtime and core2duo - its almost 2011

[RebootD]

I just don't care, as a Mac Pro user, about any multi-touch features. I have zero devices hooked up to this that can take advantage of them.

I'm all for them simplifying the interface but my apps are in my dock, I usually have my core applications running so I just cmd-tab to switch..

Well whatever, as long as they work on making my current hardware run faster I'll be happy.

Also, who wants to bet that "full screen mode" destroys any Adobe app come next summer? ;)

[C. Alan]

Supporting the App Store for OS X could become a REALLY big thing, but as usual - most people don't seem to be able to take a long-term view of anything innovative? The mere fact that Apple allows developers to split profits 70% to 30% and the App Store handle update management for the users who purchase their app means it'll generate a considerable amount of interest in developing new software for the platform. (Look how many people wrote games and apps for the iPhone/iPad who weren't coding an OS X equivalent. Many of them will make the transition if it's as easy as porting it and submitting it the way they're already accustomed to doing now.)



I am interested to see how the app store plays out. It is one thing to sell Iphone apps that for the most part price under $5, but softare for Macs and PC's in general goes for alot more per title. Will this allow smaller developers to compete without the publishing companies? Will the big companies flood the store with 'junk' ports?

I am in the process of learning Objective C, so this could get interesting for me.

[hoefler]

thing i'm worried about is that myt computer is going to look like a freaking commercial!

i bet there will be a permanent appstore icon of some sort in the finder window, comparable to the itunes store icon in itunes, i'll bet money on it!

next say hello to iads all over the screen...and IOS and ipad toy OS on a 5000$ computer i use for my professional work...?

Hope i'm wrong but this event was more like a "professionals hit the road" keynote. We get 1 hour of ilife crap about how easy it is to make picture books and how cool it is to make your own trailer with the use of some lame templates, and we had the crowd going nuts...lol mac"pro"

[scottsjack]

thing i'm worried about is that myt computer is going to look like a freaking commercial!

i bet there will be a permanent appstore icon of some sort in the finder window, comparable to the itunes store icon in itunes, i'll bet money on it!

next say hello to iads all over the screen...and IOS and ipad toy OS on a 5000$ computer i use for my professional work...?

Hope i'm wrong but this event was more like a "professionals hit the road" keynote. We get 1 hour of ilife crap about how easy it is to make picture books and how cool it is to make your own trailer with the use of some lame templates, and we had the crowd going nuts...lol mac"pro"

Like I noted earlier Macs do make great Windows computers. While I prefer to use Mac OS X Windows 7 isn't all that bad and does have some performance advantages over SL.

I dread the thought of going back to Windows as my primary OS but Steve will let us know within a year what the true path for OS X is. While I don't believe that he'll turn it into an app-happy, ad-happy, closed system, giant iToy one never knows with that guy. He's probably the most openly greedy person on the planet.

[brentsg]

He's probably the most openly greedy person on the planet.

See I'll never understand comments like this. Jobs has one objective, and that's to maximize shareholder value. He's doing this.

Greed comments attributed to a CEO are nothing but comedy, regardless of what company is being targeted.

[reel2reel]

He's probably the most openly greedy person on the planet.

I respect that so much more more than the secretive, lying, backstabbing, self-absorbed people I've ever known (a lot). More power to Steve.

[Major Reeves]

Only consumer related crap, HD4870 pulled out, no word on the HD5870, no word on xcode 4 and no word how 10.7'll be under the hood.

[philipma1957]

See I'll never understand comments like this. Jobs has one objective, and that's to maximize shareholder value. He's doing this.

Greed comments attributed to a CEO are nothing but comedy, regardless of what company is being targeted.

so greed is good. where have I heard that?

greed is not good by definition it is always in excess of what is needed. thus causing ones self damage.
you are confusing greed with growth . all truly greedy CEO'S Need to be fired as they are hurting their business with excessive gain and growth.

enough of the english lesson. I don't think Steve Jobs is greedy in the least. I think he is practicing sound business for his company. For example Mac Air books will truly die off due to the flash memory. most likely in the 4th or 5th year of use After applecare expires. true junk and he did mention how easy they are to recycle them. That sound like a business plan to me.

[Bernard SG]

I don't think Steve Jobs is greedy in the least. I think he is practicing sound business for his company.

