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Glassed Silver
Feb 16, 2012, 04:02 PM
Heya guys,

so... ML will drop support for GMA X3100/950 and ATi X1600 Macs...

Are you worried?
Are you affected?
What's your plan?
Do you think it will be hacked to run on older machines?


I'm not affected, but worry for my fiancé...
I'd might hack it onto her system, if that will be possible, but I fear it might not be a very smooth thing to maintain. (think updates and the hoops hackingtoshers sometimes have to jump through)


Glassed Silver:mac



wrldwzrd89
Feb 16, 2012, 04:17 PM
It looks like my mother's Mac is too old to support Mountain Lion. I, however, do not have any Macs too old to support ML.

daneoni
Feb 16, 2012, 04:23 PM
A friend who i got to switch in 2007 will not be able to upgrade. She is still rocking a White MacBook but alas it has a GMA 950 and is therefore SOL.

ThE.MeSsEnGeR
Feb 16, 2012, 04:24 PM
My white 13" MacBook (2008) has been acting weird lately... dvd not always working, screen turning off, etc... I was already waiting for this summer for the new MacBook Pro's to come out, and now that I know that ML is coming out this summer, it means it's going to be launched alongside with new Macs!

the final push for my decision is seeing that my MacBook has been listed among the non-compatible devices for ML.

15" MacBook Pro (Ivy Bridge) w/ Mountain Lion, here I come!!

q64ceo
Feb 16, 2012, 04:28 PM
For those who have little option with their Mac's there is always the Hackintosh option

JurassicJon
Feb 16, 2012, 04:29 PM
I think Mountain Lion is going to be the last OS X version my iMac is going to see.

rprebel
Feb 16, 2012, 04:34 PM
I have a new Mini which won't be affected, but my 2006 Mini, which has been demoted to home theater duty, won't be able to upgrade. That's fine, since it can't use 10.7 either.

This has been going on for decades. It's nothing new, and it's no big deal. If you want to run the latest software, you need the latest hardware. Supporting legacy hardware constrains development.

ixodes
Feb 16, 2012, 04:44 PM
Apple cannot stay on top forever.

History reveals the odds are stacked against that being the case with any company. Change is the one constant that we can count on.

When Apple becomes no longer relevant, I will be well prepared to move on with an appropriate strategy... :)

ajvizzgamer101
Feb 16, 2012, 04:45 PM
I have a post-2007 15' Macbook Pro. I was told it wouldn't work but it runs as smooth as butter. A few hiccups but the install was faster and smoother than Lion.

FNH15
Feb 16, 2012, 06:15 PM
My plan is to force install Mountain Lion on my MacBook 4,1. If that doesn't work, I'll buy a refurb MacBook Pro (the $929 one) when the updated MacBook Pro's come out in the Summer.

AbSoluTc
Feb 16, 2012, 06:19 PM
Apple cannot stay on top forever.

History reveals the odds are stacked against that being the case with any company. Change is the one constant that we can count on.

When Apple becomes no longer relevant, I will be well prepared to move on with an appropriate strategy... :)

What the hell does this even mean? :confused: You're in the wrong forum.

zorinlynx
Feb 16, 2012, 06:48 PM
I have a 2006 Mac Pro (1,1) that is supposedly unable to run Mountain Lion.

However, since it has 64 bit CPUs, I highly suspect it will be possible to hack Mountain Lion to boot up on the machine. I hope I'm right, as this machine is MORE than fast enough for everything I need; hell Lion runs like a *SPEED DEMON* on it... and I don't want to get left behind.

So here's hoping. Theoretically it should be possible to hack Mountain Lion to boot on any Mac with a CPU supporting Long Mode (64 bit), it's just EFI that stands in the way. I'm betting someone just has to write a boot loader.

Here's hopin'.

thejadedmonkey
Feb 16, 2012, 07:11 PM
I'm effected, but don't really care. I'm still rocking on Snow Leopard.

bushido
Feb 16, 2012, 07:20 PM
happy that my mid 2009 mbp still has some life in it :cool:

Eric8199
Feb 16, 2012, 07:27 PM
Is the unibody 15" late 2008 (first unibody model) able to upgrade? I haven't seen the list.

karsten
Feb 16, 2012, 07:51 PM
I have a 2006 Mac Pro (1,1) that is supposedly unable to run Mountain Lion.

However, since it has 64 bit CPUs, I highly suspect it will be possible to hack Mountain Lion to boot up on the machine. I hope I'm right, as this machine is MORE than fast enough for everything I need; hell Lion runs like a *SPEED DEMON* on it... and I don't want to get left behind.

So here's hoping. Theoretically it should be possible to hack Mountain Lion to boot on any Mac with a CPU supporting Long Mode (64 bit), it's just EFI that stands in the way. I'm betting someone just has to write a boot loader.

Here's hopin'.

i'm hoping too.. is it possible for someone who has mountain lion installed to reboot with 3 and 2 pressed down to see if it will even boot in 32-bit mode? thanks

Gemütlichkeit
Feb 16, 2012, 07:52 PM
My ][e can't run this?!?! I'M OUTRAGED!

