PDA

View Full Version : Apple Still Needs Music Publishers' Agreement Before Launching Cloud-Based Streaming Service




MacRumors
May 20, 2011, 01:50 PM
http://images.macrumors.com/im/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/05/20/apple-still-needs-music-publishers-agreement-before-launching-cloud-based-streaming-service/)


http://images.macrumors.com/article-new/2011/05/itunes_cloud.jpg

As touched on in today's earlier report (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/05/20/apple-reaches-cloud-music-deal-with-sony-universal-last-major-label-still-to-sign/) about Apple having reached agreements with three of the four major music labels regarding cloud-based streaming services, Apple will also need the agreement of a separate group of music publishers that also has a stake in the digital music market.

All Things Digital's Peter Kafka digs a bit further (http://mediamemo.allthingsd.com/20110520/apples-cloud-music-hangup/) into that aspect of the negotiations, noting that while Apple began discussions with the labels first under the view that those would be the more difficult negotiations, Apple still has some work left to accomplish to get the publishers on board.While Apple came to terms with Warner Music and EMI Music weeks ago, and has now struck a deal with Sony Music, industry sources tell me the company doesn't have agreements with labels' associated publishing companies -- Warner/Chappell, EMI Music Publishing and Sony/ATV. The deal Apple is about to sign with Universal, also won't include publishing, I'm told.Kafka lays out how both labels and publishers receive varying levels of compensation for digital music sales, and while each label generally has an associated publishing arm, artists' work is sometimes controlled by publishers and labels under different umbrellas. For example, publishing rights to The Beatles' catalog are controlled by Sony/ATV while the recordings themselves are owned by EMI Music.

According to the report, Apple and publishers are basically on the same page, meaning that negotiations could proceed quickly if monetary compensation can be addressed to the satisfaction of both sides. That may yet take some time, however, meaning that rumors of an imminent signing by Universal to complete the label negotiations won't allow Apple to immediately roll out the service. At a minimum, Apple reportedly hopes to introduce the service at its Worldwide Developers Conference early next month, but whether it will be able to immediately go live with it depends on how quickly Apple can bring the publishers on board.

Article Link: Apple Still Needs Music Publishers' Agreement Before Launching Cloud-Based Streaming Service (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/05/20/apple-still-needs-music-publishers-agreement-before-launching-cloud-based-streaming-service/)



ciTiger
May 20, 2011, 02:00 PM
So still a couple of months before we can see "be told" anything by Apple about this... :(

KarlOlsson
May 20, 2011, 02:02 PM
I just don't get the big push for Cloud streaming with music, The iPhone, witch was founded on putting an iPod and phone with a PDA that comusmes data from a wireless provider that has been seeing data rising and in return has raised prices and now are moving to tired data plans is going to be OK with streaming music from a cloud!

Big bills for data comming soon if you use your iphone for what it was created for....music phone calls and web

20hrs of streaming music over a 30 day peroid is about 7.8gb of streaming data !
:confused:

tjanuranus
May 20, 2011, 02:02 PM
why does NO ONE else have to do this? This seems really unfair.

vartanarsen
May 20, 2011, 02:03 PM
:confused:

So confused
Dont understand any of this.
When you go on iTunes, and go to the iTune Music Store, and pay 99 cents for a track, everything should be all set..no more licesnes, ect. to worry about.
Why then does Apple need a whole set of new licensed just to give the user the ability to put that song they just bought from iTunes into the cloud???:confused:

314631
May 20, 2011, 02:13 PM
why does NO ONE else have to do this? This seems really unfair.

Probably because Apple has a business model beyond charging for storage, and that requires content licensing. Obviously it's going to cost us though. :D

Skika
May 20, 2011, 02:15 PM
I think it will be a bigger problem with the publishers. They are more involved actually with the music being played other then sold.

Piggie
May 20, 2011, 02:21 PM
Seems odd.

I can buy a music track, ripp a music track, hell, I could even pirate a music track. Upload this mp3 file onto any of the cloud services, and then play the mp3 file back on my iDevice.

