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View Full Version : Samsung's Core i5 Laptop Is Lighter, Thinner Than Air




ghileman
Mar 17, 2011, 07:46 AM
And is now on sale.

Areas besides chip, weight and thinness where the Series 9 has the Air beat:

-HD LED-backlit SuperBright Plus display (400 nit)
-1.5 watt sub-woofer
-WiMax
-It's made of Duralumin which is supposedly ”twice the strength of aluminum”

And this last point is personal preference, but I actually think it looks better than Air.

Having said all this, it obviously runs Windows. Hopefully if nothing else it will help motivate Apple to iterate the next Air update sooner.

More info here:

http://mashable.com/2011/03/16/samsung-laptop/

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/computers/samsungs-sleek-series-9-is-now-available/5281



Charlie Sheen
Mar 17, 2011, 07:47 AM
It's just a ripp-off. And it has wondoz on it. Yuck

stockscalper
Mar 17, 2011, 07:50 AM
The question is it thinner across the board? PC's have a tendency to be thin on the front, but thicker on the backside. They seem to forget the back end specs when quoting their thinness. But regardless, it still costs more than an Air, the specs aren't as good, it runs Windows and it is a Samsung, which means in 12 to 18 months the keys will be falling off it and the drive and graphics card failing and it will be generally falling apart. Thanks, but no thanks. Go troll someplace else.

Hotherps
Mar 17, 2011, 07:51 AM
And is now on sale.

Areas besides chip, weight and thinness where the Series 9 has the Air beat:

-HD LED-backlit SuperBright Plus display (400 nit)
-1.5 watt sub-woofer
-WiMax
-It's made of Duralumin which is supposedly ”twice the strength of aluminum”

And this last point is personal preference, but I actually think it looks better than Air

More info here:

http://mashable.com/2011/03/16/samsung-laptop/

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/computers/samsungs-sleek-series-9-is-now-available/5281

Who cares about a poxy windows machine, I certainly don't :D

stockscalper
Mar 17, 2011, 08:02 AM
I went read further about it and it doesn't have anywhere near the specs of the Air and it costs more. It's also not thinner. Just as I expected they tapered it severely in the front so as to claim it was thinner than the Air, but it's overall thickness is greater than the Air.

dgree03
Mar 17, 2011, 08:20 AM
I went read further about it and it doesn't have anywhere near the specs of the Air and it costs more. It's also not thinner. Just as I expected they tapered it severely in the front so as to claim it was thinner than the Air, but it's overall thickness is greater than the Air.

Are you reading the same specs I am?:confused:

ZipZap
Mar 17, 2011, 08:33 AM
The question is it thinner across the board? PC's have a tendency to be thin on the front, but thicker on the backside. They seem to forget the back end specs when quoting their thinness. But regardless, it still costs more than an Air, the specs aren't as good, it runs Windows and it is a Samsung, which means in 12 to 18 months the keys will be falling off it and the drive and graphics card failing and it will be generally falling apart. Thanks, but no thanks. Go troll someplace else.

Its not like Macs dont have their share of problems.

iNotion
Mar 17, 2011, 08:37 AM
http://i.i.com.com/cnwk.1d/i/tim/2011/01/04/9_series_open_3_610x439.JPG

WOW! I must admit it is beautiful. (killer for black)
Too bad, it runs on Windows...:D:apple:

Psilocybin
Mar 17, 2011, 08:38 AM
Pos. All that needs to be said

adztaylor
Mar 17, 2011, 08:39 AM
http://i.i.com.com/cnwk.1d/i/tim/2011/01/04/9_series_open_3_610x439.JPG

WOW! I must admit it is beautiful. (killer for black)
Too bad, it runs on Windows...:D:apple:

+1. Gotta admit. Looks great!

Scottsdale
Mar 17, 2011, 09:02 AM
Are you reading the same specs I am?:confused:

It has the same resolution as an 11" MBA in its 13" form. In addition, it will not run OS X.

The positive is duralumin (sp) . I had hoped Apple would use this in the next round of Mac notebooks. It is twice as durable as aluminum and lighter weight too. I think it's a more realistic solution than Liquid Metal. Now it might be difficult for Apple to go that path as it will not want to look copycat.

It is a good thing Samsung is competing with the MBA, as it will lead to better Macs too. The thing that confuses me is how Dell, Sony, and now Samsung try to compete with the MBA but have higher costs and less overall design competitiveness.

What does everyone think Apple will use beyond aluminium for external materials Mac notebooks? I do feel like 2012 might be the year Apple changes it up and I still think the Intel advertisement is onto something and might foretell what is next is black and thin. I look forward to it!

Artofilm
Mar 17, 2011, 09:03 AM
I dunno, when you look at it form the side, it doesnt look so great anymore.

iPave
Mar 17, 2011, 09:21 AM
Sadly they won't ship these without Windows. It would be a perfect Ubuntu laptop.

fatlardo
Mar 17, 2011, 09:22 AM
Wow that is just as sexy as the Air! But for more money! NO way!

aneftp
Mar 17, 2011, 09:35 AM
I think Samsung's laptop looks nice....however it's freaking starts at $1649 for that 13 inch 1366X768 screen with newer core i5 processor..

I think my Macbook Air 13 inch 1400X900 screen probably looks better plus it's $1399 for the same 4GB RAM with the older C2duo is the better buy at this point.

matelot
Mar 17, 2011, 09:41 AM
it certainly don't look thinner/lighter....and black sucks

fatlardo
Mar 17, 2011, 09:47 AM
it certainly don't look thinner/lighter....and black sucks

Your right, it doesnt!

entatlrg
Mar 17, 2011, 10:48 AM
Apple Innovates, others copy.

Name one product that's a copy of an Apple product this is "better". There isn't.

Will this Samsung knock off be the exception? No.

It's just another company flip flopping in Apple's Jet stream with no clue of how to invent or design their own ultra light notebook so they copy the Air.

Damn foolish to support knock off scum, imo.

KPOM
Mar 17, 2011, 10:52 AM
It's a decent machine and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend it to someone looking for a Windows subnotebook. That said, I think the next MacBook Air will get the Sandy Bridge ULV Core i5 or i7 chips (hopefully the latter). Given that summer is being primed for an iPhone update and Lion, I'm guessing that Apple will wait until September for the MacBook Air update.

matelot
Mar 17, 2011, 01:14 PM
Your right, it doesnt!

> Wow that is just as sexy as the Air!

uh...NO

simeezee
Mar 17, 2011, 02:24 PM
Mmmm, it's expensive. I wonder how much is the 11inch one and what the resolution is. I personally don't care so much about the material.

h00ligan
Mar 17, 2011, 02:31 PM
It out specs the air. And there are many day long users who wont think having the res of 11" on 13" is a bad thing. I squinted like he'll on the 11.. Wearing my glasses with ar coatings inside and out, too small.

Hellhammer
Mar 17, 2011, 02:35 PM
I think we had a lengthy thread (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1074857) about this when MBA was released...

It has the same resolution as an 11" MBA in its 13" form.

That would be the deal breaker for me at least. 1440x900 is awesome in 13", I wouldn't get anything less after that (waiting for 1680x1050 option :p)

It is a good thing Samsung is competing with the MBA, as it will lead to better Macs too. The thing that confuses me is how Dell, Sony, and now Samsung try to compete with the MBA but have higher costs and less overall design competitiveness.

This again proves that Macs are not always overpriced compared to their competitors. I have yet to see an ultraportable that could really challenge the MBA in terms of bang for the buck.

dollystereo
Mar 17, 2011, 03:03 PM
the port in the right side looks like a magsafe connector?

MyAccount
Mar 17, 2011, 03:28 PM
I like the brushed material (is that some sort of metal or fake cheap plastic almost all Windoze machines are made out of?), but other than that I'd take a MBA over it any day.

It looks like OP is a Windows fan/troll.

Consultant
Mar 17, 2011, 03:28 PM
Dell's MacBook Air ripoff already failed. Samsung didn't get the memo.

firewood
Mar 17, 2011, 03:35 PM
Note that Apple beats this product on price, as well as shipping months earlier, the opposite of the way it was many years ago.

With the Air and the iPad 2, Apple is now the price leader at many spec levels.

Who wudda thunk?

gwsat
Mar 17, 2011, 03:42 PM
I dunno, when you look at it form the side, it doesnt look so great anymore.
I believe the reason the Samsung Series 9 laptop doesn't look as good from the side as the MBA is because the Samsung's leading edge, .62 inch, is basically as thick as its back edge, .64 inch. At its thinnest, the MBA is only .11 inches thick and at its thickest, .68 inch. Thus the average thickness of the MBA is significantly less than that of the Samsung.

BENJMNS
Mar 17, 2011, 03:52 PM
good to see the big boys stepping up their game. this is good for us, the consumer. the 13" air is still king. display res just not there and ssd size.

i wonder how it does with boot up times and sleep mode.

fyrefly
Mar 17, 2011, 03:59 PM
At the bare minimum, this laptop may give us an idea of the performance of a potential Sandy Bridge MacBook Air revision - as it's using the 17W i5 processor, with the 350-900Mhz Intel HD 3000 Graphics.

I'm eagerly awaiting some reviews/benchmarks to see how the HD 3000 performs vs. something like the 320m. If the LV version isn't too far of a step back (the standard clocked HD 3000's perform slightly worse than the 320m) than we might be seeing a SB MBA sooner, rather than later! *fingers crossed*

ufkdo
Mar 17, 2011, 04:15 PM
Macbook Air base 13 inch model is the best computer I have ever used. Powerful enough and ultra portable. Also, mac os x is irrevocable :) So, why would I need a windows alternative to this?

hilarystone
Mar 17, 2011, 04:37 PM
-It's made of Duralumin which is supposedly ”twice the strength of aluminum”


Duralumin is just an alloy of aluminium – Apple certainly does not buid Airs from pure Aluminium because if they did they would fold in two when picked up... I would be certain that Apple is using a high strength Aluminium alloy...

bsolomonny
Mar 17, 2011, 04:57 PM
There are lots of nice looking windows machines ...Admittedly this is one of them (Air is still nicer). However it is the OS that makes Macs so much better.

Eidorian
Mar 17, 2011, 04:59 PM
Dell's MacBook Air ripoff already failed. Samsung didn't get the memo.Supposedly Dell is coming back with another round.

hilarystone
Mar 17, 2011, 05:00 PM
The positive is duralumin (sp) . I had hoped Apple would use this in the next round of Mac notebooks. It is twice as durable as aluminum and lighter weight too. I think it's a more realistic solution than Liquid Metal. Now it might be difficult for Apple to go that path as it will not want to look copycat.


Duralumin is just one high strength alloy of aluminium – it is no lighter than other alloy of aluminium. Duralumin covers quite a number of aluminium alloys some of which are high strength but we do not know what aluminium alloy Apple is using. There are some Aluminium metal matrix composites which will be stiffer and higher strength than standard Aluminium alloys (all standard aluminium alloys have the same stiffness) and could offer significant improvements but Duraluminum certainly does not do so – it was used on bicycle frames and components as long ago as the 1930s so is not anything new. I am certain Apple is using a good quality high strength aluminium alloy identical or similar in performance to a Duralumin alluminium alloy...

kamalds
Mar 17, 2011, 05:22 PM
Samsung has poor customer support. They forget their customers once they have sold the product. See what is happening to the poor 7-inch Galaxy Tab users - not even Android 2.3 upgrade for them.

philxor
Mar 17, 2011, 05:36 PM
I think everyone was impressed with the machine until they saw the price tag Samsung put on it.

I also think the screen resolution on the 13" model is a dealbreaker.

Gemütlichkeit
Mar 17, 2011, 05:40 PM
I dunno, when you look at it form the side, it doesnt look so great anymore.

barf

stockscalper
Mar 17, 2011, 05:42 PM
Its not like Macs dont have their share of problems.

Generally, no. I've been using Macs since 1986 in my business and at home and have never had one go down. But my colleagues that use PC's are constantly dealing with viruses and broken Dells and HP's.

Scorecard
Mar 17, 2011, 05:43 PM
It's a step in the right direction for Samsung, at the end of the day it creates better Mac products for us to enjoy in the future. As for the title of this thread it's quite misleading, It's 2.89lbs to 2.9lbs. So yes you could say it's lighter 0.01lbs is negligle, plus I find windows machines to have huge power bricks. Also it's thickest point is .64inch while the MBA is .68in but it's thinnest point .62 while the MBA is .11 So you can't really claim it's thinner.

Plus for roughly similar specs the MBA is a way better deal overall. Normally we're used to paying more for Mac products with similar design/specs but not this time! Plus graphics are a huge thing an the 320M is still better than anything Intel offers.

There still is no laptop that really matches MBP and it's form factor/price/quality build. Also many manufactures aren't up to speed yet with Sandy bridge so the MBP line is a hell of a deal!

Serenity64
Mar 17, 2011, 05:48 PM
Does it run OS X?
Does it have a multitouch glass trackpad that has usefull gestures?
Will it play along with my other MBP's screensharing and file sharing feature?

Thought not :)
Even though it has ok specs and looks almost as good as a MBA/MBP I could never ever ever -ever- go back to Windows. Sure I have just used OS X and Macs for 3 years; But after 3 iPhone generations, 4 different macs I have found a setup that works for me and I can't imagine running Windows again, even if it doesnt have the same specs.

For me the user experience matters, not the specs. End of story :)

End of offtopic :)

67bmer
Mar 17, 2011, 06:55 PM
What would be really sweet is if they came out with a 15inch one and it became their top seller!

hint hint

yanksrock100
Mar 17, 2011, 07:59 PM
But its $100 more than the 13 ultimate.
It only has a 1.4 ghz processor, has pretty much the same resolution as the 11 IN AIR, and has less storage.

And the icing on the cake.......
Windows.

