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MacRumors
Feb 13, 2011, 03:45 PM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/02/13/small-iphone-to-have-edge-to-edge-screen-voice-navigation/)

The Wall Street Journal has updated (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704657104576142262842435544.html) their previous story, adding some new details about the rumored smaller iPhone. The person who saw the prototype of the new iPhone said the device was significantly lighter than the iPhone 4 and had an edge-to-edge screen that could be manipulated by touch, as well as a virtual keyboard and voice-based navigation. The person said Apple, based in Cupertino, Calif., also plans to upgrade the iPhone 4.The new phone is said to have an "edge to edge" screen with (obviously) a touch interface. The one possibly new feature appears to be "voice navigation". Apple already offers some rudimentary Voice Control with the current iPhone, so it's not clear if this voice navigation is something really new. The newspaper also adds that the iPhone 4 is also expected to be updated.

Article Link: Small iPhone to Have Edge to Edge Screen, Voice Navigation? (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/02/13/small-iphone-to-have-edge-to-edge-screen-voice-navigation/)



TheSlush
Feb 13, 2011, 03:48 PM
Unless it's going to be a device with just a few redesigned native apps -- and not connected to the App Store ecosystem -- then this is not something that's going to happen. The current iPhone OS and app user interfaces cannot shrink without the user experience going to hell.

Goldinboy17
Feb 13, 2011, 03:50 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8C148 Safari/6533.18.5)

So instead of a bigger screen we'll have the option to opt for a smaller screen? Nice.

wordoflife
Feb 13, 2011, 03:50 PM
Voice based navigation?
How is that going to work with a lot of background noise outside?

PBF
Feb 13, 2011, 03:50 PM
Wow, so many iPhone nano rumours at once! I think it is coming to fruition after all. :eek:

fishmoose
Feb 13, 2011, 03:52 PM
English isn't my first language so forgive me if this is a stupid question, but what is an edge to edge screen? And how does it differ from what we have in iPhone's today?

HahaHaha321
Feb 13, 2011, 03:55 PM
The one possibly new feature appears to be "voice navigation".

Uh oh. Didn't Apple learn their lesson with the iPod shuffle/cigarette lighter fiasco? Let's hope this is something entirely different.

Kilamite
Feb 13, 2011, 03:55 PM
Unless it's going to be a device with just a few redesigned native apps -- and not connected to the App Store ecosystem -- then this is not something that's going to happen. The current iPhone OS and app user interfaces cannot shrink without the user experience going to hell.

Unless it had the same resolution as the first three generations of iPhone (480x320).

(edited as pointed out by alectheking)

iPave
Feb 13, 2011, 03:55 PM
iPhone 4 gets updated with a new "edge to edge" screen? How? Via software update?

HahaHaha321
Feb 13, 2011, 03:56 PM
English isn't my first language so forgive me if this is a stupid question, but what is an edge to edge screen? And how does it differ from what we have in iPhone's today?

No home button, basically. Just a giant glass slate without a border.

Prof.
Feb 13, 2011, 03:56 PM
English isn't my first language so forgive me if this is a stupid question, but what is an edge to edge screen? And how does it differ from what we have in iPhone's today?
The screen will make up the entire face of the iPhone.

alectheking
Feb 13, 2011, 03:57 PM
Unless it had the same resolution as the first three generations of iPhone (320x340).

you mean 480x320.

boshii
Feb 13, 2011, 03:58 PM
English isn't my first language so forgive me if this is a stupid question, but what is an edge to edge screen? And how does it differ from what we have in iPhone's today?

I'm guessing it means no black bezel on the face of the screen, which should've been done already.

iPhone 4 gets updated with a new "edge to edge" screen? How? Via software update?

Enter 4GS ;)

andrew0122
Feb 13, 2011, 04:00 PM
Why can't we get a slightly LARGER iPhone? . . . All I'm asking for is a 3.7" or a 4". . .

Dear :apple:,

I'm Kind of a BIG deal. :cool: (Meaning I have larger hands...) :rolleyes: I'm not asking for much, but if you're going to actually make a 'nano' version, make the standard-sized just a wee bit larger.

Sincerely,
Andrew0122

PS: Now please take my moniez for a pre-order and let me get it 2-3 days before the masses. THANKS!

MarcBook
Feb 13, 2011, 04:01 PM
you mean 480x320.

Even then, it's not the resolution that's the point. The interface and apps are designed for a 3.5" display. Any smaller and they wouldn't work properly. Buttons would be too small to press etc., meaning that the current apps in the App Store wouldn't be compatible.

If this phone really does get released, I'm guessing it'll run iOS in a similar way to how the iPod nano currently does (its own few apps and no access to the App Store).

mrblack927
Feb 13, 2011, 04:02 PM
Wow, so many iPhone nano rumours at once! I think it is coming to fruition after all. :eek:

I wouldn't say that. It's all coming from the same source (WSJ) and they could easily be wrong, especially when the rumor is supposedly 6+ months out...

MarcBook
Feb 13, 2011, 04:02 PM
I'm guessing it means no black bezel on the face of the screen, which should've been done already.

You need the bezel to hold the phone without touching the display, much like how the iPad has a thick bezel around its display.

andrew0122
Feb 13, 2011, 04:03 PM
Voice based navigation?
How is that going to work with a lot of background noise outside?

Thus entered the iPhone 4 for with a second microphone located near the headphone plug to reduce background noise...

boshii
Feb 13, 2011, 04:04 PM
You need the bezel to hold the phone without touching the display

No you don't. I never touch the bezel.

When it's in my hand, it's either resting on my palm or i'm gripping it by the antenna.

Oflife
Feb 13, 2011, 04:05 PM
...the AI based electronic butler service a year or so ago. I forget the name of the company (although I did know the founders!) and it allows you to issue spoken commands in natural English. IE, "Book appointment at hotel XYZ from START DATE to END DATE" etc.

And being the service is cloud based (I believe), it could (like Google voice search) work on any connected device.

liavman
Feb 13, 2011, 04:06 PM
I wouldn't say that. It's all coming from the same source (WSJ) and they could easily be wrong, especially when the rumor is supposedly 6+ months out...

Given the level of details, at least a prototype exists. Whether it comes to market or not is the question.

If it hits production, this is a big leak. I am sure people at Apple are not too pleased about this.

Reach9
Feb 13, 2011, 04:07 PM
So if i have this right, then in the next few months we'll be seeing..

iPad 2
MacBook Pro refresh
iPhone 5 (or iPhone 4GS or whatever it'll be called)
iPhone Nano (with edge to edge screen) (or whatever it'll be called)
iOS 5
Mac OS X 10.7
Free MobileMe
iTunes air sync

wow..this is amazing.

I really like the idea of a smaller phone, but i think "half-size" is cutting it too small, but we'll see. This is gonna be a huge blow to Android, as Apple will now be competing against the amount of iPhones in the market with the iPhone Nano, along with the specs of the Android devices as well with the iPhone 5.
Both possibly running a polished iOS 5.

And for all of us with Macs, we'll be seeing Lion be released, and maybe iOS 5 and Lion will have some sort of syncing ability or something. Their releases seem pretty close by.

ciTiger
Feb 13, 2011, 04:07 PM
So, two new iPhones at once... Nice...:D

ciTiger
Feb 13, 2011, 04:08 PM
So if i have this right, then in the next few months we'll be seeing..

iPad 2
iPhone 5 (or iPhone 4GS or whatever it'll be called)
iPhone Nano (with edge to edge screen) (or whatever it'll be called)
iOS 5
Mac OS X 10.7
Free MobileMe
iTunes air sync

wow..this is amazing.

I really like the idea of a smaller phone, but i think "half-size" is cutting it too small, but we'll see. This is gonna be a huge blow to the Android, as Apple will now be competing against the amount of iPhones in the market with the iPhone Nano, along with the specs of the Android devices as well with the iPhone 5.
Both possibly running a polished iOS 5.

And for all of us with Macs, we'll be seeing Lion be released, and maybe iOS 5 and Lion will have some sort of syncing ability or something. Their releases seem pretty close by.

You're forgetting the MBP refresh...

msb3079
Feb 13, 2011, 04:08 PM
Would love to see the top and bottom black edging shrink or almost disappear. I've wanted that since the first iPhone.

I see some mentioning they want a bigger screen... to each their own but I would never want anything bigger than the current iPhone. It's PHONE.. not a tablet or a laptop. I see people with the 4" Droids and it makes me laugh. Looks ridiculous. I'm fine with options, but as long as they don't ever bring the standard size up. That would stink.

Reach9
Feb 13, 2011, 04:09 PM
You're forgetting the MBP refresh...
Right my bad, i just updated it, thanks.

MarcBook
Feb 13, 2011, 04:09 PM
No you don't. I never touch the bezel.

When it's in my hand, it's either resting on my palm or i'm gripping it by the antenna.

OK, I should've added 'when playing many games'. For example, Real Racing 2. You need to grip the sides (when in landscape orientation) with your thumbs so that you can hold the phone like a mini steering wheel. Many apps, mostly games, need this.

Trying to hold the phone in your palms when playing a racing game looks and feels ridiculous.

enberg
Feb 13, 2011, 04:10 PM
I'm guessing it'll run iOS in a similar way to how the iPod nano currently does (its own few apps and no access to the App Store).
The Nano doesn't run iOS.

Chaszmyr
Feb 13, 2011, 04:10 PM
Even then, it's not the resolution that's the point. The interface and apps are designed for a 3.5" display. Any smaller and they wouldn't work properly. Buttons would be too small to press etc., meaning that the current apps in the App Store wouldn't be compatible.

If this phone really does get released, I'm guessing it'll run iOS in a similar way to how the iPod nano currently does (its own few apps and no access to the App Store).

I hear what you're saying. Additionally, if the iPhone nano ran only non-retina apps, it would discourage developers from bothering with retina-compatible apps, which would be bad. On the possibly more important hand, though, don't you think Apple has good reason to make it run any apps they can? Apple takes a 30% cut of app sales, which means it's less profitable for them to release a device that doesn't run apps.

bigjohn
Feb 13, 2011, 04:11 PM
we don't need a 4" phone

they're finally gonna leverage the Siri acquisition

smaller screen shouldn't be an issue at the same resolution, right?
just 2 or 3 icons wide instead of 4?

wordoflife
Feb 13, 2011, 04:13 PM
Has anyone tried using the HTC Aria (3.2inch screen) and tried typing on the vertical keyboard? It's hard as heck.

Not sure about this iPhone nano thing tbh.

rajid
Feb 13, 2011, 04:14 PM
No home button, basically. Just a giant glass slate without a border.

The screen will make up the entire face of the iPhone.

I would think this was make it really hard to hold onto without accidentally pressing something on the screen. I have a hard enough time holding onto my current iPhone without touching the screen in the wrong place, and because of this it slips out of my hands sometimes!

LoganT
Feb 13, 2011, 04:14 PM
...the AI based electronic butler service a year or so ago. I forget the name of the company (although I did know the founders!) and it allows you to issue spoken commands in natural English. IE, "Book appointment at hotel XYZ from START DATE to END DATE" etc.

And being the service is cloud based (I believe), it could (like Google voice search) work on any connected device.

The company is called Siri.

MarcBook
Feb 13, 2011, 04:14 PM
The Nano doesn't run iOS.

I'm pretty sure it's running some sort of version of iOS, a bit like how the current Apple TV runs a version of it. They wouldn't write an entirely different system from scratch just for a new touch screen iPod. They'd use what they've already got and simplify it for the nano.

ChazUK
Feb 13, 2011, 04:16 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (Linux; U; Android 2.3.2; en-gb; Nexus S Build/GRH78C) AppleWebKit/533.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/4.0 Mobile Safari/533.1)

After reading (on more than one occasion) from hardcore iPhone fans that Apple doesn't care for the commodity or "race to the bottom" low end market, I'd be pleased to see this thing come to fruition. I'd also love to snap one up if the price is right.

MarcBook
Feb 13, 2011, 04:18 PM
I hear what you're saying. Additionally, if the iPhone nano ran only non-retina apps, it would discourage developers from bothering with retina-compatible apps, which would be bad. On the possibly more important hand, though, don't you think Apple has good reason to make it run any apps they can? Apple takes a 30% cut of app sales, which means it's less profitable for them to release a device that doesn't run apps.

That definitely makes sense. I'm interested to see if this rumoured phone ever surfaces. Apple has always been about making the 'best' products, not the cheapest. That's why they never properly entered the netbook market.

I'll be quite surprised if they do make a cheap iPhone, although I'm sure they'd have their reasons. They know what they're doing, or they wouldn't be as successful as they are.

currentinterest
Feb 13, 2011, 04:23 PM
While everyone else is trying to grow their displays Apple will produce a fabulous smaller phone with no contract requirement. People will go bonkers over this. It will sell like crazy. The wireless carriers will be able to give then away with a contract, or do the buy an iPhone 4(5) and get an iPhone Nano or two free. Developing countries will gobble them up as well. Apple will be able to base it on existing iPhone 4 internals and the 3GS display resolution and make these things for $100 given their production volume. When I told my wife about it, she said "perfect"; she feels her iPhone 4 is just too big.