GimmeSlack12
Feb 16, 2012, 08:01 PM
This thread is kind of funny. Such a dramatic bunch we have here!
Seriously, you probably don't want your 5-6 year old Mac to be running the newest OS X.

I was happy when I could put 10.5 on my iBook G4, but I wasn't heartbroken when SL wouldn't work on it. Heck, I wouldn't want to.

Trentolol
Feb 16, 2012, 08:38 PM
Most of my school mac mini's will be "outdated". :/ We haven't upgraded to lion yet, so...we should do that first

Eric8199
Feb 16, 2012, 08:44 PM
Is the unibody 15" late 2008 (first unibody model) able to upgrade? I haven't seen the list.

To answer my own question, it appears after researching that the unibody MacBook pro late 2008 will run mountain lion.

bbapps
Feb 16, 2012, 09:06 PM
I have a....
iMac - 24-inch Mid 2007
MacBook - 13-inch Early 2008

Thinking about upgrading the iMac soon (e.g. would be sooner except for the ivy bridge delay) and getting an iPad. Basically, let the MacBook die a natural death. Just need the iPad to have some storage; currently will take the macbook on the road; mainly for watching movies and internet.

burnout8488
Feb 16, 2012, 09:17 PM
If the X1600 is the only thing holding my Early '06 iMac back from using 10.8, I have no doubts that there will be a workaround to trick ML into using it. Hell, it might just need a kext from 10.7 transferred over. Who knows how simple it may be.

(I swapped in a Core 2 Duo, before anyone jumps on me!)

kdum8
Feb 16, 2012, 09:48 PM
I am confused as to whether my Macbook Pro will be able to run ML. I have the last MBP released before the macbook went unibody. (Macbook Pro 4.1, 2.5 GHz Core Duo 2, mid 2008).
Although according to system profiler I am not running a 64-bit kernel, I do have the Nvidia 8600M chip which I read somewhere means I would be able to run ML.

Can anyone confirm this? :confused:There doesn't seem to be definitive answer anywhere. :confused:

burnout8488
Feb 16, 2012, 09:50 PM
Yours should be fine.... at least until we get some more specifics.

kdum8
Feb 16, 2012, 09:55 PM
Yours should be fine.... at least until we get some more specifics.

Thanks for your reply. May I ask what you base your assessment on?

Eric8199
Feb 16, 2012, 10:42 PM
I read somewhere that mid2007 and up MBPs were listed as working in the developer notes.

r0k
Feb 16, 2012, 11:36 PM
Less than a year ago, I pried open my Macbook and 3 Mac minis and upgraded the RAM so I could install Lion on them. Why? Because Apple announced they were doing away with Mobile Me and if I wanted to keep the functionality, I had to move to iCloud which meant I had to move to Lion.

So if Apple is serious about this Intel graphics thing, I'm 4+ machines away from being able to run ML. I think we'll be on Lion for a long time to come. I thought Apple would relent and bring iCloud to SL. They did not. I now sort of half heartedly expect Apple to relent and allow ML to run on older Intel hardware. But after being disappointed by Apple's inflexibility with Lion, I'm not holding out much hope.

Ungibbed
Feb 17, 2012, 03:05 AM
Wasnt sure if this would be the end of the road for Core 2 Duo systems, sounds like a mixed bag so far. Lion runs like a champ on my MBP, but for 10.8, I would really like the option of physical media for a tidy install.


My only odd thought, why remove Mac from OS X? Unless Apple plans on pushing releases to the PC camp as an alternative to Windows. :confused:

DrNoellyG
Feb 17, 2012, 01:00 PM
I have a spare aluminum 2008 macbook pro that I use as my media center computer, runs Lion pretty well for being an older machine. I don't know if it can officially support Mountain Lion, my guess is that it won't, but I probably won't be upgrading anyway because of the use that I have for it.

stewacide
Feb 17, 2012, 01:13 PM
I have a 2007 white Macbook that runs Lion very well. Hard to justify a new MBA or whatever when it won't be any faster. I'll decide when ML comes out if I want to upgrade to another Mac, but I might just put Linux on this computer in protest and drop Apple completely (my htpc already runs Ubuntu and I love it, and it didn't cost me a thing!)

hackerwayne
Feb 17, 2012, 01:25 PM
I manage to install it on both my Mac Pro 1,1 and MacBook White 2,1.. The Mac Pro works flawlessly.. But somehow the Intel GMA 950 was not recognized on the White, rendering it completely unusable.. LaunchD is taking 80% of the preformace on the white. heres some pics to prove: https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-RYJADysNc3k/Tz6oN75aQdI/AAAAAAAAAX4/dygq7idBPEs/s800/IMG_0399%255B1%255D.JPG

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-LyBSttq2W_g/Tz6lNmfke7I/AAAAAAAAAX0/mXKN_SOZoTo/s800/IMG_0397.JPG

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-T_oulkjmFIE/Tz6lN945FlI/AAAAAAAAAX0/kNC7TGpU9XI/s800/IMG_0398.JPG

Well.. apple is just trying to make you buy a new Mac.. I bypassed the EFI64bit thing xD.. :D

UPDATE: Sound doesn't work on the white as well!!

h00ligan
Feb 17, 2012, 01:36 PM
A hack will arrive.

hackerwayne
Feb 17, 2012, 01:39 PM
A hack will arrive.

