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Dr Kevorkian94
Nov 21, 2011, 03:35 PM
As the title states i want either a blue ray player or an Apple TV for x-mas. I have 2 concerns because i know the prows and cons exempt for these: Does it coast more for a physical copy than an iTunes copy? (even though i can get the movies through more crafty means) And what is the update cycle because i forgot, i don't want to get one and a new one come out in like march. Thanks!



jamesvdm
Nov 21, 2011, 04:24 PM
They are not comparable device so it's hard to tell you what would be best. Personally I am not supporting the bluray format.

There is no known update cycle for the ATV. It was almost 4 years between 1 and 2.

Dr Kevorkian94
Nov 21, 2011, 04:58 PM
They are not comparable device so it's hard to tell you what would be best. Personally I am not supporting the bluray format.

There is no known update cycle for the ATV. It was almost 4 years between 1 and 2.

Im just saying movie wise, like would i notice the difference? if i played a blue ray on my 40 something inch tv compared to an iTunes copy. And its not like i can rip blue rays with my mac if i decide to buy a blue ray just to have it. And as for an update cycle I'm past that now.

Bokes
Nov 21, 2011, 05:27 PM
If you want to best quality and experience watching a film- 100% get the blu ray. Streaming doesn't even come close.

Dr Kevorkian94
Nov 21, 2011, 05:52 PM
If you want to best quality and experience watching a film- 100% get the blu ray. Streaming doesn't even come close.

Ok then, im leaning toward a blue ray player now. Can you recommend a good one that is plain nothing fancy but a good quality picture?

Che Castro
Nov 21, 2011, 08:35 PM
Why not both?

I have a ps3 & apple tv

I buy bluray movies only my fav old movies

I use the apple tv for icefilms

I watch dexter & boardwalk empire about an hour after it airs live

slothrob
Nov 21, 2011, 08:48 PM
Im just saying movie wise, like would i notice the difference? if i played a blue ray on my 40 something inch tv compared to an iTunes copy. And its not like i can rip blue rays with my mac if i decide to buy a blue ray just to have it.
Its a subtle, but discernible, difference between the 720p of iTunes HD and the 1080p of Blueray. At least on a 40" TV from a typical viewing distance.

One thing to consider is that many, if not most, HD TV channels broadcast in 720p that is also heavily compressed by the cable companies. Can you tell when you are watching a 720p TV station and a 1080i TV station?

Either way, the iTunes HD material is usually very good. Oh yeah, also, you can also re-encode Blueray with a Mac using an external drive.

Che Castro
Nov 21, 2011, 09:03 PM
Blurays are so cheap nowadays specially for old movies

I think buying bluray disc is the way to go

Last week i bought terminator 2 bluray for $5 at target

tbayrgs
Nov 21, 2011, 09:20 PM
Im just saying movie wise, like would i notice the difference? if i played a blue ray on my 40 something inch tv compared to an iTunes copy. And its not like i can rip blue rays with my mac if i decide to buy a blue ray just to have it. And as for an update cycle I'm past that now.

Blu ray will definitely provide a better picture and sound, if you have the equipment to take advantage of it. Is your TV 720p or 1080p? If the former, then there won't be a difference while the latter will be able to take advantage of the higher resolution of blu ray (iTunes are only 720p), though at that screen size, you may not really notice the difference. Blu ray will also provide better surround sound if you have a quality receiver/speaker setup.

There are other factors you may want to consider though before deciding to go blu ray, especially if you want to watch movies on any of the devices in your signature. A blu ray player will obviously limit your viewing to only your television while iTunes purchased media will be playable on all of your Apple devices.

Personally, I dumped my PS3 a few years ago but still only purchase blu ray media. I have an external blu ray drive for my Mac which allows me to rip/encode my media into whatever resolution I need for playback on all of our household devices (1080p for my Mac Mini HTPC, 720p for our :apple:TVs, iPads, and iPhones, and standard definition for my kids iPods). I went this route instead of iTunes purchased movies/TV shows because the DRM on iTunes media doesn't allow playback on non Apple devices or via PLEX on my Mac Mini. While this setup requires a bit of work, it also gives me the most flexibility now and in the future. Just my $0.02.

SDColorado
Nov 21, 2011, 09:24 PM
Blu what? Oh yeah, thats what that thing under the thick layer of dust is. Honestly I never use mine except for the very rare occasion. The ATV2 gets used quite a bit, but everyones different. Thats the beauty of it. You are the only one that can ultimately make the best choice for you.

vrDrew
Nov 22, 2011, 12:07 AM
It depends on your viewing habits.

Blu-Ray has the absolute best picture quality. But it also has some downsides:


Buying Blu-Ray discs can be expensive, especially for new releases. $20 and up.
At present, the "back catalog" available on Blu-Ray is considerably smaller than that of other formats.
In practice, you will find your viewing options considerably more limited with Blu-Ray


This last item is worth thinking about. Even if you subscribe to a top-tier Netflix plan, you are only going to have one or two movie titles to look at each evening. With an AppleTV and a Netflix streaming account, you'll have a choice of literally thousands.

