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View Full Version : bottom RAM slot in my powerbook is fried




tekmoe
Apr 27, 2005, 10:13 AM
i attempted to use some ram by the brand name Infineon (it came from a thinkpad). it is CL 2.5, DDR2700, 512mb. same exact specs as the ram that came with my powerbook. so i turn the powerbook off, add the Infineon into the top slot. boot it up, seems to be working fine. check the system properties, but it still only says 512mb. so i figure i just didn't push the ram into the slot all the way. i shutdown, check the memory again, and it is pushed all the way in. i switch the ram modules, where the Infineon goes in the bottom, and the apple ram goes in the top. try to boot and get 3 beeps. i shutdown the powerbook, and then take out the apple ram from the top slot. try to boot and it still does 3 beeps. i take out the Infineon, and put the powerbook back to how it was, where the apple ram was in the bottom slot, adn the top slot was empty. turn it on thinking everything will be back to normal...nope, still getting 3 beeps. at this point, i am starting to sweat. pondering about it for a moment, i shut the powerbook off, and put the apple ram to the top slot. bingo, it works. but what's wrong with the bottom slot? it can't be the ram. so i call apple. they have me do the apple option o r to reset something or another. still doesnt fix the bottom slot. they have me take the battery out and hold the power button for 5 seconds. then turn it back on to reset the nvram. bottom slot still doesnt work. they finally give me the option to send it in, or take it to the apple store.

at this point, my powerbook works because the top slot is ok, but i guess my question is, has this ever happened to anyone?

if you were in my shoes, which option would you take? send it in, or take it to the apple store?

my powerbook is the new rev d' model. 15". with a bad bottom slot.

thanks



saunders45
Apr 27, 2005, 10:46 AM
Do you have 10.3.9????? It fried my bosses lower slot in his PB. It has happened to quite a few people I hear. I took it and dropped it off at the Apple store to be sent in. It seems there is a firmware upgrade thats like a friggin' time bomb.

tekmoe
Apr 27, 2005, 10:47 AM
interesting enough, i just updated to 10.3.9 about a week ago.........

saunders45
Apr 27, 2005, 11:48 AM
Yeah.. thought so. "Unofficially" there is a firmware update problem with 10.3.9. Supposedly it was prevelant in 10.3.8 for 15" PB's and spread to the rest in 10.3.9. Most Apple folk deny it, but I was told off the record that it exists.
What really sucks is that I have a rev c 15" PB too. Exact same model as his, and I had 10.3.9 longer, and yet mine works fine. I call a friend of minewho has the rev B 15" PB and he is screwed over too.

All I can suggest is take it in.

Toeknee
Apr 27, 2005, 02:36 PM
How odd havent had my slot go out on me ... yet. Although I did order a 1GB stick from Newegg a while back that didnt work with the Rev. A models. I had to return it to my dismay really wanted that stick to work. I wonder if this only "affects" the newer models and not the Rev. A. One thing I do know is that the next laptop I get will be the PowerBook G5.... when ever the hell that is.

saunders45
Apr 27, 2005, 02:54 PM
Dunno which models it affects exactly. However on the memory issue, what exactly did you get and for how much.

I just bought another gig from Crucial for $195. Not the "Official" PB ram, but the EXACT same stuff for about 150$ less than their "matched" ram.

Toeknee
Apr 27, 2005, 04:44 PM
It was a while back but it was a 1GB stick Kingmax brand that I got for about $200. The computer wouldnt run in Auto or lowest performance, only in Highest . I just said screw it and returned it, I can now get a stick of a gig for $180 from Other World.

D*I*S_Frontman
Apr 27, 2005, 05:23 PM
Wow. Same thing happened to me. My 15.2" AlBook is in Apple's Memphis shop right now, getting this fixed. All as a result of the 10.3.9 upgrade? That will prove to be a VERY expensive mistake, if this is a universal problem.

This is the first I've heard that the lower RAM slot failure is a known issue (albeit a denied one). I have never been burned by an Apple Update before. With all the cold, hard cash from iPods around, Apple has no excuse for not thoroughly testing all updates on all current hardware before unleashing havoc upon their faithful user base. I am a Mac user precisely because I don't want to deal with crap like this. My Pismo had about 7 days of downtime in the entire three years I owned it--and my new G4 Powerbook has exceeded that in the first 60 days!

I would like Apple to own up to this one, and I want assurances that they've FULLY ADDRESSED the issue. I don't want it back to have the lower RAM slot fry again in a week.

tekmoe
Apr 27, 2005, 05:40 PM
Wow. Same thing happened to me. My 15.2" AlBook is in Apple's Memphis shop right now, getting this fixed. All as a result of the 10.3.9 upgrade? That will prove to be a VERY expensive mistake, if this is a universal problem.

This is the first I've heard that the lower RAM slot failure is a known issue (albeit a denied one). I have never been burned by an Apple Update before. With all the cold, hard cash from iPods around, Apple has no excuse for not thoroughly testing all updates on all current hardware before unleashing havoc upon their faithful user base. I am a Mac user precisely because I don't want to deal with crap like this. My Pismo had about 7 days of downtime in the entire three years I owned it--and my new G4 Powerbook has exceeded that in the first 60 days!

I would like Apple to own up to this one, and I want assurances that they've FULLY ADDRESSED the issue. I don't want it back to have the lower RAM slot fry again in a week.

i am totally with you on this one. i've been searching the web, and there is also a small article on pbzone.com. i sent the editor an email expressing my frustration.

i have already called apple and went thru the troubleshooting with them. they have given me a case number and told me to call back whenever i am ready to ship my powerbook to them.

i am going to sit and wait to see what apple says/does about this issue. i am also interested to see how many more people post about it. there is a post on the official apple forums which has several people complaining about this problem. http://discussions.info.apple.com/webx?128@244.mShba9XtSx7.524729@.68acd68e

shambolic
Apr 27, 2005, 05:55 PM
Another one here. Failed last Thursday - though it had been running 10.3.9 for about six days by that point.

Latest 15" SD model, only a couple of months old.

I can't bear to be parted from it (yet) though, so I'll keep chugging along with just the 1GB in the upper slot for a while longer. (To be honest, I've not seen much of a performance drop-off)

The Apple discussions boards (http://discussions.info.apple.com) have plenty of other reports about this issue - I'm hoping that at some point Apple may acknowledge the problem in the same way that they did for the G3 iBook logic boards.

Of course I wouldn't turn down a magic firmware fix that saves me having to send the PB away to Memphis for repair..

tekmoe
Apr 27, 2005, 10:06 PM
weird things are happening. my safari unexpectedly quit when i was running a broadband speed test. my adium instant message client crashed several minutes before that.

this sucks...

California
Apr 27, 2005, 11:15 PM
I feel so bad for all youse guys with these 10.3.9 problems...

Something in my gut told me NOT to update to 10.3.9 as I am perfectly happy on 3.8.

I think it was because Tiger was coming out so soon on 3.9's heels.

I hate to postulate against the company that I have been absolutely loyal to since 1989, BUT could it be a glitch ridden update to get the unsuspecting Mac user to buy Tiger?

Hate to even think that but theyhad better have a fix on it if all this is true.

I'm not switching to Tiger for a looong while.

Faraday
Apr 28, 2005, 01:06 AM
wow, how strange. I just picked my powerbook up this morning after having the same problem fixed.

I have a 1.5 GHz, April 2004 model. I bought it with a 512 MB stick of apple ram, and I added a second 512 MB stick of no-name RAM, which worked fine.

I took it in a week or two back for a problem with the sleep light, for which they replaced the logic board under warranty.

When I got the machine back with the new logic board I found only the top RAM slot was working. Either the Apple RAM or the 3rd party RAM was fine in the top slot, but putting either stick of RAM in the bottom slot got either 3 beeps at startup if it was the only stick installed, or no beeps at all if both slots were filled, and the machine booted with only the top slot of RAM recognised. Both the install DVD hardware test and the Apple Service Diagnostic reported problems with the RAM in the bottom slot.

I had upgraded to 10.3.9 just prior to taking it in for the original sleep light problem, and I don't remember if this caused a problem with the RAM at this time, though I couldn't be sure.

The solution was a 3rd logic board, which seems to be OK. The machine is now running OK on 10.3.9 with both 512 MB sticks recognised.

saunders45
Apr 28, 2005, 10:46 AM
Wow. I knew some people had it but..... Freakin' A... This sucks. I find myself always checkin "About this mac" waitning for it to show only 1 gig. I realy can't afford to lose my computer for 7-10 days. I would be screwed.

JasonL
Apr 28, 2005, 12:14 PM
Wow. This happened to me too. I noticed that my system performance deteriorated abruptly a couple of months back, and sytem profile showed 512MB RAM instead of the 1GB I had installed. I haven't had a chance to send it in to Apple (it will be covered under AppleCare) as I need my computer on a daily basis until the end of the semester. What I did to hold me over was buy a 1GB stick from DMS (awesome prices and service, btw) and installed it in the top slot. Now, after my computer gets fixed I'll have 1.5GB of RAM...which is cool I guess.

vinnie
May 3, 2005, 11:42 PM
Me too, my lower slot was fried after the 10.3.9 update.

I know it was the upgrade because I was running Final cut pro right before the upgrade, and then minutes after it when I tried to start up FCP again it said there was insufficient memory, which is how I discovered the lower slot problem.

I've left it in to be fixed as I only have 12 days left in my warranty. If my warranty was expired I'd be hopping mad and insisting Apple fix it free of charge.

tekmoe
May 4, 2005, 06:32 AM
i still haven't sent my powerbook in. it is working fine with the ram in the top slot. i have about 10 months of warranty left. i wish apple could somehow reverse the effect with a software patch. seems like if software broke it, software could fix it.

i hope more people continue to post on this thread. so far, it is the biggest thread concerning this issue.

sejanus
May 4, 2005, 01:38 PM
me too....

15" PB 1.5ghz

have 2 x 1gb sticks.

when I first got the laptop the 2nd ram slot didn't work at all. had to get logic board swapped which was a pain as the laptop was sent away for 7 business days. that was around this time last year.

Now 2 months ago I noticed my machine was starting to thrash the disk and slowdown a bit in photoshop. lo and behold the 2nd slot had stopped again.

i thought it as just another logicboard failure but if it is 10.3.8 or 10.3.9 - that really stinks!!

as i type this my powerbook is at the service centre getting fixed....I'm typing this on a cruddy ibm laptop.

dmcalerney
May 5, 2005, 11:39 AM
Howdy,

In the past month or two, My ram has crapped out as well. Except i'm running an imac that i bought a year and a half ago. Could this be the same problem?

warrior
May 15, 2005, 12:36 AM
my lower ram slot fried too (10.3.9)

warrior
May 16, 2005, 10:04 PM
Would installing 10.4 take away this problem? or is it fried for good?

tekmoe
May 16, 2005, 10:14 PM
i wish i knew... =(

mcwotan
May 23, 2005, 03:29 AM
I have the same problem but with osx 10.4.1!! I installed Tiger about 3 weeks ago and upgraded to 10.4.1 a few days ago. yesterday my screen froze and after rebooting my lower ram slot was dead!! I don't get they didn't fix this problem at apple...! Any similar experiences? If so, anybody knows how long repairing takes in Europe (Austria)?

thx -mcwotan

Mpowerbook182
May 23, 2005, 09:10 PM
Man this sucks pretty sure mine is done too, just posted about it, I was just worried about apple trying to blame it on the non-apple ram, sounds like none of you had that problem so i guess I will head down to the apple store, wish i never installed 10.3.9 :mad:

edere
May 23, 2005, 09:59 PM
i've had the lower slot fail on me on my powerbook running both under 10.3.9 and 10.4. and both times it has been a logic board failure. apple has a great OS, but horrible hardware.

tekmoe
May 24, 2005, 08:30 AM
I am really hoping Apple will acknowledge this issue and come up with a permanant fix. I still have not sent my PB in to get the logic board replaced. I don't want to get my PB back and have the logic board fail again only to have to send it out days or weeks later to get it replaced a second or even third time.

