Nintendo...is their fate the same as Sega's?

[Doom.exe]

Considering its compeditors, can Nintendo continue? Its purple console new little DS doesn't play dvds or go online. And with games being of poorer quality when compared to past games of Nintendo or current games from Sony and Microsoft will Nintendo survive? Its deathgrip on the handheld market was keeping Nintendo on life support but with the launch of the PSP in Japan and later on in America will we see Mario and Link on the X-Box 2 and PS3?

[jadam]

Ummm

PSP doesnt play DVDs or go online either, whats you point?

Ohh if your point was that Nintendo has only sold 1.5million DSs and Sony has sold 200k PSP's, yeah, Nintendo is definetly going to die out.

[jaseone]

Smells like a troll bt I'm in a biting mood...

Purple? I must be colorblind... To me it looks platinum/silver/aluminium/shiny grey or whatever you want to call it but definitely not purple.

Doesn't go online? Huh? It has 802.11B WiFi built in.

Doesn't play DVD's? Big whoopy do, neither does the PSP and frankly disc based media in a handheld console is just asking for trouble in my opinion.

Nintendo isn't going anywhere so just get used to it, okay? They know what they are doing and they are damn good at it, just look at how profitable they are and no they aren't about to rest on their laurels either.

[Gyroscope]

Ummm

PSP doesnt play DVDs or go online either, whats you point?

Ohh if your point was that Nintendo has only sold 1.5million DSs and Sony has sold 200k PSP's, yeah, Nintendo is definetly going to die out.

PSP does play DVD's (in simplistic terms, UMD disc is actually shrinked DVD disc). Nintendo sold 1.5 mil DSs both in Japan and in US. PSP has only been sold in Japan in low quantities because Sony couldn't ship any more. Besides, no one is saying that Sony will instantly de-throne Nintendo in hand-held area. Even if Sony takes one third of Nintendo market share that could be disastrous for Nintendo bottom line.

Cheers

[risc]

Ohh if your point was that Nintendo has only sold 1.5million DSs and Sony has sold 200k PSP's, yeah, Nintendo is definetly going to die out.

Actually the PSP does have 'net connectivity if you have it working with your wireless access point, but all it does so far is use it to get firmware updates (that don't exist yet) from the internet. It's an interesting feature for the future though.

Also your figures are incorrect in the lead up to New Years Eve Sony sold 510,000 PSPs which was 100% of what they had manufactured. The reason Sony haven't been making more is they can't build the graphics processors fast enough to meet the demand. From what I've heard even Nintendo are having a hard time meeting demand, but with Sony projecting to have sold 3M units by March, and Nintendo saying 5M for the DS it's hard to say who will win this war if anyone. Based on my experience with both consoles I personally think they'll just continue selling since they aren't really targeted at the same crowd imho.

[jaseone]

PSP does play DVD's (in simplistic terms, UMD disc is actually shrinked DVD disc)

Yes but can you grab a DVD from your home collection, insert it into the PSP and watch it? I think not...

Nintendo sold 1.5 mil DSs both in Japan and in US. PSP has only been sold in Japan in low quantities because Sony couldn't ship any more. Besides, no one is saying that Sony will instantly de-throne Nintendo in hand-held area. Even if Sony takes one third of Nintendo market share that could be disastrous for Nintendo bottom line.

And you know this how exactly? There is so much hyperbole and BS being thrown around about the demise of Nintendo it is just amusing and I just don't get it...

There is a reason the Nintendo makes it's handheld systems like it does, they are handheld systems designed to be portable AND played on the go hence their design and the games available for them, they simply just do the job and do it elegantly.I love being able to throws my GBA SP into my backpack and have it there when I'm bored at an airport, in a hotel or whatever place I find myself with time on my hands as it is compact AND is easy to pick up and just play games on.

The PSP has been touted as being close to a handheld version of a PS2, don't you think Nintendo could EASILY do a similar thing? Don't you remember other companies trying to do it in the past? Heck they were competing with the ORIGINAL Gameboy, which weren't the most compact devices and only had monochrome displays yet they did their job and did it well and people loved them for it.

Personally I think Sony has gotten the handheld market very wrong but only time will tell.

