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View Full Version : 10.8 Moutain Lion carries 6950/70 fix (and Fermi refinements too) !!!




MacVidCards
Feb 16, 2012, 07:47 PM
As confirmed by 2 separate parties, the use of 6950 and 6970 is now possible in stock version of 10.8.

With any luck this will give Netkas the pieces needed to bring this fix to 10.7.3

7970 still not going yet in 10.8

There is now built-in support for GTX5xx cards in 10.8 and it seems we no longer will need to edit AGPM, the cards are now self throttling.



ActionableMango
Feb 16, 2012, 08:04 PM
It's fantastic to finally see support for newer cards and Nvidia improvements.

A 7000 series card might very well drag me out of Snow Leopard and into Lion territory.

wonderspark
Feb 16, 2012, 08:11 PM
10.8 will run PC cards as is? No more need for special Apple cards, or is that still needed?

MacVidCards
Feb 16, 2012, 08:23 PM
10.8 will run PC cards as is? No more need for special Apple cards, or is that still needed?

Until all video cards come with an EFI ROM and a regular BIOS, there will always be a need for EFI added or emulated.

This isn't the place for a primer on EFI.

The grey boot screen that appears when you push power on button has nothing whatsoever to do with drivers, OS, or anything on your hard drive.

What I am reporting is that the much troubled 6950/70 project no longer requires special drivers to work. The drivers in 10.8 are complete.

Netkas offered up an EFI64 ROM for 6950/70 cards. COmbine it with your 6950/70 BIOS and in 10.8 you have a functional card, no additional hacks needed.

As far as GTX5xx cards go, the brilliant guy who wrote the GTX470/80 EFI will need to take another shot at GTX5xx cards. All of his efforts have ended in misery so far. As is, you can use GTX5xx cards using ATY_Init, same as before, but now you don't need to edit the device id into the drivers or fiddle faddle with AGPM.

Everything written here can be googled, I would rather move discussion forward rather than list a bunch of definitions that anyone can google for themselves.

I next need to see how 6870 and Quadro 6000 behave

ClassObject
Feb 16, 2012, 08:53 PM
This isn't the place for a primer on EFI.

Why not? Give it up. 6870 works great.

wonderspark
Feb 16, 2012, 09:09 PM
Sorry to annoy you so. "Built-in support" read as plug-n-play in my mind. I thought that would be amazing. So, in my stupid mind, nothing new for my world.

BigJohno
Feb 16, 2012, 09:25 PM
This is great news! I will take a 6970 but a 7xxx series card would be better...

MacVidCards
Feb 22, 2012, 04:20 AM
10.8 will run PC cards as is? No more need for special Apple cards, or is that still needed?

I have discovered that a Mac Pro 1,1 can use a 6950/70 in ML.

You won't see boot screens, but card self initializes and can even run 4 displays.

This is in a Mac Pro 1,1 so the card's 64 bit EFI has nothing to do with it. The 10.8 DP has drivers that work quite well with the card. (iTunes is the exception)

Many ATI cards have had this functionality since 10.6.6 MBP release. 10.6.8 included it and all 10.7 releases have had it. Some 5xxx cards don't have working DP when run this way, but they can be flashed for better support, though maybe not all will work as hoped.

But 10.8 is unique, up until this OS release the only way to get the cards to work was to use special drivers that Netkas "fixed". Now the drivers come working A-OK right from Cupertino.

We are hopeful that 10.7.4 will have this same functionality. Once this is the case, the 5870 will no longer be king of the ATI/AMD hill in our Mac Pros. (with 7970 somewhere in the future too)

Concorde Rules
Feb 22, 2012, 07:52 AM
So what stage are we know with PC cards (Flashed or otherwise)?

For example, if I popped a 5870 or 6970 into my MP in replace of my Apple 4870, will everything work just as it should Edit: With the necessary firmware/kexts?

The bold bit is important, if it doesn't work, then it is NOT a solution.

ActionableMango
Feb 23, 2012, 11:52 AM
For example, if I popped a 5870 or 6970 into my MP in replace of my Apple 4870, will everything work just as it should?

No.

MacVidCards
Feb 23, 2012, 02:38 PM
So what stage are we know with PC cards (Flashed or otherwise)?

For example, if I popped a 5870 or 6970 into my MP in replace of my Apple 4870, will everything work just as it should?

The bold bit is important, if it doesn't work, then it is NOT a solution.

That's funny.

So we should only report GPU discoveries when they are 100% perfect with no effort or bother required from the user?

