Apple 2 button mouse?

[crossed-over]

Anyone know if a 2 button mouse is in development or on the agenda for Apple anytime soon? I love the sensitivity of my Apple pro mouse, but would prefer a 2 button mouse for playing games. I'm just wondering whether or not to hold out for an Apple 2 button mouse (if one is in the making) or just go out and buy a 3rd party mouse (if there's no such thing in the foreseeable future for Apple). Any recommendations for a 3rd party brand?

Thanks.

[Computer_Phreak]

i doubt apple will make a 2 button mouse soon, but i bought a 2 button mouse with a scrollwheel that I like a lot.

Its a Logitech optical mouse,
M-BJ58

Its about $20

[strider42]

Originally posted by crossed-over
Anyone know if a 2 button mouse is in development or on the agenda for Apple anytime soon? I love the sensitivity of my Apple pro mouse, but would prefer a 2 button mouse for playing games. I'm just wondering whether or not to hold out for an Apple 2 button mouse (if one is in the making) or just go out and buy a 3rd party mouse (if there's no such thing in the foreseeable future for Apple). Any recommendations for a 3rd party brand?

Thanks.

I wouldn't be surprised by one, but I don't expect one. Mac OS has never been made to require a two button mouse, and for new users, its just easier.

Go buy a third party mouse. It will be cheaper and offer more functions than anything apple would make anyway probably (the pro mouse is way expensive for what it is). I got an optical Ms trackball with scroll wheel, two buttons and forward and back buttons for about the same cost as the apple pro mouse, and even that is really expensive for everything I got (I only got it because it fits by hand nicely).

Think what you want about MS, but their input products are top notch. Kensington is good as well. Logitech drags its feet on mac support.

[blackpeter]

Originally posted by strider42

Logitech drags its feet on mac support.

My Wireless Mouseman Optical was fully supported under OS 9 and ran just fine under OS X for months without any software support from Logitech. Now that Logitech has software controllers for X, it runs even better.

I just like it's feel over the MS options. Not to mention that they are from, um... M$! ;)

[gandalf55]

3rd party hardware is the way to go (exception ** i love my pro keyboard **). i have about 8 mice, and i do enjoy the pro mouse very much (can't game with it though.) my gaming mouse right now is a logitech optical job with buttons all over it and a scrollwheel. most of my mice are logitech (even a tiny one for my laptop), logitech rocks. i bought a kennsington once and it was the worst piece of crud i ever purchased. it's not even worth the price of a 6" cat 5 patch cable...

oh... and i have a griffin technology powermate and it kicks mucho asso.

[topicolo]

I wonder when Apple will admit that they were seriously wrong in staying with a single button mouse for all these years? Every other modern platform I can think of has standardized on 2+ button mice. (solaris/unix, windoze, linux, etc).
Hell, OS X even supports 3 buttons natively. Why won't apple just release the damned thing?
I guess Apple just has too much pride to admit they're wrong. :mad:

[vniow]

I doubt they'll actually make a 2-button mouse, but I would like tp see them make a 3rd party one as a BTO or something, just to give you the option.

[Spike Spiegel]

the Contour Design UniMouse is great(the optical, scroll wheel version) its got a great shape and is very customizable.

[shadowfax]

i dropped superca$h for the kensington studio mouse.
it's optical and has a scroll sensor *not a wheel*

it's absolutely out of this world. takes some getting used to, but is very configurable. i enjoy using it, and it goes with a powermac or iMac as far as looks go quite seamlessly. prima, prima, but as i said, much money. 50-60$

[medea]

check out macally's icemouse and icemouse jr, http://www.macally.com/

[JupiterZen]

Any recommendations for a 3rd party brand?


Just had the same problem choosing when I heard the idea of bluetooth mice and keyboards (maybe even by Apple).

But I got out and bought the latest Logitech MX700 cordless optical mouse. And I must say: IT ROCKS!!! ;-)

And the design goes really well with my black pro keyboard and 17" tft studio display. I would have bought a Logitech cordless/optical mouse earlier if the previous models wouldn't have been so damn ugly (especially the color).