[TEG]

Your argument has many problems.

1) The GameCube has the ability to go online for game play, but developers are not developing games to use it, because it is similar to X-Box Live (A crappy idea BTW) but run by AOL, who is a dying company (this is helping). Nintendo should have gone the route of Sony and made Online play the responsibility of the manufacturers.

2) The Nintendo DS and Nintendo Game Boy (DS plays GB games, but they are not of the same family), sell very well. Nintendo will likely report sales growth this last year.

3) The PSP plays movies, or video, as does the GBA and DS via GameBoy Video cartridges, and the GameCube, via the GameBoy Player. The PS2 plays DVD's and the GameCube doesn't, but the GameCube is easier for developers to develop for, because they don't have to deal with the DVD player.

4) The GameCube (for that matter the X-Box) uses industry standard parts, that have been tweaked. The GameCube basically uses a G3 with modified registers, making it easier to develop for. The PS2 uses a proprietary 128-bit Processor which cost a lot of money to develop for, because of special hardware that needs to be purchased.

I will agree that Nintendo is currently stagnant, but really so is M$ and Sony. At least Nintendo has a cool new device, that enough people have already used to workout whatever kinks might exist.

I would like to see Nintendo come out with a smaller version of the GC, maybe 4 inches cube, with built in Modem and NIC, with the port on the bottom for the GB Player.

Personally, I think M$ has one more lackluster console up its sleeves before dropping out of the market forever.

BTW. I do not own a GameCube. I have a PS2 won at a raffle, and I enjoy the GTA series. On the PS2 there are currently 11 games I want to own and play, on the X-Box 2, and on the GameCube 83.

TEG

[neoelectronaut]

Okay, let's say that the Gamecube turned out to be a major flop of 3DO and Jaguar proportions...would Nintendo go out of business?

Nope. Two words.

Game Boy.

The Gameboy Advance and the systems before it sold well, very well, VERY VERY WELL.

No matter what happens, Nintendo has a bonafide success on their hands with their Gameboy line, and more money in the bank to back that up than you probably realize.

[neoelectronaut]

The PSP has been touted as being close to a handheld version of a PS2, don't you think Nintendo could EASILY do a similar thing? Don't you remember other companies trying to do it in the past? Heck they were competing with the ORIGINAL Gameboy, which weren't the most compact devices and only had monochrome displays yet they did their job and did it well and people loved them for it.

You make a very good point. The Game Gear was basically a portable Master System, and was much, much more powerful than the Gameboy. Bigger, brighter (backlit) screen, colors, and overall better graphics.

Did it overtake the Gameboy? In the end, no, though it lasted the longest of all of the Gameboy's competitors.

Did the New Geo Pocket Color, Atari Lynx, or Sega Nomad success because their hardware was superior? Nope. Don't count Nintendo out just quite yet because "OMG TEH PSP HAS TEH BETTAR GRAPIX!!11"...

[lordmac]

OK there are some facts that people are stating them are wrong/need clarification. So im not gonna takes side plus the whole ds vs psp argument just happen on anther thread so. First off doom.exe I think ment that the gamecube system dosn't play dvd's and is purple not the ds(I think it was just a typo sort of thing.). As for you teg, Aol has nothing to do with gamecube, I work there I should know. It is possible that nintendo made the online adapter software able you use it as its connection (which dose make since because they have about 25 million members, most of which still use aol as their connection provider(AOL dial-up). yes its true enough that AOL is losing subscribers to broadband but they still are the leading connection provider in the world. Also teg how are dvd's harder to develop for then the gamecubes disc, that doesn't make any sense, DVD player's are actually easer to develop for because you don't have use special discs for production, you can just use any blank dvd which there are about a million companies who sell. In fact I think using optical media is what helped the ps1 get so many third party developers. ALso, its nothing against nintendo but i think there online stuff never took off because the modem for gamecube is $80 compared to xbox's $40 I think and sony's $25 plus the gamecube modem is kinda obscure as i have never seen them on shelves at best-buy or the like. :)

[FightTheFuture]

Personally, I think M$ has one more lackluster console up its sleeves before dropping out of the market forever.
its a bit off topic - but i see this as a possibility.
i see microsoft's early entry into the next generation a sad attempt at repeating a PS2 success - whereas the PS2 had such a great launch not only because it held true to console lifecycle - but it basically had no competition for a year. its possible that x-box 2 might become the next dreamcast. of course, it does have such a huge user base right now that it may as well become the next PS2.