Hack arrived xD! Am i the first? Lol.. Jz joking. I tried it on my Mac Pro.. Works flawlessly.. Pics will b up later. Anyway, anyone has any idea how i can get the GMA950 to work? I tried installing the GMA950kext from 10.7.3 with KextHelper, it doesnt work. :(

Asclepio
Feb 17, 2012, 03:17 PM
I manage to install it on both my Mac Pro 1,1 and MacBook White 2,1.. The Mac Pro works flawlessly.. But somehow the Intel GMA 950 was not recognized on the White, rendering it completely unusable.. LaunchD is taking 80% of the preformace on the white. heres some pics to prove: Image (https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-RYJADysNc3k/Tz6oN75aQdI/AAAAAAAAAX4/dygq7idBPEs/s800/IMG_0399%255B1%255D.JPG)

Image (https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-LyBSttq2W_g/Tz6lNmfke7I/AAAAAAAAAX0/mXKN_SOZoTo/s800/IMG_0397.JPG)

Image (https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-T_oulkjmFIE/Tz6lN945FlI/AAAAAAAAAX0/kNC7TGpU9XI/s800/IMG_0398.JPG)

Well.. apple is just trying to make you buy a new Mac.. I bypassed the EFI64bit thing xD.. :D

UPDATE: Sound doesn't working on the white as well!!

How do you hacked the kernel to work on Mac pro 1.1?

hackerwayne
Feb 17, 2012, 04:19 PM
How do you hacked the kernel to work on Mac pro 1.1?

Just use the guide i posted on my thread, that guide is for MacBook white, just change some steps like instead of adding MacBook2,1 above MacBook6,1 add MacPro1,1 above MacPro4,1 the IntelGMA950 kext installation part is not required on the Mac Pro provided you are not using the 7300GT or HD2600 graphics.. Minimum MUST be GT210!

Pics to prove MacPro1,1 works =)https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-DjPyq-YEH-0/Tz-K5o3I22I/AAAAAAAAAbA/OYwGFTLWlYY/s800/IMG_0413%255B1%255D.JPG

This MP1,1 has upgraded clovertown processor woth HD6870 pc unflashed card :)

zorinlynx
Feb 19, 2012, 06:36 PM
This MP1,1 has upgraded clovertown processor woth HD6870 pc unflashed card :)

I'm starting to wonder if Apple deprecated the older machines simply because they wanted to stop having to port older video drivers.

The fact that the 7300GT and X1600 don't work would explain this nicely.

Heh, I still have a 7300GT in a drawer. That card was pathetically slow even in 2006; I think I only used it for a few weeks before upgrading to an X1600 (and eventually a 3870). It's only useful as a spare, pretty much. :)

jhnnyklry9394
Feb 19, 2012, 07:36 PM
I've been saving up for a new 15" MacBook Pro to replace my Black MacBook for a little while now so I'm all set for the upgrade.

Senseotech
Feb 19, 2012, 10:19 PM
I'm running with a Macbook Pro 2,2 and will be hacking the hell out of ML to get it to run. With iCloud/Lion, the biggest feature I wanted was seamless Pages editing from my desktop, notebook, iPad, and iPhone. Now it looks like I'll have to have ML to actually make good on that hope, and with my notebook out of the equation, its no longer appealing to me. So, I'll take what I've learned from my Hackintosh and run with it. Something I find a little more than funny is that by obsoleting all these models, Apple has inadvertently pushed more users into a space where they become comfortable hacking kexts, kernels, and the EFI, furthering the OSx86 movement.

pdjudd
Feb 19, 2012, 10:54 PM
I would have been affected if my original macbook was still functional - it just recently had screen issues and needed a replacement and I just got a 2011 MacBook Pro that will perfectly support ML (which I plan on installing shortly after it’s released. Might need to get more RAM but I’ll cross that bridge when I get there. I’m not worried nor am I upset about the timing of the OS announcement. I needed to get it when I bought it.

Ungibbed
Feb 20, 2012, 11:48 AM
I'm running with a Macbook Pro 2,2 and will be hacking the hell out of ML to get it to run. With iCloud/Lion, the biggest feature I wanted was seamless Pages editing from my desktop, notebook, iPad, and iPhone. Now it looks like I'll have to have ML to actually make good on that hope, and with my notebook out of the equation, its no longer appealing to me. So, I'll take what I've learned from my Hackintosh and run with it. Something I find a little more than funny is that by obsoleting all these models, Apple has inadvertently pushed more users into a space where they become comfortable hacking kexts, kernels, and the EFI, furthering the OSx86 movement.

It's funny you mentioned that, a friend of mine brought by an older looking Dell notebook running Lion almost perfectly. The drawback was he could not get OpenGL working properly other than that, it actually ran rather well. I remember the early OS X86 craze with early Tiger builds.

