Pain Killers....

[iGary]

As many of you know, I have a couple of blown out discs in my back (fear not, I see the neuro surgeon on Tuesday next week), but the current pain killers I use (Vicodin 5/500) just send me into outer space.

Does anyone here deal with a chronic pain problem that can recommend a less "into the stratosphere" pain killer?

I don't use them that often (afraid of addiction), but if I have to, I'm basically out for a day. Can't work or anything.

Thanks!

[katie ta achoo]

As many of you know, I have a couple of blown out discs in my back (fear not, I see the neuro surgeon on Tuesday next week), but the current pain killers I use (Vicodin 5/500) just send me into outer space.

Does anyone here deal with a chronic pain problem that can recommend a less "into the stratosphere" pain killer?

I don't use them that often (afraid of addiction), but if I have to, I'm basically out for a day. Can't work or anything.

Thanks!

When I was having crazy chest pain (still undiagnosed! boo!!) they put me on 9 pills of ibuprofen a day. (3 pills 3x a day) It worked.. but.. IT KILLS YOUR LIVER IF YOU DO IT FOR TOO LONG.

Have you thought of maybe taking half a vicodin? Maybe Tyenol 3 would be better.. It has codiene. I took it for my kidney stones, and let me tell ya...

I couldn't feel them over my drug induced haze.
Maybe you'd get some real trippy graphics done while you're on it. :)

Heal quickly! :D

[IJ Reilly]

I had to take Vicodin for a bit last year. Yikes, no thanks -- worked a little too well. I tried taking halves, which was just about as good for relieving pain as a whole pill (for me), but without the narcotic side-effects.

Big doses of ibuprofen really only work to kill inflammations. I don't think they're very good for chronic pain.

[iBlue]

oh yeah, all sorts of wonky stuff happens to me, I feel like a painkiller connoisseur, unfortunately.

boy I WISH 5/500 hydrocodone would help me, I guess at least consider yourself lucky it works, (not that I am trying to be a jackass about it, just looking at the bright side) because doctors have a fit when you want stronger meds. they do make a vareity of hydrocodone strengths (I take "Norco" 10/325 - the 10 is the opiate painkiller, the other/ is basically tylenol)

I would just try taking it with food if it makes you feel funny. pop a few ibuprofens and see if that helps too, depends on what kind of pain (you had back surgery right? don't know if you had it or not yet) I'm stunned at your pain tolerance all things considered actually.

I wish you good luck, this can't be easy for you :(

[Bibulous]

Call your Doctor, not MacRumors

[devilot]

As many of you know, I have a couple of blown out discs in my back (fear not, I see the neuro surgeon on Tuesday next week), but the current pain killers I use (Vicodin 5/500) just send me into outer space.

Does anyone here deal with a chronic pain problem that can recommend a less "into the stratosphere" pain killer?

I don't use them that often (afraid of addiction), but if I have to, I'm basically out for a day. Can't work or anything.

Thanks!
Smart man... Vicodin is extremely addictive. That being said, perhaps I should get rid of some of yours for you. :D Ok on a serious note, I really like Aleve. It's a tiny pill, it is not aspirin based and it's not ibuprofen its... um, na-, na- naproxene? Something like that. I have chronic knee and back pain and tylenol and advil don't do anything for me, but one aleve and my knee aches are history. Oooh, and Aleve comes in a really arthritis friendly pill case, easy for adults to open.

[iGary]

I had to take Vicodin for a bit last year. Yikes, no thanks -- worked a little too well. I tried taking halves, which was just about as good for relieving pain as a whole pill (for me), but without the narcotic side-effects.

Big doses of ibuprofen really only work to kill inflammations. I don't think they're very good for chronic pain.

Yeah, I'm on Relafen (a major anti-inflammatory), which does no good at all anymore. I also take Skelaxin (a muscle relaxer) three times a day. Prednisone (a steroid) is the only thing that really helps without using narcotics, but they only put me on 12-day courses of that.

Hopefully this will be a non-issue after surgery, just wanted to see if anyone had any alternatives.

[Lacero]

Call your Doctor, not MacRumorsLOL. :D

[iGary]

Call your Doctor, not MacRumors

My primary care doctor is a quack, you all are more informed than he is. I asked him the same question and he was like "yeah I'm not sure what pain killer is less sedating."

