Gov. Bush touts Christian-based program for schools

[zimv20]

link (http://www.palmbeachpost.com/state/content/state/epaper/2005/07/06/m1a_fathers_0706.html)


TALLAHASSEE — Just before Father's Day, Gov. Jeb Bush announced that he wanted every public school in Florida to host a Christian-based program designed to increase fathers' participation in their children's lives.

The program, All Pro Dad, combines a biblical foundation with the draw of popular professional athletes to promote the belief that "the father is the head of the household" and that men should rely on God to help them be better parents and keep their marriages intact. It also encourages Bible reading.

"This is a really great program," Bush said at a news conference last month, though he did not make any reference to the project's Christian foundation. "The response of this program has been a success, and I hope it expands throughout the entire state to every school in every school district."

But critics say the program, which has a direct link on the Florida Department of Education Web site, clearly has Christian overtones and is part of a national effort by evangelicals who view public schools as recruiting fields.

An official state Web site should not be linked to such an organization, said Barry Lynn, executive director of Americans United for Separation of Church and State. Lynn said the link violates the First Amendment, which prohibits government from establishing a state religion and at the same time prohibits government from interfering with religious practices.

"This has a very clear religious message, so that's wrong and that should be stopped immediately," Lynn said from his office in Washington. "This is an overtly fundamentalist Christian worldview that's being promoted."

(more)

[iGary]

Gotta love Jeb. :rolleyes:

[mactastic]

Sounds like more of that Promise Keepers BS. I thought those guys were defunct.

First the Schaivo Micheal-killed-his-wife crap and now this? How are Floridians putting up with it?

[iGary]

Sounds like more of that Promise Keepers BS. I thought those guys were defunct.

First the Schaivo Micheal-killed-hi-wife crap and now this? How are Floridians putting up with it?

Floridians (no offense) aren't known for their brightness. Hanging chads anyone?

[mactastic]

Floridians (no offense) aren't known for their brightness. Hanging chads anyone?

What a horrible generalization. And I'm constantly hearing how liberals call everyone in red states stupid...

[Xtremehkr]

Pander to the base, build support to be President. You know everyone in the Bush family wants their chance to cash in.

[iGary]

What a horrible generalization. And I'm constantly hearing how liberals call everyone in red states stupid...

Nah, I'm just joking around, don't get your dander up. ;)

The state is full of morons though. :p

[iSaint]

Sounds like more of that Promise Keepers BS. I thought those guys were defunct.

First the Schaivo Micheal-killed-his-wife crap and now this? How are Floridians putting up with it?

I never have understood Promise Keepers...if you want to be a good father, stay at home with your kids instead of being gone on the rallies or whatever.

And Floridians are old retired people, the young people are there to cater to them. So it's basically a very conservative state.

BTW notice how the Bush investigation into what happened with Schiavo's initial heart-attack (or whatever it was) kind of silently ended? Find some closure people!

[IJ Reilly]

I never have understood Promise Keepers...if you want to be a good father, stay at home with your kids instead of being gone on the rallies or whatever.

Maybe that was the concept -- the best way for some of those men to be good fathers was to stay away from home as much as possible.

[mactastic]

Nah, I'm just joking around, don't get your dander up. ;)

The state is full of morons though. :p


Oh I was just kidding too, no need to get defensive. ;)

It's still a horrible thing to say though. :p

[mactastic]

Maybe that was the concept -- the best way for some of those men to be good fathers was to stay away from home as much as possible.
Oooo now THAT'S pretty cynical. :p

I wonder how successful Jeb will be at getting this pig to fly. It's hard to believe there's not a secular alternative organization he could have turned to had he wanted.

[IJ Reilly]

Oooo now THAT'S pretty cynical. :p

I wonder how successful Jeb will be at getting this pig to fly. It's hard to believe there's not a secular alternative organization he could have turned to had he wanted.

Of course I was only kidding. ;) :p

BTW, pigs can fly. If you have enough of the right kind of faith, they grow wings.

[Mike Teezie]

The state is full of morons though. :p

Every last one of them is. :)

[solvs]

My Aunt was living there. She and her friends couldn't stand Bush. Remember Gore actually won that state by a few hundred votes. It's just that a lot of them didn't like Kerry either. Have somebody good run against Jeb and he will lose. Run another Liberal that they don't like, and let Jeb do as his Brother does so well, wearing his Bible on his sleeve, and that's how you get a Republican back in office. Even if he supports cutting Medicare, Privatizing Social Security, jailing doctors who perform euthanasia, and all those other things older people really care about.

A lot of people are actually Democrats. They just don't realize it. Thanks to both the Neocons and the Liberals.

[kuyu]

I never have understood Promise Keepers...if you want to be a good father, stay at home with your kids instead of being gone on the rallies or whatever.

I only know one person who is/was a promise keeper. My uncle was disowned at 19 because he was a crazed coke dealer, theif, and a liar. He would steal from my grandparents, etc.

At 30 something he "found Jesus", and has since become the nicest, most thoughtful person I've ever known. The family took him back. He's been married to one woman faithfully for 25 years and is an excellent father. He always took his family with him to the rallies, and they made a long family weekend out of the events.

The amazing part is, since finding religion, his family is very prosperous. They spend two weeks a year building homes for the poor in impoverished parts of Central America. The entire time they wear one set of clothes, as their luggage is full of clothes/supplies/first aid kits that they give away. At Christmas, they adopy poor families and fully fund their x-mas instead of giving eachother presents.

The world could use more people like that. Instead of just talking about the problems we have (like poverty), he goes out there and tries to fix them.

