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MacRumors
Jun 3, 2011, 11:16 AM
http://images.macrumors.com/im/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/06/03/apple-overtakes-research-in-motion-in-u-s-smartphone-usage-share/)


http://images.macrumors.com/article-new/2011/06/comscore_apr11_smartphones.jpg


comScore today released (http://www.comscore.com/Press_Events/Press_Releases/2011/6/comScore_Reports_April_2011_U.S._Mobile_Subscriber_Market_Share) the results of its April survey of mobile phone usage in the United States, finding that Apple has nudged past Research in Motion to claim the second spot among smartphone platforms behind Android. According to the data, Android continues to widen its lead and now holds 36.4% of the market, while Apple's iOS holds 26.0% and Research in Motion's BlackBerry operating system has slipped to 25.7%.

http://images.macrumors.com/article-new/2011/06/comscore_apr11_phones.jpg


When looking at mobile phone manufacturers overall, Apple is now the fourth most-popular vendor with 8.3% of the market, once again barely beating out Research in Motion.

comScore's surveys of over 30,000 mobile phone subscribers examine installed user base rather than quarterly sales as with many other sources. Consequently, comScore's data examines a slightly different metric that is slower to respond to shifts in sales trends. Apple passed Research in Motion (http://www.macrumors.com/2010/11/01/apple-tops-u-s-smartphone-vendors-trails-android-consortium/) in quarterly U.S. shipments late last year, but the BlackBerry maker's historical lead had enabled it to hold off Apple in installed user base share until recently.

Article Link: Apple Overtakes Research in Motion in U.S. Smartphone Usage Share (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/06/03/apple-overtakes-research-in-motion-in-u-s-smartphone-usage-share/)



Aduntu
Jun 3, 2011, 11:24 AM
I made the mistake one time of thinking I would enjoy a BlackBerry more than an iPhone. Boy was I wrong.

toddybody
Jun 3, 2011, 11:28 AM
I guess I was wrong about the whole iPhone Fad going belly up

TC400
Jun 3, 2011, 11:29 AM
I don't ever believe this because next week you will hear that Android will have more market share and blah blah blah it's always different.
In my mind the iPhone is THE BEST smart phone.

blueroom
Jun 3, 2011, 11:30 AM
I made the mistake one time of thinking I would enjoy a BlackBerry more than an iPhone. Boy was I wrong.

My significant other has a BlackBerry, I was not impressed.

AFPoster
Jun 3, 2011, 11:31 AM
w00t w00t stoked about this!!!

bpeeps
Jun 3, 2011, 11:33 AM
I don't ever believe this because next week you will hear that Android will have more market share and blah blah blah it's always different.
In my mind the iPhone is THE BEST smart phone.

I agree, but iOS is not the best mobile operating system.

0815
Jun 3, 2011, 11:34 AM
The interesting news is that MS is still loosing market share .... Are the any number how much of the MS numbers are WinMob7 ?

Laird Knox
Jun 3, 2011, 11:36 AM
I agree, but iOS is not the best mobile operating system.

*YAWN*

Yes, yes, we get it. iOS, Android, Win, Mac, Chevy, Ford, football, futball, yadda, yadda...

NebulaClash
Jun 3, 2011, 11:36 AM
Interesting. And Nielson found during that same quarter that Android's U.S. share dropped from March to April (http://www.electronista.com/articles/11/05/30/nielsen.hints.android.has.stopped.growing/). I realize there are different companies doing the measuring, and in this case Nielson is looking month-to-month instead of by quarter, so we'll have to see what happens the rest of the year. But I would not be surprised to see Android's growth soon slow if not stop.

Think about why Android suddenly gained popularity. Was there a groundswell of demand from average consumers for Android? Not really. Only geeks knew about Android. The average phone buyer goes into a shop and picks a phone based on what's available.

So what caused the very rapid ascent of Android over the last year or so? It's quite simple: All of the also-ran phone manufacturers switched from WinMobile or Symbian or whatever OS to the free Android OS. When you shift all of the other guys into one big Android slice, Android's market share jumps immediately. That is precisely what happened.

But what happens when they have already jumped to Android? Right. Market share levels off. There simply isn't a big consumer-led demand for Android. Again, the geeks demand it, but the average person barely knows what their phone runs.

This was simply a supply-side shift of the also-rans into a single segment of the pie. The shift is over. Thus the share level is starting to become static. No surprise. This is precisely what you would expect to see from a supply-side, rather than a demand-side, situation.

So look for a plateau stage next, and then the stage that follows is a decline in market share for Android as all those also-rans start to consolidate or drop out of the market because they cannot sufficiently differentiate from their me-too competition. Again, this won't be a surprise. Except among the Android supporters who think the whole world is yelling for Android.

ten-oak-druid
Jun 3, 2011, 11:37 AM
The smart phone numbers are more important from an investors point of view.

The iphone basically destroyed Nokia and now Android phones are finishing the job. For some reason the poor performance of Nokia stock is spilling over onto RIM. Although there have been stories about their poor performance too. I guess since they have both had negative stories, investors back of both if they back off one.

tekmoe
Jun 3, 2011, 11:37 AM
Daayyyyyaaaammm!!!! Android is KILLING IT!

My HTC G2 with Android 2.3 craps all over an iPhone. HAHA

KnightWRX
Jun 3, 2011, 11:37 AM
I don't ever believe this because next week you will hear that Android will have more market share and blah blah blah it's always different.

Did you look at the graphs in the summary ? We don't really have to wait to next week to hear about Android having more market share. ;)

0815
Jun 3, 2011, 11:39 AM
I don't ever believe this because next week you will hear that Android will have more market share and blah blah blah it's always different.
In my mind the iPhone is THE BEST smart phone.

I agree and I love my iPhone.

But: Android also has a few great ones, but to many garbage ones and that blurs the whole Android Picture.

juicedropsdeuce
Jun 3, 2011, 11:39 AM
This is very shocking and amazing and super and all, but the real battle of paradigms is between Android and iOS. :rolleyes:

Full of Win
Jun 3, 2011, 11:39 AM
Sounds like a resounding win for Android. Google increase in marketshare was 400% greater than was the increase for Apple.

diamond.g
Jun 3, 2011, 11:41 AM
The smart phone numbers are more important from an investors point of view.

The iphone basically destroyed Nokia and now Android phones are finishing the job. For some reason the poor performance of Nokia stock is spilling over onto RIM. Although there have been stories about their poor performance too. I guess since they have both had negative stories, investors back of both if they back off one.
Nokia was never really a player in the US. Which is what the graphs are showing...

ccraig13
Jun 3, 2011, 11:43 AM
RIM who?

lemoncrsh
Jun 3, 2011, 11:43 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8J2 Safari/6533.18.5)

Whackberry

firewood
Jun 3, 2011, 11:44 AM
Sounds like a resounding win for Android. Google increase in marketshare was 400% greater than was the increase for Apple.

But "losing" isn't so bad for a device vendor that is increasing both market share and total sales, as well as making more profit than any of the vendors selling the resounding "winners" devices.

SandynJosh
Jun 3, 2011, 11:46 AM
The interesting news is that MS is still loosing market share .... Are the any number how much of the MS numbers are WinMob7 ?

Let's see, Ballmer has one, but he only uses it as a phone. Gates was given one, but he hasn't activated it yet, and then the employees were all given one that they pretend to use when at work. Hmm, that's about it.;)

DakotaGuy
Jun 3, 2011, 11:50 AM
All this information tells me is that the smart phone market is heading to Google versus Apple just like the PC market is Apple versus Microsoft. In both PCs and smart phones there are some smaller players, but for the most part that is where things are headed.

AppleDroid
Jun 3, 2011, 11:53 AM
This is very shocking and amazing and super and all, but the real battle of paradigms is between Android and iOS. :rolleyes:

And just like the PC wars Apple makes a great #2. I don't mean this as as slam either but having someone above them in marketshare keeps them hungry and innovating.

mw360
Jun 3, 2011, 11:53 AM
Interesting. And Nielson found during that same quarter that Android's U.S. share dropped from March to April (http://www.electronista.com/articles/11/05/30/nielsen.hints.android.has.stopped.growing/). I realize there are different companies doing the measuring, and in this case Nielson is looking month-to-month instead of by quarter, so we'll have to see what happens the rest of the year. But I would not be surprised to see Android's growth soon slow if not stop.