Genious decided it wasn't a priority last Friday to call in my refill for Vicodin, so I got to do a four-day business trip in agonizing pain. I had an MRI two weeks ago and he still hasn't forwarded me the radiologist's report. He walked out during the middle of my last physical to take a 15-minute cell phone call. When I called to tell him that my last period of bed rest and steroids did not work, he called back and actually said "what were we going to do next?"

I know, I need to switch, but anyone who has an HMO knows what a pain in the arse switching primary care doctors is. Once this back thing is sorted he's gone.

[GanChan]

I think Tramadol would be a less mind-bending choice. After my foot surgery I had both hydrocodone (which I think is approximately the same as Vicodin?) and Tramadol sitting around the house, but only used the Tramadol. The hydrocodone made me dizzy and nauseous, and gave me awful nightmares. The Tramadol just made me stop hurting.

Also, as a general rule it's a good idea to take the absolute smallest dose that seems to work, regardless of the prescription instructions. If you can get away with a half-dose, do so.

[iGary]

I think Tramadol would be a less mind-bending choice. After my foot surgery I had both hydrocodone (which I think is approximately the same as Vicodin?) and Tramadol sitting around the house, but only used the Tramadol. The hydrocodone made me dizzy and nauseous, and gave me awful nightmares. The Tramadol just made me stop hurting.

Also, as a general rule it's a good idea to take the absolute smallest dose that seems to work, regardless of the prescription instructions. If you can get away with a half-dose, do so.

Hydrocodone is Vicodin - Vicodin has acetominophen with it.

And yeah, it gives me some of the most bizarre dreams/nightmares I have ever had in my life. I really hate the stuff, but it does make me able to walk/drive/sit in my office and work. Guess I should just deal.

Thanks for the Tramadol name, I'll ask about it.

[ravenvii]

I recently had surgery, and took vicodin during the first two days afterwards to cope with the pain. I hate the stuff too - it makes me feel like I'm going to faint every 15 minutes.

It makes me wonder what exactly does it take to become addictive? Why'd people get addicted to something like THAT?

Oh well.

[wdlove]

I glad to hear that you have an appointment with your neurosurgeon next week. One thing to remember about narcotics is that they are constipating, drinking plenty of fluids is very important. Some even need a stool softener. You could try Motrin, but it can be hard on the stomach.

My wife is a Registered Nurse also. She has worked with pain management issues. Her recommendation is that you see a pain management specialist. Also a physical therapist could be helpful. Your physician should be able to set you up with a referral.

[MacAztec]

I had a hernia surgery, and they gave me some 500mg Viccodin. I was IN THE ZONE when I took those. I would just pop one, go on the computer, play some poker, and time flew. Man, those were something else.

[Mechcozmo]

When I was having crazy chest pain (still undiagnosed! boo!!) they put me on 9 pills of ibuprofen a day. (3 pills 3x a day) It worked.. but.. IT KILLS YOUR LIVER IF YOU DO IT FOR TOO LONG.

I'm not sure about ibuprofen, but acetaminophen (Tylenol) is dangerous at 3 grams a day, aka, 6 pills.

I know, I need to switch, but anyone who has an HMO knows what a pain in the arse switching primary care doctors is. Once this back thing is sorted he's gone.

HMO... nice. My dad's hospital doesn't take those anymore. In case you're wondering why: They would go out of business if they continued. Each HMO patient, the hospital and the surgeon loose money.
Your doctor couldn't care what happens to you. Each second he spends on you, each time you go to see him, he looses money. Your doctor DOESN'T WANT TO SEE YOU because you're driving him out of business. I'm not accusing anyone here, just pointing this out.

My dad's theory is that eventually health care will split into two: HMOs and not. The doctors that take HMOs will be the worst doctors. They will be cheap. The other doctors won't be cheap, but will take actual care of you.

Take your pick.

[Sun Baked]

I'm not sure about ibuprofen, but acetaminophen (Tylenol) is dangerous at 3 grams a day, aka, 6 pills.Yes, I though the liver damage warning went out for acetaminophen ... especially because it is in everything these days without a strong warning, resulting in lots of death livers every year.

Especially if you end up on multiple medications...

[iBlue]

Tramadol (aka: Ultram) is probably a good idea actually, it's a synthetic opiate but not as additctive physically and doesn't tinker with your mental faculities as much. However, it's not meant for those with seizure risk, a note that should be mentioned. it raises the seuzure threshold... it's somewhat rare but it happens. seizures are strange, often once you get one it means you are more prone to having another. (to explain briefly)
that's my disclaimer ;)

yes hydrocodone is also known as Vicodin, Lortab, Norco, etc the strengths in acetaminophen and the hydrocodone (opiate pain killer within) vary.
the opiate part, the part that works, comes in:
5mg
7.5mg
10mg

the acetaminophen comes in 325mg, 500mg, and 650mg - this varies on how it was prescribed.

