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gryffinwings
Mar 27, 2012, 10:12 PM
I was looking at old-macs.com for video cards, currently looking at the ATI X800 XT and the Nvidia 6800 GT. What do you guys think?



dmueller6
Mar 27, 2012, 11:13 PM
I was lucky and got a 6800 ultrs for 40 from fleabay. Its works good for me. Light gaming and video playback are good. Hooked up to a 23inch Dell monitor.

Jethryn Freyman
Mar 28, 2012, 01:04 AM
I've got the ATI FireGL X3, which is identical to the X800 XT.

I haven't compared the two myself, but barefeats.com have (give it a google.)

The ATI is a much smaller card though, and doesn't block the adjacent PCI slot. And it's very easy to overclock ATI cards in OS X with ATIccelerator II.

VanneDC
Mar 28, 2012, 01:15 AM
ive got the X800XT in my agp PM. great little card. plays games fine :D

666sheep
Mar 28, 2012, 03:44 PM
I was looking at old-macs.com for video cards, currently looking at the ATI X800 XT and the Nvidia 6800 GT. What do you guys think?

X800 looks better than 6800 :p

skinniezinho
Mar 28, 2012, 04:34 PM
back in the windows days 6800 was a little better due to pixel shadder 3.0 support I guess..something like that, but they performed more or less the same.

666sheep
Mar 29, 2012, 01:14 PM
back in the windows days 6800 was a little better due to pixel shadder 3.0 support I guess..something like that, but they performed more or less the same.

Not exactly the same, X800 is about 25% faster in some tasks ;)

http://s14.postimage.org/v7b6m77a9/x800_vs_6800.jpg

zen.state
Mar 29, 2012, 01:24 PM
Yes the x800 is a bit better of a card but I disagree it's sexier. Those Mac 6800 cards had that gorgeous darker aluminum cooler. The x800's stock cooler looks like cheap plastic to me.

I would still go with the x800 though if I was in the market as it's a better card. Cinebench numbers are very consistent and reliable.

666sheep
Mar 29, 2012, 01:34 PM
Personally I'd get FireGL X3 and flash it (like I did before - above CB screen shows FGL flashed to X800 running with stock X800 clocks, 6800 Ultra is genuine Mac one).

Barefeats did some performance comparison as well: http://www.barefeats.com/radx800.html

G5 Mac Daddy
Mar 29, 2012, 01:42 PM
For the money its 7800 gs in my book.

vohdoun
Mar 29, 2012, 03:16 PM
If there was a Mac firmware for the GeForce 7800 GS+ that could make use of the 512MB VRAM, I'd flash it. But everywhere I've looked it only makes use of 256MB, which is no better off than the stock 6800 Ultra I'm using.

Is the ATI X850XT Mac compatible? another card thats been boxed up for sometime.

666sheep
Mar 29, 2012, 03:37 PM
If there was a Mac firmware for the GeForce 7800 GS+ that could make use of the 512MB VRAM, I'd flash it. But everywhere I've looked it only makes use of 256MB, which is no better off than the stock 6800 Ultra I'm using.

Is the ATI X850XT Mac compatible? another card thats been boxed up for sometime.

What makes 7800 faster than 6800 it's not the VRAM amount. Any 7800 beats your Ultra. Gainward one is 7800GT in fact, so even with 256MB useable is faster than any 6800.
BTW, there's no ROM for 7800GS+ because it's G71 based. G70 based Gainwards are GS, without "+" ;)

There was X850XT Mac version and X850 is flashable, but that same as X800
it does display video through VGA only. No DVI for flashed X800/850XT.

vohdoun
Mar 29, 2012, 07:02 PM
What makes 7800 faster than 6800 it's not the VRAM amount. Any 7800 beats your Ultra. Gainward one is 7800GT in fact, so even with 256MB useable is faster than any 6800.

Preview can eat up a lot of VRAM.


BTW, there's no ROM for 7800GS+ because it's G71 based. G70 based Gainwards are GS, without "+" ;)

Same card I have and box. http://www.s155158671.websitehome.co.uk/gainwardbliss780.html

Ah, wait no. Bummer.

http://www.pressebox.de/attachment/17072/Gainward+BLISS+7800GS++AGP.jpg

There was X850XT Mac version and X850 is flashable, but that same as X800
it does display video through VGA only. No DVI for flashed X800/850XT.

That would be a major downgrade. I haven't touched VGA since 2004.

