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Mad Mac Maniac
Jun 7, 2011, 12:31 PM
So I'm unclear on this... Is iDisk gone? Is there a replacing iCloud app that will support the same?

This would be a big step backwards if it's gone. It would be so difficult to move things around. (say from pages on iPad to word on a Mac)



Morod
Jun 7, 2011, 12:43 PM
I hope it's not gone.
Yeah, it's slow, but I still use it. A lot.

happyslayer
Jun 7, 2011, 01:18 PM
This is mine and my friend's question as well. I use iDisk every day! It is where I store all my important data. I so hope it stays or there is an iCloud equivalent.

Mad Mac Maniac
Jun 7, 2011, 01:40 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8G4 Safari/6533.18.5)

I know iDisk will be around for at least 1 year... Because everyone's MobileMe has been extended to June 30, 2012 fully functioning (I don't really understand why they aren't just rolled into iCloud?) so they will have that.

Maybe Apple will have an alternate solution by then...

aresinferno
Jun 7, 2011, 02:05 PM
I am guessing that iDisk will be phased out... for now. I can see that Apple will offer a paid version of iCloud that brings back some of the storage-based features of iDisk, Gallery possibly iWeb but not likely.

techpr
Jun 7, 2011, 02:16 PM
I am guessing that iDisk will be phased out... for now. I can see that Apple will offer a paid version of iCloud that brings back some of the storage-based features of iDisk, Gallery possibly iWeb but not likely.

iDisk like will be at iCloud it is called Backup (the green cloud icon), 5GB max for Free. You can buy more GB space for an extra charge.

Mad Mac Maniac
Jun 7, 2011, 02:52 PM
iDisk like will be at iCloud it is called Backup (the green cloud icon), 5GB max for Free. You can buy more GB space for an extra charge.

uhhh I think you are mistaken... Apple was using icon's for all their features, but they certainly aren't all apps with actual icons. And I think the backup icon referred to the wireless ability to...(wait for it) backup your iDevices. the backup consists of things like settings, SMS's, Photos, etc.

I understand the 5GB thing, but that can be used for the "hidden" iCloud aspect. Meaning if you create something in pages on your iPhone... it automatically appears on your iPad, and your Mac for that matter. This is because the copy of it is actually stored in the cloud, but if there is no iDisk I don't think there is a way to view it OUTSIDE of the iWork suite. Like if I wanted to view it on Word on my Mac. All apps will have access to the iCloud so does that just mean syncing between iOS devices(or Mac app equivalent if they have one)? or could devs include iCould access to other iOS apps? Meaning could I have docs2go on my iPhone and quick office on my iPad and still have automatic saving across them? Do apps have access to ALL iCloud data (kinda like iDisk view within each app)? Or maybe viewing access to all "compatible" documents?

There has been 0 mention on any kind of iDisk or iDisk suppliment so I'm just wondering... I know Apple hates file system, but surely Apple can see the merit in easily moving files between apps.

I guess Apple knows what they are doing. Maybe when we get iOS 5 it will become clear to us how everything works and it makes sense. I have faith that Apple's not stupid

nutmac
Jun 7, 2011, 07:14 PM
iDisk like will be at iCloud it is called Backup (the green cloud icon), 5GB max for Free. You can buy more GB space for an extra charge.

With iCloud, it's up to applications (e.g., iWork) to mirror data to iCloud, which will then be pushed to other devices. As far as I can see, you cannot force specific data to be sent to iCloud.

Backup is for backing up iOS data (e.g., settings, photos, apps, SMS) to the cloud, which is different from what Dropbox does.

hitekalex
Jun 7, 2011, 09:15 PM
I understand the 5GB thing, but that can be used for the "hidden" iCloud aspect. Meaning if you create something in pages on your iPhone... it automatically appears on your iPad, and your Mac for that matter. This is because the copy of it is actually stored in the cloud, but if there is no iDisk I don't think there is a way to view it OUTSIDE of the iWork suite.

There has been 0 mention on any kind of iDisk or iDisk suppliment so I'm just wondering... I know Apple hates file system, but surely Apple can see the merit in easily moving files between apps.

Well, Apple did say that iCloud will be available to 3rd party developers via an open API. So it would seem that it's only a matter of time before a 3rd party app offers "general file sync" capabilities between your devices an iCloud (of course bound by Apple's 5GB storage cap). I can see companies like GoodReader and ReaddleDocs doing this pretty quickly.

