Android has only 17 apps.

Umm, did you look at the date on the article?

This forum thread provides an up-to-date list of Honeycomb applications.

Flash support in the browser on Honeycomb negates the need for some applications which contribute to the high number on iOS. I'd rather see Flash videos and games played right in the page rather than having to quit and launch a separate app...

Since most people use Tablets for web browsing (and Android provides a full web browsing experience unlike iOS), I don't see a problem.

I think it's great that the App Store has over a billion apps or whatever... but I only have 14 installed on my iPhone, and about 9 of them are just apps to replace a website such as the Facebook and Twitter apps. The rest consist of a couple of games, a messenger, a radio app, Kindle app and a flashlight app. And if iOS gave a full web experience, I doubt I'd have use for the games, messenger and the radio apps.

Basically, I don't see this as an issue.

And the purpose of this thread is to do what?

roadbloc said:

Since most people use Tablets for web browsing (and Android provides a full web browsing experience unlike iOS), I don't see a problem.

I think it's great that the App Store has over a billion apps or whatever... but I only have 14 installed on my iPhone, and about 9 of them are just apps to replace a website such as the Facebook and Twitter apps. The rest consist of a couple of games, a messenger, a radio app, Kindle app and a flashlight app. And if iOS gave a full web experience, I doubt I'd have use for the games, messenger and the radio apps.

Basically, I don't see this as an issue.

Click to expand...

yep I have to agree having flash on my Android browser is a lot nicer than I though. I figured it was an eh thing for a small screen but being able to play embed videos on websites turns out to be a lot nicer than I was expecting.

The best thing I like about android apps is that you don't need account for downloading free apps as compared to Apple. (where you need to have an apple account in order to download a free app)

Clearly, the OP is trying to put Android in a negative light, when he probably uses the poor old Flash-less iPad to browse the web. It's a sad little product.

I know the world may eventually go towards HTML5, but an Android device will be able to access both Flash and HTML5, and just what Steve Jobs allows you to.

roadbloc said:

Since most people use Tablets for web browsing (and Android provides a full web browsing experience unlike iOS), I don't see a problem.

Click to expand...

You can do so much with an iPad. It's pretty insane. Would you like me to list the Top Apps in each category? Hell, better yet, I'll list *my* apps and give you a sampler of just what I can do with my iPad.

Abstract said:

It's a sad little product

Click to expand...

It's a sad little product that is *still* the only viable tablet option out there. And the competition has had over a YEAR to get it right.

The lack of Flash doesn't seem to be a problem when it comes to sales.

neiltc13 said:

Umm, did you look at the date on the article?

This forum thread provides an up-to-date list of Honeycomb applications.

Flash support in the browser on Honeycomb negates the need for some applications which contribute to the high number on iOS. I'd rather see Flash videos and games played right in the page rather than having to quit and launch a separate app...

Click to expand...

Two excellent threads I use to keep up with Honeycomb apps are these two: (Clue: both feature more than 17 apps)
http://forum.androidcentral.com/mot...al-optimized-honeycomb-apps-list-n-216-a.html

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=999133

I think I already have more than 17 Honeycomb optimized apps and games installed on my Xoom. A nice fail post by the OP tho.

There isnt anything today missing from my honeycomb experience now.

Streaming Movies/TV series from my Mac = Plex
Streaming music from my Mac = Audiogalaxy
Twitter app = Tweetcomb
Facebook = Friendcaster
Browser + flash gives me plenty of online content (LoveFilm player, bbc player etc)

I've also bought plenty of Tegra and Honeycomb optimised games too.

All is well for me in Honeycomb land.

Rodimus Prime said:

yep I have to agree having flash on my Android browser is a lot nicer than I though. I figured it was an eh thing for a small screen but being able to play embed videos on websites turns out to be a lot nicer than I was expecting.

Click to expand...

Every time I hear this given as a reason why mobile devices need Flash support it makes me cringe. The only reason Flash became the standard way of playing audio/video media online is because of the lousy browser support for a better standard — it's nothing but a stodgy workaround for a problem which, quite frankly, should have been resolved many years ago. Finally, HTML 5 provides simple video and audio tags. Now it's just up to the browser developers to support it (which they do), and to get over their differences on which media formats to support.

neiltc13 said:

Flash support in the browser on Honeycomb negates the need for some applications which contribute to the high number on iOS. I'd rather see Flash videos and games played right in the page rather than having to quit and launch a separate app...

