Apple Developing New Palmtop Mac?

[MacRumors]

According to Powerpage (http://www.powerpage.org/cgi-bin/WebObjects/powerpage.woa/wa/story?newsID=14284), Apple has in the works a palmtop computer, or mini laptop.
Sources who claim to have see one have commented to the PowerPage that an internal planning spec details that the new machines runs a stripped-down flavor of Mac OS X. We're told that it will finally utilize Apple's Inkwell technology to "write anywhere" and neatly fold into your pocket - rather like an enlarged Motorola RAZR V3 mobile phone with a keyboard.

[Chaszmyr]

Seems highly unlikely... I think the time for those devices has come and gone, and won't return any time soon.

[chrone]

It'd be nice to not have to buy an OQO.

[AirUncleP]

Is Inkwell used anywhere else?

[stoid]

Is Inkwell used anywhere else?

I recently purchased a graphics tablet, and when it's plugged in, I have the option of enabling Inkwell. Of course, at a desk with a keyboard, it's much easier just to type, especially because Inkwell is not too easy to use (though easier than the standard Palm text squigglies).

[wordmunger]

Something like the Hitchhiker's Guide To the Galaxy (http://hitchhikers.movies.go.com/main.html) (the e-book they show in the trailer) would be pretty cool!

[BlackLilyNinja]

waiting patiently... better have a good size HD in it

[TMA]

iWalk? iNewton? iBook Mini? Mini Book?

Pffffft I don't have any enthusiasm for this 'rumor' what so ever.

[bosrs1]

I'm torn on this news. On one hand I think it's a cool idea. I've always liked PDAs and their potential, espeically if you combine this with Apple's newfound love of Motorola.... :)

However these devices aren't nearly as hot as they used to be. However Blackberries are doing well so maybe it's a variation on that theme?

[aricher]

PowerPage has a history of putting bogus leads up to drive traffic to the site. As much as I would love to have a pocket-sized Mac it ain't gonna happen.

[puckhead193]

I had a palm ( visor neo) and a pocket pc,(toshiba 7 something) both of them last about 2 months before i just gave up.... their nice but on the pee-cee side of it it stinks. if i had in on my mac and had it sync with ical that would be nice, but i don't have loads of stuff in ical either.

[zelmo]

I think that the palmtop computer has always been an idea ahead of the available tech, starting with the Newton and right on through the current offerings. I've been using a Palm for years. They are handy, but I always think that they don't quite do enough, or that the unit is too dang clunky for what it does. Not quite right.
I would love for someone to put a powerful device into a small package. Frankly, I'm excited about the PSP. While I'll mostly use it for games, I can see how the WiFi capabilities, along with the leaked news of web browser, email, and Office-type apps, would make it convenient in places where a laptop is cumbersome. Add in the ability to listen to some tunes and watch movies, and all it won't do is make phone calls...yet. Not saying the PSP is the answer, but perhaps it's success in areas beyond games will inspire others, like Apple, to push the boundaries.

[DavidLeblond]

Hush hush we never told you, it's hot and from the PowerPage.

Haha sounds like they're scared of being sued by the big A. "Ya didn't hear it from me!" :D

[ravenvii]

I love my BlackBerry, but for it's communication abilities, not for it's PDA capabilities. If this is basically a palm with OS X, I (probably) won't be interested. But if it comes with communication capabilities, similar to the BlackBerry... I'll be all over it like white on rice.

[puckhead193]

I love my BlackBerry, but for it's communication abilities, not for it's PDA capabilities. If this is basically a palm with OS X, I (probably) won't be interested. But if it comes with communication capabilities, similar to the BlackBerry... I'll be all over it like white on rice.

I love the blackberry. My dad has one for work. its such a great way to get in touch with him. but the PDA aspect is so-so.

Anyone like the Treo by palm. it seems cool, but a bit big and won't sync with .mac mail

[yossele]

sure, they need one, it has to fit the line.
iPod mini - Mac mini - Book mini!

they need to add a PowerPod though

[Yonizzle]

Has PowerPage gotten anything right in the last 3 years? 5 years? Doesn't seem worthwhile posting anything from them without another source..

[Plymouthbreezer]

A new Newton would be awesome... Then again, a 12" PowerBook is wicked small in its self, almost makes this seem dumb.

[MacPhreak]

It's the rumor that just won't die.

While I'd love to see another Newton, I really doubt this is true. The handheld market has gotten cold recently, as evidenced by Sony's withdrawal. Steve has already said 'no' (wasn't it last summer at some sort of conference where a reporter asked him about an Apple PDA?). And last but not least, the Newton was one of the first things, if not the first, that SJ killed off after returning to Apple. I don't see him with too much enthusiasm for a Newton-like device.

I've got a few more points, but this has been hashed and re-hashed so many times, I'll quit now.

[nagromme]

I don't believe it. There COULD well be such a thing in the labs, but I bet it stays there. It will be a long time before a really GOOD device could be made at the right price. (Maybe someday.)

That said, I'd (http://www.spymac.com/gallery/show_photo.php?picid=56906) buy some kind of pocket Mac for sure, at the right price :) And not just because it would be fun and cool. It would be USEFUL.

Something small but able to do anything JUST IN CASE you need it. Sometimes you leave the house knowing you'll probably need to do some heavy-duty computing--editing photos, building web pages, 3D rendering, video effects, writing a paper, etc. So when you know you'll need a FULL-size laptop, you can take one with you! But what about the other times, when you expect you're less likely to need those things--and therefore wouldn't bother lugging any full laptop? Then what happens when you unexpectedly need--or want--your files? Your apps? Your email? Your games? Your client proposals? Your vacation photos? What if you suddenly need to check movie times, retrieve email, or look at the weather via your cell-phone and Bluetooth Internet? Or play a WiFi LAN game of UTX from sheer boredom? What if you need to make a little change in Photoshop or Final Cut, and not have to drive to the office?

With a palmtop Mac, IF something comes up, you can do what you need to do. The small screen may not be ideal, but it will get the job done--instead of leaving you with nothing.

[lmalave]

iWalk? iNewton? iBook Mini? Mini Book?

Pffffft I don't have any enthusiasm for this 'rumor' what so ever.

I think iBook Mini hits the nail on the head, since as the article pointed out it goes with their "Mini" theme. I think they should market it as a sub-notebook though, not as a PDA. Hmm...maybe they revive the G3 or use some other low-power Moto chip?

I picture something like this:

low-power G3 running at 800MHz (gotta have at least 5 or 6 hours battery life)
6" to 8" Widescreen Display (touchscreen). At least 640 pixels wide.
Full qwerty keyboard
1 or 2 USB ports (possibly also FireWire)
Bluetooth and Wi-Fi enabled (same setup as Mac mini)
1.8" Hard drive at 20GB or 40GB
1 RAM slot, up to 1GB (laptop memory)
small external video connector (same as iBooks)
not sure about video card, but something with 32MB VRAM and ability to run full-fledged OSX and drive and
NO optical drive
Under 2lbs. weight

Omitting the optical drive and using a 1.8" hard drive will allow the unit to be quite a bit smaller than he Mac Mini. As with the iPod mini when it first came out, it would not be that much cheaper than the cheapest iBook. (especially considering the expensive hardware like touchscreen and 1.8" drive). So maybe something like this could sell for $800 initially?

As with the iPod mini, I think there would definitely be a market for it. It would be the size of a small paperback book so we're talking a whole new level of portability. It could be marketed to students or mobile professionals that just need a machine to take notes, edit documents, surf the web, send email, etc. And the bluetooth and external display connector mean that you can use it as a full-fledged computer at your desk at your dormroom or office.

[Stella]

PDAs are a thing of the past, a dying breed. I hope apple do not go down this blind alley.

Smartphones are the replacement now.

[Zaty]

I don't think Apple is working on a PDA. But they might be working on an ultra portable notebook.

[dhns]

Has PowerPage gotten anything right in the last 3 years? 5 years? Doesn't seem worthwhile posting anything from them without another source.As this comes from the "EU Bureau" they might have misinterpreted as rumor our real project which aims at exactly what they tell: http://www.dsitri.de/wiki.php?page=QuantumSTEP - but we are not related to Apple - just Mac-Enthusiasts.

And we are doing that only because we believe that there *is* still a demand for devices compatible to MacOS X not only in look and feel (as theming would provide) but also in API, data formats, way of handling things. E.g. what about copying the address book or calendar files to the handheld device by drag&drop and simply use them? No worry about Syncing?

-- hns
http://www.dsitri.de

[wdlove]

If it were something similar to the Palm Pilot, would make some sense. It would seem that they could go with a version of the iPod.