[takao]

what the ... is a promise keeper thing ? somebody want to clear that up ?

i mean i get freaked out by those mormons with their suits and missions who are around in summer in front of shopping centers from time to time or those other who are shouting whole parts of the bible in the town center while waving with dubious flyers and bibles over their heads (i was _this_ close to call the police because of those)
it's sad how in other countries it seems to be normal for every little christian group to have their special school stuff etc., sure we had religious edu in school (about all different big religions) but it didn't stop us from using the new testaments as throwable 'weapons' during brakes (only beaten by the slightly heavier music book

[srobert]

I love the political forums. We get the most interesting "contextual" google ads ^_^

Here is the one I got at the end of this thread. kinda scary:

Anyone wanna enter his name and email address? :p

(It links to: http://religion.coffeehousetheology.com/)

[miloblithe]

I only know one person who is/was a promise keeper. My uncle was disowned at 19 because he was a crazed coke dealer, theif, and a liar. He would steal from my grandparents, etc.

At 30 something he "found Jesus", and has since become the nicest, most thoughtful person I've ever known. The family took him back. He's been married to one woman faithfully for 25 years and is an excellent father. He always took his family with him to the rallies, and they made a long family weekend out of the events.

The amazing part is, since finding religion, his family is very prosperous. They spend two weeks a year building homes for the poor in impoverished parts of Central America. The entire time they wear one set of clothes, as their luggage is full of clothes/supplies/first aid kits that they give away. At Christmas, they adopy poor families and fully fund their x-mas instead of giving eachother presents.

The world could use more people like that. Instead of just talking about the problems we have (like poverty), he goes out there and tries to fix them.

In addition, they tip well. I was a waiter in DC during one of the big Promise Keeper thingies. They decended en masse to the restaurant, ate quietly (and uncomfortably as they felt like everyone was lookin' at 'em funny) and then tipped 20% all around.

I think it's great when people get their lives together and when people give to others and try to help the world and their community. I just wish that for most people it didn't require silly superstitions. Still, certainly better than being a lying coke dealer.

[Ugg]

what the ... is a promise keeper thing ? somebody want to clear that up ?

i mean i get freaked out by those mormons with their suits and missions who are around in summer in front of shopping centers from time to time or those other who are shouting whole parts of the bible in the town center while waving with dubious flyers and bibles over their heads (i was _this_ close to call the police because of those)
it's sad how in other countries it seems to be normal for every little christian group to have their special school stuff etc., sure we had religious edu in school (about all different big religions) but it didn't stop us from using the new testaments as throwable 'weapons' during brakes (only beaten by the slightly heavier music book

promisekeepers.org is a christian based men's organization designed to help men become better fathers and husbands.

I've heard the Mormons have a tough time of it in Europe. I was in Lyons a number of years ago and met two mormon missionaries who said that the most common response to their pamphlets was, "What part of the catholic church is this?" I think they have a lot more success in Latin America though.

Yeah, the whole evangelizing thing really gets old after awhile. Especially since the evangelicals are mostly fire and brimstone and god's love as opposed to doing good deeds like jesus did. Religion is fine for those who need it but it should never be forced on anyone via the education system.

[zimv20]

In addition, they tip well.[...] 20% all around.

some of us atheists tip 20% or more. fwiw.

also fwiw -- i think the best tippers generally are the ones who've waited tables. i think it should be a conscription thing for 2 months. you learn humility :-)

[kuyu]

some of us atheists tip 20% or more. fwiw.

also fwiw -- i think the best tippers generally are the ones who've waited tables. i think it should be a conscription thing for 2 months. you learn humility :-)

I do;)

Yeah, I work a tip job and the best tips are from servers, bartenders, etc..

[Don't panic]

...They decended en masse to the restaurant, ate quietly ...

surely you mean after mass...

[miloblithe]

some of us atheists tip 20% or more. fwiw.

also fwiw -- i think the best tippers generally are the ones who've waited tables. i think it should be a conscription thing for 2 months. you learn humility :-)

Of course. I think they were all told to be on good behavior so as to fend off any potential criticism (of which there was plenty) of their meeting and ethos.

Restaurant workers make the best tippers, no doubt. On the other hand, I think that for most people who've worked in restaurants and no longer do, each year that they're out they lose a percent or so and eventually settle into being good rather than great tippers.

[takao]

promisekeepers.org is a christian based men's organization designed to help men become better fathers and husbands.

thx ... i'm pretty sure there are organizations for everything

I've heard the Mormons have a tough time of it in Europe. I was in Lyons a number of years ago and met two mormon missionaries who said that the most common response to their pamphlets was, "What part of the catholic church is this?" I think they have a lot more success in Latin America though.

pretty much all churches/religions have problems, even catholic church but they at least have the advantage of rather, atypical, local youth organizations and the sheer amount of presence (through tradition) something the "evangelics" (all the protestants are thrown together normally ;) ) don't have ... at least not here in austria and we are not that different from france or italy in terms or religion, perhaps we have more muslims

especially when i hear phrases like "evangelic railway station" or "evangelic pommes frites" (about fancy formed fries) from my father it's pretty clear that the sides are still not speaking that good of each other after all the years

Yeah, the whole evangelizing thing really gets old after awhile. Especially since the evangelicals are mostly fire and brimstone and god's love as opposed to doing good deeds like jesus did. Religion is fine for those who need it but it should never be forced on anyone via the education system.

i second that, and that's why i'm for a universial ethical education lessons isntead of those (rather wasted) christian orientated ones currently in our school systems (seperated into "normal" classes and soemtimes 2-3 classes of "evangelics" for the whole school, the muslims and everybody else gets those hours off), it simply is seperating ppils more than it brings them together
and it shouldn't made as easy as it is now , it's normally one of the "free A subjects"