Maybe it could be a bad batch of RAM that Apple included with our Powerbooks? I've read posts on macrumors and also the official Apple forums where people have sent in their PB's to have the logic board replaced, only to get it back, and it fails again. Maybe the RAM is causing it?

Please Apple, at least write a statement to the general public saying you know there is a problem with the lower ram slot failing.

California
May 24, 2005, 11:58 PM
Maybe Apple wrote this into the updates so that we don't buy third party ram? I'll bet all of the ram that fried was non OEM.

CanadaRAM
May 25, 2005, 12:02 AM
Maybe Apple wrote this into the updates so that we don't buy third party ram? I'll bet all of the ram that fried was non OEM.
No, some of the posters have said that when they swapped places, the Apple didn't work in the lower socket and the 3rd party did. I think it's a socket thing...

mcdermd
May 29, 2005, 07:18 PM
I've been having problems with my 1.25ghz 15". I have a single 1gb OWC SODIMM in the lower slot. Since 10.4.0, it has been experiencing random freezes and unexpected quits at least once per day, usually more than twice. Last night I swapped the slot to the upper and everything seems alright now.

Does this jive with the lower slot problem, or does the slot just fail 100%? This kind of sucks as the warranty expired two months ago now :mad:

superkatalog
Jun 1, 2005, 08:32 AM
wah.
i read about the problem and i checked an i have the probelm too. :mad:
g4 1.5 ghz 15"pb

grrrr.

California
Jun 1, 2005, 02:01 PM
Guys please get APPLECARE if you can. It is totally worth it; Apple did more than they should have for me in my last year of warranty.

matheweis
Jun 3, 2005, 03:05 AM
Me too - Lost the lower slot on my PB 15" 1.33 Ghz; Just upgraded to OS X 10.4

HumanBean
Jun 17, 2005, 04:37 PM
Yeah I'm going through the same problem with my PB G4 15 inch 1.5 GHz, and I've noticed a lot of people going through the same thing. There is a petition at, http://lowermemoryslot.editkid.com/ to have Apple recognize the problem, and hopefully recall these PB's.

Piarco
Jun 27, 2005, 03:15 PM
Bugger... add another notch for Apple. I was wondering why VPC was being sluggish and checked the PC settings and it was showing insufficient RAM when I bumped it up to the max 512MB. After a while of uninstalling VPC thinking it was at fault, I've gone and checked for my worst nightmare....

And yep, its a dead lower memory slot.

I use my PB at work as I now hate my work PC - the Mac is just so much more productive. Yet now I'm facing a week or two with no PB... maybe longer as mine is a BTO 128MB vram model. Hopefully living so close to the Apple Store on Regent Street will pay off, but I think the BTO nature will negate that....

boatz
Jul 5, 2005, 05:40 PM
I upgraded to 10.3.9 a couple weeks ago and noticed the ibook slowed down massively. put a new 256 stick in and it is not recognized - or is the old 128MG stick... both modules tested good, but system profiler seems to think the slot is empty... are you powerbook users getting an indication of an empty slot? or is there no slot listed?

swiftaw
Jul 5, 2005, 08:36 PM
Well, wouldn't you know, today my powerbook 'lost' half its RAM. A few checks later and I found that I am suffering from the same problem as you have all documented here, a non working lower RAM slot.

After reading this thread and similar threads on Apple's forums, I have come to the logical conclusion that this is a design or manufacturing fault of the 15" powerbook resulting in a loss of connection between the logic board and the lower RAM slot.

Obviously replacing the logic board will solve the problem, but as its the same logic board design as the original logic board there is nothing stopping this problem reoccurring. Thus, I have decided to wait a little while in the hope that Apple do the right think and announce that this is a known issue and offer a solution.

For what it is worth, I filled out the feedback form on Apple's site. I have no idea if they read or respond to these things but I thought I would share with you what I wrote to Apple:


Today I noticed that my powerbook was not recognizing all my available RAM. On further investigation I concluded that it was a problem with the lower ram slot not recognizing the RAM that was in it. I did all possible checks to make sure that everything was installed correctly and that it wasn't the RAM itself that was defective but rather the slot itself.

After this discovery, I decided to search the apple support forums to see if other users had experienced similar problems. I was shocked by what I found. Hundreds of other 15" powerbook users have experienced the exact same problem. It seems that this is caused by a design or manufacturing problem with the logic board and/or ram slots. I am willing to bet that it is a problem with the soldering between the logic board and the ram slots, over time it degrades and the connection between the logic board and the lower ram slot is lost.

The (temporary) solution seems to be a Logic Board replacement, but, whilst this indeed cures the problem as in it returns the usability of the lower ram slot, it does nothing to stop it happening again to the replacement logic board / ram slots. Several users have had multiple logic board replacements for the exact same problem.

There is overwhelming evidence that this is a design or manufacturing problem, and I find it amazing that Apple has no knowledge of this issue. Actually, I believe that Apple has full knowledge of this issue (several Apple Store Geniuses have acknowledged this) but are for whatever reason not prepared to make their awareness of the problem known. Instead Apple are happy to continue to replace Logic Boards either under warranty or at the expense of the customer.

My powerbook is covered by AppleCare for the next two and a half years, thus it is not the cost of the Logic Board replacement that I have issue with, but rather it is the fact that this problem is obviously something more than a few isolated incidents, rather it is evidence of a design or manufacturing problem.

I believe that Apple knows this, but for some reason are not willing to admit this is a problem, possibly because they do not have a solution other than replacing the Logic Board with one that is equally susceptible to the same problem. Apple's failure to acknowledge this problem has a number of consequences, the alienation of is current powerbook users who are frustrated with this recurring problem, and the loss of many new users who are warned away from powerbooks due to this problem, to name two.

You may say "What's the problem? Apple will fix it for free under warranty." Whilst this is true, it doesn't actually solve the problem, it just (temporarily) removes the symptoms, the underlying cause is still present and thus users have no idea how long it will be before the problem resurfaces. Also, whilst the repair might not cost anything in terms of money (if under warranty), most users cannot afford to lose their powerbook for the week or two it takes to send it for repair. Thus the cost in terms of time can be high.

I am not an angry screaming neanderthal who just wants Apple to solve my problem at all costs. I am a intelligent rational person who is hoping that Apple will do the right thing by its users by admitting that this is a design or manufacturing problem and offering users a solution that will actually prevent the problem occurring rather than temporarily curing the symptoms.

I wait eagerly for your reply, and would be more than happy to discuss this with Apple further in order to solve this problem.

tekmoe
Jul 12, 2005, 09:35 AM
I STILL have not sent in my Powerbook to get the logic board replaced. My warranty ends next March. My plan is to wait until Apple comes out in the open and admits this IS a manufacturing problem. If they don't before my warranty expires, I will simply pay for the Applecare, and continue to wait. I have a 1gb stick in the upper ram slot now, so it doesn't bother me that the lower ram slot is not working.

matheweis
Jul 13, 2005, 01:20 PM
Funny thing - I got am RMA to return my Powerbook 1.33 Ghz to the shop I had purchase it from. Before returning the item, I swapped the RAM back to the lower slot - what do you know - it worked again!?

This only serves to make this problem more peculiar. I have no doubt the problem exists, since I have only one stick of RAM (Originally in the lower slot), and the machine wouldn't boot up at all (Booting up gave the RAM failure chime).

But fixing itself? Anyone else having a similar experience?

swiftaw
Jul 13, 2005, 02:29 PM
Funny thing - I got am RMA to return my Powerbook 1.33 Ghz to the shop I had purchase it from. Before returning the item, I swapped the RAM back to the lower slot - what do you know - it worked again!?

This only serves to make this problem more peculiar. I have no doubt the problem exists, since I have only one stick of RAM (Originally in the lower slot), and the machine wouldn't boot up at all (Booting up gave the RAM failure chime).

But fixing itself? Anyone else having a similar experience?

This would make perfect sense if the problem was some kind of loose connection. Connection could be (temporarily) reestablished.

D*I*S_Frontman
Jul 26, 2005, 12:54 PM
Hey,

You may have read my post on Page 1 of this thread, in April. At that time, I took my PB 15" 1.5ghz to my local Apple Store and had it "fixed" under warranty. BTW, I purchased it in late February 2005.

Guess what? The lower RAM slot has failed again. I submitted it to the same Apple store AGAIN for repair a week ago. Their repair shop hasn't even looked at it yet. It will be out of my hands for close to two weeks, and I am sure they will just be popping in a new MLB instead of getting to the REAL issue, because it is apparent to all of us here that they still don't know what that issue actually is.

FWIW, I never heard the fan come on, ever. My suspicion is that some goofy firmware glitch within 10.3.9 and up screws with the heat regulation systems, and some solder point in the stock MLBs fails under the excess temperatures. That would explain why the symptoms vary a bit from user to user, and why MLBs that are up to spec cold (i.e., when tested by a QC person at the production plant or on an Apple technician's work bench) would fail in actual use.

If you have not done so yet, please add your name to the host of people acknowledging the same problem. Use this link:

http://lowermemoryslot.editkid.com

I can't wait to be using my THIRD MLB in six months (stock + two replacements), and if this is not recognized by Apple soon, I'll be writing back to let you know how my FOURTH one is doing.

C'mon Apple! Use that iPod cash and fix this. Share the love, man!

jkea
Jul 27, 2005, 01:20 PM
Why are people getting their powerbooks fixed if apple has not fixed the problem? Does the same problem happen when using an older OS, i.e. 10.3.8? My powerbook seems to be having the same problem under 10.3.9. Has anyone tried switching to an older OS and seeing if that fixes the problem?

Cloudgazer
Aug 12, 2005, 03:25 AM
I'm thinking of buying an extra 1gb Ram for my powerbook.

I wanted to know if it makes a difference into which slot the additional RAM is installed.

Thats when I stumbled across this thread.

I'm very worried now.
I'm running 10.3.9, i have the standard 512 RAM in the lower slot.

If I add more RAM, is there a chance of frying my lower slot?

I don't want to take the chance.
If any thing happens to my powerbook, they will have to ship it half way around the world to get it repaired.

xparaparafreakx
Aug 12, 2005, 09:04 PM
My little brother has a AlBook 1.5Ghz with the standard. Nothing is wrong with it yet but should i
a. buy applecare when apple might recall it?
or
b. buy 1GB of ram and keep it under my desk so when my little bro's AlBook goes crazy, i can replace it?