So, is it really "better"?
no


AND, would you rather be walking into a coffee shop with the MACBOOK AIR? Or something thats called the "series 9" or whatever.

thejadedmonkey
Mar 17, 2011, 08:16 PM
Apple Innovates, others copy.

Name one product that's a copy of an Apple product this is "better". There isn't.

Will this Samsung knock off be the exception? No.

It's just another company flip flopping in Apple's Jet stream with no clue of how to invent or design their own ultra light notebook so they copy the Air.

Damn foolish to support knock off scum, imo.

Erm, Zune > iTunes, Windows Phone 7 > iPhone, and Microsoft Surface and the xbox 360 + kinect doesn't even have an Apple branded competetor.

All you've managed to do is solidify your position as an Apple fanboy. :D

meanwhile, this is a nice looking laptop.

hcho3
Mar 17, 2011, 08:20 PM
Let' see..

They copied Apple's drop off port from first gen MBA. It's a shame that apple has drop ports no longer because it was not a good idea.

No matter. No matter. Copycats will just copy.

It's priced more than MBA.

No matter. No matter. Copycats deserve more money.

Samsung doesn't offer customer service like apple store because... they don't have their own freaking store. You have to buy this from best buy and buy warranty from there.

Pass.

sparkomatic
Mar 17, 2011, 09:06 PM
It's nice but there's no way I'd trade my MBA for it. Granted, I am a total mac geek...but still.

yanksrock100
Mar 17, 2011, 09:32 PM
Erm, Zune > iTunes, Windows Phone 7 > iPhone

Well, Zune is a product, and iTunes is the software.
I suppose you mean Zune (which is discontinued because nobody wanted it) vs the iPod. And, as we ALL know, the iPod beats the Zune.

And Windows Phone 7 (COnfusing name because there hasnt been 7 windows phones yet....) does not beat out the iPhone 4.
Im pretty sure there isnt anything "retina" about the "Windows phone 7".

ghileman
Mar 17, 2011, 09:40 PM
It looks like OP is a Windows fan/troll.

nope, i own a Rev B Air and I'm champing at the bit the for a Sandy Bridge Air.

ghileman
Mar 17, 2011, 09:44 PM
Also it's thickest point is .64inch while the MBA is .68in but it's thinnest point .62 while the MBA is .11 So you can't really claim it's thinner.

good point. it would be more precise to say the Air is fatter.

anthro
Mar 17, 2011, 10:17 PM
Samsung Series 9 could be the best non-Apple laptop out there. Not better than Air for many people, though. People like me.

The software side is obvious. Let's go to hardware. Air's industrial design is still unmatched. The Samsung may have a better material, but that's no MacBook unibody. Spec-wise, I'd choose Core 2 Duo + NVIDIA 320M over Sandy Bridge + Intel intergrated.

And again, price.

Psilocybin
Mar 17, 2011, 11:51 PM
nope, i own a Rev B Air and champing at the bit the for Sandy Bridge Air.

Huh

calvol
Mar 18, 2011, 12:05 AM
MBA > VAIO-Z > Samsung i5 (good try though)
Samsung dropped the ball on screen resolution.
What is Samsung's battery life? I'm getting 8-10 on a UMBA, light duty.

zesta
Mar 18, 2011, 12:24 AM
The Samsung just doesn't look as nice as the Air.

And the keyboard layout looks like it was designed by a retarded monkey. What the hell were they thinking?

artivideo.nl
Mar 18, 2011, 12:34 AM
But this implies that we can expect the I5 sand bridge soon (June) in the MBA ?????

ZipZap
Mar 18, 2011, 04:32 AM
Generally, no. I've been using Macs since 1986 in my business and at home and have never had one go down. But my colleagues that use PC's are constantly dealing with viruses and broken Dells and HP's.

And I know plenty of folks who have indeed had issues with Macs.

Many have posted on this very forum with issues.

I highly doubt you have never had an issue with a Apple since 1986. But if true congrats as you were extrodinarily lucky.

wisty
Mar 18, 2011, 05:04 AM
The Series 9 is based around a bright (400 nits) 13.3-inch 1366×768 edge-to-edge display. It starts at $1,649 with a 1.4GHz Core i5-2537M dual-core processor, 4GB of memory, a 128GB solid-state drive (in place of a hard drive) and Windows 7 Home Premium. The only configurable option is the operating system–Windows 7 Professional adds $50 to the system price.


CPU - no real winner. The 1.83 MBA is 30% faster, but a new i5 is ~30% faster (clock for clock) than a C2D.

GPU - MBA wins.

Battery life - the Samsung will use less power (i5 is efficient, and no hungry GPU), but Apple may have a better batter.

OS - I'd rather OSX.

Screen - MBA. Unless you compare it to the 11" MBA - then they are similar.

Touchpad, keyboard, etc - probably the MBA.

Case - probably Samsung (though it looks better in the promo photos than up close - it looks like it's *designed* to look skinny in a photo).

Price - MBA.



Not an MBA killer, and the next MBA will be even better ... but not too bad. It's good to see *some* competition.

And it's good to see that while 10" netbooks (with crap builds, mechanical hard drives, and Atom processors) are cheaper than a MBA, capable ultraportables are no cheaper. Yet.

Dr McKay
Mar 18, 2011, 05:15 AM
Well, Zune is a product, and iTunes is the software.
I suppose you mean Zune (which is discontinued because nobody wanted it) vs the iPod. And, as we ALL know, the iPod beats the Zune.

And Windows Phone 7 (COnfusing name because there hasnt been 7 windows phones yet....) does not beat out the iPhone 4.
Im pretty sure there isnt anything "retina" about the "Windows phone 7".

He means Zune, the program, it does everything iTunes does (Minus the App Store), plays music and video, you can download or stream music and movies from the store side of it.

http://www.softdistrict.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/zune-software.png

benji888
Mar 18, 2011, 05:28 AM
... it runs Windows and it is a Samsung, which means in 12 to 18 months the keys will be falling off it and the drive and graphics card failing and it will be generally falling apart. Thanks, but no thanks. Go troll someplace else.

exactly, I owned a samsung DVD-r & VCR combo, the DVD ran out with the warranty, that was my first samsung, I won't buy samsung again...they can build some great electronic components, but they don't know how to make devices to use them.

benji888
Mar 18, 2011, 05:41 AM
Although this might be the nicest looking PC laptop I've seen, it still runs crappy windows, and it doesn't have the "fit & finish" the air has.

I do like the brushed metal look.

I think we may see liquid metal this year in iPhones and/or iPad 3, and then, 2012, they will liquid metal the MacBooks. One thing with liquid metal is color can be added to it, it would not be painted or dyed on the outside, so a scratch would not show. But they will do smaller devices first. Apple is going to change the game as soon as you think they won't, don't think because they've got something that works they won't change it.

Dr McKay
Mar 18, 2011, 08:01 AM
it still runs crappy windows

But Windows does run OS X ;)

http://www.m4d3l-network.com/wp-content/gallery/mac-os-x-vmware-install/snowleopard1.png

shen
Mar 18, 2011, 08:29 AM
But Windows does run OS X ;)

Like hiring a cheap hooker with 4 STDs and asking her to wear my wife's evening dress. Disgusting, wrong, foul, illegal, and begs the question "why?"

Dr McKay
Mar 18, 2011, 08:54 AM
Disgusting, wrong, foul, illegal, and begs the question "why?"

Why is it 'Disgusting, Wrong, Foul'

And would you care to find it written in a book of Law that you cannot run OS X in a virtual Machine? Just because it goes against Apples Policy.

And why? The same reason why I also have a Windows 3.1 VM.

Because I can.;)

Hellhammer
Mar 18, 2011, 09:01 AM
Windows Phone 7 > iPhone

That's just your opinion. If we look at the market share, iPhone is way ahead of WP7.

CPU - no real winner. The 1.83 MBA is 30% faster, but a new i5 is ~30% faster (clock for clock) than a C2D.

i5-2537M goes up to 2.3GHz with Turbo so it is way faster than the old C2D.

wisty
Mar 18, 2011, 09:34 AM
That's just your opinion. If we look at the market share, iPhone is way ahead of WP7.

I bet if you look, there'll be a video of Ballmer savaging the iPhone over it's lack of Apps (when WinCE was king), and it's lack of features that are missing from WP7 - like copy and paste.


i5-2537M goes up to 2.3GHz with Turbo so it is way faster than the old C2D.

OK. Plus hyper-threading, for parallel stuff. It's not always way faster though.

Geekbench2 shows ~3800 for the Samsung, vs ~3400 for the 13" MBA ultimate.

http://browse.geekbench.ca/geekbench2/view/351809
http://browse.geekbench.ca/geekbench2/view/381027

Both are capable, neither is a powerhouse.

I'm still a MBA fan, thanks to the screen, the general build, and OSX.

captgecos
Mar 18, 2011, 10:22 AM
It is a good thing Samsung is competing with the MBA, as it will lead to better Macs too.

This is a nice looking computer. I hope that Apple will be pushed to compete and improve the MBA. The Samsung is using Sandy Bridge while the MBA is still two cycles behind with the C2D. Hopefully the next MBA will have Ivy Bridge but you never know with Apple. It can't hurt for Apple to have a little pressure from competition. Then on second thought, competition has really made Apple jump through hoops on the iPhone/iPad :rolleyes:

dellar
Mar 18, 2011, 12:00 PM
http://i.i.com.com/cnwk.1d/i/tim/2011/01/04/9_series_open_3_610x439.JPG

WOW! I must admit it is beautiful. (killer for black)
Too bad, it runs on Windows...:D:apple:

Looks like the Apple PowerBook G3 Lombard from 1999. Wow they're about 12 years behind!

chaoticbear
Mar 18, 2011, 12:18 PM
I really like the finish; otherwise this thing is just uggs. The Dell Adamo, while still pricier than the current MBA, seemed like a closer replacement (even if it wasn't 0.01 lbs lighter than the MBA.)

shen
Mar 18, 2011, 12:29 PM
Why is it 'Disgusting, Wrong, Foul'

And would you care to find it written in a book of Law that you cannot run OS X in a virtual Machine? Just because it goes against Apples Policy.

And why? The same reason why I also have a Windows 3.1 VM.

Because I can.;)

I have run every version of windows from 2.0 up except for 7, didn't bother trying it. Every version with the possible exception of 3.11 was somewhere between less than good, and pure evil. Running windows is simply, in my personal opinion, disgusting, wrong, foul, unnecessary, evil, and yucky.

So far, when the EULA says don't do it, it is generally upheld. That makes it illegal until ruled otherwise, though certainly challengeable and possibly winnable, still illegal until that time.

And yes, you can. But that isn't enough reason for me to dump my wife for a whore. YMMV (Your Morals May Vary)

2IS
Mar 18, 2011, 12:30 PM
I like it. I actually prefer Windows 7 to OSX so that's a non-issue for me. i5 is a very nice bonus but the screen resolution comes in at a paltry 1366x768 which is a bummer.

I'd also like to add, comparing wives:whores to OSX:Windows is quite literally the most ridiculous thing i've ever heard.

ritmomundo
Mar 18, 2011, 01:31 PM
Like hiring a cheap hooker with 4 STDs and asking her to wear my wife's evening dress. Disgusting, wrong, foul, illegal, and begs the question "why?"

Wow, you're an apple fanboy if I ever did see one. Windows is not THAT bad...

That's just your opinion. If we look at the market share, iPhone is way ahead of WP7.

Same could be said about Windows dominating the market over OSX.

This is a nice looking computer. I hope that Apple will be pushed to compete and improve the MBA. The Samsung is using Sandy Bridge while the MBA is still two cycles behind with the C2D. Hopefully the next MBA will have Ivy Bridge but you never know with Apple. It can't hurt for Apple to have a little pressure from competition. Then on second thought, competition has really made Apple jump through hoops on the iPhone/iPad :rolleyes:

I agree. I love my MBA, but I'm not so jaded as to not recognize that this laptop does look cool. Sure, it doesn't look as thin because its not tapered, but thats still impressive. I like the brushed metal look (as long as it is actual metal, and not plastic). The screen looks like it has that edge-to-edge glass over the bezel that the MBPs have, but unfortunately, the MBA does not. And better hardware specs. The competition is pretty darn good. Apple, time to step up your game and give us something even more awesome in the next MBA refresh!

GFLPraxis
Mar 18, 2011, 01:33 PM
Are you reading the same specs I am?:confused:

He's partially right.

The Samsung costs $50 more than the top-end MacBook Air, has a better CPU and more RAM and USB 3.

However, it has half the storage space (and SSD's are the most expensive components in these devices, a 256 GB SSD costs ~$300-$400 depending on quality), a weaker video card, a lower resolution screen,

ritmomundo
Mar 18, 2011, 02:18 PM
Generally, no. I've been using Macs since 1986 in my business and at home and have never had one go down. But my colleagues that use PC's are constantly dealing with viruses and broken Dells and HP's.

Its all about the user. I've been using PCs for 15+ years (and still do), and I've rarely had issues. I've been using Macs for the past ~5 years, and also rarely had issues. If the user installs things left and right and isn't careful about what he's doing on the web, then yes, there is the potential for issues regardless of what he's using - PC or Mac. Yes, PCs are attacked by viruses, and this is why you need antivirus software. One day, someone will come out with a virus for Macs that will find a way to bypass OSX's security measures, but no one will be prepared for it because everyone assumes that Macs are invulnerable. Its only a matter of time.

As for PCs breaking down, you have to remember, OSX is installed only on hardware made by Apple. Windows is installed on all PCs, made by high end companies (which will see less issues) and low end companies (which will have a lot of issues, because of cheaper build quality). Buy a really good quality PC, and you'll see just as few issues as you would with a Mac. Take care of it, be safe on the web, and I'm sure you won't have any problems.