Demosthenes X
Feb 13, 2011, 04:23 PM
I'm pretty sure it's running some sort of version of iOS, a bit like how the current Apple TV runs a version of it. They wouldn't write an entirely different system from scratch just for a new touch screen iPod. They'd use what they've already got and simplify it for the nano.

Actually, I believe Apple actually just added touch capability on top of the existing iPod operating system (Pico), and tweaked the UI a bit. It's not iOS, though.

enberg
Feb 13, 2011, 04:24 PM
I'm pretty sure it's running some sort of version of iOS
It doesn't really matter what you think, it still doesn't. It's just tarted up to look like it does.

notabadname
Feb 13, 2011, 04:25 PM
If you could make the iPhone as big as the current physical screen, with a little room on top for the ear speaker and camera, you could have a nearly 30% smaller phone, with no change in display/interface. And they maybe able to reduce its with slightly by having the screen go even closer to edge. Would make for a nice form factor. You could make the top button do the same as the home button now, and make it require a longer hold to sleep the phone, or bring up a combined sleep or power off option.

I'm hopeful this is a true rumor. I think I would buy it, now that my iPad replaces my need for many iPhone features when I am traveling.

hashholly
Feb 13, 2011, 04:29 PM
It doesn't really matter what you think, it still doesn't. It's just tarted up to look like it does.

The iPod Nano runs a slimmed down version of iOS,

msb3079
Feb 13, 2011, 04:30 PM
I'd assume that the screen size would remain the same but there'd be very little gap on the top and bottom. Take away those two sections... and that's taking away almost 1/3 of the phone.

bdkennedy1
Feb 13, 2011, 04:31 PM
The iPhone's Voice Control implementation is absolutely horrid. Even Microsoft could have done a better job.

msb3079
Feb 13, 2011, 04:34 PM
If you could make the iPhone as big as the current physical screen, with a little room on top for the ear speaker and camera, you could have a nearly 30% smaller phone, with no change in display/interface. And they maybe able to reduce its with slightly by having the screen go even closer to edge. Would make for a nice form factor. You could make the top button do the same as the home button now, and make it require a longer hold to sleep the phone, or bring up a combined sleep or power off option.

I'm hopeful this is a true rumor. I think I would buy it, now that my iPad replaces my need for many iPhone features when I am traveling.

Yeah, EXACTLY. Or they could move the home button to the side.. or even something different... if you tap bottom center of the screen (in sleep) could act as the home button... or with screen on, tap and hold for 2 seconds. Just examples.. but they could easily work around that. Remember there were rumors months ago of the home button going away.

Mister Snitch
Feb 13, 2011, 04:35 PM
Unless it's going to be a device with just a few redesigned native apps -- and not connected to the App Store ecosystem -- then this is not something that's going to happen. The current iPhone OS and app user interfaces cannot shrink without the user experience going to hell.

Actually, it could be the same-sized screen but with no bezel left & right, and a smaller area at the top and bottom. Result: Same 'live' touch area, smaller overall device.

I can't speak for holding it without the bezel, but I have to imagine they've tested it to death. Especially after the whole 'antenna' flap.

If it feels OK in the hand, and has the same size display, I can see where a smaller device could be popular.

Beezy
Feb 13, 2011, 04:40 PM
The more I think about it the more awesome it sounds tbh. If I am in no better shape financially in a year and a half and this is out it may be considered. I like the size of the phone now tho. Hmm.

MarcBook
Feb 13, 2011, 04:40 PM
Actually, I believe Apple actually just added touch capability on top of the existing iPod operating system (Pico), and tweaked the UI a bit. It's not iOS, though.

That sounds plausible. They clearly want people to think that it runs iOS. :p

It doesn't really matter what you think, it still doesn't. It's just tarted up to look like it does.

fishmoose
Feb 13, 2011, 04:40 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_2_1 like Mac OS X; sv-se) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8C148 Safari/6533.18.5)

It doesn't really matter what you think, it still doesn't. It's just tarted up to look like it does.

The iPod Nano runs a slimmed down version of iOS,

It actually doesn't, runs the same OS as the the other iPods (bar the iPod Touch) Apple has confirmed this.

Eriamjh1138@DAN
Feb 13, 2011, 04:40 PM
Would it be crazy for Apple to develop a smaller phone with the original 480x320 resolution (same as the 3GS, but at a smaller diameter it would have a better density), but with no 3G required data plans (the biggest cost of a smartphone)?

The kids would love it. They have the eyes and fingers to use a smaller phone and don't have the money to pay for a full-blown iPhone plan.

It would have to run all the apps that other iPhones can run. To do that, it would have to have either the current resolution or the old resolution. Jobs would never let the iPhone get fragmented like Android phones are. Unless they figured out a way to scale the apps...

CrystalPepsi
Feb 13, 2011, 04:45 PM
Sounds fake. I can, however, see an iPhone with a 4.3" screen being successful.

TheSlush
Feb 13, 2011, 04:47 PM
Actually, it could be the same-sized screen but with no bezel left & right, and a smaller area at the top and bottom. Result: Same 'live' touch area, smaller overall device.

I can't speak for holding it without the bezel, but I have to imagine they've tested it to death. Especially after the whole 'antenna' flap.

If it feels OK in the hand, and has the same size display, I can see where a smaller device could be popular.

But the current rumors about this (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/02/13/apple-working-on-cheaper-smaller-iphone-and-mobileme-overhaul/) are reporting that it would be "half the size of the iPhone 4". That's just too small to not have its own redesigned OS/user interface.

E.Lizardo
Feb 13, 2011, 04:55 PM
Unless it's going to be a device with just a few redesigned native apps -- and not connected to the App Store ecosystem -- then this is not something that's going to happen. The current iPhone OS and app user interfaces cannot shrink without the user experience going to hell.

And that phone found in a bar last year is NOT the new iPhone.No Way.Only an idiot would think so.The design is totally un-Apple.And those black lines on the side,Apple would never,never do that.And they'd never let a prototype off campus anyway,so it's impossible.Obviously some cheap crappy looking Chinese garbage.

Beware of people who think they absolutely know what Apple will do.
They don't.

SgtPepper12
Feb 13, 2011, 04:58 PM
I don't really think "edge to edge" display means that the display makes up the whole face, it would look really really stupid. I think the parts with the facetime camera and home button will stay, just the bezel to the left and right of the screen will be shrunk down to a minimum.

I imagine in like this: http://npshare.de/files/870deb3a/iphone4m.jpg

Although I still don't believe it is going to happen.

newdeal
Feb 13, 2011, 04:59 PM
Unless it's going to be a device with just a few redesigned native apps -- and not connected to the App Store ecosystem -- then this is not something that's going to happen. The current iPhone OS and app user interfaces cannot shrink without the user experience going to hell.

They don't need to shrink it perhaps they are going buttonless, moving the speaker to the top instead of the face, dropping the camera and having the same screen size (probobly not retina) and just getting rid of all the black space.

newdeal
Feb 13, 2011, 05:00 PM
I don't really think "edge to edge" display means that the display makes up the whole face, it would look really really stupid. I think the parts with the facetime camera and home button will stay, just the bezel to the left and right of the screen will be shrunk down to a minimum.

I imagine in like this: http://npshare.de/files/870deb3a/iphone4m.jpg

Although I still don't believe it is going to happen.

People said the iphone4 leak last year couldn't possibly be the real iphone because Apple wouldn't make something that looked like that...until Steve had it on stage.

Wang Foolio
Feb 13, 2011, 05:01 PM
"Half the size" likely means surface area, which can be reached by dropping the dimensions by just 30%.

0.7x0.7=0.49

I can see the screen shrinking by 25% (wouldn't have to drop the full 30% if the bezel is being reduced) and losing the Retina display resolution. Probably the older processor and GPUs as well to keep costs down. Web browsing and whatnot would be less attractive, but for the basics and a few apps, I can see a market for this.

Whoever mentioned sales in Asia probably hit the nail on the head. A much cheaper phone that does almost everything the bigger brother does would probably have a better chance in new/emerging markets compared to the US and Europe. I don't see many people switching from a full iPhone to the "nano" or whatever it ends up being called, but it would be a very interesting option when competing against the cheap and disposable non-smart phones.

E.Lizardo
Feb 13, 2011, 05:02 PM
I hear what you're saying. Additionally, if the iPhone nano ran only non-retina apps, it would discourage developers from bothering with retina-compatible apps, which would be bad. On the possibly more important hand, though, don't you think Apple has good reason to make it run any apps they can? Apple takes a 30% cut of app sales, which means it's less profitable for them to release a device that doesn't run apps.

Plus the reverse it true,Apps sell the phone.

gnasher729
Feb 13, 2011, 05:02 PM
That definitely makes sense. I'm interested to see if this rumoured phone ever surfaces. Apple has always been about making the 'best' products, not the cheapest. That's why they never properly entered the netbook market.

I'll be quite surprised if they do make a cheap iPhone, although I'm sure they'd have their reasons. They know what they're doing, or they wouldn't be as successful as they are.

I thought about this, mostly in relation with Nokia and its problems. There are people who want just a phone to make phone calls and maybe sending / receiving text messages. There are people who want a bit more, like taking photos and playing music. And there are people who want a gadget that lets them install hundred different applications and use them all the time - and it also makes phone call. The iPhone is perfect for the third category of people. Android does reasonably well for the third category, and due to low price it's also suitable for the second category and the cheapest products even apply to category 1. Nokia has the problem that they have no product for category 3, where most of the money is.

Apple _could_ build a phone that caters to the first two categories. No apps, no 3G, no WiFi. Just phone, texting, music, camera, photos. A highly optimised user interface reduced to these task, which makes it a lot easier and faster to use. A high quality display. Either 16 GB storage, priced not much more than a 16 GB iPod nano, or 2 GB, priced a lot cheaper. And the main point of the whole product would be to make it a really, really nice phone for plain phone users.

Even today, I guess 90% of all phones are sold into this market. A lot is sold on price, but only because there isn't much difference between products. A phone that stands out from the crowd could definitely sell a lot at a price that makes a good profit.

Rot'nApple
Feb 13, 2011, 05:03 PM
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So instead of a bigger screen we'll have the option to opt for a smaller screen? Nice.

And with edge to edge icons, you'll be constantly closing the apps you opened just by virtue of holding the thing. I know, I know... Steve will say we are holding it wrong. So he's just gonna have to show us! :D

But do we hold it with our pinky finger up in the air? :rolleyes: ;)

Mattsasa
Feb 13, 2011, 05:03 PM
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I think Apple is bluffing!! And wall street journal is dumb to believe it.

karsten
Feb 13, 2011, 05:04 PM
So if i have this right, then in the next few months we'll be seeing..

iPad 2
MacBook Pro refresh
iPhone 5 (or iPhone 4GS or whatever it'll be called)
iPhone Nano (with edge to edge screen) (or whatever it'll be called)
iOS 5
Mac OS X 10.7
Free MobileMe
iTunes air sync

wow..this is amazing.

I really like the idea of a smaller phone, but i think "half-size" is cutting it too small, but we'll see. This is gonna be a huge blow to Android, as Apple will now be competing against the amount of iPhones in the market with the iPhone Nano, along with the specs of the Android devices as well with the iPhone 5.
Both possibly running a polished iOS 5.

And for all of us with Macs, we'll be seeing Lion be released, and maybe iOS 5 and Lion will have some sort of syncing ability or something. Their releases seem pretty close by.

and mac mini :apple:

E.Lizardo
Feb 13, 2011, 05:05 PM
I'm pretty sure it's running some sort of version of iOS, a bit like how the current Apple TV runs a version of it. They wouldn't write an entirely different system from scratch just for a new touch screen iPod. They'd use what they've already got and simplify it for the nano.

No.When it was released Apple said it was not related to iOS,they just made it loos similar.
It is not an iOS device in any way manner or form.

fishmoose
Feb 13, 2011, 05:05 PM
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Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_2_6 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8E200 Safari/6533.18.5)

I think Apple is bluffing!! And wall street journal is dumb to believe it.

Could be, wouldn't be the first time Apple puts out false information to close down leaks.

michaelcyee
Feb 13, 2011, 05:07 PM
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I think Apple is bluffing!! And wall street journal is dumb to believe it.

WSJ has been right several times. Give them some credit.

Granted, if they're wrong we can slander and pile on and laugh at the WSJ, but I'm inclined to hold my fire for right now.

E.Lizardo
Feb 13, 2011, 05:07 PM
The iPod Nano runs a slimmed down version of iOS,

incorrect.

AmpSkillz
Feb 13, 2011, 05:08 PM
Unless it's going to be a device with just a few redesigned native apps -- and not connected to the App Store ecosystem -- then this is not something that's going to happen. The current iPhone OS and app user interfaces cannot shrink without the user experience going to hell.
Even then, it's not the resolution that's the point. The interface and apps are designed for a 3.5" display. Any smaller and they wouldn't work properly. Buttons would be too small to press etc., meaning that the current apps in the App Store wouldn't be compatible.