I managed to get my old Pentium 4HT Gateway notebook working very well but could not get audio as Gateway used an odd sound solution. What was rather surprising was getting much older PC hardware working including the old Intel 855 GME video chipset working. Other hardware in my old Gateway just by happenstance was used in the MacBook 1,1 (wireless, Bluetooth, FireWire, and Ethernet worked right away, the only hurdles were native .kexts for the older 855 Intel video and my audio never worked. Rosetta BTW, screamed on the Pentium 4 HT processor running at 2.8Ghz (supporting emulated features of a G3 processor at the time when showing hardware info in Photoshop 7 but a speed that a G3 would never see).

It was a fun project to try out but being so early for Intel in the wild really limited it's usefulness and I was forced to use Windows until I bought a newer Mac. :apple:

Senseotech
Feb 20, 2012, 02:50 PM
It's funny you mentioned that, a friend of mine brought by an older looking Dell notebook running Lion almost perfectly. The drawback was he could not get OpenGL working properly other than that, it actually ran rather well. I remember the early OS X86 craze with early Tiger builds.

I managed to get my old Pentium 4HT Gateway notebook working very well but could not get audio as Gateway used an odd sound solution. What was rather surprising was getting much older PC hardware working including the old Intel 855 GME video chipset working. Other hardware in my old Gateway just by happenstance was used in the MacBook 1,1 (wireless, Bluetooth, FireWire, and Ethernet worked right away, the only hurdles were native .kexts for the older 855 Intel video and my audio never worked. Rosetta BTW, screamed on the Pentium 4 HT processor running at 2.8Ghz (supporting emulated features of a G3 processor at the time when showing hardware info in Photoshop 7 but a speed that a G3 would never see).

It was a fun project to try out but being so early for Intel in the wild really limited it's usefulness and I was forced to use Windows until I bought a newer Mac. :apple:

The whole scene now is much more matured, to the point where I can safely say a hackintosh i5 is my main setup, with a performance-per-dollar ratio that blows any mac out of the water. Sure I miss the elegance and beauty of the hardware, but on my college kid budget it was the best solution for me at the time, and it only fuels my desire to get a MBA once my student debt is in a better position. Hopefully all of the work from the community can give a stay of execution to many of the older Macs with ML, my X1600-toting Macbook Pro included.

linkboy
Feb 20, 2012, 07:53 PM
Thanks for your reply. May I ask what you base your assessment on?

I have a 2.2ghz MBP with the Core2Duo in it (the last before the Unibody MBP's came out).

I've currently got Mountain Lion on it and its running great.

jabbawok
Apr 11, 2012, 03:10 PM
Got DP2 running on my upgraded Mac Pro 1,1 (1,2 firmware update, E5345 CPUs)
Had to use Chameleon to emulate EFI64 and boot it, but runs pretty well.
http://www.jabbawok.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/jabbamac.jpg

MJL
Apr 11, 2012, 06:38 PM
I did not wait till I was going to be affected by anything - once I discovered the built in obsolescence of OS X and the software running on it I switched back to Windows 7. I might stick with the hardware since in the PC world there is no similar small form factor computer with the same low background noise as a Mac mini but Windows 7 it is for me for the time being.

panzer06
Apr 13, 2012, 12:43 PM
I am confused as to whether my Macbook Pro will be able to run ML. I have the last MBP released before the macbook went unibody. (Macbook Pro 4.1, 2.5 GHz Core Duo 2, mid 2008).
Although according to system profiler I am not running a 64-bit kernel, I do have the Nvidia 8600M chip which I read somewhere means I would be able to run ML.

Can anyone confirm this? :confused:There doesn't seem to be definitive answer anywhere. :confused:

Perhaps ML will run until the defective 8600M dies on you and you can't use it at all.

Cheers,

wolfpackfan
Apr 13, 2012, 03:38 PM
My plan was to go out an buy a new Mac mini (which I did). My old Mac mini is still on SL.

50voltphantom
Apr 14, 2012, 01:11 PM
So far, my 2008 iMac still appears to be supported. Mountain Lion would be the 4th OS to run on this machine. Not too bad.......

Madd the Sane
Apr 16, 2012, 01:45 PM
I'm running an old Mac mini with a GMA 950 that I use as a server. I would really like to be able to have ML Server loaded on it, but if not, no big loss. My Main machine will be supported, though.

Tower-Union
Apr 16, 2012, 05:19 PM
My ][e can't run this?!?! I'M OUTRAGED!

Not to single out Gemütlichkeit, as I'm not sure if his sarcasm is real or not, but I've seen this sort of (serious) mocker come from a lot of people lately. My complaint isn't that my old hardware can't run OS X 10.6, my complaint is that I purchased my Mac Pro 1,1 SPECIFICALLY because Apple advertised it as 64 bit, and I wanted something that would be compatible in the future when 64 bit was mainstream. It is capable of running any 64 bit app, AND Windows 64 bit, the only reason 10.8 won't run is because Apple hamstrung it with a lousy EFI.

Also, the argument of "oh well its 6 years old, blah blah blah doesn't cut it. With a SSD, 10 gigs of ram and 2GB Radeon HD 6870 it can run circles around any iMac or Mac Mini that is "supported".