MacFever
Mar 18, 2011, 02:45 PM
Samsung just made the AIR look dated....lol

Core I5, USB 3.0

where is the new MBA with the comparable I5 and Thunderbolt???

What is apple waiting on really? :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

magbarn
Mar 18, 2011, 03:14 PM
I bet if you look, there'll be a video of Ballmer savaging the iPhone over it's lack of Apps (when WinCE was king), and it's lack of features that are missing from WP7 - like copy and paste.




OK. Plus hyper-threading, for parallel stuff. It's not always way faster though.

Geekbench2 shows ~3800 for the Samsung, vs ~3400 for the 13" MBA ultimate.

http://browse.geekbench.ca/geekbench2/view/351809
http://browse.geekbench.ca/geekbench2/view/381027

Both are capable, neither is a powerhouse.

I'm still a MBA fan, thanks to the screen, the general build, and OSX.

Geekbench is a pretty crappy synth benchmark, look at the multithread performance of SB KILLS the single-thread peformance of the c2d. GB puts too much emphasis on single-thread. Play with a 2011 MBP 13, much snappier than the C2D 2010 MBP 13. SB will run turbo 95% of the time, unlike last years i5/i7's.

Dr McKay
Mar 18, 2011, 03:45 PM
I have run every version of windows from 2.0 up except for 7, didn't bother trying it. Every version with the possible exception of 3.11 was somewhere between less than good, and pure evil. Running windows is simply, in my personal opinion, disgusting, wrong, foul, unnecessary, evil, and yucky.

So far, when the EULA says don't do it, it is generally upheld. That makes it illegal until ruled otherwise, though certainly challengeable and possibly winnable, still illegal until that time.

And yes, you can. But that isn't enough reason for me to dump my wife for a whore. YMMV (Your Morals May Vary)

I was preparing a reasoned response, but I see you are nothing but a massive Apple Fanboy, who would never respond to that. So Im going to stop talking to you now.

Saying Windows is 'Wrong, Yucky, Disgusting, Evil, Foul, unnecessary' is frankly laughable. Comparing running OS X in VMware to 'dumping my wife for a whore' is simply ridiculous.

And questioning my morals, because I installed a legal, purchased copy of Snow Leopard on my PC to fool around with..

Wow.... just wow.....

n1tut
Mar 18, 2011, 04:25 PM
Windows 7 is not crap. It is a damn good stable operating system at last, and I have only just acquired my first Mac, 11.6" Basic which I would not now change for anything. Apart from being an object of beauty, it is as light as a feather, has great resolution, and is as fast as my fingers and eyes can keep up with.

I am all for comparing it to other notebooks, but I really dislike this blinkered image that nothing else can compare with it, or that OS X is the holy Grail. Most members on here are rational in their posts, but as in every Forum there will be the retards.

tut

tom vilsack
Mar 20, 2011, 03:04 AM
i don't really like the "heavy" brushed look of it...and for that price,best not be loaded with crapware.

lshirase
Mar 20, 2011, 03:37 AM
i'm glad other companies are releasing macbook air rivals. sandy bridge air in june, please!

Gaso
Mar 20, 2011, 04:48 AM
For me one of the selling points for MBA was the usability of the multi-touch trackpad. I was considering PC counterparts (well, a month ago there was not many or at all), but decided not to wait because the the integration of multi-touch gestures with OS wouldn't happen on the same level with a windows machine (not bashing windows or PC's in general).

Veinticinco
Mar 20, 2011, 07:38 AM
The day one of these 'me too' laptops can natively run OS X is the day we can have a relevant and meaningful discussion about comparative specs and design in relation to an MBA.

As for this latest pretender, it's a Samsung. Ugh. QC issues every week of ownership you can bet. Plus I'd be taking a blade to that awful ugly typographic logo on the lid if I was unfortunate or deluded enough to buy one of these.

Hellhammer
Mar 20, 2011, 07:43 AM
The day one of these 'me too' laptops can natively run OS X is the day we can have a relevant and meaningful discussion about comparative specs and design in relation to an MBA.

That day will never happen. Hacks will get better and easier but you will very unlikely be able to pop in the OS X disc and install it normally and have everything working right away.

Veinticinco
Mar 20, 2011, 07:48 AM
That day will never happen. Hacks will get better and easier but you will very unlikely be able to pop in the OS X disc and install it normally and have everything working right away.
I agree, which was kind of my point. These spec-comparing/willy-waving discussions are pointless.

stockscalper
Mar 20, 2011, 08:50 AM
Windows 7 is not crap. It is a damn good stable operating system at last, and I have only just acquired my first Mac, 11.6" Basic which I would not now change for anything. Apart from being an object of beauty, it is as light as a feather, has great resolution, and is as fast as my fingers and eyes can keep up with.

I am all for comparing it to other notebooks, but I really dislike this blinkered image that nothing else can compare with it, or that OS X is the holy Grail. Most members on here are rational in their posts, but as in every Forum there will be the retards.

tut

OS X is the Holy Grail and Windows is just a stinky plate of haggis. :D

noripwr
Mar 21, 2011, 03:29 AM
I really like the finish; otherwise this thing is just uggs. The Dell Adamo, while still pricier than the current MBA, seemed like a closer replacement (even if it wasn't 0.01 lbs lighter than the MBA.)


I had an Asus that had the appearance of that finish but the paint started fading away over time. If Samsung is charging that much for that laptop, that finish better be real metal and not paint over plastic. They can always say they use Duralumin, but where exactly?

scottgroovez
Mar 22, 2011, 08:58 AM
Nice, but damn expensive!!

josh2007
Mar 22, 2011, 10:45 AM
+1. Gotta admit. Looks great!

Now with Linux that could be a great toy.

on second thought, nahh.........

munkees
Mar 22, 2011, 10:53 AM
good to see the big boys stepping up their game. this is good for us, the consumer.

yep competition, we need it so the envelope of technology can be pushed

josh1231
Mar 22, 2011, 11:51 AM
And is now on sale.

Areas besides chip, weight and thinness where the Series 9 has the Air beat:

-HD LED-backlit SuperBright Plus display (400 nit)
-1.5 watt sub-woofer
-WiMax
-It's made of Duralumin which is supposedly ”twice the strength of aluminum”

And this last point is personal preference, but I actually think it looks better than Air.

Having said all this, it obviously runs Windows. Hopefully if nothing else it will help motivate Apple to iterate the next Air update sooner.

More info here:

http://mashable.com/2011/03/16/samsung-laptop/

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/computers/samsungs-sleek-series-9-is-now-available/5281

Looks great, however I think its too expensive.

iRun26.2
Mar 22, 2011, 11:57 AM
Nice, but damn expensive!!

To be honest, I wish the price of the MBA was higher. Not that I want to pay a higher price for the current 11.6" MBA, but I would have liked to have had the option to pay more for additional advanced BTO options:

1) 256G SSD (11.6" MBA)
2) Higher resolution screen ('Retina' display)
3) Backlit keyboard

I realize that the 11.6" model is partily geared to be cheaper but I think that there are fair number of us out there that would be willing to pay quite a bit more for a more advanced version.

ja12ke
Mar 22, 2011, 12:12 PM
MBA > VAIO-Z > Samsung i5 (good try though)
Samsung dropped the ball on screen resolution.
What is Samsung's battery life? I'm getting 8-10 on a UMBA, light duty.

Please...The MBA is not even in the same league as the Z. In addition, how many of you have actually used a windows 7 machine recently to think that the OS X is so much better? My MBA has crashed more times than my Windows 7 machine at work...I also have a lot of crap software on my windows box too. That thing is on 24x7 since I remote desktop into the box from my MBA to get work done. The days of bashing Windows as a crappy OS is over...You can still have your preferences...But in terms of reliability, i might even say that Win 7 is more reliable than the OS X.

iRun26.2
Mar 22, 2011, 12:55 PM
Please...The MBA is not even in the same league as the Z. In addition, how many of you have actually used a windows 7 machine recently to think that the OS X is so much better? My MBA has crashed more times than my Windows 7 machine at work...I also have a lot of crap software on my windows box too. That thing is on 24x7 since I remote desktop into the box from my MBA to get work done. The days of bashing Windows as a crappy OS is over...You can still have your preferences...But in terms of reliability, i might even say that Win 7 is more reliable than the OS X.

Yes, Windows 7 is pretty good. But, for me, however, Vista is still firmly fixed in my mind. That was the worst OS I have ever used.

BENJMNS
Mar 22, 2011, 12:57 PM
please...the mba is not even in the same league as the z. In addition, how many of you have actually used a windows 7 machine recently to think that the os x is so much better? My mba has crashed more times than my windows 7 machine at work...i also have a lot of crap software on my windows box too. That thing is on 24x7 since i remote desktop into the box from my mba to get work done. The days of bashing windows as a crappy os is over...you can still have your preferences...but in terms of reliability, i might even say that win 7 is more reliable than the os x.

agreed

BENJMNS
Mar 22, 2011, 01:00 PM
Yes, Windows 7 is pretty good. But, for me, however, Vista is still firmly fixed in my mind. That was the worst OS I have ever used.

another embellishment... vista ran pretty much the same as 7 so long as you keep the OS updated... just like OSX.

vista worked just fine for me. win7 works just fine as well.

BENJMNS
Mar 22, 2011, 01:00 PM
To be honest, I wish the price of the MBA was higher. Not that I want to pay a higher price for the current 11.6" MBA, but I would have liked to have had the option to pay more for additional advanced BTO options:

1) 256G SSD (11.6" MBA)
2) Higher resolution screen ('Retina' display)
3) Backlit keyboard

I realize that the 11.6" model is partily geared to be cheaper but I think that there are fair number of us out there that would be willing to pay quite a bit more for a more advanced version.

you're gonna need a new retina for any higher res on the small arse 11" screen

KPOM
Mar 22, 2011, 01:07 PM
another embellishment... vista ran pretty much the same as 7 so long as you keep the OS updated... just like OSX.

vista worked just fine for me. win7 works just fine as well.

Vista is on my work PC and I have Win 7 on my Mac's Boot Camp partition. Win 7 is far better and more stable. Vista isn't as bad as its reputation (at least since SP1), but there's a reason most people waited until Windows 7 came out. Win 7 has some nice UI improvements over Vista, as well as tighter code.

fs454
Mar 22, 2011, 01:38 PM
It's .05 of an inch thinner than the back part of an MBA.

And stays that way the whole way around, and it's not tapered.

It will feel much thicker than the MBA.

Gaelic2
Mar 22, 2011, 01:46 PM
come on folks! This guy is just pushing another line of computers for reasons of his own. It has nothing to do with anything other than business.;)

iRun26.2
Mar 22, 2011, 04:47 PM
you're gonna need a new retina for any higher res on the small arse 11" screen

I take it that you don't own an iPhone 4 then. Text is the same size but it is ultra crisp (no rabid edges). Images are crisp as well. You can not see the pixels (which is what the retina display is referring to). It is not hard to see the individual pixels on the current 11.6" MBA screen).

There will be a time when ALL laptop screens will have pixel densities as high as the iPhone 4. I want that now in my 11.6" MBA. I will pay an extra $1000 for that screen.

iRun26.2
Mar 22, 2011, 04:56 PM
It's .05 of an inch thinner than the back part of an MBA.

And stays that way the whole way around, and it's not tapered.

It will feel much thicker than the MBA.

It sure seems like a more relevant metric would be volume (or average thickness). I think the MBA would win that hands down. There are other slanted things in my backpack besides my MBA. If it's volume is lower, that is a real advantage.

(which, of course, is one of the reasons I love my 11.6" MBA even more). :)

Scottsdale
Mar 22, 2011, 05:06 PM
To be honest, I wish the price of the MBA was higher. Not that I want to pay a higher price for the current 11.6" MBA, but I would have liked to have had the option to pay more for additional advanced BTO options:

1) 256G SSD (11.6" MBA)
2) Higher resolution screen ('Retina' display)
3) Backlit keyboard

I realize that the 11.6" model is partily geared to be cheaper but I think that there are fair number of us out there that would be willing to pay quite a bit more for a more advanced version.

I agree fully and know exactly what you mean... I want the possibility to spend much more and get the MBA of my dreams.

For example:
IPS Hi Res Display all the way to x1050 resolution or higher (really possible in the future with resolution independence)
Discrete GPU option on all of Apple's 13" notebooks and the Mac mini.
Larger and faster SSD options
More RAM options to 8GB and on SB/IB 16GB
Aluminum capped keys as I don't like the feel of the plastic keys (glass might be even better)
Backlit keyboard
black aluminum
HD webcam
USB 3.0
some sort of WiDi solution
docking station with built in blu ray and discrete GPU
docking cable
and I am sure there's more I am not thinking of right this second

I mean why doesn't Apple truly capitalize on us nutjobs who will blow our wads on these MBAs. I would add it all, as this is my addiction.

cube
Mar 22, 2011, 05:13 PM
Where PC hardware wins is in thin ultraportables with optical drives.

If it doesn't have an optical drive, you can just buy one of Apple's netbooks.

halledise
Mar 22, 2011, 05:33 PM
it's ***** ;)

Psilocybin
Mar 22, 2011, 06:37 PM
Where PC hardware wins is in thin ultraportables with optical drives.

If it doesn't have an optical drive, you can just buy one of Apple's netbooks.

Apples netbooks?

Psilocybin
Mar 22, 2011, 06:38 PM
Apples netbooks? What netbooks they don't sell netbooks

cube
Mar 22, 2011, 06:45 PM
Apples netbooks? What netbooks they don't sell netbooks

Yes, they sell expensive netbooks, the MBA.

To be accurate, even in this case the PC hardware is better, as they don't have gigabit Ethernet, which is essential.

munkery
Mar 22, 2011, 06:58 PM
Yes, they sell expensive netbooks, the MBA.

To be accurate, even in this case the PC hardware is better, as they don't have gigabit Ethernet, which is essential.

