Has anyone here tried to force Jaguar to crash?

Well, after installing my Sonnet Tempo ATA/100 card, which unbeknownst to me doesn't work with Jaguar, the system would rarely boot and it would give me a KP. Then another time it booted completely, but all the programs crashed upon launch. And then another time it actually booted with no visible problems, but I was using a program (can't remember which, I doubt it matters anyway) and I got the "calm" KP, the one that freezes your computer and gently tells you to restart your computer in four or five different languages. And that was all in Jaguar. Took out the card, and all is fine. 10.2.1, hurrrrryyy!!!

I got the same KP when with all the different languages when I tried to access my smb windows computer. Only other think I had open at the time was IE.

This was not a clean install though, do you recommend doing one. My brother is getting his eMac next week so I can back up all my files on to it.

pretty easy

I have not even come close to pushing Jaguar to the max and it has crashed on me 3 times in the past 2 weeks. twice when waking up from sleep and another time working with vpc and ichat. Jaguar has a lot of work left. It is very unstable.

One KP style crash, only without the KP text now in 10.2, waking from sleep on my PBG4 along with USB devices being unplugged/plugged-in at same time.

Re: pretty easy

Originally posted by jermsmingy
I have not even come close to pushing Jaguar to the max and it has crashed on me 3 times in the past 2 weeks. twice when waking up from sleep and another time working with vpc and ichat. Jaguar has a lot of work left. It is very unstable.

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sounds like a problem with you not jag.

It's easier to freeze Jaguar than 10.1.x. All you have to do is attempt to mount a disc image of any sort. OK, the image will mount, but now try to do anything with it. This was never a probem in earlier versions of OS X.

But then again, I upgraded from the lousy $19.95 upgrade discs, which will not allow you to do a clean install - they will update 10.1 installs only. Completely idiotic move on Apple's part (they're going to squeeze full price out of their customers one way or another).

Regardless, I did try mounting a disc on one of the university computers with a clean install of 10.2 - still not possible. I haven't seen any proof yet that an update Jaguar install is less stable that a clean one, so long as you do it properly.

Here is a vital tip I came across at another Mac forum. The trick is this: after you update, reinsert install disc one, go to disk utility and verify and repair disk permissions on OS X. It will fix several things (I don't understand what they really are) and you'll then notice a significant improvement in boot times and general speed. Other than the weird disc mounting bug, Jaguar has been extrememly stable for me - AFTER I repaired the disk permissions.
Prior to making this repair, Jaguar did seem a little unstable (Audion 3.0.2, for instance, kept crashing) and no faster than 10.1.5. This repair made all the difference.

I should mention that if you only have the upgrade discs, it's best to do the nearest thing to a clean install. I wiped the drive completely, reformatted, did the most minimal install possible from the 10.1.3 disc, then upgraded to Jaguar. From what I've read, it seems that the instability comes from already existing apps on your HD.

Originally posted by Pepzhez
It's easier to freeze Jaguar than 10.1.x. All you have to do is attempt to mount a disc image of any sort. OK, the image will mount, but now try to do anything with it. This was never a probem in earlier versions of OS X.

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again sounds like a messed up computer not a problem with jag. im not saying jag is flawless (just take a look at the jag bug list ) but the erros you describe sound like problems introduced by the user not by jag. i use disk images dozens of times daily and have never had an issue.

if you are having trouble with jag try fixing the problem before assuming there is a problem with the os, 9 times out of 10 it is something you did wrong. if you dont know how to do basic disk maitenance check here

No problems

No KP's at all, but one strange system hang when I was copying across a wired/wireless network from an old 7500. That machine has been having problems, so it was probably the source of it, but I couldn't find a way to quit copying or relaunch the finder.

Other than that, it's been pretty great. I get the sense, though, that it's a little buggier than 10.1.5. There are some strange issues with the pull-down menu not wanting to go away when I play some games in full-screen mode, and some other little niggling things like that.

Chris
TiBook 667, 512 MB RAM, upgrade (no clean install needed)

Re: Re: Has anyone here tried to force Jaguar to crash?

Originally posted by Shrek


People, read the damn instructions before you do your tests. Geez.

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was that really necessary?

