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MacRumors
Jul 29, 2011, 09:26 AM
http://images.macrumors.com/im/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/07/29/samsung-halts-public-disclosures-of-mobile-phone-sales-numbers/)


Even as its smartphone sales explode (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/07/29/apple-passes-nokia-and-holds-off-samsung-to-become-worlds-top-smartphone-vendor/) and appear set to cruise past Apple during the current quarter to take the top spot in the market, Samsung has instituted "a new information policy" that will see the company cease public reporting of its quarterly phone sales numbers, according to The Wall Street Journal (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424053111904888304576475693866644746.html).

http://images.macrumors.com/article-new/2011/06/samsung_logo.jpg


While industry analysts will still be able to make some reasonable estimates of Samsung's phone shipments going forward, the new tight-lipped policy will make performance comparisons between market leaders more difficult."As competition intensifies, there are increased risks that the information we provide may adversely affect our own businesses," Robert Yi, Samsung's chief of investor relations, said on the call. He declined a request for further explanation.The report notes that Samsung may have implemented the new policy at least in part due to its legal dispute with Apple, fearing that concrete comparisons between its shipments and Apple's could harm its case. Apple has accused Samsung of copying Apple's designs (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/04/18/apple-targets-samsung-with-new-lawsuit-over-galaxy-line/) with its own Android-based products, which have seen tremendous success over the past several years.

Article Link: Samsung Halts Public Disclosures of Mobile Phone Sales Numbers (http://www.macrumors.com/2011/07/29/samsung-halts-public-disclosures-of-mobile-phone-sales-numbers/)



*LTD*
Jul 29, 2011, 09:34 AM
The report notes that Samsung may have implemented the new policy at least in part due to its legal dispute with Apple, fearing that concrete comparisons between its shipments and Apple's could harm its case.

Exactly. ;)

It appears even Samsung realizes there a limits to how blatantly they can play the game they're playing.

King Flamez1
Jul 29, 2011, 09:57 AM
samsung is starting to piss me off

at least theres more competition for Apple :cool:

Shrink
Jul 29, 2011, 10:15 AM
so :apple: isn't the only one wearing out the rubber in their "Top Secret" stamps.;)

SockRolid
Jul 29, 2011, 11:52 AM
What Mr. Yi said: "... there are increased risks that the information we provide may adversely affect our own businesses ..."

What Mr. Yi meant: We will hide the fact that Apple is beating us so our stock won't tank.

Rocketman
Jul 29, 2011, 12:33 PM
Publicly traded corporations are obligated to report earnings and expenses and a variety of details. They issue statements about the makeup of those earnings on a voluntary basis to help their investors understand "color" associated with those numbers.

One second after those voluntary disclosures provide any negative effects or risk doing so for any reason, they actually have an obligation to protect shareholders, even if that means being less forthcoming.

Apple itself has concatenated product lines into categories for the same reason. But if they felt it was a risk to shareholders to even report those figures they could step back from that.

So fine.

But nonetheless it is funny to us non shareholders, Samsung has to do this! :D

Rocketman

quinney
Jul 29, 2011, 01:04 PM
What Mr. Yi said: "... there are increased risks that the information we provide may adversely affect our own businesses ..."

What Mr. Yi meant: We will hide the fact that Apple is beating us so our stock won't tank.

I think he meant that it looks like they might end up paying Apple a fee for each Android phone sold and they want to be able to minimize the number.

wovel
Jul 29, 2011, 01:22 PM
Their Hot New SII was outsold by a year old phone globally, seems like a good time to keep quiet. Samsung dd not sell anything close to 14 million of them (roughly the number of iPhones sold outside the US last quarter).

wovel
Jul 29, 2011, 01:25 PM
Publicly traded corporations are obligated to report earnings and expenses and a variety of details. They issue statements about the makeup of those earnings on a voluntary basis to help their investors understand "color" associated with those numbers.

One second after those voluntary disclosures provide any negative effects or risk doing so for any reason, they actually have an obligation to protect shareholders, even if that means being less forthcoming.

Apple itself has concatenated product lines into categories for the same reason. But if they felt it was a risk to shareholders to even report those figures they could step back from that.

