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MacRumors
Jun 15, 2011, 12:26 AM
http://images.macrumors.com/im/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/06/15/references-to-next-generation-airport-extreme-and-time-capsule-found/)


Earlier this evening, Apple released (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/06/14/apple-releases-airport-utility-5-5-3-for-mac-and-windows/) version 5.5.3 of AirPort Utility. This small update to the AirPort Extreme Base Station and Time Capsule administration software contained a few bug fixes, but also a bit of a surprise. Readers in the MacRumors Forums (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1170337) (neek (http://forums.macrumors.com/member.php?u=121169) and jonnyz (http://forums.macrumors.com/member.php?u=189213)) found references to unreleased 4th Generation Time Capsules and 5th Generation AirPort Extremes.

In the weeks leading up to the WWDC keynote, there had been reports of dwindling Time Capsule and AirPort Extreme stocks, suggesting an imminent refresh. It seems that Apple has been working on next-generation devices, but hasn't yet released them.

http://images.macrumors.com/article-new/2011/06/time_capsule_leap_forward.jpg
Also found were references to Software Updates being stored on devices, but these references are not new as the same text has been found in older versions of the software dating back to at least 2010."bsUP.productName" = "Store Apple software updates on this %@";
"bsUP.description" = "Apple software updates that are copied to this %@ are available to anyone using this network.";
These findings were also reported (http://www.9to5mac.com/72073/new-airport-extremes-and-time-capsules-with-software-update-caching-confirmed/) by 9to5Mac, which had previously detailed (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/06/02/apple-testing-new-time-capsules-for-caching-software-updates/) that upcoming Time Capsules would be offering a Software Update caching system:What we do know is that Apple has been internally testing Time Capsules to cache Software updates for both Mac and iOS devices. The way we've heard it works is that the new Time Capsule learns which devices connect to it via Wifi. It then goes out to Apple's servers and downloads Software Updates for those products.

When the user wants to install the software update, the Time Capsule, which is also the router, routes you to the locally stored update, rather than downloading the whole thing over the Internet.Given the fact that these Software Update references were also present in the old firmware, it's not clear when Apple is planning on launching this features, especially in light of the recent iCloud announcements. Apple has also been rumored (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/06/03/new-time-capsules-to-run-ios-on-a4a5-processors/) to be redesigning its Time Capsules and AirPort Extremes around the same A4/A5 processors used in the iPhone and iPad.

Article Link: References to Next-Generation AirPort Extreme and Time Capsule Found (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/06/15/references-to-next-generation-airport-extreme-and-time-capsule-found/)



RawBert
Jun 15, 2011, 12:29 AM
It will be interesting to see what the fifth gen Airport will offer.

erictooth
Jun 15, 2011, 12:31 AM
I'm really looking forward to this. I've never had an airport extreme/time capsule, and I'm getting tired of my DD-WRT router..

nastymrx
Jun 15, 2011, 12:36 AM
All i can say is.. WOW!.

thejadedmonkey
Jun 15, 2011, 12:39 AM
Basically anyone who is 100% Apple is in for a real treat.

OriginalMacRat
Jun 15, 2011, 12:40 AM
Hopefully the Airport Extreme will have ThunderBolt ports.

Both for adding Time Machine storage and for networking via ThunderBolt.

Jerome Morrow
Jun 15, 2011, 12:40 AM
Basically anyone who is 100% Apple is in for a real treat.

I need to postpone my flight to Titan for this.

batchtaster
Jun 15, 2011, 12:41 AM
"Store Apple software updates on this %@"
"Apple software updates that are copied to this %@"

Apple has a love-hate relationship with their products.

"You're revolutionary (http://www.apple.com/timecapsule/), you piece of #%@&..."

Sounds like this won't help if have ADSL/2+ router and are running your TimeCapsule in bridged mode.

brunozs
Jun 15, 2011, 12:42 AM
Hopefully the Airport Extreme will have ThunderBolt ports.

Both for adding Time Machine storage and for networking via ThunderBolt.

I guess theres no point really, due speed transfer limitations over 802.11n

Peteman100
Jun 15, 2011, 12:42 AM
Hopefully the Airport Extreme will have ThunderBolt ports.

Both for adding Time Machine storage and for networking via ThunderBolt.

+1 on this!

OriginalMacRat
Jun 15, 2011, 12:44 AM
I guess theres no point really, due speed transfer limitations over 802.11n

As I said in my original post, networking via ThunderBolt as well.

aloshka
Jun 15, 2011, 12:45 AM
If they do de-duplication, I will convert more people into using Apple ;)

3goldens
Jun 15, 2011, 01:04 AM
Not very interesting, that's for sure.

TheAustrianGuy
Jun 15, 2011, 01:06 AM
...removed due to incorrect info...

aloshka
Jun 15, 2011, 01:07 AM
... but this is what the updated Airport Utility shows for the Time Capsule Apple gave to me for free back in December as a good will gesture because they totally screwed up an iPad exchange.

The new one is not out yet?? What's your point? We all have gen 3

aleni
Jun 15, 2011, 01:17 AM
what about a device with a local iCloud?

iCloud is sure doesn't work in my country which only has 0.2 mbps upload speed. photostream will not work well, let alone videos upload! :(

aloshka
Jun 15, 2011, 01:18 AM
what about a device with a local iCloud?

iCloud is sure doesn't work in my country which only has 0.2 mbps upload speed. photostream will not work well, let alone videos upload! :(

Yeah but if it's all done in the background when the device is idle, it'll still work just not as instant. Or at least I think...

MrSmith
Jun 15, 2011, 01:30 AM
Not the kind of thing most of us will discard a working model of to get a new one.

aleni
Jun 15, 2011, 01:36 AM
Yeah but if it's all done in the background when the device is idle, it'll still work just not as instant. Or at least I think...

hell no, with 0.2mbps upload speed, my battery will be dead before it even finishes uploading.

orfeas0
Jun 15, 2011, 01:51 AM
When the user wants to install the software update, the Time Capsule, which is also the router, routes you to the locally stored update, rather than downloading the whole thing over the Internet
this means it will download the updates without even asking you, which means if you're playing an online game at the moment you're doomed to lag :cool:

monty77
Jun 15, 2011, 01:51 AM
..a new A4 powered AEBS with built in iTunes server to act as a home media hub (very much in keeping with the home sharing concept) would be amazing - I currently have a Mac Mini doing this and it's pretty wasteful. VPN support would be good too.