California
Aug 13, 2005, 04:00 AM
Okay, i got a brand new iBook 1.33 14" for reasons I've discussed on this site. basically, I need a lower resolution screen to see my Word documents on than my 667 Tibook DVI gives me.

So I bought some Samsung ram 1gig chip to put in the ibook tonight and even though I am going to see my Apple tech guy tomorrow to help me put it in, I just pull up the keyboard (an easy task on Tibooks) to see where the more difficult ram chip has to go in past the Airport extreme card.

I try to reseat the keyboard after looking at the neat looking card and nothing else.

suddenly I get the flashing colored lights on the screen and three beeps.

Then the machine chimes up but no display.

Then nothing.

I was running the dreaded 10.3.9 Panther.

What happened? Did I just lose my HD or was it a logic board failure or what? I had the iBook for ONE WEEK. All it had was ORIGINAL ram, i have no idea even how to get into the ram area.

Unreal.

ic1
Aug 14, 2005, 05:28 PM
Cloudgazer,

No, adding a memory stick in your unused slot will not cause it or the other slot to fry. In fact, putting 1 Gig in the top slot would match my RAM configuration (1.5GB) exactly. So far working fine.

Now, does the RSA in your location mean you're in South Africa? If so, are there any Apple resellers/repair shops there? I ask because I too have a 15" Rev C PB running 10.3.9. If anything goes wrong, I was expecting South Africa to be the nearest source of repair so your remark about them (?) having to ship the machine half-way around the world for repair really got my attention.

Cloudgazer
Aug 15, 2005, 03:44 AM
Cloudgazer,

No, adding a memory stick in your unused slot will not cause it or the other slot to fry. In fact, putting 1 Gig in the top slot would match my RAM configuration (1.5GB) exactly. So far working fine.

Now, does the RSA in your location mean you're in South Africa? If so, are there any Apple resellers/repair shops there? I ask because I too have a 15" Rev C PB running 10.3.9. If anything goes wrong, I was expecting South Africa to be the nearest source of repair so your remark about them (?) having to ship the machine half-way around the world for repair really got my attention.

Yes, RSA is South Africa.
You might be able to get minor repairs done here, but they usually just ship your machine overseas.
The techies who work for Apple here, are not the sharpest tools in the shed. (or should i say ripest fruit in the basket)

Also, they tend to give you the 3rd degree if you didn't purchase your Mac here. (I don't know if thier attitude would be different if you have Apple Care)

But, i must say Apple's presence in SA is getting better, so hopefully their service levels will as well,

ic1
Aug 15, 2005, 09:16 AM
Thanks for the insight Cloudgazer.

Now returning thread to its original purpose.

tekmoe
Aug 15, 2005, 01:55 PM
i recently purchased a 12" powerbook from apple store. has the original 512mb ram in it. no problems with it so far.

i still have not sent in my 15" to get the logic board replaced. :)

spiffo
Sep 29, 2005, 11:00 PM
I have an original AlBook (1.25/80GB/1.25GB/64MBDDR/SD) which I installed Tiger on fine. Then I decided to up the RAM, and replaced my 2x256MB with 1 Geil 1GB chip (cheap on NewEgg) on the top slot, and left the bottom slot with the 256MB. Then I started getting a lot of crashes and freezes, within 30secs to 5 mins of turning on my PB. I swapped out the 1GB for the original 256MB and everything worked fine (TTP and the Disk Verification said all was well in both RAM configs). Then I installed the 1GB on the bottom slot and one of the 256MB chips in the top, and everything seems to be working reasonably fine right now. Has Tiger (10.4.2) fixed the 10.3.9 bug? Why would changing from the top to the bottom slot make a difference? Am I going to burn my motherboard and a 1GB chip any day now? Has anyone had similar experiences? Advice?

CanadaRAM
Sep 29, 2005, 11:11 PM
I have an original AlBook (1.25/80GB/1.25GB/64MBDDR/SD) which I installed Tiger on fine. Then I decided to up the RAM, and replaced my 2x256MB with 1 Geil 1GB chip (cheap on NewEgg) on the top slot, and left the bottom slot with the 256MB. Then I started getting a lot of crashes and freezes, within 30secs to 5 mins of turning on my PB. I swapped out the 1GB for the original 256MB and everything worked fine (TTP and the Disk Verification said all was well in both RAM configs). Then I installed the 1GB on the bottom slot and one of the 256MB chips in the top, and everything seems to be working reasonably fine right now. Has Tiger (10.4.2) fixed the 10.3.9 bug? Why would changing from the top to the bottom slot make a difference? Am I going to burn my motherboard and a 1GB chip any day now? Has anyone had similar experiences? Advice?
I'm going to guess the NewEgg RAM is to blame. Someone who really knows may be able to confirm, but perhaps the memory controller in that machine populates the memory in the top slot first, then the bottom. So if you had flakey RAM in the top slot, it would crash right away, whereas having it in the bottom slot won't give a problem until you start using a lot of RAM.

Anyway, regardless of the reason, there is no way the RAM 'has' to go in one slot or another, so if it crashes when the 1 gb is in the top slot, send it back for a refund. It'll come back and bite you later if you leave it in the bottom slot.

spiffo
Sep 29, 2005, 11:17 PM
Thanks for the info. That and an AppleCare plan sounds like a safe bet. Just for clarification, is crappy RAM gonna do that all the time (basically if I send it back for a different chip by the same brand is this always gonna happen)? Do I need to shell out for the Samsung RAM (it's like $50 more) or can I just try to get another random chip?


I'm going to guess the NewEgg RAM is to blame. Someone who really knows may be able to confirm, but perhaps the memory controller in that machine populates the memory in the top slot first, then the bottom. So if you had flakey RAM in the top slot, it would crash right away, whereas having it in the bottom slot won't give a problem until you start using a lot of RAM.

Anyway, regardless of the reason, there is no way the RAM 'has' to go in one slot or another, so if it crashes when the 1 gb is in the top slot, send it back for a refund. It'll come back and bite you later if you leave it in the bottom slot.

Ferrence
Sep 30, 2005, 12:33 PM
I just got my 15" PB Alum back from Apple 2 days ago. I sent it in because I had a problem at start-up, the lower memory slot wasn't registering and I kept getting kernal panics (I purchased this laptop brand new from Apple in May 2005--4 months ago!!!).

Currently I'm running 10.4.2 and I have the original 512 + 1 GB that I added in the upper memory slot. I just checked the "About this Mac," and once again it is only registering 1 GB. This is ridiculous! I'm am seriously considering switching back to PC if they don't fix this problem soon.

Apparently, people are trying to file a class action lawsuit on this matter. I've joined the fight in hoped that Apple will address this situation.

Here's the link, if you're interested.

https://www.lawyersandsettlements.com/caseapple_powerbook_classaction




i've had the lower slot fail on me on my powerbook running both under 10.3.9 and 10.4. and both times it has been a logic board failure. apple has a great OS, but horrible hardware.

coachingguy
Sep 30, 2005, 03:25 PM
Wow, after reading of everyone else's issue's it's nice to know I'm not alone. I was working on my PB (15.2, 1.5Ghz, 80hd, 1.25ram,SD, OS X.4.2) two weeks ago today, when it went out on me. I couldn't even get it to boot. I called Apple the following Monday, they said I needed to verify my Date of Purchase. I purchased this machine new the end of June from Tech For Less for over $200 less than Apple was selling it Refurb. The D.O.P. Apple had was when Tech For Less bought it. I even registered it online the day I got it... Anyhow, I fax in the invoice from both Tech For Less and UPS establishing purchase and delivery last Monday(the 19th). I wait 2 days and call back, repeat my story verbatim, the tech guy starts the RMA process and then comes back on saying they have not verified my D.O.P.. Thursday night I try to turn on the PB again VIOLA! It starts right up like nothing was wrong (I did reset the RAM in the slots). The PB ran great til Monday afternoon, then it crashed again and all I could get was the Blue Screen once in awhile and the Beeps. So I call Apple again, repeat story again even with the case # the new people always want to verify your story. I'm told again they have not verified D.O.P. But the tech guy says he'll personally look into it and call me back. Nobody calls me back, I call back on Tuesday. Same story we're looking into it - we'll call you back. Of course every time I'm on the line they want me to go through the basics IE: reset Pram, safe boot etc... One woman put me on hold for almost 20 minutes and then I was disconnected. I call back yesterday, repeat, repeat finally I ask the guy, should I just re-fax the info. He thinks that would be a good idea. I get all the information together again, write a terse cover letter and send it in. I call back today to verify, yada, yada, yada wait nearly 20 minutes...Finally they have found yesterday's fax, but it will take 5-7 days to process the Date of Purchase. I get firm with the guy, "This is the 2nd time I've faxed it in, you guys lost the first one from nearly two weeks ago, meanwhile I'm unable to work on my machine for 2 weeks - you must expedite this!" He tells me they can't, that that dept (D.O.P.) processes them as they get them and that I should call back next Weds or Thursday to begin to RMA... In the end, they will fix it, lower ram slot, logic board etc... but I'll be without my PB for about a month! Good thing I still have my trusty iBook!

ape
Oct 2, 2005, 08:43 PM
!

Wow, ok.

My PowerBook (15", 1.25 Ghz) just experienced a severe fit of crashing a couple of weeks ago, followed by a single RAM error message (that I cannot recall word for word) after starting up one time. (However, since that time... I have no really experienced much trouble, go figure.)

I took it to the Apple Store in NY and one of the tech guys proclaimed the logic board to be dead. No good. He claimed that it was busted because the computer no longer recognizes the correct amount of RAM in the lower slot. [It reads the RAM as half the amount of what it really is.]

So, I called Apple and set up a pickup so I can have my logic board replaced... I'm expecting a DHL box this week.

Now, tonight... I removed the 1GB stick of Crucial RAM that I had installed, and re-installed the other 256MB stick in the machine.

I restarted, and System Profiler reads the correct amount of RAM.

What gives?

Am I suffering from a fried logic board, or is my Crucial RAM defective?


This issue is so thoroughly confusing me...

mjstew33
Oct 2, 2005, 09:12 PM
In that case, it's probably dead RAM.

tekmoe
Oct 2, 2005, 10:00 PM
as the creator of this thread, i am happy to say that i finally sent in my powerbook last week to get the logic board replaced. i think i have found a buyer for my powerbook and i told them i would get the logic board replaced before we conduct the transaction.

ape
Oct 3, 2005, 05:09 PM
In that case, it's probably dead RAM.


I have no idea what is wrong now, check this out:

http://www.aqua-soft.org/board/showthread.php?t=28424&page=2

My PowerBook is now reading the correct amount of 1GB Crucial RAM in the lower slot.

I ran Hardware Test with both the two original 256MB sticks and one 256MB + 1GB Crucial installed, and everything passed.

So confused.

AlBDamned
Oct 3, 2005, 05:15 PM
I have no idea what is wrong now, check this out:

http://www.aqua-soft.org/board/showthread.php?t=28424&page=2

My PowerBook is now reading the correct amount of 1GB Crucial RAM in the lower slot.