[GFLPraxis]

Considering its compeditors, can Nintendo continue? Its purple console new little DS doesn't play dvds or go online. And with games being of poorer quality when compared to past games of Nintendo or current games from Sony and Microsoft will Nintendo survive? Its deathgrip on the handheld market was keeping Nintendo on life support but with the launch of the PSP in Japan and later on in America will we see Mario and Link on the X-Box 2 and PS3?


The Nintendo DS is outselling the PSP 10 to one, is nearly $100 cheaper when you consider the memory card, has MUCH smaller media, can go online as soon as a game is released with the capability, can play GBA games, can play music with a GBA flash cart (PSP requires a bigger memory card for music, so same thing), and NEITHER the PSP or DS can play DVD's.

And the GameCube rocks. Nintendo's game as of recent have been better and more innovative than ever.

Nintendo is becoming the Apple of the gaming industry. And the Revolution is gonna pwn.

[GFLPraxis]

Let's look ahead, shall we?

The XBox 2 is coming out a YEAR early (therefore it will have the weakest graphics), and will not have its hard drive. People bought the XBox because:

1) Best graphics.
2) Hard Drive.
3) Halo.

Now there will only be Halo.

I predict that fans will buy it first, but when the others come out the XBox 2 will get pwned.

That leaves Nintendo vs Sony. PS3 vs Revolution. We don't have enough details on the Revolution to postulate yet.

[GFLPraxis]

its a bit off topic - but i see this as a possibility.
i see microsoft's early entry into the next generation a sad attempt at repeating a PS2 success - whereas the PS2 had such a great launch not only because it held true to console lifecycle - but it basically had no competition for a year. its possible that x-box 2 might become the next dreamcast. of course, it does have such a huge user base right now that it may as well become the next PS2.

However, a big deal with PS2 was backwards compatibility. This will be difficult since the XBox 2 is PPC with an ATi card as opposed to x86 with an NVidia card.

[Jimong5]

However, a big deal with PS2 was backwards compatibility. This will be difficult since the XBox 2 is PPC with an ATi card as opposed to x86 with an NVidia card.

dont forget, microsoft owns Virtual PC now, a decent x86 emulator. just make a few more tweaks and allow the use of the GFX card, and Xbox2 could be backwards compatible.

I also read that backwards compatability was only a driving purchase in like 5% of PS2 sales.

[dermeister]

dont forget, microsoft owns Virtual PC now, a decent x86 emulator. just make a few more tweaks and allow the use of the GFX card, and Xbox2 could be backwards compatible.

I also read that backwards compatability was only a driving purchase in like 5% of PS2 sales.

Unless the xbox 2 is a bagillion gigahertz, VPC won't amount to anything.

[BubbaJones]

Don't forget that the Gamecube has a killer line-up this year.

Resident Evil 4
Advance Wars
Legend of Zelda (Name not yet released)
There is a new DDR from Konami just for the Gamecube
Timesplitters 3
Geist
Mario 128 (Name not yet released)
Fire Emblem

Just to name a few. Don't count the little cube out yet.

[lordmac]

Don't forget that the Gamecube has a killer line-up this year.

Resident Evil 4
Advance Wars
Legend of Zelda (Name not yet released)
There is a new DDR from Konami just for the Gamecube
Timesplitters 3
Geist
Mario 128 (Name not yet released)
Fire Emblem

Just to name a few. Don't count the little cube out yet.

True enough except that the new "DDR" for game cube is not made by konami and a bit of a rip-off, nd just to be fair DDR for xbox although it is made by konami is not nearly as good as the ps2 version. Also I cant wait for the new mario sounds fun. :)

[GFLPraxis]

dont forget, microsoft owns Virtual PC now, a decent x86 emulator. just make a few more tweaks and allow the use of the GFX card, and Xbox2 could be backwards compatible.

I also read that backwards compatability was only a driving purchase in like 5% of PS2 sales.