Dream on I guess though.

Monty

Thex1138
Jun 15, 2011, 01:57 AM
iCloud pushes all the updates and purchases to your TC... then whenever you get in range it auto synch's... I like it!
:D

If it requires a new TC rather than my existing TC... well ah...
:rolleyes:

aleni
Jun 15, 2011, 02:00 AM
automatic downloading for music and apps is stupid too.

i hope this new device will act as a server, so when i download an app from my iPhone, when it finishes, the iPhone will upload the app to the new device and then the device will push it to my iPad and my wife's iPhone.

i know i can turn off the automatic download, but i'd really love to enable it without it consuming my internet bandwidth. and one more annoying thing is when i download an app, it takes 3 times longer because the iPad and my wife's iPhone will download it too. if i want to play NOVA 3, i buy it, so now download takes 3 times longer before i could play it. and i know i can turn the feature off, but i don't want to call my wife at home and tell her to temporary turn off the automatic download, it's much of a hassle.

apple will waste bandwidth too because of this, so when im downloading an app, it means for apple to waste 3 times more bandwidth and makes higher for monthly bandwith cost.

if i were steve jobs, i would make this new device can store iCloud locally and sell it for only $15-$20, so people who have more than one iDevices would buy this and they can even have 3 of them connected as backups in case of **** happening.

so subsidized money in new device taken from saved monthly bandwidth cost.

and about that instant stuff like u working a document in iPhone, do u really need it to be pushed to your iPad at home right away? this local iCloud is instant too, by the time u arrive at home and your iPhone is connected to wifi, the iPad will get the document too.

kockgunner
Jun 15, 2011, 02:09 AM
Apple has a love-hate relationship with their products.

"You're revolutionary (http://www.apple.com/timecapsule/), you piece of #%@&..."

Sounds like this won't help if have ADSL/2+ router and are running your TimeCapsule in bridged mode.

Everyone take a look that bottom of the Time Capsule page. They are still using a Macbook Air image from 2008. How apt!

Chaos215bar2
Jun 15, 2011, 02:22 AM
I'm really looking forward to this. I've never had an airport extreme/time capsule, and I'm getting tired of my DD-WRT router..

I was planning on upgrading to a nice new dual-band n router running DD-WRT, but now I'm going to wait and see what happens. The wireless network extending functionality of the Airport Express is really tempting too. I always wished I could do that with my DD-WRT router.

8CoreWhore
Jun 15, 2011, 02:26 AM
I agree, put Thunderbolt on the Base Station. A HDD connected there, and a GBNetwork = fast LAN.

OTOH, it may not be technically possible, as TB is an extension of PCI-E.

Imagine a Mac Mini with Server, and the guts and software for Time Capsule... and AppleTV all in one.

BOING! :D

I'm still waiting for an Apple built HDTV. Down boat me! It WILL happen! : )

aleni
Jun 15, 2011, 02:27 AM
I was planning on upgrading to a nice new dual-band n router running DD-WRT, but now I'm going to wait and see what happens. The wireless network extending functionality of the Airport Express is really tempting too. I always wished I could do that with my DD-WRT router.

i have 2 airport express, and the wireless network extending functionality is really helping my home clutter free :D

Halon X
Jun 15, 2011, 02:29 AM
Because of this, so when im downloading an app, it means for apple to waste 3 times more bandwidth and makes higher for monthly bandwith cost.

if i were steve jobs, i would make this new device can store iCloud locally and sell it for only $15-$20, so people who have more than one iDevices would buy this and they can even have 3 of them connected as backups in case of **** happening.

so subsidized money in new device taken from saved monthly bandwidth cost.


Bandwidth is cheap, especially at the capacities Apple is purchasing it in. Selling an AP/TC at $15 - $20 would be a much greater loss overall than any bandwidth costs ever would be.

I'd also imagine that any overhead such as bandwidth, data center costs, etc are factored into Apple's take from the sell of each app.

Also think about the cheap cost of their new Music Match and the bandwidth that will be chewed up through this. Most people I know have 100+ GB music collections. Apple is only charging $25 a year for the service. Cost of bandwidth is hardly a concern.

aleni
Jun 15, 2011, 02:31 AM
Bandwidth is cheap, especially at the capacities Apple is purchasing it in. Selling an AP/TC at $15 - $20 would be a much greater loss overall than any bandwidth costs ever would be.

I'd also imagine that any overhead such as bandwidth, data center costs, etc are factored into Apple's take from the sell of each app.

Also think about the cheap cost of their new Music Match and the bandwidth that will be chewed up through this. Most people I know have 100+ GB music collections. Apple is only charging $25 a year for the service. Cost of bandwidth is hardly a concern.

well maybe, but not for us with crappy internet connection. i paid $50 a year for a 1mbps download and 0.2mbps upload speed. :(

maybe iCloud isn't meant for me. but good thing is it backups app data :D

LarryC
Jun 15, 2011, 02:43 AM
I just bought my first Airport Extreme Base Station about two months ago :D

Oh well, it works perfectly and I am very happy with it.

Jeaz
Jun 15, 2011, 02:56 AM
It'll be interesting to see what updates they are planning, but either they have to add some really cool new features or seriously lower the price to make an upgrade worth it in my case. In particular, the Time Capsules have had a ridiculous price up to now.

Prallethrin
Jun 15, 2011, 03:10 AM
Ya, I agree with some people here that it would be nice if it acted like a mini-cloud.

Just in case your internet connection goes down for some reason. You still kind of have a back up.
Ya, I know rare scenario for the internet to die along with your device losing data. :P

Still it would be cool to have, your own personal mini-cloud.

Heck if there is a way to disable uploading to Apple, it will be good for people who want cloud functionality (syncing of everything) without having their stuff sent to Cupertino - limited to WiFi range of course.

kennycheng93
Jun 15, 2011, 03:13 AM
What if Apple builds a TC with integrated Apple TV? :D

ansalmo
Jun 15, 2011, 03:16 AM
Hmmm, so this will only work if you route through your AE/TC? That's a disappointment, though I can see why that decision was taken as it makes it a whole lot easier to implement - there's no need of any tweaks at the client end to make it work, it's all done on the AE/TC.