ALOT of people have bought 6870s and placed them in their Mac Pro and been thrilled with results. No flashing or hacks are needed for basic functionality. I am pointing out that the same behavior is coming from 6950/70 when used in 10.8.

Many would consider that good news.

If you want everything perfect and functional from the second you yank it out of the box, The Apple Store is your friend. A 5770 or 5870 will do as you have asked. (Unless of course you try to use an OS or System Disk prior to 10.6.5, in which case you will be rather disappointed. It won't work at all, much less "just as it should")

Maybe you'd better hold on to that 4870......

Concorde Rules
Feb 23, 2012, 02:53 PM
That's funny.

So we should only report GPU discoveries when they are 100% perfect with no effort or bother required from the user?

ALOT of people have bought 6870s and placed them in their Mac Pro and been thrilled with results. No flashing or hacks are needed for basic functionality. I am pointing out that the same behavior is coming from 6950/70 when used in 10.8.

Many would consider that good news.

If you want everything perfect and functional from the second you yank it out of the box, The Apple Store is your friend. A 5770 or 5870 will do as you have asked. (Unless of course you try to use an OS or System Disk prior to 10.6.5, in which case you will be rather disappointed. It won't work at all, much less "just as it should")

Maybe you'd better hold on to that 4870......

Never said you shouldn't report it, I asked, if you read it again "what stage where we at?" I've edited my original post for clarification.

I'm not adverse to flashing GPUs or messing with the kernel, been there, done that and would quite happily do that if the end result would mean that I'd have a boot screen, games working (Steam), iTunes (Some kernel panic at the moment I see), mDP and DVI ports working, etc.

Just because people have fitted 6870s into a MP (Believe me, I want to get rid of my 4870) and were thrilled doesn't mean they have to avoid doing something (E.g. Launch iTunes) in order for it to work.

So, if I bought a 6870 (one with the correct firmware, ports, etc), flashed it and installed whatever kernel extensions, what *wouldn't* work?

wonderspark
Feb 23, 2012, 03:17 PM
Never said you shouldn't report it, I asked, if you read it again "what stage where we at?" I've edited my original post for clarification.

I'm not adverse to flashing GPUs or messing with the kernel, been there, done that and would quite happily do that if the end result would mean that I'd have a boot screen, games working (Steam), iTunes (Some kernel panic at the moment I see), mDP and DVI ports working, etc.

Just because people have fitted 6870s into a MP (Believe me, I want to get rid of my 4870) and were thrilled doesn't mean they have to avoid doing something (E.g. Launch iTunes) in order for it to work.

So, if I bought a 6870 (one with the correct firmware, ports, etc), flashed it and installed whatever kernel extensions, what *wouldn't* work?
I was thrown off by the post as well, and after what read to me like a condescending reply, determined that MacVidCards is probably someone I wouldn't hang out with in person. I know a lot of people who know more than I do, but they're usually better about educating people than what I've seen in this thread, because this post is apparently for people who already know all about flashing GPUs, and everyone else can just go elsewhere if they want more information.

Us dummies is be polluting the thread with stoopid questions that the elite can't be bothered to answer without a rotten attitude.

MacVidCards
Feb 23, 2012, 04:18 PM
I was thrown off by the post as well, and after what read to me like a condescending reply, determined that MacVidCards is probably someone I wouldn't hang out with in person. I know a lot of people who know more than I do, but they're usually better about educating people than what I've seen in this thread, because this post is apparently for people who already know all about flashing GPUs, and everyone else can just go elsewhere if they want more information.

Us dummies is be polluting the thread with stoopid questions that the elite can't be bothered to answer without a rotten attitude.

Hold on, let me get out my spoon....

I'm just trying to report news of 10.8, why am I required to regurgitate all of the 6870 and other info which is contained here on these very boards?

The info is there, why not do a simple search and apply some critical thought?

The info is there guys. Either read it and learn or remain blissfully unaware. I refuse to give each new person their own personal interpretation.

It is not my job to "educate you", it is your job.

wonderspark
Feb 23, 2012, 04:36 PM
I've educated myself, but your choice of words can be misleading at times.

Can you put your spoon down and answer a simple question, or do you simply lack the confidence in your knowledge to answer in a sentence or two? You wrote more to belittle others than it would have taken to tell Concord Rules what wouldn't work... several times over.

Just because you're having a terrible month doesn't mean you should drag everyone else down with you. Goodness, man.