VPC can barely emulate a 500 mhz P3, and it's incapable of even using a graphics card, let alone tricking an ATi card into pretending it's an NVidia ;)

[GFLPraxis]

Take a look at this!

http://middaysoftware.com/MinhsBlogs/articles/223.aspx

What's your opinion on the software?

The same old thing we've seen a thousand times. The best game at launch was Ridge Racer. It's 1995 all over again! (laughs) I'm sure the vast majority of the PSP's catalogue will consist of remakes of old PlayStation games. For the good of the industry I would actually like to see original games on the PSP and not just remakes.

Do you think it will be a success?

I don't think so. I reckon our Nintendo DS will sweep the floor with it. What do they have? They have Square Enix. They will probably release a traditional RPG [role playing game]. Children are bored of RPG's. Kids don't want to have long conversations with NPC's [non-playable characters] or random battles with enemies. They want Pokemon. They want interaction. They want communication. They want screens in which you can write and send messages to your friends and in which you can actually touch the game characters. The DS opens new possibilities in the gaming, it makes it more accessible, more social. The DS will make the world a better place. Sony cannot see that because long ago Sony lost track of the values that make the Japanese game industry the best in the world.

Which are?

Loyalty. Innovation. Boldness. Sure, little by little, Western values creep into our society. We have lost partners along the way, like Square, and recently Capcom. We felt their betrayal very deeply. Poor Shigery was disconsolate, he was personally let down by Mikami [Shinji Mikami, Capcom executive] after reaching a gentleman's agreement with him. They shook hands and gave their word, in my day, that was enough to seal any deal. Mikami is a double faced bastard, that's what he is. What kind of man breaks his word? So we know what it is like to lose allies. They were lured by the money and the glittering lights. Well, those lights are the lights of the train coming straight ahead at you. We are that train, and we will run over anyone in our way.

So Nintendo will no longer have a cordial relationship with Capcom?

Jumpman / MarioLet's say we may forgive, but never forget. Frankly, I couldn’t care less about Mikami, but I feel sorry for Shigery, he's so sensitive. He's an artist, and as such, he's very easily affected by external developments, and I fear once again he needs my help and guidance to keep him on track. Like when he was designing Jumpman [Nintendo character Mario], he wasn't going through a particularly happy period of his life, and that led to carelessness and abandon. For instance, he didn't want to give Jumpman a moustache because he thought it made Jumpman look like Hitler. But I told him, Jumpman is Italian, Italians are hairy, he needs a moustache, and so what if some idiots think he looks like Hitler? Let's take the risk. He who dares, wins, then and now, in business and in life.


and

We have Revolution [Nintendo's next generation system] and we have our new Film Production division. Some of the stuff those boys are doing is amazing. Revolutionary. The Americans won't be able to compete, and it will be yet another market that we will snatch away from them. What Godzilla started we will finish (laughs).

What are your predictions for the next hardware generation?

SoftwareFrom a technological point of view, all machines will be pretty evenly matched up. So what will make the difference will be the software, and Nintendo is the best software house in the world. Revolution will be the perfect platform to demonstrate that. The name is no coincidence. It will be revolutionary. The technology, the software libraries, the control method. Even the plastic the case will be made of is of a new, revolutionary kind. And it will interact with the DS in ways never thought possible. From a financial point of view, the next two years won't be very profitable for everyone, but as soon as there's an installed user base for the new consoles, the next generation will prove to be the most profitable one. Not everybody will get to that point. Certainly not Sega (laughs). They were a worthy rival but look where they are now, fighting for the scraps of the sports game market, they cannot even compete with a bunch of Canadians. I mean look at their logo, it's a leaf! (laughs) And Sega is in this position because they had neither vision nor courage during the last hardware generation. Winning the console wars will take boldness. It will take a huge gamble. But I've always told the heads of my software and hardware groups -- no guts, no glory.


I'd also quote what he said about Microsoft (inSteve Ballmer's FACE! It's utterly hilarious), but it contains some language. View it in the article for a massive laugh. I *almost* felt sorry for Steve.