+1
The way Steve Jobs leads Apple is centered on finding the optimal win/win solution for all stakeholders: Apple, consumers, developers, content creators...
The optimal is not something that works for 100% of people 100% of the times; there are compromises. Those who don't like the compromises are free not to opt-in.

[yoink]

I just don't care, as a Mac Pro user, about any multi-touch features. I have zero devices hooked up to this that can take advantage of them.

Magic Trackpad is amazing for both FCP and Logic Pro. I barely use the Euphonix transport surface in FCP anymore since the gestures are so much quicker than both the jog/shuttle (on the MC Transport) and some of the keyboard shortcuts they replace!

Same goes for Motion. I can't imagine going back to a mouse now. And I only picked it up since I got so used to the exposé and browser features on a Macbook Pro trackpad. Then I discovered the $79 device mostly replaced a $450 add-on to a control surface setup.

Speaking of which, I have an Euphonix MC Transport for sale.

[bvp663]

Magic Trackpad is amazing for both FCP and Logic Pro. I barely use the Euphonix transport surface in FCP anymore since the gestures are so much quicker than both the jog/shuttle (on the MC Transport) and some of the keyboard shortcuts they replace!

Same goes for Motion. I can't imagine going back to a mouse now. And I only picked it up since I got so used to the exposé and browser features on a Macbook Pro trackpad. Then I discovered the $79 device mostly replaced a $450 add-on to a control surface setup.

Speaking of which, I have an Euphonix MC Transport for sale.

This is the first positive review of the magic trackpad by a creative professional I've read. Does FCP have multitouch gestures built into it?

[RebootD]

I use a 6x11in Wacom Intuos3.. with a pen so I really don't need,or want, another input device but I'm glad it worked out for you.

Magic Trackpad is amazing for both FCP and Logic Pro. I barely use the Euphonix transport surface in FCP anymore since the gestures are so much quicker than both the jog/shuttle (on the MC Transport) and some of the keyboard shortcuts they replace!

Same goes for Motion. I can't imagine going back to a mouse now. And I only picked it up since I got so used to the exposé and browser features on a Macbook Pro trackpad. Then I discovered the $79 device mostly replaced a $450 add-on to a control surface setup.

Speaking of which, I have an Euphonix MC Transport for sale.

[hoefler]

if this keynote showed us anything it was the fail of the magic mouse and hilarious mouse gestures just to get something done. It looked pretty retarded.

i can only agree with the guys whom said that its form above function with Apple. Me as a person who almost exclusively uses his computer for work could care less about how my machine looks, i just want performance and a computer that works.

I'm a fairly new mac user and without stepping on someones toes, I'm in no way impressed, on the contrary, with all this video card drama and now the future of the OS witch is probably going to make my computer look like a freaking commercial i regret switching to Mac

probably a weird taught but i kind of think that if the Microsoft/windows people have seen this keynote (and I'm sure mr gates, steve balmer and top windows developers have) i think they would have really been laughing or must have said WTF...full screen mode for lion, windows is able to run software in full screen mode since 98, loads of hoopla over some trailer templates to make fun video's, and woah! picture books...appstore for mac....an outdated and overpriced notebook that just looks good

In the future its going to be Apple who decides which app we can and can not install, they are moving towards controlling everything about how we use our computer...hope i'm wrong but if this is the case, i won't hesitate one sec. to go back to windows

[pastrychef]

It's a beta.

I don't understand what you mean by looking like a freaking commercial. But I regret you switched to a Mac, too.

If you want a good laugh, you need to google "BSOD on stage".

No one ever said the App store is the only means of purchasing or installing apps.

[mikerr]

if this keynote showed us anything it was the fail of the magic mouse and hilarious mouse gestures just to get something done. It looked pretty retarded.
Agreed - too many gestures, he should have been using the bluetooth trackpad, or a TOUCHSCREEN

The iOS inspired homescreen and homescreen folders, also screamed touchscreen to me - the only reason Jobs talked down the idea of a touchscreen macbook is that they aren't releasing one yet - as OS X isn't ready for it, but Lion may be - nothing really to do with vertical orientation.

Come late next year or 2012, Apple will bring out a touchscreen macbook, proclaim it revolutionary, and conveniently forget all that vertical orientation crap.

[hoefler]

It's a beta.