MacVidCards
Feb 23, 2012, 04:49 PM
I've educated myself, but your choice of words can be misleading at times.

Can you put your spoon down and answer a simple question, or do you simply lack the confidence in your knowledge to answer in a sentence or two? You wrote more to belittle others than it would have taken to tell Concord Rules what wouldn't work... several times over.

Just because you're having a terrible month doesn't mean you should drag everyone else down with you. Goodness, man.

Google and the "Search" bar up on right corner are your friends. Feel free to use them when you have a break from analyzing other people's lives.

I REFUSE TO ANSWER QUESTIONS THAT HAVE BEEN ANSWERED AT LEAST A DOZEN TIMES BEFORE. IF YOU DON'T LIKE THAT DON'T COME POSTING IN A THREAD I STARTED !!!

I'm sure that you are doing a grand service standing up for the rights of the Lowest Common Denominator, please just do it in someone else's thread.

highdefw
Feb 23, 2012, 05:01 PM
So what the OP is saying is that the 6000 series is simply plug and play? As if I bought it directly from apple like a 5770? As for NVidia, are you saying I should start saving up for a GTX 580???!!!

wonderspark
Feb 23, 2012, 05:03 PM
Google and the "Search" bar up on right corner are your friends. Feel free to use them when you have a break from analyzing other people's lives.

I REFUSE TO ANSWER QUESTIONS THAT HAVE BEEN ANSWERED AT LEAST A DOZEN TIMES BEFORE. IF YOU DON'T LIKE THAT DON'T COME POSTING IN A THREAD I STARTED !!!

I'm sure that you are doing a grand service standing up for the rights of the Lowest Common Denominator, please just do it in someone else's thread.
Nice rant. I award you three stars for anger, but zero stars for useful information. Maybe someone who knows the answers to the questions of the LCD will stop by for some enlightenment.

MacVidCards
Feb 23, 2012, 05:23 PM
So what the OP is saying is that the 6000 series is simply plug and play? As if I bought it directly from apple like a 5770? As for NVidia, are you saying I should start saving up for a GTX 580???!!!


Thank you, I was beginning to wonder if anyone remembered why I started this thread. The 6870 has had basic functionality since the 10.6.6 MBP update. This functionality moved into the general OS in 10.6.8.

You will not see the EFI "Boot Screens" but desktop will appear. There have been many MANY reports on here and at Netkas regarding this. There are some limitations, but doing a search is best way to find experiences of a broad group of users.

If you have a Mac Pro 3,1 or later, you can flash card and gain boot screen and fix some of the other issues. For these machines, the cards are nearly flawless in that the lower DVI port will display a boot screen and the 2 MDP ports as well as the HDMI port can be used simultaneously for a total of 4 displays. If you buy one that only has 1 @ DP, you can only run 3 displays.

So far in 10.7, the only way to get a 6950 or 6970 to work was to use some patched drivers that the Great Mac God Netkas wrote. The amazing discovery in 10.8 was that the "it just works" behavior of 6870 has now moved to 69xx cards. And when they are flashed with an EFI written by Netkas, they have boot screen, etc. The only remaining big problem is that iTunes crashes out the system. Netkas knows how to fix, he may or may not fix the 10.8 DP drivers for this. Can't speak for him.

The GTX5xx cards have been able to be gotten working by usig ATY_Init in 10.7+. Unfortunately, you also need to add the device id to one kext and remove another kext to gain full power. The great thing in 10.8 is that neither kext fix is needed now. The cards just work, albeit with ATY_Init still needed. It is possible that the guy who wrote the EFI that boots GTX470 and GTX480 cards may someday get a GTX570/580 written, if he ever gets a chance.

My intention with this thread was to post info on NEW discoveries in 10.8. It was not to give a primer on Mac EFI and GPUs, nor was it to recount a history of which cards did what in what OSs.

This thread was started to discuss 10.8 and the new GPU options that are available in it. If there are people with questions about older OSs and older GPUs, they should read the pertinent threads on those. We move ahead when we build on past knowledge. To do so, we have to avail ourselves of it and not expect someone to regurgitate it to us at our leisure.

wonderspark
Feb 23, 2012, 06:04 PM
That last post of yours, along with:
7970 still not going yet in 10.8
would have been an excellent first post in this thread. Thank you... it's now moving forward!

ActionableMango
Feb 23, 2012, 07:21 PM
Just because people have fitted 6870s into a MP (Believe me, I want to get rid of my 4870) and were thrilled doesn't mean they have to avoid doing something (E.g. Launch iTunes) in order for it to work.

