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MacRumors
Jun 10, 2011, 02:55 PM
http://images.macrumors.com/im/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/06/10/apple-legal-filing-cites-fear-of-inferior-amazon-appstore-tarnishing-its-reputation/)


http://images.macrumors.com/article-new/2011/06/amazon_appstore_icon.jpg

The trademark dispute (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/03/21/apple-sues-amazon-over-app-store-trademark/) between Apple and Amazon over the term "App Store" continues to play out, with Computerworld noting (http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9217533/Apple_slams_Amazon_s_Android_e_store_as_inferior_) that a new filing by Apple clarifies the company's stance that it fears a tarnishing of its reputation by association with the "inferior" Amazon Appstore for Android.In a filing on Wednesday, Apple countered Amazon's claim that "app store" is a generic label, and repeated its demand that the court issue a preliminary injunction barring Amazon from using the similar "appstore" to market its Android app download center.

"Amazon mischaracterizes Apple's tarnishment claim," Apple said in the June 8 reply to an earlier Amazon filing. "Apple has not asserted that the Android operating system is inferior. Rather, Apple has asserted that Amazon's service is inferior and will tarnish Apple's mark."In its filing, Apple also expresses concern over the Amazon Appstore's offering of apps that bypass security mechanisms built into the Android platform, as well as a number of cases of malicious or pirated apps that have appeared in Android app marketplaces. Apple fears that having the word "app store" associated with such types of applications will tarnish the reputation of Apple's relatively tightly-regulated App Store.

Apple has also taken the opportunity to point to Amazon's new Mac download store (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/05/26/amazons-new-mac-download-store-takes-on-apples-mac-app-store/) as an example of how Amazon can offer application download services without using the "app store" term.

Apple has been trying since July 2008 to have the U.S. Patent and Trademark Organization grant its trademark application for the "App Store" term. In the process, Apple has reached out to companies it believes are infringing on the mark, as would be required for a granted trademark lest it become considered a generic term and thus unprotect-able. Microsoft has been leading the fight (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/01/12/microsoft-objects-to-apples-app-store-trademark-application/) to have Apple's trademark application denied, arguing that the term is too generic in the first place to receive trademark protection.

Article Link: Apple Legal Filing Cites Fear of 'Inferior' Amazon Appstore Tarnishing its Reputation (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/06/10/apple-legal-filing-cites-fear-of-inferior-amazon-appstore-tarnishing-its-reputation/)



Mr Fusion
Jun 10, 2011, 03:01 PM
... So Apple's worried about the tarnishing of their "tightly regulated" reputation?

...

;)

ECUpirate44
Jun 10, 2011, 03:03 PM
"Inferior app store" OUCH!

inket
Jun 10, 2011, 03:08 PM
An appropriate word to describe this is "pwned".

xnu
Jun 10, 2011, 03:11 PM
change the name to "crAPPS" perhaps?

logandzwon
Jun 10, 2011, 03:11 PM
I don't have the words...

sined13
Jun 10, 2011, 03:13 PM
Apple's arrogance has no boundaries.

Goldinboy17
Jun 10, 2011, 03:14 PM
Really?
That's all I've got to say.

RoboCop001
Jun 10, 2011, 03:15 PM
Apple = Daleks?

Steve "I've created the perfect species!!! From my own cells!!!"

Phil S. "THE AMAZON APPSTORE IS IN-FE-RIOR! IT MUST BE EX-TER-MINATED!"



Steve Ballmer = CyberController

chrono1081
Jun 10, 2011, 03:16 PM
Sorry Apple, I can't back you on this one and I don't think others will either.

wordoflife
Jun 10, 2011, 03:16 PM
Inferior Appstore? That's pushing it, Apple. Wow.

And no one cares what you call your Appstore/Marketplace/download center. We just care about the applications.

BJ.SoundWave360
Jun 10, 2011, 03:16 PM
If Amazon would put some investment into some design people, it would REALLY help. That clunky pile of clutter is hard to look at. Apple should win this. I tried downloading an album from Amazon, to this day if I launch that downloader, it is STILL trying to get one of the songs from that album.

"It just works" is not what is going on there. Basically, they are Walmart on the internet. You go there to get something you've already chosen that you want cheap, then you get the heck out of there.

MacEdit
Jun 10, 2011, 03:18 PM
its funny because even though "app store" can be a generic term, it wasn't until apple created their's that other's wanted to use it.
Apple beat them to the punch and the other companies want to capitalize on a phrase and term that the iPhone and Apple pretty much created.
It wasn't until the marketers of other phones started to use the term apps to help sell their devices against apple's that this became an issue. Whether you support Apple or not, you can not deny they did it first and others are just trying to catch up.

benthewraith
Jun 10, 2011, 03:19 PM
If Amazon would put some investment into some design people, it would REALLY help. That clunky pile of clutter is hard to look at. Apple should win this. I tried downloading an album from Amazon, to this day if I launch that downloader, it is STILL trying to get one of the songs from that album.

"It just works" is not what is going on there. Basically, they are Walmart on the internet. You go there to get something you've already chosen that you want cheap, then you get the heck out of there.

Ever have random download errors 502, 503, 603, 1009, 8003, 1009... they're all from iTunes.

KingCrimson
Jun 10, 2011, 03:19 PM
If Amazon would put some investment into some design people, it would REALLY help. That clunky pile of clutter is hard to look at. Apple should win this. I tried downloading an album from Amazon, to this day if I launch that downloader, it is STILL trying to get one of the songs from that album.

"It just works" is not what is going on there. Basically, they are Walmart on the internet. You go there to get something you've already chosen that you want cheap, then you get the heck out of there.

You have to know that the Zune Marketplace is airtight and beautiful to work with.

Maiden of Death
Jun 10, 2011, 03:19 PM
Well normally I have no problems with apple but in this case Apple can eat a dick. Amazon is still new right? what give apple the right to call new products that aren't made by them "Inferior". Are they trying to make everything closed?
Even though I prefer my iPhone to the modern day Android, Apple should seriously bug off projects that aren't made by them unless it directly copies them instead of suing the living crap off everything they don't agree with, Also FYI apple App stands for Application not Apple so chill the hell out.

kenliles
Jun 10, 2011, 03:21 PM
App Store was clearly a term associated with Apple's application store, first termed by them, marketed by them, and broadly accepted as referring to it's success. App Store does not associate with Amazon or any other store. IMO Apple is correct;

There is a clear reason Amazon named it such. In my view Amazon is the leach here...

wirelessness
Jun 10, 2011, 03:21 PM
How stupid does Apple think its consumers are? Do they really think anyone is stupid enough to confuse the Apple App Store with the Android App Store and then somehow blame Apple for this....?