So seeing as that's simple, easy and possible now. Just what are Apple up to?

I think most people just assumed it would be a place to upload their music onto to free their device of holding data, but it's obviously going to be a lot more involved than that, why would the music people need all this licencing deals in place, when you don't need them now to put your purchased tracks in the cloud.

Seems all a bit fishy.

Thataboy
May 20, 2011, 02:24 PM
:confused:

So confused
Dont understand any of this.
When you go on iTunes, and go to the iTune Music Store, and pay 99 cents for a track, everything should be all set..no more licesnes, ect. to worry about.
Why then does Apple need a whole set of new licensed just to give the user the ability to put that song they just bought from iTunes into the cloud???:confused:


Because that's not how the service would work. The way it will likely work: Apple streams to you THEIR master copies of a file after scanning/verifying you have it in iTunes. That is different than you uploading your OWN copy of a file to a server (like Amazon/Google).

dustinsc
May 20, 2011, 02:28 PM
The momentum is clearly now in Apple's favor for rolling this out. It just better have some killer features that make it clearly beat Google and Amazon. I like iTunes, and I'd like a seamless solution for getting my music to my work computer.

radiohead14
May 20, 2011, 02:30 PM
:confused:

So confused
Dont understand any of this.
When you go on iTunes, and go to the iTune Music Store, and pay 99 cents for a track, everything should be all set..no more licesnes, ect. to worry about.
Why then does Apple need a whole set of new licensed just to give the user the ability to put that song they just bought from iTunes into the cloud???:confused:

it's for mechanical royalties.. for the writers

vartanarsen
May 20, 2011, 02:33 PM
Because that's not how the service would work. The way it will likely work: Apple streams to you THEIR master copies of a file after scanning/verifying you have it in iTunes. That is different than you uploading your OWN copy of a file to a server (like Amazon/Google).


Interesting....but then why the need for building massive data centers when all Apple would need to do is stream their Master copy (which they already have in their server and something for which they already got licenses a long time ago...in order to sell via traditional iTunes methodology

gramirez2012
May 20, 2011, 02:43 PM
Come on already, MobileMe was supposed to be updated in April. My mom had gotten a free trial when she bought her new MacBook back in March, but it expired already.

virus7
May 20, 2011, 02:50 PM
I'm a little confused too...I'm hoping this 'new' service is similar to Lala.com's service, which Apple acquired. They would allow you to stream their master copy of your music, assuming they had it, otherwise you could upload a copy.

I'd assume they had these licences set up already so wouldn't it be easy for Apple to do the same.

Maybe I'm making too many assumptions...

damage00
May 20, 2011, 02:52 PM
Good god, what a kludge. Even the middlemen have middlemen. No wonder the industry is in trouble.

microbial
May 20, 2011, 02:53 PM
I am a long time ipod/itunes (and now iphone) user. I have a ton of music (~140G) in my library. I love the idea of streaming music from the cloud, and can't wait to see what Apple is coming up with for MobileMe/iTunes.

However, what I don't get is, why wouldn't iTunes just move to a Rhapsody-like format? $10/month for streaming access to all of their music? In addition to using my iTunes library with my iPod and iPhone, I have been using rhapsody for a while now, and it's great. The mobile app is terrific.

I can't see the point paying Apple anything more than $10/month for cloud streaming if it only limits me to the music I already own, when for the same price Rhapsody gives me access to most of what I own plus millions more songs that I don't own. I don't need to upload anything to Rhapsody, and much of what I own is already there. I just use my iTunes for the rest.

I'd like to see some sort of hybrid plan from Apple, where you can pay a monthly fee (ala Rhapsody, MOG, Rdio, etc) to get access to all of iTunes' music on a streaming basis, compatible with phones, ipods, computers, appleTV, etc., and ALSO upload music to the cloud if iTunes doesn't have it.

Piggie
May 20, 2011, 03:15 PM
I can't see any monthy free to "Only" listen to your own purchased music every working.