[JtheLemur]

It's a good thing at least one of us has insider information. I know Jobsy is going to draw-and-quarter me for this but hey, whatever. Here you go baby.

[bdkennedy1]

I'm torn on this news. On one hand I think it's a cool idea. I've always liked PDAs and their potential, espeically if you combine this with Apple's newfound love of Motorola.... :)

However these devices aren't nearly as hot as they used to be. However Blackberries are doing well so maybe it's a variation on that theme?

I think the picture is misleading everyone to believe that's what it's going to look like. What has Apple done that wasn't jaw-dropping over the past 8 years? You can bet if they're going to do something like this it's going to be sweet.

[bdkennedy1]

It's a good thing at least one of us has insider information. I know Jobsy is going to draw-and-quarter me for this but hey, whatever. Here you go baby.

Pretty ugly Photoshop job.

[rikers_mailbox]

If this is mearly a note about some internal Apple spec for a palmtop, that by no means indicates there is any plan to produce such a device. A spec is SO early in the development cycle that this thing may not even be prototyped.

This rumor is in the noise, and rightfully posted on the deuce.

[JtheLemur]

Pretty ugly Photoshop job.

Thanks! :rolleyes:

[Daveway]

This soo stupid. Everyone knows the pocketpc market is dying out as we speak. :rolleyes:

[iindigo]

Found this on Apple's server when I was looking for Tiger stuff:

http://iindigo3d.com/ibookmini1.jpg





















Ok, so I didn't :rolleyes: I made it myself tho...


I could see Apple bringing out something like that. I wish they would, the Newton left a gaping hole that needs to be filled -

[zv470]

First thought.... Noooo :(
Second thought... phew... its just a page 2 rumor :o

PDAs are dead. The Smartphones are taking over.

[Macheath_Messer]

PDA's may be dead to all the nerds/geeks, but they're still alive and kicking pretty well for the Pharmacy/Medical nerds/geeks. :D

As a Pharmacy student, I use my PDA for accessing drug information databases. It sure beats lugging around several large books.

If Smartphones are the way to go, they'd better start coming down in price! :cool:

This "iBook Mini" concept would be interesting to me. I'd love something such as this for taking notes in class (including being able to draw freehand chemical structures), and then being able to use it for typing up papers on the go, as well as being able to go online while on campus.


Maybe that's just me; perhaps I'd be better served with an iBook. :confused:

FWIW

[ccrandall77]

I love being able to get my email, ssh into my machine, browse the web, run SOAP apps, watching pre-recorded TV and movies, listening to MP3s, while I'm out and about. So to that end, I spent major $$$ for a Treo 650, iPod-mini (was a 40GB model), and a Zaurus SL-C760 with wifi/bluetooth.

Now my work stuck me with pager and I look like frickin' Batman (or Choda Boy) with all the gadgets on my belt. If Apple came out with a PDA-type device that integrated with OS X, had mini versions of their stock apps and some iLife apps, and had integrated 802.11g and bluetooth with a keyboard, I could sell all that other crap.

It's gotta have at least a 4-6GB HDD and builtin wireless, though!

Actually, it'd be very cool if they partnered with Motorola to update the A630. I owned one briefly (T-Mob coverage didn't work for me) and loved the form factor, but the software on it sucked. If they redid that model so it had a slightly larger internal screen, OS X lite, and at least a mini-SD slot (or a CF HDD!) that would be cool. That definitely would replace my PDA, cell phone, and iPod.

[swissmann]

I'd buy one. I hope this is true, but doubt it.

[superleccy]

My pockets are already full, carrying round an iPod and a mobile phone.

I used to carry a Palm too, but it didn't havet a single application that couldn't be handled in some way by either my 40G iPod or my Nokia 7610 (yes, even taking the SyncML/iSync issues into account). OK, so a PDA might be better at some tasks than either the iPod or the smartphone, but not so much that it's worth carrying yet another gadget everywhere.

S'leccy.

[wdlove]

PDA's may be dead to all the nerds/geeks, but they're still alive and kicking pretty well for the Pharmacy/Medical nerds/geeks. :D

As a Pharmacy student, I use my PDA for accessing drug information databases. It sure beats lugging around several large books.

If Smartphones are the way to go, they'd better start coming down in price! :cool:

FWIW

Yes, my wife is very dependent on her Palm Pilot. It allows her to download the latest drug, disease, and other medical data. Comes in very handy at a patients home. Anything new would need this ability.

[Stella]

They will come down in price.

Nokia want to bring series 60 devices to the mid range from the high range of phones.

Can't wait.. even more Symbian devices to dominate the smartphone land scape.
PDA's may be dead to all the nerds/geeks, but they're still alive and kicking pretty well for the Pharmacy/Medical nerds/geeks. :D

As a Pharmacy student, I use my PDA for accessing drug information databases. It sure beats lugging around several large books.

If Smartphones are the way to go, they'd better start coming down in price! :cool:

This "iBook Mini" concept would be interesting to me. I'd love something such as this for taking notes in class (including being able to draw freehand chemical structures), and then being able to use it for typing up papers on the go, as well as being able to go online while on campus.


Maybe that's just me; perhaps I'd be better served with an iBook. :confused:

FWIW

[Yvan256]

I think almost everyone agrees that "PDAs are dead", but IMO a compact iBook (iBook mini) would surely sell. I know I'd buy one.

Don't make it any less than the iBook (no special OS X version, no special hardware) and you get a more portable than laptop, better than PDA solution.

Doesn't IBM have something like a low-power G3 with altivec? Imagine the batteries lasting for like 20 hours... :D

Drop the CD drive, put in one PCMCIA type II slot. Keep the laptop 2.5" drive (the iPod drives can't last much when used as computer hard disks if I remember correctly).

[Graeme]

iWalk? iNewton? iBook Mini? Mini Book?

Pffffft I don't have any enthusiasm for this 'rumor' what so ever.


How about the PowerPod, a la the iPod. Only if it plays music too though.

[biohazard6969]

if they were going to do something like this, how big would it be? like r we talkin mini laptop? i.e. 6-10" screen? or PDA? and would it be like a foldout keyboard? (that would be rele cool)

[dotdotdot]

Ugh - I saw these before - they are like 7" or 8" laptops... they really, really suck. Like, big time.

Like, I wouldn't buy this...

...and neither would anyone when they can get a 12" iBook/Powerbook... why go DOWN when most (not me though) want a 13.3" Pb... although a 10.1", 13.3", 15" and 17" PB line would be cool, and a 10.1" would fit in w/ the iBook series...

[asphalt-proof]

I think that the only way his could be conceiveable is if its a communication device like blackberry. I love the Blackberry! I think that there is only one other company that does push communication so there would be room for Apple to get in there. Especially if its incorporated with .Mac. Its true that handhelds are dead, but the market is really growing for smartphones. An Apple Smartphones with a blackberry Push-type email program compbined with there ability to make things "just work" would put them in the forefront in another tech area. I REALLY hope this pans out! A clamshell device like the SideKick II or the Nokia 9xxx would be very cool.

[Cybernanga]

At least the guy's at Engadget have a much better mock-up

The bitchlog one looks sooo fake it's sad.

[ki-goi]

make it screenless, call it "ibook shuffle"

hey wasn't there another rumor of a flat mystery box with an altivec G3...?

anyway in defense of PDAs - it seems like, outside of sales execs, people just aren't really geeky enough for them yet - when we're out and about everything we need we get just by calling friends or something.

my handspring (aka "alkaline-powered quadra") is still chugging along with a beautiful research database setup using filemaker/jfile. various dictionaries, tide tables, star charts, books, travel guides, train schedules, outliner, stopwatch, international clock, advanced calculator, regular do-it apps. screen's twice the size of a smartphone's.

basically any time i wish i had some info, i go and find it for the handheld, load it, and it's there next time. it's true most of the info stuff you can get from the web... but carrying it in your pocket is a lot cheaper than paying for mobile web access...

[wdlove]

if they were going to do something like this, how big would it be? like r we talking mini laptop? i.e. 6-10" screen? or PDA? and would it be like a foldout keyboard? (that would be rele cool)

How about the PowerPod, a la the iPod. Only if it plays music too though.

Would like to see the size still be about the size of the Palm. My wife has leather bound protector. It doesn't really need a fold out keyboard, but a built in keyboard. A similar setup to the Palm.

[awinn233]

I doubt it...

[hob]

I would buy it in a second.

I have been waiting a long time for Apple to do the PDA properly... (I wasn't really old enough when newtons were around... Though I do remember some other kids dad letting him play with his newton on a train... I looked at my dad with dissapointment!)

[Analog Kid]

make it screenless, call it "ibook shuffle"

It's rare for a post to get me laughing out loud, but you got me with this one...