Click to expand...

Seriously? Given the choice, you'd rather have to fire up your web browser, navigate to a website, click on the Flash game, wait for it to download, and have all the overhead of the Flash Player, rather than just click once on an app icon and play a game that runs natively? Oookay…

*LTD* said:

You can do so much with an iPad. It's pretty insane. Would you like me to list the Top Apps in each category? Hell, better yet, I'll list *my* apps and give you a sampler of just what I can do with my iPad.

Click to expand...

As we have already established, app numbers are irrelevant when your tablet can display all parts of web pages. Why would I want to launch an 'app' for Facebook, Twitter etc when I can just visit the full website in the browser?

Think about how many applications you have on your computer to replicate the functionality of websites.

kalsta said:

Every time I hear this given as a reason why mobile devices need Flash support it makes me cringe. The only reason Flash became the standard way of playing audio/video media online is because of the lousy browser support for a better standard — it's nothing but a stodgy workaround for a problem which, quite frankly, should have been resolved many years ago. Finally, HTML 5 provides simple video and audio tags. Now it's just up to the browser developers to support it (which they do), and to get over their differences on which media formats to support.

Click to expand...

Browser developers supporting it isn't the problem. The problem is getting users to upgrade their browsers.

And also, until someone invents a way to display DRM protected video using the HTML5 <video> tag then we're not going to see mass adoption by the video sites people want to use - TV networks, movie studios etc.

Seriously? Given the choice, you'd rather have to fire up your web browser, navigate to a website, click on the Flash game, wait for it to download, and have all the overhead of the Flash Player, rather than be able to click once on an app icon and play a game that runs natively? Oookay…

Click to expand...

Of course a native application is going to be the better option in some cases. However, I'm more thinking of content discovery. If I'm on a gaming blog and I see a link to a new game, I'd rather click the link and start playing rather than having to click the link, realise it is Flash so I can't play and then hope that there is an iOS version available. If there is, I have to quit the browser, go to the app store, find the app, log in, download and then launch it. Hardly an ideal process.

The same goes for video. I'm on a website that has embedded video content from a video sharing site that isn't YouTube. On my Android tablet, the video plays when I tap the play button. On iPad, again I have to hope that the video sharing site either has an HTML5 version, or I have to go to the app store, find the app, download it, launch it, search for the video I wanted to see and then start viewing. It's far worse if the site in question has built its own proprietary video container - I simply won't be able to see that video.

kalsta said:

Every time I hear this given as a reason why mobile devices need Flash support it makes me cringe. The only reason Flash became the standard way of playing audio/video media online is because of the lousy browser support for a better standard — it's nothing but a stodgy workaround for a problem which, quite frankly, should have been resolved many years ago. Finally, HTML 5 provides simple video and audio tags. Now it's just up to the browser developers to support it (which they do), and to get over their differences on which media formats to support.

Click to expand...

I do agree with this as I long for the day I can fire up any browser and be able to access all of the content available on a site.

As a stop-gap for now, flash does the job (albeit not always well) but I'd prefer it if the HTML5 standards were finalised with universal browser support.

ChazUK said:

I do agree with this as I long for the day I can fire up any browser and be able to access all of the content available on a site.

As a stop-gap for now, flash does the job (albeit not always well) but I'd prefer it if the HTML5 standards were finalised with universal browser support.

Click to expand...

The HTML 5 standards are already well and truly in place for this, but as usual the number of people still using older versions of Internet Explorer tends to slow down progress for everyone. Also, the browser makers can't seem to agree on which media codecs to support, forcing developers to publish each file in multiple flavours, so that is frustrating. Still, it's possible to support now, and as for all those old IE users… I think it's about time they got a jolly good kick in the pants anyway.

neiltc13 said:

Of course a native application is going to be the better option in some cases. However, I'm more thinking of content discovery. If I'm on a gaming blog and I see a link to a new game, I'd rather click the link and start playing rather than having to click the link, realise it is Flash so I can't play and then hope that there is an iOS version available. If there is, I have to quit the browser, go to the app store, find the app, log in, download and then launch it. Hardly an ideal process.

Click to expand...