If this phone really does get released, I'm guessing it'll run iOS in a similar way to how the iPod nano currently does (its own few apps and no access to the App Store).

assuming the screen is only slightly smaller (25-30%) and exactly half the resolution of the current iPhone 4, there would be no reason Apple couldn't make it immediately capable of running half resolution versions of all current apps and then allow developers to slowly update their apps to be more compatible over time

that is exactly what they did with iPad only initially doubling resolution until individual app compatibility was implemented by developers

and you are out of your mind if you think Apple would release a phone (or any mobile computing device) that is not in the iTunes/app store ecosystem

Bureaucromancer
Feb 13, 2011, 05:10 PM
As much as I agree that this device is likely to have user experience 'difficulties' I'm starting to think it quite likely, and likely to come as part of a larger rework of the whole iPhone/iPod lineup.

My impression (entirely speculative, but tell me if it doesn't make sense) is that the iPod line has some problems right now, mostly centered on the current Nano being too small for a lot of people and not having any real commonality with the rest of the line. Most notably I suspect they'd really like to bring back video on the Nano but just can't do it on the new screen (although I suppose Nano video was always marginal, so who knows on that front). My guess, then, is the Nano phone comes alongside an iPod Touch Nano (won't they PLEASE just officially call them iTouch - well maybe not). The current nano could then take the place of the screenless shuffle with the same hardware at reduced price (although it wouldn't surprise me if it DID go to iOS at some point and start getting apps once they accept the interface incompatibilities a Nano phone will create and assuming the rumours of a system for developer resolution independence bear fruit). I'd actually guess that the current Nano will still have a shuffle model below it though (and will be given an entirely new title with the re branding, since they will want to pair the new phone with the more established Nano title and Shuffle makes less sense once you have a screen).

The new SCREENLESS shuffle on the other hand is, IMO the least likely part of what occurred to me, but I can't imagine that they haven't looked at the earpiece based design everyone and their brother imagined when the saw the cigarette lighter. That said, Apple being Apple, my actual guess is only that there will continue to be a screenless, sub $100 model (I'm thinking that the current Nano probably just isn't ready to go that low yet with what is a small but high quality screen).

The above note about the Shuffle leads me to my last point which is really just a response to the line of thought that a smaller/cheaper iPhone doesn't fit with Apple's high revenue/low volume strategy of not competing for the bottom of the market. While they do generally follow this, it just hasn't been true for some time in the iPod segment, with the Shuffle forming a large part of their maintenance of market domination. Given that they really do seem to look at the phones as a spinoff of the iPods rather than the computers or an entirely separate market I am not entirely sure that their conventional strategy applies (especially when combined with how close to dominant they are in phones with a SINGLE model, and that the iPad does to some extent represent a roundabout entry into the netbook price range). On a related note, also supporting the new phone, I suspect that the company would be happier with a Nano type device than the current strategy of having an older and almost completely unpromoted version of the phones remain available they are using now.

karsten
Feb 13, 2011, 05:12 PM
"Half the size" likely means surface area, which can be reached by dropping the dimensions by just 30%.

0.7x0.7=0.49

I can see the screen shrinking by 25% (wouldn't have to drop the full 30% if the bezel is being reduced) and losing the Retina display resolution. Probably the older processor and GPUs as well to keep costs down. Web browsing and whatnot would be less attractive, but for the basics and a few apps, I can see a market for this.

Whoever mentioned sales in Asia probably hit the nail on the head. A much cheaper phone that does almost everything the bigger brother does would probably have a better chance in new/emerging markets compared to the US and Europe. I don't see many people switching from a full iPhone to the "nano" or whatever it ends up being called, but it would be a very interesting option when competing against the cheap and disposable non-smart phones.

maybe they saw the nokia/ms merger on the wall and decided they needed something to compete with a commodity production with a big o/s on it.

tmofee
Feb 13, 2011, 05:14 PM
I think people are looking at this wrong. My guess is the smaller iphone is just going to be the latest version of the cheap iphone..

I think we're at the point where a big announcement of an iphone 5 won't happen. We might get a faster CPU, more storage but the camera is pretty decent in the current one. Oh, of course we'll get an iphone that will work on both Verizon and AT&T for the Americans.

Saying that, they can't sell the iphone 4 cheaply like they did with the 3GS for the time being. Something similar in form factor to the 3GS but with (possibly) facetime ability and the strength inside to run ios5 whenever that comes out. With new tech it's got to be smaller than before.

Another guess? The numbers are going to disappear. It's just going to be called The Iphone and The Iphone Nano/Mini/Tiny whatever name they stick with. Come update time you're just going to find better specs on both the models in the store.

Richard1028
Feb 13, 2011, 05:15 PM
If you could make the iPhone as big as the current physical screen, with a little room on top for the ear speaker and camera, you could have a nearly 30% smaller phone, with no change in display/interface. And they maybe able to reduce its with slightly by having the screen go even closer to edge. Would make for a nice form factor. You could make the top button do the same as the home button now, and make it require a longer hold to sleep the phone, or bring up a combined sleep or power off option.

I'm hopeful this is a true rumor. I think Iwould buy it, now that my iPad replaces my need for many iPhone features when I am traveling.

What you describe simply sounds like the natural progression of the standard iPhone as they figure out how to make smaller components. Maybe 2 more versions down the road.

I can't imagine another iphone with a smaller screen.

Bureaucromancer
Feb 13, 2011, 05:16 PM
As much as I agree that this device is likely to have user experience 'difficulties' I'm starting to think it quite likely, and likely to come as part of a larger rework of the whole iPhone/iPod lineup.

My impression (entirely speculative, but tell me if it doesn't make sense) is that the iPod line has some problems right now, mostly centered on the current Nano being too small for a lot of people and not having any real commonality with the rest of the line. Most notably I suspect they'd really like to bring back video on the Nano but just can't do it on the new screen. So, my guess is the Nano phone comes alongside an iPod Touch Nano (won't they PLEASE just officially call them iTouch - well maybe not). The current nano could then take the place of the screenless shuffle with the same hardware at reduced price. I'd actually guess that the current Nano will still have a shuffle model below it though (and will be given an entirely new title with the re branding, since they will want to pair the new phone with the more established Nano title).

The new SCREENLESS shuffle on the other hand is, IMO the least likely part of what occurred to me, but I can't imagine that they haven't looked at the earpiece based design everyone and their brother imagined when the saw the cigarette lighter. That said, Apple being Apple, my actual guess is only that there will continue to be a screenless, sub $100 model (I'm thinking that the current Nano probably just isn't ready to go that low yet with what is a small but high quality screen).

The above note about the Shuffle leads me to my last point which is really just a response to the line of thought that a smaller/cheaper iPhone doesn't fit with Apple's high revenue/low volume strategy of not competing for the bottom of the market. While they do generally follow this, it just hasn't been true for some time in the iPod segment, with the Shuffle forming a large part of their maintenance of market domination. Given that they really do seem to look at the phones as a spinoff of the iPods rather than the computers or entirely separate I am not entirely sure that the conventional strategy applies (especially when combined with how close to dominant they are in phone with a SINGLE model, and that the iPad does to some extent represent a roundabout entry into the netbook price range). On a related note, also supporting the new phone, I suspect that the company would also be happier with a Nano type device than the current strategy of having an older and almost completely unpromoted version of the phones remain available they are using now.

Defender2010
Feb 13, 2011, 05:16 PM
Perhaps this iPhone nano is the new yearly iPhone (5)....trimmed down to be smaller and lighter....I for one, dont think Apple will release any future iPhone with anything less than a retina display,,,regardless of the screen size.That would be bad for the image. If the screen resolution was less than the iPod Touch, would anyone buy it??

vincenz
Feb 13, 2011, 05:17 PM
That's a lot of rumors over the weekend!

addicted44
Feb 13, 2011, 05:19 PM
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It actually doesn't, runs the same OS as the the other iPods (bar the iPod Touch) Apple has confirmed this.

You are right...

http://www.cultofmac.com/apple-touchscreen-ipod-nano-does-not-run-ios/57467

Wickedgardengtp
Feb 13, 2011, 05:24 PM
The iPhone5 should be invisible

3goldens
Feb 13, 2011, 05:27 PM
"The person"


Why not just make up some more BS so MacRumors can publush it!

puttputt
Feb 13, 2011, 05:29 PM
Wow, it's really lighter? I wonder how they could make a smaller phone weigh less? :rolleyes:

Meandmunch
Feb 13, 2011, 05:32 PM
Edge to edge would make the phone very difficult to use. You need that tiny bit of Bezel so the chubby-ness of your fingers doesn't interfere with using the device.

mdgm
Feb 13, 2011, 05:32 PM
If this small iPhone really does happen, I may buy my first new iPhone. The current iPhones are too expensive to buy outright imo. When I look at the price for the 32GB iPhone, I keep on thinking I could get a good Mac Mini instead.

I hope this rumour is true.

baryon
Feb 13, 2011, 05:32 PM
Voice navigation Shuffle-style: press and hold the button 3 times in a row, and the voice will read out the possible things you can do. Press it again to do the thing it says.

I don't know about you guys, but while voice navigation sounds cool, I would never really use it. I feel stupid saying commands to a phone, and especially when I have to repeat them 5 times for it to get it right. Then of course by that time you could just have done it with your hands.

But the rest sounds good, if this is really true, they are probably making the device much smaller, but only making the screen slightly smaller. And since the screen already touches the edges as much as possible on the sides, they are probably going to cut off the top and bottom (speaker and home button part) of the phone. That's something I think they should do with the normal-sized iPhone as well, if they can. Well, I'm sure they will do it as soon as it is technically possible!

Brewstermax
Feb 13, 2011, 05:34 PM
iPhone Nano : Now includes sandpaper. The iPhone nano will happen when the 7" iPad does. If you haven't noticed, screen sizes have gotten bigger with smartphones. Apple won't go backwards. WSJ is wrong. And if you haven't noticed, the competitors are moving to iPad screen size, not the other way around. Apple would have to include some awesome sandpaper with these alleged products.

brendu
Feb 13, 2011, 05:41 PM
Imagine if you will that Apple is trying to steal market share from Android by creating more choices.

This summer, iPhone 4 stays and is just called iPhone. And then they introduce the iPhone Nano (same screen as ipod touch 4 but no bezel at all) and also an iPhone Pro, 4" screen with small bezel around it and same retina resolution. Then their lineup becomes:

iPhone Nano : $0 on contract
iPhone: $199 on contract
iPhone Pro: $299 on contract

Now come back to reality and realize Apple will never do this. An iPhone nano, maybe, but im still doubtful about any of it. None of this fits Apples "one size fits all and makes us boatloads of cash" design.

bt2184
Feb 13, 2011, 05:43 PM
It sounds very interesting. After cutting out a peice of cardboard the size of the screen and holding it, it does feel quite small, they would need to make it feel comfortable and still includle a camera which would be a challenge, but at $200 and free w/contract could get a lot of the people who would opt for a cheap Android.

URFloorMatt
Feb 13, 2011, 05:43 PM
iPhone Nano : Now includes sandpaper. The iPhone nano will happen when the 7" iPad does. If you haven't noticed, screen sizes have gotten bigger with smartphones. Apple won't go backwards. WSJ is wrong. And if you haven't noticed, the competitors are moving to iPad screen size, not the other way around. Apple would have to include some awesome sandpaper with these alleged products.To be fair, nothing in this release says that the iPhone nano would have a smaller screen size--just a smaller form factor. But I agree this would all make a lot more sense if we were talking about a 3.7" iPhone nano and a 4.0" or 4.3" iPhone.

mad-dog-one
Feb 13, 2011, 05:45 PM
Roughly 1/3rd of the current iPhone screen is unusable, with narrow vertical bands on each side and larger horizontal strips of unusable space at the top and bottom of the display. If it is really possible to have a usable screen that extends to all four sides of an iPhone that is 1/3rd the current size, wouldn't the usable display be about the same size as the usable display on the iPhone 4.

Personally, I would prefer a slightly larger phone having a usable display that extends to all four sides.

lilo777
Feb 13, 2011, 05:46 PM
Do they really want to go the way of the failure that is the latest iPod Nano?

bt2184
Feb 13, 2011, 05:46 PM
I think its pretty safe to assume the screen size will remain the same, the os will be the same, just no bezel. Actually pretty amazing if they can squeeze all that into that small of a phone.

eye
Feb 13, 2011, 05:50 PM
This is not going to happen. Let's think in terms of business. If they released a similarly capable phone for less than the 4, nobody would buy the 4. The iphone 4 is basically like printing money. Apple is smarter than this although it makes for good news to sell papers with.

Full of Win
Feb 13, 2011, 05:50 PM
Finally a right move from Apple....if true.

Friscohoya
Feb 13, 2011, 05:55 PM
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Voice control? I've never gotten the current voice garbage to work well.

old-school
Feb 13, 2011, 05:58 PM
This rumor suggests that Apple will be integrating in the tech they bought when they acquired Siri last year. Not a big stretch.