[lmalave]

I still think there's a market for a sub-notebook. Yes, clamshell Pocket PCs failed before, but I think it's because the technology wasn't quite there yet. The Mac Mini showed how much you could fit into a small package with the latest technology. Now take it a step further with a 1.8" hard drive and no optical drive. The difference is now you can put a full-fledged OS X operating system and software on such a machine - not "Pocket" versions. Which means when you hook up an external display and input devices to the machine, it functions just like a "normal" machine.

And with the ubiquity of wi-fi in schools, offices, and hotels, a wi-fi equipped subnotebook lets people do the tasks the most want to do when they're mobile: check email, surf the web, and use Microsoft Office. And when you're at your desk and don't want to be squinting at an 8" display and typing on little chiclet keys, you just hook up an external display, keyboard and mouse.

So I hope the part that's wrong about this rumor is that the device runs a "stripped down" version of OS X. There's no need to with today's technology. Just keep it the size of a paperback book but make sure it packs enough punch to run Tiger.

[Analog Kid]

First and foremost, I agree with the people who think this is bunk.

Otherwise, I agree that this wouldn't be a PDA. Although I tend to think the PDA market died because Palm ran out of ideas and MS filled the void with rubbish, I think consumers now trust their phones more than they would a separate handheld.

Very small keyboard based units do have a market though. For one thing, they're the only computer you can even think of using on a plane any more, and as a walk through the shops in Akihabara, Tokyo will show-- the Japanese have been enamored with small sized (often Transmeta powered) Windows machines for a while.

Notes in class, travel computer, presentation machine whatever-- I'd probably get one. Price it like a mini and I'd probably get it in addition to a Powerbook..

My dreams aside, the rumor is still bunk.

[hobbbz]

Here is a leak ripped off the apple site, err my poor attempt at a mockup

[astrochess]

The PDA isn't dead, but it is dying. I still see one every now and then, and I use one myself, but they definitely aren't the cream of the electronics industry. If Apple is really going to go after this, though, it's gotta have something to freshen up the market and make it a novelty again.

I doubt that Apple would go for this. Usually, Apple looks at what customers want, expand the idea, and sell it. Right now, there isn't such a big demand for PDAs.

[lmalave]

Very small keyboard based units do have a market though. For one thing, they're the only computer you can even think of using on a plane any more, and as a walk through the shops in Akihabara, Tokyo will show-- the Japanese have been enamored with small sized (often Transmeta powered) Windows machines for a while.

Notes in class, travel computer, presentation machine whatever-- I'd probably get one. Price it like a mini and I'd probably get it in addition to a Powerbook..


I think a good number of American consumers can also become enamored with ultra-small laptops. The advantages in terms of portability sell themselves, as long as the price is right. I think what's missing is a cohesive and strong marketing effort - the type which Apple excels at. I mean, think of it:

"Introducing the iBook Mini. The smallest and lowest-priced Mac portable ever. Starting at $699."

It would just fit so well with Apple's latest moves!

In fact, Apple should totally ditch the idea of a touchscreen or anything that makes it more PDA-like. The emphasis should be on smaller size and price and the fact that it runs Tiger, iLife, etc. Really it would be a kind of like Mac Mini, but with a small built-in display and keyboard that you can use for light tasks (which by the way also happend to be far and away the most common tasks).

Think about it. Apple was able to sell the Mac Mini for $499. Remove the optical drive and add a small display and keyboard, and I think the $699 price point is reachable. Or maybe initially $799 until they ramp up volume sufficiently.

[Macheath_Messer]

Haven't seen anyone mention this from Sony. It seems to be meant for the Japanese market only, but Kurns & Patrick sells it.

Kurns & Patrick (http://www.kurnspatrick.com/)

It runs XP, and not the flavor meant for the Tablet PC.

I would love to see something like that from Apple. I might be the only one, however.

I could type notes during classes, then use the touch-sensitive screen to draw drug structures and such. Cool; well, at least in my opinion. :)

Also, check out the Zaurus clamshell PDA. Interesting.

[lmalave]

Haven't seen anyone mention this from Sony. It seems to be meant for the Japanese market only, but Kurns & Patrick sells it.

Kurns & Patrick (http://www.kurnspatrick.com/)

It runs XP, and not the flavor meant for the Tablet PC.

I would love to see something like that from Apple. I might be the only one, however.

I could type notes during classes, then use the touch-sensitive screen to draw drug structures and such. Cool; well, at least in my opinion. :)

Also, check out the Zaurus clamshell PDA. Interesting.

Nice link! Ahh, but I was thinking something more along the lines of the JVC 741 laptop featured on the same page:

9" Screen. 2 lbs. 8.58 in x 1.16 in x 6.97 in. Built-in wi-fi. 60GB drive. It even has 64MB VRAM. But for that they're charging about $2000!!

The Mac Mini showed that smaller doesn't have to mean more expensive. Granted, they're adding a display and keyboard to it, but maybe they can cut corners there. Like maybe the widescreen display is only 896x600 or even just 720x480 (though that might get annoying since a lot of websites assume at least 800 pixels width). I still think a $799 initial launch for such a machine is very possible.

[Heb1228]

Apple could care less about PDA's. Give it up!

Why would they? The 12" Powerbook is only twice as big as a PDA! ;)

[GregA]

with the ubiquity of wi-fi in schools, offices, and hotels, a wi-fi equipped subnotebook lets people do the tasks the most want to do when they're mobile: check email, surf the web, and use Microsoft Office. And when you're at your desk and don't want to be squinting at an 8" display and typing on little chiclet keys, you just hook up an external display, keyboard and mouse.I think the wireless connectivity would be the key if Apple does anything in this area. Start with a device with iPod Photo functionality, with additional functions to check your messages (phone, voice, fax), check your calendar, open/edit simple documents, and perhaps make phone calls via headphone/mic (don't put the device to your head!). Plus simple applets.

You could do all that via a smarter synchronisation with .Mac, and Dashboard apps. Perhaps a cut-down OSX refers to dashboard? A super-iPod with a larger screen, dashboard, and wireless (3G or Airport?, or possibly simply bluetooth connected to the net via your mobile phone).

All that said, I doubt Apple is currently doing that.So I hope the part that's wrong about this rumor is that the device runs a "stripped down" version of OS X. There's no need to with today's technology. Just keep it the size of a paperback book but make sure it packs enough punch to run Tiger.hehehe... damn, if it's that easy..... :)

[asdf123]

Apple could care less about PDA's. Give it up!

Why would they? The 12" Powerbook is only twice as big as a PDA! ;)

what kind of PDA are you talking about? Small....not that small.

Rumor...blah.

Under current market conditions and demand, never going to happen. Especially for a price sub-$1000. And doesn't OSX feed on RAM? Why would apple use less than stellar hardware to drive a rather power hungry OS. ESPECIALLY Tiger.

There would have to be some major innovations on apple hardware/software to drive such an idea.

Not saying it's not grand......

[nagromme]

The next laptop I buy will be the SMALLEST I can get that runs OS X. If that's a 12" PB, so be it. If it's even smaller, all the better! And OS X means it can run ALL my stuff in a pinch, even if the form factor isn't ideal for certain tasks. That means it's a real portable Mac OS X computer, not a PDA, or you'll have a tough time selling me one.

My iPod is all the PDA I need: great at delivering data (maps, photos, audiobooks, calendars, To-Do lists, address book, mini-games, text notes and reference info, and soon calculator etc. thanks to Linux!) And for INPUTTING the data, which I need more rarely, using my Mac is far easier than a stylus anyway.

BTW for efficient typing in a tiny area, there ARE some interesting alternatives:

http://www.the-gadgeteer.com/images2/frogpad-ifrog3.jpg
http://www.the-gadgeteer.com/frogpad-ifrog-review.html

[SiliconAddict]

*shrugs* I've given up on Apple ever releasing anything PDA-ish. Jobs would have to die before he lets anything Newtonish back into HIS kingdom.

That being said I'm perfectly happy with my HP iPaq 4705. 624Mhz Xscale, 128MB of ROM, 64MB RAM, BlueTooth, WIFI, 480 x 640 4" display, native landscape support, SD slot, CF slot. With a 1GB SD card and a 4GB CD card. (Ask me how many movies I have on it. :D )
*shrugs* I still use my Newton to take notes from time to time but there is a reason the system is named: Newton-4705. As far as I'm concerned HP picked up the torch Jobs threw to the ground, and ran with it. The 4705 IMHO is where the Newton would be if Jobs hadn't killed it.

http://home.comcast.net/~jonnormand/Newton4705.jpg




PS- Lets see your iPod pull this one off... :P

http://home.comcast.net/~jonnormand/NewtonMap.jpg

Yes that is a app. I can zoom in to street level and it supports my BT GPS unit.