So fine.

But nonetheless it is funny to us non shareholders, Samsung has to do this! :D

Rocketman


Depends on the country, I do bot believe Samsung is traded in the US, nor do I think many of their public statements would stand up to SEC scrutiny. The number of "mistakes" they make in public statements is astonishing.

winston1236
Jul 29, 2011, 09:09 PM
sounds sketchy

paul4339
Jul 30, 2011, 02:39 PM
...
One second after those voluntary disclosures provide any negative effects or risk doing so for any reason, they actually have an obligation to protect shareholders, even if that means being less forthcoming.

...

Yes, as long as they still provide enough transparency to give investors an understanding of how well the company is doing: such disclosing total smartphone sales vs non-smartphone sales, but giving no breakdowns.

I can see that not disclosing number to protect investors is good, but not disclosing enough also defeats the purpose of reporting. For example, if were a Samsung investor I would like to see how smartphone and tablets sales are growing (as separate figures) so that i can make a good investment choice, or even to gauge how well management is doing. It would also be nice to see gross margins.

Once there's too much hidden, it can be used by management to hide poor decisions or poor performance.

P.

backinblack875
Jul 30, 2011, 04:11 PM
I think he meant that it looks like they might end up paying Apple a fee for each Android phone sold and they want to be able to minimize the number.

yes, but should they have to pay for each phone sold, i'm sure they would be required to release the true numbers, at least to apple.

MacinDoc
Aug 1, 2011, 03:39 PM
The only possible harm I can see to Samsung from disclosing its numbers would be the inevitable comparison with Apple.

itsalexaye
Aug 1, 2011, 03:41 PM
they are scared because Apple crushed them :)

FloatingBones
Jan 27, 2012, 07:30 AM
so :apple: isn't the only one wearing out the rubber in their "Top Secret" stamps.;)

As can be seen in this FY 2012 Q1 results article (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/01/24/apple-reports-best-quarter-ever-in-q1-2012-13-06-billion-profit-on-46-33-billion-in-revenue/), Apple explicitly announces the number of iPhones shipped in their quarterly financial results calls. This past quarter, they announced sales of 37M phones. Apple doesn't break down all numbers -- they don't seem to announce the number of iPod Touch units sold -- but they do clearly announce the number of iPhones, iPads, and Macs sold every quarter. Samsung is apparently starting to keep those numbers secret.

Keeping mobile phone sales results secret is very different than keeping details of products in development secret.

[I saw this thread because it was referenced in a front page article (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/01/26/apple-estimated-to-retake-title-of-worlds-largest-smartphone-vendor/) last night.]

Consultant
Jan 27, 2012, 10:44 AM
As can be seen in this FY 2012 Q1 results article (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/01/24/apple-reports-best-quarter-ever-in-q1-2012-13-06-billion-profit-on-46-33-billion-in-revenue/), Apple explicitly announces the number of iPhones shipped in their quarterly financial results calls. This past quarter, they announced sales of 37M phones. Apple doesn't break down all numbers -- they don't seem to announce the number of iPod Touch units sold -- but they do clearly announce the number of iPhones, iPads, and Macs sold every quarter. Samsung is apparently starting to keep those numbers secret.

Keeping mobile phone sales results secret is very different than keeping details of products in development secret.

[I saw this thread because it was referenced in a front page article (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/01/26/apple-estimated-to-retake-title-of-worlds-largest-smartphone-vendor/) last night.]

I am guessing Samsung is hedging on the fact that if they lose, they might have to pay damages for each phone sold.

If the information is not public, they can change it to their advantage if regulators came calling.

Yes I know this article is old.

thewitt
Jan 27, 2012, 12:33 PM
They will be forced to make these numbers available in any legal actions. The lack of public disclosure only impacts public opinion, not legal actions.

remosobert
Mar 1, 2012, 10:37 PM
They will be forced to make these numbers available in any legal actions. The lack of public disclosure only impacts public opinion, not legal actions.

I agree! Many of their public statements would stand up to SEC scrutiny. The number of mistakes they make in public statements is astonishing.