DeathChill
Feb 13, 2011, 06:01 PM
John Gruber touched on this a few minutes ago:

"As for the smaller iPhone, I doubt the screen will be much smaller than 3.5 inches diagonally (if at all). I’m guessing it’s just thinner and with a smaller chin and forehead. But this Journal story says “One of the people, who saw a prototype of a new iPhone several months ago, said the new device is intended to be sold alongside the current line of iPhones and would be about half the size of the iPhone 4.” It’s unclear what “half the size” means, but surely it doesn’t mean a 1.75-inch diagonal screen."

kny3twalker
Feb 13, 2011, 06:02 PM
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I could see this happening. And furthermore, the iPod classic and shuffle discontinued. Then the current nano would become the new shuffle, an iPhone nano sized iPod touch would become the new iPod nano and the iPod touch renamed iPod.

In addition I could see the iPhone nano using either a retina quality 3.2" or 3.5" 3GS display. If the device uses a smaller display it could retain the front facing camera and home button or with the 3GS display drop them.

Lineup
iPod shuffle - current iPod nano
iPod nano - iPhone nano sized device
iPod - iPod touch renamed
iPhone - remains untouched
iPhone nano

Saladinos
Feb 13, 2011, 06:02 PM
Actually, it could be the same-sized screen but with no bezel left & right, and a smaller area at the top and bottom. Result: Same 'live' touch area, smaller overall device.

I can't speak for holding it without the bezel, but I have to imagine they've tested it to death. Especially after the whole 'antenna' flap.

If it feels OK in the hand, and has the same size display, I can see where a smaller device could be popular.

That makes it a pretty pointless device, TBH. Doesn't differentiate the product line in any significant way (which is what they need).

A larger iPhone would be easier technically, but it would likely appeal mostly to 'Pro' users, and they aren't the market Apple needs to go for right now (the people growing the smartphone market are everyday users, who would likely prefer a smaller device).

The way I could see this working is like this: the iPhone gets LTE. The iPhone nano comes out with 3G only, with a slightly smaller screen but keeping the 480x320 resolution. All of that can be done in a ridiculously thin device (see iPod touch). The only remaining issue is with the keyboard. One solution would be to include a hardware keyboard, which would also solve a big gripe a lot of users have about the iPhone, further broadening appeal.

Having a slide-out keyboard is quite un-Apple like, but so is poor usability. Personally, I don't think an iPhone nano is going to come out for this very reason (incl. product differentiation), but if it were to happen, this is how it would.

Mattsasa
Feb 13, 2011, 06:03 PM
nevermind

StumanRH
Feb 13, 2011, 06:10 PM
Ok, everyone replying to this is saying that the UI will be destroyed...The article says it will be a smaller device, and have an edge to edge screen. Why are they assuming the screen will be smaller? They seem to forget that the current iPhone has a black border around the display. Isn't it possible that the device will shrink but the display stays the same size, getting rid of the black border (at least on the left and right sides)?:D;)

P.s. just registered for this site and think its funny how the thread comment plane uses a windows '98 looking UI.

sagnier
Feb 13, 2011, 06:10 PM
Wow, it's really lighter? I wonder how they could make a smaller phone weigh less? :rolleyes:

i vote for them removing the optical drive. i bet most people dont use it on even a weekly basis.

OPTICAL MEDIA IS DEAD!

sagnier
Feb 13, 2011, 06:16 PM
Finally a right move from Apple....if true.

'finally'? - they seem to have been pretty successful on the old 'right move' front in recent years.

Xenc
Feb 13, 2011, 06:19 PM
i vote for them removing the optical drive. i bet most people dont use it on even a weekly basis.

OPTICAL MEDIA IS DEAD!

I can't say I've ever put a DVD in my iPhone. That optical drive is wasted space!

:p

Aleco
Feb 13, 2011, 06:21 PM
Now the touch gestures make a little more sense.

Laird Knox
Feb 13, 2011, 06:24 PM
If the voice navigation works really well then that might also compensate for a smaller device. More of a phone and less of a pocket computer.

Lepton
Feb 13, 2011, 06:27 PM
Let's not talk about phones for a minute. Let's talk about Television. Rumors fly every so often that Apple is doing a TV set, a real big screen TV. OK, take an AppleTV and put a 50" screen on it. No tuner though, just a couple of HDMI inputs, and Ethernet and WiFi. Kind of cool!

But instead of 50", think about 4". Basically an AppleTV with a 4" screen attached. Take out HDMI and Ethernet, keep WiFi, maybe add 3G, maybe add a phone since you have the 3G in there. Have iPod connector with video out. But it's not a replacement for an iPhone or an AppleTV. It is a replacement for the iPod Touch, as cheap as the iPod touch in its non-3g version.

So what do I have in my pocket? Like AppleTV, it has relatively few gigs of memory. It plays stuff from the cloud. It's a screamer of a streamer. Play rented movies and TV, play Netflix, play your stuff on iTunes at home. Play selected apps - the ones the AppleTV will open up to soon.

As for voice control, YES. Put Siri in there, in the same way it's getting into the iPhone and perhaps the Mac - ask this thing any question, get an answer back, give it orders like "book me a cab" and it does it. For my thoughts on upcoming voice control, check my blog at myallo.com.

WeegieMac
Feb 13, 2011, 06:28 PM
To those who want a larger screen.

I had a go of an HTC Desire HD on Friday after a work colleague got one.

And, sorry, it's too big. Even the guy who owned it said, "Taking it in/out your pocket is like wielding a brick at times".

It almost reminded me of the days I walked around with the original N-Gage at my ear while Nokia's were getting smaller and smaller.

The Desire HD looks more like a mini-tablet than a large phone.

btcutter
Feb 13, 2011, 06:31 PM
Voice based navigation?
How is that going to work with a lot of background noise outside?

Works great on Android OS. Why can't it for iOS? What's taking so long? Andoid has better Voice Command functions than iOS.

btcutter
Feb 13, 2011, 06:34 PM
Voice navigation Shuffle-style: press and hold the button 3 times in a row, and the voice will read out the possible things you can do. Press it again to do the thing it says.

I don't know about you guys, but while voice navigation sounds cool, I would never really use it. I feel stupid saying commands to a phone, and especially when I have to repeat them 5 times for it to get it right. Then of course by that time you could just have done it with your hands.

But the rest sounds good, if this is really true, they are probably making the device much smaller, but only making the screen slightly smaller. And since the screen already touches the edges as much as possible on the sides, they are probably going to cut off the top and bottom (speaker and home button part) of the phone. That's something I think they should do with the normal-sized iPhone as well, if they can. Well, I'm sure they will do it as soon as it is technically possible!

Hate to break this to you. While I love Apple products, voice command is one area Android has Apple beat by a mile.

I can tell my phone to call xxx resturant and it will find it and call it. Tell it to Navigate to location/store or address and it does it. I say 90% accuracy. You need to try it to believe it. In fact, I dictate many of my text messages now as well. I can't understand why Apple hasn't master voice command yet?

applefan69
Feb 13, 2011, 06:37 PM
I would think this was make it really hard to hold onto without accidentally pressing something on the screen. I have a hard enough time holding onto my current iPhone without touching the screen in the wrong place, and because of this it slips out of my hands sometimes!


definitely happens to me too!

one time i was lying in bed using my iphone and i dropped it on my head, it hurt! :p

smithrh
Feb 13, 2011, 06:38 PM
That's a lot of rumors over the weekend!

MWC (Mobile World Congress) is going on right now, many press releases and announcements coming out of that.

Apple is making sure they're not forgotten in the flurry of words being flung around...

Lesser Evets
Feb 13, 2011, 06:40 PM
Do they really want to go the way of the failure that is the latest iPod Nano?

The latest iPod Nano was a fail for so many reasons, the biggest being the exact same price as the last one but with the same memory and LESS function. Ridiculously stupid.

An iPhonano would be excellent if it cut some utility, was half size, and was half price. I'd be interested in that if it was still a good mp3+info holding device sans video. I'm not a texter, though, unlike most people.

Full of Win
Feb 13, 2011, 06:41 PM
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To those who want a larger screen.

I had a go of an HTC Desire HD on Friday after a work colleague got one.

And, sorry, it's too big. Even the guy who owned it said, "Taking it in/out your pocket is like wielding a brick at times".

It almost reminded me of the days I walked around with the original N-Gage at my ear while Nokia's were getting smaller and smaller.

The Desire HD looks more like a mini-tablet than a large phone.

Exactly.

Apple knows it's users, of which many are women and anemic males who do not want such an ugly bulge on their starvation achieved bodies.

Also, such a large phone would not easily fit in the hands of females, which are key to the iPhones success.

MattInOz
Feb 13, 2011, 06:52 PM
Even then, it's not the resolution that's the point. The interface and apps are designed for a 3.5" display. Any smaller and they wouldn't work properly. Buttons would be too small to press etc., meaning that the current apps in the App Store wouldn't be compatible.

If this phone really does get released, I'm guessing it'll run iOS in a similar way to how the iPod nano currently does (its own few apps and no access to the App Store).

Well not really 3.5" with 44x44pixel controls isn't ideal for everyone but was designed to capture the largest group of people possible. It also may have been a compromise between detection grid resolution(including light transmission lose from the screen), response time, control density and well price at the time. If Moore's Law applies then for the same cost they should be able to detect a target 1/4 the size with today's tech.

If you consider that the majority of the population are women and children. So even before you take in to account cultural influences a significant part of the market would find a slightly smaller screen more comfortable and still highly usable.

Those of us with bigger hands can be offered an improved experience with just the better detection tech.

michaelcyee
Feb 13, 2011, 06:52 PM
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Exactly.

Apple knows it's users, of which many are women and anemic males who do not want such an ugly bulge on their starvation achieved bodies.

Also, such a large phone would not easily fit in the hands of females, which are key to the iPhones success.

Anemic males? :lol:

I kind of really like the current form factor of the iPod touch right now. It feels right in my hand. I have to see an iPhone nano in my hand, though, to really see if it's better or worse.

MarcBook
Feb 13, 2011, 07:01 PM
assuming the screen is only slightly smaller (25-30%) and exactly half the resolution of the current iPhone 4, there would be no reason Apple couldn't make it immediately capable of running half resolution versions of all current apps and then allow developers to slowly update their apps to be more compatible over time

that is exactly what they did with iPad only initially doubling resolution until individual app compatibility was implemented by developers

and you are out of your mind if you think Apple would release a phone (or any mobile computing device) that is not in the iTunes/app store ecosystem

Can you imagine the current on-screen buttons 25-30% smaller? Clearly you didn't read my post properly. Resolution isn't the issue, the physical size is. Making the current apps any smaller would make them near impossible to use.

enfanteribl
Feb 13, 2011, 07:01 PM
To those who want a larger screen.

I had a go of an HTC Desire HD on Friday after a work colleague got one.

And, sorry, it's too big. Even the guy who owned it said, "Taking it in/out your pocket is like wielding a brick at times".

It almost reminded me of the days I walked around with the original N-Gage at my ear while Nokia's were getting smaller and smaller.

The Desire HD looks more like a mini-tablet than a large phone.

I agree. I thought the iPhone 3/3G was too big also. I had a Sony Ericsoon W880i for ages, and wouldn't give it up until recently as it was so handy.

The new HP Veer might have started something - it is quite thick, but otherwise a handy size.

If the iPhone Nano is 'half the size', that might mean by volume, and that would mean less significant reductions of screen area.

neko girl
Feb 13, 2011, 07:04 PM
Can you imagine the current on-screen buttons 25-30% smaller? Clearly you didn't read my post properly. Resolution isn't the issue, the physical size is. Making the current apps any smaller would make them near impossible to use.
The cheaper phone doesn't have to include a retina display. The shrink could be anywhere between 0 and 30%. I'm sure that a $200 or $300 price point, enough people won't really care about the point you're making. There's a price/usability middle ground somewhere.

I think we all agree that Apple will not introduce fragmentation, even if it meant no apps for this new tiny phone.

thelookingglass
Feb 13, 2011, 07:05 PM
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If this thing is an edge to edge screen, then clearly the screen size can remain 3.5". The device would just be about the size of the iPhone 4 with the bezels chopped off. No issues wit different display sizes. Home button can shift to the sides or go away altogether, the latter being more likely.

Laird Knox
Feb 13, 2011, 07:09 PM
Exactly.

Apple knows it's users, of which many are women and anemic males who do not want such an ugly bulge on their starvation achieved bodies.

Also, such a large phone would not easily fit in the hands of females, which are key to the iPhones success.

Wow, you say some pretty stupid things but this comment sets new standards.

On a related note: Last night I was talking to a guy that said he hated his Droid because it was so big. Five minutes later he was telling me he bought it beceause the screen was bigger than the iPhone. Talk about confused.

Then again, I would love a 10" screen that came in a 3.5" phone. :confused:

hobbbz
Feb 13, 2011, 07:10 PM
Quick 'chop

Mr. Gates
Feb 13, 2011, 07:13 PM
The black around the screen is not the Bezel..... Its the Frame

sam10685
Feb 13, 2011, 07:17 PM
We're going to need electrically conductive styluses if the screens keep getting smaller on iOs devices.

Mattsasa
Feb 13, 2011, 07:26 PM
The latest iPod Nano was a fail for so many reasons, the biggest being the exact same price as the last one but with the same memory and LESS function. Ridiculously stupid.

