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MacRumors
Jan 20, 2012, 09:27 AM
http://images.macrumors.com/im/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/01/20/camera-free-iphone-4-and-4s-now-officially-available-in-singapore/)


Last week, we noted (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/01/13/singapore-carriers-to-offer-camera-less-iphone-4s-models/) that several carriers in Singapore were working to offer camera-less iPhone 4S models for users whose professions prevented them from carrying camera-equipped mobile phones. With Singapore requiring all male citizens and many permanent residents to serve up to two years in the military, there is a significant market for camera-less phones in the country.

http://images.macrumors.com/article-new/2012/01/m1_singapore_non_camera_iphones.jpg


CNET Asia now reports (http://asia.cnet.com/crave/non-camera-iphone-from-m1-is-now-official-62213116.htm) that Singapore carrier M1 has officially gone live (http://www.m1shop.com.sg/AdvanceSearchServlet?searchBy=1&browsingPlatform=iPhone&go=go) with its camera-less iPhone 4 and 4S models on its website. As previously reported, the devices are standard iPhone 4 and 4S models which have seen both front and rear cameras removed by the carrier. The camera-free versions carry a S$49 premium over their standard counterparts, covering the camera removal process. The camera removal process also voids Apple's warranty on the device, and M1 is offering users the ability to purchase a separate one-year warranty through a third-party vendor.

Article Link: Camera-free iPhone 4 and 4S Now Officially Available in Singapore (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/01/20/camera-free-iphone-4-and-4s-now-officially-available-in-singapore/)



justperry
Jan 20, 2012, 09:39 AM
I wouldn't buy a mutilated iPhone for a premium, just use a different dumb phone for 2 years and then buy a normal iPhone

Have to be careful not to get one of these when I buy mine in Singapore, ooch, I better go to Malaysia, they are cheaper there.

commander.data
Jan 20, 2012, 09:47 AM
If Apple is producing these camera-free iPhones I wonder why that voids the warranty? Unless the Signapore carriers are removing the cameras themselves in which case I wonder how they are doing that. Is Apple actually allowing them to open up already built iPhones and modify components or is Apple actually allowing the carriers access to the raw iPhone factories to start an alternate production line that doesn't add the camera?

justperry
Jan 20, 2012, 09:56 AM
If Apple is producing these camera-free iPhones I wonder why that voids the warranty? Unless the Singapore carriers are removing the cameras themselves in which case I wonder how they are doing that. Is Apple actually allowing them to open up already built iPhones and modify components or is Apple actually allowing the carriers access to the raw iPhone factories to start an alternate production line that doesn't add the camera?

There's another thread on this a few days ago, the (Sg-M1?) Provider removes the camera and therefore voids Apple's warranty.
They open the iPhone and remove both the camera's, an easier way (In my other post) would be to use a light laser to damage the Camera sensor.

http://www.macrumors.com/2012/01/13/singapore-carriers-to-offer-camera-less-iphone-4s-models/
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=14189337#post14189337

baryon
Jan 20, 2012, 09:56 AM
If Apple is producing these camera-free iPhones I wonder why that voids the warranty? Unless the Signapore carriers are removing the cameras themselves in which case I wonder how they are doing that. Is Apple actually allowing them to open up already built iPhones and modify components or is Apple actually allowing the carriers access to the raw iPhone factories to start an alternate production line that doesn't add the camera?

It's all in the article: The Singapore carrier removes the cameras, and it does void Apple's warranty, so it's not "authorized" by Apple, but it's not illegal or anything, just not official. So the carrier buys normal iPhones and removes the cameras and resells them.

dakwar
Jan 20, 2012, 10:06 AM
If Apple is producing these camera-free iPhones I wonder why that voids the warranty? Unless the Signapore carriers are removing the cameras themselves in which case I wonder how they are doing that. Is Apple actually allowing them to open up already built iPhones and modify components or is Apple actually allowing the carriers access to the raw iPhone factories to start an alternate production line that doesn't add the camera?

Dude. In the article: "As previously reported, the devices are standard iPhone 4 and 4S models which have seen both front and rear cameras removed by the carrier." ... No Apple hasn't given them access to its factories.

firewood
Jan 20, 2012, 10:26 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9A405 Safari/7534.48.3)

Since there are so few non-camera cellular smartphone models currently in popular use, how are secure facilities in the rest of the world dealing with people carrying cell phones (including on call medical and emergency personal)?

Do they take away cell phones from all the lawyers visiting/representing prisoners? Aviation contractors? Etc.

Teo Morabito
Jan 20, 2012, 10:38 AM
Still no news on the mic-less version of the iPhone ?

fhall1
Jan 20, 2012, 11:04 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9A405 Safari/7534.48.3)

Since there are so few non-camera cellular smartphone models currently in popular use, how are secure facilities in the rest of the world dealing with people carrying cell phones (including on call medical and emergency personal)?