Think about why Android suddenly gained popularity. Was there a groundswell of demand from average consumers for Android? Not really. Only geeks knew about Android. The average phone buyer goes into a shop and picks a phone based on what's available.

So what caused the very rapid ascent of Android over the last year or so? It's quite simple: All of the also-ran phone manufacturers switched from WinMobile or Symbian or whatever OS to the free Android OS. When you shift all of the other guys into one big Android slice, Android's market share jumps immediately. That is precisely what happened.

But what happens when they have already jumped to Android? Right. Market share levels off. There simply isn't a big consumer-led demand for Android. Again, the geeks demand it, but the average person barely knows what their phone runs.

This was simply a supply-side shift of the also-rans into a single segment of the pie. The shift is over. Thus the share level is starting to become static. No surprise. This is precisely what you would expect to see from a supply-side, rather than a demand-side, situation.

So look for a plateau stage next, and then the stage that follows is a decline in market share for Android as all those also-rans start to consolidate or drop out of the market because they cannot sufficiently differentiate from their me-too competition. Again, this won't be a surprise. Except among the Android supporters who think the whole world is yelling for Android.

That's an interesting post. I would have also added that the also-rans will find themselves split more and more between Android and Windows, decreasing the Android share even more, but it seems I'd be wrong. Is windows really doing that badly?

BornAgainMac
Jun 3, 2011, 11:54 AM
RIM is still doing very well. If Apple had come out with the Blackberry after RIM's had come up with the iPhone then Apple wouldn't even have 1% of the market. The ability that RIM has to sell Blackberry phones against better phones is amazing.

cvaldes
Jun 3, 2011, 11:56 AM
That's an interesting post. I would have also added that the also-rans will find themselves split more and more between Android and Windows, decreasing the Android share even more, but it seems I'd be wrong. Is windows really doing that badly?
Yes, it appears so.

ten-oak-druid
Jun 3, 2011, 11:57 AM
Nokia was never really a player in the US. Which is what the graphs are showing...

Nokia is on its last legs. Look at the stock. And RIM isn't doing too well either.

The reason Nokia didn't fare well is because the iphone and other smart phones came out and Nokia had nothing to compete with. They have now done away with symbian and are going to try Windows phone OS as a last resort.

cube
Jun 3, 2011, 11:57 AM
Wrong statistics again. Any Nokia Series 60 phone is a smartphone.

neko girl
Jun 3, 2011, 11:57 AM
There simply isn't a big consumer-led demand for Android.
Nothing you've said agrees with multiple studies that say otherwise. I'll wait to call the one study of declining Android market share as conclusive until we have more numbers.

OllyW
Jun 3, 2011, 11:59 AM
Think about why Android suddenly gained popularity. Was there a groundswell of demand from average consumers for Android? Not really. Only geeks knew about Android. The average phone buyer goes into a shop and picks a phone based on what's available.

All the geeks I know have got iPhones. My non-geeky friends are all starting to update their dumb phones to Android phones because they don't cost as much as the iPhone.

KnightWRX
Jun 3, 2011, 12:00 PM
Nothing you've said agrees with multiple studies that say otherwise. I'll wait to call the one study of declining Android market share as conclusive until we have more numbers.

Especially since Apple has had quarter-to-quarter share drops before. It always depends. If you release something new one quarter, the next quarter have nothing new and just keep pushing out the same model, you might have a month-to-month or quarter-to-quarter drop.

It happens. Heck, this isn't the first time Apple passes by RIM in market share, but RIM picks it back up. They've been trading spots for a while now. Android definitely blew by both of them though.

In the end, all are winners.

zacman
Jun 3, 2011, 12:00 PM
The chart macrumors posted is a little bit misleading. Actually Apple overtook RIM (again) already in March 2011. However Apple lost about 1.1% marketshare since then and RIM won 0.2%. Also Apple's marketshare is down since December 2010 by almost 6%.

http://s3.amazonaws.com/wpcms_production/resources/images/000/045/713/large/marketshare.png

Also it doesn't look like Android's (worldwide) marketshare will go down in the near future:

http://img685.imageshack.us/img685/8982/smart.gif

ciTiger
Jun 3, 2011, 12:03 PM
Blackberry's are nice, my step father is on the second one but they are very different from an iPhone... To me iPhone all the way...

NebulaClash
Jun 3, 2011, 12:03 PM
That's an interesting post. I would have also added that the also-rans will find themselves split more and more between Android and Windows, decreasing the Android share even more, but it seems I'd be wrong. Is windows really doing that badly?

Windows is really doing that badly at the moment, yes, but I think they will improve in the future. One thing to remember is that Microsoft is charging companies for using Android, claiming that Android infringes on their intellectual property. So, for example, HTC pays Microsoft for every Android phone they make. Android is not free to HTC. Rumors are that other companies are doing the same thing.

Microsoft does this, of course, to make Windows Phone look less expensive in comparison. So yes, as many of these also-rans get tired of being me-too copies of everyone else, I expect some of them will try making Windows phones instead of Android phones.

Phone manufacturers are platform agnostic. They couldn't care less what their phones run as long as they are making money. Android depends on such companies, and that's not a very firm foundation.

NebulaClash
Jun 3, 2011, 12:06 PM
In the end, all are winners.

This truly is the bottom line. Any company that has 20-40% of the smart phone market is laughing all the way to the bank. This is too huge of a market for any one device to take it all. There will be several winners (and a bunch of also-ran losers too) from this market. It won't be a zero-sum game for a very long time.

iRobby
Jun 3, 2011, 12:06 PM
My significant other has a BlackBerry, I was not impressed.

Grounds for DIVORCE

GLS
Jun 3, 2011, 12:07 PM
Sounds like a resounding win for Android. Google increase in marketshare was 400% greater than was the increase for Apple.

For someone who has been here since 2007, you sure have a dislike for all things Apple.

Why stick around? Misery breeds company or somesuch?

cooldaddybeck
Jun 3, 2011, 12:09 PM
The most shocking part of all this? I didn't know Palm still existed or that people still used their equipment.

kevingaffney
Jun 3, 2011, 12:10 PM
I was the first in my circle of friends and business contacts three years ago to use and iPhone here in Ireland. I would take note the odd time I would see anyone using one. Was at a meeting today with five managers of a company and every one of them had one. They have gotten a huge grip on market here and the UK

Oletros
Jun 3, 2011, 12:12 PM
Interesting. And Nielson found during that same quarter that Android's U.S. share dropped from March to April (http://www.electronista.com/articles/11/05/30/nielsen.hints.android.has.stopped.growing/). I realize there are different companies doing the measuring, and in this case Nielson is looking month-to-month instead of by quarter, so we'll have to see what happens the rest of the year. But I would not be surprised to see Android's growth soon slow if not stop.

Think about why Android suddenly gained popularity. Was there a groundswell of demand from average consumers for Android? Not really. Only geeks knew about Android. The average phone buyer goes into a shop and picks a phone based on what's available.

So what caused the very rapid ascent of Android over the last year or so? It's quite simple: All of the also-ran phone manufacturers switched from WinMobile or Symbian or whatever OS to the free Android OS. When you shift all of the other guys into one big Android slice, Android's market share jumps immediately. That is precisely what happened.

But what happens when they have already jumped to Android? Right. Market share levels off. There simply isn't a big consumer-led demand for Android. Again, the geeks demand it, but the average person barely knows what their phone runs.

This was simply a supply-side shift of the also-rans into a single segment of the pie. The shift is over. Thus the share level is starting to become static. No surprise. This is precisely what you would expect to see from a supply-side, rather than a demand-side, situation.

So look for a plateau stage next, and then the stage that follows is a decline in market share for Android as all those also-rans start to consolidate or drop out of the market because they cannot sufficiently differentiate from their me-too competition. Again, this won't be a surprise. Except among the Android supporters who think the whole world is yelling for Android.