'Oh, Apple sucks!!! This Amazon App Store is total garbage it's offering me an Adobe Flash Plug-in, why in the world would I want something like that?'

MCP-511
Jun 10, 2011, 03:21 PM
CRapp Store. :D

magnon
Jun 10, 2011, 03:21 PM
You have to know that the Zune Marketplace is airtight and beautiful to work with.

What's a Zune?

kirky29
Jun 10, 2011, 03:21 PM
I can't back Apple on this one!
The Apple App Store is far from perfect.

BLACKFRIDAY
Jun 10, 2011, 03:22 PM
That's rude.

Maybe Apple shouldn't call their phone an iPhone as there are so many crap phones out there. /jk

Rodimus Prime
Jun 10, 2011, 03:22 PM
These defense from Apple just smell of pure desperation.

Sorry Apple, I can't back you on this one and I don't think others will either.

oh come on you for forgetting about a certain user here who goes by a 3 letter name. but I will say it is nice to see one of the bigger Apple fans here go against Apple.

Inkling
Jun 10, 2011, 03:23 PM
Apple's claim of tarnishment is just legal boilerplate. Trademark infringement, should Apple even get one for App Store, requires showing that similar terms or marks inflict harm on the value of your trademark. That means Apple has to diss Amazon's store. It doesn't mean that Apple lawyers actually have to believe what they're claiming.

This dispute is ridiculous. Whether Apple likes it or not, "app" really is a generic term and Apple and Amazon are so big, that consumer confusion is impossible. Fighting over this makes a little sense as the Ford Motor Company and General Motors disputing over who has the right to "Motor" in their name.

KingCrimson
Jun 10, 2011, 03:23 PM
App Store was clearly a term associated with Apple's application store, first termed by them, marketed by them, and broadly accepted as referring to it's success. App Store does not associate with Amazon or any other store. IMO Apple is correct;

There is a clear reason Amazon named it such. In my view Amazon is the leach here...

Of course you believe that...

benthewraith
Jun 10, 2011, 03:24 PM
These defense from Apple just smell of pure desperation.



oh come on you for forgetting about a certain user here who goes by a 3 letter name.

Shhh... that alone summons him now. He's like the Borg, he adapts.

KingCrimson
Jun 10, 2011, 03:25 PM
Apple's claim of tarnishment is just legal boilerplate. Trademark infringement, should Apple even get one for App Store, requires showing that similar terms or marks inflict harm on the value of your trademark. That means Apple has to diss Amazon's store. It doesn't mean that Apple lawyers actually have to believe what they're claiming.

This dispute is ridiculous. Whether Apple likes it or not, "app" really is a generic term and Apple and Amazon are so big, that consumer confusion is impossible. Fighting over this makes a little sense as the Ford Motor Company and General Motors disputing over who has the right to "Motor" in their name.

Of course the equivalent would have been Ford claiming that GM couldn't have dreamt of using "Motor" because before they only understood "horseless carriage". Essentially Apple is accusing other companies of being primitives compared to their prescient genius.

a.gomez
Jun 10, 2011, 03:27 PM
nonsense - I have it on my Galaxy Tab and have not had a problem with it - no better or worst over getting apps on my iPhone - not a defense based on reality

Doctor Q
Jun 10, 2011, 03:27 PM
I'll be surprised if Apple wins this court battle. I consider the phrase "app store" to be merely descriptive, not a brand name, and I think this cat is already out of the bag.

RawBert
Jun 10, 2011, 03:30 PM
Inferior App Store... :D LOL - That sounds funny.

zin
Jun 10, 2011, 03:30 PM
oh come on you for forgetting about a certain user here who goes by a 3 letter name. but I will say it is nice to see one of the bigger Apple fans here go against Apple.

I hope you don't mean me. :eek:

Anyway, I have to agree. This is quite rude.

RawBert
Jun 10, 2011, 03:32 PM
I hope you don't mean me.

He means *LTD*. He's got it in for him. :rolleyes:

wow - i love apple and all but that was seriously snotty

I think you mean snooty (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/snooty).

reactions
Jun 10, 2011, 03:33 PM
wow - i love apple and all but that was seriously snotty :rolleyes:

good luck in stopping amazon which we all love :D

charlituna
Jun 10, 2011, 03:33 PM
the point isn't what argument Apple gives. The real point is that they filed and were approved for a Trademark on the term App Store for mobile device software (though now several folks are trying to appeal that judgement). And under Trademark rules you have to protect your trademark from anyone else that tries to use it or you will lose the protection. And unlike patents you have to do it right away. You can't wait 19 and a half years until someone has made a fortune off your stuff to file a suit. Apple is just doing what they have to do to stay in the game.

tdstom
Jun 10, 2011, 03:34 PM
What I'm shocked over is Microsoft - the ones who register trademarked "Word" and "Window" - is the ones leading the charge!

Really Microsoft?? Those that live in glass houses . . .

reactions
Jun 10, 2011, 03:34 PM
Shhh... that alone summons him now. He's like the Borg, he adapts.

:popcorn:

Fraaaa
Jun 10, 2011, 03:38 PM
The argument is a bit dodgy to me.

What if Amazon's AppStore was as tightly controlled as the Apple one's? So would Apple allow Amazon to use that name? No. The argument is foul.

TallGuy1970
Jun 10, 2011, 03:38 PM
Translation...

Android and Google aren't so bad, but we think Amazon is a piece of junk! ;)

thejadedmonkey
Jun 10, 2011, 03:48 PM
What's a Zune?

Zune is the name of Microsoft's MP3 player, music service, and...

Oh right, I'm on a mac board ;)

Back on Topic, I feel like Apple would be good to let this die. Otherwise they'll have to fight the Microsoft AppStore, Amazon AppStore, BlackBerry AppStore, HP/Pre AppStore, Android AppStore, and Chrome AppStore.

I just don't see them winning, and ultimately it'll be just as bad for them as not having Word trademarked is for Microsoft ;)

*LTD*
Jun 10, 2011, 03:50 PM
the point isn't what argument Apple gives. The real point is that they filed and were approved for a Trademark on the term App Store for mobile device software (though now several folks are trying to appeal that judgement). And under Trademark rules you have to protect your trademark from anyone else that tries to use it or you will lose the protection. And unlike patents you have to do it right away. You can't wait 19 and a half years until someone has made a fortune off your stuff to file a suit. Apple is just doing what they have to do to stay in the game.