Bottom line, APPLE LIED TO ME about what I was spending $3k on. :(

Gemütlichkeit
Apr 16, 2012, 06:09 PM
Not to single out Gemütlichkeit, as I'm not sure if his sarcasm is real or not, but I've seen this sort of (serious) mocker come from a lot of people lately. My complaint isn't that my old hardware can't run OS X 10.6, my complaint is that I purchased my Mac Pro 1,1 SPECIFICALLY because Apple advertised it as 64 bit, and I wanted something that would be compatible in the future when 64 bit was mainstream. It is capable of running any 64 bit app, AND Windows 64 bit, the only reason 10.8 won't run is because Apple hamstrung it with a lousy EFI.

Also, the argument of "oh well its 6 years old, blah blah blah doesn't cut it. With a SSD, 10 gigs of ram and 2GB Radeon HD 6870 it can run circles around any iMac or Mac Mini that is "supported".

Bottom line, APPLE LIED TO ME about what I was spending $3k on. :(Apple didn't promise you anything and what you did was just assume. Apple is running a business, I know going in that one day my hardware don't run the latest software.

Tower-Union
Apr 16, 2012, 08:36 PM
No, I didn't. They specifically marketed it as a 64-bit machine, instead it is software locked from being able to do what they claimed.

KurtangleTN
Apr 16, 2012, 10:48 PM
It's just vintage Apple on display. Cutting off Macs that are going to be less than 4 years old. You could have bought a Macbook back in January 09 and now not been able to keep up with the latest OS. The Mac Mini had a GMA950 (how pathetic) all the way up to March of 09.

As if those Macs truly couldn't run whatever useless iOS bullcrap they're adding now.

Apple either failed to think ahead with their models and now the customers are paying or they completely are just carrying on with their planned obsolescence model.

I don't even care about the latest updates, the iOS crap, and all the other completely useless features they'll be adding. The issue with Apple is if you stay behind in the walled garden you're left for dead. Look at how they treated Leopard and Tiger users with the recent malware. Over 20% of the active userbase and they did nothing for them. No Java updates, nothing, you're on your own.. good luck!

This is my last Apple desktop for certain. All in ones are a "bag of hurt". The power to price ratio sucks and not only are they the epitome of planned obsolescence but hilariously they defy their own reason for existing. Apple always uses that ridiculous comparison of wires on a full sized desktop but if you saw my desk right now, I need an external USB hub because 3 ports is a joke, I need an external HD because the HD inside isn't user serviceable, I need an external card reader, and if I were to stick with Apple I'd need an external Blu Ray player to boot.

As far as notebooks, when the time comes for me to upgrade I'll also be think of switching, but I've gotta admit it's hard to beat Apple's all around game when it comes to notebooks.

east85
Apr 17, 2012, 12:46 AM
It's just vintage Apple on display. Cutting off Macs that are going to be less than 4 years old. You could have bought a Macbook back in January 09 and now not been able to keep up with the latest OS. The Mac Mini had a GMA950 (how pathetic) all the way up to March of 09.

As if those Macs truly couldn't run whatever useless iOS bullcrap they're adding now.

Apple either failed to think ahead with their models and now the customers are paying or they completely are just carrying on with their planned obsolescence model.

I don't even care about the latest updates, the iOS crap, and all the other completely useless features they'll be adding. The issue with Apple is if you stay behind in the walled garden you're left for dead. Look at how they treated Leopard and Tiger users with the recent malware. Over 20% of the active userbase and they did nothing for them. No Java updates, nothing, you're on your own.. good luck!

This is my last Apple desktop for certain. All in ones are a "bag of hurt". The power to price ratio sucks and not only are they the epitome of planned obsolescence but hilariously they defy their own reason for existing. Apple always uses that ridiculous comparison of wires on a full sized desktop but if you saw my desk right now, I need an external USB hub because 3 ports is a joke, I need an external HD because the HD inside isn't user serviceable, I need an external card reader, and if I were to stick with Apple I'd need an external Blu Ray player to boot.

As far as notebooks, when the time comes for me to upgrade I'll also be think of switching, but I've gotta admit it's hard to beat Apple's all around game when it comes to notebooks.

They released a cleaning tool that will identify and remove the most common variants of Flashback. I think it would be more proper though if they had released a Java fix as well. It would be unfair to say that they have done nothing, because they have done something, but it's not enough.

I am on a Macbook 5,1 and am unaffected.

Macman45
Apr 17, 2012, 12:49 AM
It looks like my mother's Mac is too old to support Mountain Lion. I, however, do not have any Macs too old to support ML.

Same here, all pretty new stuff, so no issues.

q64ceo
Apr 17, 2012, 02:37 AM
No offense, guys, but if you are using a 2006-2007 model you have no room to complain.

There is a reason why these devices are gonna lose their support. Besides making you open up your wallet again, they also do not have to deal with old technology getting in the way of innovation.

Just get yourself a Mac Mini, they are cheap these days. Hell, Hackintosh is the way to go if you dont want to hurt your bank.

KurtangleTN
Apr 17, 2012, 03:20 AM
They released a cleaning tool that will identify and remove the most common variants of Flashback. I think it would be more proper though if they had released a Java fix as well. It would be unfair to say that they have done nothing, because they have done something, but it's not enough.

I am on a Macbook 5,1 and am unaffected.