I ran Hardware Test with both the two original 256MB sticks and one 256MB + 1GB Crucial installed, and everything passed.

So confused.


Something's obviously rotten in Denmark but hopefully it's not serious. Could be that the Crucial stick got dis-lodged or something. Just keep an eye on it.

My 5 month old PB has just had a new logic board. I'm keeping an eye on 'about this mac'!

tekmoe
Oct 3, 2005, 08:15 PM
i am happy to say i received my powerbook today. all is well.

missbhavens
Oct 10, 2005, 06:15 PM
This whole lower slot thing is killing me. It sets in motion a whole host of problems even though I'm still under warantee. Every Apple phone tech I've talked to says they've never heard of this problem, which has caused a lot of yelling on my part, and they are refusing to fix it because the RAM is 3rd party. Now I'm stuck with a non-expandable computer with a useless warantee. So if I DO want to fix it, I have to pay for it, and buy a 1G chip to put in the upper slot so it can run everything it's supposed to do in the first place. I have been loyal to Apple for years, but their denial of this obvious widespread problem is pretty dispicable. Between the iPod batteries, the iBook issues, the Nano screens and now this??? Apple is hardly the innovative, inspirational product line it once was. Although they are still as expensive as ever, aren't they?

tekmoe
Oct 10, 2005, 06:23 PM
This whole lower slot thing is killing me. It sets in motion a whole host of problems even though I'm still under warantee. Every Apple phone tech I've talked to says they've never heard of this problem, which has caused a lot of yelling on my part, and they are refusing to fix it because the RAM is 3rd party. Now I'm stuck with a non-expandable computer with a useless warantee. So if I DO want to fix it, I have to pay for it, and buy a 1G chip to put in the upper slot so it can run everything it's supposed to do in the first place. I have been loyal to Apple for years, but their denial of this obvious widespread problem is pretty dispicable. Between the iPod batteries, the iBook issues, the Nano screens and now this??? Apple is hardly the innovative, inspirational product line it once was. Although they are still as expensive as ever, aren't they?

i don't see how they could refuse to replace your logic board, if that's what the problem is, especially if your powerbook is still under warranty? ram is a user replaceable part. it's not like you voided the warranty by putting a stick of ram in there. i would suggest you call apple corporate and ask to speak with customer relations. and please, try to refrain from yelling. it will only make things worse... :o

plexiglass
Oct 10, 2005, 06:29 PM
15" 1.5GHZ, 1gb Ram, 128vram
lower mem slot failure last week.

ARG my system just suffered this problem too! My RAM was cut in half.
Tiger was suddenly running very slowly, and upon running xbench it reported only 512mb of RAM installed. :eek: This is SO annoying... I gotta back everything up, send the computer over to Apple, and wait a week or so while they fix the only computer I own. Luckily I am still covered by the warentee! If I had to pay for this B.S. problem to be fixed I would be foaming at the mouth about now.

Time for apple to start a program similar to the iBook logic board replacement program, which I also had the displeasure of using. my last mac (iBook g3 700mhz) had a defect as well and would break about every 3 months. Why I do continue to buy apple products? :mad:

missbhavens
Oct 10, 2005, 06:29 PM
i don't see how they could refuse to replace your logic board, if that's what the problem is, especially if your powerbook is still under warranty? ram is a user replaceable part. it's not like you voided the warranty by putting a stick of ram in there. i would suggest you call apple corporate and ask to speak with customer relations. and please, try to refrain from yelling. it will only make things worse... :o

Oh, I know. But after being bumped around and put on perma-hold, and being told "too bad, lady" one gets testy. They are claiming that I HAVE violated my warantee by not only putting RAM in there, but also opening it up the back to move RAM around to see what the deal was. Now it's all on a new case number with all the details and I can't very well pretend I didn't do it. But if you are telling me to seek a higher customer service authority, I certainly will. They also have mangled the paper trail of this problem beyond recognition (I bought the computer and the Apple Care was transferred to me). Apparantly SOME kind of hardware has been replaced on this machine (logic board? Hard Drive? No one seems to know) and Apple has no record of it, even though the kid who sold it to me gave me the care number. The whole phone service from Apple has been dismal. But I will try again in a calmer fashion!

CanadaRAM
Oct 10, 2005, 06:32 PM
I purchased this machine new the end of June from Tech For Less for over $200 less than Apple was selling it Refurb. The D.O.P. Apple had was when Tech For Less bought it.
Question - is Tech for Less an Apple Authorized Dealer?

MacTruck
Oct 10, 2005, 06:44 PM
This bottom ram slot problem is so common its sick. Luckily I have not experienced this yet. Looks like its the 1.5ghz powerbooks getting this. Anyone with a 1.67ghz have this problem yet?

CanadaRAM
Oct 10, 2005, 06:50 PM
...They also have mangled the paper trail of this problem beyond recognition (I bought the computer and the Apple Care was transferred to me). Apparantly SOME kind of hardware has been replaced on this machine (logic board? Hard Drive? No one seems to know) and Apple has no record of it, even though the kid who sold it to me gave me the care number. The whole phone service from Apple has been dismal. But I will try again in a calmer fashion!
You bought your machine used, with a transfer of Applecare? unfortunately you are going to run into more roadblocks that way.
You can't void your warranty by replacing RAM. In fact, you can't void your warranty by taking the back off it, unless Apple can prove that you did damage by doing so.
BUT - if the previous owner monkeyed with the hardware before you got it, and did some damage or replaced non-user installable parts, that might be a problem.

missbhavens
Oct 10, 2005, 07:13 PM
You bought your machine used, with a transfer of Applecare? unfortunately you are going to run into more roadblocks that way.
You can't void your warranty by replacing RAM. In fact, you can't void your warranty by taking the back off it, unless Apple can prove that you did damage by doing so.
BUT - if the previous owner monkeyed with the hardware before you got it, and did some damage or replaced non-user installable parts, that might be a problem.


Well, I'm glad to hear about the "voiding" issue. I get a different story every time I talk to them. The previous owner had problems with 10.4 software, and had sent it in at Apple's behest, and Apple replaced the hard drive because it couldn't solve the software troubles (although, since they have crappy records of this, it may have been the logic board) came back with small dents above the keyboard and on the lid, which the kid called them on, and opened another case #. I bought it from him knowing this, knowing that APple had offered for him to mail it back and have THAT fixed ,too, but couldn't spend two weeks without it so didn't bother. I could care less about a dent, so I was basically biding my time till something bigger warranted a trip to the repair shop. So when this happened (first no start- up happy mac noise then disappearing RAM) I called, started "RAMgate", and inquired about the dent etc. That's when things got confusing. That case number is tied to the original software issue, and somehow the dent, but the phone guy couldn't stitch together the whole story based on the notes in his computer about the different repairs. The whole thing is too frustrating. Now, if I want to try and fix this, I have to throw in the cost of a back up hard drive large enough to copy everything because I'm worried about taking to the Apple Store (a whole other pain) it in and losing it all. It just makes me really sad.

superflymutha
Dec 26, 2005, 06:06 AM
Your not alone.

Apple are behaving terribly on this issue.

I have been through 3 logic boards this year. My powerbook has spent over 4 months in service being repaired.

I have tried every way to contact Apple Australia via phone, emails, faxes, writing letters they just ignore me. Taking it to an Apple center just get the response its going to cost me $1200 to fix it. I know now 3 times that it will not be fixed.

i am out of warrantee and its still broken and not of my doing. I believe it was the upgrade to 10.4 others have a different view of the reason. Suffice to say it a design flaw.

There is a class action and i urge you to submit you details to the firm handling the issue.


Class Action against Apple.

US Law firm Wolf Popper LLP have just issued a class action against Apple Inc. for all of us who have this problem and Apple refuses to help and acknowledge there is a problem at all.

In August 2005, we filed a class action complaint against Apple Computer, Inc. on behalf of all purchasers of Apple PowerBook G4 laptops alleging defects with the lower memory slot. In October 2005, defendant answered the complaint. There is an initial pretrial hearing scheduled with the Court on January 13, 2006. Prior to that, there is a meet and confer between the attorneys for the parties to discuss scheduling of discovery and other matters.

People with this lower ram slot problem need to register with them and list the specific extent of the problem they are having.

Got to: http://lowermemoryslot.editkid.com/ and follow the links!

This is what we have been all waiting for! Viva the revolution!

actionslacks
Dec 26, 2005, 05:57 PM
I have had the bad RAM slot problem for months and have been wiating to hear that someobody has had a permanent fix before i send it in. It's really frustrating and I am considering trying to get apple to upgrade my machine as I know they have done for one or two people over on the Appleinsider boards.

If anyone has any luck, keep posting.

YS2003
Dec 26, 2005, 08:19 PM
My 15" PB (1.25 GHz with 1.5 GB RAM) running 10.3.9 is working flawlessly. I added OWC's Samsung RAM (1 GB + 512 MB) after taking about Apple's OEM RAMS from both slots. I did this about more than a year ago and I have not experienced any problem with my machine. Maybe this is a 15"/1.5 GB thing?

AlBDamned
Dec 28, 2005, 10:17 AM
My 15" PB (1.25 GHz with 1.5 GB RAM) running 10.3.9 is working flawlessly. I added OWC's Samsung RAM (1 GB + 512 MB) after taking about Apple's OEM RAMS from both slots. I did this about more than a year ago and I have not experienced any problem with my machine. Maybe this is a 15"/1.5 GB thing?


Nope, mine is a 1.67 and the logic board has gone twice now. It's a design flaw, pure and simple. Also a thing to note, is that when it went last time, I made sure I put the Apple supplied RAM in the lower slot. It still blew. Crap engineering and Apple are acting very poorly for not recognizing it.

I'm taking mine in to the store again to see what they can do with it.

California
Dec 28, 2005, 01:07 PM
Wow, after reading of everyone else's issue's it's nice to know I'm not alone. I was working on my PB (15.2, 1.5Ghz, 80hd, 1.25ram,SD, OS X.4.2) two weeks ago today, when it went out on me. I couldn't even get it to boot. I called Apple the following Monday, they said I needed to verify my Date of Purchase. I purchased this machine new the end of June from Tech For Less for over $200 less than Apple was selling it Refurb. The D.O.P. Apple had was when Tech For Less bought it. I even registered it online the day I got it... Anyhow, I fax in the invoice from both Tech For Less and UPS establishing purchase and delivery last Monday(the 19th). I wait 2 days and call back, repeat my story verbatim, the tech guy starts the RMA process and then comes back on saying they have not verified my D.O.P.. Thursday night I try to turn on the PB again VIOLA! It starts right up like nothing was wrong (I did reset the RAM in the slots). The PB ran great til Monday afternoon, then it crashed again and all I could get was the Blue Screen once in awhile and the Beeps. So I call Apple again, repeat story again even with the case # the new people always want to verify your story. I'm told again they have not verified D.O.P. But the tech guy says he'll personally look into it and call me back. Nobody calls me back, I call back on Tuesday. Same story we're looking into it - we'll call you back. Of course every time I'm on the line they want me to go through the basics IE: reset Pram, safe boot etc... One woman put me on hold for almost 20 minutes and then I was disconnected. I call back yesterday, repeat, repeat finally I ask the guy, should I just re-fax the info. He thinks that would be a good idea. I get all the information together again, write a terse cover letter and send it in. I call back today to verify, yada, yada, yada wait nearly 20 minutes...Finally they have found yesterday's fax, but it will take 5-7 days to process the Date of Purchase. I get firm with the guy, "This is the 2nd time I've faxed it in, you guys lost the first one from nearly two weeks ago, meanwhile I'm unable to work on my machine for 2 weeks - you must expedite this!" He tells me they can't, that that dept (D.O.P.) processes them as they get them and that I should call back next Weds or Thursday to begin to RMA... In the end, they will fix it, lower ram slot, logic board etc... but I'll be without my PB for about a month! Good thing I still have my trusty iBook!

