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jnozsc
Feb 27, 2011, 07:07 AM
:( I have to say those amazing new features really devour my Disk space.
It has been taken about 30G space from my Disk.

How to delete them or set them disable or just limit the size?

Best Regard

-------update----------

I find how to disable the local snapshot:

1.click the time machine menubar icon
2.open TM preference...
3.Option...
4.uncheck the ’create local snapshot‘


well, how to delete exist local snapshot?



jnozsc
Feb 27, 2011, 09:36 AM
update

I find a way to disable the local snapshots.

but I don't know how to delete the exist local snapshots.

They are placed at /MobileBackups

still need help

MikhailT
Feb 27, 2011, 09:56 AM
I think this is your TimeMachine Backup folder. It may be a bug in Lion but it's not mainly for your snapshots, it includes everything you need to backup and that's why it is big.

Snapshots doesn't take up that much room, it only stores the diff information. Which means that if you only changed 1KB in 100GB file, it'll only saved 1KB in a version ("diff").

jnozsc
Feb 27, 2011, 10:24 AM
I think this is your TimeMachine Backup folder. It may be a bug in Lion but it's not mainly for your snapshots, it includes everything you need to backup and that's why it is big.

Snapshots doesn't take up that much room, it only stores the diff information. Which means that if you only changed 1KB in 100GB file, it'll only saved 1KB in a version ("diff").


thanks for you reply, in face I don't have an TimeMachine Backup before.
And after I uncheck the ‘create local snapshot’ and login again. My 30G disk space comes back.

I cannot figure out whether it is the problem with local snapshots or some bugs.

neko girl
Feb 27, 2011, 10:25 AM
Out of curiosity how much space is Local Snapshots eating up? Is it significant that you'd stop using it, even when Lion goes gold?

MikhailT
Feb 27, 2011, 10:28 AM
thanks for you reply, in face I don't have an TimeMachine Backup before.
And after I uncheck the ‘create local snapshot’ and login again. My 30G disk space comes back.

I cannot figure out whether it is the problem with local snapshots or some bugs.

How do you know it is taking up 30GB? Do you actually see your main drive reduced by 30GB in Finder when you turn it back on?

I tried to do this but it only changed around 100MB when i turn it off and on for the main drive in Finder. The MobileBackups folder is 40GB here as well but it doesn't disappear like that.

Remember that it's 40GB that links to your current existing files in addition to diffs, not 40GB of extra files.

basher
Jul 20, 2011, 05:18 PM
:( I have to say those amazing new features really devour my Disk space.
It has been taken about 30G space from my Disk.

How to delete them or set them disable or just limit the size?

Best Regard

-------update----------

I find how to disable the local snapshot:

1.click the time machine menubar icon
2.open TM preference...
3.Option...
4.uncheck the ’create local snapshot‘


well, how to delete exist local snapshot?

The above directions don't seem to work in the released version of Lion. I don't see the item you describe in step number 4.

mrapplegate
Jul 20, 2011, 05:20 PM
The above directions don't seem to work in the released version of Lion. I don't see the item you describe in step number 4.

The GUI ability to shut it off was taken out in DP4.
They really did fix the bug that caused excessive local snapshots, but if you want to turn off local snapshots open terminal and type sudo tmutil disablelocal

basher
Jul 20, 2011, 05:28 PM
Thanks. I guess since the space issue has been addressed, I'll just leave it as is.

mrapplegate
Jul 20, 2011, 05:30 PM
Thanks. I guess since the space issue has been addressed, I'll just leave it as is.

Yes, it has been fixed.

Tom8
Jul 20, 2011, 05:33 PM
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Can someone explain to me what exactly local time machine is? Does it just apply to Versions? Or is it a system wide thing that could be used to restore a deleted file etc?

mrapplegate
Jul 20, 2011, 05:35 PM
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Can someone explain to me what exactly local time machine is? Does it just apply to Versions? Or is it a system wide thing that could be used to restore a deleted file etc?

Here is info from the TM help section. Local snapshots are mainly used on laptops. They do not have anything to do with versions.