Can't you pay a similar amount and listen to any track at any time with other services?

Why would you buy a track, then have to pay per month to have access to you track?

rworne
May 20, 2011, 03:34 PM
Apple streaming fromt their stored copies sounds about right. Sorta like what MP3.com did back in the day whre you stuck in a CD and they supplied you with ripped MP3's.

If they allow uploading a user's own tracks, I'd be really concerned.

Depending on what the labels wanted, and I'd be pretty sure they would want the ability to look and see what users uploaded to the cloud. This could then lead to fishing expeditions where EMI or Universal or some other publisher could then demand a user "prove" they have the rights to what was on the service.

It could prove quite lucrative. It's a dumb move on the Labels' part, but I am beyond looking for any sense of sanity from them.

Piggie
May 20, 2011, 03:45 PM
So what about Spotify?

13 million tracks to select from, your own playlists, for a fixed monthly fee and you never have to buy any track, you just pay your subscription and listen to anything all day long.

LoganT
May 20, 2011, 04:03 PM
So what about Spotify?

13 million tracks to select from, your own playlists, for a fixed monthly fee and you never have to buy any track, you just pay your subscription and listen to anything all day long.

Well if Spotify would ever find a way to launch in the US, that would be a viable option.

Piggie
May 20, 2011, 04:07 PM
Well if Spotify would ever find a way to launch in the US, that would be a viable option.

It's only a matter of time is it not?

If we can use it in the UK, I don't know why you can't enjoy the same thing over there?

Or is Apple trying to "get in" before this happens, or doing dirty deals with the media industry to make sure Spotify can never launch in the US ?

min_t
May 20, 2011, 04:15 PM
I just don't get the big push for Cloud streaming with music, The iPhone, witch was founded on putting an iPod and phone with a PDA that comusmes data from a wireless provider that has been seeing data rising and in return has raised prices and now are moving to tired data plans is going to be OK with streaming music from a cloud!

Big bills for data comming soon if you use your iphone for what it was created for....music phone calls and web

20hrs of streaming music over a 30 day peroid is about 7.8gb of streaming data !
:confused:

And some of us were lucky enough to stick with the unlimited when unlimited was unlimited.;)

radiohead14
May 20, 2011, 07:00 PM
Good god, what a kludge. Even the middlemen have middlemen. No wonder the industry is in trouble.

this is nothing new.. even before the digital music era, record labels had to clear songs from publishers. this is what people who illegally download music don't realize. they think that it's not a big deal, since these artists and labels have enough money, but they fail to realize that they are mostly screwing over hard working writers who, some, earn much less money from album sales

KingCrimson
May 20, 2011, 08:19 PM
Who wants to bet that after Apple has sealed all these licensing deals that the RIAA is going to shut down all the digital lockers out there unless they can *prove* they aren't hosting any pirated music?

Luscious
May 20, 2011, 09:54 PM
These cloud based services will all be massive flops in the end. Storage technology is always increasing and prices are coming down meanwhile more and more restrictions are being put on mobile broadband and things like unlimited plans are going away because mobile broadband providers can't keep up with the demand. Also from a battery perspective we all know how quickly the batteries in our mobile devices die if you're heavily using mobile broadband.

A service like this would be useful as a cloud based backup of my media, for those times when there are some songs I'd like to hear that aren't on my mobile device and battery life isn't an issue and on any device that is wired that either isn't on my local network or is but doesn't have much storage capacity on it's own. Let's face it. For most of us, it's kind of niche deal.

Now, some kind of cloud based subscription service where you pay a monthly fee and have access to a wide range of media that you don't already own is something that is useful and will be a hit if priced right with a large enough library.

Hopefully this service is step one in getting media companies on-board with the ultimate goal of subscription based streaming services of media you don't already own. That kind of service is something I would pay money for if priced right. Cloud based storage of your own media at this point in time isn't unless it's free.