Paragraphs are our friends.

But as to the issue, if I had a 15" Powerbook, NO WAY IN HECK would I put in Crucial or KVR (Kingston Value Ram) or even Infineon or any other brand but SAMSUNG.

Why? Because this is the ram Apple uses OEM. I don't think it's Apple's BAD manufacturing -- I think it is Apple high standards in their ram slot.

Case in point -- I bought some very cheap Infineon ram chips for two iBooks last month.

They were the right speed, the right size, everything -- but guess what?

They didn't even fit into the slot on the 'books. The owner of the company, who only deals with wholesale ram, said that he can't warranty ram on Apple products because their standards are so stringent.

I lost money on shipping back to him and learned a lesson: Samsung.

California
Dec 28, 2005, 10:49 PM
Nope, mine is a 1.67 and the logic board has gone twice now. It's a design flaw, pure and simple. Also a thing to note, is that when it went last time, I made sure I put the Apple supplied RAM in the lower slot. It still blew. Crap engineering and Apple are acting very poorly for not recognizing it.

I'm taking mine in to the store again to see what they can do with it.

I'm amending my previous post because of what you wrote here AlBDamned.

What kind of "Apple supplied ram" was it?

AlBDamned
Dec 29, 2005, 02:21 AM
I'm amending my previous post because of what you wrote here AlBDamned.

What kind of "Apple supplied ram" was it?

The RAM that was in the lower slot when it blew this time around was the Samsung 512MB stick supplied with the PowerBook. So that sort of blows your theory I'm afraid, California (though I sincerely wish it was just a case of cheap RAM doing it, it would be simple to fix...).

There is a design flaw that causes the logic boards to bug out. Pure and simple. It happens too frequently and too often to the same machines after they've been fixed already.

CanadaRAM
Dec 29, 2005, 02:45 AM
Paragraphs are our friends.
But as to the issue, if I had a 15" Powerbook, NO WAY IN HECK would I put in Crucial or KVR (Kingston Value Ram) or even Infineon or any other brand but SAMSUNG.
Why? Because this is the ram Apple uses OEM. I don't think it's Apple's BAD manufacturing -- I think it is Apple high standards in their ram slot.

Umm.... There is ample evidence here and elsewhere that the lower slot problem is present on Apple genuine Samsung modules. Of course if you use out of spec RAM (of ANY brand) it won't work right. But there are reputable suppliers of Infineon, Siemens, Transcend and Samsung modules that are tested and compatible. The issue is with the logic board and SEEMS to be triggered by a firmware upgrade associated with 10.3.9 or 1o.4

Had a customer in today with a 15" 1.25 with a lower slot defective... 2 x Apple Samsung original 256's Out of warranty - it's gonna be a problem.

AlBDamned
Dec 29, 2005, 12:15 PM
Umm.... There is ample evidence here and elsewhere that the lower slot problem is present on Apple genuine Samsung modules. Of course if you use out of spec RAM (of ANY brand) it won't work right. But there are reputable suppliers of Infineon, Siemens, Transcend and Samsung modules that are tested and compatible. The issue is with the logic board and SEEMS to be triggered by a firmware upgrade associated with 10.3.9 or 1o.4

Had a customer in today with a 15" 1.25 with a lower slot defective... 2 x Apple Samsung original 256's Out of warranty - it's gonna be a problem.

The firmware angle seems to be a fairly current theme, but I'd been running 10.4.3 since it was released a while back and hadn't added any software for at least two weeks.

In the run up to the slot blowing this time, my PB drained its battery as we were watching a dvd on Eurostar. It went into sleep, then when I plugged it in when we got back it was completely dead (not even enough juice to sleep). I had to boot it up. A lack of sound then became apparent when we tried to finish watching the dvd. I restarted the machine, no boot chime and lo and behold, "lower RAM slot empty".

I realised what had happened, but we carried on watching the dvd (LOST) and then I also realised my legs were hot (hotter than usual with this POS laptop on my lap). So we stopped watching the dvd and I switched the powerbook off (felt like chucking it out the window). The next day, I notice practically 1st degree burns on my right leg where it had been heated up by the powerbook (through a duvet).

I've pretty much had it with the damn thing.

California
Dec 29, 2005, 02:11 PM
Umm.... There is ample evidence here and elsewhere that the lower slot problem is present on Apple genuine Samsung modules. Of course if you use out of spec RAM (of ANY brand) it won't work right. But there are reputable suppliers of Infineon, Siemens, Transcend and Samsung modules that are tested and compatible. The issue is with the logic board and SEEMS to be triggered by a firmware upgrade associated with 10.3.9 or 1o.4

Had a customer in today with a 15" 1.25 with a lower slot defective... 2 x Apple Samsung original 256's Out of warranty - it's gonna be a problem.

I amend and repent of my previous post saying it wasn't a logic board problem. Really sounds bad and I checked it out and this thread was started months and months ago before I personally made the switch to Tiger and I think you are correct about the firmware thing. Weird that Apple hasn't fixed it yet.

LastLine
Dec 29, 2005, 05:46 PM
Question: I want to buy a new laptop.
ibook - 14" 1.42Ghz with no ram problems - 899
PB - 15" 1.5Ghz with potential ram problems? 745.

Which do I go for? Both come with 512mb standard and I'd want to upgrade to 1gb soon. Thoughts?

AlBDamned
Dec 31, 2005, 09:06 AM
Question: I want to buy a new laptop.
ibook - 14" 1.42Ghz with no ram problems - 899
PB - 15" 1.5Ghz with potential ram problems? 745.

Which do I go for? Both come with 512mb standard and I'd want to upgrade to 1gb soon. Thoughts?

I'd still go for the Powerbook. The lower slot problem is still a small percentage of units sold and you can put the money you're saving towards AppleCare ;).

In an update on my scenario, Apple are replacing my laptop. Not sure yet if it's for another Rev D or a Rev E but will find out on Wednesday.

discoforce
Jan 15, 2006, 05:24 PM
In an update on my scenario, Apple are replacing my laptop. Not sure yet if it's for another Rev D or a Rev E but will find out on Wednesday.

So what did Apple end up replacing?

I was bummed to just find this thread after finding that my lower slot is now "empty" as well. Bummed because I hoped I had a fairly simple problem that a single trip to my friendly neighborhood Apple specialist could fix. According to those posting here, I'm going to experience a LOT of downtime if I persist on having this fixed. :(

For those keeping track, I've got the 15" 1.25 GHz and just updated to 10.4.4. I upgraded my ram at the Apple specialist to two sticks of 512 (1 gig total)and paid full price, so I assume it was Apple ram. I don't know exactly when my lower slot stopped working, but I noticed it after the 10.4.4 update.

So what responses have folks received from Apple lately? If this problem first started cropping up May 2005, it seems like they could do better than replace your logic board as many times as it takes for Apple care to run out (glad I've got that for 440 more days!).

Any new news?

CanadaRAM
Jan 15, 2006, 06:15 PM
The firmware angle seems to be a fairly current theme, but I'd been running 10.4.3 since it was released a while back and hadn't added any software for at least two weeks.

In the run up to the slot blowing this time, my PB drained its battery as we were watching a dvd on Eurostar. It went into sleep, then when I plugged it in when we got back it was completely dead (not even enough juice to sleep). I had to boot it up. A lack of sound then became apparent when we tried to finish watching the dvd. I restarted the machine, no boot chime and lo and behold, "lower RAM slot empty".

I realised what had happened, but we carried on watching the dvd (LOST) and then I also realised my legs were hot (hotter than usual with this POS laptop on my lap). So we stopped watching the dvd and I switched the powerbook off (felt like chucking it out the window). The next day, I notice practically 1st degree burns on my right leg where it had been heated up by the powerbook (through a duvet).

I've pretty much had it with the damn thing.

Excess heat is also a recurring theme -- it may make some sense this way:

1) Firmware update changes the processor speed controlling or fan control in some manner.
2) Then at some point sooner or later, when the machine is under heavy use, the combination of the environment, faulty cooling / processor limiting in the firmware, and a buildup of heat, cause a component to fry that controls the lower RAM socket. Probably pure luck it doesn't totally disable the machine, but may be related to extraordinary use of the RAM module itself.

This would suggest that extra vigilance on cooling has to be taken... (on a duvet isn't a terriffic environment for heat dissipation)

discoforce
Jan 16, 2006, 08:52 AM
Excess heat is also a recurring theme -- it may make some sense this way:

1) Firmware update changes the processor speed controlling or fan control in some manner.
2) Then at some point sooner or later, when the machine is under heavy use, the combination of the environment, faulty cooling / processor limiting in the firmware, and a buildup of heat, cause a component to fry that controls the lower RAM socket. Probably pure luck it doesn't totally disable the machine, but may be related to extraordinary use of the RAM module itself.

This would suggest that extra vigilance on cooling has to be taken... (on a duvet isn't a terriffic environment for heat dissipation)

My powerbook definitely can get hot, and it used to get pretty uncomfortable actually using it as a laptop :eek:

But I've been using rain design's iLap, since shortly after I bought the thing. How careful can you be?

BEET
Jan 30, 2006, 03:16 AM
Not sure if this is totally related....

I've been running on 10.3.9 for a while now and have only recently noticed that my powerbook has been running slower than usual. I checked the "about this computer" which said that only one ram slot was being used and the pb was running on 256mb. I ordered another 512mb from crucial (only to find that both slots had ram cards in) and very carefully replaced the card in slot closest to the back of the computer (the one that was regestering as empty).
The pb powered up ok, but still only registered 256mb, so I ran a hardware text and got this error "2MEM/5/4:SODIMMO/J25 LOWER

I then swopped tha cards around and tried a few variations only to find that now the pb won't turn on at all. When I turned it on this first time a message appeared telling me to turn it off. The second time it got as far as the grey screen with the apple on and then loads of terrifying text appeared. Now it won't turn on at all, just beeps.

I did a google search and found the ram replacement scheme on the apple website, only to find that my serial number doesn't fall within the replacement range. Is my logic board screwed? or has the dud ram socket blown all of my ram cards, and simply just need to buy new ram? (please god let this be the case!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

AlBDamned
Jan 30, 2006, 07:14 AM
Not sure if this is totally related....

I've been running on 10.3.9 for a while now and have only recently noticed that my powerbook has been running slower than usual. I checked the "about this computer" which said that only one ram slot was being used and the pb was running on 256mb. I ordered another 512mb from crucial (only to find that both slots had ram cards in) and very carefully replaced the card in slot closest to the back of the computer (the one that was regestering as empty).
The pb powered up ok, but still only registered 256mb, so I ran a hardware text and got this error "2MEM/5/4:SODIMMO/J25 LOWER

.... (please god let this be the case!!!!!!!!!!!!!)