Jethryn Freyman
Mar 29, 2012, 07:19 PM
No DVI for flashed X800/850XT.
I've got a FireGL X3 flashed with X800 XT ROM, and the two DVI ports work fine.

gryffinwings
Mar 29, 2012, 09:46 PM
I've got a FireGL X3 flashed with X800 XT ROM, and the two DVI ports work fine.

After I heard about the ATI FireGL X3, I thought that would be a great card to work with too. Are the X800 XT and the FireGL X3 the same except the FireGL X3 has DVI or is it different? How does it stack up against the Nvidia stuff?

Jethryn Freyman
Mar 30, 2012, 12:10 AM
After I heard about the ATI FireGL X3, I thought that would be a great card to work with too. Are the X800 XT and the FireGL X3 the same except the FireGL X3 has DVI or is it different? How does it stack up against the Nvidia stuff?
I'm pretty sure they're identical, just ATI did something to that you couldn't run the FireGL driver's on the Radeon X800 so they could get graphics pros to spend 5x the price on the FireGL card with it's fancy drivers instead of the cheaper but equal performing Radeon card

666sheep
Mar 30, 2012, 01:21 AM
I've got a FireGL X3 flashed with X800 XT ROM, and the two DVI ports work fine.

So? Flashed Fire GL X3 = working DVI (even Dual link), flashed X800/X850XT = VGA only... Simple enough? ;)
These cards are almost identical (reference ofc), but "almost", not "completely"...

Jethryn Freyman
Mar 30, 2012, 04:11 AM
So? Flashed Fire GL X3 = working DVI (even Dual link), flashed X800/X850XT = VGA only... Simple enough? ;)
These cards are almost identical (reference ofc), but "almost", not "completely"...
Nothing 666, just saying that they work awesome. Just keep in mind that a lot of games will be bottlenecked by the CPU before the GPU (e.g. Doom 3, Quake 4, UT 2004.)

VanneDC
Mar 30, 2012, 04:29 AM
awesome card, i have the X800XT, but the mac edition.

http://www.globalvideocard.com/image/cache/data/Radeon-X800XT-500x500.jpg

runs like a dream, is the x850xt rom for mac any quicker than the x800xt?

jbarley
Mar 30, 2012, 12:27 PM
awesome card, i have the X800XT, but the mac edition.
runs like a dream.
Can you verify that the fan runs variable speed and just how noisy it is?

GermanyChris
Mar 30, 2012, 12:31 PM
can you flash either of these cards from inside the G5 without using a PC?

AGP PC's are getting a bit scarce and I loathe the idea of buying one just to flash a single graphics card..

Jethryn Freyman
Mar 30, 2012, 03:42 PM
Can you verify that the fan runs variable speed and just how noisy it is?
The FireGL X3 flashed as an X800 XT does run at variable speed. Under normal use, I can't hear mine at all, even when the main CPU fans are at their quietest. The only time I've heard it actually ramp up speed was while running a GPU intensive benchmark in Unreal Tournament 2004, and even then it was only about a quarter of max speed, if that (it spends a few seconds at full speed just after you power on the G5.)

MacVidCards
Mar 30, 2012, 04:21 PM
Glad to see all of these cards still being used and loved.

My old hacking friend Arti Itra wrote the 6800 roms that allow flashed cards to have DVI. I'll give you guys a tip, there is a Quadro 4500 or 4000 AGP card that flashes beautifully if you change device id. It will allow 30" display support, unlike 99% of these 6800s which are 24" only at top end.

I created first FireGl X3 into X800 and what a moment that was. At the time, the other big bonus was that it ran in G4, all of the Apple X800s needed a G5. The first time the X3 fired up my (then majestic) 17" ADC, I was thrilled beyond words.

You need to be certain you have a 128K chip for full flash, TOmejapan made a reduced ROM I believe if it is 64K. It is sometimes necessary to reduce clocks a touch, as X3 didn't have same clocks as X800.

The 7800GS was another thing we created, I did first one and my friends at Strabgedogs made it better. At the time, Doom3 had come out and the standard cards were DOGS with it. The 7800GS made it workable.

We tried and tried to get 512 Megs to show up on the Gainward card. We came to conclusion that the OS just didn't su[pport it over AGP bus. To this day my parents have my old G5, with a Gainward Bliss card purring softly away to run their 24" display. They have no idea that they have 1 of no more than 10 of these cards running in a Mac. They enormous fan has kept it cool and quiet for years. It is very difficult to find these with G70 as the only SURE way is if a Windows guy removes fan and sees the (much larger) G70 chip underneath. Or using something like GPU-Z. But Gainward packaged and part numbered them identically.