There is the issue of storage. Personally, I think that the days when we consumers keep a shelf full of discs (CDs, DVDs, VHS tapes, or Blu-Ray discs) are coming to an end. More and more content is available online, in the cloud, or on our personal media servers.

Lastly, an AppleTV can do so much MORE than a Blu-Ray player. You can watch YouTube on your biggest screen. You can hook the AppleTV to a stereo or A/V receiver and stream your entire music collection over good speakers. You can view your personal photo stream. You can wirelessly "beam" music and video from your iPhone or iPod to your TV.

Blu-Ray is very nice. But IMHO the video is, at best, only marginally superior to streaming 720. And at the end of the day, Blu-Ray is a one-trick pony.

Andrew*Debbie
Nov 22, 2011, 04:36 AM
Does it coast more for a physical copy than an iTunes copy? (even though i can get the movies through more crafty means)


New titles can go either way. For older movies, a used Blue Ray or Amazon Special is often cheaper. You can also sell a used disc on Amazon or eBay. Not possible to sell an iTunes title you own.

Apple TV wins for renting. Sure Block Buster or Netflix may be a little less per title, but they cost in time and for BB fuel.


Coast more? I'd say a Blue-ray, being round will coast better than a square Apple TV. ;)


And what is the update cycle because i forgot, i don't want to get one and a new one come out in like march. Thanks!

:apple:TV is a hobby product. Hardware updates are infrequent. A new device could happen whenever. The firmware is in active development. There have been a ton of software updates.

New Blue-Ray players seem to come out every 6 months.

theSeb
Nov 22, 2011, 06:41 AM
Im just saying movie wise, like would i notice the difference? if i played a blue ray on my 40 something inch tv compared to an iTunes copy. And its not like i can rip blue rays with my mac if i decide to buy a blue ray just to have it. And as for an update cycle I'm past that now.

You can rip BluRay discs with your Mac. I do it all the time.

If you're a movie enthusiast and intend to build a home cinema setup, or already have one, a Blu Ray player makes the most sense, especially if things like HD Audio, DTS master HD and so forth mean anything to you.

Most BR players can even play your ripped DVDs and BRs from the network these days so you can still create a digital media repository and use the BR player as you would use the ATV.

Considering that you are choosing between the two I assume that your budget is not very high? In that case I would recommend a Sony BDP s580 (about $110) or a similarly priced model from Panasonic. If you're a bit more serious about this, then I would recommend an Oppo BDP 95.

Bokes
Nov 22, 2011, 07:38 AM
this debate can go on all day.
To me- the difference is not subtle.
Streaming is full of motion artifacts, washed out color and poor blacks.

It's fast food vs fine dining.
If you have 2 rooms and in one room you view a streaming a film- it will look OK- but if you step into another room playing the blu ray version of the same film- there is NO WAY you're going back to watch the Stream.

If you go Blu- get decent components and calibrate your screen.

OptyCT
Nov 22, 2011, 09:32 AM
Count me in with the contingent that says get both. Blu-ray players are super cheap these days. A highly-rated blu-ray player can be had for under $100. Add another $100 for the AppleTV 2 = $200 total.

Instead of buying blu-rays (which most people watch once or twice then throw in a cabinet), get Netflix. For the cost of purchasing one blu-ray ($18/month), you can sign up for Netflix's "one blu-ray out at a time, plus streaming - unlimited" plan. Plus, your AppleTV can be used for a lot more with your iPad 2 and iPhone 4S (i.e. Airplay, etc.).

Dr Kevorkian94
Nov 22, 2011, 01:05 PM
Im liking the feedback guys, another question tho. a lot of blu rays have like extras will the always be the same with the iTunes copy? Also if i can find a decent blu ray for under $ 100 that will play a good picture ( maybe a player with just playing capabilities, if they still make those lol) then i will consider just getting both i have like $200 to spend. i like the fact of being able to play dads and blu rays because i do have some already (only because they came with dvds). so right now i have a couple options: 1) get either or 2) find a blu ray that just plays so nothing fancy and get both 3) get the ATV and find a cheep blu ray ripper.

Dr Kevorkian94
Nov 22, 2011, 07:24 PM
Ive decided to get both, I totally forgot that my birthday is coming up so it gives me the excuse lol. Thanks for all the info i already order my ATV :D

ericrwalker
Nov 22, 2011, 07:29 PM
I've got 2 samsung blu-ray players and an Apple TV. I haven't powered either blu-ray player on in several months. I use the Apple TV several times a week.