That's the error message that means that slot is indeed fragged.

Are you still in warranty? I'm guessing not but fingers crossed.

If you're not in warranty, the most cost-effective way round this is to buy a 1GB stick and just use the top slot. However, I'm not sure what running too hot and everything else does for the overall longevity of the 'book.


1) Firmware update changes the processor speed controlling or fan control in some manner.
2) Then at some point sooner or later, when the machine is under heavy use, the combination of the environment, faulty cooling / processor limiting in the firmware, and a buildup of heat, cause a component to fry that controls the lower RAM socket. Probably pure luck it doesn't totally disable the machine, but may be related to extraordinary use of the RAM module itself.

This would suggest that extra vigilance on cooling has to be taken... (on a duvet isn't a terriffic environment for heat dissipation)

Just realised I never replied to this. Suffice to say, I agree, it's probably a combo of factors that add up to the slot frying.

It's worth pointing out though, that the slot fried on mine long before it got near the duvet. It did actually go when the battery died completely while watching a DVD on the train with the powerbook sitting on the table in front of me.

BEET
Jan 30, 2006, 08:11 AM
That's the error message that means that slot is indeed fragged.

Are you still in warranty? I'm guessing not but fingers crossed.

If you're not in warranty, the most cost-effective way round this is to buy a 1GB stick and just use the top slot. However, I'm not sure what running too hot and everything else does for the overall longevity of the 'book.




Just realised I never replied to this. Suffice to say, I agree, it's probably a combo of factors that add up to the slot frying.

It's worth pointing out though, that the slot fried on mine long before it got near the duvet. It did actually go when the battery died completely while watching a DVD on the train with the powerbook sitting on the table in front of me.


Very unfortunately, it's not under guarantee by about 6 months. I had tried swopping the cards over which had worked (leaving the broken port empty). The I tried adding one of the original cards back into the empty (broken slot) which led to the pb not turning on. It now has both the original 256mb cards in, and will not switch on. So now I'm thinking that the faulty socket blew the ram cards - which would explain why neither socket is registering the ram?

I don't know! I'm blinded by a combination of rage, disappointment and general confusion.

discoforce
Jan 30, 2006, 09:18 AM
I don't know! I'm blinded by a combination of rage, disappointment and general confusion.

Doubt this will help with the disappointment and rage, but maybe the confusion:

I just received my 15 Powerbook (1.25 GHz) back from repair for this same issue. I had not installed any new ram, but the lower slot went kaput. Here's what they replaced:

1. PCBA, MLB - Pretty sure this is the main logic board
2. DSPL, 15.2 XGA - The display? :confused:
3. Foam Diffuser

In short, they replaced a lot of expensive parts. If I hadn't had Applecare I would have gone with ALBDamned's suggestion: Buy the biggest single ram card (don't skimp here) and put it in the slot that works. Then buy a laptop stand or cooling pad to reduce heat.

MacAficionado
Jan 30, 2006, 09:37 AM
My powerbook is within the range of affected PBs.

http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=303173

They are doing something about it.

AlBDamned
Jan 30, 2006, 09:59 AM
Very unfortunately, it's not under guarantee by about 6 months. I had tried swopping the cards over which had worked (leaving the broken port empty). The I tried adding one of the original cards back into the empty (broken slot) which led to the pb not turning on. It now has both the original 256mb cards in, and will not switch on. So now I'm thinking that the faulty socket blew the ram cards - which would explain why neither socket is registering the ram?

I don't know! I'm blinded by a combination of rage, disappointment and general confusion.


I have a spare, genuine Apple 256MB RAM stick that I'd be happy to donate to your cause for testing your top slot to see if it works. (Just don't put it in the lower slot - with that warning on the hardware test it's definitely fried!)

PM me your address and I'l send it out tomorrow.

BEET
Jan 30, 2006, 10:31 AM
I have a spare, genuine Apple 256MB RAM stick that I'd be happy to donate to your cause for testing your top slot to see if it works. (Just don't put it in the lower slot - with that warning on the hardware test it's definitely fried!)

PM me your address and I'l send it out tomorrow.


That's extremely generous. Forgive me for looking a gift horse in the mouth...... but you'd be willing to send me your pb ram for nothing?

AlBDamned
Jan 30, 2006, 11:09 AM
That's extremely generous. Forgive me for looking a gift horse in the mouth...... but you'd be willing to send me your pb ram for nothing?


Yes. It's a 256MB stick - I've got no use for it and it's not worth selling. If it would help you to diagnose your Powerbook then you're welcome to it. :)

BEET
Jan 30, 2006, 05:02 PM
I realise questions like the one I am going to ask, don't do much for my kudos, however.......

The lower RAM socket would be the one on top? (when my pb is upside down) and on the bottom when the correct way up?

shambolic
Jan 30, 2006, 05:14 PM
I realise questions like the one I am going to ask, don't do much for my kudos, however.......

The lower RAM socket would be the one on top? (when my pb is upside down) and on the bottom when the correct way up?

Other way around. Lower RAM slot is the one on the bottom when you open up the machine - in other words, if you have two sticks of RAM installed, you have to remove the upper one in order to get to the lower one.

If your PB came pre-installed from Apple with a single DIMM, it should be in the lower slot.

AlBDamned
Jan 31, 2006, 03:26 AM
Other way around. Lower RAM slot is the one on the bottom when you open up the machine - in other words, if you have two sticks of RAM installed, you have to remove the upper one in order to get to the lower one.

If your PB came pre-installed from Apple with a single DIMM, it should be in the lower slot.

Yep, the bottom slot is the one deepest.

BEET
Jan 31, 2006, 05:14 PM
ok, thanks.

BEET
Feb 10, 2006, 03:20 PM
Hi all, it's me again.

Just received the memory card, thanks loads AlBDamned! However, after reading carefully through the pdf instructions you posted and following them very carefully, I just tried to start up the damn powerbook and still get a single beep and the little sleep light. Does this mean that mean that I paid 1500 for a laptop that only lasted a year and a half?

I called apple the other day and spoke to them about the ram replacement scheme. They simply said I'd have to take my computer to the nearest apple dealer and pay them to check it out. I guess this is what I'm going to have to do. I'll just be even more bitter if I have to pay them 30 to tell me it's screwed.

thanks again for sending me the ram card.

discoforce
Feb 10, 2006, 04:29 PM
Hi all, it's me again.

Just received the memory card, thanks loads AlBDamned! However, after reading carefully through the pdf instructions you posted and following them very carefully, I just tried to start up the damn powerbook and still get a single beep and the little sleep light. Does this mean that mean that I paid 1500 for a laptop that only lasted a year and a half?

I called apple the other day and spoke to them about the ram replacement scheme. They simply said I'd have to take my computer to the nearest apple dealer and pay them to check it out. I guess this is what I'm going to have to do. I'll just be even more bitter if I have to pay them 30 to tell me it's screwed.

thanks again for sending me the ram card.

Yuck.

I would take it to an Apple store, be polite, but let them know that you've clearly got the same problem as the "covered" powerbooks. My pb (1.25) wouldn't be covered either, but it had the exact same problem. In my mind, this is a larger problem than they're accepting responsibility for just yet.

BEET
Feb 13, 2006, 04:44 PM
So I took my pb in to my local apple retailer, I had to pay them 25 to tell me the lower ram slot is fried. However, they did solve a bit of a problem, they told me that to enable my computer to run on ram from the upper slot there needs to be ram in the lower slot, even though it won't be used.
I'm managing to write this message from my currently working pb! I just really, really hope the upper slot lasts! No more leaving my computer on all night, or watching movies in bed.

The guy in the apple shop did confirm that my pb is suffering the same symptoms as is are specified on the ram replacement scheme, followed by re-confirming that my pb is not within the serial range. I have tried speaking to apple about this, and got put on hold for 20 minutes while a technical support guy tried to speak to a customer support guy, minutes past......and I got tired of waiting (plus I was at work). Gonna try and call again at the weekend.

maybe I'll be able to shed a little hope on this RAM problem.

missbhavens
Mar 24, 2006, 01:40 AM
My powerbook is within the range of affected PBs.

http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=303173

They are doing something about it.

Well, my PB ISN'T in that serial number range, and I couldn't be more angry about it.

b.

zach
Mar 24, 2006, 01:53 AM
i've had this issue for like a month now, couldn't be arsed to send it in though, far too busy and i still had 512 RAM.

i'm gonna do it tommorow though... question though. i've never sent in a computer for repair to apple: should i remove all software/files of dubious legality off it first, or does it not matter? i've already got backups JIC.

exeterbohemian
Mar 24, 2006, 02:22 AM
i had this same problem about a month ago. granted, my powerbook is still covered under warranty/applecare. nevertheless, i called applecare, they shipped me a box, i sent it in, and had it back in less than 4 days flat. apparently they replaced the entire logic board.

AlBDamned
Mar 24, 2006, 07:34 AM
i've had this issue for like a month now, couldn't be arsed to send it in though, far too busy and i still had 512 RAM.

i'm gonna do it tommorow though... question though. i've never sent in a computer for repair to apple: should i remove all software/files of dubious legality off it first, or does it not matter? i've already got backups JIC.

It'd probably be best to get rid of any "illegitimate" software. JIC ;).

I had this same problem about a month ago. granted, my powerbook is still covered under warranty/applecare. nevertheless, i called applecare, they shipped me a box, i sent it in, and had it back in less than 4 days flat. apparently they replaced the entire logic board.

That's right, the whole thing comes out. It'll cost you about 600/US$1,000 if it was out of warranty because its such a major component (and a fair bit of work too).

discoforce
Mar 24, 2006, 09:44 AM
i've had this issue for like a month now, couldn't be arsed to send it in though, far too busy and i still had 512 RAM.

i'm gonna do it tommorow though... question though. i've never sent in a computer for repair to apple: should i remove all software/files of dubious legality off it first, or does it not matter? i've already got backups JIC.

Are you asking if Apple is going to call the feds if they find illegal software on your computer? If you're worried about it, maybe you should buy the software :p

I might be wrong about this, but I thought that generally they don't even log into your user account to make repairs like this. When I took my computer in to an Apple Specialist for repair they just booted from an external HD. But I don't know what they did when they replaced my logic board. They did ask for my password...

hhlee
Mar 24, 2006, 05:28 PM
Joining the club here with my 1.25ghz 15''.

Called applecare and the local apple certified repair place.

Its $380 for applecare or $429 for the local repair place - this is the amount to replace the logic board for this very infamous design flaw.

But the new logic board is only under warranty for 90 days which means there's plenty of time for your new board to fry again! and thus playing another $400! Wahoo!

AlBDamned
Mar 24, 2006, 05:47 PM
Joining the club here with my 1.25ghz 15''.

Called applecare and the local apple certified repair place.

Its $380 for applecare or $429 for the local repair place - this is the amount to replace the logic board for this very infamous design flaw.

But the new logic board is only under warranty for 90 days which means there's plenty of time for your new board to fry again! and thus playing another $400! Wahoo!