Do they take away cell phones from all the lawyers visiting/representing prisoners? Aviation contractors? Etc.

You check your cellphone at the door.

Andrew*Debbie
Jan 20, 2012, 11:06 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9A405 Safari/7534.48.3)

how are secure facilities in the rest of the world dealing with people carrying cell phones

I've been many places where people are asked to check their phones.

Including:

BMW assembly plants.
UPS. I saw a recent hire there loose his job on the spot because he was carrying a phone after being warned not to.

Many others where I've signed non-disclosures.

8ate8
Jan 20, 2012, 11:08 AM
So you pay more for a phone that has something removed that has no factory warranty, but you have the option of paying even more to buy a third party warranty. Sign me up :rolleyes:

Is this even legal for carriers to do? Offering a modified product for sale without an included warranty that is. I know they can legally remove the cameras.

It's like if you bought an AMG Mercedes. You don't have a Mercedes warranty, you have an AMG warranty as Mercedes and AMG are two different companies. But pretend AMG didn't include a warranty and you had the "option" of buying one from "Joe's Discounts-R-Us Warranties". Just seems real shady.

Consultant
Jan 20, 2012, 11:09 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9A405 Safari/7534.48.3)

Since there are so few non-camera cellular smartphone models currently in popular use, how are secure facilities in the rest of the world dealing with people carrying cell phones (including on call medical and emergency personal)?

Do they take away cell phones from all the lawyers visiting/representing prisoners? Aviation contractors? Etc.

In some places they take away any electronics device that could have camera.

In other places it's on the honor system due to almost all phones have camera.

pdjudd
Jan 20, 2012, 11:38 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0_1 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/5.1 Mobile/9A405 Safari/7534.48.3)

Since there are so few non-camera cellular smartphone models currently in popular use, how are secure facilities in the rest of the world dealing with people carrying cell phones (including on call medical and emergency personal)?


No, people in positions where cell phone cameras are restricted either have their phones confiscated during work, have models without cameras, or the camera is physically destroyed.


Do they take away cell phones from all the lawyers visiting/representing prisoners? Aviation contractors? Etc.

In many cases yes they do. Prisons, absolutely.

commander.data
Jan 20, 2012, 11:41 AM
Dude. In the article: "As previously reported, the devices are standard iPhone 4 and 4S models which have seen both front and rear cameras removed by the carrier." ... No Apple hasn't given them access to its factories.
The line you're quoting doesn't actually say where it's being done. I missed the link to the previous article which was in the first paragraph rather than the second paragraph you quoted. In any case, justperry makes it very clear with his reference links that it's purely the carrier's process taking apart pre-built iPhones.

rmwebs
Jan 20, 2012, 12:36 PM
Putting 'officially' in the title makes it sound like Apple are the ones offering it, when its actually the networks modifying the phones. Might want to change the title.

engg2000
Jan 20, 2012, 06:56 PM
So you pay more for a phone that has something removed that has no factory warranty, but you have the option of paying even more to buy a third party warranty. Sign me up :rolleyes:

You obviously don't understand Singapore & their military system.
There is a world with different rules beyond your border...I'm sure I can guess where you are from.
You think this company is doing this because they want to lose money? Demand dictates innovation.

justperry
Jan 20, 2012, 09:36 PM
You obviously don't understand Singapore & their military system.
There is a world with different rules beyond your border...I'm sure I can guess where you are from.
You think this company is doing this because they want to lose money? Demand dictates innovation.

Exactly, although Singapore looks and feels like the "West" it is by no means the same as the west.
For instance, it looks free but it's only since a few years that people are allowed to demonstrate and only in certain places, the judiciary system is also not really impartial.
It's a young state and Sg accomplished a lot but they are not there yet.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics_of_Singapore

The Economist Intelligence Unit classifies Singapore as a "hybrid" country, with authoritarian and democratic elements. Freedom House does not consider Singapore an "electoral democracy" and ranks the country as "partly free". Reporters Without Borders ranked Singapore 140th out of 167 countries in its 2005 Worldwide Press Freedom Index.

dereth
Jan 21, 2012, 01:17 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Mobile/9A334)

So right. Just stand in a group of 3 or even less in silent protest outside of a government office, and you'll soon be dragged away by no less than 2 dozen officers of the law soon enough.

Anyway, Justperry, iPhone should be more expensive from Malaysia if you buy them from Maxis right? Even with a decent data+voice contract, you'll still Have to pay like.... 2000 ringgit compared to less than 500 sgd in SG with an equivalent plan.

ohbrilliance
Jan 21, 2012, 03:25 AM
The Public Order Act of 2009 prevents an individual from protesting:

http://www.yoursdp.org/index.php/news/singapore/2126-pap-not-even-one

Like many laws, this is entirely unconstitutional, but that argument hasn't gained any sympathy in the corrupted courts.

I stayed there for ten years, and the absurd hypocrisy of the purer-that-pure government is my biggest reason for moving away (ten years, I know...)