I haven't heard of inability to launch iTunes with 6870. Maybe you are thinking of 6950/6970.

wallysb01
Feb 23, 2012, 09:11 PM
Google and the "Search" bar up on right corner are your friends. Feel free to use them when you have a break from analyzing other people's lives.

I REFUSE TO ANSWER QUESTIONS THAT HAVE BEEN ANSWERED AT LEAST A DOZEN TIMES BEFORE. IF YOU DON'T LIKE THAT DON'T COME POSTING IN A THREAD I STARTED !!!

I'm sure that you are doing a grand service standing up for the rights of the Lowest Common Denominator, please just do it in someone else's thread.

Wow, you got issues. If you come here to tell people something is possible, you should probably expect questions about it....

Googling stuff like this is often not easy. That's why we have forums to ask/answer questions, like this one.

On a slight side note, why do people have some sort of sense of ownership over a thread they start? People aren't going to play by what ever rules you wish to try and enforce just because you pleasured us with starting the thread. Get over yourself.

pprior
Feb 23, 2012, 09:16 PM
Sorry to pollute this thread, but I have to LOL when I'm reading through this great news only to find that you can't even run this stuff without it puking all over itself when you try to do something esoteric like, say, open itunes....

Man I sold all my PC rigs close to 10 years ago just to get away from updating bios, flashing boards and endless driver conflicts. I can't in any way imagine why you all would want to inflict pain on yourself like that.....

But I return you to your regularly scheduled hackfest and wish you all well. Me, I'll just stick to what works.

derbothaus
Feb 23, 2012, 10:20 PM
It is great news. It is to be taken or left as so. If you know what is possible with the news, great. But no one should complain about free info. Not too many of you are testing cards and have access to many models to test against. So why complain about anything? Hacking does not always yield easy results. If you are so truly excited to get an upgrade, buy a card and try it yourself. You can always return it. Costing you very little. If this does not sound like a great idea you should probably wait for an official Apple upgrade card.

wallysb01
Feb 23, 2012, 11:21 PM
It is great news. It is to be taken or left as so. If you know what is possible with the news, great. But no one should complain about free info. Not too many of you are testing cards and have access to many models to test against. So why complain about anything? Hacking does not always yield easy results. If you are so truly excited to get an upgrade, buy a card and try it yourself. You can always return it. Costing you very little. If this does not sound like a great idea you should probably wait for an official Apple upgrade card.

I don't think anyone is complaining about this new capability of OSX. I think a few people were a little confused by the OP's few posts, asks some question, and the OP reacted poorly to them. Why get your panties in knot when someone unfamiliar with this kind of capability or is simply confused by word choices starts asking some questions? This is a forum to TALK right. The OP seems to think he's here to make some grand announcement and we're all just supposed to "get it" right off the bat.

To someone like me, who's happy to do anything short of recompiling the kernel, this was something I wasn't aware of. As such the OP's first few posts had me a little confused as well. A lot of people read these posts that have a large diversity of familiarity with computing. Plus, this is a computer forum, so its quite off-putting when someone behaves like the OP and essentially acts annoyed when asked to, you know, talk on a forum he posted to. But hey, I'm not trying to enforce some code of conduct here. I'm just saying my basic went something like this as reading down the post:

1) "Mac Pro's running 10.8 can use the better XXXX graphic cards, neat."
2) "Wait, not exactly, you need this EFI64 ROM and BIOS for the card too?"
3) "Oh ok, that doesn't sound too hard, I've done plenty of stuff similar to that. Anyway, too bad I don't care about GPUs"
4) "Jeez, this guy is kind of a DB."
5) "Wow, look at said DB blow up at the guy who asked the same questions I would have had I not being doing other things."

MacVidCards
Feb 24, 2012, 02:50 AM
4) "Jeez, this guy is kind of a DB."
5) "Wow, look at said DB blow up

Name calling is always a true sign of class.

It's funny that every day a new thread pops up where people lament the fact that the Mac Pro has lost it's "Pro" status due to the iToy Phenomenon.

These boards used to be a place to come and find out about latest Mac Hardware and how to get it running.

When I first needed 8800GT flashing info I came here. Nicely detailed threads where a group of like minded people worked out the mysteries around the EFI32 vs EFI64 versions.

This was the place for serious discourse and discovery.

I came here with info about a new discovery in 10.8 about a GPU that many people were curious about. I expected to get responses from people who had these cards or were ready to experiment with them. I was hoping that I could find some serious people ready to make some discoveries and move the general state of knowledge forward.