THE LESS ACETAMINOPHEN THE BETTER - this drug got the unfortunately good name of being safe, it's in everything and it's actually really bad stuff.
the toxic dose is actually 4grams (4000mg) from my understanding, and one extra strength Tylenol is 500mg - so beware.

there is NO SUCH THING as 500mg of hydrocodone itself, that is death - the 500 you see is merely acetaminophen/tylenol. (sorry, it's something I hear a lot and it bugs me, I feel compelled to inform ;))

Aleve is not always so easy on the stomach but it's not a bad idea.

oh enough from me on this, hope it helps though

[iJon]

It can cost quite a bit but some marijuana can always do the trick ;)

jon

[MacAztec]

It can cost quite a bit but some marijuana can always do the trick ;)

jon

haha, how much is it for a gram over there? its like $15-$18 here.

[iBlue]

haha, how much is it for a gram over there? its like $15-$18 here.


WOW, that's a lot!!! but since I don't know what is "allowed" here and what might really be frowned upon, I won't go too deep into that discussion.

P.S. I never found weed to be very helpful for pain, and I don't get the impression iGary wants to be more inebriated.

[Royal Pineapple]

i just broke my collarbone and have been medicating with vicodin and marijuana for the past few days.
this is my first experience with vicodin and i have to say i was pretty satisfied. after i take a pill i cant even feel the pain for the whole day. only in the evening does it start acting up again, so i smoke some pot and it goes away again (and i can fall asleep). i havent had any nightmares, i wonder what part of the vicodin has been causing them in you guys.

[mgargan1]

you know what's weird, vicodin didn't do anything for me when I took it. The pain didn't go away, nor did I have any haze. When I took tylenol 3, I got all hyper and had the same affect as caffiene.

Good luck iGary

[iGary]

LOL - I'd consider the ganja route, but I quit smoking tobacco five years ago, and I'm sure it would make me pick up the cigs again...

My script bottle actually has a warning about liver damage an acetominophen.

Hopefully won't be taking these much longer, but glad to have the Tramadol option.

[Jay42]

yup, I've been on vicodin on more than one occasion. Most of the time though, I would rather have the side effects rather than whatever pain I needed them for.

From what you say about your doctor, sounds like borderline malpractice if he didn't give you the meds you needed!

[Sun Baked]

you know what's weird, vicodin didn't do anything for me when I took it. The pain didn't go away, nor did I have any haze. When I took tylenol 3, I got all hyper and had the same affect as caffiene.

Good luck iGaryNote this if you are ever in a position to be prescribed these meds again.

Basically put it down as having a reaction to codeine (I think that's Tylenol3) on your medical history when it is updated. And list what the reaction was.

[iGary]

Well he is a dork, that's for sure. I just had to call them and have them fax my last radiologist report from my MRI - he never called me.

Judging form the report, looks like surgery time.

I have a 24mm (1-inch) long disk fragment climbing up the posterior side of my L5 vertebrae with a smaller 12mm fully sequestered (separated) fragment.

I also have spinal stenosis, whatever the eff that is. :rolleyes:

Never thought I'd be dealing with this crap at 35. The saddest partis I won't be able to run marathons anymore. :(

Thanks for all the advice, guys - even the ganja! ;)

[eva01]

well i have had migranes for 10 months straight now (maybe 11 but whos counting) and they have had me on everything from just ibuprofen, to morphine, to percocets and everything else you can name. right now i am on hydromorphone, but nothing ends up working

i would recommend percocets for your cause

[Sun Baked]

well i have had migranes for 10 months straight now (maybe 11 but whos counting) and they have had me on everything from just ibuprofen, to morphine, to percocets and everything else you can name. right now i am on hydromorphone, but nothing ends up working

i would recommend percocets for your causeOuch that's not good...

So are you on a anti-caffeine or a caffeine required diet by your doctor.

[eva01]

Ouch that's not good...

So are you on a anti-caffeine or a caffeine required diet by your doctor.

I have no specific diet that i am on, they just have me go up to the hospital in boston (B&W) and get a shot above my eye and in my temple, its not fun.