Nielsen report also shows an iPhone drop

Negafox
Jun 3, 2011, 12:15 PM
I don't ever believe this because next week you will hear that Android will have more market share and blah blah blah it's always different.
In my mind the iPhone is THE BEST smart phone.

The chart in the article shows that Android has a 10.2% market share lead; so yeah, you can infer from the article that Android has a lead.

*LTD*
Jun 3, 2011, 12:16 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Mobile/8J2)

This was obvious even two years ago.

zacman
Jun 3, 2011, 12:17 PM
Nokia is on its last legs.

Nokia sold about 26 million smartphones the last quarter. Let's imagine that only *half* of that people will get a Nokia Windows Phone 7 in Q4/11 then WP7 will be available on about 16 million phones (13 million Nokia + about 3 million HTC/Samsung/LG/Dell/...) per quarter. With these numbers WP7 soon will be the next big competitor to iOS.

Apple already lost against Android in less than 2 years, they have to fight hard to not get in the third or fourth spot now. And I seriously doubt that iOS5 will fix all the bloatware that Apple introduced over the last years (like choppy animations when launching apps, 20% battery drop since 4.3.1, choppy listview when there are lots of elements, etc.), not even to speak that iOS needs a big facelift. Fixing the crappy notification system can just be the first step here.

ftaok
Jun 3, 2011, 12:18 PM
These charts are telling me that both Apple and RIM are selling significantly more smartphones than any other single vendor. If my calculations are correct, Apple's smartphone marketshare is nearly 2x of Samsung's.

OK, I went back and re-read the linked article. It seems that these charts are for installed user base and not market-share of sales.

Even so, I crunched some numbers (with a few assumptions), and it looks like Apple and RIM have larger smartphone user bases than any other OEM. Also, when looking at the OEM/Andriod combo, both Apple and RIM are approach 2x of any other individual OEM/Android portfolio.

Themaeds
Jun 3, 2011, 12:24 PM
I don't ever believe this because next week you will hear that Android will have more market share and blah blah blah it's always different.
In my mind the iPhone is THE BEST smart phone.


In MY mind Kool Aid tastes great.

Themaeds
Jun 3, 2011, 12:34 PM
For someone who has been here since 2007, you sure have a dislike for all things Apple.

Why stick around? Misery breeds company or somesuch?

Misery? haha he made a very factual statement

chrmjenkins
Jun 3, 2011, 12:35 PM
I think Android's success with consumers will be tested if iPhone 5 rolls out to AT&T and Verizon simultaneously, along with either T-Mobile and/or Sprint. Then we'll know how many simply choose Android because iPhone doesn't exist as a choice for them. The other thing we have to wait for is Apple to have a $100 or lower iphone offering for consumers much like the current 3GS for AT&T. There are a lot of android phones in that segment that can be sold as having most of the same features of the iphone for much less. Some consumers aren't smart enough to look at the monthly costs as compared to the purchase price.

My argument is that your average consumer that isn't tech inclined will always prefer an iPhone over an android phone unless they are finicky about screen size or a hardware keyboard. Most of the people that prefer Android and have well reasoned points for doing so are power users and do not reflect the average consumer. The iphone has a more straight forward app and media purchasing scheme with more options, a more consistent UI and intelligibility to it, more streamlined media playing features, etc. It's just less intimidating.

AaronEdwards
Jun 3, 2011, 12:40 PM
I was the first in my circle of friends and business contacts three years ago to use and iPhone here in Ireland. I would take note the odd time I would see anyone using one. Was at a meeting today with five managers of a company and every one of them had one. They have gotten a huge grip on market here and the UK

In the UK (http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2011/apr/18/smartphone-market-android-win-nokia-rim-lose), between March 2010 and March 2011, iOS went from a 39.5% market share to 23%.

Apple are losing market share in Europe in a way that they aren't in the US.

NebulaClash
Jun 3, 2011, 12:41 PM
All the geeks I know have got iPhones. My non-geeky friends are all starting to update their dumb phones to Android phones because they don't cost as much as the iPhone.

Yes, that's my point. In your case your geek friends went with iPhones, in other cases they go for Android, but they are choosing based on tech features that fit their needs and wants. They do not generally choose based on what's the cheapest.

Your non-geeky friends went with Android because they are available and cheap. That's my point. If all those phone manufacturers switched from Android to Windows, for example, your non-geeky friends would then be buying cheap Windows phones, and the Win Phone market share would jump overnight. And it wouldn't be because of demand for Windows...

Android depends on fickle phone manufacturers for support, and that's a group that is willing to switch any time they feel like it makes business sense.

newagemac
Jun 3, 2011, 12:41 PM
So Apple continues to grow its marketshare and has a whopping 26% all to themselves while its competitors using Android are splitting up only 36% between ALL of them. And the rest not using Android are still losing marketshare.

Holy crap Apple is killing its competitors! :eek:

gnasher729
Jun 3, 2011, 12:43 PM
Nokia sold about 26 million smartphones the last quarter. Let's imagine that only *half* of that people will get a Nokia Windows Phone 7 in Q4/11 then WP7 will be available on about 16 million phones (13 million Nokia + about 3 million HTC/Samsung/LG/Dell/...) per quarter. With these numbers WP7 soon will be the next big competitor to iOS.

But why would people buy a Nokia Windows phone? Nokia used to sell Symbian phones, and for many years (until around 2007) they were the best you could buy. Plenty of people kept buying them, although in shrinking numbers, when better phones became available. But now there are no Symbian phones anymore. Since all these Nokia customers have to switch to something different, why would they switch to a Windows phone? Most of them use Windows at work, they know how bad it is, and they wouldn't want it in their private life if they got paid. The huge majority of these people will switch to iPhone or Android.

newagemac
Jun 3, 2011, 12:46 PM
So Apple continues to grow its marketshare and has a whopping 26% all to themselves while its competitors using Android are splitting up only 36% between ALL of them. And the rest not using Android are still losing marketshare.

Holy crap Apple is killing its competitors! :eek:

Consumers.unite
Jun 3, 2011, 12:47 PM
So Apple continues to grow its marketshare and has a whopping 26% all to themselves while its competitors using Android are splitting up only 36% between ALL of them. And the rest not using Android are still losing marketshare.

Holy crap Apple is killing its competitors! :eek:


Apple will awalys have the profits.

OllyW
Jun 3, 2011, 12:47 PM
Yes, that's my point. In your case your geek friends went with iPhones, in other cases they go for Android, but they are choosing based on tech features that fit their needs and wants. They do not generally choose based on what's the cheapest.

Your non-geeky friends went with Android because they are available and cheap. That's my point. If all those phone manufacturers switched from Android to Windows, for example, your non-geeky friends would then be buying cheap Windows phones, and the Win Phone market share would jump overnight. And it wouldn't be because of demand for Windows...

I agree. They buy them because they are similar to iPhones and are inexpensive. If iPhones cost the same they would probably buy them instead.

The phone OS isn't a consideration for them. I even had to explain to one friend that his phone was running Android, he'd never heard of it before. :)

Dcuellar
Jun 3, 2011, 12:49 PM
How many different smartphones did Android have to be on to have this market share? By default they should be at the top. This doesn't mean they have made more money than Apple or RIM have selling phones with their proprietary OS's.

The problem I see with Android is that there are so many variations in phones that the user experience will never be the same from one consumer to another. Naturally, the advantage of taking this approach of providing only software for phones is that your market share will be greater because you have greater exposure. That doesn't mean the brand value has increased though. For all we know many of the consumers are not educated enough to specifically ask for a phone with an Android OS...instead they are asking for the cheapest.

My household consists of 2 adults and 3 children. All 3 children are approaching the age where they will be asking for cell phones. When my wife and I decide to get them the phones Android's market share will be 3/5 of our household where Apple's will only be 2/5. There's no way I'm going to buy them the more expensive iPhone...

In my mind the iPhone has greater brand value than any other phone on the market. Brand value goes a long way.

Themaeds
Jun 3, 2011, 12:57 PM
For all we know many of the consumers are not educated enough to specifically ask for a phone with an Android OS...instead they are asking for the cheapest.