Okay, fair enough. I guess that scenario hasn't affected me yet so it's not something I considered.

Browser developers supporting it isn't the problem. The problem is getting users to upgrade their browsers.

Click to expand...

Yes, I acknowledged that problem too in my previous comment, before I noticed that you had edited your comment to reply to me. Believe me, as someone involved in web development, I know all about supporting [insert rude word here] Microsoft web browsers. If I had my way, all web developers would band together and agree to put a 'Sorry, this website requires you to update your browser' screen for anything less than IE9!

*LTD* said:

It's a sad little product that is *still* the only viable tablet option out there. And the competition has had over a YEAR to get it right.

The lack of Flash doesn't seem to be a problem when it comes to sales.

Click to expand...

If 'sales' are you measure of a great product, then the iPad is a fantastic product. Personally, I don't believe that to be true. I was a Mac user before they became popular, and that's because I believe in good products, not good sales.

A device meant for media consumption, but can't handle Flash, isn't a good product for media consumption, IMO.

Clearly, a product that can handle both Flash and HTML5 is better than a product that can't handle Flash, and is waiting for HTML5 to become the only thing around.

kalsta said:

The only reason Flash became the standard way of playing audio/video media online is because of the lousy browser support for a better standard — it's nothing but a stodgy workaround for a problem which, quite frankly, should have been resolved many years ago. Finally, HTML 5 provides simple video and audio tags. Now it's just up to the browser developers to support it (which they do), and to get over their differences on which media formats to support.

Click to expand...

True, but giving reasons from history does not mean that having Flash today isn't important. I live in the real world, not an idealized world where HTML5 is the only thing out there. Flash isn't fake. It's real, and real people need to deal with Flash when browsing the internet because that's the way the world is, as much as that may upset you as a web developer.

Ideally, you'd want a product to support as many things as possible.

Abstract said:

True, but giving reasons from history does not mean that having Flash today isn't important. I live in the real world, not an idealized world where HTML5 is the only thing out there. Flash isn't fake. It's real, and real people need to deal with Flash when browsing the internet because that's the way the world is, as much as that may upset you as a web developer.

Click to expand...

Fine, but it may be that the popularity of the iPad (and the fact that it doesn't support Flash) actually forces developers to support modern standards, and that is a good thing IMO. It's also a good thing that there are other devices on the market that do support Flash, for those who want it. I'm not against choice. But I am against the argument that the iPad is inherently flawed or doomed to ultimate failure because, in this regard, it embraces the future rather than the past.

Ideally, you'd want a product to support as many things as possible.

Click to expand...

As a consumer, you could argue that. We've become very spoiled as to what these devices can do.

I look at it a little differently I guess. The iPad is what it is. It's not my MacBook Pro and I don't expect it to be. For many iPad owners it is a toy, and I don't use that term in a derogatory way. It is a powerful and very entertaining device, but it doesn't do everything. For us it finds a very happy place in our home, and no one complains about lack of Flash anymore because we have so many amazing games on it. Yes, it would be nice if it could play every video on the web, but I would rather see the world embrace modern standards, and perhaps the iPad's popularity is helping to fast track that to some degree.

Abstract said:

Clearly, the OP is trying to put Android in a negative light,

Click to expand...

You don't have to try very hard to do that.

Universally licensed operating systems that are open-source, have and will continue to be very problematic. That's the price the user pays for a companies' race for big share numbers and low cost.

Plus, this is an Apple fansite. You'll get a lot of pro-Apple comments (and let's be fair, most of them are very understandable given what Apple's done.) This is the place to do it.

*LTD* said:

Plus, this is an Apple fansite. You'll get a lot of pro-Apple comments (and let's be fair, most of them are very understandable given what Apple's done.) This is the place to do it.

Click to expand...

I respect your opinion and also expect a pro Apple slant here but do you support threads like this that are factually incorrect because they are based on outdated news?

*LTD* said:

Plus, this is an Apple fansite. You'll get a lot of pro-Apple comments (and let's be fair, most of them are very understandable given what Apple's done.) This is the place to do it.

Click to expand...

I was unaware this was an apple fansite. I was under the impression it was a site to talk about apple related things critically and praisingly and to seek assistance.



