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View Full Version : Taking the "iOS thing" too far... [Pics]




mrblack927
Feb 27, 2011, 10:08 AM
I'm all for giving Apple the creative freedom to do their own thing, and I'm not even really opposed to taking the best things from iOS and bringing them to the desktop, but honestly... wtf is this?

Pics are of the new Mail in "full screen" mode. Composing a new email and a new note, respectively. Really Apple? This was your idea of merging them? Exactly like it is on the iPad? It gives you a "modal popup" with no way to move or resize and no obvious way to close...

I think this is the line. This is where the iOS style goes to far.



miles01110
Feb 27, 2011, 10:11 AM
Seems like a relatively minor complaint to me, but to each their own.

Hellhammer
Feb 27, 2011, 10:12 AM
This is the first public build. Lots of things can still change.

neko girl
Feb 27, 2011, 10:13 AM
Just use it, and don't fidget so much with the arrangement. It's full screen, meaning distraction free. I think that's the point.

What do you get out of resizing it?

funrush
Feb 27, 2011, 10:14 AM
I'm all for giving Apple the creative freedom to do their own thing, and I'm not even really opposed to taking the best things from iOS and bringing them to the desktop, but honestly... wtf is this?

Pics are of the new Mail in "full screen" mode. Composing a new email and a new note, respectively. Really Apple? This was your idea of merging them? Exactly like it is on the iPad? It gives you a "modal popup" with no way to move or resize and no obvious way to close...

I think this is the line. This is where the iOS style goes to far.

Do you resize all your 'compose mail' windows?
'No obvious way to close'? There is a HUGE 'cancel' button on the top. Or press cmd + W like all with all windows.

mrblack927
Feb 27, 2011, 10:15 AM
Seems like a relatively minor complaint to me, but to each their own.

It's just unnecessary. Why remove the ability to move or resize a window? What if I need more space? What if I want to look at the email that's open behind the compose window to reference something? There's no logical reason to remove these abilities. Well, there's one reason. To make it behave exactly as it does on the iPad. That's my point. They're starting to remove random functionality for no other reason than to make my macbook pro look and feel like an iPad.

zorinlynx
Feb 27, 2011, 10:15 AM
So don't use full screen mode. (did I miss somethnig here? How is this a problem?)

Awjvail
Feb 27, 2011, 10:15 AM
I agree - if I wanted to send an email in iPad mail.app then I would.

rorschach
Feb 27, 2011, 10:17 AM
It'd be one thing if this was in normal, windowed mode. But I think the whole purpose of full-screen is that you aren't messing around with windows.

It would be nice if they let you resize it though...

mrblack927
Feb 27, 2011, 10:19 AM
'No obvious way to close'? There is a HUGE 'cancel' button on the top. Or press cmd + W like all with all windows.

Good call! I guess I thought cancel did something else. I'm used to using the red "x" bubble. Still no way to close the notes window though. I didn't know about the cmd+w hotkey. I don't think that's a great solution considering it's not labeled and how many people wouldn't just know that off hand. I guess I just don't see the advantage to removing these things from the window....:o

MikhailT
Feb 27, 2011, 10:20 AM
It's just unnecessary. Why remove the ability to move or resize a window? What if I need more space? What if I want to look at the email that's open behind the compose window to reference something? There's no logical reason to remove these abilities. Well, there's one reason. To make it behave exactly as it does on the iPad. That's my point. They're starting to remove random functionality for no other reason than to make my macbook pro look and feel like an iPad.

They didn't remove anything. This only happens in the full screen mode. If you need to reference something behind, you shouldn't be in the full screen mode. Just exit the mode, resize it to full and then do what you want to do.

The Full Screen mode is a single window mode environment, that's why you don't get any external windows, only in tabs like in Safari or popup windows like in Mail.