My household consists of 2 adults and 3 children. All 3 children are approaching the age where they will be asking for cell phones. When my wife and I decide to get them the phones Android's market share will be 3/5 of our household where Apple's will only be 2/5. There's no way I'm going to buy them the more expensive iPhone...

In my mind the iPhone has greater brand value than any other phone on the market. Brand value goes a long way.

I love this general assumption that everyone who isnt OS educated just walks into a cell store and asks for the cheapest phone available. If we apply a little logic to this wouldn't the phone with the best brand awareness be the first choice for someone who is "In the market" and not tech savvy?

Maybe this so called "Idiot" consumer was able to walk into a store and make an educated decision based on what they saw, felt and heard when trying out a phone.

Consumers.unite
Jun 3, 2011, 12:58 PM
How many different smartphones did Android have to be on to have this market share? By default they should be at the top. This doesn't mean they have made more money than Apple or RIM have selling phones with their proprietary OS's.

The problem I see with Android is that there are so many variations in phones that the user experience will never be the same from one consumer to another. Naturally, the advantage of taking this approach of providing only software for phones is that your market share will be greater because you have greater exposure. That doesn't mean the brand value has increased though. For all we know many of the consumers are not educated enough to specifically ask for a phone with an Android OS...instead they are asking for the cheapest.

My household consists of 2 adults and 3 children. All 3 children are approaching the age where they will be asking for cell phones. When my wife and I decide to get them the phones Android's market share will be 3/5 of our household where Apple's will only be 2/5. There's no way I'm going to buy them the more expensive iPhone...

In my mind the iPhone has greater brand value than any other phone on the market. Brand value goes a long way.
______

Actually the Android brand is really high android matches Iphone when it comes to "most desirable smartphone polls", and has a really high satisfaction rate, not as high as Apple but right up there, so you are wrong.

Consumers.unite
Jun 3, 2011, 12:59 PM
How many different smartphones did Android have to be on to have this market share? By default they should be at the top. This doesn't mean they have made more money than Apple or RIM have selling phones with their proprietary OS's.

The problem I see with Android is that there are so many variations in phones that the user experience will never be the same from one consumer to another. Naturally, the advantage of taking this approach of providing only software for phones is that your market share will be greater because you have greater exposure. That doesn't mean the brand value has increased though. For all we know many of the consumers are not educated enough to specifically ask for a phone with an Android OS...instead they are asking for the cheapest.

My household consists of 2 adults and 3 children. All 3 children are approaching the age where they will be asking for cell phones. When my wife and I decide to get them the phones Android's market share will be 3/5 of our household where Apple's will only be 2/5. There's no way I'm going to buy them the more expensive iPhone...

In my mind the iPhone has greater brand value than any other phone on the market. Brand value goes a long way.
________

Others will argue that the good thing about android, there is no one size fits all.

Dcuellar
Jun 3, 2011, 01:02 PM
I love this general assumption that everyone who isnt OS educated just walks into a cell store and asks for the cheapest phone available. If we apply a little logic to this wouldn't the phone with the best brand awareness be the first choice for someone who is "In the market" and not tech savvy?

Maybe this so called "Idiot" consumer was able to walk into a store and make an educated decision based on what they saw, felt and heard when trying out a phone.

No.. Brand awareness means they will also be aware of the price associated with it. If they are not aware of the price, and that happens to play a factor in their buying decision, then they will be attracted to the phones that offer similar features. It's the equivalent to Walmart or Publix selling their own brand of corn, soda, chips, etc.

Dcuellar
Jun 3, 2011, 01:03 PM
And that doesn't make them "idiot" consumers. That just means they they are price-sensitive and the iPhone's price does not fit their budget.

erzhik
Jun 3, 2011, 01:04 PM
The smart phone numbers are more important from an investors point of view.

The iphone basically destroyed Nokia and now Android phones are finishing the job. For some reason the poor performance of Nokia stock is spilling over onto RIM. Although there have been stories about their poor performance too. I guess since they have both had negative stories, investors back of both if they back off one.

iPhone never destroyed Nokia, it didn't even come close to touching it. WTF are you talking about? Newsflash, US market is not the only and definitely not the largest phone market in the world. China market and India markets are far larger, and this is where Nokia dominates (including some European countries). Just so your 12 year old mind knows, Nokia created smartphones and we wouldn't have smartphones of today if it wasn't for Nokia. Get your fanboyism out of your rear cushion.

Dcuellar
Jun 3, 2011, 01:04 PM
______

Actually the Android brand is really high android matches Iphone when it comes to "most desirable smartphone polls", and has a really high satisfaction rate, not as high as Apple but right up there, so you are wrong.

Do you always contradict yourself?

Rodimus Prime
Jun 3, 2011, 01:05 PM
RIM is still doing very well. If Apple had come out with the Blackberry after RIM's had come up with the iPhone then Apple wouldn't even have 1% of the market. The ability that RIM has to sell Blackberry phones against better phones is amazing.

Rim still has its bread and butter and that is enterprise and RIM is not going to hurt that just to court the finky consumer market. Remember in the consumer world what is hot today is cold tomorrow. It is not exactly the most stable market.

All the geeks I know have got iPhones. My non-geeky friends are all starting to update their dumb phones to Android phones because they don't cost as much as the iPhone.

Depends. Geeks I know at school in the Computer Engineering and CS department it goes Android, Blackberry then iPhone way down on the list. In a class of 30+ students you might and I mean MIGHT have 2 iPhones in the entire class. 10-15+ android phones and then 5-6 blackberry. Dumb phones having a small handful. Hell I have seen Windows Mobile have more phones than iPhones. Android is the one taking everything.

Top it off a lot of those blackberry's and Android are from Verizon and AT&T. Add to it talking to them they have zero intersted in going iPhone. Blackberry users for their next phone it pretty much blackberry Android or WP7. iPhone does not come up.

We agree the iPod is a very good media player but just do not like iOS for our cell phone.

Especially since Apple has had quarter-to-quarter share drops before. It always depends. If you release something new one quarter, the next quarter have nothing new and just keep pushing out the same model, you might have a month-to-month or quarter-to-quarter drop.

It happens. Heck, this isn't the first time Apple passes by RIM in market share, but RIM picks it back up. They've been trading spots for a while now. Android definitely blew by both of them though.

In the end, all are winners.

Yep month to month or Quarter to Quarter comperisons are not worth much. I rather see year to year views.

Also marketshare is meaning less and less because they can loss market share but still show growth. Just means the market is growing faster than they are but they are still doing well in the case of RIM.

Oletros
Jun 3, 2011, 01:05 PM
And that doesn't make them "idiot" consumers. That just means they they are price-sensitive and the iPhone's price does not fit their budget.

Galaxy S, Desire HD, etc have morelesss the same price than iPhone and here in Spain they are the Android phones more sold.

Hueyfreeman
Jun 3, 2011, 01:07 PM
I think the problem with RIM is that other platforms are taking their thunder. For instance people say the I phpne is the easiest smart phone to use. Anyone who has ever used one knows that they are super easy to use. A brain dead monkey can set up an appointment with his zoo keeper on a black berry.

I do think it may be time for RIM to ditch its os and go with another. Of they go with windows phone 7 it could be a major win for both pf them. If they go android they may instantly be known as the first bussiness class android phone. And the combination would shutdown any gain M$ hopes to.get.

Dcuellar
Jun 3, 2011, 01:10 PM
Galaxy S, Desire HD, etc have morelesss the same price than iPhone and here in Spain they are the Android phones more sold.

So if you take the most sold of those two and compare it's sales to iPhone sales which will have the most sales?

All I'm trying to say is that by Android being on more than one phone they can attract many different parts of the market. The people looking for the cheaper phones, the people looking for a different carrier than what iPhone offers, etc. iPhone has only one market it attracts.

OllyW
Jun 3, 2011, 01:10 PM
Depends. Geeks I know at school in the Computer Engineering and CS department it goes Android, Blackberry then iPhone way down on the list.

Probably different types of geeks. The geeks I know are all middle aged and got into the iPhone well before Android made any serious impact on the market. :)

NebulaClash
Jun 3, 2011, 01:11 PM
Rim still has its bread and butter and that is enterprise and RIM is not going to hurt that just to court the finky consumer market.