I just tried it, and how I usually do that is jsut open everything in my dock all at once. I did upgrade but being on how I'm reporting on how it DID NOT CRASH, I don't see how that's relevant. For your extraneous info, I did have iTunes playing (not a beat skipped, but that's mostly due to the fact that I have all my music on a seperate HD) I did calculate Pi in Mathematica for fun, but that's a quick calculation anyhow, I have two images open in Preview, and I did not run any of my games because they're full screen and being by the time all the other apps finally get going it slows everything down ALOT, it's jsut a pain. Anyhow, I AM RUNNING MY KDX SERVER WHEN DOING THIS (BTW it's called AnimeNation) and it looks like I jsut plain forgot to launch Stickies, oh well I'm runnind a DP 450 G4 w/1024 MB of RAM. So there you have it. I have experienced no problmes in Jaguar except for the fact that Toast doesn't launch, and my Dock is slow popping up. That's it. And and one last thing: I HOPE EVERYONE IS REPORTING THESE TO APPLE!!

Did some checking and have discovered that the disc mounting problem is a Toast 5.1.4 (current version)-Jaguar incompatibility issue. So the problem lies with Toast, not OS 10.2 itself.

Roxio's site promises an update soon. Meanwhile they concede that the current version of Toast is not fully 10.2 compatible.

So I was wrong. This one is not Apple's fault.

Originally posted by Pepzhez
Did some checking and have discovered that the disc mounting problem is a Toast 5.1.4 (current version)-Jaguar incompatibility issue. So the problem lies with Toast, not OS 10.2 itself.

Roxio's site promises an update soon. Meanwhile they concede that the current version of Toast is not fully 10.2 compatible.

So I was wrong. This one is not Apple's fault.

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ah. that makes more sense. well in the meantime you can use disk copy to mount .toast images. i have always used disk copy to mount those just as a persnal preference, so i know it works.

someone please explain to me...

how it is my fault that jaguar has crashed on me when all I did was open the lid on my powerbook to wake the computer from sleep. The only thing that is ever plugged in to my powerbook is the powercord. I have an airport card and a network printer. I don't understand how it could be my fault. The computer has frozen on me twice just because I woke it up from sleep. I did a clean install and I have done fsck -y. 10.1.x never froze on me. An app might have crashed but the computer never completely locked up. I am running jag on my powerbook 800 with 1 gig of ram. If someone can tell me why it freezes I would be glad to listen, but please don't tell me that my computer freezing is my fault when all I did was wake the computer up from sleep.

chill people, its a .0 release. the stability isnt exactly where we all wanted it, but we did get speed and features galore.

by the way, i ran the restore privileges on mac15s advice and my stability has increased bigtime, along with minor speed increases, and this on a clean freshly formatted install.

AmbitiousLemon,

Thanks for the Disk Copy tip. It works fine! So a note to all Toast users: you'll have to use Disk Copy and NOT Toast's built-in "Mount Disc Image" to mount images in 10.2 until Roxio releases the next Toast update. (Roxio's support page mentions the problem and promises a fix/update soon; so, yes, they are aware of this.)

Also thanks for leading me to Mac Janitor and X Optimize. I notice a nice speed improvement since running both this afternoon. Boot time is much faster and everything now just seems smoother altogether - even in (no, ESPECIALLY in) my G3 imac DVSE.

Regarding Disc Images...

I'm not sure if everyone knows this, but in Disc Copy, you can say "Convert Disc Image..." and it will convert an image with a .toast extention to one that Disc Copy can read/mount. I hope that's helpful to some people!

I have not had Jag crash once, and I installed the upgrade from 10.1.5 (I didn't have time to wipe my drive, install 10.1.3 and upgrade from there).

One sure way to kill your system, however, is to install an upgrade (like from 10.2 to 10.2.1 when it comes out), force quit the software updater (ie don't restart), use your computer like normal for a few days, then change your start up disk, then restart.

...not that I've ever done something like that before to know

No problems whatsoever with the PowerMac G3/400. I have two drives and installed it two ways. The ATA drive was an "Archive and Install" installation and the Ultra2SCSI was an "Upgrade" install.

Re: Re: Has anyone here tried to force Jaguar to crash?

Originally posted by Shrek
People, read the damn instructions before you do your tests. Geez.

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I read your "instructions." I ignored them.

Chris

I don't think it is much a matter of "pushing" the system to make it crash. It does have memory protection and multithreading. The easiest way to make it crash it try to run some software that uses Kernel Extensions (.kext) that is buggy. I have been able to make it crash. I was using AFS and testing it, and it was very easy to make it crash. There was a bug in the way that it copies files, and it would immediately crash the kernel.

I can mount images fine WITH Toast 5.1.4 within Jag....but i cant use regular Disk mount that came with Jag....odd eh?....im running 6D44

Originally posted by 8thDegreeSavage
I can mount images fine WITH Toast 5.1.4 within Jag....but i cant use regular Disk mount that came with Jag....odd eh?....im running 6D44

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well 6D44 isnt a public release so those sorts of issues arent surprising.