Or how about this...

http://home.comcast.net/~jonnormand/NewtonPDF.jpg

Yep that is the PDF service manual for the Mac Mini. Easily viewable on my 4" VGA screen.

[Lacero]

Apple could make a 9" PowerBook. This would be much more useful than a PDA or palmtop. And it wouldn't have to sacrifice a CD drive. Use 1.5" harddrives, standard USB 2.0, drop Firewire, 10/100 ethernet, bluetooth, Airport Extreme, OLED screen, chiclet keyboard, miniaturized motherboard.

[Windowlicker]

As with the iPod mini, I think there would definitely be a market for it. It would be the size of a small paperback book so we're talking a whole new level of portability. It could be marketed to students or mobile professionals that just need a machine to take notes, edit documents, surf the web, send email, etc. And the bluetooth and external display connector mean that you can use it as a full-fledged computer at your desk at your dormroom or office.

As long as it would be much more affordable than the ibooks, i would definitely concider getting one at some point. I'd like to have a laptop for taking notes and such (hate writing by hand and then having to search for the notes) but don't have much money and don't need a fast computer since I already have my G5PM for serious work.

[iindigo]

Here's my PS of what I think this thing would look like... does it look real?

[JtheLemur]

And it wouldn't have to sacrifice a CD drive.

Yes yes yes it would. If the rumor is true, I bet Apple would try to squeeze an optical drive in it, but I hope thy won't. Once I step outside my home or office I never EVER use the optical drive. Make the damn thing a companion to a home Mac - syncable via FireWire, etc. No need for an optical drive of any sort - you use iTunes for music playback, etc. The specs wouldn't make it a viable DVD creation station either, so no CD drive needed. NO CD DRIVE I SAY! It would also cut power consumption and improve the thinness of the thing if they left it out.

[Yvan256]

Yes yes yes it would. If the rumor is true, I bet Apple would try to squeeze an optical drive in it, but I hope thy won't. Once I step outside my home or office I never EVER use the optical drive. Make the damn thing a companion to a home Mac - syncable via FireWire, etc. No need for an optical drive of any sort - you use iTunes for music playback, etc. The specs wouldn't make it a viable DVD creation station either, so no CD drive needed. NO CD DRIVE I SAY! It would also cut power consumption and improve the thinness of the thing if they left it out.

Removing the CD drive not only cut on the thickness and power consumption, but it also make it lighter and less expensive.

The 12" iBook/PowerBook may be small, but a sub-notebook would be so small and useful (run full OS X version, not some cut-down, limited crap that requires special software, like PocketPC and Palms) that you'd take it everywhere, just in case.

And make it run 20 hours or more on a single charge so it's actually useful.

Imagine the Mac mini motherboard with a keyboard and a LCD on top of it (instead of the CD drive). That's how small it needs to be (CD case in surface area, maybe about two CD cases in thickness?).

[emotion]

It would make a great deal of sense for Apple to go into the sub-notebook market given the stalling of the whole G5-in-a-notebook project.

So an ibook mini would still use the same chips (cpu etc) that the other g4 based portables use but the innovation would be the size not the power.

I've used a PDA for years but have never been that happy with them and how they integrate with my desktop/notebook. i'd get rid of my pda like a shot if i could have a macosx based sub note.

[fixyourthinking]

PowerPage has a history of putting bogus leads up to drive traffic to the site. As much as I would love to have a pocket-sized Mac it ain't gonna happen.


A history? More like all of their stories have turned to Dvorak like mad lib rants, reviews of laptop bags no one cares about, or as you say - just rumors that aren't true to drive traffic.

About a month and a half ago, they removed the comments from each post because people were starting to disagree.

http://www.jackwhispers.com/powerpagelosespower.html

[jholzner]

Has PowerPage gotten anything right in the last 3 years? 5 years? Doesn't seem worthwhile posting anything from them without another source..

Maybe I'm wrong but didn't they break the Asteroid story?

[Yvan256]

I might be wrong, but follow me for a second...

- Apple has inkwell technology which is superior to anything on the market (or so people keep saying).

- Apple and Sony are getting a bit friendly... Even Steve said "Apple and Sony are cooperating. Maybe even music and computers in the future, who knows?" on stage, to Sony's president (or CEO, or whatever)

- Sony recently dropped their own Palm-powered Clié PDA line.

- Steve said they'd never make PDAs. A sub-notebook/palmtop isn't a PDA, it's a fully-fonctionnal computer that only happens to be very small. And if Sony makes it, it won't be from Apple, so Steve wasn't lying. ;)

We're already getting iTunes on Motorla phones, why not OS X on Sony palmtops? And if it's an IBM G3+Altivec, it won't even put the (recent) iBooks in danger of being overthrown.

What do you think?

[corywoolf]

I think iBook Mini hits the nail on the head, since as the article pointed out it goes with their "Mini" theme. I think they should market it as a sub-notebook though, not as a PDA. Hmm...maybe they revive the G3 or use some other low-power Moto chip?

I picture something like this:

low-power G3 running at 800MHz (gotta have at least 5 or 6 hours battery life)
6" to 8" Widescreen Display (touchscreen). At least 640 pixels wide.
Full qwerty keyboard
1 or 2 USB ports (possibly also FireWire)
Bluetooth and Wi-Fi enabled (same setup as Mac mini)
1.8" Hard drive at 20GB or 40GB
1 RAM slot, up to 1GB (laptop memory)
small external video connector (same as iBooks)
not sure about video card, but something with 32MB VRAM and ability to run full-fledged OSX and drive and
NO optical drive
Under 2lbs. weight

Omitting the optical drive and using a 1.8" hard drive will allow the unit to be quite a bit smaller than he Mac Mini. As with the iPod mini when it first came out, it would not be that much cheaper than the cheapest iBook. (especially considering the expensive hardware like touchscreen and 1.8" drive). So maybe something like this could sell for $800 initially?

As with the iPod mini, I think there would definitely be a market for it. It would be the size of a small paperback book so we're talking a whole new level of portability. It could be marketed to students or mobile professionals that just need a machine to take notes, edit documents, surf the web, send email, etc. And the bluetooth and external display connector mean that you can use it as a full-fledged computer at your desk at your dormroom or office.

it all adds up to the ipod movie, maybe it will be called the mini ibook or whatever. but it would make sense, the widescreen would be perfect...


just a thought

[dsharits]

I might be wrong, but follow me for a second...

- Apple has inkwell technology which is superior to anything on the market (or so people keep saying).

- Apple and Sony are getting a bit friendly... Even Steve said "Apple and Sony are cooperating. Maybe even music and computers in the future, who knows?" on stage, to Sony's president (or CEO, or whatever)

- Sony recently dropped their own Palm-powered Clié PDA line.

- Steve said they'd never make PDAs. A sub-notebook/palmtop isn't a PDA, it's a fully-fonctionnal computer that only happens to be very small. And if Sony makes it, it won't be from Apple, so Steve wasn't lying. ;)

We're already getting iTunes on Motorla phones, why not OS X on Sony palmtops? And if it's an IBM G3+Altivec, it won't even put the (recent) iBooks in danger of being overthrown.

What do you think?
Sounds good, but wouldn't that be the first step toward licensing OS X and the PowerPC processor for other companies to use? Also, the G3 most likely wouldn't run Tiger nearly as well as Apple would like it to. Who knows? Apple may surprise us.

Daniel

[Eniregnat]

This may be in the works, but not from this rumor.
" runs a stripped-down flavor of Mac OS X"- isn't going to happen.
Stripped down versions of OSs usually cause more problems than they are worth. Apple is not going to strip down OSx, unless it is to minimize device drivers. The OS can easily fit on an iPod, so it could easily fit in a sub notebook.

Jobs was very taken by the eMate. Apple even looked into developing a bMate (b for business). Apple also knows that cost is an issue, and unless they have the killer apps, with stunning design, at a great price, they know that they won't break even on the development costs.

The only cost effective model is for Apple to subsidize the cost, and attempt to seed it as a way to gain switchers.

I hope it's true, I would love one, but it certainly would cut into iBook sales.
But it might also generate desktop sales.

[Chobit]

Found this on Apple's server when I was looking for Tiger stuff:

http://iindigo3d.com/ibookmini1.jpg


Ok, so I didn't :rolleyes: I made it myself tho...


I could see Apple bringing out something like that. I wish they would, the Newton left a gaping hole that needs to be filled -


That is quite possibly the cutest thing I have ever seen. This just makes me want to find another iBook so mine can mate with it ::frantically searches:: I don't even care if this DOES anything (would be a nice though), I'd pay to have it sitting there looking cute next to my current one.