Who hard lines a portable anymore?

iRun26.2
Mar 22, 2011, 08:06 PM
I agree fully and know exactly what you mean... I want the possibility to spend much more and get the MBA of my dreams.
and on SB/IB 16GB
...
I mean why doesn't Apple truly capitalize on us nutjobs who will blow our wads on these MBAs. I would add it all, as this is my addiction.

Yes, it is nearly a disease with me too (endless excitement and hope for the next upgrade). :)

In what way would Apple's bottom line be reduced if they sold 'luxury' MBAs ($3k to $4k) to those who want to spend their excess money on advanced machines?

Where is capitalism when you need it?! :)

stockscalper
Mar 23, 2011, 08:08 AM
it's ***** ;)

+1

Hellhammer
Mar 23, 2011, 10:37 AM
Where PC hardware wins is in thin ultraportables with optical drives.

If it doesn't have an optical drive, you can just buy one of Apple's netbooks.

I have yet to see a laptop that matches MBA's form factor and specs with an optical drive. ODDs take a ridiculous amount of space and are more or less useless.

Yes, they sell expensive netbooks, the MBA.

No. MBA is an ultraportable, not a netbook. Netbook is something extremely cheap and limited and usually not even light or small (besides the small screen).

To be accurate, even in this case the PC hardware is better, as they don't have gigabit Ethernet, which is essential.

What is the point of an ultraportable if you have to keep it plugged in?

GekkePrutser
Mar 23, 2011, 11:32 AM
In what way would Apple's bottom line be reduced if they sold 'luxury' MBAs ($3k to $4k) to those who want to spend their excess money on advanced machines?

Where is capitalism when you need it?! :)

Adding extra options costs a lot more than just the added hardware. You have to think of the extra stockkeeping in the factories, warranty stock in local countries, testing, more complicated manufacturing processes, managing extra supply streams, support, refurb/rework etc.

That's why they only go for the options that deliver some volume. If you offer an option that is only taken by 1% of the customers it's usually not worth the trouble at all. Raising the option price to cover the cost is not possible either because that reduces that percentage even more.

PittAir
Mar 23, 2011, 12:09 PM
As a related example, I just set up a Sony Vaio X1 for a junior faculty of mine. While it is incredibly light and thin, the entire Windows 7 experience on this computer is entirely different than a MBA. I forgot how frustrating the whole experience of computing can be.

It's not the specs--it's the entire experience of computing for what you do most. Software and hardware integration.

I cannot see Sony or Samsung competing on the basis of user experience, as much as they may try. The only thing left is specs, which is so last decade.

cube
Mar 23, 2011, 12:20 PM
I have yet to see a laptop that matches MBA's form factor and specs with an optical drive. ODDs take a ridiculous amount of space and are more or less useless.



No. MBA is an ultraportable, not a netbook. Netbook is something extremely cheap and limited and usually not even light or small (besides the small screen).



What is the point of an ultraportable if you have to keep it plugged in?

There are ultraportables with very thin optical drives.

Any laptop that does not have an optical drive is a netbook. If in addition, it doesn't have ethernet, it is an uber-netbook.

Why would you have to keep an ultraportable plugged in if it has an ethernet port?

gwsat
Mar 23, 2011, 12:27 PM
I have yet to see a laptop that matches MBA's form factor and specs with an optical drive. ODDs take a ridiculous amount of space and are more or less useless.

No. MBA is an ultraportable, not a netbook. Netbook is something extremely cheap and limited and usually not even light or small (besides the small screen).

What is the point of an ultraportable if you have to keep it plugged in?
Hellhammer -- I admire your patience but my advice would be: Don't feed the trolls.:)

As a related example, I just set up a Sony Vaio X1 for a junior faculty of mine. While it is incredibly light and thin, the entire Windows 7 experience on this computer is entirely different than a MBA. I forgot how frustrating the whole experience of computing can be.

It's not the specs--it's the entire experience of computing for what you do most. Software and hardware integration.

I cannot see Sony or Samsung competing on the basis of user experience, as much as they may try. The only thing left is specs, which is so last decade.
I agree that the MBA's esthetics are remarkable and also that there is nothing in the same world among Windows laptops. I run Windows 7 in emulation on my MBA because I must. Windows 7 is extremely flexible and probably gives very, very savvy users greater ability to customize it than does OS X. But, as you noted, OS X integrates seamlessly with Apple's hardware and is exponentially less frustrating to use than Windows 7.

gnasher729
Mar 23, 2011, 12:54 PM
Problems: It only has the screen resolution of the 11", it runs Windows only, and the cheapest model costs more than the most expensive MBA 13".

So it won't take any MacOS X customers away from Apple. Question is how many they will sell to Windows users; good luck to them. Dell's Adamo (headline: Dell Adamo is a super slim laptop all set to blow away the AIR) isn't for sale anymore, due to overwhelming success in sales :D

On the other hand, Samsung _does_ make nice looking stuff (two TVs and one colour laser printer here, all looking very nice and working just fine), so if you were looking for a very, very nice laptop to run Windows, and have no interest in MacOS X whatsoever, and your eyesight has reached the point where the pixels on the MBA 11" are too small for you, then it may compete reasonably well with the MBA in that market. Especially when you add the cost of a Windows license to the MBA.


And would you care to find it written in a book of Law that you cannot run OS X in a virtual Machine? Just because it goes against Apples Policy.

It doesn't say anywhere that you cannot run OS X in a virtual machine. The MacOS X license does however say that you can only run it on an Apple-branded computer and only once. So Mac Pro, ten VMs, ten separate copies of MacOS X, that looks quite legal to me (the family license unfortunately says that you can install it on five _different_ Macs, so two family packs are not legal). MacOS X an a VM running on a Samsung laptop. And you can't avoid falling foul to the DMCA legislation, with the going rate of > $2,000 per breach, as Psystar found out. Not that Apple cares what you do at your home, unless you try turning it into a business.

jamesryanbell
Mar 23, 2011, 01:11 PM
Problems: It only has the screen resolution of the 11", it runs Windows only, and the cheapest model costs more than the most expensive MBA 13".

So it won't take any MacOS X customers away from Apple. Question is how many they will sell to Windows users; good luck to them. Dell's Adamo (headline: Dell Adamo is a super slim laptop all set to blow away the AIR) isn't for sale anymore, due to overwhelming success in sales :D



This is pretty much all that needs to be said.

fortunecookie
Mar 23, 2011, 01:22 PM
I still love MBA! :)

jamesryanbell
Mar 23, 2011, 01:36 PM
I still love MBA! :)

Me too! That's why I just bought one today. :)

rav16
Mar 23, 2011, 01:55 PM
i have yet to see a laptop that matches mba's form factor and specs with an optical drive. Odds take a ridiculous amount of space and are more or less useless.



No. Mba is an ultraportable, not a netbook. Netbook is something extremely cheap and limited and usually not even light or small (besides the small screen).



What is the point of an ultraportable if you have to keep it plugged in?

+100

Hellhammer
Mar 23, 2011, 02:21 PM
There are ultraportables with very thin optical drives.

Links, please.

Any laptop that does not have an optical drive is a netbook.

According to what? Netbook is a laptop with ≤10" screen.

Netbooks are small portable computing device, similar to a notebook, and are great for surfing the Web and checking e-mail. What differentiates a netbook from a notebook is its physical size and computing power. A netbook typically has a small display, ranging from 7 to 10 inches.

A small laptop that has a screen size of less than 10” diagonally.

These are essentially scaled down notebooks with smaller screen sizes, most commonly in 9 and 10 inches and based on x86 CPUs, such as Intel's Atom family.

If in addition, it doesn't have ethernet, it is an uber-netbook.

Why would you have to keep an ultraportable plugged in if it has an ethernet port?

Why should it have an Ethernet port if nobody uses it? I fail to see how you can use the Ethernet port without plugging a cable into it. I have yet to see wireless Gigabit Ethernet.

Psilocybin
Mar 23, 2011, 03:42 PM
The MBA is definitely not classified as a netbook

cube
Mar 23, 2011, 05:21 PM
Links, please.



According to what? Netbook is a laptop with ≤10" screen.









Why should it have an Ethernet port if nobody uses it? I fail to see how you can use the Ethernet port without plugging a cable into it. I have yet to see wireless Gigabit Ethernet.

Toshiba Portege, for example.

I don't care about those arbitrary definitions. A netbook is a crippled, not full-functional laptop. No optical drive == not full functional. No ethernet == crippled.

You said that "if it had an ethernet port, you would have to leave it plugged in". You can use gigabit ethernet when you need it and still not plug it all the time.

radiohead14
Mar 23, 2011, 05:48 PM
Links, please.

there was the sony vaio t series that came out back in 2008:

http://www.engadget.com/2008/09/23/sonys-11-inch-vaio-tt-worlds-lightest-blu-ray-laptop/

iRun26.2
Mar 23, 2011, 08:21 PM
Toshiba Portege, for example.

I don't care about those arbitrary definitions. A netbook is a crippled, not full-functional laptop. No optical drive == not full functional. No ethernet == crippled.

You said that "if it had an ethernet port, you would have to leave it plugged in". You can use gigabit ethernet when you need it and still not plug it all the time.

I consider a laptop computer to be 'crippled' if it HAS an optical drive. That's dead weight that I would almost never use and I would hate to have the burden of carrying it around with me wherever I go.

Your philosophy for the gigabit Ethernet connector is the same taken by MBA owners and the optical drive. We'll plug it in when we are in need of it (which is becoming very rare).

iRun26.2
Mar 23, 2011, 08:29 PM
Toshiba Portege, for example.

I don't care about those arbitrary definitions. A netbook is a crippled, not full-functional laptop. No optical drive == not full functional. No ethernet == crippled.

Your definition of 'fully functional' is arbitrary in it's own way. I still sometimes use an RS232 port for some of my engineering work (using old hardware). Is your computer 'crippled' because it lacks a serial port?

It is all a matter of perspective. I consider my 11.6" MBA to be fully functional because 99% of the time, it is all I need.

2IS
Mar 23, 2011, 08:37 PM
According to what? Netbook is a laptop with ≤10" screen.

I have a feeling if the MBA came in a 9.9" variant, your definition for netbook would conveniently change also.

Now while I do not agree that the MBA is a netbook, I do agree that your definition of what constitutes a netbook is indeed arbitrary.

MBA IMO falls in between. It's feature set does resemble that of a netbook. It's performance is that of a full blown laptop.

fyrefly
Mar 24, 2011, 12:39 AM
there was the sony vaio t series that came out back in 2008:

http://www.engadget.com/2008/09/23/sonys-11-inch-vaio-tt-worlds-lightest-blu-ray-laptop/

The sony is 1" thick. Hardly matching the MBA form factor. It's as thick as a MBP. Yes, it's only 2.87 lbs, but it's only 11" screen and costs $2K.

radiohead14
Mar 24, 2011, 03:41 AM
The sony is 1" thick. Hardly matching the MBA form factor. It's as thick as a MBP. Yes, it's only 2.87 lbs, but it's only 11" screen and costs $2K.

never said it was. i was only responding to this section:

There are ultraportables with very thin optical drives.Links, please.

noripwr
Mar 24, 2011, 03:53 AM
I have a feeling if the MBA came in a 9.9" variant, your definition for netbook would conveniently change also.

Now while I do not agree that the MBA is a netbook, I do agree that your definition of what constitutes a netbook is indeed arbitrary.

MBA IMO falls in between. It's feature set does resemble that of a netbook. It's performance is that of a full blown laptop.


As reference to your post, the 11'' MBA 2gb on 10.6.7 kicks the ***** out of my Samsung N110 4gb Intel Atom netbook running Win7.

The Sammy had various ports that I hardly ever used. I truly only cared about the usb. And I couldn't do anything productive with the horrible screen res. For $530 that I paid when the N110 first came out, the only amazing thing about it was the 10 hr battery life. Of course, that's Atom for you.

skeane87
Mar 24, 2011, 08:20 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EaKWHvUASgk

Big D 51
Mar 24, 2011, 08:40 AM
It's nice but there's no way I'd trade my MBA for it. Granted, I am a total mac geek...but still.

+1 ... I like the black but its not mac :D :apple:

chaoticbear
Mar 24, 2011, 09:02 AM
I take it that you don't own an iPhone 4 then. Text is the same size but it is ultra crisp (no rabid edges). Images are crisp as well. You can not see the pixels (which is what the retina display is referring to). It is not hard to see the individual pixels on the current 11.6" MBA screen).

There will be a time when ALL laptop screens will have pixel densities as high as the iPhone 4. I want that now in my 11.6" MBA. I will pay an extra $1000 for that screen.

The problem with that is that anything in the current OSX would be unreadable; since it doesn't support resolution independence, the text would be absolutely tiny. iOS handles this just fine, though.

(and lol @ "rabid edges")

Hellhammer
Mar 24, 2011, 09:33 AM
Toshiba Portege, for example.

There aren't dimensions on Toshiba's site but in my eyes, it seems to be closer to 13" MBP's form factor, not MBA's.

You said that "if it had an ethernet port, you would have to leave it plugged in". You can use gigabit ethernet when you need it and still not plug it all the time.

And what is the need for it then? The people who buy MBAs don't need it. I know you are going to say that it can be used for file transfers but how many have an external storage solution with Gigabit Ethernet? I bet not that many, USB is sufficient for most people. Besides, it will be useless when Thunderbolt and/or USB 3.0 is added.

there was the sony vaio t series that came out back in 2008:

http://www.engadget.com/2008/09/23/sonys-11-inch-vaio-tt-worlds-lightest-blu-ray-laptop/

I also said:

I have yet to see a laptop that matches MBA's form factor and specs with an optical drive. ODDs take a ridiculous amount of space and are more or less useless.