For those of us that use AE/TC as an access point rather than a router, I wonder if it will be possible to make this work by pointing the software update addresses to the AE/TC in our LAN DNS? I guess not, though it would be nice if that did work.

ArmCortexA8
Jun 15, 2011, 03:17 AM
Well surprise surprise, just updated my AirPort Utility Software and now my current gen Apple Airport Extreme info says "AirPort Utility found an AirPort Extreme 802.11N (4th Generation)" Notice the "4th Generation" title has now been added, so 5th generation will be next.

Reason077
Jun 15, 2011, 03:22 AM
Hmmm, so this will only work if you route through your AE/TC? That's a disappointment, though I can see why that decision was taken as it makes it a whole lot easier to implement - there's no need of any tweaks at the client end to make it work, it's all done on the AE/TC.

I'd be surprised if they implemented it this way, actually, despite the wording of this article. More likely, the software update utility will simply know to look for cached ASUs on the local network automatically.

simulacra
Jun 15, 2011, 03:24 AM
Hmm, I was going to buy me an Airport extreme when I'm in the US early Juli, hopefully they'll be in stores by then, I rather not buy something that gets replaced a couple of week after I purchased it.

colmaclean
Jun 15, 2011, 03:25 AM
I need to postpone my flight to Titan for this.

Two weeks later...

I postponed my flight to Titan for THIS??????

caspersoong
Jun 15, 2011, 03:41 AM
I am getting mad of waiting... practically everything is don't buy!

dawnrazor
Jun 15, 2011, 03:44 AM
New APE for me once they come out. My 1st Gen is showing it's age, it's range is piss poor and it forgets who it is from time to time....

NightFox
Jun 15, 2011, 03:53 AM
... and one more annoying thing is when i download an app, it takes 3 times longer because the iPad and my wife's iPhone will download it too. if i want to play NOVA 3, i buy it, so now download takes 3 times longer before i could play it. and i know i can turn the feature off, but i don't want to call my wife at home and tell her to temporary turn off the automatic download, it's much of a hassle.

Not sure I'm understanding what you're saying here. Why would it take 3 times as long? With updates, one single download will take place over your slow broadband connection to your Extreme/TC. This will then be served out to your devices over your home WiFi which is going to be much, much faster. If you're not talking about Airport but just iCloud syncing in general, if you're not at home when you buy an app even if it does also push at exactly the same time to your wife's iPhone at home, you'll be on different connections so why would it be any slower? And it would only push if she has the same iTunes account as you anyway. :confused:

Sorry if I've misunderstood, full of flu at the moment :(

GregA
Jun 15, 2011, 03:56 AM
..a new A4 powered AEBS with built in iTunes server to act as a home media hub (very much in keeping with the home sharing concept) would be amazing

I was disappointed that Steve showed a slide saying that the computer was just another device now, and yet the subsequent demonstrations really needed a computer to sync to for lots of stuff. I couldn't sync a small subset of songs/photos to my laptop and free up a heap of space.

Ya, I agree with some people here that it would be nice if it acted like a mini-cloud.

Just in case your internet connection goes down for some reason. You still kind of have a back up.

Yes, that would be great. All my data on the Time Capsule, plus a backup copy on the cloud perhaps?

Hmmm, so this will only work if you route through your AE/TC?

Well, apart from their being nothing known at all... if it caches software updates then I'm sure a Mac or iPhone could notice a Time Capsule on the network, and try to get its software there if available. Apple likes the "zero configuration" stuff.

What if Apple builds a TC with integrated Apple TV? :D

I hope not.

If Apple builds a TC media server, then better to have the separate AppleTV focussing on displaying media and playing stuff straight from the media server. The 8GB cache on the AppleTV will make it as good as local.

Basically anyone who is 100% Apple is in for a real treat.

That'd be nice. A partnership between the iCloud and the Time Capsule would be brilliant. There are lots of other possibilities that others have already done that Apple could make easy too.

Even a simple mail/calendar/file server with integrated iTunes server would be great though.

gekko21
Jun 15, 2011, 04:10 AM
I am getting mad of waiting... practically everything is don't buy!

Agreed. I've been waiting since earlier this year to push the button on a new home theatre solution. Was going to go Mac Mini but it's been months of rumours as to when that will get refreshed. Recently, I've changed tack and pretty much decided to go Time Capsule, Apple TV, iPad. I've been waiting for the TC refresh (looks like soon) and now there are more rumours about new iPad updates later this year (not sure I believe those at the moment though). You really can't win and in the meantime, I've held off for months waiting to see what sort of media server solutions Apple would put out this year.

I think there comes a point where all the endless speculation backfires a bit for the company as my credit card has been secure in my purse for six months now due to it never being the right time to press the button. Also, I need a network backup solution fast due to an aging iMac that's crippled by copious amounts of media. If I don't order something by the end of this week, my other half has threatened to take me to the Apple store and ask for an upgrade :(.

initialsBB
Jun 15, 2011, 04:32 AM
And here's me just hoping the 7.5.3 update will fix the cripppled 7.5.2 update on my 1st gen AE...

Hairball
Jun 15, 2011, 04:35 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Mobile/8J2)

Great products, but WAY too expensive. It'll be interesting to see what the new products and corresponding prices are.

Menopause
Jun 15, 2011, 04:37 AM
automatic downloading for music and apps is stupid too.

i hope this new device will act as a server, so when i download an app from my iPhone, when it finishes, the iPhone will upload the app to the new device and then the device will push it to my iPad and my wife's iPhone.

i know i can turn off the automatic download, but i'd really love to enable it without it consuming my internet bandwidth. and one more annoying thing is when i download an app, it takes 3 times longer because the iPad and my wife's iPhone will download it too. if i want to play NOVA 3, i buy it, so now download takes 3 times longer before i could play it. and i know i can turn the feature off, but i don't want to call my wife at home and tell her to temporary turn off the automatic download, it's much of a hassle.

apple will waste bandwidth too because of this, so when im downloading an app, it means for apple to waste 3 times more bandwidth and makes higher for monthly bandwith cost.

if i were steve jobs, i would make this new device can store iCloud locally and sell it for only $15-$20, so people who have more than one iDevices would buy this and they can even have 3 of them connected as backups in case of **** happening.

so subsidized money in new device taken from saved monthly bandwidth cost.

and about that instant stuff like u working a document in iPhone, do u really need it to be pushed to your iPad at home right away? this local iCloud is instant too, by the time u arrive at home and your iPhone is connected to wifi, the iPad will get the document too.