I don't think you understood what I'm saying.. I'm not commenting on their horrible handling of not updating java.. I'm saying they completely left Leopard users out in the cold with no java update, no protection, nothing. Hell, there isn't a flashback removal tool even for Snow Leopard, it's just Lion.

Leopard users compose of nearly 20% of the active Mac userbase. That's a large chunk of people to flip the bird to.

Leopard is 5 years old, yes, but it should still receive patches to fix critical holes like this. Not to mention it basically had all support cut off after 4 years.

Look at how Microsoft supports their OSes, not just XP either. Windows 7 has a 11 year long term support plan. Support will not end until 2020. It's completely irresponsible for Apple to use security updates as a hostage to upgrade, but that's what they do.

The sad thing is many of the people who run older versions of OS X just simply aren't really techies, maybe older, or simply not into computers all that much. They are completely oblivious to the point that if they open the wrong Google image or Wordpress site that they may be infected. They are basically running around naked, and this is around 20% of the active Mac userbase.


No offense, guys, but if you are using a 2006-2007 model you have no room to complain.

There is a reason why these devices are gonna lose their support. Besides making you open up your wallet again, they also do not have to deal with old technology getting in the way of innovation.

Just get yourself a Mac Mini, they are cheap these days. Hell, Hackintosh is the way to go if you dont want to hurt your bank.

You do realize that some of these models go as far forward as 2009? Including the Mac Mini and the Macbook? Two of their most popular models.

There is no way that these models aren't capable of running the OS and if some shocking move Apple comes out with a whole new UI that taxes the systems too much then you'd really have to blame Apple because they decided it would be a smart idea to put a horrible GPU in $600 and $1000 systems, just so they could make their more expensive stuff more appealing.

MissKreeps
Apr 17, 2012, 03:29 AM
It does effect me as im on an old white macbook late 2009 thats running 10.5 still, but im not worried really as im only gonna upgrade this to snow leopard and thatll be it i dont really need it to be the latest OS X but i don't like some of the issues with software compatibility i keep running into cause I'm not running 10.6 or later and my machine will run 10.6 smoother then the later OS Xs anyway

and if i ever want mountain lion i always have my mac mini its a 2011 model running lion atm so thatll be mountain lion compatible

q64ceo
Apr 17, 2012, 06:35 AM
You do realize that some of these models go as far forward as 2009? Including the Mac Mini and the Macbook? Two of their most popular models.

Yes, thats why I specifically referred to the 2006-2007 models. No one can sit there and tell me that the x1600 is still top-of-the line electronics.

KurtangleTN
Apr 17, 2012, 09:25 PM
Yes, thats why I specifically referred to the 2006-2007 models. No one can sit there and tell me that the x1600 is still top-of-the line electronics.

But do you actually believe it's not good enough to run the operating system? Unless Apple is changing the UI dramatically, let's not fool ourselves. We're talking about running an operating system, not playing a high end game.

This is all on Apple. They decided to shave some profit, use a cheaper GPU and now they are using it as an excuse to drop them. The fact that you could buy a high end computer as little as 3 years ago with a GPU that weak is mind boggling.

*LTD*
Apr 18, 2012, 08:00 AM
Run the latest OS that *is* supported by your Mac.

Get another year or two out of your Mac. Then move on or simply continue for as long as you can. Problem solved.

Pheo
Apr 18, 2012, 09:10 AM
I would hope at a minimum to get 3 years of updates to my MacMini (matching AppleCare) plus further 2 years of security updates only.

I'd be a bit disappointed with less than this. However more may well limit ability to innovate.

KurtangleTN
Apr 20, 2012, 09:16 PM
I would hope at a minimum to get 3 years of updates to my MacMini (matching AppleCare) plus further 2 years of security updates only.

I'd be a bit disappointed with less than this. However more may well limit ability to innovate.

Yeah all the great innovations in 10.8 and 10.7 :rolleyes:

McKs
Apr 21, 2012, 11:02 AM
I have an iMac that is effected by this, but I don't care. I didn't even upgrade it to Lion (I do actual work on that machine, something Lion, imo is not exactly optimised for...)
I can't wait to upgrade my MBA to ML though

freespeed
May 11, 2012, 02:36 PM
I have an iMac (Mid-2007), upgraded to an SSD and now it runs faster and smoother than ever before. Kind of a shame that Apple will not provide support for a computer that I consider more than capable of handling Mountain Lion. Just seems like another money grab tactic to get users to upgrade.

blow45
May 12, 2012, 10:24 PM
I don't think you understood what I'm saying.. I'm not commenting on their horrible handling of not updating java.. I'm saying they completely left Leopard users out in the cold with no java update, no protection, nothing. Hell, there isn't a flashback removal tool even for Snow Leopard, it's just Lion.

Leopard users compose of nearly 20% of the active Mac userbase. That's a large chunk of people to flip the bird to.

Leopard is 5 years old, yes, but it should still receive patches to fix critical holes like this. Not to mention it basically had all support cut off after 4 years.

Look at how Microsoft supports their OSes, not just XP either. Windows 7 has a 11 year long term support plan. Support will not end until 2020. It's completely irresponsible for Apple to use security updates as a hostage to upgrade, but that's what they do.