[dhns]

It's a good thing at least one of us has insider information. I know Jobsy is going to draw-and-quarter me for this but hey, whatever. Here you go baby.Nice photoshop fake. It is the T-Mobile MDA IV with an apple symbol pasted on one key... Why does it NOT have the alt key and the Apple key? And what is the yellow/green window button for on a small screen? A "Mini MacOS X" needs to modify some of the concepts to really work on a smaller touchscreen.
I can only repeat: watch out for QuantumSTEP. That is NOT a fake. You can already test drive some applications compiled for PowerPC on your Mac and a new release will come.

-- hns

[boobers]

That is quite possibly the cutest thing I have ever seen. This just makes me want to find another iBook so mine can mate with it ::frantically searches:: I don't even care if this DOES anything (would be a nice though), I'd pay to have it sitting there looking cute next to my current one.

Maybe your little ibook can mate with my little powerbook?

Shes a redhead.

No optical, with a 20-40GB HD, 802.11G, Bluetooth, 1Ghz processor 1Ghz RAM. No it doesn't fit in your pocket. Comes with a bluetooth mousey. Squeak!

[dsharits]

Maybe your little ibook can mate with my little powerbook?

Shes a redhead.

No optical, with a 20-40GB HD, 802.11G, Bluetooth, 1Ghz processor 1Ghz RAM. No it doesn't fit in your pocket. Comes with a bluetooth mousey. Squeak!
It looks like it's 16x9 widescreen, too. :D

Daniel

[nitropowered]

I need an ultraportable/pda and if apple makes one, i will buy one. I mainly need one for on the go email checking and quick lookups on the web. I can't afford the Blackberry service cingular offers. It would be sweet if it had wifi, bluetooth and quad band gsm.

[RealDeal]

low-power G3 running at 800MHz (gotta have at least 5 or 6 hours battery life)
6" to 8" Widescreen Display (touchscreen). At least 640 pixels wide.
Full qwerty keyboard
1 or 2 USB ports (possibly also FireWire)
Bluetooth and Wi-Fi enabled (same setup as Mac mini)
1.8" Hard drive at 20GB or 40GB
1 RAM slot, up to 1GB (laptop memory)
small external video connector (same as iBooks)
not sure about video card, but something with 32MB VRAM and ability to run full-fledged OSX and drive and
NO optical drive
Under 2lbs. weight
800 bucks..

looking good- I would use for writing notes to include in publications/books, maybe play music or an old Doom (1) game. My USB port for the memory-card to move files. Video card could by even 16MB. Cummon- we have to choose either touchscreen or keyboard- whatever works- not both.

[soniquev8]

I get worried if more than a month goes by without a page 2 - Apple PDA rumor.

Now I can sleep soundly again.

[-hh]

As a person who does a lot of business travel with a PDA, cellphone and laptop (and sometimes with my wife's iPod mini & digital camera too), I've been watching the convergence trends.

FYI, you'll note that I don't have a "black" or "blue" blackberry ... I need to be another step up the higherarchy chain before I'd be "allowed" to have one, and in some ways, I'm just as happy that I don't! In any event, its merely just one more piece of the puzzle in the convergence conglomeration.

Here's the terrain the way I see it:

PDA:
- "in your pocket" (fast/easy access) to phone numbers when you're away from your desk. However, this need is better addressed by putting them into your cellphone (easier dialing).
- "in your pocket" access to your business calendar, and similarly intimate "nag" alarms to remind you that you're supposed to be somewhere else.
- Palm OS has excellent interfacing to MS-Outlook via "Conduits": allows for one common calendar, phonebook, notes file, To-Do list that gets synchronized.
- reasonably good battery life, although its mostly because the device is used in standby mode ~95% of the time. If used constantly, goes dead fast.

Blackberry:
- wireless email on the road is its claim to fame. Battery life pretty good. PDA functionality generally not considered as good as Palm OS (I'm unsure if it has "Conduits" into MS-Outlook that are as good as they are on the Palm).
- "Blue" variant has integrated cellphone capability. Reduces its battery life, but a pretty good convergence.
- but it doesn't automatically (wirelessly) transfer your email right into your laptop while on the road.

Cellphone:
- similar "in your pocket" convenience to being able to contact other people.
- reasonably good battery life, partly again because you don't really spend too many hours on the phone (vs. standby).
- An excellent choice for convergence with PDA functions

MP3 player:
- yet another pocket device, but generally sucks too much power in comparison to the above. As such, not as suitable for convergence within the above.
- integrating MP3 into a cellphone and/or PDA is probably a darn good way to kill its battery faster than you would otherwise want those two devices to last.

Digital Camera:
- YA pocket device. Has already converged with cellphones (varying quality), so there's some potential there. Power needs reasonable if picture taking is kept limited. However, many businesses currently prohibit cellphones with cameras from being brought into their conference rooms, etc, because they're a security risk (corporate espionage, etc). As such, there will be a business need for cellphone/PDA's that specifically do not have this feature converged. Also, because of varying consumer needs, expect that there will be "camera first" and "phone first" specialization for many years to come.

Laptop:
- pretty much can do all of the above, although the cellphone integration and/or blackberry wireless isn't at all commonly found (probably for good reason).
- has had a long history of the "not good enough for desktop too", although this is generally no longer true.
- has had long history of poor battery life which limits utility...although some current products can hit ~6 hours
- weight trade-offs for battery life, above.
- not "instant on" or "in-pocket" like nearly all of the above
- users frequently like to have a 15" screen...until they're flying in Coach and the guy in front of you reclines.
- not cheap. Also, probably the most fragile of these items.


Implications: if you look at the above holistically, it should be evident that the laptop does "all" (mostly) of the desired tasks, but it simply isn't as convenient...the "in the pocket" and instant-on. Similarly, the cellphone/wireless email is the other key need, and its also the one that you want to have 24+ hour battery life for...the rest tend to be power-hungry, which will only be improved by battery technology.

As such, what I see as the road ahead is a three device system, that interconnect via bluetooth or a similar very localize LAN:

#1: wireless earpiece. For phone calls and MP3-listening

#2: "pocket" device. Houses the cellphone/blackberry/PDA functions and relays the data to the other two.

#3: "laptop" type device. Its power consumption needs to be low enough that its able to remain in standby all day long. It receives the email (and voicemail messages) from #2, plus its your MP3 transmitter sending to #1 (in this standby mode, using the laptop's RAM as a buffer for MP3 data from its hard drive will conserve power, etc).

This type of configuration is very doable today, but the IMO big technology breakthrough will be to do away with the current LCD screen...alternatives include holographic projection, which means that the guy reclining in the seat in front of you doesn't create a problem.

A more near-term technology solution would be a new LCD screen hinge design that cantilevers the screen forward, so that instead of your screen being "behind" the keyboard, its kind of more "over" it...


-hh

[smharmon]

I love the blackberry. My dad has one for work. its such a great way to get in touch with him. but the PDA aspect is so-so.

Anyone like the Treo by palm. it seems cool, but a bit big and won't sync with .mac mail


I have a treo 600, and is syncs with my .Mac mail just fine.

[jadam]

I want a tablet PC, but I want it to run OS X... Apple if you come with this I will love you forever.

I seirously would love to use a tablet PC in my classes, but Windows XP, bleh, have to right click everywhere. Apple's one button philosphy would fit in very well with a tablet OS.

[hob]

I want a tablet PC, but I want it to run OS X... Apple if you come with this I will love you forever.

I seirously would love to use a tablet PC in my classes, but Windows XP, bleh, have to right click everywhere. Apple's one button philosphy would fit in very well with a tablet OS.

Apple's Newton Philosophy would fit well with a tablet mac...

[bosrs1]

Well when you consider that the 12 in PB is smaller then the last newton.... I don't think this is a likely development.

[Philsy]

I reckon the future is with smartphones, that do everything a PDA will do and allow you to surf the web, check email, send texts, play music and video clips and - shock - make phone calls.

Considering the success of the iPod, Apple should produce a 3G phone/PDA/MP3 player/DAB radio that uses the iPod form factor.

OK, it'd be a bit bigger than a current iPod and would need a larger screen, but still smaller than carrying around a seperate PDA, phone and iPod. It would have stylus data entry - very small keyboards are unuseable and, besides, such a device would be used mainly to view information.

Add iSync so you sync your contacts and other data with your Mac and you'd have the perfect companion to the Mac. I'd buy one tomorrow!

[hchaney]

I for one would like to see something done right with handhelds...hopefully Apple will do so.