If you were steve jobs you'd leave your country with ****** internet, migrate to one where it's fast, where Automatic Downloads won't seem 'stupid' to you like it doesn't to most of us and stop complaining about things that don't work for just for you.

Darlo770
Jun 15, 2011, 04:43 AM
..Not the only motivation for a chip upgrade obviously, but..

Seeing as Lion implements the AFP 3.3 protocol now, DHX2 authentication is mandatory, and (as i have found) not many NAS devices support DHX2 currently, as it does require a slightly more beefy processor.

This is probably one of the reasons for the coming refresh and rumoured A4/A5 chips. Not the only motivation for a chip upgrade obviously, but it makes sense.

Also, does anyone know what version of AFP the current gen' Time Capsules run? If it's <AFP 3.2, we can expect a firmware update before the release of Lion.

Time Machine in Lion requires no less than AFP 3.3. Reducing most current third-party NAS's to a doorstop in terms of Time Machine use, until those manufacturers release a firmware update to include Netatalk 2.2 (AFP 3.3 port) they're pretty much dead for Time Machine :(

chaosbunny
Jun 15, 2011, 04:46 AM
Anyone else still uses one of these:

http://www.onedigitallife.com/images/airport-ufo.jpg

:)

rdlink
Jun 15, 2011, 04:54 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Mobile/8J2)

Great products, but WAY too expensive. It'll be interesting to see what the new products and corresponding prices are.

Why, exactly, are they way too expensive? Can you point us to a device that does what the AEBS does for a much lower price?

gramirez2012
Jun 15, 2011, 04:54 AM
Good thing I sold my AEBS last week!

Anyone else still uses one of these:

Image (http://www.onedigitallife.com/images/airport-ufo.jpg)

:)

I sold one of those about a year ago for $60. Got it at Goodwill for $10. :cool:

2992
Jun 15, 2011, 04:55 AM
Two weeks later...

:))))))

mdgm
Jun 15, 2011, 04:59 AM
Seeing as Lion implements the AFP 3.3 protocol now, DHX2 authentication is mandatory

Apparently there is a Terminal hack to not require this. Though of course Apple would not expect people to use this with their products.

Time Machine in Lion requires no less than AFP 3.3. Reducing most current third-party NAS's to a doorstop in terms of Time Machine use, until those manufacturers release a firmware update to include Netatalk 2.2 (AFP 3.3 port) they're pretty much dead for Time Machine :(
Netatalk 2.2 was released on June 9 (http://www.netafp.com/netafp-netatalk-2-2-0-is-available-437/). Lion is still pre-release software and many will wait for a few point releases for any major bugs remaining to get sorted out and waiting for apps to get updated to work better on the new OS.

Then there'll also be those waiting to see if Apple will relent and offer a physical media alternative to get Lion.

Lion will not be worth upgrading to for many NAS users for a while.

Considering Lion is due for release in July there's still a bit of time for NAS manufacturer's to get Netatalk 2.2 into firmware updates though it may be pushing it to get it into production firmware before Lion's release.

One would expect NetGear or QNAP would be first looking at http://www.netafp.com/status-of-netatalk-and-afp-support-by-nas-vendor-322/

Having software updates cached by the Time Capsule would be interesting and a good feature. However if they cripple it by keeping a single non-user replaceable hard drive in it then many will remain not interested in the device.

I have an AEBS for my wireless N network, but I backup using Time Machine to a NetGear ReadyNAS unit.

To consider the Time Capsule, I would like the Time Capsule to have two user replaceable hard drives so one could use RAID-1 for redundancy. If one disk failed one could replace it to rebuild the redundancy rather than having to restore a backup of a Time Capsule e.g. to a new one. A good option for backing up the Time Capsule over a network or to a Thunderbolt peripheral would be good.

rdlink
Jun 15, 2011, 04:59 AM
Anyone else still uses one of these:

Image (http://www.onedigitallife.com/images/airport-ufo.jpg)

:)

Always thought those looked weird. Wondering what the back looks like.

robbieduncan
Jun 15, 2011, 05:02 AM
I wonder if Apple is going to provide a Time Capsule backup migration strategy. As of now if you buy a new Time Capsule (and are an existing Time Capsule owner who has been using it for Time Machine backups) there is no simple, automatic way to have the new one copy all your backups from the old one and seamlessly pickup where the old one left off.

Pack-a-Mac
Jun 15, 2011, 05:33 AM
My 15 month old Time Capsule was zapped during a storm recently - despite surge protection etc. etc. :mad:
Fingers crossed (dangerous I know) that I don't need a backup until the next gen comes along!!
Any of you guys have any ideas of timescale for new gen release or is it the usual 'hold your breath for as long as possible and pray that nothing fails in the meantime?'

HelveticaNeue
Jun 15, 2011, 05:59 AM
'hold your breath for as long as possible and pray that nothing fails in the meantime?'

No one has any idea, unfortunately. Rumour is that supply is being constrained so hopefully it will only be a couple weeks. Maybe they'll wait until Lion is released.

pubwvj
Jun 15, 2011, 06:01 AM
This is seriously bad unless there is major throttling of the automatic downloads. We have a very limited connection as is typical in rural areas. If the Airport decides to suck up all of our bandwidth it leaves us choking. I would want this to be turn off-able and for it to automatically throttle itself down if there is any other network activity. This feature should get lowest priority.

JabbaII
Jun 15, 2011, 06:19 AM
Kind of defeats the purpose of iCloud if AE has itunes server.

GregA
Jun 15, 2011, 06:24 AM
To consider the Time Capsule, I would like the Time Capsule to have two user replaceable hard drives so one could use RAID-1 for redundancy.

I think you're wanting more than the time capsule is intended for.