I did not expect that it was my personal responsibility to explain all aspects of every detail about all recent card flashing, etc. I honestly do not see that as my responsibility nor will I engage in it. It is very easy to tell questions asked by people who have interest and have done some research versus questions asked by tourists who saw something shiny in the window and decided to ask questions because they had their curiosity piqued as they surfed by.

So while members here bemoan the iToy dumbing down of the OS and their machines, you are now demanding that Pro level experimentation get dumbed down to entry level or you don't want to hear about it.

If I can't explain things so that every possible reader can understand, I am being a "DB". If I don't answer every question, no matter how infantile or foolish, I am being a "DB".

I made a discovery on Feb 16th and posted it on 2 sites. This discovery got posted as news at 3 or 4 sites before it finally got reposted in this very forum as "News" on the 21st. Oddly, nobody grilled the reposter or demanded that he explain in detail.

You want the latest info on Mac GPUs? It can't always be posted with pretty color photos, arrows, and a detailed step-by-step "How To". Sometimes it just gets posted and people who "get it" can do something with it. Sometimes you might even have to think for yourselves and use the search bar and google if you want the information to mean something to you. People who are interested and have motivation will do this and ask questions that show they cared enough to do some of their own research. And those people I will gladly help.

While people daily bemoan how OSX and Macs are getting brought down to a Lowest Common Denominator level for the 14 year old "facebooking from the mall" crowd, here I am getting dragged over the coals because I won't courteously answer any and every question regarding Mac GPUs. You can't have it both ways.

I feel that I am expected to only post GPU info that can be easily broken down into 4 word tweets, understandable by anybody. You can't have it both ways.

I will be happy to restrict my future posts to Netkas and InsanelyMac. You will end up with the same info here, just 5 days later from a reposter who CAN'T answer any questions. I quit posting here before and I'll be happy to do it again.

If this is no longer a place for cutting edge info, I'll be glad to take it elsewhere. If you look back, you'll see that I am not the only "pro" to quit posting here. When any serious discourse gets yelled down by the masses who demand that it gets explained to them until they understand, then nothing gets done here except rehashing reposts from the more serious boards. If that is what you guys want, great.

But for the life of me I can not understand why people can't be expected to avail themselves of things like "google" and the search function. When JimBob Johnson comes here and says he put a 6870 in his 2,1 and it ran his 24" Apple Display with no trouble in 10.6.8, he meant it. He didn't hallucinate, he isn't likely a mole from AMD trying to move an extra 10 boards, and he probably isn't a vicious scoundrel playing tricks upon the Macrumours community. In other words, whenever a member here says they tried something and it worked...IT WORKED FOR THEM AND IT WILL PROABLY WORK FOR YOU TOO.

The reverse of that is that when someone comes on here and says their unlashed 5870 stopped running their DisplayPort monitor when they ran the 10.6.8 update, they didn't suddenly go blind or crazy. So if you have an unlashed 6870, running the 10.6.8 will probably make your DisplayPort Display go black too. You have a tremendous resource here, USE IT !!!

Every time someone asks a question that could easily be answered with some simple research the value of all the past experience here is being tossed in the trash. They are in effect saying, "I don't believe anything anyone has posted in the past, I want an answer custom crafted just for me." This totally devalues the wealth of experience that hundreds of members have had.

All GPU info can't be reduced to something easily readable on an iPhone screen. Aim higher. Do you want cutting edge info posted here by people making discoveries or do you want to rehash some reposts from the "pro" sites?

It is this very "make it accessible to the masses" mentality that is making our OS and machines increasingly geared to the twitter crowd. "Wowie, I can post a picture of me driving Paris Hilton's Bentley !!! Yippity !!! " You can demand more. You can expect people to ask intelligent, researched questions rather than just responding with their emotional response to a cute puppy picture.

So, while I would rather post info about the latest discoveries on Mac GPUs in latest Mac OS versions I could always just post pictures of me hanging out at The Playboy Mansion that I took with my iPhone.