KingCrimson
May 20, 2011, 10:24 PM
These cloud based services will all be massive flops in the end. Storage technology is always increasing and prices are coming down meanwhile more and more restrictions are being put on mobile broadband and things like unlimited plans are going away because mobile broadband providers can't keep up with the demand. Also from a battery perspective we all know how quickly the batteries in our mobile devices die if you're heavily using mobile broadband.

A service like this would be useful as a cloud based backup of my media, for those times when there are some songs I'd like to hear that aren't on my mobile device and battery life isn't an issue and on any device that is wired that either isn't on my local network or is but doesn't have much storage capacity on it's own. Let's face it. For most of us, it's kind of niche deal.

Now, some kind of cloud based subscription service where you pay a monthly fee and have access to a wide range of media that you don't already own is something that is useful and will be a hit if priced right with a large enough library.

Hopefully this service is step one in getting media companies on-board with the ultimate goal of subscription based streaming services of media you don't already own. That kind of service is something I would pay money for if priced right. Cloud based storage of your own media at this point in time isn't unless it's free.

I predict the iTunes Cloud will be a massive failure as most people will not want to be strictly tied to these music labels.

Luscious
May 20, 2011, 10:50 PM
I just don't get the big push for Cloud streaming with music, The iPhone, witch was founded on putting an iPod and phone with a PDA that comusmes data from a wireless provider that has been seeing data rising and in return has raised prices and now are moving to tired data plans is going to be OK with streaming music from a cloud!

Big bills for data comming soon if you use your iphone for what it was created for....music phone calls and web

20hrs of streaming music over a 30 day peroid is about 7.8gb of streaming data !
:confused:

You hit the nail on the head. Streaming your own music that's not on your mobile device is cute, but who is really going to do that often and for extended periods of time considering the caps that are on most mobile data plans, the effect accessing mobile broadband has on mobile device battery life and the obvious fact that you're going to load your favorite stuff on your mobile device so what you leave off is likely stuff you don't listen to as much anyway?

I just don't get it. Unless it's a 100% free service and is just phase one in Apple's master plan to get the major media companies on board with a streaming subscription based service to allow users to access a giant library of media that they haven't already purchased for a monthly fee. If that's the ultimate goal here I get it. Baby steps with these media companies that are historically ten steps behind the times. If that's the ultimate goal it would amount to a boat load of recurring revenue and a service that clearly provides end users with value if it's priced right.

With that being said if the end game here is just letting users stream things they already bought to their mobile devices in a world where storage is getting larger, cheaper and physically smaller all the time and where mobile broadband is going from unlimited to capped because mobile broadband providers are struggling to keep up with more and more smartphones with Internet access let alone smartphones with Internet access that stream a bunch of media then I think this is bound to be a flop.

SockRolid
May 21, 2011, 12:18 PM
Who wants to bet that after Apple has sealed all these licensing deals that the RIAA is going to shut down all the digital lockers out there unless they can *prove* they aren't hosting any pirated music?

I'm sure there's a line on this in Vegas.

SockRolid
May 21, 2011, 12:36 PM
[ ... ] I just don't get it. Unless it's a 100% free service and is just phase one in Apple's master plan to get the major media companies on board with a streaming subscription based service to allow users to access a giant library of media that they haven't already purchased for a monthly fee. If that's the ultimate goal here I get it. [ ... ]

Henry Ford once said "If I'd asked my customers what they wanted, they'd have said 'A faster horse.'"

Apple is preparing for 2021 with their cloud service. Yes, it is a baby step. No, it's not going to fail. It's a crucial part of Apple's future and they will make sure it succeeds.

10 years from now, devices that can stream audio and 3d video will be so cheap that not even Apple will be able to maintain their hardware margins any more. Battery life won't be an issue even at true 4G speeds. Wireless internet access will be fast and pervasive. We'll look back at 2011 and laugh when we remember the good old days when we actually downloaded and carried gigabytes of media around with us.