An iPhonano would be excellent if it cut some utility, was half size, and was half price. I'd be interested in that if it was still a good mp3+info holding device sans video. I'm not a texter, though, unlike most people.

the new ipod nano was not a failure,

Thex1138
Feb 13, 2011, 07:38 PM
If it's so cheap to make iPhone 3GS then why not simply sell that as the low end model AKA Tier 3 ?

Or even when iPhone 5 arrives... iPhone 4 is Tier 2.

iPhone 5 is premium...

Each new iteration supersedes the previous and 3 generations still run the current iOS... with iOS then 3GS probably wont run it so end user can keep iOS 4...
My niece uses my iPod Touch 1 fine with her music and stuff and videos and arcade games.

mjay2k
Feb 13, 2011, 07:41 PM
I think the the edge to edge screen design enables this new iPhone to shrink considerably without creating an unusable interface. The screen doesn't have to shrink much at all!

http://www.mjaystudios.com/rand/iPhone5nano.jpg

It might even sell better then the regular iPhone. I believe it will be free with a 2 year contract. This is the phone for the masses.

Hopefully they'll take the regular iPhone5's screen edge to edge while keeping the same form factor (or something similar.) This is actually something i've been wanting for some time!

http://www.mjaystudios.com/rand/iPhone5.jpg

JoshBoy
Feb 13, 2011, 07:51 PM
You need the bezel to hold the phone without touching the display, much like how the iPad has a thick bezel around its display.

Sorry but your holding it wrong!!! :rolleyes:

ghostlyorb
Feb 13, 2011, 07:52 PM
I think that it will be something like a semi-smart phone. Can't do everything that the iPhone can.. just most of the stuff. It would allow for Apple to sell to people who don't want to pay for data (my parents for their own phones) but still have a top-of-the-line touchscreen phone.

josh2012
Feb 13, 2011, 08:01 PM
Wirelessly posted (iPhone 4: Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8C148 Safari/6533.18.5)

So if i have this right, then in the next few months we'll be seeing..

iPad 2
MacBook Pro refresh
iPhone 5 (or iPhone 4GS or whatever it'll be called)
iPhone Nano (with edge to edge screen) (or whatever it'll be called)
iOS 5
Mac OS X 10.7
Free MobileMe
iTunes air sync

wow..this is amazing.

I really like the idea of a smaller phone, but i think "half-size" is cutting it too small, but we'll see. This is gonna be a huge blow to Android, as Apple will now be competing against the amount of iPhones in the market with the iPhone Nano, along with the specs of the Android devices as well with the iPhone 5.
Both possibly running a polished iOS 5.

And for all of us with Macs, we'll be seeing Lion be released, and maybe iOS 5 and Lion will have some sort of syncing ability or something. Their releases seem pretty close by.

Missed the MacBook Air refresh if you believe the rumors.. I hope its true..

TheSlush
Feb 13, 2011, 08:13 PM
Unless it's going to be a device with just a few redesigned native apps -- and not connected to the App Store ecosystem -- then this is not something that's going to happen. The current iPhone OS and app user interfaces cannot shrink without the user experience going to hell.
And that phone found in a bar last year is NOT the new iPhone.No Way.Only an idiot would think so.The design is totally un-Apple.And those black lines on the side,Apple would never,never do that.And they'd never let a prototype off campus anyway,so it's impossible.Obviously some cheap crappy looking Chinese garbage.

Um, random attempt at a rumor connection? I never doubted that incident was the real iPhone 4. But this "half-sized iPhone nano" rumor is just dumb without a redesigned interface as part of the equation.

Beware of people who think they absolutely know what Apple will do.
They don't.

Of course I do. :rolleyes:

Mr Fusion
Feb 13, 2011, 08:13 PM
... Then I'll be impressed! ;)

Plymouthbreezer
Feb 13, 2011, 08:14 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_2_6 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8E200 Safari/6533.18.5)

"call Mark." = "calling Mom."

Voice navigation still blows.

Tshapi
Feb 13, 2011, 08:32 PM
imagine the iphone nano as the current iphone screen size. and that is the whole entire phone. but were talking about apple. so if they create an edge to edge screen for a nano it would stand to reason that the next generation iphone 4 or 4gs or 5 what ever they call will most likely be the same form fact and ui.

im apples last earnings conference call. it was mentioned that if apple wanted to go LTE the phone would need a completly new redesign.

ARF900
Feb 13, 2011, 08:33 PM
I really dont think this will happen. although ive said that before and been wrong.

I think this thing is either

A. an iPod nano
B. BS

Cheerwino
Feb 13, 2011, 08:36 PM
I really dont think this will happen. although ive said that before and been wrong.

I think this thing is either

A. an iPod nano
B. BS

Ooo, I can't wait to hear more about the new Apple BS! :D

thuchu1
Feb 13, 2011, 08:43 PM
No you don't. I never touch the bezel.

When it's in my hand, it's either resting on my palm or i'm gripping it by the antenna.

Clearly the epitome of what steve meant when he said we were holding it wrong :p

gkarris
Feb 13, 2011, 08:56 PM
Smaller screen?

For real?

Like it's not small already...

But it's a "retina" screen and you can view the entire front page of "The Wall Street Journal" on it... :eek:

It'll be like that tiny button-less iPod Shuffle - that was successful...

$200 unlocked phone from Apple in the US - like Verizon and AT&T are going to go for that...

:rolleyes:

Mr. Incredible
Feb 13, 2011, 08:57 PM
If it's going to be an edge to edge screen, then where is the front facing camera gonna go? And how will you be able to hear someone, if it's going to be all glass?

I don't get it. :confused:

aughsum
Feb 13, 2011, 08:59 PM
smaller. I want a modu-sized iPhone with a custom nano-esque interface.

addicted44
Feb 13, 2011, 09:00 PM
If it's going to be an edge to edge screen, then where is the front facing camera gonna go?

Behind the display.

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/09/01/08/apple_files_patent_for_camera_hidden_behind_display.html

alexhasfun28
Feb 13, 2011, 09:02 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8C148 Safari/6533.18.5)

Voice Navigation? wow.. I feel like it's 2007 all over again.

Whoopee:D voice navigation -_-

shartypants
Feb 13, 2011, 09:10 PM
Maybe "voice navigation" is just voice control that actually works half way decent.

andrewsd
Feb 13, 2011, 09:11 PM
Be interested in seeing it in person but I prefer the size of the iPhone 4 now. Messed with bigger phones and didn't enjoy them such as the EVO and don't think I'd like a smaller one. But we shall all see. Besides I'm gonna roll with my iPhone 4 until 2012 anyways.

Surely
Feb 13, 2011, 09:11 PM
Perhaps the screen size will be exactly the same as the current iPhone, but there just won't be a black bezel above or below......

Yr Blues
Feb 13, 2011, 09:21 PM
I would buy it if it was $200 unsubsidized.

I think it's BS, 'cos Apple is just selling the previous versions as the "economy" version, although it's still subsidized.

Maybe without the bezzle they can keep the screen the same size. They'll probably use it as a test bed to experiment with different features.

No doubt they are making prototypes, but I can't see them making it.

Unlocked for T-mobile, please.

Cheerwino
Feb 13, 2011, 09:22 PM
It will come with Bluetooth earpiece so no speaker or microphone. Brain waves control the iOS. Apps load directly into your cerebral cortex. All files will be stored in the cloud. Red pill or blue pill. You decide...:p

triceretops
Feb 13, 2011, 09:23 PM
I just wish they would keep these stupid iPhone rumors off the MAC rumors pages.:mad:

torbjoern
Feb 13, 2011, 09:24 PM
I just wish they would keep these stupid iPhone rumors off the MAC rumors pages.:mad:

Thank you for writing that. I'm so sick of hearing about the iPad too - I resent the product itself big time.

zenio
Feb 13, 2011, 09:27 PM
If the voice navigation works really well then that might also compensate for a smaller device. More of a phone and less of a pocket computer.
This small form factor will place it in the dumb phone / gadget class. A perfect space to keep Apple from having to compete with increasingly better Android phones.

Priced as low as free from subsidizing carriers, women especially will like it's diminutive size. Reminds me of something Sony would offer.

Racing to the bottom, Apple can boast of being the first. A win/win for the Walmart mass market demographic. Very smart. An impulse item that retail stores love.

twoodcc
Feb 13, 2011, 09:27 PM
edge to edge screen sounds good to me! looking forward to both in June!

Surely
Feb 13, 2011, 09:28 PM
Thank you for writing that. I'm so sick of hearing about the iPad too - I resent the product itself big time.

That's because you don't have one. ;)


This site was named MacRumors well before any of the iDevices were invented. Fortunately/unfortunately, the Mac isn't Apple's primary product anymore.

shartypants
Feb 13, 2011, 09:28 PM
Edge to edge would make the phone very difficult to use. You need that tiny bit of Bezel so the chubby-ness of your fingers doesn't interfere with using the device.

I agree, I'd be hitting stuff on the edge all the time. I'm sure Apple would consider that? The idea of having a full touch/display surface including the edge is a cool thought. They could add new virtual buttons like a camera button or a separate rotation-lock button, etc.

DickKnowsBest
Feb 13, 2011, 09:29 PM
A smaller iPhone would be ok. It could work with the keyboard. If the longest length of the screen (960) in the 'iPhone nano' is at least the same length as the shorter length of the screen (640) in the 3.5" iPhone, it will still be fine as a keyboard so long as it is used in landscape. But what I think apple will benefit more from, is a cheaper iPhone, without the rear camera, and lower specs (e.g. 1ghz and 512mb ram and 4gb version, compared to an iPhone 5 with possibly a dual core, 1gb ram and up to 64gb version)
Maybe $499 starting price for the handset alone. This is New Zealand prices of course...

$499 - iPhone 5
1Ghz A4
512mb ram
4gb capacity
Facetime (VGA) + rear camera (VGA)

$999 - iPhone 5
Dual core A5
1gb ram
32gb capacity
Facetime (VGA) + rear camera (5mp)

$1199 - iPhone 5
Dual core A5
1gb ram
64gb capacity
Facetime (VGA) + rear camera (5mp)

I would like to see this... but likely we will just see the old iPhone 4 for $199 less in the next iPhone 5 lineup. Like they did with the 4gb 3gs when the iPhone 4 was released.

You know... lot of people use a shuffle or nano for their music, and a lot of people just want a phone with a good UI and simple interface for a fraction of the price of a regular iPhone, without having to pay for the 5mp camera, 32gb storage and other features they don't need. So a dumbed down iPhone would definitely find it's place in the market, since a lot of people just want a phone. A smaller iPhone just strains your eyes and thumbs when it comes to typing and using apps. When your thumb covers almost the whole screen so that you can't see what you are doing, you then know it's not a very good product. That's why I never liked the small screen of the nano. ;)

Yr Blues
Feb 13, 2011, 09:34 PM
I agree, I'd be hitting stuff on the edge all the time. I'm sure Apple would consider that? The idea of having a full touch/display surface including the edge is a cool thought. They could add new virtual buttons like a camera button or a separate rotation-lock button, etc.

they can program the touch screen to only work within certain pixels....I thought that would be a good way for an edge to edge iPad....depending on the app, the imaginary bezel can still be programmed within certain pixels

roocka
Feb 13, 2011, 09:37 PM
Do you guys think apple will use Liquidmetal in the iPhone nano?

Amnak
Feb 13, 2011, 09:41 PM
imagine the iphone nano as the current iphone screen size. and that is the whole entire phone. but were talking about apple. so if they create an edge to edge screen for a nano it would stand to reason that the next generation iphone 4 or 4gs or 5 what ever they call will most likely be the same form fact and ui.

im apples last earnings conference call. it was mentioned that if apple wanted to go LTE the phone would need a completly new redesign.

the size of the current screen is what im thinking too!

torbjoern
Feb 13, 2011, 09:41 PM
That's because you don't have one. ;)

I know that my posting easily can give that impression. I said something similar to a guy who obviously hated the MacBook Air because he couldn't afford one.

As for the iPad, I was really impressed and excited to test it until I actually did try one. I wasn't impressed about it at all. Graphics were grainy and it felt uncomfortable to hold it and write... maybe I was just holding it wrong, what do I know? I just don't need such a huge iPod.

However, it was never like I couldn't afford an iPad, because I certainly can. But for the same reason that I don't find the iPad worth the price (or even a fraction of the price), I feel sick to see all the headlines still hyping it up.

ColeHarris
Feb 13, 2011, 09:55 PM
Well first off this is obviously absolutely ridiculous, but for arguments sake lets pretend its not. According to this unnamed source Apple is going to release a mini iphone with entry level smart phone features for consumers not interested in the advanced abilities of more expensive androids or the iPhone 4. But since they are definitely not going to cut this iphone light off from the app store this group of old people and young children are going to pay the 90 or whatever dollars a month to use the phone they bought because of there lack of need for the advance features they would have to pay more for? Sorry but this sounds completely idiotic to me!

aughsum
Feb 13, 2011, 09:58 PM
I know that my posting easily can give that impression. I said something similar to a guy who obviously hated the MacBook Air because he couldn't afford one.

As for the iPad, I was really impressed and excited to test it until I actually did try one. I wasn't impressed about it at all. Graphics were grainy and it felt uncomfortable to hold it and write... maybe I was just holding it wrong, what do I know? I just don't need such a huge iPod.