Frankly my dear, I don't give a darn. If you guys prefer a simpler, friendlier board geared down so that nobody gets left out, great. I'll be happy to post elsewhere. If I post here, it will be latest info for the latest cards in latest OS. If not, fine. I'm not going to post dumbed down versions for the iToys "short attention span" crowd.

highdefw
Feb 24, 2012, 03:17 AM
jesus, i just want to know if these cards work or not so I can run Starcraft at higher frame rates. Just these massive all of texts are all I see :confused:

MacVidCards
Feb 24, 2012, 03:27 AM
jesus, i just want to know if these cards work or not so I can run Starcraft at higher frame rates. Just these massive all of texts are all I see :confused:

these cards work

Cindori
Feb 24, 2012, 03:48 AM
69xx card inserted in any Mac Pro with ML will behave like this:

No bootscreen
Problems with some apps like itunes, chess (this was fixed for 10.7.x so netkas can probably fix for these drivers too)
Awesome performance
Works out of the box



all you need to know really.
the big question is whether we can port these drivers back to 10.7.3 and get support today.

Concorde Rules
Feb 24, 2012, 04:02 AM
Google and the "Search" bar up on right corner are your friends. Feel free to use them when you have a break from analyzing other people's lives.

I REFUSE TO ANSWER QUESTIONS THAT HAVE BEEN ANSWERED AT LEAST A DOZEN TIMES BEFORE. IF YOU DON'T LIKE THAT DON'T COME POSTING IN A THREAD I STARTED !!!

I'm sure that you are doing a grand service standing up for the rights of the Lowest Common Denominator, please just do it in someone else's thread.

And yet again you assumed that I haven't done all this.

I have. BUT there are hundreds of conflicting reports, let alone getting the 'right' card (typically ATi designs seem to work best).

As Cindori put above, that is the answer I would have liked for the 6800 series of cards.

However given that netkas, etc work magic and now have 10.8 to work with then 6900 could very well be on the cards as well.

If I could make a suggestion: Perhaps start a thread answering every possible question anyone could ask about using PC cards in a mac. I did this years ago on how to overclock R520 and people found it very useful.

Cindori
Feb 24, 2012, 04:09 AM
If I could make a suggestion: Perhaps start a thread answering every possible question anyone could ask about using PC cards in a mac. I did this years ago on how to overclock R520 and people found it very useful.

there is one, the Golden Guide, but things change so fast that it's hard to keep a guide like that up to date :/

MacVidCards
Feb 24, 2012, 04:09 AM
If I could make a suggestion: Perhaps start a thread answering every possible question anyone could ask about using PC cards in a mac. I did this years ago on how to overclock R520 and people found it very useful.

This is exactly and precisely what I just said I would not do.

I can't guys. I really can't.

Here is your chance, or Mr. Psychologist-in-training's chance to make a HUGE contribution. Start the thread. Answer "every possible question anyone could ask about using PC cards in a Mac". I personally look forward to it.

Concorde Rules
Feb 24, 2012, 04:40 AM
there is one, the Golden Guide, but things change so fast that it's hard to keep a guide like that up to date :/

Heh. I forgot about that thread.

As you said it is quite out of date. I know Lion and ML has brought more to the table.



This is exactly and precisely what I just said I would not do.

I can't guys. I really can't.

Here is your chance, or Mr. Psychologist-in-training's chance to make a HUGE contribution. Start the thread. Answer "every possible question anyone could ask about using PC cards in a Mac". I personally look forward to it.

I've done my contribution to hardware forums over the years, nor am I in ANY sort of position to start a thread on a subject I don't comprehensively understand.

The R520 I understood because I spent weeks messing about with three cards. I haven't touched a GPU since the 4870 and haven't flashed anything GPU related since the R520. (Flashed a BR drive tho).

Guides on how to flash, how to modify roms and all that is quite easily available and I have done it myself.

What the END RESULT of me EFI'ing a 6 series card is where I am puzzled.

wonderspark
Feb 24, 2012, 06:49 AM
...I expected to get responses from people who had these cards or were ready to experiment with them. I was hoping that I could find some serious people ready to make some discoveries and move the general state of knowledge forward.

It would have made a lot more sense to indicate that you were even looking for people willing to experiment with cards, then. Your first post didn't say that at all. You forgot to add a sentence such as, "Anyone want to help us port these drivers back to 10.7.3 and get support today?"

For someone that wrote an insanely long post about the Bentley-driving, puppy-loving Twitter crowd being the lowest common denominator with a short attention span, it sure seems hypocritical to accuse anyone but yourself of being lazy. If you're ripping into someone, you write like a hero... but to answer a question is too much for you, because you have the idea that asking a question is akin to throwing "the value of all the past experience here ... in the trash..." as if that makes any sense.

Perhaps you haven't noticed, but crying your eyes out about how dumb everyone else is just pollutes any search results with your nonsense, rather than provide info to be found. It would have taken 1/10th as much effort to repeat something short and meaningful. Instead, you've created the opposite effect you desire, and watered down the information with your tantrums.