That reminds me, time to put my blu-ray players on ebay or amazon.

greganpace
Nov 22, 2011, 07:35 PM
One last thing... If you get a wifi-capable blu-ray, You can also buy the 1080 movies and stream them. In the PS3, you can use Vudu to do it, as well as rent, being able to choose standard definition, 720, or 1080 and pay an extra dollar usually for each, with just about any movie you can think of. Something you don't get from ATV, I believe.

macjonny1
Nov 22, 2011, 07:42 PM
You aren't going to get 7.1 digital audio on the Apple TV. You may not care though.

x-evil-x
Nov 23, 2011, 01:16 AM
most blu ray players have netflix so id get a blu ray player but they are so cheap id get both. but you can't get blu ray quality from streaming plain and simple... and blu ray are as much as what dvds used to be its not that bad...

sapporobaby
Nov 23, 2011, 01:24 AM
Why not both?

I have a ps3 & apple tv

I buy bluray movies only my fav old movies

I use the apple tv for icefilms

I watch dexter & boardwalk empire about an hour after it airs live

Exactamundo....I have both....

00sjsl
Nov 23, 2011, 04:04 AM
I love the picture quality of blue ray + surround sound, streamed video does not come close, difference is quite obvious on a 40 tv. I subscribe to love film to avoid owning too many disks.

bmacir
Nov 23, 2011, 04:44 AM
Ok then, im leaning toward a blue ray player now. Can you recommend a good one that is plain nothing fancy but a good quality picture?

I would recommend a ps3, it's the best (upgradable) blu-ray player and it's much more than just that.

It has one major downside: it makes a lot of noise, for many it's a non-issue, but it can be annoying.

I too would say get an atv as well. If you have iDevices, an atv is a cool addition. Plus you could watch tv shows and movies, when you feel lazy, without having to change disk. :)

mstrze
Nov 23, 2011, 06:23 AM
Another question to ask:

Do you want to build up a collection of 'things' you need to find a place to store? Blu-Ray means you will collect more items and have to store them physically somewhere. One external HDD can hold the same amount of movies as an entire wall unit filled to the brim.

On my 42", from 8 feet away, I cannot tell the difference between BR and ATV HD. Although I am not admittedly obsessed over quality. :p

tbear1
Nov 23, 2011, 06:35 AM
It depends on your viewing habits.

Blu-Ray has the absolute best picture quality. But it also has some downsides:

[LIST]
Buying Blu-Ray discs can be expensive, especially for new releases. $20 and up.

The good thing about many BD players is that they also support DVD play back. So you can save some money if you don't need the BD quality.

With black Friday coming up, you may be able to buy both. BD players are cheap.

Glenn

JoeSixPack
Nov 23, 2011, 08:09 AM
If you want to best quality and experience watching a film- 100% get the blu ray. Streaming doesn't even come close.

If you like movies with action and special effects -- and have a large, HD tv with surround sound speakers than blu ray is without peer. But if you are watching content with a high dialogue to explosion ratio like sit-coms than blu ray does not add much value.

Personally I use the blu ray for epic movies and the iPad for more mundane watching. Also, if you have an iPad you can buy a cable adapter and use it like an Apple tv.

pagansoul
Nov 23, 2011, 08:27 AM
I'm one for overkill, I have a Samsung 40inch, a mac mini, :apple:TV and my Panny bluray player. The mini is new and I would not need the :apple:TV if I got it first but now I don't use it much. It all boils down to what you use your TV for. Using Apps to watch rented movies, buying digital movies, ripping and watching your own collection of movies? I do it all.

Cave Man
Nov 23, 2011, 09:04 AM
I'd spend $400 on a hackintosh with a Blu-ray drive so long as you have ethernet. If not, Apple WiFi card in a PCIe to Mini-PCIe card for another $90. Then install Plex and be done with it. No True-HD or DTS-MA, but you'd get fabulous 1080p video and on-demand access to all of your videos.

OptyCT
Nov 23, 2011, 09:33 AM
Ive decided to get both, I totally forgot that my birthday is coming up so it gives me the excuse lol. Thanks for all the info i already order my ATV :D

Good choice! Enjoy!

Dr Kevorkian94
Nov 23, 2011, 02:31 PM
Well according to the tracking info my ATV should be hear today! What I now realize is that the reason I would have both is because there are some movies I'd rather have a physical copy. And Whatever blu ray player I decide to get ill go from there. Thanks for all the help!

athens
Nov 23, 2011, 02:45 PM
I own both and I use the AppleTV far more.

Netflix, youtube, vimeo are what I use most on the AppleTV. I also ripped a lot of my DVD's with the goal of ripping EVERY one of my DVD's into my iTunes library to share out to my AppleTV. My blu-ray player gets used maybe twice a week for movies. I would say own both but if you had to pick which one to get first go with the AppleTV.

----------

Well according to the tracking info my ATV should be hear today! What I now realize is that the reason I would have both is because there are some movies I'd rather have a physical copy. And Whatever blu ray player I decide to get ill go from there. Thanks for all the help!

Just a little advice, hard wire the AppleTV over wireless. Makes a big difference. And with that you will need a Ethernet connection for your Blu-ray player because they need security updates a few times a year to work with the newest Blu-Ray movies. So you might as well run a line to your TV area and put a switch there so you can plug both in to a cable.