However, 2 synced time capsules might do that job. Perhaps a sync between 2 time capsules in different locations.

gnasher729
Jun 15, 2011, 06:27 AM
hell no, with 0.2mbps upload speed, my battery will be dead before it even finishes uploading.

I think you didn't get it. You take 100 MB worth of photos on your iPhone. You come into range of your Time Capsule, the iPhone uploads the photos to your Time Capsule within 10 seconds. The Time Capsule then uploads the photos to iCloud, taking a bit over an hour. It does that on its own, your phone is not involved after the first ten seconds. At least that would be the idea.

You'd even be able to download the photos to your iPad, as long as the iPad is in range of the same Time Capsule. If your iPad is somewhere else, you'd have to wait over an hour until the photos are uploaded to iCloud, and then wait again to download.

balamw
Jun 15, 2011, 06:45 AM
I wonder if Apple is going to provide a Time Capsule backup migration strategy. As of now if you buy a new Time Capsule (and are an existing Time Capsule owner who has been using it for Time Machine backups) there is no simple, automatic way to have the new one copy all your backups from the old one and seamlessly pickup where the old one left off.

Isn't there? Can't you archive and then manually copy the sparseimages? (EDIT: OK the restore could be better).
http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1281

B

robbieduncan
Jun 15, 2011, 06:56 AM
Isn't there? Can't you archive and then manually copy the sparseimages? (EDIT: OK the restore could be better).
http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1281

B

I didn't say there was no way of doing it. I said no simple, automatic way. I can't imagine talking my mum through that over the phone!

bbeagle
Jun 15, 2011, 07:01 AM
this means it will download the updates without even asking you, which means if you're playing an online game at the moment you're doomed to lag :cool:

You don't give Apple any credit for being smart at all, do you?

These things aren't just developed at a whim by a random person at Apple, then released to an 'oops! we forgot about people playing online games!'. No - this is not how business works. Many people over many weeks/months in meetings decide on the features of a product, and find it's short-comings, and try to correct those.

I bet in the first few minutes of the first meeting about the next-generation Airport/Time Capsule, slowing speeds by playing online games was brought up, and my knee-jerk reaction to the solution is to look at network traffic, and not download updates while a computer is using the network - try to find a non-busy time.

There are reasons that Apple Engineers are one of the best.

OllyW
Jun 15, 2011, 07:07 AM
There are reasons that Apple Engineers are one of the best.

I don't think you can call the Apple engineers who designed the current Time Capsule 'one of the best' after all the reliability problems it has suffered.

macsmurf
Jun 15, 2011, 07:09 AM
To consider the Time Capsule, I would like the Time Capsule to have two user replaceable hard drives so one could use RAID-1 for redundancy. If one disk failed one could replace it to rebuild the redundancy rather than having to restore a backup of a Time Capsule e.g. to a new one. A good option for backing up the Time Capsule over a network or to a Thunderbolt peripheral would be good.

This is exactly what I have on my "NAS". It's actually a cheapo linux server with two RAID-1 1TB hard drives with LVM on top. It runs as Time Capsule and other stuff as well (http etc.) - at half the price of an actual Time Capsule. It's not as pretty but it's in my closet so I'm OK with that.

I think it's a form factor issue. In order to support two drives you'd have to make the Time Capsule thicker and that does not compute at Apple. :)

steviem
Jun 15, 2011, 07:24 AM
I personally would love to have a new generation time capsule if it will hold and serve my videos as well as music. iCloud had a glaring omission in TV shows and movies at the WWDC keynote.

My computer still isn't rebuilt since moving to the US, and with a time capsule that can serve/sync all media with my idevices, I don't see a real need to build it (apart from aperture, I guess, but I might buy an iMac for that eventually).

bbeagle
Jun 15, 2011, 07:26 AM
I don't think you can call the Apple engineers who designed the current Time Capsule 'one of the best' after all the reliability problems it has suffered.

This is like saying Luongo is not 'one of the best' goalies after all the goals he gives up every game.

Nothing is perfect. But compare the Airport Extreme / Time Capsule to all the problems with Linksys routers, and I can tell you Apple is much better. I know, I had many Linksys routers before, and they were all crap compared to my Time Capsule. I've had 0 problems with it.

Sodner
Jun 15, 2011, 07:27 AM
Basically anyone who is 100% Apple is in for a real treat.

That's me!

If the refresh adds some functionality count me in as I need a bigger TC for my time machine backups -- from 2 iMac's and an Air.

Jeaz
Jun 15, 2011, 07:31 AM
It would be genuinely awesome IMO if they'd add iTunes hosting to the time machine. I don't mean it for external access but as a replacement for the Mac when watching you movies, listening to music on the AppleTV. Now you need the Mac and iTunes turned on to do that, which is a bit backwards IMO. Basically, make the TM a light media server.

OllyW
Jun 15, 2011, 07:34 AM
I've had 0 problems with it.

I'm glad to hear that and I hope it's one of the later ones with the slower and cooler running green drives hard fitted.

The design of the Time Capsule case is very poor with no ventilation and a incorrectly placed fan which doesn't cool anything when it eventually starts spinning. The heat build up on earlier models which came with standard hard drives results in the capacitors in the power supply overheating and swelling over time causing it to eventually fail.

reubs
Jun 15, 2011, 07:43 AM
We've got ATT U-Verse, and we've got their 3Wire router/modem with it. I'm really interested in a Time Capsule/Airport Extreme, but I'm not really sure how well it would integrate with the hardware ATT provides.

Either way, Apple's doing exciting stuff even with routers, it seems, and that's cool to see.

fkhan3
Jun 15, 2011, 07:44 AM
Anyone else still uses one of these:


:)

Yes, as paperweight :)

Shackrat
Jun 15, 2011, 07:55 AM
What about adding more real "router" functions like QOS tagging (essential for VoIP applications), static NAT options, port triggering, and timed rules? These features are found on routers that cost less than half of what I paid for my AEBS.

radiogoober
Jun 15, 2011, 08:05 AM
If you were steve jobs you'd leave your country with ****** internet, migrate to one where it's fast, where Automatic Downloads won't seem 'stupid' to you like it doesn't to most of us and stop complaining about things that don't work for just for you.

LOL. I voted your post up! I too can't stand people complaining about everything!!