It has nothing to do with iOS but more of how much you can do when an application takes up the whole screen.

mrblack927
Feb 27, 2011, 10:27 AM
The Full Screen mode is a single window mode environment, that's why you don't get any external windows, only in tabs like in Safari or popup windows like in Mail.

Not true. Mail's "preferences" window pops up in a new window. There's nothing about full screen mode that doesn't support multiple windows or even make it more complicated to use them. It's no different than having a window maximized in windows. Apple went out of their way to remove some window controls in this mode though (like compose and notes). And it just happens to look identical to iOS? How does this have nothing to do with iOS?

MikhailT
Feb 27, 2011, 10:47 AM
Not true. Mail's "preferences" window pops up in a new window. There's nothing about full screen mode that doesn't support multiple windows or even make it more complicated to use them. It's no different than having a window maximized in windows. Apple went out of their way to remove some window controls in this mode though (like compose and notes). And it just happens to look identical to iOS? How does this have nothing to do with iOS?

Remember, this is still a first preview build. Apple hasn't done anything with the Preferences yet, there are all sorts of bugs and we still haven't seen what Apple plans to do with the final interface.

If you click on the main Mail application while this preferences window is open, you'll see that you have no way of getting back to this Preferences window without existing the full screen mode or going to the Windows Menu > select the window. This is what I mean about "single mode" environment, which is what the iOS is in all the time.

Mail 5 looks nothing like the Mobile Mail on the iOS devices. Apple is just taking advantage of the interface theme that iOS have to improve Mail on the Mac.

Blakeasd
Feb 27, 2011, 10:54 AM
If you do not like this Mail feature do the following, open Mail preferences and navigate to viewing. Here you can check the classic view. Very Simple.

mrblack927
Feb 27, 2011, 11:44 AM
Remember, this is still a first preview build. Apple hasn't done anything with the Preferences yet, there are all sorts of bugs and we still haven't seen what Apple plans to do with the final interface.

If you click on the main Mail application while this preferences window is open, you'll see that you have no way of getting back to this Preferences window without existing the full screen mode or going to the Windows Menu > select the window. This is what I mean about "single mode" environment, which is what the iOS is in all the time.

Mail 5 looks nothing like the Mobile Mail on the iOS devices. Apple is just taking advantage of the interface theme that iOS have to improve Mail on the Mac.

Good point. I should reserve judgement until the final version comes about. I just get worried when Apple starts taking away functionality for no reason other than aesthetics. :p

jbg232
Feb 27, 2011, 12:02 PM
Good point. I should reserve judgement until the final version comes about. I just get worried when Apple starts taking away functionality for no reason other than aesthetics. :p

This is one of Apple's favorite moves... but in then end, the final product is almost always better for it. That's why Apple design is so soothing and why I don't use windows except for word, excel and powerpoint.

Truth be told, both operating systems do the same stuff in the end if you know what you're doing, but Apple's is so much nicer to use because of its design.

AceFernalld
Feb 27, 2011, 12:12 PM
I like it. Looks awesome.

Tanegashima
Feb 27, 2011, 12:25 PM
Don't use it.

retroneo
Feb 27, 2011, 11:27 PM
So your complaint is that "full screen mode" makes everything take up the whole screen....

Hilarious

theBigD23
Feb 27, 2011, 11:31 PM
People keep posting that this is the first seed and that things can change. I doubt this particular change will. It's full screen mode and everything is in full screen. The whole is to not use other windows. Nothing to really change.

mrblack927
Feb 28, 2011, 07:28 AM
So your complaint is that "full screen mode" makes everything take up the whole screen....

Hilarious

No... My complaint is just the opposite... Do you see the screenshots? The "new email" and "notes" windows come up as one fixed size. You can't make them bigger, move them, or do any window controls really, just like the iPad. They decided to stick them right there and if you don't like it, too bad. ;)

rekhyt
Feb 28, 2011, 07:59 AM
I agree - if I wanted to send an email in iPad mail.app then I would.