That is what I said first. Yes, there must be netbook with ODDs but they are inferior in all other ways then. If ODD is taking 1/3 of the innards, there is simply no space for other parts. Sure you can put an Atom in there but then it isn't comparable with MBA anymore.

iRun26.2
Mar 24, 2011, 10:03 AM
The problem with that is that anything in the current OSX would be unreadable; since it doesn't support resolution independence, the text would be absolutely tiny. iOS handles this just fine, though.

(and lol @ "rabid edges")

I know. My request assumed that the future Retina Display on the MBA would have the necessary scaling software in OSX.

ZZANG
Mar 24, 2011, 10:19 AM
Samsung has been and always been a pretty damn good company. They have really stepped it up in their new product lineup for PC owners...

Either you are a Apple diehard fanatic or not - you have to appreciate quality when you see it.

Most arguments are one liners - "it's not a Mac." or "it has windows." who cares. If it works for those that want it and does what it needs to do - don't go knock'n on a product just cause you are a sheep.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

iRun26.2
Mar 24, 2011, 11:59 AM
Samsung has been and always been a pretty damn good company. They have really stepped it up in their new product lineup for PC owners...

Either you are a Apple diehard fanatic or not - you have to appreciate quality when you see it.

Most arguments are one liners - "it's not a Mac." or "it has windows." who cares. If it works for those that want it and does what it needs to do - don't go knock'n on a product just cause you are a sheep.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

But the OS is part of the package (and, for goodness sake, this is a MACRUMOR's forum)! :)

Certain software requires OSX (X-code, for example) and, because of that, it will not work for some of us. When you don't have a choice, you are not sheep. People who stick with Windows without considering OSX are the sheep in my mind.

jamesryanbell
Mar 24, 2011, 12:06 PM
Most arguments are one liners - "it's not a Mac." or "it has windows." who cares. If it works for those that want it and does what it needs to do - don't go knock'n on a product just cause you are a sheep.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It's not because people are sheep. It's because the OS is THE MOST IMPORTANT THING to a LOT of people. No OSX, no care. Plain and simple. Many, many, many, MANY people agree with that. For those that don't, go buy the Samsung. On THIS forum, better get used to "no OSX, no care". That's a big part of why we're here.

Scottsdale
Mar 24, 2011, 12:19 PM
Samsung has been and always been a pretty damn good company. They have really stepped it up in their new product lineup for PC owners...

Either you are a Apple diehard fanatic or not - you have to appreciate quality when you see it.

Most arguments are one liners - "it's not a Mac." or "it has windows." who cares. If it works for those that want it and does what it needs to do - don't go knock'n on a product just cause you are a sheep.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Apple loves Samsung as it's its number one supplier. We should all hope that finally the MBA is really challenged. Competition will bring much better MBAs to us, as Apple does respond to competition even though it has OS X to rely on.

I want Samsung's new line of notebooks to challenge MacBooks at all levels, and once the price matches the competition can begin. I would love to see Samsung challenge with high resolution retina-like displays in notebooks, lightweight materials and thin form factors, cutting edge technologies, and finally compatibility between devices and services.

I don't get all of the ridiculous trash talk against Samsung, as this isn't grade school and neither Samsung nor Apple benefits from the name calling. Competition WILL drive better Macs, and every time Samsung wins a small battle Apple will take notice. Whether it's a 400-nit bright display, a cool forward thinking design, or even just USB 3.0 making its way into the competition it will drive Apple to improve the MBA where it needs to.

I hope Apple rethinks the backlit keyboard, goes ahead with USB 3.0, adopts even better LCDs, and even goes with duralumin or some similar black design. The MBA is great, but IT CAN BE BETTER! And competition can twist Apple's hand faster than we can!

gnasher729
Mar 24, 2011, 12:25 PM
Most arguments are one liners - "it's not a Mac." or "it has windows." who cares. If it works for those that want it and does what it needs to do - don't go knock'n on a product just cause you are a sheep.

The last sentence comes quite close to an ad hominem attack.

But seriously, the hardware is not comparable with the MBA 13" because of the lower screen resolution. The cheapest model is more expensive than the most expensive 13" and a lot more expensive than the 11" which has the same resolution in much smaller size. MBA has some other fine details like the magnet power connector, the best mousepad anywhere, being able to use the optical drive of any other computer.

So even if you want a pure windows machine and have to add the price of a Windows license to the MBA, the Samsung is competitive, but in no way beating the MBA. And Windows users willing to shell out $1650 for a laptop are a rare breed, as Dell found with the Adamo (you could get one for $999 in the fire sale when they stopped selling it).

cube
Mar 24, 2011, 12:40 PM
There aren't dimensions on Toshiba's site but in my eyes, it seems to be closer to 13" MBP's form factor, not MBA's.



And what is the need for it then? The people who buy MBAs don't need it. I know you are going to say that it can be used for file transfers but how many have an external storage solution with Gigabit Ethernet? I bet not that many, USB is sufficient for most people. Besides, it will be useless when Thunderbolt and/or USB 3.0 is added.



I also said:



That is what I said first. Yes, there must be netbook with ODDs but they are inferior in all other ways then. If ODD is taking 1/3 of the innards, there is simply no space for other parts. Sure you can put an Atom in there but then it isn't comparable with MBA anymore.

The Porteges are very light. That's what matters, not if it's a bit thicker.

You don't need a gigabit NAS. Network backup to a local FW or USB drive would be painful without gigabit ethernet. Even tape drives from old generations are much faster than 100 mbps. File transfers between computers can easily take advantage of gigabit ethernet, too.


When the MBA comes with Thunderbolt it won't be crippled in this regard, just inconvenient.

KPOM
Mar 24, 2011, 01:32 PM
The Porteges are very light. That's what matters, not if it's a bit thicker.


Not necessarily. Thickness counts, too. I can't get a 1" thick notebook (or even one that's .68" all around like the Samsung) into the document pocket of my notebook case, nor will it fit into the front pocket of my luggage.

radiohead14
Mar 24, 2011, 02:15 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EaKWHvUASgk

i hope the refresh comes with sandy bridge tho!

Apple loves Samsung as it's its number one supplier. We should all hope that finally the MBA is really challenged. Competition will bring much better MBAs to us, as Apple does respond to competition even though it has OS X to rely on.

I want Samsung's new line of notebooks to challenge MacBooks at all levels, and once the price matches the competition can begin. I would love to see Samsung challenge with high resolution retina-like displays in notebooks, lightweight materials and thin form factors, cutting edge technologies, and finally compatibility between devices and services.

I don't get all of the ridiculous trash talk against Samsung, as this isn't grade school and neither Samsung nor Apple benefits from the name calling. Competition WILL drive better Macs, and every time Samsung wins a small battle Apple will take notice. Whether it's a 400-nit bright display, a cool forward thinking design, or even just USB 3.0 making its way into the competition it will drive Apple to improve the MBA where it needs to.

I hope Apple rethinks the backlit keyboard, goes ahead with USB 3.0, adopts even better LCDs, and even goes with duralumin or some similar black design. The MBA is great, but IT CAN BE BETTER! And competition can twist Apple's hand faster than we can!

gasp! an open minded post with some sense! you don't belong here... :D

but for reals.. if the air gets the backlit keys back, thunderbolt or usb 3, and an updated cpu.. that's when i'll upgrade from my santa rosa mbp

LarryC
Mar 24, 2011, 06:11 PM
I was preparing a reasoned response, but I see you are nothing but a massive Apple Fanboy, who would never respond to that. So Im going to stop talking to you now.

Saying Windows is 'Wrong, Yucky, Disgusting, Evil, Foul, unnecessary' is frankly laughable. Comparing running OS X in VMware to 'dumping my wife for a whore' is simply ridiculous.

And questioning my morals, because I installed a legal, purchased copy of Snow Leopard on my PC to fool around with..

Wow.... just wow.....

I really do like the way you think!

Twe Foju
Mar 25, 2011, 11:19 AM
ugh, at a point i was really exited for the Samsung 9 series until i found out they are still not using a dedicated graphics like Air

if only they stuff the same 320M as with Air, i would have choose the Samsung hands down

but then again, with this, i am hoping that the next Air will also be a Sandy Bridge Processor and maybe a GT330M Nvidia :D

DVD9
Mar 25, 2011, 02:06 PM
Laptop Magazine did an unboxing (http://blog.laptopmag.com/samsung-series-9-unboxed-from-its-stylish-packaging) of the 9 Series.

Then they tested the boot against the Air (http://blog.laptopmag.com/samsung-series-9-notebook-boots-faster-than-macbook-air).

Twenty-four seconds for the 9 Series.

Twenty seven seconds for the Air.

ritmomundo
Mar 25, 2011, 02:12 PM
Laptop Magazine did an unboxing (http://blog.laptopmag.com/samsung-series-9-unboxed-from-its-stylish-packaging) of the 9 Series.

Then they tested the boot against the Air (http://blog.laptopmag.com/samsung-series-9-notebook-boots-faster-than-macbook-air).

Twenty-four seconds for the 9 Series.

Twenty seven seconds for the Air.

You missed something tho. Right under the video, they've got written: "It’s worth noting that the MacBook Air booted in 15 seconds when we first tested it. It’s no longer at the fresh install stage now whereas the Series 9 is almost right out of the box."

Sayer
Mar 25, 2011, 02:29 PM
The OP deliberately, or unknowingly, used a form of propaganda called technical jargon.

Duralumin is a trade name for an aluminum alloy originally developed over 100 years ago. A common alloy in the Duralumin line, used in aircraft, today is known as 2024. Apple has said they use "aircraft quality" aluminum for the unibody designs.

So using an obsolete trade name for the family of aluminum alloys is somehow turned into being "better" than what Apple is using. Even though Apple is already using pretty much that type of "superior" alloy. 2024 is expensive, more than likely the copycats are using lesser quality alloys to save costs, which is still technically a Duralumin alloy.

I also expect battery life to be terrible on this copycat, plus all the fun with real virus/adware/spyware threats and not the hobgoblin straw man arguments that Macs *could* get as many viruses and other exploits, they just don't because of their invisible marketshare. Also, Linux.

X2468
Mar 25, 2011, 07:08 PM
I ignore Apple Tax since I prefer OS X hands down.

Eidorian
Mar 25, 2011, 07:11 PM
ugh, at a point i was really exited for the Samsung 9 series until i found out they are still not using a dedicated graphics like Air

if only they stuff the same 320M as with Air, i would have choose the Samsung hands down

but then again, with this, i am hoping that the next Air will also be a Sandy Bridge Processor and maybe a GT330M Nvidia :DYou will more than likely be greeting the Intel HD 3000.

I have to commend Samsung for that 400-nit display.

iRun26.2
Mar 25, 2011, 08:19 PM
You will more than likely be greeting the Intel HD 3000.

I have to commend Samsung for that 400-nit display.

Does anybody know what the intensity (compared to 400-nits) is of the MBA screens (11.6" and 13.3")?

The 400-nits of the Samsung is a brilliant selling point. Who cares if you get 1-hour of battery power at 400-nits (just a guess). The option of that bright of a screen would be awesome!

ritmomundo
Mar 25, 2011, 08:29 PM
Laptop Magazine did an unboxing (http://blog.laptopmag.com/samsung-series-9-unboxed-from-its-stylish-packaging) of the 9 Series.

Then they tested the boot against the Air (http://blog.laptopmag.com/samsung-series-9-notebook-boots-faster-than-macbook-air).

Twenty-four seconds for the 9 Series.

Twenty seven seconds for the Air.

You missed something tho. Right under the video, they've got written: "It’s worth noting that the MacBook Air booted in 15 seconds when we first tested it. It’s no longer at the fresh install stage now whereas the Series 9 is almost right out of the box."

BTW, I just tested my MBA 11" (base model with upgraded ssd) which I bought in November, and I get a startup time of ~18 seconds and a shut down time of less than 3 seconds. It's snappy-ness still makes me smile :)

KPOM
Mar 25, 2011, 08:50 PM
Laptop Magazine did an unboxing (http://blog.laptopmag.com/samsung-series-9-unboxed-from-its-stylish-packaging) of the 9 Series.

Then they tested the boot against the Air (http://blog.laptopmag.com/samsung-series-9-notebook-boots-faster-than-macbook-air).

Twenty-four seconds for the 9 Series.

Twenty seven seconds for the Air.

The Air shut down in 2/3 of the time as the 9 series, and woke from sleep twice as fast.

Spin aside, though, both notebooks are pretty speedy.

Cheffy Dave
Mar 25, 2011, 11:42 PM
If it trips your trigger, buy it,and don't troll . We love the MBA, don't want WINDOZE,, whatever it has, it doesnt have OSX, and frankly, we have no interest:eek:

2IS
Mar 26, 2011, 12:03 AM
What's this "we" business? There are MBA users that think the Samsung is rather nice and think Windows 7 > OSX

AppleScruff1
Mar 26, 2011, 03:41 AM
Samsung has poor customer support. They forget their customers once they have sold the product. See what is happening to the poor 7-inch Galaxy Tab users - not even Android 2.3 upgrade for them.


I'd like to hear some of your customer support stories concerning Samsung. Which products did you have problems with and what response did you get from customer service?


Samsung Series 9 could be the best non-Apple laptop out there. Not better than Air for many people, though. People like me.

The software side is obvious. Let's go to hardware. Air's industrial design is still unmatched. The Samsung may have a better material, but that's no MacBook unibody. Spec-wise, I'd choose Core 2 Duo + NVIDIA 320M over Sandy Bridge + Intel intergrated.

And again, price.


What happens when the MBA gets Intel graphics on the next upgrade like the 13" Macbook Pro just did?


The day one of these 'me too' laptops can natively run OS X is the day we can have a relevant and meaningful discussion about comparative specs and design in relation to an MBA.