I don't understand what you mean by looking like a freaking commercial. But I regret you switched to a Mac, too.

If you want a good laugh, you need to google "BSOD on stage".

No one ever said the App store is the only means of purchasing or installing apps.

hey chill man, don't take it personal... i'm just talking about a computer brand, not your mama

[Hisdem]

hey chill man, don't take it personal... i'm just talking about a computer brand, not your mama

Yeah but if you talk something that clearly isn't correct with such a senseless basis, do you just expect people to agree with you? The real troll here would be you, because if someone criticizes what you say you just call them a fanboy and don't use valid arguments against their criticism.

I do agree though, that the Magic Mouse was a fail on stage yesterday.

[hoefler]

Yeah but if you talk something that clearly isn't correct with such a senseless basis, do you just expect people to agree with you? The real troll here would be you, because if someone criticizes what you say you just call them a fanboy and don't use valid arguments against their criticism.


ah quit the troll stuff will ya, its getting old, everytime some guy says something negative about Apple he's either a troll, talking crap or not correct "yawn"

whats not correct about me saying i kind of regret moving to Apple...so you guys can look inside my brain somehow or know me personaly? whats not correct when i say that i'm having video card problems on my 5000$ computer AND most people on here act as if it "normal" and "OK" because hey guess what "its Apple, and Apple is great". If i don't like the way its going with Apple than thats my point of view, and here's a new one, but you don't have to agree just as i don't have to agree with people who like how its going, its called "an opinion" forums are here so people can post opinions, no need to make it a personal thing or take it personal. for some twisted reason when you give some critique about Apple products on macrumors your a troll and or getting payed by Microsoft to go around the internet and post negative stuff about the Almighty Apple Co. (yeah someone actually send me a PM claiming i'm getting payed by microsoft ) ....go figure

i'm not calling him a fanboy because he doesn't agree with me, I'm calling him a fanboy because he's taking stuff personal and can't look beyond the fact that there are in fact customers whom are not happy with good reason, like i said i'm talking about a computer brand man, why on earth would he regret me switching to mac LOL, is it coasting him money, am i ruining his day, is it a closed community....please fill me in??:confused:

[pastrychef]

I agree that the method used to activate Mission Control needs work. A three finger swipe on a trackpad may work great, but on the Magic Mouse, it requires that I release my fingers from the side of the mouse and, while swiping, the mouse itself has a tendency to move.

[Hisdem]

Well, of course you can be disappointed on your switch to Mac. I'm not here to say Apple is good or if it's bad or if it's better. But, if we are going to say they screwed up, let's use valid arguments.

You are having problems on your Mac Pro, which is a very expensive machine. It's a machine, it can fail. HOWEVER, if the problem you are having was common, and many people had it, then I would agree with you. Did Apple refuse to replace it for you or something? Because if they didn't I don't see a reason for you to be that angry. Of course it was expected to work fine the first time, but if it didn't try again. It's a machine, it CAN, and WILL fail. The only question is when. Fun thing is I don't see anyone complaining about MS or so when your PC freezes or needs re formatting. They consider that "normal".

So why is it Apple can't make a mistake and others can?

[philipma1957]

so they won't replace the card? your machine is new why won't they give you a new card? I have a 2010 with the 5870 card it is working. what is wrong with your card.

BTW I am having both USB2 and FW800 issues with my machine. I have a work around with the USB2 I purchased a USB2 pcie card. I had planned to do so now I had to do so. My machine was 2700 so I am annoyed about the fw800 problem. I am not looking to buy a pcie card for fw800 but my fw800 wants to run at fw400 speeds.

[yoink]

This is the first positive review of the magic trackpad by a creative professional I've read. Does FCP have multitouch gestures built into it?

Yes it does.

[B]FCP:
Rotate to scrub. Three fingers up and down (home to end), three finger swipe to jump from clip to clip, pinch to zoom (both clips and timeline.) The trackpad sped up my work flow the most here.

Admittedly it just took place of the arrow keys, Command +/-, Home/End BUT because I would use those keyboard commands with my right hand and need the mouse, that hand would move a lot, while my left and can do all the other keyboard commands. Now I can keep my left hand running the keyboard and my right hand on the track pad.