There is also nothing preventing someone from writing a MacOS or Windows client (if Apple doesn't offer one themselves) that lets you access your iCloud data outside of iWork/iTunes confines via Apple's iCloud API.

So there is your iDisk equivalent, if things pan out the way I am thinking..

Aniday
Jun 8, 2011, 10:19 PM
I actually went ahead and chatted with an Apple rep via the Apple.com support page and, unfortunately, he didn't really help.

We are being told that all customer's should receive email notifications of all the features in great detail, the closer it gets to the release. Your current
MobileMe features and services will still remain active for you until the transition is completed on June 30, 2012

Alright. Hopefully iDisk will remain intact. Especially considering it's embedded into Finder currently.

Yes, I do completely agree with you, that certainly is an awesome feature and I do not see why iDisk will discontinue.

So, apparently we'll get more info later.

Getting rid of iDisk would irritate me. It's convenient as hell.

hitekalex
Jun 8, 2011, 10:24 PM
I actually went ahead and chatted with an Apple rep via the Apple.com support page

You may as well have asked a random guy on he street - chances are he knows just as much as the Apple support rep :D

Personally, I think it's 98% chance that iDisk as we know it now will cease to exist. Listen to what Apple is saying - they don't want you to use filesystem based storage.

Anonymous Freak
Jun 9, 2011, 03:08 AM
With iCloud, it's up to applications (e.g., iWork) to mirror data to iCloud, which will then be pushed to other devices. As far as I can see, you cannot force specific data to be sent to iCloud.

Backup is for backing up iOS data (e.g., settings, photos, apps, SMS) to the cloud, which is different from what Dropbox does.

This is my take on it as well. As was mentioned, it probably won't be long until a developer releases an app to allow storage of arbitrary files, though.

irfan.kara06
Jun 9, 2011, 05:25 AM
just an FYI for anyone interested, I asked an apple support rep about iDisk and Gallery and I got a pretty positive response. Not sure how reliable it is, but here it is below:

"I can definitely understand wanting to know if certain features are going to be available in iCloud. While specific details have not been released I am confident that there will be features that are similar, if not the same, to both iDisk and Gallery. There are too many of our customers, such as yourself, that enjoy all the features that Mobileme has to offer with both their iDIsk storage and using the Gallery. Again, while the exact details have not been released of what is going to be included, I am confident that those features will be included in iCloud, the name may change, but you will still be able to use all the features you have grown to rely on with MobileMe."

hitekalex
Jun 9, 2011, 09:33 AM
just an FYI for anyone interested, I asked an apple support rep about iDisk and Gallery and I got a pretty positive response. Not sure how reliable it is, but here it is below:

Again, I would put zero stock into any "forward looking" statements made by Apple support reps. It's just a guy's opinion - he has exactly zero knowledge or control over what Apple decides to do with the service.

Internaut
Jun 9, 2011, 10:30 AM
I would hope that nothing gets EOL'd as such in the move to iCloud but its too early to tell at the moment. I use iDisk, email and Mobile Me is my web host. With respect to email, I'm sort of hoping we'll get the option of a change of email address....... I was a little bit undisciplined with my me address and find I get too much unsolicited (albeit legit) email marketing.

tlinford
Jun 9, 2011, 02:03 PM
I am very concerned that Steve Jobs said "Some people think that cloud computing is just a Hard Disk in the sky". This seems to undermine the incredibly useful fact that a Hd In the sky is damn useful. Also Steve said that Apple had been trying to get away from file systems for 10 years.

Getting away from rusty filesystems sounds laudable but in the real world we need folders and subfoulders. I organise work by projects , type and time, without a filesystems I would get lost... Also we have to interact with the rest fthe world that uses simpler file system structures....

Has Steve forgotten the Ancient of days, when apple files could not be read on PCs.... Surly we don't want to go back there?

PDACPA
Jun 9, 2011, 03:19 PM
This is my opinion from watching the Keynote and reading various threads online about the new iCloud and what we are currently using with Mobile Me.

I liken iCloud to a "train stop" on the way from your iphone to ipad and/or Mac and/or PC and vice versa.

Nothing was mentioned as being held in the cloud long term. Pictures would remain 30 days and then be gone. They are not housing your music, they are just keeping track of what you own and giving you the option to download it to 1 of 10 devices.

Mail, iDisk and Galleries are all held online in the cloud and sync with your various devices. That is why they were charging us for the Mobile Me service as Apple had to maintain harddrives with our data.