No one likes blind loyalty...and the subsequent posts that exhibit such mentality over and over

neiltc13 said:

As we have already established, app numbers are irrelevant when your tablet can display all parts of web pages. Why would I want to launch an 'app' for Facebook, Twitter etc when I can just visit the full website in the browser?

Click to expand...

3 out of the 12 'Top' free apps in Mac App Store are desktop clients for 'full' websites (Twitter, Facebook and Evernote). Why is that? Because the experience is simply better. Such apps are very popular on iOS too.

AdrianK said:

3 out of the 12 'Top' free apps in Mac App Store are desktop clients for 'full' websites (Twitter, Facebook and Evernote). Why is that? Because the experience is simply better. Such apps are very popular on iOS too.

Click to expand...

Those little Apps are great for twitter I will say that on both my laptop and Atrix. But it is more for the widget like state for both.

kalsta said:

Every time I hear this given as a reason why mobile devices need Flash support it makes me cringe. The only reason Flash became the standard way of playing audio/video media online is because of the lousy browser support for a better standard — it's nothing but a stodgy workaround for a problem which, quite frankly, should have been resolved many years ago. Finally, HTML 5 provides simple video and audio tags. Now it's just up to the browser developers to support it (which they do), and to get over their differences on which media formats to support.

Click to expand...

You need to look up the history of flash. It was never designed to orginally handle video but that was an add on audio was easier to bake into it.

As for the internet HTML5 is still a long ways from being ready for prime time. It is a crap shoot on if a given browser will support something. For example go look at MS HTML5 test things or Apple test things for HTML5. You will noticed something they only really work well on either IE or Safari. This proves to me that it is not ready for prime time. MS more so the Apple since Apple is more likely to put their only browser hooks. Until all the browser can handle MS little test area great it just shows HTML5 is not ready for prime time at all.

Flash works and is what the real world works in. Right now HTML5 sucks down more processor power than Flash sadly.

Now for most of the web flash is really not needed big time on a mobile browser but I have multiple times run into sites were it is just nice being able to play embed videos in the site with out having to launch a separate app.

Rodimus Prime said:

You need to look up the history of flash. It was never designed to orginally handle video but that was an add on audio was easier to bake into it.

Click to expand...

Where did I say Flash was originally designed to handle video? Mate, I was creating Flash based websites many years before the iPhone was even a twinkle in Steve's eye, so I do know a little about it.

As for the internet HTML5 is still a long ways from being ready for prime time. It is a crap shoot on if a given browser will support something.

Click to expand...

HTML5 is not yet complete, but elements of it are well supported. To write the whole thing off as not ready for prime time just speaks of ignorance. See this page for an overview of browser support: http://www.findmebyip.com/litmus/ Older versions of IE tend to be what holds back support for modern standards more than anything. That is a real shame, but when it comes to online video, that's not really an excuse, because there are many solutions which use HTML5 by default and only fall back to the Flash Player if someone is using an old browser. Many developers have put countless hours of work into producing solutions like these to pave the transition, mostly because a company like Microsoft is so damn slow at implementing standards and even slower at getting its users to adopt. These solutions are ready to use now.

Rodimus Prime said:

T

As for the internet HTML5 is still a long ways from being ready for prime time.

Click to expand...

I hadn't noticed.

YouTube works perfectly on my iDevices.

*LTD* said:

I hadn't noticed.

YouTube works perfectly on my iDevices.

Click to expand...

What? You must only visit youtube then...

Abstract said:

If 'sales' are you measure of a great product, then the iPad is a fantastic product. Personally, I don't believe that to be true. I was a Mac user before they became popular, and that's because I believe in good products, not good sales.

A device meant for media consumption, but can't handle Flash, isn't a good product for media consumption, IMO.

Clearly, a product that can handle both Flash and HTML5 is better than a product that can't handle Flash, and is waiting for HTML5 to become the only thing around.

Ideally, you'd want a product to support as many things as possible.

Click to expand...

+1

hit the nail on the head -

flash supports is really irritating on the iphone - on the ipad - really limits its functionality

here's hoping ios5 brings flash - as i gave up my ipad since it really didnt do what i wanted it to do!

*LTD* said:

YouTube works perfectly on my iDevices.

Click to expand...

YouTube != The Internet.

To be honest, whenever I try out YouTube in HTML5 mode on my iMac, it is slow and poor quality.

(PS. This is not an Apple fan site.)