The sad thing is many of the people who run older versions of OS X just simply aren't really techies, maybe older, or simply not into computers all that much. They are completely oblivious to the point that if they open the wrong Google image or Wordpress site that they may be infected. They are basically running around naked, and this is around 20% of the active Mac userbase.




You do realize that some of these models go as far forward as 2009? Including the Mac Mini and the Macbook? Two of their most popular models.

There is no way that these models aren't capable of running the OS and if some shocking move Apple comes out with a whole new UI that taxes the systems too much then you'd really have to blame Apple because they decided it would be a smart idea to put a horrible GPU in $600 and $1000 systems, just so they could make their more expensive stuff more appealing.
Qft, best post in the thread by far.

That's apple for us these days, a 3 year old macbook or mini can't run a 2012 os, or to be more precise the service pack to their rubbish previous os. All that to premium priced, 50% margin computers. Unbeeffinglivable...

freespeed
May 13, 2012, 12:55 AM
Qft, best post in the thread by far.

That's apple for us these days, a 3 year old macbook or mini can't run a 2012 os, or to be more precise the service pack to their rubbish previous os. All that to premium priced, 50% margin computers. Unbeeffinglivable...

Welcome to the post Steve jobs money grab. Full soulless corporatism in effect. Just take a walk inside the apple store, they're taking full advantage of there effect on customers who lust over "the new" and next status symbol from Apple and I'm not just talking trash because I asked Siri and she agrees.

torana355
May 13, 2012, 01:35 AM
So far, my 2008 iMac still appears to be supported. Mountain Lion would be the 4th OS to run on this machine. Not too bad.......

My 2008 imac is not supported as it uses the ati 2600 video card, i assume you have the 8800 model? Anyway i will upgrade to ML on my 2011 MBA and get a new imac :)

jeanlain
May 13, 2012, 03:05 AM
2006 Mac Pro. I'm pissed that it won't run ML because Apple never provided a firmware update. I don't think hacking will be a viable solution (2006 Mac Pros booting the 64 bit firmware have no sound, among other issues).

----------

No offense, guys, but if you are using a 2006-2007 model you have no room to complain.

There is a reason why these devices are gonna lose their support. Besides making you open up your wallet again, they also do not have to deal with old technology getting in the way of innovation.
My Mac Pro isn't getting in the way of anything. It has been sold up to early 2008 and is more than powerful enough to run ML. It's much more powerful than my MacBook Pro, which is supported.

rrgjl
May 13, 2012, 03:35 AM
But are they completely cutting off support for the Mac's that don't support ML, or will they simply not be able to run the newest version of OS X, however still receive updates?

shinobi-81
May 13, 2012, 04:38 AM
If I get cut off from upgrading the OS and from critical security fixes within 3-4 years after the purchase date of a Mac, I will be really mad. In comparison, Windows XP has been supported with updates for more than a decade after its release in 2001.

When I buy expensive computers, I expect to use them for at least 5-6 years. One can always use an outdated Mac mini as a media center, file server or a kid's toy - but I do feel sorry for the Mac Pro users who have invested thousands of dollars in one single computer only to experience this. :(

maril1111
May 13, 2012, 05:03 AM
No offense, guys, but if you are using a 2006-2007 model you have no room to complain.

There is a reason why these devices are gonna lose their support. Besides making you open up your wallet again, they also do not have to deal with old technology getting in the way of innovation.

Just get yourself a Mac Mini, they are cheap these days. Hell, Hackintosh is the way to go if you dont want to hurt your bank.

than please explain why my macbook that was built in early 2008 and has an intel x3100 card looses support but my dads imac built in mid 2007 doesnt...?

rctlr
May 13, 2012, 05:23 AM
yeah, my mac mini is 4 years old now. Still works a treat. It would be nice to have all the new bright and shiny, but I can wait.

emoore
May 13, 2012, 11:51 AM
Well wait, isn't being able to upgrade the OS and getting OS support two different things? Yes Windows XP was supported for 10 years but I would not expect to be able to install and run Vista or 7 on a machine that is 10 years or even 5 years old! SL is still getting security updates and I'm guess Lion will still be getting updates long after ML is out. No Apple does not support OSes as long a MS but there seems to be some confusion between getting updates and being able to run the newest OS.

flkd
May 13, 2012, 01:14 PM
No offense, guys, but if you are using a 2006-2007 model you have no room to complain.

There is a reason why these devices are gonna lose their support. Besides making you open up your wallet again, they also do not have to deal with old technology getting in the way of innovation.

Just get yourself a Mac Mini, they are cheap these days. Hell, Hackintosh is the way to go if you dont want to hurt your bank.

That is crap. Users with 2006/2007 machines do have the right to complain, especially with Apple's extortionate prices. As for old tech getting in the way of innovation, bull, plain bull. It's no skin off Apple's nose to add a few extra drivers for older hardware when feasible. They have made an arbitrary cull at the software level, this forces the choice out of the hands of users and forces them to either fall behind in OS terms or buy even more expensive hardware.

I will be mostly unaffected by this (our oldest white Macbook has developed severe case fractures anyway) but I can sure understand any fellow Mac user who is furious about this.