[funkywhat2]

if they did make a two button mouse, it would probobly be sold only to pro users, like the editing keyboard was. they could make it programable, or build in with a programable scroll wheel, so zooming in and out or moving forward in a timeline, or something. Most likely not wiht the idea of scrolling long web pages (besides, a lot of scroll mouse users use the directional keys to look at web pages; i know i do!)

[Hemingray]

Originally posted by Shadowfax
i dropped superca$h for the kensington studio mouse.
it's optical and has a scroll sensor *not a wheel*

it's absolutely out of this world. takes some getting used to, but is very configurable. i enjoy using it, and it goes with a powermac or iMac as far as looks go quite seamlessly. prima, prima, but as i said, much money. 50-60$

That's not any more than the Apple mouse! And you get more buttons and a scroll sensor to boot.

To me, the sensible purchase would definitely be that over the Apple mouse. Like I've said many times whenever a mouse thread comes up, since I've moved on to the three-button mouse with scroll wheel, I'll never go back.

[cosmicsoftceo]

No, Apple is right. One of the most confusing things for new users/non computer users is the two-button mouse. It's best to keep things simple. The idea behind Macintosh was the "noun, then verb" philosophy. First, you select an object (the noun) then the verb (the menu item). A two-button mouse blurs that philosophy. Also, there's the problem of confusing interfaces with the two-button mouse. If you right click-drag a file on Windows, you get a completely different menu that says "Copy Here, Move Here, Cancel". That confuses even me. Sure, you get it, I get it, but 80% of people just don't get it and never use the right mouse button. If you want a two-button mouse, buy it on your own.

Just because others support it doesn't mean it's good. Every other platform has "standardized" on big, bulky machines that take up way to much room and sound like jet engines. That doesn't mean Mac should. The whole point of Macintosh is to "think different".

Just my viewpoint.

Originally posted by topicolo
I wonder when Apple will admit that they were seriously wrong in staying with a single button mouse for all these years? Every other modern platform I can think of has standardized on 2+ button mice. (solaris/unix, windoze, linux, etc).
Hell, OS X even supports 3 buttons natively. Why won't apple just release the damned thing?
I guess Apple just has too much pride to admit they're wrong. :mad:

[{1984}]

i don;t think Apple will make a mouse, but there is a third party 2 button mose with scroll wheel that looks a lot like the pro mouse... i have it, very nice... The third party pro mouse... (http://www.colorcase.com/crysneonopmo2.html)

[vniow]

Originally posted by cosmicsoftceo


Just because others support it doesn't mean it's good. Every other platform has "standardized" on big, bulky machines that take up way to much room and sound like jet engines. That doesn't mean Mac should. The whole point of Macintosh is to "think different".

Just my viewpoint.




Think Different, yes, but different doesn't always mean better.
I for one HATE the Apple mouse, control clicking is way more frustrating than right clicking, I'm always pushing a bit too hard so I accidentally click on something I don't want to click on and it's got no scroll wheel which I find to be really inconvienent now that every other mouse I've used has had one.

They can keep making it for all I care, what they should do is make a 2-button/scroll wheel counterpart as an option which would surely cannabalize 1 button sales, but I couldn't give a rat's ass.

And even to new computer users, having another button with another function isn't that heard to learn, they're going to be using the left button mostly anywayz, so I don't see what all the fuss is about.
And remember that those additional menus are also in OSX.

I think it is pride, they've made a big deal abouut the Mac simpler and easier to use and the 1 button mouse is supposed to represent that to a certain extent, but I find it simpler and easier with a full features 2 button scroll wheel mouse.:)

[Pepzhez]

I really don't believe that anyone, including a person who has never before touched a computer, is going to become consternated when confronted with the alleged intracacies of a 2-button mouse. The stubborn committment to the 1-button mouse is Apple's arrogance, plain and simple. It is rather condescending also, i.e. - "computer users can't possibly figure out the use and functions of two buttons!" The manipulation and use of a pen or pencil is far more involved than the operation of any multi-button mouse, and I am fairly 100% certain that any new computer user knows how to write!