However, it was never like I couldn't afford an iPad, because I certainly can. But for the same reason that I don't find the iPad worth the price (or even a fraction of the price), I feel sick to see all the headlines still hyping it up.

It depends on the person. Everything is subjective to the needs of the consumer. For every one person who doesn't think the iPad is worth a fraction of the price, there are 10,000 who think it is.

tthere5
Feb 13, 2011, 10:01 PM
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Those positing that iPhone nano will not have access to the ap store are off base. Why would apple sell a cheaper (likely less profitable) version of the iPhone and not utilize it's best asset- the aP store ecosystem? People buy iPhone nano get aps- love aps, then buy iPhone, iPad, Mac, etc. The nano halo effect- just like tue iPod before it.

Surely
Feb 13, 2011, 10:01 PM
I know that my posting easily can give that impression.

It didn't. That's why there's a ;) in my post.

If you don't like that iPad, you don't like the iPad. That's your opinion, and you're entitled to it. I've thoroughly enjoyed using mine, and I think it's worth every penny.

gkarris
Feb 13, 2011, 10:07 PM
Well first off this is obviously absolutely ridiculous, but for arguments sake lets pretend its not. According to this unnamed source Apple is going to release a mini iphone with entry level smart phone features for consumers not interested in the advanced abilities of more expensive androids or the iPhone 4. But since they are definitely not going to cut this iphone light off from the app store this group of old people and young children are going to pay the 90 or whatever dollars a month to use the phone they bought because of there lack of need for the advance features they would have to pay more for? Sorry but this sounds completely idiotic to me!

Yes, extremely idiotic.

Especially the part of it being unlocked at $200 (not gonna happen in the USA).

I think someone might have seen one of those smaller Chinese iPhone knock-offs and mistook it for an Apple prototype and now everyone's running with it...

niji
Feb 13, 2011, 10:14 PM
maybe 2 phones:

1/ "smaller" iphone 5:
resolution: same as iPhone 4
total size of external dimensions of case: smaller than current iPhone 4
weight: probably about 20 grams lighter than current iPhone 4
price: same as current iPhone 4. none of this USD 200 price point.

2/ "same size as iPhone 4" iPhone 5
more disk storage space than iPhone 4
more memory than iPhone 4
larger battery than iPhone 4
NFC module
larger focal point zoom camera
price: premium to smaller iPhone5

Yr Blues
Feb 13, 2011, 10:19 PM
Do you guys think apple will use Liquidmetal in the iPhone nano?

you mean polymimetic alloy:D

nitropowered
Feb 13, 2011, 10:21 PM
i want a larger iphone

MattInOz
Feb 13, 2011, 10:24 PM
It depends on the person. Everything is subjective to the needs of the consumer. For every one person who doesn't think the iPad is worth a fraction of the price, there are 10,000 who think it is.

Plus common opinions on tech forums aren't known for siding with the 10,000. Many seem to take pride in being the one.

Hey where is the technically superior Nomad these days?

AmpSkillz
Feb 13, 2011, 10:24 PM
Can you imagine the current on-screen buttons 25-30% smaller? Clearly you didn't read my post properly. Resolution isn't the issue, the physical size is. Making the current apps any smaller would make them near impossible to use.

well you are exaggerating quite a bit when you say nearly impossible to use

everyone here who has an i phone has noticed how impressively easy it is to click on a specific tiny link or button in the web browser due to the ability of iOS to determine your fingers focal point

not sure why you think all current buttons would cease to be functional if the size was reduced by 25%

I never said I would like a smaller screen just pointing out that it's feasible

for example, look at mjay2k's mockup on page 5 of this thread and explain to me how that looks completely unusable

Laird Knox
Feb 13, 2011, 10:26 PM
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I really dont think this will happen. although ive said that before and been wrong.

I think this thing is either

A. an iPod nano
B. BS

Ooo, I can't wait to hear more about the new Apple BS! :D

You just did: The iPhone Basic System - smaller, lighter and just makes calls. :)

hotcocoa
Feb 13, 2011, 10:34 PM
Seems like this will probably go one of two ways:

1. iPhone Nano offered as a replacement to the current low-cost iPhone (i.e. 3GS). Perhaps slightly reduced screen area (not to much or the physical size of UI elements will become too small), and reduced bezel, but otherwise hardware more or less in line with iPhone 4 hardware (although perhaps without the retina display--the iPhone 4's most expensive part).

2. Newly designed phone targeting the 'feature phone' segment. This would basically be an iPod nano / phone hybrid. A data plan wouldn't be required. Rather than being iOS-based, this phone would be based on the (non-touch) iPod OS.

My guess is that Apple goes with option #1. Apple seems to place its bets on long-term trends. Smartphones represent the fastest growing segment of the cell phone market.

Option #2 would also present serious branding problems. In the mind of many consumers iPhone is basically synonymous with smartphone. Option #2 would be really confusing to market within the iPhone brand.

My guess is that the iPhone nano was developed because the current iPhone 4's parts costs is currently around $170 (perhaps this might drop to $160 by June), too much to have a phone that can be offered for free with a contact after overhead and manufacturing costs. Meanwhile the 3GS is getting pretty outdated. An iPhone nano could be developed to have a much lower parts cost while also generating a great deal of interest and excitement.

Epic Xbox Revie
Feb 13, 2011, 10:41 PM
Referring to a couple posts back... if the screen is the same size and resolution to the current model, and the screen is edge to edge, where are they going to put the volume out speakers for phone calls (the one currently on the front by the facetime camera)?

It's an interesting idea to have a cheaper or free iPhone, yes, but I don't see Apple being the company to do something like that. The only thing I can see them doing is maybe going back and using much cheaper internal parts, something with the capabilities of the iPhone 3G...which even then is REALLY unlikely seeing as that technology is three years old. But I don't see any other option to have a free phone and still be an iPhone.

The reduced features in the iPod Touch pushes their prices down to 229,299,and 399 dollars but you still need the cellular chip.. which is like $100 I believe..I can't see this happening until I see a couple more details on what the feature trade off will be..

As for the large screen sizes, I believe Steve Jobs, who still makes major decisions, has said that he thinks that the current size is perfect.

mhobb
Feb 13, 2011, 10:48 PM
Is this what you picture?

Mr. Incredible
Feb 13, 2011, 10:49 PM
Behind the display.

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/09/01/08/apple_files_patent_for_camera_hidden_behind_display.html

Very interesting concept, but that was filed 4 years ago. Is this something that we should be expecting in Apples lineup of iPhones/iPods/iPads?

That would be amazing.

MattInOz
Feb 13, 2011, 10:51 PM
Can you imagine the current on-screen buttons 25-30% smaller? Clearly you didn't read my post properly. Resolution isn't the issue, the physical size is. Making the current apps any smaller would make them near impossible to use.

The interface guidelines say the target should be 44pixels between centers on the original res screen, this means each target is a little smaller then a 7mm circle. On a 3.0inch screen that would reduce to 6mm and 5mm on a 2.5inch screen*. The difference is really minor.

Yet my fingers pushed against a ruler is about 15mm which is far bigger than the first, yet at 2.5inch screen would still only overlap the same number of control objects. So its not the size that matters it's the resolution of detection to pick which control is truly center of my finger touch. Although the users motor control also factors in still something between 2.5 to 3.0inch would still seem practical.

*Sorry for the mismatch of units.

Epic Xbox Revie
Feb 13, 2011, 10:53 PM
Is this what you picture?

That actually looks like a decent concept picture iPhone nano:apple:. However, it's barely any smaller than the iPhone 4.. and is smaller only because it doesn't have the physical button, which I believe an overwhelming large majority of people are in favor of keeping...

SandynJosh
Feb 13, 2011, 10:53 PM
After reading (on more than one occasion) from hardcore iPhone fans that Apple doesn't care for the commodity or "race to the bottom" low end market, I'd be pleased to see this thing come to fruition. I'd also love to snap one up if the price is right.

While I think Apple is not interested in the dumb phone market at all, they may release such a product as an iPhone Nano in the smart phone market to push the "ceiling" down for the wannabe, thus making the market Apple wants to dominate even more miserable for the competitors.

Few posters in this thread picked up on the "voice navigation" aspect of the small iPhone (and likely the standard sized iPhone). This may be a great end run on any complaints about keyboard size reduction, if it should be an issue.

A smart phone needs to understand voice to a much greater extent than it does at present. Especially to lessen poking in so much text.

SandynJosh
Feb 13, 2011, 11:05 PM
1. iPhone Nano offered as a replacement to the current low-cost iPhone (i.e. 3GS). Perhaps slightly reduced screen area (not to much or the physical size of UI elements will become too small), and reduced bezel, but otherwise hardware more or less in line with iPhone 4 hardware (although perhaps without the retina display--the iPhone 4's most expensive part).

You offered two alternatives, with this one being the most likely. I would propose a third alternative, and that is there will be no Nano iPhone.

Think back a few days and HP announced their new line-up which included a nano-sized phone. Additionally, of all the new devices, this small phone would be the only thing coming onto the market before the usual iPhone release date.

This rumor could be nothing more then FUD thrown out by Apple via WSJ as their patsy, to make people hold off on the HP small phone to see what Apple has to offer. Thus blunting the introduction of the HP release.

Even if Apple has a June release of a iPhone Nano, they've accomplished the same thing and not tipped their hand.

shazzam
Feb 13, 2011, 11:10 PM
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Edge to edge screen gets Apple closer to their no-design design philosophy. I see this happening along with the 'total rethink' design of iPhone 5.

xnu
Feb 13, 2011, 11:19 PM
The interface guidelines say the target should be 44pixels between centers on the original res screen, this means each target is a little smaller then a 7mm circle. On a 3.0inch screen that would reduce to 6mm and 5mm on a 2.5inch screen*. The difference is really minor.

Yet my fingers pushed against a ruler is about 15mm which is far bigger than the first, yet at 2.5inch screen would still only overlap the same number of control objects. So its not the size that matters it's the resolution of detection to pick which control is truly center of my finger touch. Although the users motor control also factors in still something between 2.5 to 3.0inch would still seem practical.

*Sorry for the mismatch of units.

Excellent post, answers some of the questions I was pondering. Thanks!

KPOM
Feb 13, 2011, 11:20 PM
I wouldn't say that. It's all coming from the same source (WSJ) and they could easily be wrong, especially when the rumor is supposedly 6+ months out...

Except the WSJ is usually pretty conservative about publishing rumors. They are a respected publication and won't publish a rumor unless they can reasonably substantiate it. The VZW iPhone rumors gained significant credibility once the WSJ announced it was coming. Sure enough, within a month, the device was launched.

Until the past year, Apple had a reputation for being extremely secretive. Whether it's a change in tactics by Apple (i.e. controlled leaks), more scrutiny from corporate espionage types, or more talkative suppliers (or some combination) I don't know, but lately, the rumor mills have been pretty accurate.

ProwlingTiger
Feb 13, 2011, 11:20 PM
How would an edge-to-edge screen work with cases? It sounds like it wouldn't work too well. Regardless, I think I'll be skipping the iPhone Nano. If anything, I want a larger iPhone like the Droid X.

garoto
Feb 13, 2011, 11:22 PM
The iPod Nano runs a slimmed down version of iOS,

No it does not! The iPod Nano is "AN IPOD", what OS is it running? THE "iPod" App! The exact same app that you see in your iphone, is the actual operating system of you iPod, because.... it's an iPod Nano! It is a trimmed down version of the iPod App, with touch interface instead menus and a clickwheel to keep the family likeness with other apple devices. An operating system is not what you see on your screen, the operating system is underneath!

ProwlingTiger
Feb 13, 2011, 11:28 PM
No it does not! The iPod Nano is "AN IPOD", what OS is it running? THE "iPod" App! The exact same app that you see in your iphone, is the actual operating system of you iPod, because.... it's an iPod Nano! It is a trimmed down version of the iPod App, with touch interface instead menus and a clickwheel to keep the family likeness with other apple devices. An operating system is not what you see on your screen, the operating system is underneath!
Apple said that it's not iOS and I'd wager it's not even the iPod app. Like most people have speculated, probably some reworked OS X code.

GorgonPhone
Feb 14, 2011, 12:01 AM
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So instead of a bigger screen we'll have the option to opt for a smaller screen? Nice.

Women control consumer markets and women want smaller sonthe corporations will give them smaller .... Men wantvbigger butbmen dontbmatter as much .... The current iPhone 4 is too small so I think they should Make 2 options one smaller and one bigger....

They can make it thinner and lighter but for gods sake don't make thebscreen harder to see than it is now ...

My guess is they wanna make a "cute iPhone" for women

starflyer
Feb 14, 2011, 12:08 AM
Could an edge to edge screen iPhone nano work like this? Same screen size and resolution, but a smaller phone. Almost 1/3 smaller? What would they have to take out? How would it work without a home button?

MacFly123
Feb 14, 2011, 12:15 AM
Unless it's going to be a device with just a few redesigned native apps -- and not connected to the App Store ecosystem -- then this is not something that's going to happen. The current iPhone OS and app user interfaces cannot shrink without the user experience going to hell.