This is worth repeating.

Zune is the name of Microsoft's MP3 player, music service, and...

Oh right, I'm on a mac board ;)

Back on Topic, I feel like Apple would be good to let this die. Otherwise they'll have to fight the Microsoft AppStore, Amazon AppStore, BlackBerry AppStore, HP/Pre AppStore, Android AppStore, and Chrome AppStore.

I just don't see them winning, and ultimately it'll be just as bad for them as not having Word trademarked is for Microsoft ;)

Those other ones already have different names.

ECUpirate44
Jun 10, 2011, 03:53 PM
Zune was the name of Microsoft's MP3 player, music service.
Fixed that for you ;)

brayhite
Jun 10, 2011, 03:58 PM
I agree it's rather lame for Apple to do this, but I still feel like App Store should be granted to them for trademarking. The first page of a Google search for App Store is nearly all about Apple's App Store. www.appstore.com redirects you to an Apple page. Hell, over half of Apple's name is part of the potential trademark App Store.

I see the reasoning behind it being too generic and descriptive of a name, but the fact of the matter is, it's been widely adopted as to be referencing Apple's App Store. Not Android's marketplace. Not Amazon's AppStore.

If Microsoft can trademark "Internet Explorer", something so descriptive as to be exactly what you're doing while using it - exploring the internet - then Apple should be able to trademark App Store.

iNeedToDoHw
Jun 10, 2011, 04:00 PM
well this is embarrassing for amazon. being called inferior

BC2009
Jun 10, 2011, 04:06 PM
An appropriate word to describe this is "pwned".

That's not a word, and it fails to appropriately describe anything. (sorry pet-peeve)

Apple's claim of tarnishment is just legal boilerplate. Trademark infringement, should Apple even get one for App Store, requires showing that similar terms or marks inflict harm on the value of your trademark. That means Apple has to diss Amazon's store. It doesn't mean that Apple lawyers actually have to believe what they're claiming.


Exactly. This is almost a required response from Apple since "trademark defense" is about showing a dilution of your brand. There are two basic tenants they can stand on:

1) Customers will be confused about who they are buying from.

2) Customers will feel that things associated with the trademark (e.g.: "App Store") are of low quality.

Apple would have a hard time proving (1) since both companies are high-profile. But they will probably make a few statements with respect to (1). Their lawsuit with Samsung over trade dress and design patents is more inline with (1).

Apple's stance on there being "more malware" on the Amazon App Store is probably the best case they can make for (2). Both stores have bugs and issues (albeit Amazon has more), but Apple's is far from perfect. Apple is saying that they want to associate the term "App Store" with a malware-free no-worry download place and Amazon is tarnishing the meaning. I am pretty sure the future of the "Macs are Malware-Free" motto is going to be based on a decision to require an extra step to enable software installations that did not come from the "Mac App Store" since Trojans are so prevalent these days. Already the iOS App Store is a nice malware-free place to purchase apps. So I can see Apple's point regarding malware here. In any other ways they try to say the Amazon App Store is inferior it would just come down to a subjective opinion -- that is not going to hold up.

nagromme
Jun 10, 2011, 04:08 PM
I don’t much care how this shakes out—I can see both sides.

But I can see Apple’s point on this particular issue. It’s miraculous how safe installing apps on iOS is: non-techie people (like my parents) are not afraid to just try any old app they feel like. Even I (a tech-head) am cautious about that on Mac and Windows! (And I would surely be nervous on Android too.)

The fact that apps are so VERY safe and hassle-free makes the App Store and iOS apps in general feel (and work!) like something truly new. Kind of like the widespread use of the term “apps” is new, and the term “App Store” itself.

If people think of the App Store as safe, when computing in general is so dangerous, and then Amazon (combined with Android) starts to make people think “app stores” are NOT safe (among those all-important people who aren’t yet iOS users), then that does indeed tarnish Apple’s App Store product and harm their business.

the8thark
Jun 10, 2011, 04:18 PM
If MS can trademark - Word, Windows, Internet Explorer. Then Apple can trademark AppStore. There is no difference between Apple's and MS's trademarks. Both are trademarks of seemingly very general words. But oh yeah there's a good potential amount of money to be made if you beat Apple. And you can set a precedent if you beat Apple. That's the only reason why people are suing Apple these days. For the money.

I have to say Apple is going about this in a rather arrogant fashion. But the truth of the matter is, if Apple loose this case then people should target MS's patents using the Apple case as precedent. But that won't happen. The world and his dog knows Apple is popular now and is trying to use Apple's success leech publicity for themselves (and their own companies) using this fact.

Apple deserve to win this. And they probably will if they don't get too arrogant over themselves. If they do then they might lose. Getting the court system to like you is a good way to help you to win. I know it's supposed to be 100% about the law but heck everyone knows it's more then that. Hard to win any case if the court hates you when you walk in the door.

blow45
Jun 10, 2011, 04:19 PM
Apple has also taken the opportunity to point to Amazon's new Mac download store as an example of how Amazon can offer application download services without using the "app store" term.

hoisting them on their own petard, clever lawyers. :cool:

CFreymarc
Jun 10, 2011, 04:21 PM
Inferior Appstore? That's pushing it, Apple. Wow.

And no one cares what you call your Appstore/Marketplace/download center. We just care about the applications.

Now I know why the courtyard of the new purposed Apple campus is so large, so Apple legal's balls of steel could fit there.

KnightWRX
Jun 10, 2011, 04:21 PM
App Store was clearly a term associated with Apple's application store, first termed by them

Wait, Apple is first to say App Store ? They did this prior to 1998 ? Because someone filed a trademark for AppStore in 1998 :

Typed Drawing

Word Mark APPSTORE
Goods and Services (ABANDONED) IC 042. US 100 101. G & S: providing computer software application hosting services by means of a global computer information network, where such services allow multiple users to rent software applications developed by applicant or third parties
Mark Drawing Code (1) TYPED DRAWING
Serial Number 75542841
Filing Date August 26, 1998
Current Filing Basis 1B
Original Filing Basis 1B
Published for Opposition February 29, 2000
Owner (APPLICANT) SAGE NETWORKS, INC. CORPORATION BY ASSIGNMENT DELAWARE 215 FIRST STREET CAMBRIDGE MASSACHUSETTS 02142
Assignment Recorded ASSIGNMENT RECORDED
Attorney of Record John P. Courtney
Type of Mark SERVICE MARK
Register PRINCIPAL
Live/Dead Indicator DEAD
Abandonment Date November 24, 2000

I think you need to revise your position. Apple sure didn't coin the term "App Store" and sure weren't "first".