Even though handhelds have been around for a while, the software part of the industry is still in its infancy as there are a lot of software developers (maybe most) that rushed products to market. When they didn't sell in volumes anticipated, the software hasn't evolved much further. This has prevented comprehensive software development, especially in some of the codes that are more space efficient, although the new MS ".NET" language is promising, but again that's in it's infancy as well. I'm disappointed in most applications I've installed...save for a couple of isolated apps. I'm especially disappointed in the GPS mapping software.

Simply, software usually doesn't do what it's advertised to do. As an
example, I just bought a 2nd generation golf game because I really liked
the simplicity of the first generation. It is a piece of crap...unstable and
quirky. This is not my first experience with less than honest marketers.
Another example is some electrical engineering formula apps. I bought 3 or
4 specific task apps, and all of them do less than indicated and are nothing
more than look ups of tables of text information that can't be exported
into a spreadsheet or readily used. This stuff is readily available online, and
importable into excel. Or it's something that can duplicate in a spreadsheet
quickly and actually use. And the cost of the software is approaching the
cost of PC software...with a lot less quality.

For specific requirements, a handheld designed for a specific task seems
to be best, i.e.; For example, for a GPS, I would recommend a specific
handheld with GPS built in.

Memory storage and RAM being small limits really powerful software but
you know thats improving with 1 and 2 Gig cards.

The internet has been very slow to really adopt website specifically for
browsing with hand helds. There are web sites, but they usually are watered
down versions. This may change because of smart phones...who knows.

The development of tablet PCs have further struck a blow to hand helds which is where I see the new Apple product fitting in. Sony stopped development and marketing hand helds because of tablet PC
development. I really see an evolution to tablet PCs and their size
shrinking taking the place of current hand helds all together.

The smart phones are taking care of limited capability. They are great for address books, contact information, calendars, text
information apps, and calculators. The input is tedious unless you sync with your PC or Mac, anything else extends beyond their real
capability at this point.

Well, other than that, I like my dell Pocket PC OK. Actually, I'm trying to
lighten my technology load. My iPod will keep addresses and calendars for
me and will sync with my laptop so, I'm thinking about getting rid of my
Dell...as good as it is. Right now I have an iPod...I'm thinking about
getting a 2nd generation Photo iPod and hopefully, can get a calculator. Then it will do everything I need a handheld to do. Store picts of sexy girls and display them at my will (the downside is the screen size...hard to see the detail needed when looking at sexy girls), store and play my music library, hold contacts and addresses, sync to my laptop calendar, play a few mindless simple games, and make me look cool as I use it. What else is there?

12" Powerbook 133 Mhz, 1.25 GB RAM ( :D I love this machine)
12" iBook G4
Peach iMac
10 lb windoze wondermachine (company owned Jetbook) piece of crap.
Dell Axium X30 Pocket PC Arm 624 Mhz
2nd G iPod 10G

[wdlove]

I think that the phone and PDA should be kept separate. Having the functionality of the Palm is very important. It's very beneficial to the medical [profession.

[Lacero]

Small chiclet form factor devices that act as PDAs and phones or text messagers have failed miserably. PDAs are not the future. Subcompact laptops are really were it is at.

[weldon]

I really like how my phone and laptop work together with bluetooth. I'd like to see further development in this area so that the devices can share information. I don't really want an all-in-one smartphone as much as I want my PDA, iPod, Phone, and laptop to share information seamlessly.

[JzzTrump22]

I really don't think apple will make any money off of something like that. I really don't know anyone who still looks into buying hand held devices like Palms.

[dhns]

Here is a leak ripped off the apple site, err my poor attempt at a mockup
Also have a look at http://www.applele.com Isamu has a lot of very nice potential designs... How do you like http://www.applele.com/picture_f_hiphone_r08a.html ?

-- hns

[dhns]

It's a good thing at least one of us has insider information. I know Jobsy is going to draw-and-quarter me for this but hey, whatever. Here you go baby.Nice image - but isn't it a T-Mobile MDA IV where some bitten apple is placed on one key? Not to mention that it does not have the alt key which you need to operate MacOS X...

It is not that simple running standard OS X on a touchscreen device by adding an Apple-Key. IMHO, the argument "Apple has Inkwell and MacOS X and just needs to build a Newton like hardware" does not hold. They need to modify (and simplify) a lot to fit into 128MB working memory! Requiring the typical 512MB-1GB you need on an iBook or Powerbook to be happy in a handheld device makes the battery larger than the whole device...

And finally, there is no low-power PowerPC processor for handheld devices. IBM did have one (405LP) but it was discontinued two years ago. So, it would either need a very slow emulator or complete recompilation (i.e. two versions of all software) for a let's say StrongARM.

So, the only solution to our hopes is not waiting for Apple but doing it ourselves based on available technologies: Sharp Zaurus ARM-based PDA and GNUstep. And we have decided to use the (re)compilation approach. If you want to join or support this project, please visit http://www.dsitri.de/wiki.php?page=QuantumSTEP

-- hns

[Philsy]

I really don't think apple will make any money off of something like that. I really don't know anyone who still looks into buying hand held devices like Palms.

Actually, everyone's got one - it's called a mobile phone. Most have at least basic PDA capabilities - contacts, calendar, reminders. Many go much further - look at the Sony Ericcson P900 or Motorola A1000 for instance.

[asdf123]

Well when you consider that the 12 in PB is smaller then the last newton.... I don't think this is a likely development.

how do you figure....like the eMate?


The Newton was a PDA...sized. Not larger than the 12 powerbook. Come'on.\=

[graphyte]

This thing is cool! I'd buy one for sure if Apple released it, but I don't think so... :(
It's a very competitive market, and, if released (:rolleyes: ),would it attract people's attention? It would have to be really awesome :p
And apart from using Inkwell it could also use the iPod click wheel... what do you think? :cool:

g

[chaos86]

ok so the last one was the Newton. has anyone come up with this name for the new apple pda yet?

iSaac


i really dont think this will happen

[Philsy]

ok so the last one was the Newton. has anyone come up with this name for the new apple pda yet?

iSaac


i really dont think this will happen

The Hawking? :D

[dhns]

The Hawking? :D
Steve's new "Stephen"! :D :D

[dhns]

iSaac
Archimedes, daVinci (already a PDA brand of Royal), Einstein (an open source Newton emulator project), Hawking, Laplace, Gauss, Penrose, Klitzing, Feynman - nothing that fits well to "i"

[Candyfingered]

how do you figure....like the eMate?


The Newton was a PDA...sized. Not larger than the 12 powerbook. Come'on.\=
You ever use one? The MP2100 was thicker then the Tibook and nearly as big as the 12 inch PB. The eMate was actually BIGGER then the 12 in PB.

[d.perel]

newton 2 ?

[wisof]

I have a Sony Clie PEG NR70v/u . . . the kind that had the mini keyboard and a camera . . . not the most recent clie with bluetooth and wifi. I have to say, the only thing I want in addition to what my clie gives me would be more hard drive (or the existence of one!) and wifi/blue tooth capabilities. I rarely use the keyboard, but it does come in handy when necessary.

I personally would love that Sony continue their clie line, but I believe they have been discontinued.

That being said, where will the capabilities for the iPod stop? Do you think Apple will just stop updating the iPod if users want more features? I feel that the iPod is just a stepping stone for something else in a similar form factor but with many more features. Already they are working on wifi or bluetooth for the iPod, and there are "palmtop" features already on the iPod OS like address/date book, and minimal games. they just need to step up to the plate and make an os that can support more features. And then they need to give the ipod more ports.

A pocket mini that you can travell with like an iPod, but that can be also hooked into a display, keyboard, and mouse.

I have seen a device similar to this that is a box about the size of an iPod, but is a full flegged comp. Nothing too fast, but it is getting closer to what some people want . . .

[chaos86]

no, the ipod will reamin a portable media serving device (music, photos), with 5 buttons and extremely limited content editing (now only on-the-go playlists). if apple makes something PDAish it will be a pda, a new device.

anyway, the pda is dead. if we have a 1 inch thick computer to carry, a full size computer for hard work, and a tiny portable to serve media content to us, what place does a pda have in between?

[emotion]

pda's aren't dead. many people use them (medics for one).

the all singing all dancing pda is dead tho. once you loaded the thing with stuff you don't need then you may as well have a laptop, i agree.

[cubist]

I use a PDA heavily. Recently changed to a Palm M505. I carry it everywhere. It's thin enough to fit in my shirt pocket, and weighs next to nothing. I take notes and update data constantly. I'm aware that that's an older model, but a PDA must be super-reliable, and from what I hear Palm's Tungstens are not reliable (and the Zires are too thick and heavy).

People who say the 12" powerbook is small enough really make me wonder. Do you take it shopping? Do you open it in the bread aisle to check the prices, or jot them down? Do you glance at it while driving to check the directions? Most people would admit it's much too large for a use-everywhere portable.