Sincere thanks to people like Cindori and others who actually care about sharing information and encouraging the spread of knowledge.

wallysb01
Feb 24, 2012, 10:49 AM
Name calling is always a true sign of class.
.
.
.

Frankly my dear, I don't give a darn. If you guys prefer a simpler, friendlier board geared down so that nobody gets left out, great. I'll be happy to post elsewhere. If I post here, it will be latest info for the latest cards in latest OS. If not, fine. I'm not going to post dumbed down versions for the iToys "short attention span" crowd.

Jesus, man. I'm glad you spent all that time to write this rant, because I sure didn't read it. I did however copy it into Word, and you just wrote over 1000 words after complaining about not wanting to answer simple questions, which you could have have just posted links to. Instead of doing such thing, you've now spent probably several orders of magnitude more time twisting about, getting your panties in knot.

Second, I love it when people make some long rant to and end with some variation of "I don't give a darn". Obviously you do, otherwise why did you just write out some 1000+ word directed towards me?

Third, I'm not terribly interested in what the guy acting like a douche thinks is class. Obviously, his perspective is a little off, or has rules for others, but not himself. Either way, its the internet, man. I'll call a spade a spade, even if it offends your delicate sensibilities.

Anyway, thanks for the info. But quite seriously, you should probably reconsider some of your behaviors, hopefully you don't actually act this way in your "real" life....

ActionableMango
Feb 24, 2012, 11:38 AM
Macvidcards has spent a tremendous amount of work on getting PC cards to work in OS X. This has been a great benefit to a great many people with Mac Pros in particular.

Hundreds of times over the years people have asked how to do get a PC card working without even bothering to look at the many existing threads and resources. Many, many, times these people get direct and custom answers. What I have personally read over the years is that some of the experts get tired of being tier 1 support.

They are already doing so much for us by getting the damn stuff working in the first place, spending their own money on cards they have no idea will work or not, having to constantly backup and start over with a fresh OS, trying every new OS, trying every single update to an OS, each one of these on multiple cards over and over, writing programs to assist people, writing directions to assist people, writing drivers, modifying EFI, even doing hardware mods to cards.

So when, for the thousandth time, yet another person wants personal answers for their specific scenario, hasn't bothered to spend 5 minutes looking first, asking about a card that this thread isn't about, and then, WORST OF ALL, declaring that anything short of perfection "is NOT solution"... well, I for one can understand why Macvidcards got mad.

This thread has devolved into personal attacks of character, probably everyone involved would be better off just letting it go. There are no winners in an Internet argument.

gpzjock
Feb 24, 2012, 11:50 AM
Normally folks arguing about arguing on a forum that is built for ... er.. arguing about Mac stuff is... well... exactly what the forum exists for.
This thread started out with a piece of news which is basically very good for the Mac Pro User community.
Somehow the subtle use of CAPITALS and short tempers has turned an otherwise good message about GFX card developments into a slanging match over temperament and expectations.

So I'm going to ask all the verbal combatants here to lay down their pitchforks and play nice please. I'm asking nicely folks so try to type it polite and mature like adults from now on, if you want to keep the respect of the community at large. If someone antagonizes you by being rude or stupid or lazy then the Thumper's Mum philosophy should be overriding all the hot headed fighting talk your testosterone is fueling.
"If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all.".

Excellent news about the 6900 series btw MVCs. I sincerely wish all at netkas.org the very best in their research and discoveries, I await the next big breakthrough with interest. :)

-hh
Feb 24, 2012, 11:49 PM
Macvidcards has spent a tremendous amount of work on getting PC cards to work in OS X. This has been a great benefit to a great many people with Mac Pros in particular.

That very well may be true, but unfortunately, the content of the original post was very much like walking in to the middle of someone's conversation. Since this is just the "Mac Pro" forum and not the "Mac Pro Graphics Card Hacks" subforum, there were assumptions which created large contextual shortcomings that can pretty much predict that some percentage of readers were going to be immediately lost...


Hundreds of times over the years people have asked how to do get a PC card working without even bothering to look at the many existing threads and resources. Many, many, times these people get direct and custom answers. What I have personally read over the years is that some of the experts get tired of being tier 1 support.