CFreymarc
Jun 10, 2011, 04:22 PM
well this is embarrassing for amazon. being called inferior

Considering most of the work done on Amazon's store is outsourced, just desserts.

ratzzo
Jun 10, 2011, 04:22 PM
The higher they fly the harder they fall...

Mattie Num Nums
Jun 10, 2011, 04:40 PM
The Amazon App Store is actually pretty nice. I use it everyday to get my free app of the day.

iCrizzo
Jun 10, 2011, 05:05 PM
I wonder if iCloud communications could use MobileMe as an example of "Inferior" cloud computing against Apple. :D

ten-oak-druid
Jun 10, 2011, 05:33 PM
Apple has dealt with inferior competition for a while now. Windows and Android come to mind. I think they just jump to conclusions about the competition too easily now; especially with the lawsuit in play. Amazon's products are not inferior. I like the kindle and Amazon's cloud service is fine. Amazon should come up with a new name for their store though.

Ubuntu
Jun 10, 2011, 05:38 PM
Only company tarnishing Apple's reputation is Apple itself at the moment. I mean this isn't a good time seeing as they're suing companies for copying and in the other hand blatantly copying other companies at the same time... for the innovative Apple we all know and love that'll do some damage.

EDIT: Can't they just go after Microsoft? Really, look at the link in my signature, that's just so lame of Microsoft.

jonnysods
Jun 10, 2011, 05:39 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Mobile/8J2)

Wow, interesting given the icloud communications lawsuit.

Prallethrin
Jun 10, 2011, 05:50 PM
Just call it something else.

Look at RIM, they called their App World. See no problem.

So many names you can use, App Universe, App Mart, App Market, ... etc.
What the heck do these companies pay their marketing people for?

benthewraith
Jun 10, 2011, 05:54 PM
Apple has dealt with inferior competition for a while now. Windows and Android come to mind. I think they just jump to conclusions about the competition too easily now; especially with the lawsuit in play. Amazon's products are not inferior. I like the kindle and Amazon's cloud service is fine. Amazon should come up with a new name for their store though.

I'm sorry, but as an operating system, Android OS is better than iOS.

KnightWRX
Jun 10, 2011, 05:58 PM
I'm sorry, but as an operating system, Android OS is better than iOS.

iOS 5 will be as good as Android! After all, they copied everything Google has done to get it up to par. :p

ten-oak-druid
Jun 10, 2011, 06:06 PM
Just call it something else.

Look at RIM, they called their App World. See no problem.

So many names you can use, App Universe, App Mart, App Market, ... etc.
What the heck do these companies pay their marketing people for?

Apple should have gone after something different than "cloud".

Perhaps "inebula"? Think higher! LOL

I'm sorry, but as an operating system, Android OS is better than iOS.

Wrong.

*LTD*
Jun 10, 2011, 06:11 PM
Just call it something else.

Why? The associations consumers make with "App Store" make the term far too valuable.

This is what Apple is fighting for - the positive, popular associations consumers make with the term. Brand recognition. "App Store" is a critical slice of the Apple mindshare pie. Apple popularized it, placed it into everyday consciousness and made it a household term. It's associated with a huge money-making aspect of Apple's ecosystem. Way, way too valuable not to fight for in court. Apple would be absolutely retarded not to do everything to protect it. There is a lot of money at stake here. It doesn't matter how litigious it makes Apple seem. The average consumer certainly doesn't give a damn how often Apple is in court. What really counts is that they get their Apple gear, and are given more goodies as time goes by. That's all that matters.

Ownership of this term is all about directing and influencing consumer perception. It's extremely powerful. For example, Apple has fought tooth and nail over the last few years for rights to "i"-everything. And now look at them. The most powerful and well-known brand on the planet.

*LTD*
Jun 10, 2011, 06:36 PM
I love how apple parented a generic term and other companies need to use it to get there products and stores off the ground

http://www.appleitup.blogspot.com

;) Someone gets it.

EDIT:

I love how apple parented a generic term and other companies need to use it to get there products and stores off the ground

http://www.appleitup.blogspot.com

I would really love to know who voted this comment down. Because this is EXACTLY what is happening.

apolloa
Jun 10, 2011, 06:43 PM
What Steve wants Apple's lawyers will stoop to ANY level to get, if this was a company the size of iCloud instead of Amazon, then I have no doubt they would simply steal the term and use it without asking said company..

Apple can sometimes be really thick and utter cocks..

SeattleMoose
Jun 10, 2011, 06:43 PM
Well....it is.

*LTD*
Jun 10, 2011, 06:45 PM
What Steve wants Apple's lawyers will stoop to ANY level to get, if this was a company the size of iCloud instead of Amazon, then I have no doubt they would simply steal the term and use it without asking said company..

Apple can sometimes be really thick and utter cocks..

It's business. You can't really blame Apple for doing what they're doing in this case. You and I would do exactly the same thing.

lilo777
Jun 10, 2011, 06:47 PM
An appropriate word to describe this is "pwned".

Not yet. But Apple will be pwned by court on this one.

benthewraith
Jun 10, 2011, 06:48 PM
It's business. You can't really blame Apple for doing what they're doing in this case. You and I would do exactly the same thing.

Because you know, Google is suing Microsoft over the use of "market" in the names of their respective app stores? :rolleyes:

NinjaHERO
Jun 10, 2011, 06:49 PM
I know it's been said a million times on this site, but it's pretty clear that App Store is generic. Either way I hate this fight.

Apple makes the computers I love and Amazon sells me everything else in my life. It's like my two favorite companies battling to the death. This sucks. :(

*LTD*
Jun 10, 2011, 06:53 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPad; U; CPU OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8J2 Safari/6533.18.5)

It's business. You can't really blame Apple for doing what they're doing in this case. You and I would do exactly the same thing.

Because you know, Google is suing Microsoft over the use of "market" in the names of their respective app stores? :rolleyes:

No, the term "App Store" equates to a market success phenomenon. It's iconic. It's extremely valuable now as mindshare goes. Far more than the others are. This is a special case.