Motion:
The finger swipe (reveal/hide "project pane"), three finger scroll (reveal/hide timeline), two finger 2d scroll (adjust preview/canvas location), pinch to zoom (as it should be but far far better than either command +/- or selecting the zoom percentage since there are no steps with the trackpad.)

Logic:
Logic is far more limited with the track pad, but my biggest issue with Logic in 10+ years of using it was the zooming and scrolling. Actually, I've always found that to be an interface issue with most applications... but that for another time.

The trackpad's pinch to zoom (horizontal zoom) and alt two-finger scroll (vertical zoom), combined with the two finger 2-d scroll (to move in any direction) sped up my editing workflow to no end. I always found the silly ball in the Mighty Mouse a setup up from nothing, but still clumsy. As with most gestures, the quick scrolling behaviour became second nature within, say, 30 minutes.

Rotate will move the active fader too. That one I don't like since I already have a much more sensitive set of faders in a control surface, but for someone only wanting a Faderport or something simple like that it could very well be the ticket.

---

I had an intuos tablet for a while. I didn't like it. I'm not saying it was bad really, just not for me.

And to the person saying "too many gestures" I thought the same, until I started using them. Muscle memory is so quick and powerful... Once you use them a couple of times, you stop thinking about it and just, well, move.

[George Knighton]

So why is it Apple can't make a mistake and others can?

I think that the problem could be that Apple & Jobs have an evidently undying commitment to producing items that "just work" for the overwhelming majority of people who use electronic devices.

This philosophy is responsible for both the extreme and loud dissatisfaction in those few cases where somebody just doesn't get it or ends up with an item that isn't working for him, and those cases where a user is looking for a Windows-like tweaking environment that provides infinite customising potential AND an infinite opportunity for totally screwing up your device.

Apple is never going to satisfy everybody because of the basic direction they are taking and evidently will continue to take, just providing an adequate decently performing environment for the majority of people, and trying their hardest to keep them out of trouble. They don't seem to want to be on the cutting edge, necessarily.

The particular old man who is typing this is 55 years old, and only at this late point in life has he realised that he no longer has the time to play with systems or fool around with anything except producing the work and enjoying real life. :-) And this is putting me into the Apple Camp in a way that is shocking people. I've been playing with Windows forever and I just don't have time for it any longer.

This doesn't help the original poster with his complaint, of course.

[reel2reel]

This is the first positive review of the magic trackpad by a creative professional I've read. Does FCP have multitouch gestures built into it?

Really? There have been whole threads about it. Just sayin.

[reel2reel]

[B]FCP:
Rotate to scrub. Three fingers up and down (home to end), three finger swipe to jump from clip to clip, pinch to zoom (both clips and timeline.) The trackpad sped up my work flow the most here.

Also, two fingers to scrub video, which is awesome. The scrolling of the timeline alone is worth the price, especially when using a large timeline.

EDIT: Sorry, I keep forgetting about multi-quote!

[ActionableMango]

It's understandable that Back to the Mac would be disappointing for creative professionals, but it wasn't meant for that audience anyway. The particulars of certain video card models and Mac Pro bugfixes might excite certain people in this forum, but they do not make for an existing national press event.

The Mac Pro was recently updated, so nobody should have expected an announcement so soon.

As for Lion, we really don't know what it's all about yet. The main piece of news is the Mac app store, which needs to be announced early because they need to get developers on board. Everything else they will keep a secret as long as practical to keep the rumor engines running and the competition on its toes. This is always the way it has been.

You just weren't the particular audience intended for this particular event. No worries though, Apple will get around to updating the Mac Pro again, and the pro apps too.

[hoefler]

Well, of course you can be disappointed on your switch to Mac. I'm not here to say Apple is good or if it's bad or if it's better. But, if we are going to say they screwed up, let's use valid arguments.

You are having problems on your Mac Pro, which is a very expensive machine. It's a machine, it can fail. HOWEVER, if the problem you are having was common, and many people had it, then I would agree with you. Did Apple refuse to replace it for you or something? Because if they didn't I don't see a reason for you to be that angry. Of course it was expected to work fine the first time, but if it didn't try again. It's a machine, it CAN, and WILL fail. The only question is when. Fun thing is I don't see anyone complaining about MS or so when your PC freezes or needs re formatting. They consider that "normal".

So why is it Apple can't make a mistake and others can?

everybody's entitled to make a mistake, and nothing is perfect, but thats not even the point. All i said was that i don't like how things are going and that i regret moving to Mac especially after yesterday's keynote.