Fair enough, and we all do get grumpy at times too. However, if one isn't going to be willing to follow-up with any amount of helpfulness, then it begs why then make the effort to initiate the thread in the first place? For someone cold coming in and reading ... and scrolling past four (yes, 4) "push back" responses before an IMO reasonable explanation was offered makes it unfortunately all too obvious that something basic was being overlooked upfront.

So when, for the thousandth time, yet another person wants personal answers for their specific scenario, hasn't bothered to spend 5 minutes looking first, asking about a card that this thread isn't about, and then, WORST OF ALL, declaring that anything short of perfection "is NOT solution"... well, I for one can understand why Macvidcards got mad.

Sorry, but we all have different levels of being users.

So while some of us may be quite willing to go jump through whatever sequence of flaming hoops to get a particular capability, that's not everybody...there's also others of us who surely would like more, but it comes with the caveat that the hassle factors also need to be pretty low. If this were in a specialized subforum, it would make sense to be a bit impatient or terse, but we're not so it doesn't.


- -

In any case, if I've read correctly, this new card (straight from the box) form running 10.8 has two shortcomings:

(a) No boot screens displayed
(b) Instability running iTunes

Next, a flash of the card can resolve (a), but it appears that (b) doesn't yet have a fix (but appears to be capable of being solved TBD soon).

- -
(56 word summary, BTW)

This thread has devolved into personal attacks of character, probably everyone involved would be better off just letting it go. There are no winners in an Internet argument.

True, although not initially. The lesson is that a very little additional effort upfront .. such as actually mentioning that iTunes bug .. probably would have averted a lot of the resulting confusion that stemmed from the diversity of MR readership community, where not everyone is a GPU hacker.

Quite frankly, the reason why I read this thread was because it appeared to be illustrating a new Mac Pro graphics card development within ML which could be foreshadowing a (hopefully soon) new Mac Pro hardware release.


-hh

Garamond
Feb 25, 2012, 04:00 AM
7970 still not going yet in 10.8
Damn. But do you think it will be implemented before 10.8 goes gold?

jayhawk11
Feb 26, 2012, 02:24 AM
This thread is a complete disaster.


Good tidbit about expanded support in 10.8 DP1, though. Hopefully it gets fleshed out more as we move closer to a GM and release.

palmharbor
Jun 30, 2012, 09:11 AM
I don't think anyone is complaining about this new capability of OSX. I think a few people were a little confused by the OP's few posts, asks some question, and the OP reacted poorly to them. Why get your panties in knot when someone unfamiliar with this kind of capability or is simply confused by word choices starts asking some questions? This is a forum to TALK right. The OP seems to think he's here to make some grand announcement and we're all just supposed to "get it" right off the bat.

To someone like me, who's happy to do anything short of recompiling the kernel, this was something I wasn't aware of. As such the OP's first few posts had me a little confused as well. A lot of people read these posts that have a large diversity of familiarity with computing. Plus, this is a computer forum, so its quite off-putting when someone behaves like the OP and essentially acts annoyed when asked to, you know, talk on a forum he posted to. But hey, I'm not trying to enforce some code of conduct here. I'm just saying my basic went something like this as reading down the post:

1) "Mac Pro's running 10.8 can use the better XXXX graphic cards, neat."
2) "Wait, not exactly, you need this EFI64 ROM and BIOS for the card too?"
3) "Oh ok, that doesn't sound too hard, I've done plenty of stuff similar to that. Anyway, too bad I don't care about GPUs"
4) "Jeez, this guy is kind of a DB."
5) "Wow, look at said DB blow up at the guy who asked the same questions I would have had I not being doing other things."
SNOW LEOPARD DOES NOT DO THE BASICS RIGHT. MOST USERS do not care about the esoteric issues 10.8 may deal with.
The calendar seems like a Microsoft App...
Apple Mail, killed bounce, uses icons in B & W and in the smallest fonts possible, does not delete a message easily.
Address book, does not permit color, tiny font is not adjustable
so get out your magnify glass.
I think the team who designed WIN 95 were hired to put Lion together. IT IS NOT INTUITIVE.

Dzokayi
Jun 30, 2012, 12:31 PM
MacVidCards,

Thank you for the service you provide to this community. I don't tinker with hardware as much as I used to, so I enjoy the broad overview of the current state of video cards found here. Netkas is a bit bleeding edge for me now, so I hope you continue to post here.

Folks, seriously, expend a bit of effort and read the threads before demanding to be spoon-fed.

As a compromise, perhaps we can post the breaking news, and then provide a concise summary of exactly what behavior to expect with the various card / OS combinations. Would keep most people happy, I imagine.

[lurk]