Unless it had the same resolution as the first three generations of iPhone (480x320).

(edited as pointed out by alectheking)

you mean 480x320.

EXACTLY! If Apple did the old resolution which all the apps are already made for, at half the size it would still be pretty high pixel density! :cool:

I am excited to see what iOS 5 has in store! I am excited for Lion too, but I find myself moving more and more like Steve said, I get excited about the future of the iPhone and iPad and I still want my Mac Pro, but that is my "truck" that I'm only on for serious things like video editing.

notabadname
Feb 14, 2011, 12:16 AM
Could an edge to edge screen iPhone nano work like this? Same screen size and resolution, but a smaller phone. Almost 1/3 smaller? What would they have to take out? How would it work without a home button?

You could easily make the sleep button function as the Home Button with a quick click, then a long hold of the sleep button could bring up both the power down red slider and a touch sleep option on the screen. Would be very easy.

SicMX
Feb 14, 2011, 01:11 AM
My guess:

The downsides on the iPhone Nano (compared to the iPhone 5):

- worse camera
- worse battery life
- no LTE
- worse speaker
- no physical buttons except sleep and maybe volume
- single core CPU
- less RAM
- less flash (4-16gb?)

What should be the same:

- same resolution
- same screen size
- facetime cam
- NFC chip

It would be kind of like the iPod Touch 4G but with cellular capabilities

abhimat.gautam
Feb 14, 2011, 01:27 AM
Unless it's going to be a device with just a few redesigned native apps -- and not connected to the App Store ecosystem -- then this is not something that's going to happen. The current iPhone OS and app user interfaces cannot shrink without the user experience going to hell.

This actually makes some sense, and could be logical and feasible. It might just end up being something like the new iPod nano, but based on iOS. It would just have smaller apps exclusively designed for it, but not open for development. And these apps would not be all the apps available on the iPhone right now, just some essential ones, like Phone, SMS, iPod, and probably small utilities like like calculator and clock. Other than that, everything else could be available on the full iPhone.

But as I type this, I also realize that it would be going away from the entire eventual movement to smartphones…

abhimat.gautam
Feb 14, 2011, 01:31 AM
Apple said that it's not iOS and I'd wager it's not even the iPod app. Like most people have speculated, probably some reworked OS X code.

I think I remember that it was a new operating system, possibly based off of the classic iPod OS, made to resemble iOS.

shazzam
Feb 14, 2011, 01:49 AM
You could easily make the sleep button function as the Home Button with a quick click, then a long hold of the sleep button could bring up both the power down red slider and a touch sleep option on the screen. Would be very easy.

Basically, yeah. Like this.

tmofee
Feb 14, 2011, 01:51 AM
does anyone honestly think we'll get a phone that won't be able to connect to the app store?? i think the screens will be the same, maybe not retina, but juiced up inside so it's up to date. angry birds and all will still continue to work on these cheaper phones, just not as pretty :P

i'm sorry, i just can't see apple making just a phone at this point. and i think the app developers would be pretty pissed if they get from apple "sorry! you have to re-design your apps for our iphone nano! deal with it!" that would go down well...

sk58781111
Feb 14, 2011, 02:14 AM
You need the bezel to hold the phone without touching the display, much like how the iPad has a thick bezel around its display.

wow, you're dumb.

Xenc
Feb 14, 2011, 03:13 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-gb) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8C148 Safari/6533.18.5)

You need the bezel to hold the phone without touching the display, much like how the iPad has a thick bezel around its display.

wow, you're dumb.

No, he's right. Try holding the phone by the touch screen. It thinks you're tapping it.

Man4allsea
Feb 14, 2011, 03:13 AM
What if the screen is the same size (edge to edge) but there is no bezel or a greatly reduced bezel.
Same ios experience, but much smaller.
There has been rumor of saying goodbye to the home button.
This would solve all of that.
Smaller, lighter but the same functionality.

zerofour
Feb 14, 2011, 03:28 AM
I'd be quite surprised by this as I'm not sure what the market is for a smaller phone, esp with sizes now around 4 and 4.3 inches for smartphones. Still, Apple know marketing better than me!

NightFox
Feb 14, 2011, 03:34 AM
...I see some mentioning they want a bigger screen... to each their own but I would never want anything bigger than the current iPhone. It's PHONE.. not a tablet or a laptop. I see people with the 4" Droids and it makes me laugh. Looks ridiculous. I'm fine with options, but as long as they don't ever bring the standard size up. That would stink.

10 years ago when the first Windows CE-based smart phones started being used people looked ridiculous with a device not much bigger than today's smart phones held against their ears when everyone else was using ever-shrinking Nokias, but now we think nothing of it. That said, I agree with you that personally I wouldn't want anything larger.

MrCrowbar
Feb 14, 2011, 03:38 AM
Could an edge to edge screen iPhone nano work like this? Same screen size and resolution, but a smaller phone. Almost 1/3 smaller? What would they have to take out? How would it work without a home button?

Voice Navigation. Just shout "Home" and it'll take you there. :-p

NightFox
Feb 14, 2011, 03:39 AM
The iPhone5 should be invisible

It is. I know because I'm currently testing one for Apple. Yours for $500.

MrCrowbar
Feb 14, 2011, 03:41 AM
I'd be quite surprised by this as I'm not sure what the market is for a smaller phone, esp with sizes now around 4 and 4.3 inches for smartphones. Still, Apple know marketing better than me!

There's a market for non-smart-phones, i.e. phones that are good for making phone calls. The iPhone (any version) is kinda awkward for making calls, bad shape, weak vibrator, quiet speaker (too quiet when ringing, too quiet for speakerphone), weak battery compared to old Nokias.

I'm eagerly awaiting a simple phone by Apple to replace my original iPhone.

zerofour
Feb 14, 2011, 03:45 AM
There's a market for non-smart-phones, i.e. phones that are good for making phone calls. The iPhone (any version) is kinda awkward for making calls, bad shape, weak vibrator, quiet speaker (too quiet when ringing, too quiet for speakerphone), weak battery compared to old Nokias.

I'm eagerly awaiting a simple phone by Apple to replace my original iPhone.

Fair points! I'm needing to replace an N82, tho I'll wait til the Summer to see what happens!!

Islandz
Feb 14, 2011, 03:54 AM
Who else thinks this will be Apple's true "smart watch".

Nano with Facetime? Bluetooth?

*head explodes*

ri0ku
Feb 14, 2011, 03:57 AM
I dont think it will happen at all.. why would they make a smaller iphone (with a smaller screen unless they keep it the same size) it would be totally pointless, nothing would be right touch performance will be crap. Steve said the same thing about making the iPad smaller. If thats the case (in which case dimming down the size would have been allot easier to handle with the GUI since 7" is still quite big) Doing it to a 3.5 screen and taking it down would just make it shocking...

Anyone who thinks it could work and wont have the app store is mental. I wouldnt buy an iPhone or iPad or iPod now if it didnt have the App store, android offerings are far superior the only reason why I dont buy android stuff is because Apple has the App store which is way ahead of anything else and thats the reason I bought my iPhone.

iPhone without the App store is an outdated boring phone.

theres a reason the phone has a bezel too I dont get this edge to edge thing everyone thinks will happen. You try holding a phone without a bezel and you will constantly touch the screen moving things around or selecting the wrong thing etc. The Bezel is there for a reason... and it gives a little extra space to pack more things in. If we had a phone without a bezel and it was just all screen on the top then that would be a nightmare.

Cinnabar
Feb 14, 2011, 03:58 AM
If they're going to do this, here is my prediction (indulging in some classic rumour combination).

This is all about losing the home button. The iPhone Nano (or whtever it's called) will be the same size as the screen on the current iPhone (so no issue with scaling of the apps). The screen will be edge-to-edge, and the overall size of the device will be smaller than current iterations.

The important part to think about here is differentiation then between the 'Nano' and the iPhone 5. Again, it's all about removal of the home button. The iPhone 5 will basically stay the same overall size also, but will have an edge-to-edge screen, thereby increasing the screen size and providing the differentiation between teh devices (don't ask me how this works with scaling of the apps!)

So, there we have it. A bigger iPhone 5 screen (as many people have been clamouring for), and a smaller device which retains the current level of real estate and means that no apps have to be rescaled.

Amazing what you can almost convince yourself of....

Oh, and one other thing, whatever they produce it has to have access to the App Store. These days, that's the iPhone's biggest selling point if you ask me.

ri0ku
Feb 14, 2011, 04:04 AM
Honestly you guy are mental if you think an edge to edge screen is going to happen.

Imagine this... when you print out a high glossy photo through your printer and it comes out and you pick it up you only hold the back of it.. you dont dare to put your fingers on the front incase you smudge it right?

Youl do the same thing with an edge to edge phone because you will constantly keep hitting stuff on the screen you didnt want to touch...

mirko.meschini
Feb 14, 2011, 04:13 AM
I think the new iPhone nano will be 3.3" to 3.5" sized, with hw specs simil-3gs (480x320), with front face camera and led flash on rear camera, reduced black bezels around the screen, and 4 or 8GB of memory. The iPhone5, 3.7" to 4" sized, with reduced bezels, iphone4-like specs with A5 processor (we'll see it with the iPad 2) and 16-64GB of memory.
All these phones will use the same apps with no change from actual 3gs and 4.
Price points: 250-350$ for nano, and 600-800$ range for iPhone 5.

matthewprince
Feb 14, 2011, 04:16 AM
Whats all the confusion about the edge to edge screen? You dont hold the phone with your finger on the back and your thumb on the front now do you????

You would still hold it by its sides so the only thing apple would do is take away the 2-3mm side bits so it goes all over. No harder to use but smaller.

Matt

shazzam
Feb 14, 2011, 04:17 AM
Honestly you guy are mental if you think an edge to edge screen is going to happen.

Imagine this... when you print out a high glossy photo through your printer and it comes out and you pick it up you only hold the back of it.. you dont dare to put your fingers on the front incase you smudge it right?

Youl do the same thing with an edge to edge phone because you will constantly keep hitting stuff on the screen you didnt want to touch...

I think the left and right bezel will stay the same size as it is now. But the top and bottom bezel will be reduced to the same size as that of left and right. It'll look like a tiny iPad basically.

What I find more interesting (if the edge to edge rumor is true) is what are they doing with the speakerphone and front facing camera? Could they put the speakerphone under the glass? What about the camera?

JS77
Feb 14, 2011, 04:28 AM
And that phone found in a bar last year is NOT the new iPhone.No Way.Only an idiot would think so.The design is totally un-Apple.And those black lines on the side,Apple would never,never do that.And they'd never let a prototype off campus anyway,so it's impossible.Obviously some cheap crappy looking Chinese garbage.

Beware of people who think they absolutely know what Apple will do.
They don't.

Well said. Exactly what I was thinking.

vaiol123
Feb 14, 2011, 04:50 AM
I don't really understand the advantages of having a phone that is navigated by your voice, other than when you are driving. As an Androider, that's the only time I ever use it. Other than that, I don't want to look like an idiot whose shouting commands into oblivion :P

Wiesenlooser
Feb 14, 2011, 04:59 AM
Here a really bad photoshop (must be because I don't own photoshop and did it with preview lol :D )

http://s5.directupload.net/images/110214/2lc2wouu.jpg

You could do a 3.5" screen, that would avoid fragmentation. The iPhone 4 chipset would fit in that size-factor with no problem. In fact, the battery takes the majority of space. So you could do that with no problem, just with a worse battery life. However, if Apple could fit in a more energy efficient screen and maybe tweak the chipset a little more you could have roughly the same (or just slightly worse) battery life.

iPhone 4 internals (maybe worse cam) could make this product cheaper than the iPhone 5.

I could imagine the Home button at the top of the device (like the sleep button).

Lesser Evets
Feb 14, 2011, 05:08 AM
Other than that, I don't want to look like an idiot whose shouting commands into oblivion :P

I remember all those people laughing about cell phones saying "I'D NEVER USE ONE OF THOSE! I'll look like some idiot standing around talking to myself." They all look like idiots now, indeed.

The iPhone 4 chipset would fit in that size-factor with no problem. In fact, the battery takes the majority of space. So you could do that with no problem, just with a worse battery life.
Assuming this story is a true possibility and Apple is working on it, and knowing Apple, they won't sell a half-price product with the same function. Most likely they will trim down function.

Web browsing would be a serious pain on the thing. It seems to be too small to me. Most of the comfortable function of the iPhone will become squint-worthy on this phone, or it will have to be cropped if not chopped entirely.

camelsnot
Feb 14, 2011, 05:20 AM
nice to see apple catching up to other phones with other OS' which already do voice nav! :rolleyes:

iJays
Feb 14, 2011, 05:22 AM
maybe this is a follow up to the old rumour that the home button will disappear which means the "mini" iPhone will only have a slightly smaller screen than the standard iPhone. neat stevie.

Wiesenlooser
Feb 14, 2011, 05:34 AM
Assuming this story is a true possibility and Apple is working on it, and knowing Apple, they won't sell a half-price product with the same function. Most likely they will trim down function.