I get the impression that Apple does not want to have these hard drives that are growing and growing with data. So they created the iCloud, that is a temporary hard drive, moves the data to our local devices and then it is gone.

iKennett
Jun 9, 2011, 03:36 PM
If iCloud allows developers to make use of your storage space what is stopping Apple releasing iDisk to make use of iCloud... or heck a developer doing the same thing. If you want more space you simply buy more to give you similar limits to MobileMe.

hitekalex
Jun 9, 2011, 03:45 PM
If iCloud allows developers to make use of your storage space what is stopping Apple releasing iDisk to make use of iCloud... or heck a developer doing the same thing. If you want more space you simply buy more to give you similar limits to MobileMe.

What I am really hoping for is "Dropbox for iCloud" :D

tlinford
Jun 9, 2011, 06:01 PM
What I am really hoping for is "Dropbox for iCloud" :D

Already there is fragmentation (something which Jobs always had tried to avoid) in the way iOS Apps interact with cloud storage. Many Apps can be configured to sync data from sky storage from different providers, including DropBox, Sugarsync, MobileMe and others but interestingly not Apple Apps. Pages onto speaks to iDisk cirr

tlinford
Jun 9, 2011, 06:03 PM
Pages only speaks to iDisk, people like Circus Ponies are looking at DropBox for NotePad.... Come on Apple get it sorted and don't pass the buck!

maclaptop
Jun 9, 2011, 06:08 PM
I have faith that Apple's not stupid
I concur, Apple is most definitely not stupid.

Conversely, it's their decision making about the direction they are taking that is a bit puzzling at times. :)

hitekalex
Jun 9, 2011, 10:37 PM
Pages only speaks to iDisk

No, you can have Pages (and other iWork apps) talk to *any* WebDAV server. With Lion Server - it's very easy to run your own WebDAV server on a Mac.

I am doing exactly that on my Mini server - my own "private cloud" with no disk space restictions and the data completely in my control. Who needs iDisk ;)

iKennett
Jun 10, 2011, 03:30 AM
No, you can have Pages (and other iWork apps) talk to *any* WebDAV server. With Lion Server - it's very easy to run your own WebDAV server on a Mac.

I am doing exactly that on my Mini server - my own "private cloud" with no disk space restictions and the data completely in my control. Who needs iDisk ;)

My line is planned up a upgrade in September and I'll should be getting a 7.8MB upload speed (32mb down)... at this point I'll be looking at the likes of iCloud to provide a time-capsule like service for all my key media.

While I am big user of technology I try to keep my electricity usage low and the idea of a NAS always on isn't too appealing for me. If iCloud provided a reasonable cost back up service for the mac... they do it for the iDevice so only a matter of time I hope!

tlinford
Jun 10, 2011, 05:20 AM
No, you can have Pages (and other iWork apps) talk to *any* WebDAV server. With Lion Server - it's very easy to run your own WebDAV server on a Mac.

I am doing exactly that on my Mini server - my own "private cloud" with no disk space restictions and the data completely in my control. Who needs iDisk ;)

I don't want to set up a serve in my home thanks very much, I've got more interesting things to do with my time. The main reason I think that remote cloud disk storage is good (apart from syncing across mobile device) is security. If my MacBook breaks down, catches fire or is stolen I know all my precious files are still safe, I can get another MacBook and get my files back straight away.

If I had a server in my house, offering my own personal cloud, it could break down get destroyed by fire or flood, or be stolen by a burglar...

From a user point of view who isn't running Lion server blah blah blah, the only option on pages for iPad seems to be iDisk?

Mad Mac Maniac
Jun 10, 2011, 10:10 AM
How exactly does the iCloud API work? Has anyone had a chance to really dig into it?

Do you have access to the entire iCloud? Because if so, then the "developer created iDisk equivalent" speculated above would be very possible. Joe Shmoe could create a "Filesystem for iCloud" app, allowing you to view pages files, numbers files, keynote files, and all other files of iCloud enabled apps on your devices. The only difficultly I could see is many apps could use unique formats so they may not be compatible with the viewer in the filesystem app.