I prefer physical movies to digital downloads, I can get them cheaper in Physical copy. Most of my AppleTV usage is with Netflix and streaming DVDs I already own (rips)

Mac.World
Nov 23, 2011, 02:59 PM
Physical media like blu-ray and DVD is a dead technology. Much like VHS. Right now, blu-ray is just living on borrowed time. Large discs that are easily damaged, require a ton of packaging and plastic is coming to an end.

Digital media content is the wave of the future. small thumb drives and online cloud content is where the industry is heading. Why do you think Apple has starting dumping optical drives and never had any intention of utilizing blu-ray.

Dr Kevorkian94
Nov 23, 2011, 02:59 PM
I own both and I use the AppleTV far more.

Netflix, youtube, vimeo are what I use most on the AppleTV. I also ripped a lot of my DVD's with the goal of ripping EVERY one of my DVD's into my iTunes library to share out to my AppleTV. My blu-ray player gets used maybe twice a week for movies. I would say own both but if you had to pick which one to get first go with the AppleTV.

----------



Just a little advice, hard wire the AppleTV over wireless. Makes a big difference. And with that you will need a Ethernet connection for your Blu-ray player because they need security updates a few times a year to work with the newest Blu-Ray movies. So you might as well run a line to your TV area and put a switch there so you can plug both in to a cable.

I prefer physical movies to digital downloads, I can get them cheaper in Physical copy. Most of my AppleTV usage is with Netflix and streaming DVDs I already own (rips)

I have a cat5 cable running to the Xbox from my airport already So I can switch them if need be, thanks.

Irishman
Nov 23, 2011, 03:08 PM
Well according to the tracking info my ATV should be hear today! What I now realize is that the reason I would have both is because there are some movies I'd rather have a physical copy. And Whatever blu ray player I decide to get ill go from there. Thanks for all the help!

I don't recall you saying if your 40" TV is 1080p or not.

If so, get both the ATV2 and the BDP. That's what I have. Several reasons to go for standalone Bluray player, some of which will directly apply to you right now, and some which will apply should you choose to upgrade your sound system:

1. Picture quality of a well-mastered Blu-ray is leaps and bounds above anything else in HD. By the way, the scale of pq, from best to worst, is: Blu-ray, Over-the-air HD (via antenna), cable or Satellite HD, streaming HD, Over-the-air SD, cable or Satellite SD, streaming SD.

2. If you have a 1080p HDTV, Blu-ray is the only way to really see that detail and color depth.

3. Sound quality for most Blu-rays is encoded with lossless soundtracks, either Dolby TrueHD, or DTS HD Master Audio. These are bit-for-bit identical to the studio masters from whence they came. If you invest in a good quality A/V receiver and speakers, you can create a jaw-dropping theater experience at home.

4. Most new Blu-ray players stream content, just as the AppleTV does. So, you'll get Netflix, Youtube, sometimes CinemaNow, Pandora, even Facebook, Amazon's video service, Vudu, etc.

5. The prices of Blu-ray players and titles has dropped into bargain basement territory, under $99 for players, and under $20 for a LOT of good titles. Try high def digest online for a ton of blu-ray reviews. That way you can avoid the detritus while investing your money well.

So, it all depends on what is important to you, what hardware you have and what hardware you want. But, keep in mind that, like Apple products, home theater products are VERY Aspirational and can quickly drain your wallet if you let it. :)

Irishman
Nov 23, 2011, 03:19 PM
Physical media like blu-ray and DVD is a dead technology. Much like VHS. Right now, blu-ray is just living on borrowed time. Large discs that are easily damaged, require a ton of packaging and plastic is coming to an end.

Digital media content is the wave of the future. small thumb drives and online cloud content is where the industry is heading. Why do you think Apple has starting dumping optical drives and never had any intention of utilizing blu-ray.

It is the future, but it's not here yet.

You can't even stream OTA HD quality yet, much less blu-ray quality.

Until such time as that happens, there will be room for both:

streaming for convenience, and blu-ray for quality.

athens
Nov 23, 2011, 03:23 PM
Its true a lot of players now have the ability to do youtube and netflix. Test if possible to see if you would like it. My blu-ray player does both youtube and netflix and I will never use it for either because the controls are horrible and the speed is terrible between menus.

@Mac.World

Its not dead and will not be for a while yet. Blu-ray got hurt bad because of the format war. Its lagging still because its over priced. But as it becomes more respectable in price its going to continue to grow for a while. The biggest issue with digital is you don't own anything except 1's and 0's that can be easily erased. Highly compressed High Def content takes up a lot of space and does not look as nice as blu-ray. Many ISP's have bandwidth limits which will limit how much HD content you stream or download. A lot of issues still need to be resolved before Digital takes over. Price, size, bandwidth, redownloading...

Dr Kevorkian94
Nov 23, 2011, 03:36 PM
I don't recall you saying if your 40" TV is 1080p or not.