TallManNY
Jun 15, 2011, 08:23 AM
Argh again. Another rumor. Means I should hold out at least another week. Current wifi setup not getting it done. And now that GF is back from being out of town, her hulu use must be taken into consideration. That is why I have two cable lines set up. But right now only one has wifi (AEBS) due to broken TC which was supposed to be connected to other line.

balamw
Jun 15, 2011, 08:25 AM
The design of the Time Capsule case is very poor with no ventilation and a incorrectly placed fan which doesn't cool anything when it eventually starts spinning. The heat build up on earlier models which came with standard hard drives results in the capacitors in the power supply overheating and swelling over time causing it to eventually fail.

Heat/power was also a major issue for the ATV1, and was solved beautifully by going over to A4/iOS and removing the HDD. I can see a similar path for the next Airport Extreme as a possibility, but the TC requires an HDD, no?

B

gorgeousninja
Jun 15, 2011, 08:29 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Mobile/8J2)

Great products, but WAY too expensive. It'll be interesting to see what the new products and corresponding prices are.


If your sig is anything to go by it seems that the ability to spend money is not your biggest problem.....

ghostlyorb
Jun 15, 2011, 08:34 AM
I want to update my 2009 APE... so I'll buy one when new ones come out!

shurcooL
Jun 15, 2011, 08:37 AM
I really hope they refresh AirPort Extreme/Time Capsule with a port faster than USB 2.0, say Thunderbolt or eSATA, so that hard-drive sharing becomes a real possibility again.

Hooking up an external hard-drive via USB 2.0 in 2011 is like using a floppy drive.

ten-oak-druid
Jun 15, 2011, 08:48 AM
I hope airtunes will be part of all airport products from now on. But I also hope that the airport express continues as a product as well. Some may say the AppleTV replaces that (for the same price you get audio plus video). But the express allows for analog audio output (digital too if needed).

For audio purposes alone there is nothing wrong with grabbing older models. You don't need an N speed express that is dedicated to just music streaming. So if the express goes away, I'll be buying used units as people upgrade.

The other upgrade to the extreme I'd like to see is multiple usb ports so an external hub isn't required.

MTShipp
Jun 15, 2011, 08:49 AM
Well it didn't fix the WPA2 problem...:rolleyes:

hinchesk
Jun 15, 2011, 08:50 AM
..a new A4 powered AEBS with built in iTunes server to act as a home media hub (very much in keeping with the home sharing concept) would be amazing - I currently have a Mac Mini doing this and it's pretty wasteful. VPN support would be good too.


Ya, it'd be cool if they come with an A4 or A5 but even better is that they'd likely be running iOS. That opens doors to the jailbreak community. Imagine being able to do to an AE/TC what you can now do to an atv2?

In a few months of development the atv2 went from a typical walled garden Apple media-selling device to a much more open one able to run XBMC... changed everything (well for those willing to jailbreak at least).

Here's to hoping for an audio port for some Airplay on the AE/TC.

toddybody
Jun 15, 2011, 08:57 AM
Aluminum construction + user accessible HDD bay...starting at $150


My body is ready

fat jez
Jun 15, 2011, 09:03 AM
Aluminum construction + user accessible HDD bay...starting at $150

That would be sweet, but the aluminium casing would not be good for RF propagation.

radiogoober
Jun 15, 2011, 09:14 AM
You gotta love that a new APE or TC has not even been announced, and we are all already arguing about how hypothetical features should work.

usptact
Jun 15, 2011, 09:15 AM
I see hardly what "Extreme" can be seen in those AirPorts...

diamond.g
Jun 15, 2011, 09:24 AM
My 15 month old Time Capsule was zapped during a storm recently - despite surge protection etc. etc. :mad:
Fingers crossed (dangerous I know) that I don't need a backup until the next gen comes along!!
Any of you guys have any ideas of timescale for new gen release or is it the usual 'hold your breath for as long as possible and pray that nothing fails in the meantime?'That is partly why I wouldn't get a TimeCapsule. You end up having to hope that the single drive wouldn't go bad.

Well it didn't fix the WPA2 problem...:rolleyes:What WPA2 problem?

jacoblost
Jun 15, 2011, 09:27 AM
"bsUP.productName" = "Store Apple software updates on this %@";
"bsUP.description" = "Apple software updates that are copied to this %@ are available to anyone using this network.";

Its fun if you replace %@ with your favorite curse word when you read this quote :p

I personally like throwing in a mofo.

the8thark
Jun 15, 2011, 09:31 AM
If you were steve jobs you'd leave your country with ****** internet, migrate to one where it's fast, where Automatic Downloads won't seem 'stupid' to you like it doesn't to most of us and stop complaining about things that don't work for just for you.
Things that don't work just for "you" tend to also just not work for others too. it's very rare only one person has an issue. Normally it's a lot if people with the same issue. Apple realise this.

And also your post I am quoting is full of arrogance. Limited and expensive bandwidth is a major issue for many people around the world. Either you can live in fantasy land and deny it or you can move to reality and accept this is an issue that needs to be addressed. And addressed pretty soon too. Cause with Apple's push to all things online/cloud the bandwith factor is going to become the bottleneck in the system that slows everything down.

Just because you don't have an issue does not mean others do or do not have the issue. Cut out the arrogance, it's not a good thing to do.

deconstruct60
Jun 15, 2011, 09:47 AM
I think you didn't get it. ... The Time Capsule then uploads the photos to iCloud, taking a bit over an hour.

I think you don't get it. It is immaterial whether the Time Capsule or the phone is totally consuming your uplink. The whole uplink is being consumed. What if you want to do something else during that hour that involves exchanging data with the internet ? The Time Capsule could "flow control" the upload so that it takes even longer, but you get some bandwidth back.

That said there is an "off" switch for iCloud. If you don't like it turn it off. What is probably bad for locations such as this is that it is on by default when you pull the devices out of box or upgrade them . It doesn't "look" to see if it makes sense (i.e., meets some minimal bandwidth requirements) to turn iCloud on; it just assumes it is OK.

William25
Jun 15, 2011, 09:47 AM
Crud I just ordered an airport extreme off of amazon.

Prallethrin
Jun 15, 2011, 10:26 AM
Yes, that would be great. All my data on the Time Capsule, plus a backup copy on the cloud perhaps?