The way I originally anticipated the API's functioning is you could link them to your own apps and that is it. Like say I created a note taking app called "iNotes R Us" for iPhone, iPad, and Mac. I would use the iCloud API to link my apps to my individual iCloud "slot" (say position AAABBBC). Each app I create would link to that AAABBBC slot to keep all devices in perfect sync with each other. I don't have access to anything else in the iCloud, my App is for my app files. Of course under this system I could still foresee building an arrangement with another app developer like QuickOffice. Or maybe partnering with a Mac App developer if I didn't decide to create my own Mac App. Then I would share my slot AAABBBC with him and he could share his slot DDDEEEF with me. Now both of our apps can be in sync with each other and it would be up to us to make sure the files are compatible.

That is how I had envisioned it. No one with access to the entire iCloud (except for Apple if they had decided to make an iCloud app). Of course it would be possible for an app like Dropbox, or goodreader, or readdledocs to try to gain partnership with as many popular apps as they can to try to create a pseudo iCloud database.

hitekalex
Jun 10, 2011, 05:26 PM
The main reason I think that remote cloud disk storage is good (apart from syncing across mobile device) is security. If my MacBook breaks down, catches fire or is stolen I know all my precious files are still safe, I can get another MacBook and get my files back straight away.

You will get back up to 5GB of your files, to be precise.. 5GB is a minuscule amount of space by today's standards. I have about 2TB worth of personal files (movies, photos, music, home videos). Backing up 5GB of this data "in the cloud" doesn't do much for me. For the offsite backup purposes - I keep a high-capacity portable drive offsite (in my office).

Don't like running your own WebDAV server? Fine. But "the cloud" is not really an answer for offsite backup.. unless all your valuable data fits on a single DVD!

hitekalex
Jun 10, 2011, 05:45 PM
How exactly does the iCloud API work? Has anyone had a chance to really dig into it?

Do you have access to the entire iCloud? Because if so, then the "developer created iDisk equivalent" speculated above would be very possible. Joe Shmoe could create a "Filesystem for iCloud" app, allowing you to view pages files, numbers files, keynote files, and all other files of iCloud enabled apps on your devices.

From what I have seen, it's something like this. Each device gets access to the iCloud slice associated with the device's AppleID (up to 5GB of storage). Within that 5GB slice, every iCloud-enabled app gets it's own sandbox, associated with that apps entitlement ID. Multiple apps can share sandboxes by sharing entitlement IDs, but they would typically be done by the same developer.

So by default there is no sharing of iCloud data between apps.. And it's unclear if it's even possible to share data between different Apple IDs. So any kind of iDisk emulation would be restricted to a particlar app (or maybe a suite of apps). The user would then need to copy files into individual apps sandboxes (say Pages), just like you'd do today with GoodReader or ReaddleDocs.

toke lahti
Jun 11, 2011, 03:04 AM
I am very concerned that Steve Jobs said "Some people think that cloud computing is just a Hard Disk in the sky". This seems to undermine the incredibly useful fact that a Hd In the sky is damn useful. Also Steve said that Apple had been trying to get away from file systems for 10 years.

Getting away from rusty filesystems sounds laudable but in the real world we need folders and subfoulders. I organise work by projects , type and time, without a filesystems I would get lost... Also we have to interact with the rest fthe world that uses simpler file system structures....

Since I don't own any iOS devices, can someone explain to n00bi3 how files are managed in iOS without file system and every app handles only it's files?
Eg. if you have 3 apps in ipad that you can use for jpg's, how one jpg app gets pictures from the other app?

tlinford
Jun 11, 2011, 09:03 AM
You will get back up to 5GB of your files, to be precise.. 5GB is a minuscule amount of space by today's standards. I have about 2TB worth of personal files (movies, photos, music, home videos). Backing up 5GB of this data "in the cloud" doesn't do much for me. For the offsite backup purposes - I keep a high-capacity portable drive offsite (in my office).

Don't like running your own WebDAV server? Fine. But "the cloud" is not really an answer for offsite backup.. unless all your valuable data fits on a single DVD!

I do not consider movie or music files as precious, and for these fat files a local backup is perfectly file. When I am Speaking about precious files I am thinking specifically about a univiserty doctorate research files.... These files occupy within the 20 Gbyte MobileMe provision, this should continue to be offered!

Mad Mac Maniac
Jun 24, 2011, 01:18 PM
Well I guess this question was answered.

Apple wants to kill all assemblance of a file system!!

Benbikeman
Jul 3, 2011, 10:44 AM
From a user point of view who isn't running Lion server blah blah blah, the only option on pages for iPad seems to be iDisk?
You can use WebDAV to save Pages documents to dropbox (including in Word format), but that costs $5/month.