(Not to mention that control-clicking is far more cumbersome than right clicking, and right clicking is more easily intuitive, no doubt about that.)

The real reason that Apple will not be introducing a 2-button mouse any time soon (if ever) is that Apple apps do not take advantage of right clicking, unfortunately. Including a 2-button mouse as a stock item would only highlight a limitation on Apple apps.

I've recently switched to a Logitech Marble Mouse - a 4-button optical trackball that can be had for around $25 (I highly recommend the Marble Mouse). Immediately after plugging it in, I can't believe that I ever got anything done with the Apple Pro Mouse. Why in the world did I stick with that thing for so long? Now I only wish that Final Cut Pro had right clicking features. That would make things even faster.

Oh, and if you are planning to run *nix apps on OS X, a 2-button mouse is an absolute necessity. I use the GIMP as a Photoshop alternative, and I defy anyone to make much use out of this app if you are using the Apple Pro Mouse. Unless, of course, you enjoy performing approximately 100 control-click operations every couple of minutes.

I'll never go back to a one-button mouse either.

[Pepzhez]

And I should also add that a every single Windows user (and let's face it, that's what most people are) is familiar with the (at least) 2-button mouse. Do you know what is the number one complaint I have heard from people who I have convinced to swith to Mac? They love everything about the Mac and the OS, but they always say that they can't stand the one button mouse! As a friend of mine told me last week, right after purchasing a new imac (she was always a Windows user prior to this), "I love almost everything about this machine. The computer itself and OS X make me feel like I am 20 years into the future. But that damn single button mouse brings me back to 1960!"

Since Tuesday was her birthday, I went out and bought her a 4-button Logitech mouse. Now she is completely satisfied with her Mac.

If you really want more people to switch to Apple, the mouse issue is a serious issue to consider.

[medea]

Originally posted by Pepzhez
I really don't believe that anyone, including a person who has never before touched a computer, is going to become consternated when confronted with the alleged intracacies of a 2-button mouse.

Well don't be surprised, when I was doing ISP support I had all kinds of problems with people and mice, like people trying to use their mouse as a foot pedal, and as one infamous story goes "the customer kept saying that he cant doubleclick on the icon because everytime he tries he cant see the icon any more......turns out he was placing the mouse on the monitor when trying to click on the icon....."
both of these are sooo true that it is almost not funny.

[edit]oh and I love my apple pro mouse in all it's one-button glory"[edit]

[hesdeadjim]

I actually like the one button mouse to a point. My whole family (immediate family of 8) are pc users except me and my brother. And you know what, only one uses the second button regurally and that is only for games. Hell, even my GF, a recent switcher never used the second button. The truth is, most PC users, except pro users, use the second button.

That being said, once one gets used to the second button, its hard to go back. Ask any mac user who has switched from a one button mouse and I bet they wouldn't go back.

One last thing, every standard mouse I used with a PC, I didn't enjoy. When I was a PC user, I ended up going out and buying a better mouse anyway, so I just see it as part of the computer world.

[SilvorX]

the only time i ever want a 2nd button is when im using mozilla, and the macs i use daily (old candy imacs) have a cruddy ctrl key :(
2nd button wouldnt be needed on a mac any time soon for most ppl, but i'll probably be using my m$ mouse tho when i get my mac since i spent lots of money on it n its the ONLY ms product that hasnt caused any troubles on me yet lol

[MacBandit]

I'm glad someone started a thread on mice I've had a question for a while. I've been considering a mouse with a scroll wheel. I could care less about a second button. But here's the deal I'm a gamer and I'm wondering if there is anything to the high dpi rates of the Razer Boomslang mice. I don't want to spend my money on another mouse without know this. Any help would be nice espcially input if you have one or have used one on a mac.

[j763]

Go buy a logitech and get over it!!!

surely there's something better to discuss than computer mice?

[APPLEP58]

FIRST OF ALL:

Apple doesn't MAKE your mouse, The designed NOTHING but the asthetics;

Second: You most likely already own a Logitech mouse, or a Fujitsu, don't believe me?