"App Store." Say it and the first thing that comes to mind is Apple and everything consumers associate with the brand - everything they *perceive* of the brand. It's important for Apple to control perception when it comes to their brand and any term associated with their brand. It's consumers' perceptions that are the key to success. Apple's ability to tap in and control that (while influencing it *against* others) has been one of their reasons they do so well in the market (the others being that they make great products.)

Controlling perception is really what every company would love.

lilo777
Jun 10, 2011, 06:56 PM
Apple has dealt with inferior competition for a while now. Windows and Android come to mind. I think they just jump to conclusions about the competition too easily now; especially with the lawsuit in play. Amazon's products are not inferior. I like the kindle and Amazon's cloud service is fine. Amazon should come up with a new name for their store though.

Could you explain how "inferior" competitors manage to beat Apple so handily?

*LTD*
Jun 10, 2011, 07:04 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPad; U; CPU OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8J2 Safari/6533.18.5)

Apple has dealt with inferior competition for a while now. Windows and Android come to mind. I think they just jump to conclusions about the competition too easily now; especially with the lawsuit in play. Amazon's products are not inferior. I like the kindle and Amazon's cloud service is fine. Amazon should come up with a new name for their store though.

Could you explain how "inferior" competitors manage to beat Apple so handily?

Apple directs the industry and dictates the pace of change, you can't do much better than that. It's not for nothing they enjoy record sales of nearly everything they make quarter for quarter; that they are the most valuable tech company on the planet; that they have the strongest brand on the planet; that they create entire markets almost overnight, with everyone else wanting to get in on the action.

Yeah, I'd guard my image like it's gold too, if I were in their position. And I'd use all the tools at my disposal to go after even the slightest sign of encroachment. Because *I can.*

0815
Jun 10, 2011, 07:40 PM
What's a Zune?

That is (was) a so called iPod Killer ... unfortunately it got killed before it killed the iPod :D

jay_app
Jun 10, 2011, 07:45 PM
Microsoft has no standing, having trademarked the word "windows".

benthewraith
Jun 10, 2011, 07:51 PM
Microsoft has no standing, having trademarked the word "windows".

Windows is the name of an operating system. Both windows and app store are generic. Windows can refer to the Operating System, which is protected by trademark, or the application window running on your computer, which is generic and not protected by Microsoft's trademark. Outside of technology, windows are generic completely. App is an abbreviation for application, whose word predates Apple. Hell, there's even this folder called Applications on Windows 95-7.

And I disagree, LTD, when people think App Store, they think about the store they use for their respective phone platform AS an app store.

reactions
Jun 10, 2011, 08:26 PM
He means *LTD*. He's got it in for him. :rolleyes:


I think you mean snooty (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/snooty).

how about both:eek:

AppleScruff1
Jun 10, 2011, 08:31 PM
Apple gets lamer as the days go by.

lamina
Jun 10, 2011, 08:37 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8J2 Safari/6533.18.5)

Now that's smug.

Rodimus Prime
Jun 10, 2011, 08:41 PM
Windows is the name of an operating system. Both windows and app store are generic. Windows can refer to the Operating System, which is protected by trademark, or the application window running on your computer, which is generic and not protected by Microsoft's trademark. Outside of technology, windows are generic completely. App is an abbreviation for application, whose word predates Apple. Hell, there's even this folder called Applications on Windows 95-7.

And I disagree, LTD, when people think App Store, they think about the store they use for their respective phone platform AS an app store.

I agree with you.

Multiple people I know (both iPhone and Android ones) all use App store to describe the App store. There is no confusion. If they are talking about Apple's App Store. They say APPLE App Store. If is is Amazon's App Store they use AMAZON App Store. There is no confusion.

This is more Apple trying to confuse the custermer to preventing companies from calling the name of the store exactly what it is an App store.

*LTD*
Jun 10, 2011, 08:53 PM
I agree with you.

Multiple people I know (both iPhone and Android ones) all use App store to describe the App store. There is no confusion. If they are talking about Apple's App Store. They say APPLE App Store. If is is Amazon's App Store they use AMAZON App Store. There is no confusion.

This is more Apple trying to confuse the custermer to preventing companies from calling the name of the store exactly what it is an App store.

Multiple people I know (both iPhone and Android ones) all use App Store to describe all "app stores."

See what I just did? I know people as well. I can say *anything* I want without having to substantiate any of it when I use the disclaimer "multiple people I know." It's about as useful as a pair of thermal underwear in Death Valley at high noon. Without an actual substantial sample or survey, we can't know for sure. But given the fact that a really smart company that makes a helluva lot of money has decided to pursue this, I'm fairly confident we can get an idea of just how important something like this is.

What we *do* have to go on is Apple's decision to pursue this. We know that they clearly understand consumers (better than most) and they clearly see a material advantage in pursuing ownership of this term, and quite frankly, their pursuit of trademarks in the past (or rather, their explicit reliance on them) has played a significant role in the recognition of their brand. At least, we can assume that whatever they did in the past has contributed to their success.

In a nutshell, Apple wouldn't be pursuing this if there was no material value in doing so. It's not being done for fun and games or to "confuse the customer", whatever that's supposed to mean. Here's a company that understands brand power and the consumer mind to the fullest. Chances are, there's something to their decision to go ahead with this. Better to go on this than what your particular circle of buddies think.

JoeG4
Jun 10, 2011, 09:09 PM
Dare I say it, and this coming from a guy that LIKES the Amazon App store a lot, I think Amazon should just call the darn thing "Amazon Apps" and leave it at that. It's shorter, and well.. www.amazon.com/apps is the actual app store address for it anyway.

True story.

I think (but I can't prove) that Apple was the first to coin the term "app store", but I don't think it should be trademarked. I don't think they should be suing others for using the same set of words to describe a place where people buy mobile phone applications, because in the end they're just making things worse for everyone.

However, seeing as some people on this board believe Apple can do no wrong and anything but the iOS ecosystem is a "fragmented" "problematic" "inferior" experience, I can't say anything to make you happy lol.

benthewraith
Jun 10, 2011, 09:10 PM
Multiple people I know (both iPhone and Android ones) all use App Store to describe all "app stores."

See what I just did? I know people as well. I can say *anything* I want without having to substantiate any of it when I use the disclaimer "multiple people I know."

I'm guessing Apple doesn't need to substantiate the massive horror stories of consumer confusion over an android app store or Amazon app store. They can just say it too?