[Mac Dummy]

Yeah,a Tablet Mac wouldn't be so bad, except I seriously doubt that Apple would develop one considering how other manufacturers have done with their tablet computers.

[macux]

Yeah,a Tablet Mac wouldn't be so bad, except I seriously doubt that Apple would develop one considering how other manufacturers have done with their tablet computers.

How many mp3 players were out competing with each other and failing to survive before the ipod took over the market? Do you really think that just because windows tablets are poor products and don't sell well that a mac tablet would fail? If they take the time and do it right we might be in for another revolution.

[ccrandall77]

I wonder why so many people on this forum keep saying PDAs are dead?? Far from it! I work in the IT department for a Fortune 500 financial/insurance institution. ALL of the field reps use Palms. In fact, any of my friends in sales positions, realestate, etc. all use Palms.

I have both a Treo650 and a Zaurus SL-C760. I agree smartphones are very cool and takes the place of the handheld many times... but try taking a Treo650 out to the bar, concert, etc. It's too big, too fragile, too tempting to steal.

In many ways I wish I could go back to having a decent bluetooth cellphone and my bluetooth PDA. I had the SE T610 with T-Mobile and unlimited data. It was great except the coverage stunk. No other cell company has anything like T-Zones unlimited data unless you are willing to pay almost $80/mo! Anyway, it was great to have a phone with a decent set of PIM apps, that easily fit in my pockets. When I need more, I just popped out the Z... if I didn't need it, it stayed home. With a smartphone, you are stuck carrying it everywhere unless you decide you don't need a phone at all.

dhns posted a great link earlier in this thread to http://www.applele.com. If Apple comes out with a sub-notebook, here's what it should look like:

http://www.applele.com/picture_a_hibook_r08a.html

I currently have a 12" Powerbook. It's great, but still WAY TOO BIG. If I need a big screen, I'll use my iMac. The whole reason to have a small laptop is PORTABILITY. I would gladly ditch my 12" PB, for a smaller subnotebook if it had similar specs (Superdrive, 1GB RAM, G4-1.33GHz). I also wish they'd use Sony's screens. My officemate has a 13.3" Sony laptop and its screen makes mine look like CRAP!

I'd also like to see Apple come up with a cool PDA... something that'll replace my Treo650, Zaurus, and iPod-mini. Like a posted earlier, something like a Moto A630 with a memory slot, wider internal screen, OS X lite, and mini: iTunes, iCal, AddressBook, and Quicktime would be perfect! With something like that, I could have a decent cell phone with great PIMs that seamlessly sync with my iMac, enough capacity to play 1000 or so songs, bluetooth, and an OS that would allow me to add 3rd party apps like pssh.

[pubwvj]

Seems highly unlikely... I think the time for those devices has come and gone, and won't return any time soon.

I would buy one, especially if it was tightly integrated with my PowerBook - dock and merge. I have a Handspring Visor Deluxe (PalmOS) but would replace it with the right handheld. The ideal machine will have (at least!):

MacPalmOS (stripped down MacOSX) so most applications supported and there can thus be great programmer support since you can develope for the iPalm or iBook or PowerBook or PowerMac and everything runs across the platform at what ever capability the hardware has.

MP3 + Recorder (Voice mic built in + Microphone line-in) - gotta have tunes!

Wi-Fi - of course.

Cellphone + 2.4GHz phone which works with Airports for internet calling. Since it's got Wi-Fi it could form local area networks and operate as a radio phone too. Useful on hikes or when working on the farm or fields.

Strong support for essencial apps like: iTunes, Addressbook, Safari, Mail, jNotes (Common Apple, Hire that guy!), iCal, iSpreadsheet, iWord, Preview, Calculator, WeatherMan, iData(base), etc. Strong merging support with desktop PowerMacs, iBooks and PowerBooks as well as iPalm to iPalm.

The screen needs to be ultra readable in bright sunlight, office conditions and in bedroom or the dark. It should be as easy to read as a small paperback book and folds to half that size for slipping in your pocket. This could be the eBook type machine that keeps getting reinvented. There are now a lot of great public domain books out there. This could spur a new must have application and industry making electronic publishing really take off.

It needs fantastic battery life. SolarSkin perhaps? Shake and charge? Induction charging? Recharge with USB/FW too. One thing to achieve the great battery life that Apple could do is have the processor crank _down_ in many steps so that it can dynamically adjust to the needs of the user. You don't need 1GHz to enter an email, lookup an addressread a novel or browse most web pages. A palm version doesn't need the high speed of the G5, nor its heat and power problems. The palm should also shut off higher power components to conserve battery. GPS and Wi-Fi could be shut down when not in use to save power just like spinning down the harddrive or dimming the screen.

It should work with wireless keyboards and mice. It should be able to be a tablet for another Mac.

No CD-ROM or DVD drive is necessary. Any movies or music is downloaded. Same for OS upgrades. Media is merely a medium.

Added bonus, snap two or more together and they join processors and displays forming a larger, more powerful unit. Place them next to your PowerMac, PowerBook or iBook and it merges with the bigger machine becoming a backedup resource of added storage, processing and display.

Infrared port for using it as a programmable remote with TV, VCR, DVD, stereo, etc. Open your garage door too? :)

DVD display of a stored movie would be cool if there is enough processing power.

Ideally I would like field replaceable standard batteries but if it had a SolarSkin and was water tight that would be even better.

It should be very small when folded. Thick credit card sized? Slip it into a wallet, purse or shirt pocket.

Most of all, it needs to be a real world rugged device. Drop it in the ocean, run it over, etc and it keeps on working. Ideally the case is totally sealed, it is wireless, there are no ports. Induction charging, wireless networking, bluetooth headset, keyboard, mouse, etc.

Built-in GPS and mapping software better than StreetAtlas would be a great extra for the Pro version.

There is lots of market for a really useful handheld device. Is this a PDA? A smart phone? A micro-miniturized Mac? It's all semantics - what matters is capabilities to do useful work. If something like the above comes out I'll buy several (family).

[e-freedom]

I would love this rumour to be true. I miss my Newton and if something came out with the same size screen but much thinner and in colour, I'd buy it. If you read what the "Which-PDA" type magazines, they eulogise over so-called 'new' facilities that I had many years ago.

I see no reason why iPod software couldn't also be combined :)

[ccrandall77]

A slimmer, color Newton would be awesome... esp if they could cram a SuperDrive into it... or at least provide a dock with a Superdrive.

I'd also love something like this with an attachable keyboard that could fold to cover the screen.

It would also need to be wireless (802.11g and Bluetooth 2.0), and have a firewire port and 2 USB 2.0 ports.

While that's a lot of stuff, I see no reason it couldn't be crammed into a formfactor that you suggest.

I think something the size of a Newton, a PDA, and a smartphone would be much more attractive to people than big, bulky 17" laptops. I find my 12" Powerbook to be too large. The whole reason for having a laptop is PORTABILITY... so the smaller the better.

They just need to create Palmtop/PDAs to be more useful than current offerings. My Zaurus is pretty good, but the software is clunky and it needs builtin wireless. A backlit keyboard would also help when it's dark. But with a few upgrades, PDA devices such as the Zaurus or a new Newton could easily replace a laptop.

[ccZaphod]

WiMax will start being deployed this year. How about a iNews connected Newton/Tablet with always-on connectivity. DIgital newspapers, web access, etc.

[carebear427]

Apple Better come out with one soon...or ELSE!!

[Gidman]

I gotta say, I am just not so interested in a palm top mac. I would however, and I may be in the minority here, love to be able to transform my 12" PB into a tablet, or just be able to draw on the screen. I know that it is a long shot, but it just seems so obvious to me.

Anyway, my two cents.

Gideon

[macaudiodj]

I have a treo 650 smart phone which is great, i love it. I have nothing bad to say about it....... except it is a little unstable. I love if apple made a smart phone that was stable than palm os 5.

[Benjamindaines]

That will never happen in the words of Steve Jobs PDAs are toys.
I can see a tablit mac.

[pubwvj]

I gotta say, I am just not so interested in a palm top mac. I would however, and I may be in the minority here, love to be able to transform my 12" PB into a tablet

Agreed. I would love both.

A tiny palm version for the pocket to replace my aging Handspring Visor Deluxe (buttons don't all work anymore) for calendar, address book, todo lists, notes, books, music, phone (cell+WiFi), basic email and web browsing, dictionary, games, backup of Home, etc.

A tablet version that is for more real work. Hangs on the wall at the desk, in hand in the field, on my lap in bed, at the table, etc.

Both should work with a wireless keyboard (with trackpad) and mouse.