CHECK YOUR SYSTEM PROFILER! go into the USB section, look under the vendor information, most Apple USB keyboards and Mice are made by Fujitsu, newer models are made by Logitech; there is no visible difference, only the serial number will tell it apart aside from teh Profiler, you'll also be pleased to know that the Apple "pro" mouse also works on a PC just as well, and vice versa for USB mice.

[nixd2001]

Originally posted by topicolo
I wonder when Apple will admit that they were seriously wrong in staying with a single button mouse for all these years? Every other modern platform I can think of has standardized on 2+ button mice. (solaris/unix, windoze, linux, etc).
Hell, OS X even supports 3 buttons natively. Why won't apple just release the damned thing?
I guess Apple just has too much pride to admit they're wrong. :mad:

If only the world was as simple as there being a "right" number of mouse buttons, along with a clear logical test that one could apply that demonstrated that N buttons was the only "right" answer. If there are more mice with 2 buttons than 1, it doesn't follow in logic (even if it might in less rigorous disciplines such as consumer opinion) that therefore 2 is the right answer and 1 is the wrong answer. Is 2 the right answer or 3? if you go for 2, what's the third button for? If you go for 3, what if you've only got 2 buttons (and I don't count clicking both at once as being a quality design decision). The old Atari ST supported 16 buttons at the software layer - was the ST right?

It's easy to say you'd personally rather have more mouse buttons. But it doesn't mean one number is wrong and another number is right - that's just the way of the world.

[benixau]

Originally posted by APPLEP58
you'll also be pleased to know that the Apple "pro" mouse also works on a PC just as well, and vice versa for USB mice.


Thats too right. If apple made their own keyboards, then, it wouldn't work with a pc. They would make sure of it. Fujitsu on the other hand, doesnt care. Oh what fun you can have trying to get context menus on a pc with the apple pro mouse attached.

I also personally believe that you can have too many buttons. I have a simple MS wheel mouse optical on the pc and it is plenty. I dont need a button for each app. I can lcik the scroll whell for a third button. The thing is, a basic user, with little computer knowledge loves a one button design. You cant click the wrong one. Context menus are beyond them, they surf, email, use iApps, use Appleworks, maybe play simcity 3000 but not much else. Anyone else who is beyond that*, who uses MS Office and knows a few tricks, most likely knows some or more of excel's functions, and how to (OSX 10.0+) navigate and start an app with the terminal, needs a two button mouse. no question.


*you know your 'beyond that' when you accept that a computer can not make mistakes. Only people make mistakes. Peoples mistakes cause the computer to give out garbage.

[MacBandit]

Originally posted by j763
Go buy a logitech and get over it!!!

surely there's something better to discuss than computer mice?


There's no need for rude, useless posting. If you don't have something useful to add then don't post. Some people have legitimate questions and there are a lot more useless dicussions going on then ones about mice.

[Fat Tony]

I just purchased Logitech's new MX 500 yesterday at CompUSA. All the cordless 700s were already sold out, but were about 35-40 more dollars anyway. The functionality and shape were exactly the same, so if you don't have the cash I highly recommend the MX 500. It has every possible button you could want (which you can also program through Logitech's downloadable Control Center). Very comfortable too, but they've pretty much screwed any leftys out there...

[JSRockit]

Originally posted by Shadowfax
i dropped superca$h for the kensington studio mouse.
it's optical and has a scroll sensor *not a wheel*

it's absolutely out of this world. takes some getting used to, but is very configurable. i enjoy using it, and it goes with a powermac or iMac as far as looks go quite seamlessly. prima, prima, but as i said, much money. 50-60$

I have one too...and love it. I like the Pro Mouse as well. I like that the whole mouse is the button. It is soooo lazy.

[benixau]

When i showed some friends the pro mouse they asked "where is the button?" Oh, that, old stuff, the whole mouse is the button, optical too.
Response: "Cool ....." - continue to stare and now touch and play a little before i tell them that i would rather they didnt use my computer like a toy. (ok ok ok, so i had chess up but still office was in the background ...)