Jobs himself recognized Google's app market as an "app store." (http://appadvice.com/appnn/2011/04/amazon-cites-steve-jobs-apples-app-store-lawsuit-thrown)

thermodynamic
Jun 10, 2011, 09:12 PM
Wouldn't it be cheaper just to get people used to the branded name "iApps", instead of all this legal nonsense and over what is a generic term to begin with?

Just wait for legal jobs going offshore, too... then the fun will really begin.

Rodimus Prime
Jun 10, 2011, 09:24 PM
I'm guessing Apple doesn't need to substantiate the massive horror stories of consumer confusion over an android app store or Amazon app store. They can just say it too?

Jobs himself recognized Google's app market as an "app store." (http://appadvice.com/appnn/2011/04/amazon-cites-steve-jobs-apples-app-store-lawsuit-thrown)


That has been brought up multiple times and every time it gets passed over and not responded too.

The kicker is in court that direct question will come up and it will be ask how can Apple say the term app store is not generic when its own CEO uses it that way in public keynotes.

benthewraith
Jun 10, 2011, 09:33 PM
Wouldn't it be cheaper just to get people used to the branded name "iApps", instead of all this legal nonsense and over what is a generic term to begin with?

Just wait for legal jobs going offshore, too... then the fun will really begin.

Apple hath "spoken," and so thereforeith, it is to be. Doth sayeth Steve Jobs. So Jobs decried to his followers, "we are the app store. The falsifiers who claim to provide a market for apps shall be smote by the agents and enforcers and reviewers of Hammurabi's code."

For Apple's own followers failed to see Jobs' perversion from Emmanuel Goldstein to Big Brother. Choosing which apps live and die in his market, a strict code of law for developers to follow... for Sidious basked in his new apprentice's transformation.

kenliles
Jun 10, 2011, 10:03 PM
Wait, Apple is first to say App Store ? They did this prior to 1998 ? Because someone filed a trademark for AppStore in 1998 :



I think you need to revise your position. Apple sure didn't coin the term "App Store" and sure weren't "first".

it's not the first to 'coin' the term or even file a trademark for certain uses. If you think of Cambridge when you hear Appstore then you have a point. Otherwise it doesn't apply to what Apple created and associated with the term. There is n't a term in the english language that hasn't been uttered and used, and even trademarked for certain purposes.

"Wait, Apple is first to say App Store?" No, and neither was Cambridge in your example, and yet they received a trademark. Why is it , they aren't the ones fighting Apple's use of it?
Because it was Amazon who leveraged the term for an identical purpose.

Whether Apple wins this or not - in my view, Amazon is the one who clearly characterizes themselves as yet another copy-cat of marketing to benefit from others work.

I still shop Amazon and like their service; but clearly they are best as a purveyor of other people's wares...

I believe Apple should be granted the trademark; 'Windows' and other examples are even more generically used - even in the use context. We were all using windows as a descriptor of segmented presentations on computers long before Microsoft 'coined' the term for their product. And we used it primarily for segmented presentation of APPS!! :)

ken

gorgeousninja
Jun 10, 2011, 10:27 PM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8J2 Safari/6533.18.5)

If Amazon would put some investment into some design people, it would REALLY help. That clunky pile of clutter is hard to look at. Apple should win this. I tried downloading an album from Amazon, to this day if I launch that downloader, it is STILL trying to get one of the songs from that album.

"It just works" is not what is going on there. Basically, they are Walmart on the internet. You go there to get something you've already chosen that you want cheap, then you get the heck out of there.

You have to know that the Zune Marketplace is airtight and beautiful to work with.

Is that cos it only ever has 8 customers?

aaaaaaron
Jun 10, 2011, 10:51 PM
....i think this story is tarnishing Apple's reputation. What is happening to the company I was once so fond of?

JabbaII
Jun 10, 2011, 10:53 PM
Apple's arrogance has no boundaries.

Just some trashing talking :cool:

b166er
Jun 10, 2011, 11:23 PM
this argument over use of the terms "app store" is getting stupid. Apple, I realize you did it first, but that doesn't always automatically make it yours. You can't just go around trademarking generic terms. Saying you bought an app in the app store is the same thing as saying you bought cereal at the grocery store. "App Store" is not specific to a company anymore than "Grocery Store" is.

I'll sum it up like this...... what if they had let Paris Hilton trademark "That's hot"?! THAT'S NOT THE WORLD I WANT FOR MY CHILDREN.

maclaptop
Jun 11, 2011, 12:31 AM
Apple's arrogance has no boundaries.

I agree, it's my one problem with Apple they are far too successful to act this way.

AppleScruff1
Jun 11, 2011, 12:33 AM
Thank goodness I'm old and call them programs instead of apps.

gco212
Jun 11, 2011, 01:13 AM
Multiple people I know (both iPhone and Android ones) all use App Store to describe all "app stores."

See what I just did? I know people as well. I can say *anything* I want without having to substantiate any of it when I use the disclaimer "multiple people I know." It's about as useful as a pair of thermal underwear in Death Valley at high noon. Without an actual substantial sample or survey, we can't know for sure. But given the fact that a really smart company that makes a helluva lot of money has decided to pursue this, I'm fairly confident we can get an idea of just how important something like this is.

What we *do* have to go on is Apple's decision to pursue this. We know that they clearly understand consumers (better than most) and they clearly see a material advantage in pursuing ownership of this term, and quite frankly, their pursuit of trademarks in the past (or rather, their explicit reliance on them) has played a significant role in the recognition of their brand. At least, we can assume that whatever they did in the past has contributed to their success.

In a nutshell, Apple wouldn't be pursuing this if there was no material value in doing so. It's not being done for fun and games or to "confuse the customer", whatever that's supposed to mean. Here's a company that understands brand power and the consumer mind to the fullest. Chances are, there's something to their decision to go ahead with this. Better to go on this than what your particular circle of buddies think.

So you're now assuming Amazon and Microsoft chose to fight because they were sure they will lose or Apple wouldn't care? That's preposterous. Apple is fighting because they think the legal fees of more or less $50 million are less than the brand's worth times the chances of winning. Amazon and Microsoft came to the opposite conclusion with independent advisors.

I really doubt that if you ask an equal survey of iOS and Android users, what does App Store mean, they'll say Apple App Store. I have no proof, but neither do you for your previous claim. All I have is that they'll pull out their phone and point to the "Store" they use every day. Apple doesn't own a trademark for App, it's tough to then get one for a store that sells apps and calls itself the "app store." Not impossible, but very difficult.

w00t951
Jun 11, 2011, 01:24 AM
You have to know that the Zune Marketplace is airtight and beautiful to work with.