As for this latest pretender, it's a Samsung. Ugh. QC issues every week of ownership you can bet. Plus I'd be taking a blade to that awful ugly typographic logo on the lid if I was unfortunate or deluded enough to buy one of these.


So you've had problems with your Samsung products too? As I asked the poster in the first quote in this reply, what products did you own and what were the problems you encountered?


OS X is the Holy Grail and Windows is just a stinky plate of haggis. :D



it's ***** ;)

Have you checked on out yet and played around with it? What is the build quality compared to the MBA? How do the trackpads compare? What about it did you find to be inferior? Thanks.


Samsung has been and always been a pretty damn good company. They have really stepped it up in their new product lineup for PC owners...

Either you are a Apple diehard fanatic or not - you have to appreciate quality when you see it.

Most arguments are one liners - "it's not a Mac." or "it has windows." who cares. If it works for those that want it and does what it needs to do - don't go knock'n on a product just cause you are a sheep.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I'd like to know how many of those who posted negative comments have actually seen and used the Samsung.


Apple loves Samsung as it's its number one supplier. We should all hope that finally the MBA is really challenged. Competition will bring much better MBAs to us, as Apple does respond to competition even though it has OS X to rely on.

I want Samsung's new line of notebooks to challenge MacBooks at all levels, and once the price matches the competition can begin. I would love to see Samsung challenge with high resolution retina-like displays in notebooks, lightweight materials and thin form factors, cutting edge technologies, and finally compatibility between devices and services.

I don't get all of the ridiculous trash talk against Samsung, as this isn't grade school and neither Samsung nor Apple benefits from the name calling. Competition WILL drive better Macs, and every time Samsung wins a small battle Apple will take notice. Whether it's a 400-nit bright display, a cool forward thinking design, or even just USB 3.0 making its way into the competition it will drive Apple to improve the MBA where it needs to.

I hope Apple rethinks the backlit keyboard, goes ahead with USB 3.0, adopts even better LCDs, and even goes with duralumin or some similar black design. The MBA is great, but IT CAN BE BETTER! And competition can twist Apple's hand faster than we can!


There you go, being logical, rational and open minded. What good is USB 3? Isn't it better to have only USB 2?


If it trips your trigger, buy it,and don't troll . We love the MBA, don't want WINDOZE,, whatever it has, it doesnt have OSX, and frankly, we have no interest:eek:

What do you mean we? Do you have a mouse in your pocket? The MBA is a great product. Perhaps the Samsung will be too, perhaps not. I hope it is a good one to raise the bar a level so that the next MBA is even better.

drbf
Mar 26, 2011, 12:44 PM
[QUOTE=yanksrock100;12185583]But its $100 more than the 13 ultimate.
It only has a 1.4 ghz processor, has pretty much the same resolution as the 11 IN AIR, and has less storage.

And the icing on the cake.......
Windows.

So, is it really "better"?
no


I agree......

noripwr
Mar 27, 2011, 04:22 AM
I would love to see Samsung challenge with high resolution retina-like displays in notebooks, lightweight materials and thin form factors, cutting edge technologies, and finally compatibility between devices and services.

I don't get all of the ridiculous trash talk against Samsung, as this isn't grade school and neither Samsung nor Apple benefits from the name calling. Competition WILL drive better Macs, and every time Samsung wins a small battle Apple will take notice. Whether it's a 400-nit bright display, a cool forward thinking design, or even just USB 3.0 making its way into the competition it will drive Apple to improve the MBA where it needs to.

I hope Apple rethinks the backlit keyboard, goes ahead with USB 3.0, adopts even better LCDs, and even goes with duralumin or some similar black design. The MBA is great, but IT CAN BE BETTER! And competition can twist Apple's hand faster than we can!


I like Samsung (when it comes to TVs) but I hate to break it to you there. Samsung challenge with high-resolution displays? The series 9 doesn't even have a comparable display to the Air. 400-nit display is neat, but IMHO I feel the MBA is plenty bright.

USB3.0 was great, but with such slow adoption rate compared to USB2.0, I think we should just hope for Thunderbolt instead. Heck I even read that Sony is thinking of putting Thunderbolt in their next few laptops. That surely is a quick response.

And duralumin. I hate how that's complete marketing gimmick bs to sell a product. And though a black macbook would be neat, I feel that the aluminum look is [now] iconic to Apple, and the only way they can shift to a different color is to bring the transition to the [next] MBP like they did with the shift to unibody.

And about the Series-9. Won't Samsung get into trouble with those kind of ports? I thought Apple had a patent on movable I/O ports. And the specs? Do people not realize that the current MBA was released back in October 2010? Sandy Bridge [of today] wasn't available then! Also, what about the argument that Apple macbooks were retarded because they didn't have user-replaceable batteries? Hey! I'm just saying.

Hellhammer
Mar 27, 2011, 04:26 AM
USB3.0 was great, but with such slow adoption rate compared to USB2.0, I think we should just hope for Thunderbolt instead. Heck I even read that Sony is thinking of putting Thunderbolt in their next few laptops. That surely is a quick response.

And what about the adoption rate of Thunderbolt? Currently Apple is the only company that uses Thunderbolt. The only use for it at the moment is Mini DisplayPort adapters. USB 3.0 is already widely available and an externals HD with USB 3.0 doesn't cost much more than one with USB 2.0. Sure, some TB externals have been announced but they are still months away and the price is unknown.

Faux Carnival
Mar 27, 2011, 05:15 AM
Won't you Apple fanboys appreciate stuff that is good?

This clearly crushes MBA.

- Much better display
- Thinner, lighter
- Arguably better looking
- Again arguably: No slanted design
- Very powerful Sandy Bridge processors
- Boots faster (an argument used widely by Mac users for decades)
- USB 3.0
- HDMI

When it comes to graphics, GT 320M is a tiny bit faster than Intel HD 3000. But it runs so much hotter. (Obviously because it's not integrated) And MBA will lose the external graphics when it's updated. (Look at Macbook Pro 13")

When it comes to Windows, I have nothing to say. It's just personal preference but admit this: Windows 7 is the best Windows ever, it is super stable, fast and reliable. Looks pretty damn good too. Plus, Mac OS X doesn't even have SSD Trim feature. At least not yet. (It'll come with Lion)

Hellhammer
Mar 27, 2011, 05:26 AM
- Much better display

Depends what you find better. Yes, it is brighter but the resolution is awful compared to 13" MBA's. Personally, I prefer the better resolution because I never use the screen at maximum brightness anyway.

- Thinner, lighter

It has already been said several times that it is not really thinner. Yes, it is thinner at the thickest point but MBA is significantly thinner at the thinnest point. It's very marginally lighter too.

- Arguably better looking
- Again arguably: No slanted design

Both are just your opinions, so you can't say it is generally better because you find it better looking. I like the slanted design

When it comes to graphics, GT 320M is a tiny bit faster than Intel HD 3000. But it runs so much hotter. (Obviously because it's not integrated)

320M is integrated as well. You can't say it runs hotter unless you have actually used both machines. My 13" MBA runs very cool.

Plus, Mac OS X doesn't even have SSD Trim feature. At least not yet. (It'll come with Lion)

Can be enabled in 10.6.7 with TRIM Enabler, I have done that with my MBA.

I'm not saying the Samsung is not good but I'm just correcting your arguments of it being better. Both have their pros and cons, like always.

Faux Carnival
Mar 27, 2011, 05:38 AM
Of course both have their pros and cons. I'm just saying Samsung 9 Series isn't crap like some people say. They should admit that competition is heating up. It is definitely a strong competitor to MBA and being one of the first Windows laptops, which actually looks good and elite, it will steal lots of customers.

Dr McKay
Mar 27, 2011, 06:46 AM
There you go, being logical, rational and open minded. What good is USB 3? Isn't it better to have only USB 2

If you were going to have USB, I'd say it'd be better to have USB 3, all USB 2 devices will work fine on it. And if you get a USB device, like an external hard drive, you'll see the speed benefits of 10x faster transfer.

Not as fast as Thunderbolt, but I'm just going on is it better to have USB 3 or 2.

Akira1980
Mar 27, 2011, 10:17 AM
In the end, get Samsung if you want Windows. And get Apple if you want OSX. I don't think you can go wrong with either one. But I think MBA looks nicer. :D

KohPhiPhi
Mar 27, 2011, 11:47 AM
I personally find this Samsung such a good deal actually: other than the processor, this is inferior than the MBA, and the low screen resolution would be a deal-breaker for me. Besides, this thing is not thinner and certainly not better looking than the MBA. Top that off with the fact that it's more expensive and... well, like I said it's not such a great deal.

Plus it's Windows...

votdfak
Mar 27, 2011, 12:14 PM
Parallel worlds.

In every segment of market you can always get much higher speced out Windows laptop, but it's not Apple.

I think that majority of people working in IT will end up with Apple at the end. It's evolutionary process.

LarryC
Mar 27, 2011, 05:09 PM
http://nexus404.com/Blog/2011/03/27/11-6-inch-samsung-series-9-notebook-to-cost-1199-to-rival-the-macbook-air-in-pricing-too-samsung%E2%80%99s-series-9-ultra-portable-windows-7-notebook-confirmed-to-bear-an-impressive-price-tag-1/

11.6-inch Samsung Series 9 Notebook to Cost $1,199, to Rival the MacBook Air in Pricing Too? [Samsung’s Series 9 Ultra-Portable Windows 7 Notebook Confirmed to Bear an Impressive Price Tag: $1,199]

Read: 11.6-inch Samsung Series 9 Notebook to Cost $1,199, to Rival the MacBook Air in Pricing Too? [Samsung’s Series 9 Ultra-Portable Windows 7 Notebook Confirmed to Bear an Impressive Price Tag: $1,199]

KPOM
Mar 27, 2011, 05:25 PM
The pricing of the 11" Samsung pretty much validates the MacBook Air pricing. The Samsung has a nicer processor, slightly lesser graphics, the same screen resolution, an extra USB port, HDMI, and Ethernet, and the same size SSD, and costs $200 more. It's expensive to make something of the same caliber as an Apple.

I think the main limitation of the 11" Samsung (besides the OS) is the 64GB SSD. Apple offers a 128GB model of the 11", and I think Samsung will need to, as well. Windows takes up more space than OS X, so 64GB is extra tight.

noripwr
Mar 27, 2011, 05:27 PM
- Arguably better looking
- Very powerful Sandy Bridge processors
- Boots faster (an argument used widely by Mac users for decades)



It doesn't boot faster. If anything, that video performance test was biased. I have loads more apps installed and a bunch of things on my menu bar yet my MBA boots in seconds. Again, unfair to say it crushes anything when you're comparing a newly released product to something that is 5 months old, which in the tech geeky world is ooooold. :D

Although it looks really nice, I don't dig the sides. The profile view of the machine isn't sexy at all.


I've used sammy laptops/netbooks before and although great-looking craftsmanship, their quality on the other hand begs to differ. Who knows. Maybe they've upped the ante on quality too.




And what about the adoption rate of Thunderbolt? Currently Apple is the only company that uses Thunderbolt. The only use for it at the moment is Mini DisplayPort adapters. USB 3.0 is already widely available and an externals HD with USB 3.0 doesn't cost much more than one with USB 2.0. Sure, some TB externals have been announced but they are still months away and the price is unknown.


Of course we don't know the adoption rate of TB but with Sony jumping onto it so quick and with Intel backing it, I'm inclined to believe that TB will become industry acceptance. I see a lot of USB3 externals out there. My GoFlex is a USB3 ext. drive and although my MBA can't utilize the speeds, my pc desktop can. Still, with TB offering greater bandwidth than usb3, shouldn't we be encouraging its growth? It's not like our usb2.0 drives will suddenly become usb3.0 capable without 'any' changes.

AppleScruff1
Mar 27, 2011, 05:29 PM
If you were going to have USB, I'd say it'd be better to have USB 3, all USB 2 devices will work fine on it. And if you get a USB device, like an external hard drive, you'll see the speed benefits of 10x faster transfer.

Not as fast as Thunderbolt, but I'm just going on is it better to have USB 3 or 2.


I was being sarcastic. :D Of course USB 3 is better to have than USB 2 since it's backwards compatible. I just think it's bone headed for Apple not to include it, that's all.


I personally find this Samsung such a good deal actually: other than the processor, this is inferior than the MBA, and the low screen resolution would be a deal-breaker for me. Besides, this thing is not thinner and certainly not better looking than the MBA. Top that off with the fact that it's more expensive and... well, like I said it's not such a great deal.

Plus it's Windows...

Don't forget that the Samsung has a 3 year warranty too. Have you ever used the Samsung? I'd like to hear about your experience with it. Is the screen really bad? How bad is Windows 7? Did you have a lot of problems with it crashing? Thanks.

LarryC
Mar 27, 2011, 05:50 PM
The pricing of the 11" Samsung pretty much validates the MacBook Air pricing. The Samsung has a nicer processor, slightly lesser graphics, the same screen resolution, an extra USB port, HDMI, and Ethernet, and the same size SSD, and costs $200 more. It's expensive to make something of the same caliber as an Apple.

I think the main limitation of the 11" Samsung (besides the OS) is the 64GB SSD. Apple offers a 128GB model of the 11", and I think Samsung will need to, as well. Windows takes up more space than OS X, so 64GB is extra tight.

It just seems kind of odd that Samsung would offer a product that is such a copy of the Air and try to go head to head with Apple when Samsung and Apple are kind of business partners? I may be wrong about that, but I thought I had read somewhere that Apple has invested with Samsung to manufacture LCD panels? It might have been something else and it might have not even been Samsung :D If so, then please forgive my mindless ranting. I have one more thing to say about the Mac Book Air vs the Samsung something. I really don't think that any company is gonna out-apple Apple. I hope that makes sense. It does to me, but then again I'm medicated.

bmat
Mar 27, 2011, 05:58 PM
I only have macs, and I have a ton of them. And this notebook looks very nice to me. It doesn't matter to me if Windows users get a nice form factor. The more competition the better.