Yupe, a fall back in case iCloud is unavailable.

It would be even cooler if they allowed keeping off iCloud all together and let the TC be the "local cloud", no more space limitations (although it will now have range limitations XD ) and people who are concern with privacy will welcome it I'm sure.

designgeek
Jun 15, 2011, 10:47 AM
This is exciting, I was about to replace my TC and AEBS with a Linksys e4200 but given this news and the Linksys' lack of IPv6 support, I think I'll wait. I hope there's a design change too. What exactly would the benefits be of using an A4 or A5?

NightFox
Jun 15, 2011, 10:58 AM
I think you don't get it. It is immaterial whether the Time Capsule or the phone is totally consuming your uplink. The whole uplink is being consumed. What if you want to do something else during that hour that involves exchanging data with the internet ? The Time Capsule could "flow control" the upload so that it takes even longer, but you get some bandwidth back.

That said there is an "off" switch for iCloud. If you don't like it turn it off. What is probably bad for locations such as this is that it is on by default when you pull the devices out of box or upgrade them . It doesn't "look" to see if it makes sense (i.e., meets some minimal bandwidth requirements) to turn iCloud on; it just assumes it is OK.

But how is that any different from auto updates on OS X at the moment? Or MobileMe syncing of iOS devices?

radiogoober
Jun 15, 2011, 11:01 AM
I hope airtunes will be part of all airport products from now on. But I also hope that the airport express continues as a product as well. Some may say the AppleTV replaces that (for the same price you get audio plus video). But the express allows for analog audio output (digital too if needed).

For audio purposes alone there is nothing wrong with grabbing older models. You don't need an N speed express that is dedicated to just music streaming. So if the express goes away, I'll be buying used units as people upgrade.

The other upgrade to the extreme I'd like to see is multiple usb ports so an external hub isn't required.

(I know you know this, but others don't:) The Express also acts as WiFi range extender, which is something the AppleTV cannot do at this point.

radiogoober
Jun 15, 2011, 11:06 AM
I think you don't get it. It is immaterial whether the Time Capsule or the phone is totally consuming your uplink. The whole uplink is being consumed. What if you want to do something else during that hour that involves exchanging data with the internet ? The Time Capsule could "flow control" the upload so that it takes even longer, but you get some bandwidth back.

That said there is an "off" switch for iCloud. If you don't like it turn it off. What is probably bad for locations such as this is that it is on by default when you pull the devices out of box or upgrade them . It doesn't "look" to see if it makes sense (i.e., meets some minimal bandwidth requirements) to turn iCloud on; it just assumes it is OK.

How many people really will have hundreds of MBs of things to upload daily? Are that many people taking that many photos on their phone? There is no need for iCloud or TimeCapsule or anything to backup your Apps, as Apple already has them on their servers. They also don't backup your music, because they have that on their servers too (thus Music Match - eliminating the need to actually upload any music that you didn't buy from Apple.)

The only thing that gets uploaded to Apple are documents that you create, pictures you take, etc. These are small, and *IF* TimeCapsule ever functions as an automatic backup thing that interfaces with iCloud, it could very easily be configured to only backup at night, ie, 3AM.

TimeCapsule consuming tons of bandwidth really is a nonissue. If someone really has to cry about it because they find problems in anything and everything, then just turn it off and shut your mouth! :)

toddybody
Jun 15, 2011, 11:09 AM
That would be sweet, but the aluminium casing would not be good for RF propagation.

Even with an external (ala joint trim) antennae?

radiogoober
Jun 15, 2011, 11:09 AM
Yupe, a fall back in case iCloud is unavailable.

It would be even cooler if they allowed keeping off iCloud all together and let the TC be the "local cloud", no more space limitations (although it will now have range limitations XD ) and people who are concern with privacy will welcome it I'm sure.

I totally support the idea of TimeCapsule being a local iCloud.

Currently, I have three folders linked to DropBox (documents, my development folder, and my desktop.) So my three most important things are always automatically backed up to DropBox and if anything ever happened, I'd be fine. Also, I backup to TimeCapsule twice a week or so. I've never restored a backup via TimeMachine, so I have no idea how that works.

That said, TimeCapsule + iCloud would rock. I love the idea of TimeCapsule pushing out software updates as soon as they are downloaded, being an iTunes server to sync my devices, etc. And also of it automatically backing things up.

Honestly, I think this is still pretty damn far down the pipeline though. I don't see this coming in the refresh at all. I hope I'm wrong.

fat jez
Jun 15, 2011, 11:12 AM
Even with an external (ala joint trim) antennae?

yeah, that would work fine, although I doubt it would fit with Apple's design ethic ;)

Intell
Jun 15, 2011, 11:25 AM
The "bsUP.productName" = "Store Apple software updates on this %@";
"bsUP.description" = "Apple software updates that are copied to this %@ are available to anyone using this network."; lines are not new. They've been in there since October 2009.

bergmef
Jun 15, 2011, 11:42 AM
I just hope for an itunes server with a local cloud. All the cloud stuff could stream to anything on the network. without my mac mini running all the time.

OK, I can dream. If they don't support time machine to an airport disk, how likely is the mini cloud streaming through an itunes server?!?

radiogoober
Jun 15, 2011, 12:05 PM
I just hope for an itunes server with a local cloud. All the cloud stuff could stream to anything on the network. without my mac mini running all the time.

OK, I can dream. If they don't support time machine to an airport disk, how likely is the mini cloud streaming through an itunes server?!?

How would an iTunes server work? Would your copy of iTunes on your Mac have to sync to it?

fat jez
Jun 15, 2011, 12:30 PM
How would an iTunes server work? Would your copy of iTunes on your Mac have to sync to it?

It kind of already does, assuming you are using Time Machine for backups. Could it not just mount the sparsebundle containing your Mac's backup, which will contain the latest version of your iTunes library?

CWallace
Jun 15, 2011, 02:31 PM
I went with a dual-band Airport Extreme and WD 1TB external HDD for Time Machine because I was a bit worried about Time Capsule reliability, but I think that if they do release new iOS AEs and TCs, I'll just get the 2TB Time Capsule since I can combine two devices into one (and I maintain additional backups so even if the TC dies, I'm still safe).