Time Machine overview
When you connect your computer to a new disk, a message appears asking if you’d like to use the disk to back up your files. Use this information to respond to the message.

Use as Backup Disk: Time Machine will use this disk for backups. Initially, Time Machine makes a complete backup, including system files, applications, accounts, preferences, music, photos, documents—everything you keep on your computer, except for a few temporary files (such as web browser caches).
Depending on how many items you’re backing up, your initial backup could take a while. Subsequent backups take less time because only items that have changed are backed up. You can use your computer during backups.

Time Machine works best if you use your backup disk only for backups. If you keep files on your backup disk, Time Machine won’t back up those files, and the space available for Time Machine backups is reduced.

Encrypt backup disk: For security, select this checkbox. If you back up to an external disk and do not encrypt the backup disk, any person who gains possession of the disk can read the information on it.
Decide Later: Time Machine will display the message again each time you connect to the disk.
Don’t Use: Time Machine will not ask again if you want to use this disk for backups.
If your computer is in sleep or your backup disk isn’t available when it’s time for a scheduled backup, the backup is not performed. Backups resume after the computer and backup disk are available again.

If you have a portable computer, in addition to saving backups on your backup disk, Time Machine saves hourly snapshots of files and stores the snapshots on your computer’s internal drive. If your backup disk isn’t connected, Time Machine continues saving snapshots on your internal drive, and then resumes backing up to your backup disk when you reconnect it.

Tom8
Jul 20, 2011, 05:39 PM
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Thanks for that. So the local snapshots basically just builds up a memory bank that is transferred to my external drive when I plug it in?

mrapplegate
Jul 20, 2011, 05:40 PM
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Thanks for that. So the local snapshots basically just builds up a memory bank that is transferred to my external drive when I plug it in?

Yes, if your laptop is not connected to your external drive it stores changes locally. Once connected again it backs up any changes it missed while not connected to the drive.

Tom8
Jul 20, 2011, 05:43 PM
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Thanks a lot

mrapplegate
Jul 20, 2011, 05:44 PM
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Thanks a lot

No problem.

maverick808
Jul 20, 2011, 05:46 PM
Best option is to open Terminal and type in...

sudo tmutil disablelocal

This will keep normal (remote) Time Machine back ups on, but disable local ones. It will also delete the current local cache automatically.

mrapplegate
Jul 20, 2011, 05:48 PM
Best option is to open Terminal and type in...

sudo tmutil disablelocal

This will keep normal (remote) Time Machine back ups on, but disable local ones. It will also delete the current local cache automatically.

Yes, I said that a few min ago, but this org post was back in Feb. That nasty bug was fixed a long time ago. No need to disable it if you don't have the problem.

Crosbie
Jul 21, 2011, 10:01 AM
Retail Lion would appear to have local snapshots disabled by default.

Anyone know why?

mrapplegate
Jul 21, 2011, 10:05 AM
Retail Lion would appear to have local snapshots disabled by default.

Anyone know why?

Local snapshots are disabled if any of the following are true:
- you have a desktop system
- you do not have a traditional time machine destination selected
- you have automatic backups disabled (the big switch in the Time Machine preference pane is off)

Crosbie
Jul 21, 2011, 10:18 AM
I'm on a MacBook;

I had a problem with my NAS not supporting Lion for TM backups, so switched to a USB portable HD, figuring I'd be able to keep regular local snapshots and then connect and backup fully about as frequently as I do with my iOS devices;

Switch is most definitely on - just finished by first backup to the new USB HD - but local backups weren't enabled. I nosed into the Terminal and tested as much.

I've enabled them now, but wondered whether this was a feature Apple didn't consider ready for Prime Time?

mrapplegate
Jul 21, 2011, 10:25 AM
I'm on a MacBook;

I had a problem with my NAS not supporting Lion for TM backups, so switched to a USB portable HD, figuring I'd be able to keep regular local snapshots and then connect and backup fully about as frequently as I do with my iOS devices;

Switch is most definitely on - just finished by first backup to the new USB HD - but local backups weren't enabled. I nosed into the Terminal and tested as much.