LarryC
Mar 27, 2011, 06:01 PM
I only have macs, and I have a ton of them. And this notebook looks very nice to me. It doesn't matter to me if Windows users get a nice form factor. The more competition the better.

That is an excellent point. More competition means we get better products and better prices. Sounds like the best of both worlds.

munkery
Mar 27, 2011, 06:07 PM
I think I read somewhere that Samsung is one of Apples main suppliers for OEM parts; specifically, the OEM SSDs often come from Samsung.

I guess Samsung looked at the MBAs and saw a market to make similar machines that run Windows. Many individuals in the Business sector may like the form factor of the MBAs but really only need dedicated Windows PCs.

I believe that Samsung is the largest supplier of OEM SSDs to all PC manufacturers (not sure about this). So, Apple does not really have any means to react against Samsung making this type of machine given the situation.

AppleScruff1
Mar 27, 2011, 06:07 PM
I only have macs, and I have a ton of them. And this notebook looks very nice to me. It doesn't matter to me if Windows users get a nice form factor. The more competition the better.

Competition is generally good for consumers, we get better products at fair prices, as long as it doesn't lead to cut throat prices so that quality and service suffer.

LarryC
Mar 27, 2011, 06:10 PM
I think I read somewhere that Samsung is one of Apples main suppliers for OEM parts; specifically, the OEM SSDs often come from Samsung.

I guess Samsung looked at the MBAs and saw a market to make similar machines that run Windows. Many individuals in the Business sector may like the form factor of the MBAs but really only need dedicated Windows PCs.

I believe that Samsung is the largest supplier of OEM SSDs to all PC manufacturers (not sure about this). So, Apple does not really have any means to react against Samsung making this type of machine given the situation.

Thank you. I knew that I had read something that said they do business with each other. I just couldn't remember what it was.

Mr Slippy IV
Mar 27, 2011, 06:15 PM
I dunno, when you look at it form the side, it doesnt look so great anymore.

+1. The angle of the product shots makes all the difference. Sadly, everything we see isn't quite what it's cracked up to be.

AppleScruff1
Mar 27, 2011, 07:06 PM
+1. The angle of the product shots makes all the difference. Sadly, everything we see isn't quite what it's cracked up to be.

Form over function.

fyrefly
Mar 27, 2011, 09:49 PM
I think I read somewhere that Samsung is one of Apples main suppliers for OEM parts; specifically, the OEM SSDs often come from Samsung.

I guess Samsung looked at the MBAs and saw a market to make similar machines that run Windows. Many individuals in the Business sector may like the form factor of the MBAs but really only need dedicated Windows PCs.

I believe that Samsung is the largest supplier of OEM SSDs to all PC manufacturers (not sure about this). So, Apple does not really have any means to react against Samsung making this type of machine given the situation.

This used to be the case, and while Samsung definitely supplies a bunch of OEM parts (RAM Chips, SSD Storage chips), the Actual Apple SSDs are largely made by Toshiba these days.

Look at your system profiler. If you have a MBA or a 2010/2011 MBP with SSD, it says APPLE SSD TS128C (most likely). That TS = Toshiba.

The older (slower SSD) MBA's from 2008-2009 were Samsung SSDs, they said "SM128" as their SSD

chaoticbear
Mar 27, 2011, 11:53 PM
Wait, what brightness level do y'all use? Unless I'm in a really bright room or on my porch, mine stays at one bar. Right now, I'm in my bed, and if there were a half-bar setting, I'd be using it.

And to amend my previous statement about aesthetics, most of the promo pictures show the profile view, which I think is uggs. The rest of the body is fairly attractive. If the silver on MBA/MBP weren't so iconic and ingrained in my head, I'd consider that finish if it were an option.

Hellhammer
Mar 28, 2011, 08:37 AM
Of course we don't know the adoption rate of TB but with Sony jumping onto it so quick and with Intel backing it, I'm inclined to believe that TB will become industry acceptance. I see a lot of USB3 externals out there. My GoFlex is a USB3 ext. drive and although my MBA can't utilize the speeds, my pc desktop can. Still, with TB offering greater bandwidth than usb3, shouldn't we be encouraging its growth? It's not like our usb2.0 drives will suddenly become usb3.0 capable without 'any' changes.

Intel said we won't see PCs with TB before late 2011 or more likely early 2012. It doesn't really matter if TB provides greater performance in theory because an average Joe will not be able to take advantage of it. Mechanical HDs top out at 150MB/s, something that USB 3.0 can very easily provide.

That is why I don't see TB being that big deal. USB 3.0 will be integrated into Intel's 7-series (i.e. Ivy Bridge) chipsets while there are no news about TB integration. It is theoretically cool but for an average Joe, USB 3.0 provides the same things. Here and today and relatively cheap.

Voondebah
Mar 28, 2011, 02:17 PM
Just read Engadget's review for the samsung series 9, and here are their benchmark results:

Samsung Series 9 (Core i5-2537M)
PCMarkVantage: 7582 3Dmark06: 2240

13-inch MacBook Air (Core 2 Duo, GeForce 320M)
PCMarkVantage: 5170 3Dmark06: 4643


Better CPU, but worse graphics. Suppose it depends on your needs.

Off-Topic: I imagine the Sandy Bridge Macbook Air (if it happens) would have similar specs to the samsung, so this is probably a good indicator of what kind of performance trade-offs we can expect.

Personally, I think I'll be buying a current gen macbook air independent of any refresh.

halledise
Mar 28, 2011, 02:39 PM
Just read Engadget's review for the samsung series 9, and here are their benchmark results:

Samsung Series 9 (Core i5-2537M)
PCMarkVantage: 7582 3Dmark06: 2240

13-inch MacBook Air (Core 2 Duo, GeForce 320M)
PCMarkVantage: 5170 3Dmark06: 4643


Better CPU, but worse graphics. Suppose it depends on your needs.

Off-Topic: I imagine the Sandy Bridge Macbook Air (if it happens) would have similar specs to the samsung, so this is probably a good indicator of what kind of performance trade-offs we can expect.

Personally, I think I'll be buying a current gen macbook air independent of any refresh.

quote from Engadget's review:

"Like most of Samsung's laptops, the Series 9 is preloaded with a bit of the company's own utilities. Listed under Samsung in the Start menu are Easy File Share, Easy Migration, Easy Network Management, and other "Easy" tools.
Shockingly, the rest of the system is pretty bare on third-party software … … …

But just as we're about to say the Series 9 hits it out of the park, we're hit in the face with its $1,649 price tag.
No matter how you slice it, this ultraportable is still meant for a niche user who's willing to shell out over $1,600 for a laptop (although, we are seeing it listed for $1,599 at Best Buy).
And while it may have more processing power than Apple's 13-inch MacBook Air and a backlit keyboard, Apple's offering shaves off $350, has a higher resolution display, slightly longer battery life, stronger graphics performance, and a better multitouch touchpad experience, and ultimately, we assume that will be enough for those seeking an incredibly thin laptop. That said, the Series 9 has the horsepower to be one's main system and finally proves that PC manufacturers can build an incredibly thin, head-turning laptop without sacrificing the vitals. And well, despite the Samsung tax, that's quite a feat."

all that said, it looks like *****, only runs Windows, and you'd need to buy many $ worth of software to be functional on the thing.
the rubbery feel to the touchpad would also drive me nuts.

for the full review go here >> ****************Xjh3A

fyrefly
Mar 28, 2011, 04:22 PM
Just read Engadget's review for the samsung series 9, and here are their benchmark results:

Samsung Series 9 (Core i5-2537M)
PCMarkVantage: 7582 3Dmark06: 2240

13-inch MacBook Air (Core 2 Duo, GeForce 320M)
PCMarkVantage: 5170 3Dmark06: 4643


Better CPU, but worse graphics. Suppose it depends on your needs.

Off-Topic: I imagine the Sandy Bridge Macbook Air (if it happens) would have similar specs to the samsung, so this is probably a good indicator of what kind of performance trade-offs we can expect.

Personally, I think I'll be buying a current gen macbook air independent of any refresh.

That 3DMark06 score is around the 9400m's score (http://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-Update-Apple-MacBook-Aluminium-Unibody-13-9400M.12533.0.html).

So the pessimistic way to look at it, is that you get 1/2 the Graphics capabilities with the lower-clocked HD 3000 graphics vs. the 320M.

But with only 17W TDP, instead of ~25W TDP, you'd get 30%+ CPU boost and potentially a 30% battery life improvement (imagine the Apple PR taglines now - 30% faster... and it lasts 30% longer!)

It'll be interesting to see if Apple is willing to take that trade-off, performance-wise. It would definitely be a good $$ decision for them - the SB chipset on it's own (if we're looking at the i5-2537M) costs $250 vs. $284/$316 for the SL9X00's that are currently in the air. Add in, say another $10-15 minimum for the 320M chip, as we're looking at a savings of $50-$60/machine in build costs for Apple.

If Apple's selling 1.1 Million of these things per quarter, that means $50-$60 Million dollars saved every 4 months if Apple put the i5 into the MBA.

GekkePrutser
Mar 28, 2011, 04:33 PM
Just read Engadget's review for the samsung series 9, and here are their benchmark results:

Samsung Series 9 (Core i5-2537M)
PCMarkVantage: 7582 3Dmark06: 2240

13-inch MacBook Air (Core 2 Duo, GeForce 320M)
PCMarkVantage: 5170 3Dmark06: 4643


As I mentioned in another topic (but forgot which one :) ), the 2537M is a 1.4Ghz Ultra-Low voltage cpu that you'd normally find in the 11", that's compared here to a 13" with 1.83Ghz Low Voltage one. Which makes the CPU gain even more impressive.

Of course, it depends on the benchmark, I'm not sure if this benchmark (PCMarkVantage) is multi- or singlethreaded. If it's singlethreaded, it would see a huge benefit from the Turbo Boost feature, which the current C2D CPU's in the Air don't have. But not all applications in daily usage would benefit from Turbo Boost (for example, if they're multithreaded). But I'm glad to see the performance gain is definitely there.

Scottsdale
Mar 28, 2011, 05:04 PM
As I mentioned in another topic (but forgot which one :) ), the 2537M is a 1.4Ghz Ultra-Low voltage cpu that you'd normally find in the 11", that's compared here to a 13" with 1.83Ghz Low Voltage one. Which makes the CPU gain even more impressive.

Of course, it depends on the benchmark, I'm not sure if this benchmark (PCMarkVantage) is multi- or singlethreaded. If it's singlethreaded, it would see a huge benefit from the Turbo Boost feature, which the current C2D CPU's in the Air don't have. But not all applications in daily usage would benefit from Turbo Boost (for example, if they're multithreaded). But I'm glad to see the performance gain is definitely there.

What makes the CPU impressive to me is the rumor that Apple is going to use a similar chip, disable the IGP, over clock the crap out of it (possible since none of the power needs reserved for the IGP), and use an AMD discrete GPU with it. I see this as a lower power consumption than current MBAs, better CPU, better GPU, and shear destruction of the competition.

Even though a member above doesn't think Thunderbolt has any point as he is only seeing it as connectivity for spinning disks, it actually brings single cable solutions to docking stations otherwise known as the ACD. The ACD could have FireWire or USB 3.0 on it along with speakers, a 27" display, webcam, and etc and alll run off one Thunderbolt cable... In addition, the future bandwidth capabilities with the exact same current ports further the argument. Thunderbolt is something we all want we just all don't know it yet. Imagine your MBA doesn't have FireWire or USB 3.0, but it has Thunderbolt and therefore it could still run those ports. It is the great foresight at getting future tech to work on Macs released today that makes Thunderbolt so incredible.

Or even imagine a discrete GPU built into a docking station or ACD. Now even though your MBA is stuck with an Intel IGP, when docked it could have an expansion port allowing you to use an AMD discrete GPU. It is way more than a way to get data to and from your spinning disks... It is all I mentioned and way more plus will even do the spinning disks at their full capabilities simultaneously. I really look forward to having future capabilities on Macs I buy today, and Thunderbolt will actually achieve it.

Mr. Savage
Mar 28, 2011, 05:35 PM
Wait, what brightness level do y'all use? Unless I'm in a really bright room or on my porch, mine stays at one bar. Right now, I'm in my bed, and if there were a half-bar setting, I'd be using it.


There is better than that: quarter-increments. Option, Shift, brightness key.

AppleScruff1
Mar 28, 2011, 08:05 PM
I hope Anandtech does an in depth test of the Samsung and compares it to the MBA. They'll do a much more in depth review and better comparison.

chaoticbear
Mar 28, 2011, 08:06 PM
There is better than that: quarter-increments. Option, Shift, brightness key.

Holy. Jesus.

There is a shortcut for EVERYTHING on Macs. I learn a new one in every thread I read.

I know there are fairly comprehensive guides to all the common ones, but is there a comprehensive list of all the weird ones that no one ever needs, until they do?

The most obscure one I use on a regular basis is Apple+Shift+(and Apple+Shift+]) for switching between browser tabs.

iRun26.2
Mar 28, 2011, 09:12 PM
Or even imagine a discrete GPU built into a docking station or ACD. Now even though your MBA is stuck with an Intel IGP, when docked it could have an expansion port allowing you to use an AMD discrete GPU. It is way more than a way to get data to and from your spinning disks... It is all I mentioned and way more plus will even do the spinning disks at their full capabilities simultaneously. I really look forward to having future capabilities on Macs I buy today, and Thunderbolt will actually achieve it.

Of all the comments on future possibilities that Scottsdale has written, this is the most intriguing one ever for me. I'm sure someone will come up with some technical reason as to why this wouldn't make sense but I can't think of any at this time.