RIM is losing the enterprise market. Haven't you seen the news articles talking about that trend? The big Wall Street banks are moving away from RIM and toward iPhones. It's not a trend that is good for RIM.

And RIM did court the consumer market, which is why you see so many teen girls with Blackberrys so that they can text for free. Didn't help RIM in the long run though.

Themaeds
Jun 3, 2011, 01:12 PM
No.. Brand awareness means they will also be aware of the price associated with it. If they are not aware of the price, and that happens to play a factor in their buying decision, then they will be attracted to the phones that offer similar features. It's the equivalent to Walmart or Publix selling their own brand of corn, soda, chips, etc.

Most of the best selling Android phones have the same exact price tag as the Iphone

Oletros
Jun 3, 2011, 01:14 PM
So if you take the most sold of those two and compare it's sales to iPhone sales which will have the most sales?

All I'm trying to say is that by Android being on more than one phone they can attract many different parts of the market. The people looking for the cheaper phones, the people looking for a different carrier than what iPhone offers, etc. iPhone has only one market it attracts.

Mmmm, iPhone is sold on ALL the major carriers, prices are moreless the same on all the high end phones (Apple, Samsung, HTC, Nokia, etc).

I think you're not aware that non USA phone market is very different.

Dcuellar
Jun 3, 2011, 01:15 PM
Most of the best selling Android phones have the same exact price tag as the Iphone

Then the next buying decision would be what carrier can I use for this phone. Still, if you take any of these best selling Android phones individually they will not have as many sales as the iPhone has.

Dcuellar
Jun 3, 2011, 01:18 PM
Mmmm, iPhone is sold on ALL the major carriers, prices are moreless the same on all the high end phones (Apple, Samsung, HTC, Nokia, etc).

I think you're not aware that non USA phone market is very different.

It's not the same case in the US. That's got to help Android. Android still has that advantage...unless you think the people in the US do not buy smartphones...

Oletros
Jun 3, 2011, 01:18 PM
It's not the same case in the US. That's got to help Android.

Help Android where?

Dcuellar
Jun 3, 2011, 01:20 PM
Help Android where?

In the US Market. They have better market exposure by being available on more networks.

Do the math.

5+ Android Phones X number of carriers
1 iPhone X number of carriers

AaronEdwards
Jun 3, 2011, 01:21 PM
Then the next buying decision would be what carrier can I use for this phone. Still, if you take any of these best selling Android phones individually they will not have as many sales as the iPhone has.

And the counter argument is that Apple are selling as many iPhone 4 as they are because that they only got one recent model. (BTW, is the AT&T iPhone 4 the same as the Verizon iPhone 4 and the White iPhone 4?)

Their views differ, it's as simple as that.
Apple believe that just having one recent model of the iPhone is the way to do it. HTC, Motorola, Samsung, etc believe that having more recent phones is the way to do it.

Oletros
Jun 3, 2011, 01:22 PM
In the US Market. They have better market exposure by being available on more networks.

Do the math.

5+ Android Phones X number of carriers
1 iPhone X number of carriers

So, why Android has grew like it has grew in Europe?

Themaeds
Jun 3, 2011, 01:22 PM
Then the next buying decision would be what carrier can I use for this phone. Still, if you take any of these best selling Android phones individually they will not have as many sales as the iPhone has.

Yeah but that wasnt my point at all. Nice try. I just think its extremely naive to think that a majority of the Android base is made up of misguided, budget shoppers.

Dcuellar
Jun 3, 2011, 01:25 PM
And the counter argument is that Apple are selling as many iPhone 4 as they are because that they only got one recent model. (BTW, is the AT&T iPhone 4 the same as the Verizon iPhone 4 and the White iPhone 4?)

Their views differ, it's as simple as that.
Apple believe that just having one recent model of the iPhone is the way to do it. HTC, Motorola, Samsung, etc believe that having more recent phones is the way to do it.


That's exactly what I am saying. Android will always have the better market exposure. Apple will have the better profit. If Android ever loses in the market share war then they should be ashamed of themselves. That's like Windows losing its Computer OS Market share to Apple.

Yeah but that wasnt my point at all. Nice try. I just think its extremely naive to think that a majority of the Android base is made up of misguided, budget shoppers.

That's what you assumed I was speaking of. This whole conversation has to deal with market share. There are many different factors that affect a buyers decision and Android seems to win over on the majority of them because they have the better market exposure.

TWSS37
Jun 3, 2011, 01:30 PM
That's what you assumed I was speaking of. This whole conversation has to deal with market share. There are many different factors that affect a buyers decision and Android seems to win over on the majority of them because they have the better market exposure.

Please stop...

cube
Jun 3, 2011, 01:30 PM
But why would people buy a Nokia Windows phone? Nokia used to sell Symbian phones, and for many years (until around 2007) they were the best you could buy. Plenty of people kept buying them, although in shrinking numbers, when better phones became available. But now there are no Symbian phones anymore. Since all these Nokia customers have to switch to something different, why would they switch to a Windows phone? Most of them use Windows at work, they know how bad it is, and they wouldn't want it in their private life if they got paid. The huge majority of these people will switch to iPhone or Android.

- People who don't know better and just want a cheap phone
- A few die-hard Microsoft fanboys

Dcuellar
Jun 3, 2011, 01:32 PM
Please stop...

Yes sir.

Oletros
Jun 3, 2011, 01:44 PM
- People who don't know better and just want a cheap phone
- A few die-hard Microsoft fanboys

-People who wants a Nokia phone because of the hardware
-WP7 has nothing to do with desktop Windows

tekmoe
Jun 3, 2011, 01:45 PM
I bought an iPhone 3G the day it was released. Sold it a few months later for an Android phone. Haven't looked back since. iPhone is the suck.

Rodimus Prime
Jun 3, 2011, 01:45 PM
RIM is losing the enterprise market. Haven't you seen the news articles talking about that trend? The big Wall Street banks are moving away from RIM and toward iPhones. It's not a trend that is good for RIM.

And RIM did court the consumer market, which is why you see so many teen girls with Blackberrys so that they can text for free. Didn't help RIM in the long run though.

If you are talking about the head line grabbers than when you really dig into the story there is no meat in them the yes I did but end of the day those were really non stories that were nothing more than headlines. Really read them and look at the facts and you do not see anything.

Also RIM is not going to risk its enterprise to court cosumer market. Those teen girls with BB so they can text. Guess what that did not risk or even hurt RIM enterprise side. It was just a nice feature that in enterprise was great that the conumser market loved.

Consumer market is an after though to RIM. They are primary a communication device and hands down I still see them as the best communications device. Suck at multimedia and web surfing but they rule for communications.

Now with my Blackberry I never used BBM but compared to my atrix I miss the emailing side of it and the hardware keyboard.

iOS well I hate its email program. I go to the point were I would not even bother using it on my iPod. I would walk to my computer before I would read email on it. That or go to my blackberry was. It was easier and quicker to get relevant information that way.
As for the Atrix it is ok for reading email but not as good as my blackberry was.

SchneiderMan
Jun 3, 2011, 02:11 PM
Apple is first in my book. They make their own hardware and software unlike all these Android devices from many different companies taking refuge under just one name..

dba7dba
Jun 3, 2011, 02:18 PM
Apple is first in my book. They make their own hardware and software unlike all these Android devices from many different companies taking refuge under just one name..

Not quite true...

Apple makes their OS, yes. But not the hardware. They design and outsource assembling them. Not to mention key components like RAM, screen, A4 are sourced from the likes of Samsung, LG, Toshiba...

And there's another company that makes their own hardware & software, Samsung. Not many heard of Bada from Samsung but it's out there.

cube
Jun 3, 2011, 02:21 PM
-People who wants a Nokia phone because of the hardware
-WP7 has nothing to do with desktop Windows

I bought a Nokia phone because of the hardware, but only because it had an acceptable OS and it was cheap, and iPhone is closed.

WP7 is also made by Microsoft.

Oletros
Jun 3, 2011, 02:23 PM
WP7 is also made by Microsoft.

And?

cube
Jun 3, 2011, 02:30 PM
And?

Not acceptable.