Darlo770
Jun 15, 2011, 02:33 PM
Proper media server capabilities and i'm sold ;)

Even if not, these babies will be running a form of iOS now, so it will be just a matter of time before some third party tweak enables media sharing.

New Zealand
Jun 15, 2011, 03:43 PM
1) I would put iOS on the Time Capsule so that you enable any printer to be connected (not just the Airprint approved ones). Also could enable the time capsule to be your media server.

2) I would ensure you would have at least 2 hard drive slots (for RAID configuration)

3) I would integrate it with iCloud

4) Enable direct Thunderbolt connection and SDXC slot for transferring large files.

In terms of icloud, I have a lot of photos - all of which won't fit within the iCloud limitations, where do i put those? I have 250 gb on my macbook pro but that's full. I do use an external hard drive but to me, it doesn't work in a nice integrated "apple" way. The way apple is going they are keeping on-board storage on most devices pretty low - maybe the time capsule will be the perfect bulk storage device (itunes library, photos, videos). I don't know, we'll see how things pan out but I'm holding off buying a NAS for now.

snowmen
Jun 15, 2011, 04:04 PM
I can see what may be coming for Time Capsule...

But I really don't know what I can expect from Airport Extreme...
There's really no need for Thunderbolt. It's mostly wireless for Apple user now, and there's no differences in speed for a wireless NAB if you use Thunderbolt on Extreme. PLUS, you'll still need another USB for printer...

So... Unless they charge less for Airport Extreme, or integrate with iOS so I can change setting in my iPad/iPhone... I don't see any major change that you must get one really...

radiogoober
Jun 15, 2011, 05:24 PM
1) I would put iOS on the Time Capsule so that you enable any printer to be connected (not just the Airprint approved ones). Also could enable the time capsule to be your media server.

2) I would ensure you would have at least 2 hard drive slots (for RAID configuration)

3) I would integrate it with iCloud

4) Enable direct Thunderbolt connection and SDXC slot for transferring large files.

In terms of icloud, I have a lot of photos - all of which won't fit within the iCloud limitations, where do i put those? I have 250 gb on my macbook pro but that's full. I do use an external hard drive but to me, it doesn't work in a nice integrated "apple" way. The way apple is going they are keeping on-board storage on most devices pretty low - maybe the time capsule will be the perfect bulk storage device (itunes library, photos, videos). I don't know, we'll see how things pan out but I'm holding off buying a NAS for now.

I use a lot of external storage too. I just plugged a USB hub into my existing Airport Extreme. It allows me to have external storage, but the storage is "hidden away" in an entertainment center. That way I can access it from anywhere in the house. I also have my printer plugged into that USB hub on the Airport, and can print from anywhere too. (including my iPad and iPhone.)

All I do is click on the network folder in Finder to access it.

deconstruct60
Jun 15, 2011, 05:52 PM
How many people really will have hundreds of MBs of things to upload daily?

Apple's keynote presentation outlined that the iPhone4 is about to become the most popular (in terms in pictures produced ) camera on Flickr. More of the uploaded pictures will be coming out of iPhone4 sensors than out of Nikon D90 sensors. Usually folks only upload photos they think are good. iCloud will stream every good, not good , oops photo you take. It is being done automagically.



It doesn't have to be 100's of MB when your upload is only 200k ( not 200Mbps or 2Gbps .... 200k it is almost laughable to call that broadband. it is closer to 56K modems than broadband. ) for that to consume a decent chunk of time.


These are small, and *IF* TimeCapsule ever functions as an automatic backup thing that interfaces with iCloud, it could very easily be configured to only backup at night, ie, 3AM.


You've just killed off one of the major features of iCloud. The "source of truth" sync datastore is in the cloud. What your solution does is keep the content out of source truth for long periods of time. I suspose the assumption is that all of the person's stuff is hovering around their home WiFi/LAN. If that is the case and have WiFi local sync what do you need iCloud for. Local synch to your Mac/PC. Versus 200k, your local WiFi network is plenty faster than your uplink (unless stuck with some ancient 802.11 b network. )

Delaying synchronization also opens the door to consistency/coherence problems later. iCloud isn't going to work well if many of the devices in your "apple id" network are "off the grid" 95% of the time.

If your iOS devices is not moving data 95% of the time what is the big difference between walking around with it all day and doing a classic sync to your mac/PC (with it as the source of truth) before you go to bed every night and this "hoard the updates until 3 a.m." approach? In both cases doing almost exactly the same thing. Hoarding the updates for the majority of the day.



TimeCapsule consuming tons of bandwidth really is a nonissue.



It would be a non issue bandwidth if the TimeCapsule was hooked to a 128kps line? Really? If your have low bandwidth then low bandwidth is an issue. TimeCapsule doesn't "improve" your throughput to the Internet in any way.

William25
Jun 16, 2011, 08:41 AM
I ordered an airport extreme from data vision computer about a week ago. Still hasn't shipped and when I look it up on amazon (thats where it was ordered) I notice there are only three left by three sellers. What do you think is the chance that I will get the new version? Does apple allow a gap between supplies?

UPDATE:
Unfortunately they will be sending it today. I must have bought the last one. Now I wish I had waited.

Draxxos
Jun 16, 2011, 11:44 AM
So i literally got my new AEBS from Apple in the mail the other day... Do you guys think it would be worth it to send it back and just wait for the update? That would be the biggest fail in the world if the new one came out with a cool new look and better specs for the same price I got mine.

So what do you guys think?

Darlo770
Jun 16, 2011, 12:22 PM
So i literally got my new AEBS from Apple in the mail the other day... Do you guys think it would be worth it to send it back and just wait for the update? That would be the biggest fail in the world if the new one came out with a cool new look and better specs for the same price I got mine.

So what do you guys think?

I'm in the same boat, i've just bought an Iomega NAS 1TB, now it doesn't even work with Lion :mad:

I reckon the new Time Capsules will do some cool stuff, maybe local syncing, media sharing, etc..

So it might be worth returning it. Before i ordered my NAS, i actually bought a current gen' Time Capsule, but returned it, thankfully. Just wish i hadn't spent 110 on that Iomega NAS.

HE15MAN
Jun 19, 2011, 09:55 AM
Any idea when they may be releasing the new AEBS? I am looking to buy one in the next few weeks.