I would really like a Sandy Bridge MBA but I think I would be very unhappy going backwards in the GPU performance with Intel's IGP (the video performance we have with the current MBA is amazing). I would, however be OK with the Intel IGP if I had the option to improve it significantly with a GPU on the ACD via Thunderbolt. I currently don't own an ACD but I am very certain that I will be getting one in the future for work.

I also wonder if the limitations of the (relatively) small SSD on the MBAs could also be augmented using the same Thunderbolt connection. I would be more than a docking station...it would be a computer upgrade made simply via the Thunderbolt connection: Incredible fast external storage, improved graphics when using the ADC.

(And, if this was available, it wouldn't matter if Thunderbolt didn't connect to any other peripheral. If it just connected to my ACD that would be fine)

Hellhammer
Mar 29, 2011, 01:26 AM
Of all the comments on future possibilities that Scottsdale has written, this is the most intriguing one ever for me. I'm sure someone will come up with some technical reason as to why this wouldn't make sense but I can't think of any at this time.

Thunderbolt is only 10Gb/s, that is the issue. PCIe 2.x x16 slot provides 64Gb/s. It's hard to say how much the limited bandwidth would affect performance but at least higher-end GPUs would be crippled by that. Probably a great bump over the IGP though.

I'm not saying TB isn't great but for a regular user, it doesn't provide much that DP + USB 3.0 combo wouldn't. I'm just afraid that the prices of TB peripherals will hefty.

Scottsdale
Mar 29, 2011, 02:36 AM
Thunderbolt is only 10Gb/s, that is the issue. PCIe 2.x x16 slot provides 64Gb/s. It's hard to say how much the limited bandwidth would affect performance but at least higher-end GPUs would be crippled by that. Probably a great bump over the IGP though.

I'm not saying TB isn't great but for a regular user, it doesn't provide much that DP + USB 3.0 combo wouldn't. I'm just afraid that the prices of TB peripherals will hefty.

First it's bidirectional. Second it's forward comipatible. It is going to be probably 10x faster as soon as the cable support is added. The chip has full PCI capabilities from all I have read.

AAPLaday
Mar 29, 2011, 02:48 AM
There is better than that: quarter-increments. Option, Shift, brightness key.

Works for the volume too :cool:

pcshrink
Mar 29, 2011, 07:49 AM
sorry....hard for me to justify....afterall...it is Windows and it aint an APPLE!!:eek:...........yuck.

bossxii
Mar 29, 2011, 08:15 AM
I bet if you look, there'll be a video of Ballmer savaging the iPhone over it's lack of Apps (when WinCE was king), and it's lack of features that are missing from WP7 - like copy and paste.




OK. Plus hyper-threading, for parallel stuff. It's not always way faster though.

Geekbench2 shows ~3800 for the Samsung, vs ~3400 for the 13" MBA ultimate.

http://browse.geekbench.ca/geekbench2/view/351809
http://browse.geekbench.ca/geekbench2/view/381027

Both are capable, neither is a powerhouse.


I'm still a MBA fan, thanks to the screen, the general build, and OSX.

OSX will always be the deciding factor. Every company on the planet can attempt to copy hardware and design but none of them will have OSX. Its really that simple.

Hellhammer
Mar 29, 2011, 08:25 AM
First it's bidirectional. Second it's forward comipatible. It is going to be probably 10x faster as soon as the cable support is added. The chip has full PCI capabilities from all I have read.

None of those change the fact that it is still limited to 10Gb/s. Sure, future versions will be faster but will require a new controller. On the other hand, GPUs will be faster, and games and applications will be more demanding as well. What we got now is 10Gb/s, which is much less than what PCIe 2.x can offer. How much the limited bandwidth will affect the performance is something that none of us can answer, yet.

DarwinOSX
Mar 30, 2011, 12:05 PM
Samsung responds to installation of keylogger on its laptop computers

In the first part of this two-part report, MSIA 2009 graduate Mohamed Hassan told of discovering a keylogger on two different models of Samsung portable computers. Today he continues the story. Everything that follows is Mr Hassan's own work with minor edits.

On March 1, 2011, I called and logged incident 2101163379 with Samsung Support (SS). First, as Sony BMG did six years ago, the SS personnel denied the presence of such software on its laptops. After having been informed of the two models where the software was found and the location, SS changed its story by referring the author to Microsoft since "all Samsung did was to manufacture the hardware." When told that did not make sense, SS personnel relented and escalated the incident to one of the support supervisors.

The supervisor who spoke with me was not sure how this software ended up in the new laptop thus put me on hold. He confirmed that yes, Samsung did knowingly put this software on the laptop to, as he put it, "monitor the performance of the machine and to find out how it is being used."

In other words, Samsung wanted to gather usage data without obtaining consent from laptop owners.

While in the Sony BMG security incident described in the first article in this pair one had to buy and install the CD on one's computer, Samsung has gone one step further by actually preinstalling the monitoring software on its brand laptops. This is a déjà vu security incident with far reaching potential consequences. In the words of the of former FTC chairman Deborah Platt Majoras, "Installations of secret software that create security risks are intrusive and unlawful." (FTC, 2007).

Samsung's conduct may be illegal; even if it is eventually ruled legal by the courts, the issue has legal, ethical, and privacy implications for both the businesses and individuals who may purchase and use Samsung laptops. Samsung could also be liable should the vast amount of information collected through StarLogger fall into the wrong hands.

[Mich Kabay adds:]

We contacted three public relations officers for Samsung for comment about this issue and gave them a week to send us their comments. No one from the company replied.

Good luck, Samsung! We see a class-action lawsuit in your future….

gwsat
Mar 30, 2011, 12:25 PM
Samsung responds to installation of keylogger on its laptop computers

In the first part of this two-part report, MSIA 2009 graduate Mohamed Hassan told of discovering a keylogger on two different models of Samsung portable computers. Today he continues the story. Everything that follows is Mr Hassan's own work with minor edits.

On March 1, 2011, I called and logged incident 2101163379 with Samsung Support (SS). First, as Sony BMG did six years ago, the SS personnel denied the presence of such software on its laptops. After having been informed of the two models where the software was found and the location, SS changed its story by referring the author to Microsoft since "all Samsung did was to manufacture the hardware." When told that did not make sense, SS personnel relented and escalated the incident to one of the support supervisors.

The supervisor who spoke with me was not sure how this software ended up in the new laptop thus put me on hold. He confirmed that yes, Samsung did knowingly put this software on the laptop to, as he put it, "monitor the performance of the machine and to find out how it is being used."

In other words, Samsung wanted to gather usage data without obtaining consent from laptop owners.

While in the Sony BMG security incident described in the first article in this pair one had to buy and install the CD on one's computer, Samsung has gone one step further by actually preinstalling the monitoring software on its brand laptops. This is a déjà vu security incident with far reaching potential consequences. In the words of the of former FTC chairman Deborah Platt Majoras, "Installations of secret software that create security risks are intrusive and unlawful." (FTC, 2007).

Samsung's conduct may be illegal; even if it is eventually ruled legal by the courts, the issue has legal, ethical, and privacy implications for both the businesses and individuals who may purchase and use Samsung laptops. Samsung could also be liable should the vast amount of information collected through StarLogger fall into the wrong hands.

[Mich Kabay adds:]

We contacted three public relations officers for Samsung for comment about this issue and gave them a week to send us their comments. No one from the company replied.

Good luck, Samsung! We see a class-action lawsuit in your future….
I bought an HP/Compaq desktop 6 years ago (don't ask). Its biggest weakness was all the bloated crapware that came loaded on it. Over time, thanks to my teenaged grandson's use of it, it got even further loaded down with the kind of OS crippling stuff to which Windows machines are vulnerable, while Macs are virtually immune. The Windows desktop finally got so slow and unstable that this week I reformatted the drive and installed an old copy of Windows XP Professional on it. So far, so good. I have never, ever, had anything like the problems I have experienced on Windows boxes with any Mac. Your report about Samsung's secretly loading a keylogger program on its high end laptops is a classic example of what goes on in the Windows world. Yikes!

Lord Appleseed
Mar 30, 2011, 01:54 PM
- Boots faster (an argument used widely by Mac users for decades)

If your argument is based on the video posted earlier then you are wrong. As stated below the video in the link, the Air was not a fresh instal whilst the Samsung 9 was fresh from the box.
My Air boots much faster than the one in the video, because i keep it clean.

magbarn
Mar 30, 2011, 02:36 PM
What makes the CPU impressive to me is the rumor that Apple is going to use a similar chip, disable the IGP, over clock the crap out of it (possible since none of the power needs reserved for the IGP), and use an AMD discrete GPU with it. I see this as a lower power consumption than current MBAs, better CPU, better GPU, and shear destruction of the competition.


I really doubt that from happening as Apple will have to make it a 3 chip design +1 with tbolt. Unless Intel allows AMD to make a south bridge/gpu combo chip that's compatible with sandy bridge.

jonnysods
Mar 30, 2011, 03:01 PM
Doesn't run OSX. Need it.

Hastings101
Mar 30, 2011, 03:33 PM
I want one of those, it's sexy and doesn't look like a mini macbook pro :o

radiohead14
Mar 31, 2011, 10:13 AM
Samsung responds to installation of keylogger on its laptop computers

In the first part of this two-part report, MSIA 2009 graduate Mohamed Hassan told of discovering a keylogger on two different models of Samsung portable computers. Today he continues the story. Everything that follows is Mr Hassan's own work with minor edits.

On March 1, 2011, I called and logged incident 2101163379 with Samsung Support (SS). First, as Sony BMG did six years ago, the SS personnel denied the presence of such software on its laptops. After having been informed of the two models where the software was found and the location, SS changed its story by referring the author to Microsoft since "all Samsung did was to manufacture the hardware." When told that did not make sense, SS personnel relented and escalated the incident to one of the support supervisors.

The supervisor who spoke with me was not sure how this software ended up in the new laptop thus put me on hold. He confirmed that yes, Samsung did knowingly put this software on the laptop to, as he put it, "monitor the performance of the machine and to find out how it is being used."

In other words, Samsung wanted to gather usage data without obtaining consent from laptop owners.

While in the Sony BMG security incident described in the first article in this pair one had to buy and install the CD on one's computer, Samsung has gone one step further by actually preinstalling the monitoring software on its brand laptops. This is a déjà vu security incident with far reaching potential consequences. In the words of the of former FTC chairman Deborah Platt Majoras, "Installations of secret software that create security risks are intrusive and unlawful." (FTC, 2007).

Samsung's conduct may be illegal; even if it is eventually ruled legal by the courts, the issue has legal, ethical, and privacy implications for both the businesses and individuals who may purchase and use Samsung laptops. Samsung could also be liable should the vast amount of information collected through StarLogger fall into the wrong hands.

[Mich Kabay adds:]

We contacted three public relations officers for Samsung for comment about this issue and gave them a week to send us their comments. No one from the company replied.

Good luck, Samsung! We see a class-action lawsuit in your future….

it was a false positive by an AV:

http://www.engadget.com/2011/03/31/samsung-reportedly-installing-keylogger-software-on-r525-privac/
http://www.f-secure.com/weblog/archives/00002132.html
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/hardware/samsung-keylogger-is-a-gfi-vipre-antivirus-false-positive/12128

KPOM
Mar 31, 2011, 01:09 PM
it was a false positive by an AV:

http://www.engadget.com/2011/03/31/samsung-reportedly-installing-keylogger-software-on-r525-privac/
http://www.f-secure.com/weblog/archives/00002132.html
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/hardware/samsung-keylogger-is-a-gfi-vipre-antivirus-false-positive/12128


That's good to hear. That said, given the FTC's recent settlement with Google over Buzz, doubtless this would have led to a hefty enforcement action if it were true.

Icaras
Mar 31, 2011, 01:53 PM
This is horrible. Just horrible.

jamesryanbell
Mar 31, 2011, 01:57 PM
I want to believe that Apple is ABOVE that sort of behavior. Don't ruin anything for me.

SR71
Apr 20, 2011, 08:03 AM
So, to bring this thread back from the the dead... does anyone here actually own both a MacBook Air AND a Series 9 that can do a comparison or has anyone actually seen or used one in person that can give us some info as to what it's like to actually see/hold?

thuchu1
Apr 20, 2011, 09:50 AM
The revolution of the duraluminum only goes as far as the faces that the user sees and interfaces with the most. it may be lighter and stronger, but the construction method doesn't take advantage of these nearly to the degree the macbook air does. from below it's just another plastic Windows machine.

hcho3
Apr 20, 2011, 10:17 AM
This Laptop costs more than 13 inch MBA. For 1599 dollars, I can get 13 inch MBA with 256GB SSD.

Once the price comes down, then I will take a look at it again.

Cheffy Dave
Apr 20, 2011, 10:34 AM
I dunno, when you look at it form the side, it doesnt look so great anymore.

from the side it looks like a razor clam, yuck!:eek:

SR71
Apr 20, 2011, 03:36 PM
This Laptop costs more than 13 inch MBA. For 1599 dollars, I can get 13 inch MBA with 256GB SSD.

Once the price comes down, then I will take a look at it again.

This.

The revolution of the duraluminum only goes as far as the faces that the user sees and interfaces with the most. it may be lighter and stronger, but the construction method doesn't take advantage of these nearly to the degree the macbook air does. from below it's just another plastic Windows machine.

Yup.

from the side it looks like a razor clam, yuck!:eek:

I agree.

imahawki
Apr 29, 2011, 06:39 AM
The most important question for me would be for $1600 is it still loaded down with crapware that usually can't be uninstalled effectively and slows down your brand new machine?

onthecouchagain
Apr 29, 2011, 09:00 AM
Someone mentioned briefly about the multi-touch trackpad... and I second that. I don't think I can ever go back to using a normal trackpad without gestures like the one Air/Pros have. It's just ingenious and gives the user so much control over their laptop; it's something I never imagined could be possible without a mouse.