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Mobile/9A334)

So right. Just stand in a group of 3 or even less in silent protest outside of a government office, and you'll soon be dragged away by no less than 2 dozen officers of the law soon enough.

Anyway, Justperry, iPhone should be more expensive from Malaysia if you buy them from Maxis right? Even with a decent data+voice contract, you'll still Have to pay like.... 2000 ringgit compared to less than 500 sgd in SG with an equivalent plan.

justperry
Jan 21, 2012, 04:40 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; CPU iPhone OS 5_0 like Mac OS X) AppleWebKit/534.46 (KHTML, like Gecko) Mobile/9A334)

So right. Just stand in a group of 3 or even less in silent protest outside of a government office, and you'll soon be dragged away by no less than 2 dozen officers of the law soon enough.

Anyway, Justperry, iPhone should be more expensive from Malaysia if you buy them from Maxis right? Even with a decent data+voice contract, you'll still Have to pay like.... 2000 ringgit compared to less than 500 sgd in SG with an equivalent plan.

Oh, is that so, I know that many Apple items are cheaper in Malaysia than in Sg, haven't really looked in the iPhone pricing.
If I buy one it will be full price, I am not staying in either Sg nor Malaysia.
HK would be the cheapest but that's too far away.

I just checked and You are wrong, I converted both Sg $ and Myr to Euro's and I get this :
Sg = 576 €
Malaysia = 547 € Edit : For iPhone 4s

I am pretty sure that almost all of Apple's stuff is cheaper in Malaysia.

On the other hand, I have to be careful not to buy a fake one, JB is not the best place to buy, I had a friend who bought a Nokia there a few years ago(in City Square), several days later in Melaka the battery lid fell of, she went to an official Nokia store and they told her it was fake:eek:
Sadly she couldn't go back, she had a plane to catch.

Cubytus
Jan 21, 2012, 07:17 PM
UPS. I saw a recent hire there loose his job on the spot because he was carrying a phone after being warned not to.So in a way, the management tries to cover up the extremely poor handling by their employees.

Kwill
Jan 21, 2012, 10:06 PM
What will they do with all the cameras they remove? :confused:

Zepaw
Jan 22, 2012, 12:48 AM
My job doesn't allow cameras and if you were caught taking pics it would mean your job because I work with people's health insurance info. However they know everyone has a camera on their phone, it is 2012 for god sake. Even when I was caught checking my phone I just got a quick don't do that from my supervisor.

JAT
Jan 22, 2012, 02:17 PM
In some places they take away any electronics device that could have camera.

In other places it's on the honor system due to almost all phones have camera.
I think they should just blindfold everyone.
I'm sure I can guess where you are from.
Did you guess Central Jersey?

BassPlayer
Jan 23, 2012, 10:35 AM
My job doesn't allow cameras and if you were caught taking pics it would mean your job because I work with people's health insurance info. However they know everyone has a camera on their phone, it is 2012 for god sake. Even when I was caught checking my phone I just got a quick don't do that from my supervisor.

You're in Minnesota - work for United?

jlhandy
Jan 23, 2012, 02:47 PM
camera-free iphones?! haha. Jesus, I'd admit if I was in the military or gov and was required to have a camera free phone, this would be my dream phone, i'd sacrifice the feature so I could at least enjoy the other features the iphone offers.

SamEllens
Jan 23, 2012, 04:50 PM
So you pay more for a phone that has something removed that has no factory warranty, but you have the option of paying even more to buy a third party warranty. Sign me up :rolleyes:

Is this even legal for carriers to do? Offering a modified product for sale without an included warranty that is. I know they can legally remove the cameras.

It's like if you bought an AMG Mercedes. You don't have a Mercedes warranty, you have an AMG warranty as Mercedes and AMG are two different companies. But pretend AMG didn't include a warranty and you had the "option" of buying one from "Joe's Discounts-R-Us Warranties". Just seems real shady.

AMG and Mercedes are not separate companies. AMG has been owned by Mercedes since 1999 and has since 2005 been a wholly owned subsidiary.

juanm
Jan 24, 2012, 03:38 AM
Does anyone know where to buy the cameras they take out of the phones? :o

redryder
Jan 31, 2012, 09:42 PM
Hi guys,

Iím from Singapore so let me clear up some stuff. Believe me, there is demand for a camera-less iphone here. All male citizens have to enlist in the military at from age 18 to 20, so thereís a market for camera-less phones.

When we complete our military service at age 20, we are still held in the reserves and have to go back for 2 weeks training once a year or every two years till age 40. Obviously when we go back for training we canít use a camera phone. So you can imagine thereís this huge market of males in Singapore who may want something like this.

Also, the iphone is very popular here. I vaguely recall reading somewhere that Singapore is either number 1 or 2 in the world in terms of percentage of iphone users. Iím not an iphone user myself, but only because my company gave me a blackberry and I donít want two phones.