Agreed. This is taking the whole 'iOS interface' thing way overboard. Snow Leopard may be the last Mac OS I may use... Although I do kinda like Mission Control and full-screen apps (Preview only.)

Good call! I guess I thought cancel did something else. I'm used to using the red "x" bubble. Still no way to close the notes window though. I didn't know about the cmd+w hotkey. I don't think that's a great solution considering it's not labeled and how many people wouldn't just know that off hand. I guess I just don't see the advantage to removing these things from the window....:o

Cancel usually suggests deleting the mail instead of exiting out of the full screen mode.

Mackilroy
Feb 28, 2011, 10:32 AM
The whole 'OS X is turning into iOS' is overblown IMO. Having used Lion, it feels more or less exactly like Snow Leopard but with some new features and a slightly different appearance. That goes for Mail too.

vultureboy
Feb 28, 2011, 10:48 AM
Well i've been using Lion all day at work today and I have to say I think i've had the most productive day for a long time. The use of full screen in Safari and Mail has made everything more streamlined.

A simple swipe between full screen windows got me between Textmate, Safari and Mail and did so without me getting distracted by anything else. I'm hoping that textmate has a nice way to implement fullscreen and i'll be even more at home.

Although I didn't like the idea of full screen when I first heard about it (and even when I first started in Lion) after a day of working with it I don't know where it has been for the rest of my life.

So in short, I fully welcome the changes and i've replied to many e-mails today and I have to say that the size of the e-mail window has presented no issues at all for me. In the rare occasion it does cause me some kind of issue i'll just knock it out of full screen for 5 minutes!

Compile 'em all
Feb 28, 2011, 10:52 AM
It's just unnecessary. Why remove the ability to move or resize a window? What if I need more space? What if I want to look at the email that's open behind the compose window to reference something?

Because Apple isn't designing an OS for YOU.

ErikGrim
Feb 28, 2011, 07:21 PM
Regardless of whether or not it's technically possible to open resizable windows in full screen mode (and it is), the whole philosophy behind full-screen is to use a single window interface to remove and reduce any possible distractions. Like it or not, we are moving towards a single focused task as opposed to multi tasking. This gels better with how our brains are wired and actually makes us more productive than having to juggle many tasks at once.

If you need to refer to underlying emails, the option is of course there to NOT use full screen mode should you wish to do so. It's not *that* much different if you have mail expanded to fit the full screen in the first place.

Steve Ballmer
Feb 28, 2011, 07:27 PM
Like it or not, we are moving towards a single focused task as opposed to multi tasking. This gels better with how our brains are wired and actually makes us more productive than having to juggle many tasks at once.

If this was really true, then why did the original System software ever introduce things such as MultiFinder to bring a (limited) form of multi-tasking? Why was one of the major goals of Mac OS X to bring real multi-tasking to the Macintosh, then?

We're more productive with smarter, better designed software, not because it takes up the entire screen real estate.

baddj
Feb 28, 2011, 07:32 PM
When them screenies looking at the 10.7 one there is no TO, Subject etc how does it know who to send it to?

Steve Ballmer
Feb 28, 2011, 07:36 PM
When them screenies looking at the 10.7 one there is no TO, Subject etc how does it know who to send it to?
It's hidden by default.

ErikGrim
Feb 28, 2011, 07:41 PM
If this was really true, then why did the original System software ever introduce things such as MultiFinder to bring a (limited) form of multi-tasking? Why was one of the major goals of Mac OS X to bring real multi-tasking to the Macintosh, then?

We're more productive with smarter, better designed software, not because it takes up the entire screen real estate.Because it was a limitation of software that we could overcome. Only now are we starting to learn the implications of information overload and how we are dealing with it. It is one thing to overcome a technical difficulty, it's another to optimise a user experience and interface so we can work better.

In other words: It is good that we have the ability to do multi tasking, but that we are now also optimising our workflows for more focused tasks.