G71 is a NO GO, G70 is perfect.

I would look for a 7800 over a 6800. Faster and better, but the Gainward one is the only 7800 with Dual DVI, while 6800s are much more likely to.

jbarley
Mar 31, 2012, 12:11 AM
The FireGL X3 flashed as an X800 XT does run at variable speed. Under normal use, I can't hear mine at all, even when the main CPU fans are at their quietest. The only time I've heard it actually ramp up speed was while running a GPU intensive benchmark in Unreal Tournament 2004, and even then it was only about a quarter of max speed, if that (it spends a few seconds at full speed just after you power on the G5.)
My question was for VanneDC who indicated they had a Mac version X800XT which I believe can run variable speed.

VanneDC
Mar 31, 2012, 08:29 AM
Yep fan runs variable speed on the Mac x800xt.
:D

jbarley
Mar 31, 2012, 09:51 AM
Yep fan runs variable speed on the Mac x800xt.
:D
Thank you, just what I wanted to hear.

gryffinwings
Mar 31, 2012, 01:01 PM
New questions:

1. What's the difference between a 7800gs and the 6800gs?

2. Has anyone here used an Nvidia Quadro FX series card? Are there any benefits to using one over the standard cards?

666sheep
Mar 31, 2012, 03:00 PM
New questions:

1. What's the difference between a 7800gs and the 6800gs?

2. Has anyone here used an Nvidia Quadro FX series card? Are there any benefits to using one over the standard cards?

Hmm, seems that you Google has banned you, I'll try to help then:

http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php?card1=368&card2=382

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nvidia_Quadro
http://www.nvidia.com/object/quadro_geforce.html
http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100558
http://area.autodesk.com/forum/autodesk-3ds-max/installation---hardware---os/geforce-vs-quadro-benchmarks-40actual-tests41/
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/quadro-fx-4800,2258-10.html
http://www.howtogeek.com/forum/topic/quadro-vs-geforce
http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=49080

;)

vohdoun
Mar 31, 2012, 06:46 PM
G71 is a NO GO, G70 is perfect.

I thought I was sorted when I had the 7800GS, when it really was the + version with the PCI-E to AGP bridge.

I would look for a 7800 over a 6800. Faster and better, but the Gainward one is the only 7800 with Dual DVI, while 6800s are much more likely to.

When it's not silly prices. If I was to get a 7800GS it would have to be with the dual DVI since my BTO Mac came with a 6800 Ultra.

gryffinwings
Mar 31, 2012, 07:09 PM
Hmm, seems that you Google has banned you, I'll try to help then:

http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php?card1=368&card2=382

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nvidia_Quadro
http://www.nvidia.com/object/quadro_geforce.html
http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100558
http://area.autodesk.com/forum/autodesk-3ds-max/installation---hardware---os/geforce-vs-quadro-benchmarks-40actual-tests41/
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/quadro-fx-4800,2258-10.html
http://www.howtogeek.com/forum/topic/quadro-vs-geforce
http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=49080

;)

Well at that moment I did not have access to a computer to conduct research because I was traveling and only have iPhone, so I asked.

I think what I really wanted to know is what makes the 7800 better, all I see so far is higher clock speeds.

MacVidCards
Apr 1, 2012, 10:37 PM
I thought I was sorted when I had the 7800GS, when it really was the + version with the PCI-E to AGP bridge.



When it's not silly prices. If I was to get a 7800GS it would have to be with the dual DVI since my BTO Mac came with a 6800 Ultra.

We had a friend somewhere at Apple.

The thing that amazed me was that the drivers for 7800 had both the original device id for the PCIE card (92 I think) as well as "f5" which was the bridge chip. Similarly, the 6600GT had a bridge chip id which was also in the drivers. For awhile I sold some 6600GT cards that were rather cool. Offered Dual Dual Link DVI with speed similar to a 9800 Radeon. I don't think we ever released the ROMs, but they are of limited use as all of the cards came with 64K chips and the 6600GT ROM was 128K. So, if you can't solder SOIC EEPROMs, you are out of luck.

There was a minor issue with 7800GS that was present in Tiger (had to do with widgets IIRC). When Leopard came out, the issue was fixed. SO somebody at Apple had gotten hold of a flashed 7800GS and fixed the drivers. When Barefeats tested my cards, they were the fastest PPC GPUs ever. And they still are. But Apple left the door open for me to make the cards happen.

VanneDC
Apr 2, 2012, 01:04 AM
wish those exotic roms for the 7800gtx were available :) *nudge nudge wink wink *