How can you tell if it's airtight? There's nothing in it.

KnightWRX
Jun 11, 2011, 02:34 AM
it's not the first to 'coin' the term or even file a trademark for certain uses. If you think of Cambridge when you hear Appstore then you have a point. Otherwise it doesn't apply to what Apple created and associated with the term. There is n't a term in the english language that hasn't been uttered and used, and even trademarked for certain purposes.

What are you on about ? Did you read the filing I pointed out ? SAGE networks applied in 1998 for the App Store trademark for an online store that rented apps...

Cambridge what ? You're not even making any sense here in your rant.

I believe Apple should be granted the trademark; 'Windows' and other examples are even more generically used - even in the use context. We were all using windows as a descriptor of segmented presentations on computers long before Microsoft 'coined' the term for their product. And we used it primarily for segmented presentation of APPS!! :)

Windows in computer terms are not operating systems. They are graphical squares on screen that can contain information or present controls to a user in a graphical way for interaction. A system to display these squares is called a Windowing System (like X11, Quartz or... well the early versions of Windows).

An Operating system is a mostly a compromised of a process scheduler and a hardware interface, it has nothing to do with presentation layers for users and is even more detached from the "Window" concept.

Windows certainly isn't a descriptive trademark like App Store is and your example has been debunked again and again in these threads. So your whole post has basically been non-sensical.


this argument over use of the terms "app store" is getting stupid. Apple, I realize you did it first, but that doesn't always automatically make it yours.

SAGE networks did it first ;) I posted earlier in the thread showing their 1998 filing for the trademark AppStore.

yourstation
Jun 11, 2011, 04:54 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.0.2 Mobile/8J2 Safari/6533.18.5)

If Amazon would put some investment into some design people, it would REALLY help. That clunky pile of clutter is hard to look at. Apple should win this. I tried downloading an album from Amazon, to this day if I launch that downloader, it is STILL trying to get one of the songs from that album.

"It just works" is not what is going on there. Basically, they are Walmart on the internet. You go there to get something you've already chosen that you want cheap, then you get the heck out of there.

Very well put.

Also people need to go back a couple of years when the term 'app store' really did mean the apple app store. This has changed as people like amazon have done some damage and Apple do have a point with the shoddy security of some of the android apps that come from the store. Apple clearly have a case here...

Just because Amazon and Microsoft have tried to use this as a generic term does not make it so. In the UK one night think of the company Kleenex or sellotape Many people use this incorrectly

mmoosa
Jun 11, 2011, 05:35 AM
How stupid does Apple think its consumers are? Do they really think anyone is stupid enough to confuse the Apple App Store with the Android App Store and then somehow blame Apple for this....?

'Oh, Apple sucks!!! This Amazon App Store is total garbage it's offering me an Adobe Flash Plug-in, why in the world would I want something like that?'

They're stupid enough to buy the iOS device in the first place?

Hurda
Jun 11, 2011, 05:58 AM
Thank goodness I'm old and call them programs instead of apps.
Hear, hear.

dalexa
Jun 11, 2011, 06:22 AM
i think amazon should rename the store.

since apple called it an inferior store they should rename it to iApp store (inferior app store) :D

bikemonkey
Jun 11, 2011, 06:51 AM
So many people on here jumping to bite at Apple. However, unless I'm mistaken, not one of you has taken the time to prove/explain why the Amazon App Store offers an equal or higher quality service.

MrNomNoms
Jun 11, 2011, 06:57 AM
"Inferior app store" OUCH!

Considering that one can only purchase software from Amazon if you live in the US - it is an inferior service when compared to the AppStore which is available in multiple countries.

Radoo
Jun 11, 2011, 07:04 AM
Hey Apple, I have an Apple iPhone 3g. It's inferior than your other newer phones already. You made me install iOS 4 on it and now it runs like crap. After that, you locked it from being able to get newer features. That's what I would call INFERIOR! I demand you give me money! :mad:

Apple you know how to moan allot. Too bad your customers don't beat the crap out of you for the perceived obsolescence and induced obsolescence you are creating on your "superior devices and apps". And your AppStore is far from perfect... :p On iPad for example is blinking when I want to see More apps. Why?! This is just an example, not to say more about the bugs on writing reviews, etc etc etc...

*LTD*
Jun 11, 2011, 07:32 AM
Hey Apple, I have an Apple iPhone 3g. It's inferior than your other newer phones already. You made me install iOS 4 on it and now it runs like crap. After that, you locked it from being able to get newer features. That's what I would call INFERIOR! I demand you give me money! :mad:

Apple you know how to moan allot. Too bad your customers don't beat the crap out of you for the perceived obsolescence and induced obsolescence you are creating on your "superior devices and apps". And your AppStore is far from perfect... :p On iPad for example is blinking when I want to see More apps. Why?! This is just an example, not to say more about the bugs on writing reviews, etc etc etc...

It's an old phone. Released July 2008. Discontinued June 2010.

I'm surprised Apple allows you to run the latest OS at all.

It's users like you - who demand full support and full performance from new software *on old hardware* - that are holding us back. Why haven't you upgraded yet? The pace of development in the smartphone market is blistering. No one is going to focus on optimizing new software for old hardware. And frankly, even two years in this industry is a lifetime.

I have no idea what "blinking" you're talking about in regard to the App Store.

Currently, all other Application Stores *are* inferior to the App Store. That's just a fact of life at the moment. It's not perfect, but it's the best we have, and has remained so since its inception. That's pretty impressive.

fpsBeaTt
Jun 11, 2011, 08:44 AM
Windows is the name of an operating system. Both windows and app store are generic. Windows can refer to the Operating System, which is protected by trademark, or the application window running on your computer, which is generic and not protected by Microsoft's trademark. Outside of technology, windows are generic completely. App is an abbreviation for application, whose word predates Apple. Hell, there's even this folder called Applications on Windows 95-7.

And I disagree, LTD, when people think App Store, they think about the store they use for their respective phone platform AS an app store.

By your own logic, you cannot defend Microsoft and criticise Apple. Apple has used the term "App Store" as a proper noun, referring specifically to their digital distribution medium, just as Microsoft used the term "Windows" as a proper noun to refer to their OS line. These two situations are analogous and essentially identical. Furthermore, there is no folder 'named' applications in Windows 7, and even if there was one it wouldn't be a unique digital offering attempting to use the association of quality and success that Apple's App Store has delivered.