If so, get both the ATV2 and the BDP. That's what I have. Several reasons to go for standalone Bluray player, some of which will directly apply to you right now, and some which will apply should you choose to upgrade your sound system:

1. Picture quality of a well-mastered Blu-ray is leaps and bounds above anything else in HD. By the way, the scale of pq, from best to worst, is: Blu-ray, Over-the-air HD (via antenna), cable or Satellite HD, streaming HD, Over-the-air SD, cable or Satellite SD, streaming SD.

2. If you have a 1080p HDTV, Blu-ray is the only way to really see that detail and color depth.

3. Sound quality for most Blu-rays is encoded with lossless soundtracks, either Dolby TrueHD, or DTS HD Master Audio. These are bit-for-bit identical to the studio masters from whence they came. If you invest in a good quality A/V receiver and speakers, you can create a jaw-dropping theater experience at home.

4. Most new Blu-ray players stream content, just as the AppleTV does. So, you'll get Netflix, Youtube, sometimes CinemaNow, Pandora, even Facebook, Amazon's video service, Vudu, etc.

5. The prices of Blu-ray players and titles has dropped into bargain basement territory, under $99 for players, and under $20 for a LOT of good titles. Try high def digest online for a ton of blu-ray reviews. That way you can avoid the detritus while investing your money well.

So, it all depends on what is important to you, what hardware you have and what hardware you want. But, keep in mind that, like Apple products, home theater products are VERY Aspirational and can quickly drain your wallet if you let it. :)

Yea i have a 1080p HDTV which is 47" i think, Personally i would like a blu ray player that only plays blu rays and dvds, because that is all i want it for. i understand that they do have streaming capabilities some even will stream from your computer but still id rather have an apple tv and a plain blu ray player. We do get dvds now and again and the xbox is what we use to play them and the quality isn that good and the thing is on its last leg. as for apps and stuff i have an iPhone and the rest of the family has either an iPod or iPads. So for me an ATV and a non fancy blu ray player is the way to go.

Mac.World
Nov 23, 2011, 03:45 PM
Its true a lot of players now have the ability to do youtube and netflix. Test if possible to see if you would like it. My blu-ray player does both youtube and netflix and I will never use it for either because the controls are horrible and the speed is terrible between menus.

@Mac.World

Its not dead and will not be for a while yet. Blu-ray got hurt bad because of the format war. Its lagging still because its over priced. But as it becomes more respectable in price its going to continue to grow for a while. The biggest issue with digital is you don't own anything except 1's and 0's that can be easily erased. Highly compressed High Def content takes up a lot of space and does not look as nice as blu-ray. Many ISP's have bandwidth limits which will limit how much HD content you stream or download. A lot of issues still need to be resolved before Digital takes over. Price, size, bandwidth, redownloading...
Notice i said thumb drives, not just online content. You can easily fit an entire blu-ray disc onto a 4 or 8 gb mini thumb drive or sd card. Quality is preserved and unless you break the drive or card in half, you never have to worry about scratches and if all of you content is on this sort of media, instead of taking up shelves of space, you take up one small box. Not to mention, packaging and plastic is nearly eliminated compared to now. And shipping costs are dramatically reduced.

Currently new car stereo's cater to the thumb drive, tv's are beginning to... There will be no need for an add on disc player very shortly. As i said, blu-ray and dvd are living on borrowed time.

peterjcat
Nov 23, 2011, 03:54 PM
Say it all ya like, but I don't see how you're fitting a 40GB Blu-ray on an 8GB thumb drive.

Mac.World
Nov 23, 2011, 04:08 PM
Say it all ya like, but I don't see how you're fitting a 40GB Blu-ray on an 8GB thumb drive.
Not all blu-rays are 40gb in size and I was just throwing a number out there for drive size. For the sake of argument though, how much are you spending on a 40gb bluray disc? Micro sd cards, in the 32gb size, can be had for roughly 30 bucks and the price keeps dropping.

The blu-ray is a dead man walking. But if you want to keep paying for blu-ray discs, in ten years, you can be like the guy that still has vhs tapes now. I don't buy into dead technology.

And yes, you can shrink a 40gb movie down to 8-12gb and lose very little quality.

Irishman
Nov 23, 2011, 04:37 PM
Not all blu-rays are 40gb in size and I was just throwing a number out there for drive size. For the sake of argument though, how much are you spending on a 40gb bluray disc? Micro sd cards, in the 32gb size, can be had for roughly 30 bucks and the price keeps dropping.

The blu-ray is a dead man walking. But if you want to keep paying for blu-ray discs, in ten years, you can be like the guy that still has vhs tapes now. I don't buy into dead technology.

And yes, you can shrink a 40gb movie down to 8-12gb and lose very little quality.

Every technology, given enough time, is dead technology.

Next?

peterjcat
Nov 23, 2011, 04:51 PM
Naturally every digital medium will become obsolete, it's just a question of when. At the moment the Blu-ray disc is the most cost-effective way to distribute the 40GB that the average Blu-ray movie takes up. The disc itself costs maybe 50 cents. There's no way a movie at Blu-ray quality can be distributed on a USB stick or SD card, the media is just too expensive. Sure it'll come down eventually, but it's got at least a few years to go.