[topicolo]

Sometimes I wonder if apple does any useability testing with their products at all--the hockey puck mouse that came with the original imac was the most horrendous thing every made! how does apple expect people to hold that tiny little puck for hours and not get irritated by it?

[alex_ant]

Originally posted by Pepzhez
I really don't believe that anyone, including a person who has never before touched a computer, is going to become consternated when confronted with the alleged intracacies of a 2-button mouse. The stubborn committment to the 1-button mouse is Apple's arrogance, plain and simple. It is rather condescending also, i.e. - "computer users can't possibly figure out the use and functions of two buttons!"
I don't really think it's condescending. It's not like Apple is saying, "Let's give our users a nice GUI because they're much too stupid to learn the intricacies of tcsh!" Having one button just makes things a little easier for a good portion of the users Apple is aiming their machines at. However, Apple does recognize that a 1-button mouse is not suitable for everyone, and that's why they support all standard multi-button USB mice.
The real reason that Apple will not be introducing a 2-button mouse any time soon (if ever) is that Apple apps do not take advantage of right clicking, unfortunately. Including a 2-button mouse as a stock item would only highlight a limitation on Apple apps.
Except... they do take advantage of right-clicking. And the scroll wheel. I've never used FCP, but you say it doesn't support any of that - that would be the one Apple app I know of that doesn't, and I would expect that that feature would be coming soon.
Oh, and if you are planning to run *nix apps on OS X, a 2-button mouse is an absolute necessity. I use the GIMP as a Photoshop alternative, and I defy anyone to make much use out of this app if you are using the Apple Pro Mouse. Unless, of course, you enjoy performing approximately 100 control-click operations every couple of minutes.
This is true.

[dricci]

Originally posted by topicolo
I wonder when Apple will admit that they were seriously wrong in staying with a single button mouse for all these years?

They won't, because they're not. Apple is doing the right thing by making one-button default... I know several PC users who are scared of their right mouse button, they never even use it unless required.... the beauty of the Mac is that you just need one button for basic tasks, and 2 gives you a little more... But have you ever tried explaining the 2nd button to somebody new to computers? "No. no you can't use it for that, only to get more options... no it doesn't do that." Then they just get a puzzled look on their face and it really slows down the whole learning process of the machine, which should really just be about learning the basics of using a computer, not spending the entire time on Mouse Basics 101.

Of course, I use a 2 button mouse (part of my Wacom tablet) but I have used the Pro Mouse for a long time before I got the Tablet.... It was just easier to have one mouse on the tablet than manage a pro mouse and a tablet at the same time in a small desk area.

Now I wouldn't be opposed to a BTO option for a 2 button mouse, that would be nice for people who really wanted more buttons.

[MacBandit]

Originally posted by Pepzhez
The real reason that Apple will not be introducing a 2-button mouse any time soon (if ever) is that Apple apps do not take advantage of right clicking, unfortunately. Including a 2-button mouse as a stock item would only highlight a limitation on Apple apps.


What do you mean they don't take advantage of it? I have been using right clicking using the control key on the keyboard since 8.x came out with contextual menus.

[MacBandit]

Originally posted by topicolo
Sometimes I wonder if apple does any useability testing with their products at all--the hockey puck mouse that came with the original imac was the most horrendous thing every made! how does apple expect people to hold that tiny little puck for hours and not get irritated by it?

I too initially hated my hocky-puck mouse but after a while I got use to it and eventually learned to love it. I now have a new computer with the new pro mouse and I sometimes miss the hockey-puck because of a couple of reasons. The hocky-puck mouse was really light and very easy to quickly move around also because of it's lightness it glided very easily on almost all surfaces suited for a mouse. The initial problem of having the right side up is just that initial eventually it's just like using a keyboard and knowing where the keys are by the two keys with bumps on them.

[benixau]

Originally posted by topicolo
Sometimes I wonder if apple does any useability testing with their products at all--the hockey puck mouse that came with the original imac was the most horrendous thing every made! how does apple expect people to hold that tiny little puck for hours and not get irritated by it?