Experience dictates that the 90-day warranted logic board will last somewhere between 92 and 97 days. Natch ;)

zach
Mar 24, 2006, 07:02 PM
Are you asking if Apple is going to call the feds if they find illegal software on your computer? If you're worried about it, maybe you should buy the software :p

I might be wrong about this, but I thought that generally they don't even log into your user account to make repairs like this. When I took my computer in to an Apple Specialist for repair they just booted from an external HD. But I don't know what they did when they replaced my logic board. They did ask for my password...

well, i don't really have any "illegal" or "pirated" software. like i said, it's kinda dubiously legal. what i'm really asking is they're not gonna probe deeply into my files or anything, are they? (or refuse me repairs because of something, etc).

airkarol
Mar 24, 2006, 07:51 PM
i got my logic board replaced on my old 1.67 powerbook, techknowsphere did it. the lower ram slot was dead. they did a great job.

discoforce
Mar 24, 2006, 10:53 PM
well, i don't really have any "illegal" or "pirated" software. like i said, it's kinda dubiously legal. what i'm really asking is they're not gonna probe deeply into my files or anything, are they? (or refuse me repairs because of something, etc).

I wish I knew. I'd assume that if they're working on your computer, they can see anything on your hard drive.

It reminds me of when I worked in a photo lab. When I told people about some of the photos I'd developed they were like: "People who process my film SEE MY PICTURES :eek:

That always made me laugh :p

discoforce
Mar 24, 2006, 10:53 PM
Experience dictates that the 90-day warranted logic board will last somewhere between 92 and 97 days. Natch ;)

I think that's a given. Get the applecare, and you can probably find it cheaper online.

AlBDamned
Mar 25, 2006, 05:01 AM
well, i don't really have any "illegal" or "pirated" software. like i said, it's kinda dubiously legal. what i'm really asking is they're not gonna probe deeply into my files or anything, are they? (or refuse me repairs because of something, etc).

Well, the first time my MLB went, I simply backed up and did a clean install, the reason being I didn't want the worry of them screwing with anything or losing anything. If there's nothing to screw up etc etc...

When the MLB the next time I just backed up and didn't erase things like my emails, all my browser cookies etc etc, or any of my software, though it was all ok, and they replaced my PowerBook completely. They cloned my HDD for the new one but I never saw the old PB again. I'm sure they probs just wiped its HDD and binned it, or just wiped it, but you never know. There also might be invasion of privacy laws or similar that would stop them from actually admitting they looked at your files...

In terms of "dubious" software, I assume you mean stuff like licenses that aren't actually yours or you've got from a friend or something like that. While I'd reiterate that all your software should be 100% legal ;), I don't think the feds will be knocking o your door if you've got (for example) the same copy of MS Office on more than one computer.

ClaphamChris
Mar 27, 2006, 05:33 AM
Looks like it's just happened to me too: 1.25Ghz 15".

1GB stick (Crucial) in the lower slot not being recognised, 512MB stick in the upper keeping me going.

Shame. It's been a fine machine for the two years I've had it. Suppose it's just going to force me over the edge to buy that Intel iMac I've put in my basket at Apple.com a hundred times....


Chris

danny_w
Apr 16, 2006, 03:04 PM
I also have a 15" pb with the lower ram slot failure. It is out of warranty (less than a month) but it thankfully was in the serial number range to qualify for the extension program and is now being repaired. I have read several pages of this and other similar posts, and I have noticed that several people have noted that the problem might be heat related. On this theory, I wonder how many with this problem habitually use their machines as desktop replacements, on ac and maximum cpu, and with the lid closed? Perhaps the failure is less likely if you routinely run on battery or reduced cpu, or with the case open? Since several have said that theirs was repaired only to return again later, I would like to do whatever I can to reduce the likelihood of a recurrence. I bought this pb to replace my mini as my main machine (but be portable when I needed it), but now I am beginning to get worried that I did the wrong thing.

CanadaRAM
Apr 16, 2006, 03:18 PM
well, i don't really have any "illegal" or "pirated" software. like i said, it's kinda dubiously legal. what i'm really asking is they're not gonna probe deeply into my files or anything, are they? (or refuse me repairs because of something, etc).
Assume that the technicians can see everything.
Assume that if there is anything REALLY illegal that they are obligated to inform law enforcement.
Assume that a motivated and unethical technician has the means and opportunity to scavenge your passwords, any autofill information, caches, browser history and possibly ID and charge card information.
Assume that someone will screw up and when they sell your machine as a refurb, the new owner will be able to unerase your data.

Assume that all of the above have happened at various times in the past...

discoforce
Apr 16, 2006, 04:10 PM
I also have a 15" pb with the lower ram slot failure. It is out of warranty (less than a month) but it thankfully was in the serial number range to qualify for the extension program and is now being repaired. I have read several pages of this and other similar posts, and I have noticed that several people have noted that the problem might be heat related. On this theory, I wonder how many with this problem habitually use their machines as desktop replacements, on ac and maximum cpu, and with the lid closed? Perhaps the failure is less likely if you routinely run on battery or reduced cpu, or with the case open? Since several have said that theirs was repaired only to return again later, I would like to do whatever I can to reduce the likelihood of a recurrence. I bought this pb to replace my mini as my main machine (but be portable when I needed it), but now I am beginning to get worried that I did the wrong thing.

I never ran my powerbook with the lid closed, and it happened to me. I also always use my fancy rain design iLap to protect both my data any my... potential offspring. :rolleyes:

That's an interesting theory that the pb might get hotter with the lid closed. You should be able to easily test by comparing temperature readings (http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/19994) with it open and closed.

LastLine
Apr 16, 2006, 04:12 PM
Hm, suppose I should nip check my brothers Pbook for the serial number range

danny_w
May 1, 2006, 06:37 PM
I just had mine repaired (first time) a short while ago, but am starting to get worried by all of the posts that I see regarding problems with the PowerBooks, esp. the 15" which I have. This is my first Apple laptop, and I bought it (used) to replace my trusted mini. I knew about the lower memory slot failure and the battery recall before I bought the system, and Apple handled both of them promptly and courteously. All is now working fine, but I am worried about whether I did the right thing. Should I keep it in the hopes that nothing else will happen to it, or should I sell it and keep my mini (it has never given me any trouble in over a year of use)? I am pretty sure that I could sell it for a good deal more than I paid for it, if I do it soon.

mellvik
Apr 12, 2007, 02:58 AM
Hi,
I noticed that this thread has been idle for a while, but still - her are my 2¢ worth:
The lower socket problem seems to be physical, at least it is in my case. If I insert a memory card in the lower socket without pushing it into place, the machine boots and everything works fine. When pushing the card down into its locked position, it no longer works, I get the famous 3 beeps.

After trying all kinds of tricks to clean the slot, apply pressure to the memory module and whatever, I have given up. And the machine is outside of the series that Apple is willing to fix. Finally: Yes, the problem appeared just yesterday, when I was replacing the original 512MB module with 2x1GB modules. I do have more memory now, but only half of what I wanted, paid for - and should have.

Icewind
Apr 25, 2007, 07:14 AM
Hi,
I noticed that this thread has been idle for a while, but still - her are my 2¢ worth:
The lower socket problem seems to be physical, at least it is in my case. If I insert a memory card in the lower socket without pushing it into place, the machine boots and everything works fine. When pushing the card down into its locked position, it no longer works, I get the famous 3 beeps.

After trying all kinds of tricks to clean the slot, apply pressure to the memory module and whatever, I have given up. And the machine is outside of the series that Apple is willing to fix. Finally: Yes, the problem appeared just yesterday, when I was replacing the original 512MB module with 2x1GB modules. I do have more memory now, but only half of what I wanted, paid for - and should have.

My Powerbook is now experiencing a lower RAM slot failure too. It's been running for over 1.5 years with the 2 slots filled and I've had zero problems. Strangely enough, I think this problem started around the time I updated to 10.4.9. I could be wrong, but the timeframe certainly matches.

The problem is as follows: If I have the two slots filled, I can boot the PB up and all is well for a short period of time. I would say within maybe 30 minutes, the PB must suffer a kernal panic (though I've not actually caught this visually) and shuts itself down. When I reboot the PB, it will boot up fine, but on checking the System Profiler, I see that Lower Slot appears to be empty and I only have half my RAM. If I try removing the upper slot ram and reboot with only the lower slot ram in place, I get three beeps and the sleep light will shine brightly but nothing else happens (black screen). I then have to remove the battery to power the PB down and then move the RAM from the lower slot to the upper slot and everything works fine again.

Has anyone else experienced this problem on a 15" Powerbook since 10.4.9 was released? I would be interested to hear.

P.S. It's definitely NOT the actual memory module, as I've tested both out individually in the upper slot and both work perfectly. It's only when there is one in the lower slot that the problem appears. Also, I am aware that Apple had a recall on 15" Powerbooks for a lower ram slot failure, but my PB serial number is not in the range specified in the Apple Recall Document.

danny_w
Apr 25, 2007, 08:33 AM
My Powerbook is now experiencing a lower RAM slot failure too. It's been running for over 1.5 years with the 2 slots filled and I've had zero problems. Strangely enough, I think this problem started around the time I updated to 10.4.9. I could be wrong, but the timeframe certainly matches.

The problem is as follows: If I have the two slots filled, I can boot the PB up and all is well for a short period of time. I would say within maybe 30 minutes, the PB must suffer a kernal panic (though I've not actually caught this visually) and shuts itself down. When I reboot the PB, it will boot up fine, but on checking the System Profiler, I see that Lower Slot appears to be empty and I only have half my RAM. If I try removing the upper slot ram and reboot with only the lower slot ram in place, I get three beeps and the sleep light will shine brightly but nothing else happens (black screen). I then have to remove the battery to power the PB down and then move the RAM from the lower slot to the upper slot and everything works fine again.

Has anyone else experienced this problem on a 15" Powerbook since 10.4.9 was released? I would be interested to hear.

P.S. It's definitely NOT the actual memory module, as I've tested both out individually in the upper slot and both work perfectly. It's only when there is one in the lower slot that the problem appears. Also, I am aware that Apple had a recall on 15" Powerbooks for a lower ram slot failure, but my PN serial number is not in the range specified in the Apple Recall Document.
This pretty much agrees with what others have been posting all along. The cause of the failure may not be the software update per se, but is more likely related to the extra heat generated when the processor is working hard to install the update. Several others have also said that the problem occurred just after a software update. After I had mine fixed, I always took the precaution of unplugging all peripherals, making certain that it was plugged into AC, elevating the pb off the desk, and setting the cpu to reduced power before installing the update.

Icewind
Apr 25, 2007, 09:43 AM
Thanks for the reply Danny. So, basically what you are saying is that the update caused extreme workload on the PB and as a result, this has damaged the Logic Board (which I think houses the RAM slots)? That's pretty shocking if you're correct!

I was thinking about archiving my PB and then reinstalling a clean OS from the Install Disks, then updating to 10.4.8 if possible. I would then test the PB running with the two slots filled for a while to see if the problem occurs again. If not, I will install the 10.4.9 update again and continue testing the two slots. The only thing stopping me doing this is that it's going to be major hassle, as my PB is my main machine really and it's got absolutely everything I have worked on for the past 1.5 years on it (I have a full system backup on external FW drive, so my work is safe in that respect). It's just so much hassle :(

If it is indeed a hardware issue on the lower slot, then I still have until 28th August before my 2 year warranty runs out (I got 2 years standard warranty from the place I purchased it from, so should be ok for a fix).