And the good news is that when they stop making Blu-ray players we can just copy all of our Blu-rays onto hard drives or even thumb drives -- maybe they'll be cheap enough by then -- and either play them as they are or convert them into any other format, which is much harder to do when you've just bought a DRM-protected movie. So it's kind of arguable which one will be obsolete first.

And yes indeed, you can get very good picture quality at 8-12GB, but you said you could fit a whole Blu-ray onto 4-8GB, and that kind of made it sound like you didn't know what you were talking about for a minute there.

From A Buick 8
Nov 23, 2011, 07:29 PM
For me it has been the convenience of the ATV. I have my entire DVD collection (600 +) on an ext drive.

Yes BR looks better but having access to all of our stuff + streaming Netflix on all of our TV's is just perfection.

No wall of DVD's, no searching through disc to find what I want, it really is great.

wxman2003
Nov 23, 2011, 08:23 PM
Not all blu-rays are 40gb in size and I was just throwing a number out there for drive size. For the sake of argument though, how much are you spending on a 40gb bluray disc? Micro sd cards, in the 32gb size, can be had for roughly 30 bucks and the price keeps dropping.

The blu-ray is a dead man walking. But if you want to keep paying for blu-ray discs, in ten years, you can be like the guy that still has vhs tapes now. I don't buy into dead technology.

And yes, you can shrink a 40gb movie down to 8-12gb and lose very little quality.

I would beg to differ. Just compare the original close encounters movie in blu ray to the re released version. The re released is much better due to high quality transfer. Yes, many of past blu rays are in the 8-12 gb size, but most of the newer ones coming out are much larger. The larger your tv screen the more noticeable the difference. Crappy LCD HD tv's of the past covered this up. Much better HD tv's are coming out at the same price of the crappy sets, and if your tv is 50 inches or bigger, there is a noticeable difference between the lower quality blu ray movies and the higher quality ones.

Streaming will never come close to blu ray until they can dramatically stream at a much higher bit rate. That won't happen until the whole internet infrastructure of the US is rebuilt. USB sticks still have a long way to go. I can get a high quality blu ray movie for $10 to $15. Not going to see that on a stick for quite sometime.

Plus throw in the poor chips in the ATV, Roku, etc, processing of HD material will still be second rate to a top quality blu ray player like the OPPO.

Cave Man
Nov 24, 2011, 07:35 AM
Physical media like blu-ray and DVD is a dead technology.

Blu-ray isn't because there is nothing as good. Period. So long as it leads in quality it will be marketable.

Much like VHS. Right now, blu-ray is just living on borrowed time.

All technology is on borrowed time.

Digital media content is the wave of the future.

It may be, but it isn't now. In addition, ISPs are already increasing costs for high-volume transmission. If the cost and quality of downloaded content cannot compete with Blu-ray (such as the 720p crap from the iTunes Store), then Blu-ray will still be profitable. In addition, The Studios have complete control of their distribution with physical media. You have to convince them that it's in their best interest to do digital distribution - and thus far none are willing to package Blu-ray quality into downloads.

small thumb drives and online cloud content is where the industry is heading.

You cannot stamp flash media. That dramatically increases production costs.

Why do you think Apple has starting dumping optical drives and never had any intention of utilizing blu-ray.

Because they don't make money off of optical media. They are trying to drive the industry to digital downloads and The Studios have steadfastly opposed them for the highest quality product.

Notice i said thumb drives, not just online content.

Again, you cannot stamp flash media.

You can easily fit an entire blu-ray disc onto a 4 or 8 gb mini thumb drive or sd card.

But it won't be anywhere near the audio and video quality of Blu-ray. Plus, you have to make special production runs for different languages and subtitles - unless you want to compress the video and audio even more.

The blu-ray is a dead man walking. But if you want to keep paying for blu-ray discs, in ten years, you can be like the guy that still has vhs tapes now. I don't buy into dead technology.

It's not dying and in fact it will even be more important when distribution of 4k video by The Studios begins. Optical media will be here for quite some time.

And yes, you can shrink a 40gb movie down to 8-12gb and lose very little quality.

But there's more to a container than just video and an audio track. And I'd love to see how you plan to package a DTS-MA audio track in a movie in a 12 gb container.

Bokes
Nov 24, 2011, 09:57 AM
Agree- the cloud is the future. But the future is just that...it's years away.
Huge bandwidth for blu ray quality.
You also have to rely on a hi-speed wifi connection. I live in an apartment and I'm constantly fighting interference and slowdowns.

Also- and the biggest one for me- is the extras you get with the blurry sets.