AaronEdwards
Jun 3, 2011, 02:34 PM
That's exactly what I am saying. Android will always have the better market exposure. Apple will have the better profit. If Android ever loses in the market share war then they should be ashamed of themselves. That's like Windows losing its Computer OS Market share to Apple.

There's no synergy in marketing a number of phones instead of just one. Samsung would get a lot more people buying the Galaxy S II from money spent marketing that phone than from the money spent marketing the Droid Charge, and they are definitely not getting a lot of sales from the money HTC is spending to get people to buy the ThunderBolt.

zacman
Jun 3, 2011, 02:43 PM
But why would people buy a Nokia Windows phone? Nokia used to sell Symbian phones, and for many years (until around 2007) they were the best you could buy. Plenty of people kept buying them, although in shrinking numbers, when better phones became available.

I don't know where you got your numbers. But Nokia's Symbian sales are growing only their marketshare is sinking. For example year over year (Q1/10 to Q1/11) Nokia's Symbian sales grew by about 35%. However the smartphone marketshare is growing much faster which is why Nokia loses marketshare. But in absolute sales numbers Nokia's Symbian sales are still growing.

Also keep in mind that most WP7 phones are a lot cheaper in Europe than Nokia Symbian phones. For example in Germany you can get an unlocked HTC Trophy or LG Optimus 7 for about 175 €. The Samsung Omnia 7 16 GB is about 250 €. On the other hand the Nokia C7 is about 250 €, the N8 about 330 € and the E7 about 400 €. All prices also include 19% VAT.

And most people don't choose a phone because of the OS but because of the manufacturer. That's why Nokia WP7 will sell really well because people that always had a Nokia phone will again get one. These don't care much about the OS.

Oletros
Jun 3, 2011, 02:53 PM
Not acceptable.

Why? Only because is done by MS?

cube
Jun 3, 2011, 02:58 PM
Why? Only because is done by MS?

"Only"

Oletros
Jun 3, 2011, 02:58 PM
"Only"

Ah, prejudices

cube
Jun 3, 2011, 03:04 PM
Ah, prejudices

History

ten-oak-druid
Jun 3, 2011, 03:18 PM
Sounds like a resounding win for Android. Google increase in marketshare was 400% greater than was the increase for Apple.

Interestingly that is the same percentage that malware increased on the Android OS.

iPhone never destroyed Nokia, it didn't even come close to touching it. WTF are you talking about?

Nokia was destroyed by the iphone. And Android is finishing them off. Everyone knows this. Where have you been?


... Just so your 12 year old mind knows, ...

Newsflash: you lost. You have no point to make so you resort to silly insults.

Nokia's Slump Quickens as Consumers Shun Outmoded Handsets (http://news.businessweek.com/article.asp?documentKey=1376-LM2NCV0YHQ0X01-2RSKIRBBC8MU5S0VLEO5QV615T)

Excerpt: "Nokia has lost about three-quarters of its value since Apple's 2007 introduction of the iPhone, which raised consumer expectations for handsets that can handle corporate e-mail and play movies. "

Oletros
Jun 3, 2011, 03:26 PM
Interestingly that is the same percentage that malware increased on the Android OS.

??

If you find any real number, please, show them

SandynJosh
Jun 3, 2011, 03:46 PM
Phone manufacturers are platform agnostic. They couldn't care less what their phones run as long as they are making money. Android depends on such companies, and that's not a very firm foundation.

Yes, you are correct, however Microsoft does more then supply an OS to a manufacturer, they now own, and are now, the largest phone manufacturer. It may take them a few months to fully digest Nokia and start sh*tting out smart phones, but that's their plan at present.

ct2k7
Jun 3, 2011, 03:49 PM
come on monopoly.... then Apple can be sued for forcing us to use Safari-based things on iOS.

ten-oak-druid
Jun 3, 2011, 04:09 PM
??

If you find any real number, please, show them

400% increase in Android malware (http://www.net-security.org/malware_news.php?id=1718)

I think Rodimus posted it earlier.

bwillwall
Jun 3, 2011, 04:09 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPod; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8J2 Safari/6533.18.5)

Yay! Next stop, Google. Btw ki feel bad for palm, there phones are way better than rim and androids.

rjohnstone
Jun 3, 2011, 05:41 PM
400% increase in Android malware (http://www.net-security.org/malware_news.php?id=1718)

I think Rodimus posted it earlier.
Well yes, but lets add a little perspective here... going from 1 to 5 is technically a 400% increase. The actual number was 26 apps in total.
Now compare that to the thousands of apps out there and you see it's a minor issue at best.

E.Lizardo
Jun 3, 2011, 06:20 PM
For someone who has been here since 2007, you sure have a dislike for all things Apple.

Why stick around? Misery breeds company or somesuch?

Agreed.Makes me wish for an"Ignore User"button.
Oh well,might as well just laugh instead.

E.Lizardo
Jun 3, 2011, 06:23 PM
Misery? haha he made a very factual statement

You mean he gleefully enthusiastically joyfully made a factual statement.That's the real point.

OllyW
Jun 3, 2011, 06:29 PM
Agreed.Makes me wish for an"Ignore User"button.


You can chose to ignore a members posts. Click the member's name to get to their profile then click 'Add to ignore list' under 'User lists'.

SandynJosh
Jun 3, 2011, 10:24 PM
This truly is the bottom line. Any company that has 20-40% of the smart phone market is laughing all the way to the bank. This is too huge of a market for any one device to take it all. There will be several winners (and a bunch of also-ran losers too) from this market. It won't be a zero-sum game for a very long time.

I seem to remember that Apple was shooting for only 5% of the market when they first entered the phone business. If my memory is correct then Apple has done much better then they expected.

Apple has also learned that the iPhone brought them a lot of other business due to the halo effect, so they are very interested in holding or extending their current share for that reason.

While we are really only discussing the various phone OSes, don't forget that Apple has the iOS ecosystem that is more unified and safer than anything that Android has. When (not "if") a Trojan horse or virus gets going through the Android user base, the platform may screech to a halt or slow down and never fully recover its momentum.

SandynJosh
Jun 3, 2011, 10:26 PM
You can chose to ignore a members posts. Click the member's name to get to their profile then click 'Add to ignore list' under 'User lists'.

I have a half dozen or so posters on this forum that are so clueless they are on my ignore list, and life is good. It's a good feature for this site.

kdarling
Jun 3, 2011, 11:11 PM
OK, I went back and re-read the linked article. It seems that these charts are for installed user base and not market-share of sales.

That brings up a very good point. The chart is not about sales. It's also not about who hits websites. Nor is it a random survey.

Comscore tracks 30,000 registered users who share what devices they use over the years. So their numbers actually say that out of those 30,000 people, right now:

36.4% use Android = 10,920 people.
26.0% use Apple = 7,800 people.
25.7% use RIM = 7,313 people.
6.7% use MS = 2,010 people.
2.6% use Palm = 780 people.

Basically they're following a group of the same people over time, and it's their changing interests that we're seeing. Without paying for the info, we don't know what income or location or other background they have.

These press releases are a type of advertising, in order to get buyers interested in the info Comscore sells.

SandynJosh
Jun 3, 2011, 11:13 PM
The most shocking part of all this? I didn't know Palm still existed or that people still used their equipment.

Palm does not exist, however people still use the Palm phones they bought before Palm was bought out by HP. The survey was not relating to current sales, but of surveyed the users of smart phones, so this survey could even include the first generation of iPhone users, if any 1st gen iPhone still are being used.

It's unlikely that they surveyed any users of the new HP phones using the Palm OS as the survey preceded the introduction of the HP phones to the market. I'm not sure how they might classify the HP phones in the next survey as they are really not yet a different OS from when the phones carried the Palm brand name. They may refer to them as WebOS or HP WebOS. Time will tell.

mc2thearson
Jun 3, 2011, 11:20 PM
All the geeks I know have got iPhones. My non-geeky friends are all starting to update their dumb phones to Android phones because they don't cost as much as the iPhone.