[GFLPraxis]

PSP does play DVD's (in simplistic terms, UMD disc is actually shrinked DVD disc). Nintendo sold 1.5 mil DSs both in Japan and in US. PSP has only been sold in Japan in low quantities because Sony couldn't ship any more. Besides, no one is saying that Sony will instantly de-throne Nintendo in hand-held area. Even if Sony takes one third of Nintendo market share that could be disastrous for Nintendo bottom line.

Cheers

Not true, you can't play normal DVD's. You have to buy them in a special PSP disk in a special PSP format.

You can buy cartoons in GBA carts, and probably at some point slimmed down movies on DS carts, anyway.

[GFLPraxis]

Actually the PSP does have 'net connectivity if you have it working with your wireless access point, but all it does so far is use it to get firmware updates (that don't exist yet) from the internet. It's an interesting feature for the future though.

The DS has 802.11b, just not TCP/IP standard. All someone has to do is release a game that uses TCP/IP and bam, it's online.

Also your figures are incorrect in the lead up to New Years Eve Sony sold 510,000 PSPs which was 100% of what they had manufactured. The reason Sony haven't been making more is they can't build the graphics processors fast enough to meet the demand. From what I've heard even Nintendo are having a hard time meeting demand, but with Sony projecting to have sold 3M units by March, and Nintendo saying 5M for the DS it's hard to say who will win this war if anyone. Based on my experience with both consoles I personally think they'll just continue selling since they aren't really targeted at the same crowd imho.

Nintendo has already sold 2 million...


The GameCube has the ability to go online for game play, but developers are not developing games to use it, because it is similar to X-Box Live (A crappy idea BTW) but run by AOL, who is a dying company (this is helping). Nintendo should have gone the route of Sony and made Online play the responsibility of the manufacturers.

I should point out the Nintendo Revolution will have some sort of new way of playing games online.



2) The Nintendo DS and Nintendo Game Boy (DS plays GB games, but they are not of the same family), sell very well. Nintendo will likely report sales growth this last year.


Last I heard, the GBA outsold the PS2.

Okay, let's say that the Gamecube turned out to be a major flop of 3DO and Jaguar proportions...would Nintendo go out of business?


Okay, THAT'S exaggurating. It flopped a little, but it still sold quite a lot and was second on the charts for quite a while, and made a profit. That's better than the XBox did, since MS actually lost money on it ;)

The Revolution is going to pwn though.


The PSP has been touted as being close to a handheld version of a PS2, don't you think Nintendo could EASILY do a similar thing? Don't you remember other companies trying to do it in the past? Heck they were competing with the ORIGINAL Gameboy, which weren't the most compact devices and only had monochrome displays yet they did their job and did it well and people loved them for it.

Reminds me of the Sega Nomad. A portable Sega Genesis. It sucked for the SAME REASONS the PSP does.

1) Bad battery life.
2) Bulky media (disks vs fat Genesis cartridges).
3) A bit big.
4) Very expensive compared to the Game Boy Color.

Despite having way better graphics power, the GBC pwned it completely and most people have never heard of a Nomad.

[jaseone]

Take a look at this!
http://middaysoftware.com/MinhsBlogs/articles/223.aspx


You also saw it was just a parody right? Even though it was blatantly obvious reading through that no company official could ever speak like that in the media.

[GFLPraxis]

You also saw it was just a parody right? Even though it was blatantly obvious reading through that no company official could ever speak like that in the media.
Doh, missed that line. But the thing about Steve Ballmer is true.
http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=20547

[BubbaJones]

True enough except that the new "DDR" for game cube is not made by konami and a bit of a rip-off, nd just to be fair DDR for xbox although it is made by konami is not nearly as good as the ps2 version. Also I cant wait for the new mario sounds fun. :)

No, that was the one by madkatz. There is a new one comming from Konami.

"It has come apparent that not only is Nintendo sharing development duties with Konami, but they will also be publishing Dance Dance Revolution with Mario for the GameCube. The game looks to be definitely centering around Mario to say the least. It will also feature several original minigames, and arrive in Japan this summer with a dance mat bundle also available. The title will also be shown at the Japanese Next Genration World Hobby Fair in the Konami and Nintendo booths, which starts January 16th. "

link (http://www.freewebs.com/gamecubeheaven/)