I've enabled them now, but wondered whether this was a feature Apple didn't consider ready for Prime Time?
I'm not sure, perhaps just a bug. Is this a clean install or upgrade? I can't really be sure why it did not work. If it is working now that is good.

Crosbie
Jul 21, 2011, 04:22 PM
I'm not sure, perhaps just a bug. Is this a clean install or upgrade? I can't really be sure why it did not work. If it is working now that is good.

It was an upgrade as-per-expectations from the App Store download. It works now because I did some Googling and figured out the terminal commands to get it going... I'm guessing that everyone's standard installations have it disabled by default.

To test, try:

tmutil snapshot

In the terminal. If this gives an error, snapshots aren't enabled. For a more GUI-oriented test, try going into TM when the TM disk is disconnected; if you've got snapshots enabled, this works; otherwise it'll prompt for a TM disk.

mrapplegate
Jul 21, 2011, 04:27 PM
It was an upgrade as-per-expectations from the App Store download. It works now because I did some Googling and figured out the terminal commands to get it going... I'm guessing that everyone's standard installations have it disabled by default.

To test, try:

tmutil snapshot

In the terminal. If this gives an error, snapshots aren't enabled. For a more GUI-oriented test, try going into TM when the TM disk is disconnected; if you've got snapshots enabled, this works; otherwise it'll prompt for a TM disk.

According to the man page your command will just Create new local Time Machine snapshot. The man page describes in detail the commands.

Crosbie
Jul 21, 2011, 04:33 PM
According to the man page your command will just Create new local Time Machine snapshot. The man page describes in detail the commands.

Yep. So if they aren't enabled, this command gives an error. (Error 255.)

Anyone else looking in here care to report whether they have snapshots? Is it just me for some reason? Perhaps because of problems connecting to the NAS with my usual TM backups on?

zepman
Jul 25, 2011, 04:48 AM
I have local snapshots enabled and the Mobilebackups-disk shows up in Volumes. I also can access the "Star wars"-Time Machine-thing when no external backup-disk is connected. When I run the "tmutil snapshot"-command in the terminal I don't get an error code.
So far so good.


The problem is that when I try to force a local snapshot nothing happens. The MobileBackups remains empty and I don't get a white line in Time Machine.

Don't know if this is normal but the MoblieBackups-disk shows 0 MB free and 499.2 GB used. (499.2GB is the whole capacity of my startup disk)

When the external backup disk is not connected and I run "tmutil latestbackup" I get "Unable to locate machine directory for host." and "tmutil machinedirectory" gives me "No machine directory found for host."
I assuming that if I had a successfull local snapshot those commands would had pointed to that…

I've tried to disable and enable local snapshots but that haven't helped.

Here's the Console-messages when enabling local snapshots and trying to force a snapshot.

25/7/2011 11:07:41.760 AM sudo: Fredrik : TTY=ttys000 ; PWD=/Users/Fredrik ; USER=root ; COMMAND=/usr/bin/tmutil enablelocal
25/7/2011 11:07:42.174 AM Firewall: mtmfs is listening from 127.0.0.1:49307 proto=6
25/7/2011 11:07:42.228 AM Firewall: mtmfs is listening from 127.0.0.1:49308 proto=6
25/7/2011 11:07:42.000 AM kernel: nspace-handler-set-snapshot-time: 1311584864
25/7/2011 11:07:47.190 AM com.apple.mtmfs: /var/folders/zz/zyxvpxvq6csfxvn_n0000000000000/T//mtmfsMap498
25/7/2011 11:07:47.197 AM com.apple.launchd: (com.apple.SystemStarter) Failed to count the number of files in "/System/Library/StartupItems": No such file or directory
25/7/2011 11:07:47.197 AM com.apple.launchd: (com.apple.SystemStarter) Failed to count the number of files in "/System/Library/StartupItems": No such file or directory
25/7/2011 11:07:47.197 AM com.apple.launchd: (com.apple.SystemStarter) Failed to count the number of files in "/System/Library/StartupItems": No such file or directory
25/7/2011 11:07:47.197 AM com.apple.launchd: (com.apple.SystemStarter) Failed to count the number of files in "/System/Library/StartupItems": No such file or directory
25/7/2011 11:07:47.000 AM kernel: nstat_lookup_entry failed: 2
25/7/2011 11:09:00.000 AM kernel: nspace-handler-set-snapshot-time: 1311584942