Hurda
Jun 11, 2011, 08:48 AM
So many people on here jumping to bite at Apple. However, unless I'm mistaken, not one of you has taken the time to prove/explain why the Amazon App Store offers an equal or higher quality service.
Because it's not relevant.

*LTD*
Jun 11, 2011, 12:21 PM
Because it's not relevant.

In terms of IP, it is. That's the main reason to protect trademarks and obtain rights. You want the name to be associated with *your* product - not just physically (brand recognition) but in terms of what it represents (brand integrity.) Having the band name watered down with a service that is not characteristic of Apple's standards is as legitimate a complaint as any.

Dbrown
Jun 11, 2011, 01:18 PM
By your own logic, you cannot defend Microsoft and criticise Apple. Apple has used the term "App Store" as a noun, referring specifically to their digital distribution medium, just as Microsoft used the term "Windows" as a noun to refer to their OS line. These two situations are analogous and essentially identical. Furthermore, there is no folder 'named' applications in Windows 7, and even if there was one it wouldn't be a unique digital offering attempting to use the association of quality and success that Apple's App Store has delivered.

What the heck are you talking about? Of course apple used "app store" as a noun because it IS a noun. "windows" is also a noun. What else could those words be?

The criteria for trademarks is that it cannot be descriptive. "Windows" for Microsoft Windows is acceptable because it's not describing an actual window, it's describing an operating system. "App store" isn't acceptable because it describes exactly what it is: an app store. That's like trying to trademark "grocery store" or "gas station"

KingCrimson
Jun 11, 2011, 01:41 PM
So many people on here jumping to bite at Apple. However, unless I'm mistaken, not one of you has taken the time to prove/explain why the Amazon App Store offers an equal or higher quality service.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwrKA8nX5Yc

Brother Esau
Jun 11, 2011, 01:45 PM
What is up with Apple? Every time I turn around they are suing somebody for something.

kdarling
Jun 11, 2011, 02:19 PM
Apple has used the term "App Store" as a noun, referring specifically to their digital distribution medium, just as Microsoft used the term "Windows" as a noun to refer to their OS line. These two situations are analogous and essentially identical.

If that were true, then let us recall what happened when Microsoft tried to sue over the use of "Lindows", saying it was too close to "Windows".

The courts not only rejected it, but more importantly for this forum thread, one judge commented that MS had previously used "windows" to generically describe other systems (sound familar?) and expressed doubts that the trademark was therefore even valid.

MS quickly settled out of court after that, paying Lindows $20 million to change their name.

Personally, I think Apple might've had a case until its bosses publicly called other download sites "app stores".

Furthermore, there is no folder 'named' applications in Windows 7, and even if there was one it wouldn't be a unique digital offering attempting to use the association of quality and success that Apple's App Store has delivered.

Leaving aside the fact that Windows programs are called "applications" in the file system viewer...

The quality argument is as silly as if Morton's sued Sizzler over the use of "steak house" in their name, simply because they felt it cheapened their own offerings.

ten-oak-druid
Jun 11, 2011, 02:33 PM
Could you explain how "inferior" competitors manage to beat Apple so handily?

LOL

That's not true at all.

Hurda
Jun 11, 2011, 02:34 PM
In terms of IP, it is.
No, it isn't.

ten-oak-druid
Jun 11, 2011, 02:39 PM
Don't worry. If Apple wins the App Store trademark challenge, there will be plenty of chances for Apple to be copied again and again.

Apple applied for the trademark. They have a right to sue and challenge. End of story.

Don't get sidetracked into arguing with people about who coined the term "app" first. These people just want to waste your time.

Creativity is gone. Apple should have come up with a new name for their cloud service instead of just slapping an "i" in front of it. And Apple really brought the app store to a higher level of recognition than it was previously. Some of the competition came up with unique names to distinguish themselves and others did not. Like I said creativity is dying out in these companies.

caspersoong
Jun 11, 2011, 07:49 PM
I really think it would be too harsh for Apple to lose the trademark while Amazon changing its name of Appstore should be ok.

KingCrimson
Jun 11, 2011, 07:51 PM
Don't worry. If Apple wins the App Store trademark challenge, there will be plenty of chances for Apple to be copied again and again.

Apple applied for the trademark. They have a right to sue and challenge. End of story.

Don't get sidetracked into arguing with people about who coined the term "app" first. These people just want to waste your time.

Creativity is gone. Apple should have come up with a new name for their cloud service instead of just slapping an "i" in front of it. And Apple really brought the app store to a higher level of recognition than it was previously. Some of the competition came up with unique names to distinguish themselves and others did not. Like I said creativity is dying out in these companies.

Well the cloud didn't really exist until Apple slapped an 'i' in front of it. It's been a horrible, HORRIBLE mess until Apple's version which is perfection now.:D:apple:

fpsBeaTt
Jun 12, 2011, 09:21 AM
What the heck are you talking about? Of course apple used "app store" as a noun because it IS a noun. "windows" is also a noun. What else could those words be?

The criteria for trademarks is that it cannot be descriptive. "Windows" for Microsoft Windows is acceptable because it's not describing an actual window, it's describing an operating system. "App store" isn't acceptable because it describes exactly what it is: an app store. That's like trying to trademark "grocery store" or "gas station"

I edited my post due to the typo which you exploited; if you want to use that reasoning, Windows is named based on what you use within the OS (i.e. windows, displaying folders etc).

Radoo
Jun 12, 2011, 12:56 PM
It's an old phone. Released July 2008. Discontinued June 2010.

I'm surprised Apple allows you to run the latest OS at all.
Actually your surprise is my surprise. Why Apple let me upgrade to iOS 4 when it makes my phone to work un-smoothly.

benthewraith
Jun 12, 2011, 01:00 PM
I edited my post due to the typo which you exploited; if you want to use that reasoning, Windows is named based on what you use within the OS (i.e. windows, displaying folders etc).

And we've already established that in that use, windows is in fact generic.

fpsBeaTt
Jun 13, 2011, 12:53 AM
And we've already established that in that use, windows is in fact generic.

So therefore, someone else can call their OS 'Windows' if it does in fact use windows, which is a standardized filing system tool. Furthermore, one can use Amazon as a name for their store, since one could also interpret it to be generic if you take the word to be describing an ecosystem of apps. Whether you like it or not, Apple was the first to coin the abbreviation in terms of an electronic distribution medium, and it is not coincidental that Amazon has mimicked Apple in this way.