Uh huh. Did you ever use some of the early IBM mice. Three buttons, over-sized, bulky and purley hopeless. I agree that the puck-mouse wasnt the best mouse ever, but it was easy to use. All you had to do was apply good ergnomic technique and hold your hand above the mouse not rest it on the mouse. simple.

You just didnt like it because it was different. Do you like OSX??? Its different.

[GeeYouEye]

Originally posted by crazy_will
if they did make a two button mouse, it would probobly be sold only to pro users, like the editing keyboard was. they could make it programable, or build in with a programable scroll wheel, so zooming in and out or moving forward in a timeline, or something. Most likely not wiht the idea of scrolling long web pages (besides, a lot of scroll mouse users use the directional keys to look at web pages; i know i do!)

While the rest is all well and good, I have to ask: editing keyboard? Apple made an editing keyboard? :confused:

To everyone else: The one-button mouse is just fine for me. It serves all my purposes well, and I am hardly a novice user. Any time I need a contextual menu, I crtl-click. It's become second nature at this point. The only reason I would want a multi-button mouse is that you need one to run Maya, even the PLE version. Okay, fine the scroll wheels are nice too.

[SilvorX]

lol i never knew a scroll wheel would ever be handy, till i bought my current mouse, and any mouse without a scroll wheel...needs a scroll wheel :p lol..or somethin similar

[shadowfax]

yeah, silvorX, "or something similar." lol;)

[MacBandit]

I would kill for a scroll wheel. Well maybe not quite kill maybe just mame. Severely! Anyway I've been trying to think of some way to hack a scroll wheel off another mouse and stick it on my Apple Pro Mouse. I think that would be really cool.

[shadowfax]

you can kill, maim, or severely maim your apple pro mouse, macbandit, and get this (http://www.maccessories.com/products/pro_mic_d1081.html)... all the style of mac, with a less insulting-to-your-intelligence button layout. it's really a lot of fun to use, and costs about the same as a pro mouse (says 65, i got mine for 60).

[MacBandit]

Originally posted by Shadowfax
you can kill, maim, or severely maim your apple pro mouse, macbandit, and get this (http://www.maccessories.com/products/pro_mic_d1081.html)... all the style of mac, with a less insulting-to-your-intelligence button layout. it's really a lot of fun to use, and costs about the same as a pro mouse (says 65, i got mine for 60).

I don't like the way the scroll sensor works on it or I would have it by now.

[shadowfax]

Originally posted by Macbandit
I don't like the way the scroll sensor works on it or I would have it by now.

definitely takes some getting used to. it took me a few hours, but it's second nature to me now, and should be to anyone who gives it a chance. it's like anything else, like going from a 1 button mouse to a 2, from a 2 to a scroll mouse, or from a scroll mouse to a no scroll mouse. the only difference is that in this case you aren't losing funcionality [from a normal scroll wheel mouse], you are changingthe vehicle by which that functionality is delivered. if taste in scroll is all that is holding you back, let me guarantee from experience that you will get used to it very quickly.
but if you are satisfied with your pro mouse such that you can turn your nose at this thing, then there's no real reason to change, right?

[MacBandit]

Originally posted by Shadowfax


definitely takes some getting used to. it took me a few hours, but it's second nature to me now, and should be to anyone who gives it a chance. it's like anything else, like going from a 1 button mouse to a 2, from a 2 to a scroll mouse, or from a scroll mouse to a no scroll mouse. the only difference is that in this case you aren't losing funcionality [from a normal scroll wheel mouse], you are changingthe vehicle by which that functionality is delivered. if taste in scroll is all that is holding you back, let me guarantee from experience that you will get used to it very quickly.
but if you are satisfied with your pro mouse such that you can turn your nose at this thing, then there's no real reason to change, right? [/B]

The problem I have with it per what I've read. (I admit I personally haven't used one and don't know of anyone local who has them for sale.) Is that when you touch the pad top or bottom it jumps a page? Is this correct. I want a scoll wheel to go line by line and I don't want it accidentally jumping page to page.