Geeks, celebs, WHO CARES!!!! I use an iPhone because I enjoy the interface, the quality and the fact that my iPhone 4 isn't obsolete after a year. Sure there are phones out there with faster processors and maybe a better OS, but you know what? That doesn't matter to me. I'm the one that has to use MY phone. I have made educated decisions about what is best for me. I'm comfortable with the mac OS, I like apple as a brand. I feel like the apple company respects me (at least more than most major corporations) as a customer, every time I've had to deal with them in the past. Plus I think they're an innovative company, offering stylish hardware with a sense of quality. Anyone is welcome to disagree with me. This is purely a personal opinion. That's what all this really boils down to.

You love android. Awesome. Glad you've found something that you enjoy...

but seriously...

Choosing a phone based on "geeks" or whatever, that is just...... well, ridiculous dude... REALLY ridiculous.

jprocha
Jun 3, 2011, 11:45 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_2 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8H7 Safari/6533.18.5)

What kinds of friends do you have? Even my most simple friends realize which OS their phone is running.

All of my friends have an iPhone or an android phone. The ones without an iPhone realize that their phone is running android.

jprocha
Jun 4, 2011, 12:04 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_2 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8H7 Safari/6533.18.5)

Where do people get off saying that android is only bought because of it's bargain prices? Most new smartphones cost around $200 with a new contract. Both iOS and android have cheaper phones to compete with one another. People buy the phone they enjoy the most, usually with the best and most up to date features because many realize they will be stuck with the phone they purchase for 2 years. This is why android isahead of the pack: their newer phones are more up to date than apple's. Consumers aren't stupid and don't walk into stores without doing research. Simple searches can find where millions of people are researching phones online before purchasing them (YouTube, news articles, review sites, forums such as these, yahoo answers). People know it's a long term commitment yet still a great deal are choosing android. I wonder why...

caspersoong
Jun 4, 2011, 02:27 AM
All my friends who are not geeks had a hard time with their Android phones. They hate the phones so much they are willing to sell them with hundreds of dollars loss and to get an iPhone. So far haven't seen anyone satisfied with an Android phone unless it is dirt cheap.

Oletros
Jun 4, 2011, 03:16 AM
All my friends who are not geeks had a hard time with their Android phones. They hate the phones so much they are willing to sell them with hundreds of dollars loss and to get an iPhone. So far haven't seen anyone satisfied with an Android phone unless it is dirt cheap.

And you expect that people believes that?

OllyW
Jun 4, 2011, 03:38 AM
Geeks, celebs, WHO CARES!!!! I use an iPhone because I enjoy the interface, the quality and the fact that my iPhone 4 isn't obsolete after a year. Sure there are phones out there with faster processors and maybe a better OS, but you know what? That doesn't matter to me. I'm the one that has to use MY phone. I have made educated decisions about what is best for me. I'm comfortable with the mac OS, I like apple as a brand. I feel like the apple company respects me (at least more than most major corporations) as a customer, every time I've had to deal with them in the past. Plus I think they're an innovative company, offering stylish hardware with a sense of quality. Anyone is welcome to disagree with me. This is purely a personal opinion. That's what all this really boils down to.

You love android. Awesome. Glad you've found something that you enjoy...

but seriously...

Choosing a phone based on "geeks" or whatever, that is just...... well, ridiculous dude... REALLY ridiculous.

I haven't got an Android phone. :confused:

My friends with Android phones enjoy their Android phones. Myself and many of my other friends enjoy our iPhones.

I wasn't saying they picked their iPhones because they were computer wizards and the non-savvy ones automatically went for Android, just that the more technologically minded ones jumped on the smartphone bandwagon early on when the iPhone was the automatic choice and are now hooked on them. The others who couldn't care less about tech are now going for Android because they are freely available at a lot lower cost.


Where do people get off saying that android is only bought because of it's bargain prices? Most new smartphones cost around $200 with a new contract.

Maybe because we all don't live in the USA? ;)

My friend is about to get a free HTC on a 15 per month contract ($20 before tax). He doesn't know anything about Android or iOS, he just wants a phone with a decent camera which does Facebook and the internet which doesn't cost a fortune.

Pimp Lucious
Jun 4, 2011, 06:27 AM
I think Android's success with consumers will be tested if iPhone 5 rolls out to AT&T and Verizon simultaneously, along with either T-Mobile and/or Sprint. Then we'll know how many simply choose Android because iPhone doesn't exist as a choice for them. The other thing we have to wait for is Apple to have a $100 or lower iphone offering for consumers much like the current 3GS for AT&T. There are a lot of android phones in that segment that can be sold as having most of the same features of the iphone for much less. Some consumers aren't smart enough to look at the monthly costs as compared to the purchase price.

My argument is that your average consumer that isn't tech inclined will always prefer an iPhone over an android phone unless they are finicky about screen size or a hardware keyboard. Most of the people that prefer Android and have well reasoned points for doing so are power users and do not reflect the average consumer. The iphone has a more straight forward app and media purchasing scheme with more options, a more consistent UI and intelligibility to it, more streamlined media playing features, etc. It's just less intimidating.

This matchup you envision has already been played out in markets other than the US. Android still won. Why is it always this "wait till" expectation with for some when it comes to the iPhone versus Android marketshare? The results always remain the same. Android wins.

twoodcc
Jun 4, 2011, 08:32 AM
great for apple and iphone. the next iphone better be good though, and it needs to come soon

zap2
Jun 4, 2011, 09:32 AM
To bad HP/Palm is still struggling, WebOS is a great OS, I prefer it to Andriod no question and iOS for something, not for others.

HP needs to pour some cash into buying apps from developers. Netflix is something they need for sure.

I just am waiting for proof that the market can support 5 OSes....although I doubt Windows Phone is going anywhere(and the other three have enough sales to makes profitable....I'd only expect BB OS to leave but that's for QNX, so that just means we're back up to 5)

For tablets, I'm not missing anything from the iPad(app switching for 4/5 fingers makes mulittasking a breeze and I don't find notifications are important on a tablet, so WebOS's advantages aren't as big plus their tablet is only launching soon, the iPad has a huge head starts and on my tablet, I find I do more that requires 3rd party apps on my tablet then my phone (Netflix, iWork,etc)

zap2
Jun 4, 2011, 09:50 AM
This matchup you envision has already been played out in markets other than the US. Android still won. Why is it always this "wait till" expectation with for some when it comes to the iPhone versus Android marketshare? The results always remain the same. Android wins.

Agreed, getting iOS on Sprint and T Mobile at the launch of new hardware(and Verizon getting the same) should help sales( and in 07/08 would likely have gotten Apple's market share to an even larger amount, controlling a mass amount in the US for a time), But the ability of Android to scale across hardware designs of all types means it will win out. That's the reason Windows won out in the 70s and 80s, it's the design of Apple's business model that allows it(which isn't a bad thing, as I think iOS would suffer if Apple built it with HTC, Samsung, LG, etc in mind)

Never will one hardware company be able to control a market(unless perhaps they create it or get in very early, but even then if other big players push hard enough, they can break in....look at the MP3 player market, Apple won that battle, but other companies slowly chipped away and that wasn't nearly as important as tablets/smartphones IMO.)

Smartphones are the forefront of computing now, every one in the desktop business wants to make sure they get a piece of the market that their sales are going, which is tablets and smartphones.

And so Apple will create a great product with an approach that works better in my mind, but Android is quite good and will be able partner with more big players and out sell Apple. Same with MS, I could see them out selling Apple, at least with Nokia on board(even if they only get some of their old market, they will still be a major player)

But that doesn't mean Apple's one device isn't the best fit for many people.


My interest is in HP, a huge hardware player bought a great software product(and the people to keep improving it)...if they play their cards right, I hope to see them take off. Putting WebOS on all their PCs seems like a great move, sure some people might not use it, but as long as it's done so it's not annoying to those who want to avoid it, it has they chance to introduce people so come time to get a new smartphone or tablet, they have experience with WebOS and are that much more likely to jump on board.

jacobj
Jun 4, 2011, 10:22 AM
Sounds like a resounding win for Android. Google increase in marketshare was 400% greater than was the increase for Apple.

Of course they do: they have most of the largest smartphone manufacturers using Android. Do you think that if Apple gave other hardware manufacturers access to their OS and iTunes Google would maintain it's position. Not a hope in he'll.