Some folks are content to watch the film and move on. That's cool.
I love to indulge myself in the films I like. The more the better.
You may never the amount extras you get now with streaming.

doktordoris
Nov 24, 2011, 07:56 PM
Yea i have a 1080p HDTV which is 47" i think, Personally i would like a blu ray player that only plays blu rays and dvds, because that is all i want it for. i understand that they do have streaming capabilities some even will stream from your computer but still id rather have an apple tv and a plain blu ray player. We do get dvds now and again and the xbox is what we use to play them and the quality isn that good and the thing is on its last leg. as for apps and stuff i have an iPhone and the rest of the family has either an iPod or iPads. So for me an ATV and a non fancy blu ray player is the way to go.

Blu ray players do not normally include streaming abilty. To conform to the blu ray standard players have to be ale to connect to the net, for firmware updates, special online only features and other stuff. Not t stream movies.

obsidian1200
Nov 24, 2011, 09:40 PM
Yea i have a 1080p HDTV which is 47" i think, Personally i would like a blu ray player that only plays blu rays and dvds, because that is all i want it for. i understand that they do have streaming capabilities some even will stream from your computer but still id rather have an apple tv and a plain blu ray player. We do get dvds now and again and the xbox is what we use to play them and the quality isn that good and the thing is on its last leg. as for apps and stuff i have an iPhone and the rest of the family has either an iPod or iPads. So for me an ATV and a non fancy blu ray player is the way to go.

@OP, if you're still looking for a blu ray player that's pretty bare bones, Wal-Mart is selling an LG Blu-ray player for $50. That should fit your needs, as it also upscales DVDs.

Hope this helps and enjoy your new setup!

Dr Kevorkian94
Nov 24, 2011, 09:58 PM
Thanks guys

mstrze
Nov 25, 2011, 10:14 AM
Blu-ray isn't because there is nothing as good. Period. So long as it leads in quality it will be marketable.

'Leading in quality' isn't always easily marketable. Just ask Sony about Beta. ;)

Cave Man
Nov 25, 2011, 01:58 PM
No comparison. Try Blu-ray vs. HD-DVD. And yes, the better one won.

Dr Kevorkian94
Nov 25, 2011, 04:42 PM
The amount of knowledge i accumulated from this particular form is great! By the way i think fed ed screwed up my ATV shipment so ill be waiting :( it gives me time to search for a blu ray player tho.

gagecloutier
Mar 31, 2013, 11:31 PM
Not to revive this thread or anything, but just to inject my $0.02, the people in this thread bagging on Blu-Ray or calling it a "dead technology" simply don't care about (or prioritize) quality. It's like someone who uses Earpods telling a music producer that their Audio Technica ATH-M50's suck. No... Just no.

If you're willing to greatly compromise quality in favor of going entirely digital, great! But don't try to convince us sticklers about PQ/AQ that the Apple TV is in any way, shape, or form superior to a Blu-Ray setup. It's like the kid with his iPod and Earpods trying to convince a big-time music producer that their headphones suck and their's are superior. I'm glad you're happy kid, but kindly shut up.

Ace1024
Apr 1, 2013, 02:08 AM
I have 200 Bluray titles ripped to play on my ATV, wirelessly, with no loss in picture quality and arguably minimal loss on sound quality. No physical handling of discs, no visitors meddling with my collection; a cheaper more efficient storage.

Bluray will be dead in 5 years when h265 proliferates.

eawmp1
Apr 1, 2013, 02:38 AM
Not to revive this thread or anything, but just to inject my $0.02, the people in this thread bagging on Blu-Ray or calling it a "dead technology" simply don't care about (or prioritize) quality. It's like someone who uses Earpods telling a music producer that their Audio Technica ATH-M50's suck. No... Just no.

If you're willing to greatly compromise quality in favor of going entirely digital, great! But don't try to convince us sticklers about PQ/AQ that the Apple TV is in any way, shape, or form superior to a Blu-Ray setup. It's like the kid with his iPod and Earpods trying to convince a big-time music producer that their headphones suck and their's are superior. I'm glad you're happy kid, but kindly shut up.

But you did revive a thread.

You weren't alive for VHS/Betamax, were you? The better quality technology doesn't always win. I am still waiting for a smartphone that actually makes a phone call as well as the pre-smartphone cells. Optical media is dying. The public is speaking with their $. In 10 years, you will be like the audiophiles who cling to vinyl.

5thSymphony
Apr 1, 2013, 08:58 AM
[...]
On my 42", from 8 feet away, I cannot tell the difference between BR and ATV HD. Although I am not admittedly obsessed over quality. :p
This guy has the best point...
His statement looks like this:
http://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/viewingdistrance.png

So on your 47ish TV screen, 720 & 1080 movies, beyond 8-9 feet will feel identical.

Conclusion, get an ATV. Keep buying those 5$ BR at Targe; it provide you satisfaction of a good deal it seems. Rip them to files on HD. Sells back the BR at 3$. When you want to watch a movie, sit back and fire up your ATV and brown into your awesome digital library.
Less dusty thing laying around! Keep all your Target receipts, they will come handy if you have home insurance claim one day. ;)

Please keep in mind that no jailbreak has been found yet for the ATV3. And for that matter, ATV2 are hard to find and double in price ;)

gagecloutier
Apr 27, 2013, 10:57 PM
But you did revive a thread.

You weren't alive for VHS/Betamax, were you? The better quality technology doesn't always win. I am still waiting for a smartphone that actually makes a phone call as well as the pre-smartphone cells. Optical media is dying. The public is speaking with their $. In 10 years, you will be like the audiophiles who cling to vinyl.
Saying that "optical media is dying" is a very subjective and generalized statement. For the music industry, sure. For film, not so much. I don't expect any given physical format to last forever, but there are more home cinephiles than you may think who will continue to support it for 10+ years, no doubt. Just take a look at blu-ray.com. The idea of ripping Blu-Rays into a digital format through an ATV is intriguing, but I would need 10+TB of HDD capacity to make that feasible, given my current and expanding Blu-Ray collection. That would be for the "master" original copies. Not to mention a backup solution so x2 = 20+TB. We're not there yet. At least consumers aren't.

Others share similar sentiments as me on the matter as well:
"Buy the BD and actually own it.
Buy the iTunes version and it's only a "lifetime license."
BD can be sold, willed, given to someone else. iTunes file can't.

I won't even get into the better audio standards (much better than 1992's Dolby Digital) better video quality (much less compression on the BD), BD extras, etc. I'll just offer that iTunes 1080p with DD is not equal to BD 1080p with DTS Master or True HD, etc audio.

For those indifferent, buy the BD (probably save a few bucks), go to the trouble of creating an iTunes version and enjoy all the benefits of it in iTunes (and on your iDevices) plus all of the benefits of actually owning the movie instead of lifetime "renting" it. Once you have it in iTunes, file away the disc in long-term storage in case you ever have a hard drive(s) meltdown and it can also act as your last resort backup."

If Blu-Ray turns into the equivalent of vinyl, I'm fine with that because it's better quality. As long as it's available, I'm all for it. Vinyls aren't the most popular format, but they're still available. If that's the case, then what's your argument?

SnowLeopard2008
Apr 27, 2013, 11:39 PM
No comparison. Try Blu-ray vs. HD-DVD. And yes, the better one won.

This is pure ignorance. HD-DVD lost because Japanese tech companies (Sony and Toshiba mostly) wanted to be petty and shut out American tech companies (Microsoft). Remember Sony developed Blu-Ray while Toshiba developed HD-DVD. Sony's PS3 uses Blu-Ray and Microsoft's Xbox 360 uses HD-DVD. Japanese companies didn't like Microsoft just waltzing in with their Xbox and dominating the gaming market so they made a petty move to unite in favor of the HD standard against Microsoft. That is why HD-DVD lost. Not because of technology competition.

phrehdd
Apr 27, 2013, 11:44 PM
There are several Blu Ray players that also serve up streaming. If you can deal with Amazon, Vudu and netflix along other services, then perhaps the Blu Ray would be a major advantage. If you are only interested in iTune purchases/rentals then thats all you get with the ATV (unless you get your files elsewhere and set them up via Handbrake).

I use a Blu Ray player that not only does the above but can stream files from my network storage. I have converted my movies to files served up via network and I also have Amazon and Netflix at my disposal for rentals.

You really need to decide what best suits your needs as there are many people who only want to be married to iTunes and are quite happy. As for me, I like having many options for streaming, playback and of course nothing is more fun than first popping in the disc you bought and seeing a flick for the first time (before archiving to network storage).

If you were not married to iTunes, you might also consider media players such as Medi8tor and Dune HD units.

eawmp1
Apr 28, 2013, 05:16 AM
If Blu-Ray turns into the equivalent of vinyl, I'm fine with that because it's better quality. As long as it's available, I'm all for it. Vinyls aren't the most popular format, but they're still available. If that's the case, then what's your argument?

Not your argument. You are missing the point.

I don't need you to convince me of the superiority of the Blu-Ray experience. I do buy films I consider worthy of my progeny viewing in decades on Blu-Ray. For the rest of the stuff not enhanced by Blu-Ray, DVD is just fine.

But in 10 years, give or take, unless those discs have been digitized into a supported format, increasingly one will find it harder and more expensive to find players, and physical discs will be relegated to videophiles. And the vinyl comparison is not valid...you are talking analog versus digital. Streaming speeds get fast enough you could theoretically surpass Blu-Ray data density as its all "0's and 1's".

blanka
Apr 29, 2013, 07:32 AM
I use a MacMini 2009 with 20$ USB BluRay player (rather would have bought an internal one, but 20 vs 100$ was too easy. Tray players are also more durable). It does much more than the Apple TV, including DVB tuning, and all in a nice small package. Best of all, I will be able to update it for 5-10 more years (and probably even longer with Linux or Windows) with all the latest and greatest software. Buying an AppleTV is only hoping it won't be bricked by Apple's iOS update policy in 2016. All my iOS devices from 2009-2010 are pretty useless today.

institute
Apr 29, 2013, 08:21 AM
Yeah, but a new ATV costs 99 bucks. A new Mac mini costs, on the low end, around 600.