And yes they did change the graphics card but guess what...same exact problem, and its not as if i'm the only one having the problem, the Internet and Mac forums are loaded with people complaining about the same problem, yet apple isn't even talking about it and leaving its customers to hang without knowing if its going to get fixed or what???

And before you say that Apple might not be aware of the graphics card problem, when they were checking my specs, the guy actually said there were known problems with this exact graphics card, when i asked how its going to get fixed all he could do was a repair. i had a repair and its again faulty....called again same story, this time they actually told me that another repair could come up with the same problem, they just couldn't guarantee this graphics card was ok. And before someone claims that this story is trolling, its not, believe me i'd rather have a working machine instead of going trough all this trouble, i payed close to 80 Euro's for calling Apple about the graphics card problem (try resetting the memory or something etc if it doesn't work call again...called again, and again and again). When i asked him if there was some kind of refund for the money i was throwing out the window for constantly calling them and since its their system that is faulty and that i shouldn't have to lose money over it they just said "sorry we are afraid we can't pay you back or compensate you for that"

From a customer point of view i'd be happy if Apple at least let us know something, if its going to get fixed yes or no, but not a word and thats whats frustrating me, and this is one of the main reasons why i regret moving to mac...they know there is a problem somehwere with the graphics card but they just don't step forward and admit it or do something about it, i feel as if allot of money was payed for this computer, and now that they have the money they don't even care if the machine works or not, its kind of like " go figure it out, well communicate about the problem whenever we feel like it, might as well be never"

[ActionableMango]

Well if you expect Apple Keynotes to be discussions on your graphics problems, then prepare to be disappointed with every Keynote.

[philipma1957]

>>>..... i payed close to 80 Euro's for calling Apple about the graphics card problem....

WHY do you spend money to call apple don't they have a free phone number. Where are you located?

[Hisdem]

Well if you expect Apple Keynotes to be discussions on your graphics problems, then prepare to be disappointed with every Keynote.

I was about to say this. I understand the OP's disappointment, but it's totally childish to think that they will talk about your problem on a press release, sorry.

[hoefler]

WHY do you spend money to call apple don't they have a free phone number. Where are you located?

No they don't have a free number here its a 070 number from where I'm located, they give 90 days support trough phone but the coast of the phone call are not covered. Even if i'd had Apple care i would still pay the phone coast.

And yes, i do understand that keynotes aren't going to talk about faulty graphic cards and maybe i should clarify some things...when the keynote was announced lots of forums including in macrumors macpro section people were like "yes there is going to be a 10.6.5 update, bug fixes..etc since Lion was going to be just a sneak preview allot of people thought "well at least they will give us some update. So i was hoping that this indeed would be a fact, maybe a bit naive but i don't know how these keynotes work out or what comes out of them. Guess i thought there was going to be an update announcement and with that some firmware update or bug fixes for a well documented problem and that i could finally start enjoying my computer. After the keynote not a word and i checked for maybe a silent update but nothing so yeah...its super disappointing because this means that again i'm left in the cold by Apple, in the meantime i'm working on a 5000$ newly few weeks old MacPro that sometimes only displays static, every time i have to unplug the monitor cable and plug it back in.

[roadbloc]

was it just as disappointing for you guys?
New OS X (which looks great so far),
New iLife,
App Store (long overdue).

Not one bit disappointing. Lion looks great and I can't wait to see what it has to offer.

[Mackilroy]

And yes, i do understand that keynotes aren't going to talk about faulty graphic cards and maybe i should clarify some things...when the keynote was announced lots of forums including in macrumors macpro section people were like "yes there is going to be a 10.6.5 update, bug fixes..etc since Lion was going to be just a sneak preview allot of people thought "
Unfortunately, nobody outside of Apple knew exactly what was going to happen, so basing your hopes on speculation is folly.

[zap2]

Those events are never for small 10.6.4 -> 10.6.5 updates.


The Air is an very nice products for the market it is aiming at. Which may not be you.

[RebootD]

Those events are never for small 10.6.4 -> 10.6.5 updates.


The Air is an very nice products for the market it is aiming at. Which may not be you.

I was just holding out hope for a surprise 10.6.5 release + 5870 availability in the Apple store.:D