If Mac Mini's are so cheap, are you going to volunteer to help others out who cannot afford to upgrade? I don't think so.

InuNacho
May 13, 2012, 02:21 PM
There was a time not to long ago when Apple supported older hardware and we loved them because of it.

My trusty 500Mhz PM G4 could run Tiger on day one, thats a 5 and half year computer running the latest greatest OS on launch but wait, it gets better. The Power Mac G3s yes G3 could run Tiger as well. Did I mention that my G4 could take a cheap CPU upgrade and put it in Leopard territory? Thats 8 years out up to date OSes of the same hardware.

Will Apple let a 2006 Mac Pro run ML when a 2006 Mac Pro with a $200 CPU upgrade wipes the floor with almost everything Apple currently sells? Of course not, Apple no longer truly cares for it's Macs.

My main machine right now is an early 08 Blackbook and it will forever stay on SL. I will be getting a 09 Pro and CPU upgrade it if and when new Pros are released. It too will run SL for as long as possible.

Starfighter
May 13, 2012, 02:26 PM
I'm only running macs with PPC so this has no effect on me what so ever.

blow45
May 13, 2012, 05:27 PM
Welcome to the post Steve jobs money grab. Full soulless corporatism in effect. Just take a walk inside the apple store, they're taking full advantage of there effect on customers who lust over "the new" and next status symbol from Apple and I'm not just talking trash because I asked Siri and she agrees.

That is crap. Users with 2006/2007 machines do have the right to complain, especially with Apple's extortionate prices. As for old tech getting in the way of innovation, bull, plain bull. It's no skin off Apple's nose to add a few extra drivers for older hardware when feasible. They have made an arbitrary cull at the software level, this forces the choice out of the hands of users and forces them to either fall behind in OS terms or buy even more expensive hardware.

I will be mostly unaffected by this (our oldest white Macbook has developed severe case fractures anyway) but I can sure understand any fellow Mac user who is furious about this.

If Mac Mini's are so cheap, are you going to volunteer to help others out who cannot afford to upgrade? I don't think so.
Amen brothers.

What's even more insulting is that ml is really a service pack, and that's the only honest truth about what it is - the alternative is to think notepad, reminders, notifications and twitter deserve an os release. They are not just disallowing older mac users from running a new os, they are actually disallowing them to run a service pack to a by most accounts rather poor os release and fix the problems it's created for them to begin with.

And all that just after disallowing the previous os users, snow leopard's users, from having basic sync functionality for their ios devices via icloud, when a lot of them already did have that functionality via a paid service mm (and a poor one for that matter) on snow leopard. We are not offering you syncing anymore, and instead of thanking you for sticking with us for the pain in the ass that was mobile me (SJ's admission) by enabling icloud on your sl system we are asking you to pay more to get the next os to get back the functionality you used to have, whether you like it or not, cause we are pimping it and forcing adoption of it this way.

If that isn't shameful behaviour from a computer (well...) company to its user base of premium priced products I don't know what is.

MacAndrew07
Jul 28, 2012, 12:02 PM
I have a Core Duo Mac Mini from 2007. It has Snow Leopard on it (10.6.8), ;( ;( I feel like I'm the only one with SL. But I'm probably buying a 11 inch Air soon. ;)

haravikk
Jul 28, 2012, 12:13 PM
You don't have the Not Affect but worried option that covers me :P

My Mac Pro only just made the grade for Mountain Lion, while all my other family machines should be okay for the future. However, it has me worried that 10.8 may be my last update for the Mac Pro.

That said, I can't think of anything off hand that distinguishes the machine as being worth dropping, i.e - it has solid 64-bit support and the NVidia GeForce 8800 is still a perfectly good GPU, though I'm concerned that it might lose out if Apple forges ahead with newer OpenGL support or such, though I haven't had a good look at compatibility to see if that's the case.

It means I'm extra anxious about the future of the Mac Pro line, as while I don't really need much more than what I have now, it might soon be time to think about upgrading, if I can afford it.

throAU
Jul 28, 2012, 12:34 PM
My mini is affected, but it is over 3 years old now, only has 2-3gb ram MAX anyway, so it is time to move it on due to other reasons anyway.

It currently runs Lion server (test/toy box), I might run Linux or FreeBSD on it instead, or just stick with Lion.

----------

I'm starting to wonder if Apple deprecated the older machines simply because they wanted to stop having to port older video drivers.


Pretty sure this is on the money. Its quite possible they subcontract out video driver development to the hardware OEM, and the OEM no longer maintains the code (or the cost to re-write for 64 bit OS X kernel was excessive). Do the affected video cards get new windows drivers on a regular basis? I suspect not...

Apple are not a 3d hardware driver company. They integrate and write operating systems.

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You don't have the Not Affect but worried option that covers me :P

My Mac Pro only just made the grade for Mountain Lion, while all my other family machines should be okay for the future. However, it has me worried that 10.8 may be my last update for the Mac Pro.

I reckon you'll be OK (gut feeling), despite the whining there were valid reasons apple dropped the machines they did with ML. 64 bit only kernel ruled out a lot of kernel extension/drivers that were required for old machine hardware that the OEM probably doesn't support any more.

Apple won't be dumping 64 bit kernels any time soon.