Apple needs to start changing their business model from "software sells hardware" to "software sells services." Immediately. It will take time. Heterogeneous interoperability with internet connectivity (now called "the cloud" by marketing droids) is one of the first steps in that massive business model migration.

Just think of the big picture. Apple wants to do more than just build iPods that stream. They want to be involved in as much of the recorded entertainment industry as they can. Music, movies, TV, with Apple software at the bottom (server farms), middle (iTunes) and top (iOS, Mac OS). On pocket-sized devices, pads, laptops, desktop computers, and yes, HDTV in your living room. Apple TV is still just a hobby. 10 years from now it will be Apple's main revenue source.

KingCrimson
May 21, 2011, 01:09 PM
Henry Ford once said "If I'd asked my customers what they wanted, they'd have said 'A faster horse.'"

Apple is preparing for 2021 with their cloud service. Yes, it is a baby step. No, it's not going to fail. It's a crucial part of Apple's future and they will make sure it succeeds.

10 years from now, devices that can stream audio and 3d video will be so cheap that not even Apple will be able to maintain their hardware margins any more. Battery life won't be an issue even at true 4G speeds. Wireless internet access will be fast and pervasive. We'll look back at 2011 and laugh when we remember the good old days when we actually downloaded and carried gigabytes of media around with us.

Apple needs to start changing their business model from "software sells hardware" to "software sells services." Immediately. It will take time. Heterogeneous interoperability with internet connectivity (now called "the cloud" by marketing droids) is one of the first steps in that massive business model migration.

Just think of the big picture. Apple wants to do more than just build iPods that stream. They want to be involved in as much of the recorded entertainment industry as they can. Music, movies, TV, with Apple software at the bottom (server farms), middle (iTunes) and top (iOS, Mac OS). On pocket-sized devices, pads, laptops, desktop computers, and yes, HDTV in your living room. Apple TV is still just a hobby. 10 years from now it will be Apple's main revenue source.

Who cares about 10 years from now. All that matters *now* is Apple got into bed with the big music labels and it stinks.

iEvolution
May 22, 2011, 01:48 PM
Henry Ford once said "If I'd asked my customers what they wanted, they'd have said 'A faster horse.'"

Apple is preparing for 2021 with their cloud service. Yes, it is a baby step. No, it's not going to fail. It's a crucial part of Apple's future and they will make sure it succeeds.

10 years from now, devices that can stream audio and 3d video will be so cheap that not even Apple will be able to maintain their hardware margins any more. Battery life won't be an issue even at true 4G speeds. Wireless internet access will be fast and pervasive. We'll look back at 2011 and laugh when we remember the good old days when we actually downloaded and carried gigabytes of media around with us.

Apple needs to start changing their business model from "software sells hardware" to "software sells services." Immediately. It will take time. Heterogeneous interoperability with internet connectivity (now called "the cloud" by marketing droids) is one of the first steps in that massive business model migration.

Just think of the big picture. Apple wants to do more than just build iPods that stream. They want to be involved in as much of the recorded entertainment industry as they can. Music, movies, TV, with Apple software at the bottom (server farms), middle (iTunes) and top (iOS, Mac OS). On pocket-sized devices, pads, laptops, desktop computers, and yes, HDTV in your living room. Apple TV is still just a hobby. 10 years from now it will be Apple's main revenue source.

Yeah a future where corporate servers hold all of your data, what a great future that'd be.

KingCrimson
May 22, 2011, 01:50 PM
Yeah a future where corporate servers hold all of your data, what a great future that'd be.

They're called digital lockers. Fully encrypted and beyond the reach of any intrusive officials.

guoxianteng
May 24, 2011, 02:12 AM
Apple product is too expensive, and ordinary people can't afford it.

b0blndsy
May 24, 2011, 02:44 AM
I predict the iTunes Cloud will be a massive failure as most people will not want to be strictly tied to these music labels.

I disagree, most of the people who are traveling most of the time and youngsters will love this.

caspersoong
May 27, 2011, 06:58 AM
So many rumors on this... can't wait for it to be launched.