As I said, they could use a cheaper camera. Plus they can use the iPhone 4 internals. The iPhone 4 is still very fast, and you don't absolutely need a dual core CPU as the Iphone 5 is likely to have. And they could use smaller memory (8/16 gb instead of 32/64? ) So yes, there is a lot of pottential for cutting the costs and you could still have basically the same experience.



Web browsing would be a serious pain on the thing. It seems to be too small to me. Most of the comfortable function of the iPhone will become squint-worthy on this phone, or it will have to be cropped if not chopped entirely.

I don't expect the iPhone Mini (or whatever it is going to be called) to have a smaller screen. They want the same apps to be running on this thing because they make alot of profit with the app store. Plus they would need to rethink the whole user interface...

$$$AAPL$$$
Feb 14, 2011, 05:52 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8C148 Safari/6533.18.5)

If they're going to do this, here is my prediction (indulging in some classic rumour combination).

This is all about losing the home button. The iPhone Nano (or whtever it's called) will be the same size as the screen on the current iPhone (so no issue with scaling of the apps). The screen will be edge-to-edge, and the overall size of the device will be smaller than current iterations.

The important part to think about here is differentiation then between the 'Nano' and the iPhone 5. Again, it's all about removal of the home button. The iPhone 5 will basically stay the same overall size also, but will have an edge-to-edge screen, thereby increasing the screen size and providing the differentiation between teh devices (don't ask me how this works with scaling of the apps!)

So, there we have it. A bigger iPhone 5 screen (as many people have been clamouring for), and a smaller device which retains the current level of real estate and means that no apps have to be rescaled.

Amazing what you can almost convince yourself of....

Oh, and one other thing, whatever they produce it has to have access to the App Store. These days, that's the iPhone's biggest selling point if you ask me.

I don't like any of really, but I'm resistant to change in the beginning stages anyway. I'd get one personally as a good cheap throwaway phone if it's cheap enough. I am leaning to believing this is in fact true... Bloomberg, and the WSJ? There's somerhing going on. Anyhow I don't think it would be wise at all to cut out the App store or iTunes... That is what would actuall be ridiculous... So much potential ecosystem revenue left to the wayside would be insanely dumb IMO. The iPhone is still very much evolving... And I am sure the iPhone 8 will be VERY different from iPhone 4... But I will always keep my IP4... just too much exactly everything I like in how it could be actually is:p they'll all be great collectors items someday. Wish Ihad the very first iPhone :) Whatever AAPL does I am sure as a shareholder they will see to make it super profitable, which $wise, is all I care about :) AAPL makes all who own it RICH ¥€$ ;) Going to $450.00+ by December '11...

Lesser Evets
Feb 14, 2011, 05:52 AM
I don't expect the iPhone Mini (or whatever it is going to be called) to have a smaller screen. They want the same apps to be running on this thing because they make alot of profit with the app store. Plus they would need to rethink the whole user interface...

The rumor this expands on says the prototype seen was "about half the size" of an iPhone.

It would make sense if they do get rid of all the edges on the current iPhone and have the edge to edge screen.

hellomoto4
Feb 14, 2011, 05:55 AM
Due to the sheer size and popularity of the App Store, this will never, ever, ever happen unless the screen's resolution is that of the iPhone 2G/3G/3GS (good luck finding an iPhone 4 resolution screen half the current size).

Apple (and any other person with half a brain) knows that it just won't sell if Apps aren't available on the device. The App Store is Apple's biggest selling point, just see their ads...

$$$AAPL$$$
Feb 14, 2011, 05:57 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8C148 Safari/6533.18.5)

I want an iPhone with a BIGGER retina screen!

mirko.meschini
Feb 14, 2011, 06:05 AM
Due to the sheer size and popularity of the App Store, this will never, ever, ever happen unless the screen's resolution is that of the iPhone 2G/3G/3GS (good luck finding an iPhone 4 resolution screen half the current size).

Apple (and any other person with half a brain) knows that it just won't sell if Apps aren't available on the device. The App Store is Apple's biggest selling point, just see their ads...

If the screen size is half actual (with half the resolution of retina), it can't run actual apps because they appear too small. The only way for running actual apps, is retina (960x480) or non-retina (480x320) but with a screen size NEAR 3,5" (3.0 to 4, or better 3.2 to 3.7). This is the max range for future iPhones to run actual apps without scaling.Two resolutions (960x480 and 480x320) and a size range of +/-0,5" from 3,5".

Lesser Evets
Feb 14, 2011, 06:16 AM
So if this "half size" means "iPhone sans black borders", has anyone thought about the implications for the iPad?

7.76" x 5.82"

There's your newer, smaller iPad.

Crigger540
Feb 14, 2011, 06:22 AM
The naysayers are starting to get concerned - they may have to eat crow.:D

M2M
Feb 14, 2011, 06:41 AM
Well a smaller iPhone is technically totally possible.

Cut down the top (where speaker and front facing cam reside in the 4) and the bottom (where the home button is). Remove the Front Faceing Cam. Move the Speaker to the top corner. Move the home button to the lower left or right side. Voila, size already reduced by 30%. Now just make the screen smaller with non-retina resolution and smaller pixels then the 3Gs.

You essentially get a phone thats "all display" on the front.

Big question is how to differentiate a smaller and cheaper 200-300$ iPhone (mini) to the 500-600$ regular one.

remove front facing cam ?
remove bluetooth ?
non-retina ?
smaller flash memory ?
older (3GS) CPU ?
reduce RAM ?
less megapixel cam at the back ?
no flash (for the camera that is) ?
no video or no hd video (for camera) ?
no GPS / Gyro / Compass ?

Well could be enough cut downs to justify the higher price of the regular one. But could still attract "I wont an iPhone - but cheap" people. Technically it looks like a 2G with 3GS CPU, now that i think of it.

DrJohnnyN
Feb 14, 2011, 06:41 AM
iPhone 5 should be more feature-heavy regardless of price.

I'd gladly dish out $1K+ for a top-tier model.

kdarling
Feb 14, 2011, 06:41 AM
Hey, no problem if the screen is smaller... just use the new Apple stylus!

Okay, seriously:

Apple had no qualms asking for developers to make iPad screen apps and retina-screen apps. They'd have no hesitation in asking for mini-screen apps as well.

They all mean more royalties to Apple.

Thunderhawks
Feb 14, 2011, 06:57 AM
Probably everybody is wrong.

It's an iKEA phone model Köllmy Cäll.

You get a kit and put it together. That's how the price goes down.

sk58781111
Feb 14, 2011, 06:58 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-gb) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8C148 Safari/6533.18.5)



No, he's right. Try holding the phone by the touch screen. It thinks you're tapping it.

no, you cradle it in your palm. i've never seen anyone hold their iphone with their index finger and thumb on the bezel and back of phone - totally unnatural.

borgonuovo
Feb 14, 2011, 07:00 AM
Hi Everybody,

When are the iphone updates coming out? What's your guess?
:confused:

NightFox
Feb 14, 2011, 07:04 AM
no, you cradle it in your palm. i've never seen anyone hold their iphone with their index finger and thumb on the bezel and back of phone - totally unnatural.

You've not seen me then. Believe me, there's no way I'm going to 'gently cradle' £600 worth of phone in my palm - this thing gets well and truly gripped!

tbealmear
Feb 14, 2011, 07:18 AM
I don't see how this will work. 1) Can't have a smaller screen phone without messing with it's ability to access the app store (as mentioned in many earlier posts) and 2) if they truly mean an "edge-to-edge" screen, where will the speaker area for the ear go? It all depends one what Apple defines as "edge-to-edge" I guess.

Batteman87
Feb 14, 2011, 07:23 AM
iPhone 4.5 ha ha... Maybe iPhone 5 next year with LTE? :apple:

emulator
Feb 14, 2011, 07:23 AM
Voice based navigation?
How is that going to work with a lot of background noise outside?
Hopefully better than in the Navigon I tried out before.

ChrisTX
Feb 14, 2011, 07:37 AM
I am sure people at Apple are not too pleased about this.

I wouldn't be so sure about that. A leak like this get's EVERYONE talking about about Apple at MWC without them even being there, and without leaking physical evidence. Apple is eating this up right now.

Carniphage
Feb 14, 2011, 07:45 AM
The important part of the iPhone is the screen.
IThe screen is almost exactly the size of a standard business card.

So the iPhone as a device could (in theory) shrink quite a bit, without losing screen size or pixels.

C.

Mr Bigs
Feb 14, 2011, 07:50 AM
The iPhone's Voice Control implementation is absolutely horrid. Even Microsoft could have done a better job.Could have ?? You mean already did many years ago.;)

asdf542
Feb 14, 2011, 07:53 AM
I'll have no qualms with this as long as the screen stays the same size. The on screen keyboard would be a nightmare if they make the screen smaller.

gorgeousninja
Feb 14, 2011, 07:54 AM
love my iphone4, but smaller, lighter, more pocketable.. = I'm in! :D

NightFox
Feb 14, 2011, 08:01 AM
The iPhone's Voice Control implementation is absolutely horrid. Even Microsoft could have done a better job.

They did do. Microsoft's Voice Command that ran on the Windows Mobile platform more than 7 years ago (don't know if it's still around) knocked socks off Apple's current voice control implementation.

bishop1981
Feb 14, 2011, 08:01 AM
I think an "edge to edge" iphone might look like this ...

Pro31
Feb 14, 2011, 08:22 AM
I would much rather have a 4" iPhone as well. Many people are saying its a phone, and yes it is, but I use it for far more than that. As a matter of fact, I use the data on it WAAAY more than I even talk on it. My big fat thumbs take up half the screen when trying to do stuff on it. I have held 4" phones before and they feel great. If you look at the Fascinate by Samsung, the phone itself really isn't that much bigger. It is just using more of the phone for the screen. It is dang near as thin too. So, these things are possible, but we all know Apple would rather have something paper thin and as small as a fingernail.

The Wedge
Feb 14, 2011, 08:22 AM
playing games horizontally on a phone this small would be a pain

DotComName
Feb 14, 2011, 08:32 AM
Why does this rumor come up every single year? Apple has already said there's no reason to have varying sizes if you have the perfect size already. What we should be hoping for is cheaper rate plans.. That's where we're really getting ripped off!! You can pick up a 3GS w/ a 2 year contract for only $49 bucks! Apple may reduce the price of buying the phone outright on their current-sized models, but rumors of an iPhone nano have always been and will always be absurd.

phpmaven
Feb 14, 2011, 08:39 AM
Hopefully better than in the Navigon I tried out before.

I'm not sure what you mean by that, but Navigon is great. I use it all the time. The voice directions are excellent.

h1r0ll3r
Feb 14, 2011, 08:54 AM
playing games horizontally on a phone this small would be a pain

I think do ANYTHING on this phone would be a pain. I guess those with pudgy fingers need not concern themselves with this phone.

stupidm4n
Feb 14, 2011, 08:55 AM
I'm not sure what you mean by that, but Navigon is great. I use it all the time. The voice directions are excellent.

Is it voice navigation to control phone or is it voice navigation added to maps ?
Not really seen anywhere where it tells us which, are people just assuming its to control phone
Apple purchased Placebase, an online-mapping company 2009 maybe its to do with that

TheSlush
Feb 14, 2011, 09:15 AM
LOL at all these mockups showing the current iPhone 4 with the top and bottom chopped off. <<shakes head>>

linux2mac
Feb 14, 2011, 09:36 AM
love my iphone4, but smaller, lighter, more pocketable.. = I'm in! :D

I agree 100%

HuggyLowDown
Feb 14, 2011, 09:42 AM
I think I'll just wait for the iPhone Shuffle, that calls random people:p

jouster
Feb 14, 2011, 09:51 AM
I think I'll just wait for the iPhone Shuffle, that calls random people:p

Not sure which is older: this rumor or that "joke".

Batteman87
Feb 14, 2011, 10:03 AM
I think I'll just wait for the iPhone Shuffle, that calls random people:p

Ha ha! Nice! :apple:

Powerbooky
Feb 14, 2011, 10:26 AM
Hmm... edge to edge screen, would like that on a new Macbook Pro.
:cool:

scoobydoo99
Feb 14, 2011, 11:14 AM
The newspaper also adds that the iPhone 4 is also expected to be updated.


Really?? Apple is going to update the iPhone? Now THAT'S unexpected news :rolleyes: It's going to be called iPhone 5 and you can expect it in June.

Where do they get these rumors?!

Hellhammer
Feb 14, 2011, 11:20 AM
A quick mockup of the iPhone 4 with (nearly) edge to edge screen:

https://dl-web.dropbox.com/get/iPhone%20Nano.jpg?w=767cfa62

CubusX
Feb 14, 2011, 11:28 AM
http://www.macrumors.com/images/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/02/13/small-iphone-to-have-edge-to-edge-screen-voice-navigation/)

The newspaper also adds that the iPhone 4 is also expected to be updated.

[/url]

Considering it is upgraded every year, all I can say is... DUH!!!!

btcutter
Feb 14, 2011, 11:35 AM
Hopefully better than in the Navigon I tried out before.

Have you try one of the Android phones? Voice commands are far superior to iOS. 90% accuracy for navigation and calling. I just don't understand why Apple can't do it.