Google may well have a larger marksetshare but their market is divided into a whole plethora of little markets, none offers which of the whole experience. The android user loses out unless they are committed to putting in the effort to maximize the potential of their hardware and OS.

The threat to Apple is not there at present, nor does it come from Google itself. The revenue threat to Apple comes from whichever vendor can take a dominant share of the android app market share, whilst also offering media and a simple way to manage all that content. Watch that space, not the one that lists Android as taking larger bites than Apple. They're both taking big chunks..

chrmjenkins
Jun 4, 2011, 12:00 PM
This matchup you envision has already been played out in markets other than the US. Android still won. Why is it always this "wait till" expectation with for some when it comes to the iPhone versus Android marketshare? The results always remain the same. Android wins.

None of which are Apple's home market. Companies usually perform better in their country of origin. Sony, Microsoft, and Samsung are all great examples, with many more out there. IIRC Apple's revenue is 40% domestic.

Besides, I don't think anyone is saying Apple will lead, just tht the rampant growth and market share difference will taper and shrink.

mc2thearson
Jun 4, 2011, 01:58 PM
I haven't got an Android phone. :confused:

My friends with Android phones enjoy their Android phones. Myself and many of my other friends enjoy our iPhones.

I wasn't saying they picked their iPhones because they were computer wizards and the non-savvy ones automatically went for Android, just that the more technologically minded ones jumped on the smartphone bandwagon early on when the iPhone was the automatic choice and are now hooked on them. The others who couldn't care less about tech are now going for Android because they are freely available at a lot lower cost.

.

Maybe because we all don't live in the USA? ;)

My friend is about to get a free HTC on a 15 per month contract ($20 before tax). He doesn't know anything about Android or iOS, he just wants a phone with a decent camera which does Facebook and the internet which doesn't cost a fortune.

My apologies to you sir. It looks like I grossly misinterpreted your original post. It had been a long week, with far too little sleep.

Hueyfreeman
Jun 4, 2011, 04:39 PM
Why do people play all of these excuesses why android has the largest part of the market.

Im tired of the "its because the iphone is only on two networks" guess what that is only in america everywhere else the iphone is sold unlocked and low and behold its not the majority there.

"its because android phones are sold cheaper." Then why are the best selling android phones priced the same or more as the iPhone.

Has it occured to any of you that not everyone wants an iphone. It is that simple. Some people dont want to be tied to iTunes, Somepeople don't want a 3.5" screen. Face it the iPhone is a great phone but not the best phone for everyone, it doesn't work for everyone.

rhett7660
Jun 4, 2011, 04:42 PM
It was only a matter of time!!!

AppleScruff1
Jun 4, 2011, 05:47 PM
Is this supposed to be as exciting for us as Apples record profits?

jonnysods
Jun 4, 2011, 06:07 PM
Poor RIM. Looking pretty grim.

ChrisH3677
Jun 4, 2011, 09:18 PM
This table actually tells us that one in four smartphones are iPhones. Think about that. Would love to see a table of top selling smartphones.

Hueyfreeman
Jun 4, 2011, 10:08 PM
This table actually tells us that one in four smartphones are iPhones. Think about that. Would love to see a table of top selling smartphones.

I have a guess:

1. Iphone 4
2. Iphone 3gs
3. Samsung Galaxy S
4. Samsung Galaxy 3 II
5. Blackberry Bold
6. Blackberry Curve
7. LG Optimus 1

I base these on phone availability and how many sold. I know the galaxy S is on all four major US carriers. The Blackberry Bold is also a prolific Phone. The Curve is dirt cheap for a smart phone. And the LG optimus 1 is the locust of all android phones Appearing on most of the networks in the US Including many regional making it more of a phone any person can get from AT&T all the way down to Cricket. (I happen to own one lol)

OllyW
Jun 5, 2011, 02:21 AM
My apologies to you sir. It looks like I grossly misinterpreted your original post. It had been a long week, with far too little sleep.

No worries, I've often done the same myself. :)

Winni
Jun 5, 2011, 03:06 PM
I don't ever believe this because next week you will hear that Android will have more market share and blah blah blah it's always different.
In my mind the iPhone is THE BEST smart phone.

Well, that's great for you - stick to your iPhone. I'm pretty sure that I will dump my iPhone and upgrade to a Samsung Galaxy S2 later this year.

And yes, Android already has a larger market share than iOS. Which is not very surprising, when you consider that an entire industry is using Android and not iOS as the standard OS.

DeathChill
Jun 5, 2011, 03:11 PM
Well, that's great for you - stick to your iPhone. I'm pretty sure that I will dump my iPhone and upgrade to a Samsung Galaxy S2 later this year.

And yes, Android already has a larger market share than iOS. Which is not very surprising, when you consider that an entire industry is using Android and not iOS as the standard OS.

But you're wrong: iOS has a larger market share. Android has a larger share of the smartphone market, but iOS is still bigger as a platform.

fkhan3
Jun 5, 2011, 06:59 PM
Poor RIM. Looking pretty grim.

Yep! RIM is going down real fast

fpsBeaTt
Jun 5, 2011, 08:51 PM
I agree, but iOS is not the best mobile operating system.

I beg to differ; it's the most stable, most efficient and uncluttered mobile OS available, combining with the hardware to give the best user experience on any phone or pad.


fps_beaTt
Computer Science/Physics major

Langov3
Jun 6, 2011, 10:40 AM
400% increase in Android malware (http://www.net-security.org/malware_news.php?id=1718)

I think Rodimus posted it earlier.

I don't think you can infer a 400% increase from that article or it's significance.

Firstly the author made that graph himself and clearly lacks the aptitude to correctly label an x axis, let alone understand the report he was referencing.

The article does not specify if there is a 400% increase in incidence or a 400% increase in malware being used or created, an important difference.
The figures are also not included. An increase of 12 to 48 malware programs is 400%, but an increase of 120 to 480 is far more significant.

Cross platform malware is also not accounted for. The article mentioned WiFi attacks, programs such as Faceniff, which intercept encrypted cookies and can target any OS.

There are multiple antivirus apps available, both paid and free, so there are really no excuses for getting one, nor can you hold google accountable. In fact, it's a recognition of androids popularity that it is targeted by malicious programs.

If you want to reference the issue then you might want to do so directly from the report. The link is provided in the article.

Langov3
Jun 6, 2011, 10:47 AM
Agreed.Makes me wish for an"Ignore User"button.
Oh well,might as well just laugh instead.

I wouldn't do that, no point in debating your own team! :)

Langov3
Jun 6, 2011, 11:18 AM
Do you think that if Apple gave other hardware manufacturers access to their OS and iTunes Google would maintain it's position. Not a hope in he'll.

Apple wouldn't made that much money from an open source OS. Charging the manufacturer to garner a significant profit would made the product unviable.
Google doesn't make any money from it's OS or its app market. Google raises revenue from advertisement rights pertaining to Gmail, google maps and the like.

jacobj
Jun 6, 2011, 11:34 AM
Apple wouldn't made that much money from an open source OS. Charging the manufacturer to garner a significant profit would made the product unviable.
Google doesn't make any money from it's OS or its app market. Google raises revenue from advertisement rights pertaining to Gmail, google maps and the like.

I wasn't arguing for or against Apple opening their OS. I was simply stating Apple's lower marketshare makes sense given their approach to being the sole supplier in their ecosystem.

In fact I agree with you, given that Google and Apple are running different business models, straightforward like-for-like comparisons make no sense at all.

Also, Apple still has the largest marketshare as far as revenue and software sales are concerned.

AmeyaPro
Jun 6, 2011, 11:34 AM
good to see the Apple iPhone Overtakes BlackBerry
but since i am using both phones it's the iPhone overall winner & BlackBerry For Email Service.
I think Both companies Rocks

PracticalMac
Jun 6, 2011, 12:14 PM
All the geeks I know have got iPhones. My non-geeky friends are all starting to update their dumb phones to Android phones because they don't cost as much as the iPhone.

But then they are unlikely to buy any apps for the Android.

...unless someone shows them how to buy one.


iOS will have far more app developers, and apps, then Android ever will for next couple of years, if ever.