[rainman::|:|]

Yeah, people really *want* PDAs to be dead, because so many of us have tried them, expecting big things, and then been let down-- Plus PDA advancement has been slow, it's just not an exciting field. But yeah, I expect every Fortune 1000 company has PDAs deployed somewhere... Hell, I know homemakers that use PDAs to keep on schedule. While PDAs are lackluster and in desperate need of an overhaul by Apple, they're certainly not dead, although I do agree that mini-PCs will take over once they reach the PDA size/price. People like to do more, not be restricted by Palm OS.

[dsharits]

Yeah, people really *want* PDAs to be dead, because so many of us have tried them, expecting big things, and then been let down-- Plus PDA advancement has been slow, it's just not an exciting field. But yeah, I expect every Fortune 1000 company has PDAs deployed somewhere... Hell, I know homemakers that use PDAs to keep on schedule. While PDAs are lackluster and in desperate need of an overhaul by Apple, they're certainly not dead, although I do agree that mini-PCs will take over once they reach the PDA size/price. People like to do more, not be restricted by Palm OS.
People want PDA's to be somehing like what cell phones have become with all of their games, ringtones, flashy features and whatnot. Remember back when cell phones were only used for talking? PDA's looked to have the same future as cell phones with all of their possibilities, but to this day, they really only do what they were originally designed to do. It's just not exciting to some people if a product just does what is supposed to do, especially if it's job is not exciting either.

[pubwvj]

Something I would like to see is the PalmOS run on the Mac like Classic does. I have a Visor Handspring Deluxe that has a lot of software as well as data. I would switch to an ApplePalm in a flash if, amoung other things, it could run all the PalmOS software. There is an emulator for the Palm on the Mac. It is doable. It would be eminently useful.

On the topic of ApplePalm (PDA) vs Tablet vs Notebook - they each have different markets and uses. When I 'm on the road, at the grocery store, in the field, etc I usually want the computer to be tiny. Something I can easily slip in my pocket. The primary function is to access data or run simple programs.

A tablet would be great as a replacement for a notebook if it also had a keyboard. The tablet would be the computer and screen with a clip on wireless keyboard and trackpad (and mouse for those who love them).

Notebooks (tablet + keyboard) are for working at a desk and for us have replaced desktop / tower computers.

Most of all we need robust machines that will last in the field.

[salmon]

I'm seriously hoping for an Apple attempt at a tablet device. The Windows ones generally suck, they missed the concept (as usual for Microsoft). The OQO is interesting in some ways, but approximately triple the acceptable price for me. $500-$1000cdn would be reasonable.

I think a successful tablet would have the following characteristics:

6" to 8" screen: this would of course have to be touch sensitive. Other dimensions should make it similar to a notebook in size (not a laptop, an actual paper notebook). I've heard people dismiss this type of device as beeing "way too big", but people have carried around paper notepads and organizers for years without problems. It might not fit in a pocket, but it would fit conveniently in a briefcase, organizer case, bookbag, purse, etc.
long battery life: the longer the better, of course
instant on: I like PDAs and their ability to be instantly ready to use, to jot a note or look something up. Laptops are too cumbersome in this regard.
usable keyboard: pen based computing only goes so far. But the pen is an essential tool, way better than a mouse for most things.
hard drive (maybe an iPod plugin slot?):
wifi: web browing, email, etc.
ability to annotize documents: sometimes, drawing a little diagram with a pen or scribbling a note is essential to being organized.
mp3 playing mode: like the Sony PSP. I carry a backpack when I bike to work, so this would be nice.


I recently gave up waiting for such a device and bought a Palm Tungsten E. It's been fine so far, but I'm still trying to figure out a couple of things, like managing what's on the memory card (can't find a way to delete things?). I also have to get a good movie player for it (any recommendations?) and a utility that allows me to convert movies to a suitable size and format (planning on trying FFMpeg, but haven't got around to it yet -QT Pro is probably nice, but a bit too expensive for what I need).

[pubwvj]

Tablet or PDA, one thing Apple could do is dump the CD/DVD drive. It is a hole into the machine thus making it less rugged. It burns more power and is loud. It is highly mechanical and failure prone. All software should be downloadable. Tunes are downloadable. Movies will be downloadable, Real-Soon-Now. CDs and DVDs are just a package for the data and they aren't needed anymore. Apple was couragious enough to dump the floppy drive, now dumpe the CD/DVD drive in lower end machines (iBooks, iTablets, iPalms, etc). You'll notice there is no removeable media drive on the iPod. :)

[skunk]

A little fuel to the fire: I e-mailed Skype to ask if and when a Mac-compatible DualPhone was coming out, and their e-mail stated: "We are not planning to make the dualphone Mac compatible, but we will maybe come with something new for Mac users in the autumn. I can't tell you more about it."

Hmmm.

[chaos86]

Tablet or PDA, one thing Apple could do is dump the CD/DVD drive. It is a hole into the machine thus making it less rugged. It burns more power and is loud. It is highly mechanical and failure prone. All software should be downloadable. Tunes are downloadable. Movies will be downloadable, Real-Soon-Now. CDs and DVDs are just a package for the data and they aren't needed anymore. Apple was couragious enough to dump the floppy drive, now dumpe the CD/DVD drive in lower end machines (iBooks, iTablets, iPalms, etc). You'll notice there is no removeable media drive on the iPod. :)


not everyone has a t1 connection mate. its gonna be a while before everything is downloadable. how do you install final cut or garage band without an optical drive? download? even on t1 that would take a good hour. for a pda that syncs with a computer (that has an optical drive) no optical drive makes sense. thats why they currently dont have one. but an ibook with no optical drive is stupid. how do you put tiger on it? office? larger games?

[chaos86]

I recently gave up waiting for such a device and bought a Palm Tungsten E. It's been fine so far, but I'm still trying to figure out a couple of things, like managing what's on the memory card (can't find a way to delete things?). I also have to get a good movie player for it (any recommendations?) and a utility that allows me to convert movies to a suitable size and format (planning on trying FFMpeg, but haven't got around to it yet -QT Pro is probably nice, but a bit too expensive for what I need).


ffmpeg is very good software. it even has apples new favourite codec h264 (not playable in qt6 yet so i use vlc). but, like all video software, its slow. takes about as long to convert dvd to h264 as it does to watch the dvd, so, pointless (at least to me).

oh yeah, if you want to encode a few movies at once, go to tools>open terminal window, otherwise they queue and take longer. (also, im not sure but i think it might be more efficient with your processor that way too.)

[GregA]

not everyone has a t1 connection mate. its gonna be a while before everything is downloadable. how do you install final cut or garage band without an optical drive? download? even on t1 that would take a good hour. for a pda that syncs with a computer (that has an optical drive) no optical drive makes sense. thats why they currently dont have one. but an ibook with no optical drive is stupid. how do you put tiger on it? office? larger games?As you say, if it syncs with a computer there is definitely no "requirement" for a DVD.

But an ibook is a different issue.

Although many people with an iBook have some sort of access to a DVD drive elsewhere, there are some who wouldn't. Why not an external drive? (perhaps wireless)

[Yvan256]

not everyone has a t1 connection mate. its gonna be a while before everything is downloadable. how do you install final cut or garage band without an optical drive? download? even on t1 that would take a good hour. for a pda that syncs with a computer (that has an optical drive) no optical drive makes sense. thats why they currently dont have one. but an ibook with no optical drive is stupid. how do you put tiger on it? office? larger games?

You use an optical drive from another computer via wireless, of course. You could also use an external drive connected via FireWire or USB 2.0 if you had one.

[ccool2ax]

2002 (3?), webcams were downright absolutely dead. iSight comes. Most successful webcam ever made.
2000 (1?), people with MP3 players were geeks. iPod. Thats all I have to say.
2005. Cheap computers are overcrummy, Apple makes mac mini, sells 100k by end of 1st quarter (not sure)
2005 again. Treos and stuff cost too much for too little. Combined with vidmachine PSP, and people want video, audio, photos, and an OS. iWork AV.

[ravenvii]

2002 (3?), webcams were downright absolutely dead. iSight comes. Most successful webcam ever made.

And where did you get that? I've never heard of anything like that - iSight most successful webcam ever? Never heard anything like that.
2005. Cheap computers are overcrummy, Apple makes mac mini, sells 100k by end of 1st quarter (not sure)


Apple hasn't even announced their fiscal results yet. That's going to happen on Wednesday.

[bigandy]

i love my SonyEricsson P900, couldn't live without the programs i have to edit PHP, the mini MySQL interface i run, and the FTP program....

but if there was an apple device capable of that i'd jump at it.

meanwhile there's nothing that'll do the stuff my P900 does, just as easily. So for the future i'll be keeping it :)