By the way, thats the deal with the StartupItems-folder not existing?

paulsalter
Jul 25, 2011, 05:35 AM
I am on a MacBook and usually only backup once a week (more if i have done a lot of changes)

not sure if this does the same thing as the terminal command earlier, but when I have my usb backup drive disconnected (dont want backups done), I have turned off time machine in preferences

this has recovered about 8 gig of drive space for me

mobilehavoc
Jul 26, 2011, 07:42 AM
What is the point of storing local TM snapshots? Only thing I can think of is if you accidentally delete a file or need to revert back but it doesn't do any good if your HDD fails or OSX crashes, etc.

Without them, worst case you still restore back to the last time TM ran. Think it's kind of frivolous if you ask me but I'll leave it on for now.

mrapplegate
Jul 26, 2011, 07:49 AM
What is the point of storing local TM snapshots? Only thing I can think of is if you accidentally delete a file or need to revert back but it doesn't do any good if your HDD fails or OSX crashes, etc.

Without them, worst case you still restore back to the last time TM ran. Think it's kind of frivolous if you ask me but I'll leave it on for now.

The point is to keep making backups when not connected to your TM drive. If your laptop is connected to your TM source most of the time, turn it off to save disk space.

mobilehavoc
Jul 26, 2011, 09:07 AM
The point is to keep making backups when not connected to your TM drive. If your laptop is connected to your TM source most of the time, turn it off to save disk space.

But what is the point of making a backup of something and storing the backup on the same thing? I don't see the major advantage over just waiting for the next time TM runs and calculating changes then. That's what SL did and it worked fine IMHO. I understand why Apple might do this but there's no setting for it and the average user will not get why their hard drive space shrinks on a daily basis without adding anything to it!!!

mrapplegate
Jul 26, 2011, 09:13 AM
But what is the point of making a backup of something and storing the backup on the same thing? I don't see the major advantage over just waiting for the next time TM runs and calculating changes then. That's what SL did and it worked fine IMHO. I understand why Apple might do this but there's no setting for it and the average user will not get why their hard drive space shrinks on a daily basis without adding anything to it!!!

A quote from the TM help file:

"If you have a portable computer, in addition to saving backups on your backup disk, Time Machine saves hourly snapshots of files and stores the snapshots on your computer’s internal drive. If your backup disk isn’t connected, Time Machine continues saving snapshots on your internal drive, and then resumes backing up to your backup disk when you reconnect it."

Apple sometimes shields things from the user. It assumes they don't know best. At least there is a terminal command that can disable local snapshots.
I disabled mine. I connect my external drive at least every other day. Any data loss between those days is acceptable to me.

mobilehavoc
Jul 26, 2011, 09:29 AM
A quote from the TM help file:

"If you have a portable computer, in addition to saving backups on your backup disk, Time Machine saves hourly snapshots of files and stores the snapshots on your computer’s internal drive. If your backup disk isn’t connected, Time Machine continues saving snapshots on your internal drive, and then resumes backing up to your backup disk when you reconnect it."

Apple sometimes shields things from the user. It assumes they don't know best. At least there is a terminal command that can disable local snapshots.
I disabled mine. I connect my external drive at least every other day. Any data loss between those days is acceptable to me.

I highly doubt the average Mac user will be comfortable using a command line. I'm just waiting for people to start bitching about their hard drive being used up by this and not knowing any way to turn it off. Apple is going to be getting a lot of calls.

mrapplegate
Jul 26, 2011, 09:32 AM
I highly doubt the average Mac user will be comfortable using a command line. I'm just waiting for people to start bitching about their hard drive being used up by this and not knowing any way to turn it off. Apple is going to be getting a lot of calls.

They already are complaining, search the forums for Backup and/or local snapshots . You will see them complaining about GB of snapshots taking their space. Until something changes there is no GUI to disable it, and Apple did this on purpose, remember APPLE KNOWS BEST :rolleyes: