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View Full Version : The Best IDE Review Ever




robbieduncan
Jan 20, 2012, 07:12 AM
OK, so it's Visual Studio 2010 which is not of interest to those coding on the Mac but it's worth a read anyway

MS VS Reviewed as a text-based adventure game (http://arstechnica.com/microsoft/news/2012/01/microsoft-pimps-it-old-school-with-a-pricey-text-adventure-game.ars)

:D



soco
Jan 20, 2012, 07:36 AM
I love how this was written. :D

So sad they had to include this though:

We do realize that Visual Studio 2010 isn't, of course, a game.

HippieMagic
Jan 20, 2012, 11:17 AM
I actually really like using Visual Studio 2010... so much so that VS2010 Ultimate is one of the reasons I put Windows 7 on here in the first place... the other being World of Tanks haha.

I do like the review and it brings up one really good point... the price is ridiculous. If I couldn't get it for free there is literally NO way I would ever use it. It should be worth $1000 tops.

smirk
Jan 20, 2012, 11:39 AM
That was awesome. Thanks for pointing it out!

chrono1081
Jan 20, 2012, 01:42 PM
I used to LOVE Visual Studio....then I discovered XCode (which I hated at first). Now I hate Visual Studio and adore XCode.

kainjow
Jan 20, 2012, 02:14 PM
I actually really like using Visual Studio 2010... so much so that VS2010 Ultimate is one of the reasons I put Windows 7 on here in the first place... the other being World of Tanks haha.

I've been using VS2010 daily for the last two weeks doing Win32 development (*cries*).

Maybe I'm missing something, but:

1. Why can't it show warnings and errors alongside my code?
2. Why is the build output plain text and I have to manually parse it for failures?

Xcode beats the pants off of VS in terms of visual compiler output. For being such a mature product, VS is quite crappy. Two thumbs down for me.

mobilehaathi
Jan 20, 2012, 02:37 PM
Lol, that's hilarious. Makes me want to go play Loom.....

iSee
Jan 20, 2012, 03:05 PM
As someone who's playing that game right now, I can say that review is spot-on. ;)

Well, back to finding and destroying those bugs...

MorphingDragon
Jan 21, 2012, 01:26 AM
I've been using VS2010 daily for the last two weeks doing Win32 development (*cries*).

Maybe I'm missing something, but:

1. Why can't it show warnings and errors alongside my code?
2. Why is the build output plain text and I have to manually parse it for failures?

Xcode beats the pants off of VS in terms of visual compiler output. For being such a mature product, VS is quite crappy. Two thumbs down for me.

Clang/LLVM as a compiler suite is much better than the MS .Net compiler.

I use Visual Studio for Unity development (Eww MonoDevelop). If I develop on windows I use Java and SWT.

NZPilgrim
Jan 22, 2012, 01:37 AM
I've been using VS2010 daily for the last two weeks doing Win32 development (*cries*).

Maybe I'm missing something, but:

1. Why can't it show warnings and errors alongside my code?
2. Why is the build output plain text and I have to manually parse it for failures?

Xcode beats the pants off of VS in terms of visual compiler output. For being such a mature product, VS is quite crappy. Two thumbs down for me.

Seriously?

If you're going to bag Visual Studio you might want to actually spend a bit more time with it so you don't come off looking clueless, especially if you think you have to manually parse the build output for failures.

If a build fails in VS I would suggest you bring up the Error List which gives you an itemized list of errors, warnings and messages from the compiler. Double click an item in that list and you are taken to the section of code where the error or warning was generated.

I'm relatively new to the Apple eco-system and Xcode but I've been using VS for quite a number of years. Personally I don't believe Xcode comes close to matching the functionality of VS but again, I don't know enough about it. Maybe after spending more time with it I'll change my mind :).

kainjow
Jan 23, 2012, 12:25 PM
Seriously?
I'm super serial.

If a build fails in VS I would suggest you bring up the Error List which gives you an itemized list of errors, warnings and messages from the compiler. Double click an item in that list and you are taken to the section of code where the error or warning was generated.

The Error List is still not that helpful. Sure it actually separates the warnings from errors, but it still doesn't indicate whether the build failed or not. I have a build that succeeded, but it's giving me an error in the Error List. Not that useful.

Plus I still don't see anywhere else except in the Output window whether the build succeeded or not, and again I have to read that plain text to find that out. Xcode 3 and 4 clearly show whether a build succeeded or not, and if there are errors it takes me immediately to the list of them.

I'm relatively new to the Apple eco-system and Xcode but I've been using VS for quite a number of years. Personally I don't believe Xcode comes close to matching the functionality of VS but again, I don't know enough about it. Maybe after spending more time with it I'll change my mind :).
I've been using Xcode since ~2001 when it was Project Builder. Been using VS off and on - 2005, 2008.

I still stand by my original statements.

NZPilgrim
Jan 24, 2012, 02:18 AM
I'll admit it's a little on the small side but the status bar will tell you straight away that a build has succeeded or failed. Not quite the visual notification that Xcode does (which I do like) but definitely no need to look at the output window.

Anyway, each to their own. If all of us thought the same the world would be a pretty boring place :)

trevorde
Jan 24, 2012, 07:22 AM
First up, I'm a relative n00b in Xcode but have used VS for the last 15 years or so.

The Xcode debugger is based on gdb and is incredibly crude compared to the VS debugger. For example, in Xcode, how do you examine an instance of a class variable? Further, you cannot seem to change the values of variables when debugging.

Xcode seems to deliberately prevent you from reusing/repackaging visual components ie how on earth can I add my own custom visual component to the Xcode Interface Builder toolbox? I believe it's possible but extremely non-trivial.

As for people who say Xcode is 'free', it's only true if your time has no value. I'd rather pay for something that works than wrestle with something that's 'free'.

chrisvee
Jan 24, 2012, 08:30 AM
Currently, I'm really liking Visual Studio. Of course, once I get into some more iOS development, I'm sure I'll become accustom to Xcode.

Gotta say though, working with VS on a 13" screen is.. unpleasant. External monitor for the win! :D

dma550
Feb 16, 2013, 01:21 PM
Lol great article! I use VS2010 for 6-7 hours a day. I am excited to begin my first project on 2012.

Mac_Max
Feb 18, 2013, 10:39 AM
This is definitely a 'to each their own' case. Personally I way prefer VS's debugging and error output views. Granted they both work just fine (Clang was a serious improvement). I also find VS's tabbed views to be way smoother to deal with. I wish XCode/IB had an analog to the XAML split view pane (granted I suppose that would require extending the Storyboard internal format to support manual editing). The instruments suite is really where Apple's tools outshine Microsoft's IMO.

If I couldn't get it for free there is literally NO way I would ever use it. It should be worth $1000 tops.

VS Pro is ~$500 retail. The versions that cost more than $1000 are Team server and the ones with the MSDN subscription, which in and of itself has some benefits if you need to test multiple versions of Windows out. Also I believe you get Office Win/Mac for free with the subscription (or at least my BizSpark MSDN subscription does).

Cromulent
Feb 27, 2013, 02:27 PM
You can actually get quite a lot of work done just using the Express version of Visual Studio and SQL Server. Some of the features of the paid versions are nice (really nice in fact) but I have felt like I absolutely needed them (at least not enough to justify the expense).

notjustjay
Feb 27, 2013, 10:42 PM
I love this game! I get paid good money to play it! :D