Mpulsive81
Apr 25, 2007, 11:40 AM
Suppose it's just going to force me over the edge to buy that Intel iMac I've put in my basket at Apple.com a hundred times....

WHEW! I'm not the only one who does stuff like that. Ok I feel better now. Carry on.

tjlazer
Jun 2, 2007, 06:12 PM
I am now also a victim of this problem. My 1.5 year old PB 1.67 with two factory installed 512MB SoDIMMs had the lower slot fail. It was just as IceWind said, and now it seems the lower slot is completely dead. I ended up buying a 1GB SoDIMM for the top slot and all is well so far. I also just updated to 10.4.9 recently! It must be a heat issue as my PB Is running HOT! 135F right now, with it elevated off desk too... Not happy, since my S/N range is right outside the range for the repairs I sent a letter to Apple about this, lets see what happens.

Thirteenva
Aug 18, 2007, 12:36 PM
I hate bringing old threads back from the dead but I recently noticed that my 1ghz Al powerbook was reporting the lower ram slot as empty.

I decided to open the ram door, pull the ram out and insert both sticks back into place. The ram was then recognized again. However, after about an hour i experienced a lock-up while surfing the web and had to force reboot the computer. When the computer booted back up it again said the lower ram slot was empty. I again shut down and removed both sticks of ram, swapped their position and rebooted. The ram slot was again active but after about an hour and a half i had another complete lockup and had to force reboot.

My 1ghz is not part of apples extended repair program. Is there anything I can do to remedy this on my own?

nsbio
Aug 18, 2007, 12:46 PM
I hate bringing old threads back from the dead but I recently noticed that my 1ghz Al powerbook was reporting the lower ram slot as empty.

I decided to open the ram door, pull the ram out and insert both sticks back into place. The ram was then recognized again. However, after about an hour i experienced a lock-up while surfing the web and had to force reboot the computer. When the computer booted back up it again said the lower ram slot was empty. I again shut down and removed both sticks of ram, swapped their position and rebooted. The ram slot was again active but after about an hour and a half i had another complete lockup and had to force reboot.

My 1ghz is not part of apples extended repair program. Is there anything I can do to remedy this on my own?

If you want to have both working slots, the only remedy is to replace the logic board. If you can live with one slot, removing the lower slot chip will restore the PB's functionality. You might try to beg Apple to fix the computer for you but do not count on it.

Steve Jobs - and only Steve Jobs, not you - knows what you want and you have very little say in it: if he says that 1Ghz machines are not affected by the memory slot failure, then they are not affected, and if you say that your PB is affected, then you are hallucinating - end of story.

ale500
Aug 19, 2007, 01:14 AM
As you may not want to spend >$400 in a new logic board, may be you can get it repaired somewhere else:

If the problem is physical one, you can get a new socket, unsolder the old one and solder the new one.

But, if the socket is in good shape... then, the only way is a new logic board :-(

ykmv

Dublin
Aug 19, 2007, 06:12 PM
Since someone re-opened this thread I'd like to ask a question that no one with the bad ram slot has. With the Aluminum PB work with (1) 2GB SoDIMM in the upper slot, since the machine lists 2GB as max. Or is it restricted by 1GB per slot, since there are no specs stating 1GB slot 0 and 1GB slot 1 and I have seen various configurations of mix/match would (1) 2GB work.

Thirteenva
Aug 26, 2007, 02:25 PM
Since someone re-opened this thread I'd like to ask a question that no one with the bad ram slot has. With the Aluminum PB work with (1) 2GB SoDIMM in the upper slot, since the machine lists 2GB as max. Or is it restricted by 1GB per slot, since there are no specs stating 1GB slot 0 and 1GB slot 1 and I have seen various configurations of mix/match would (1) 2GB work.

Based on my research is 1GB per slot. I also have not been able to even locate a 2GB stick for the computer to even give it a try.

Thirteenva
Aug 26, 2007, 02:26 PM
If it's believed that this is somehow a firmware issue... would restoring back to factory defaults using the DVD's that came with the powerbook solve this?

Dublin
Aug 26, 2007, 02:44 PM
Thirteenva, yah they make a 2GB around $110 bucks. As for being a firmware issue I have my doubts. The PB I have the slot issue with, is actually about 5 donor PB's reassembled. The logic board was previously found to have the bad slot. After assembly original installation disks were used to get her up and running. I also have a 1.33 logic board with the same condition, although is is intermittent and shows up about every 4th restart.

CanadaRAM
Aug 26, 2007, 04:01 PM
Thirteenva, yah they make a 2GB around $110 bucks.

The Powerbook G4's will not support a PC2700 2 Gb SODIMM, even if you could find one.

zeebaholst
Aug 28, 2007, 08:20 AM
Your not alone.

Apple are behaving terribly on this issue.

I have been through 3 logic boards this year. My powerbook has spent over 4 months in service being repaired.

I have tried every way to contact Apple Australia via phone, emails, faxes, writing letters they just ignore me. Taking it to an Apple center just get the response its going to cost me $1200 to fix it. I know now 3 times that it will not be fixed.

i am out of warrantee and its still broken and not of my doing. I believe it was the upgrade to 10.4 others have a different view of the reason. Suffice to say it a design flaw.

There is a class action and i urge you to submit you details to the firm handling the issue.


Class Action against Apple.

US Law firm Wolf Popper LLP have just issued a class action against Apple Inc. for all of us who have this problem and Apple refuses to help and acknowledge there is a problem at all.

In August 2005, we filed a class action complaint against Apple Computer, Inc. on behalf of all purchasers of Apple PowerBook G4 laptops alleging defects with the lower memory slot. In October 2005, defendant answered the complaint. There is an initial pretrial hearing scheduled with the Court on January 13, 2006. Prior to that, there is a meet and confer between the attorneys for the parties to discuss scheduling of discovery and other matters.

People with this lower ram slot problem need to register with them and list the specific extent of the problem they are having.

Got to: http://lowermemoryslot.editkid.com/ and follow the links!

This is what we have been all waiting for! Viva the revolution!

Hey superflymutha ---

Am Curious to know how you got on with the Law and this issue.

I recently signed the petition, and sent snailmail letters to Apple, the Attorney Gen of Calif. and other Consumer groups in U.S., U.K. and Europe.

Today I got a call from Apple Ireland, but have been declined a repair - outside of the Ser. No. Range - although as you mention, these repairs seem only to be temporary.

What a mess.

Do you know if there was any settlement to this case in the courts? -- or what the current situ. is? I'd be curious if you had any info.

thanks in adv.

John.

Thirteenva
Aug 29, 2007, 07:22 PM
As for being a firmware issue I have my doubts. The PB I have the slot issue with, is actually about 5 donor PB's reassembled. The logic board was previously found to have the bad slot. After assembly original installation disks were used to get her up and running.

If I understand you correctly, you're saying that on this powerbook the logic board (which previously had a bad lower slot) is now functioning properly after a completely fresh reinstall?

How did you handle the supposed 10.4.x updates that supposedly caused this issue?

Can anyone else confirm that they were successfully able to remedy the issue after a fresh install? I'm willing try it with mine since the slot seems to come back to life if i remove and then snap the ram back in place, but the reinstall is a time consuming process and would only like to attempt it assuming that this has worked for others.

TitanJeff
Jan 15, 2008, 10:26 AM
I'd love to know this as well as I am among those 1.5 GHz Powerbook owners who lost the lower memory slot. My serial number starts 8433 so I am SOL on getting a free repair.

If this worked, I would have thought Apple would have released this information. Or is that admitting fault?

FYI, if you experience this issue, please sign the petition at:
http://lowermemoryslot.editkid.com/

Nearly 4,000 strong.

jtonline99
Feb 24, 2008, 05:09 AM
i just discovered this happened to me today. i had performed a hdd replacement prior, my powerbook was dead prior to this for a couple of weeks. at first i thought the ram was fried, but both sticks work fine in the upper slot. then i thought maybe i fried the slot when i reinstalled the hdd. doesnt appear so. checking in open firmware, the ram is still detected and the information on the dimm is there. it appears open firmware isnt mapping the first dimm to any address space.

you can find out if your open firmware is detecting two modules by typing:

dev /memory <cr>
.properties <cr>

this will list details on installed memory.

refer to the following apple tech note for more information:
http://developer.apple.com/qa/qa2001/qa1099.html

i am unsure of why this is. i hope this information is of use to someone more tech savvy.

jtonline99
Feb 26, 2008, 03:59 AM
here is a solution to the problem, sort of.

i confirmed my lower slot is not fried by starting up with a single dimm in the lower slot. however it still will not recognize the lower dimm if there is memory in both the upper and lower. this may be different to what others are experiencing so your mileage may vary.

####NOTE THIS INVOLVES THE USAGE OF OPEN FIRMWARE, YOU COULD PERMANENTLY DAMAGE YOUR MACHINE FOLLOWING THIS PRODECURE SO
PERFORM AT YOUR OWN RISK, I WILL NOT BE HELD LIABLE####

anyway as i said, my powerbook was physically detecting the ram in open firmware, simply not mapping it to any address space.

logic dictates that if the ram isn't properly mapped to an address, it will not be visible in mac os x. thus the ability to artifically reduce the size of your system ram in open firmware by changing these mappings.

1). first of all a note about module sizes. sizes appear to be in hex.
- 10000000 = 256mb
- 20000000 = 512mb
- 40000000 = 1gb
- and so forth...

you need to use the sizes above to map your ram to relavent address space.

2). next boot into open firmware.
do this by holding cmd+opt+o+f just after the boot chime of your macintosh.

3). this will bring you to the white open firmware prompt "0>". from here you need to navigate to the memory device tree by

typing:

0> dev /memory

4). to display the details about the current memory mappings type:

0> .properties

5). this is an example of how i mapped my powerbooks memory modules to address space.

0> 0 encode-int 10000000 encode-int encode+
2> 10000000 encode-int 40000000 encode-int encode+
4> encode+
2> " reg" delete-property
2> " reg" property
0> mac-boot

the first line loads onto the OF stack the location of my first memory module. in this case it starts at address space 0 and is 10000000 (256mb) in size.

the second loads my second memory module onto the stack starting at address 10000000 (directly after the first module) and is 40000000 (1gb) in size.

the third line encodes the two lines above together on the stack.

the fourth line deletes the current address space mappings (the contents of the " reg" property).

the fifth pops my new memory mappings off the stack and onto the " reg" property.

finally the last line starts the boot process for your mac. check system profiler and both dimms should be registering now.

6). There are two problems I can see with the use of this method. First of all it is not persistant, when you reboot your machine these mappings will be lost and you will be back to square one. Second, and this is the biggie, why is open firmware not doing its job and mapping both modules properly! is there a problem with it gauging the size of the memory in the lower slot when two modules are installed (i.e. faulty module)? or is this just a firmware bug?

Anybody have any answers? Anybody at all???