[Sun Baked]

I have no specific diet that i am on, they just have me go up to the hospital in boston (B&W) and get a shot above my eye and in my temple, its not fun.Strange that the doctor hasn't looked into a migraine and your diet...

You may want to look into it yourself, if you haven't.

Caffeine is generally one of the ingredients in food that could both trigger them, or moderate them depending on the person.

All depends on how much caffeine you are taking at the moment.

Of course it can also be something way off base like your teeth causing the problem, which is also a source.

Edit: I only harp on caffeine now, since the last 10 years has seen a bunch of people thinking nothing of high caffeine energy drinks and Starbucks. So there are a lot more people getting caffeine related symptoms.

[mgargan1]

Note this if you are ever in a position to be prescribed these meds again.

Basically put it down as having a reaction to codeine (I think that's Tylenol3) on your medical history when it is updated. And list what the reaction was.

thanks for the advice...

[iBlue]

oh my god iGary!!! i'm stunned you are not curled in a ball freaking out right now, those are some painful conditions. holy high pain tolerance! thumbups up to you!

be sure not to mention anything on the lines of "reaction" with regard to the meds or you will be so "SOL" if your pain really takes its toll. opiate pain meds are along the superior and you'll be incredibly limited for pain relief down the road. i can't caution enough against saying reaction to a doctor over those meds. reactions that aren't seriously troubling, or that don't include hives and problems breathing shouldn't be mentioned IMO.

BTW, all opiates will cause itching and nausea, this is so totally normal. opiates release a histamine in your body and make you itch. Codeiene is actually one of the worst with regard to itching. your nose will especially trouble you. (i was seen with a red peeling nose a few times and people who knew their opiates knew what was up with me :o i find it better than the alternative though, pain sucks)

did the eating before taking the hydrocodone help at all? it cuts its effectiveness some, of course actually cutting the things in half helps too. i'm just surprised that one of the weaker ones is plastering you.

but yeah, again Tramadol/Ultram might work for you better. it lasts longer but takes longer to kick in. don't take the "ultracet" you don't need the excess acetaminophen (ultram/tradadol itself has no acetaminophen, whereas ultracet does)
just a tip ;)

good luck

[Sun Baked]

be sure not to mention anything on the lines of "reaction" with regard to the meds or you will be so "SOL" if your pain really takes its toll. opiate pain meds are along the superior and you'll be incredibly limited for pain relief down the road. i can't caution enough against saying reaction to a doctor over those meds. reactions that don't include hives and problems breathing shouldn't be mentioned IMO.People on pain management are usually something different than the general population, where being extremely wired and unable to get any rest can interfere with recovery.

mgargan1, didn't have the breathing problems, but the codeine may have induced an extreme reaction -- I thought he meant the inability to sit still and/or sleep at all.

Once that he'll have to balance out if he's in a position to get the medication again, for some people that reaction is bad enough for them to avoid codeine in the future if it is possible.

Personally for me, the choice between some pain and sleeping and zero pain and staring at white walls for hours on end -- was sleeping after surgery and leaving the pills in the bottle.

[PaRaGoNViCtiM]

I recently had surgery, and took vicodin during the first two days afterwards to cope with the pain. I hate the stuff too - it makes me feel like I'm going to faint every 15 minutes.

It makes me wonder what exactly does it take to become addictive? Why'd people get addicted to something like THAT?

Your Kidding Right?!

[iGary]

The stuff just knocks me out.

I don't get nausea or anything like that, I just get loopy and tired. I usually end up crashing on the couch for a couple of hours like I did today.

I just turn up the Soundsticks to max on the compter so I can hear if an e-mail comes in. ;)

Sorry for ranting about this, I've just had it with all the drugs, physical therapy, steroids...I just want them to open me up and fix it so I can get on with my life. I function pretty well on a day-to-day basis, but it does affect how much work I can get done in a day.

[iBlue]

it is always so interesting how different people react to different medications.

iGary, have you had a chance to talk to "the quack" about getting some Tramadol?
or, have you tried drinking something with caffeine with your meds to see if it helps cut out the drowsiness? (I'm sure you have, but just in case you haven't, I thought I should mention it)

I feel bad that you're being tormented by these meds. Sure surgery is probably a good choice so long as you are prepared (well duh, not to relay the obvious) but in the meantime I sure hope you can find something that helps without the unwanted side effects.

cyber {{{hug}}}

[iGary]

it is always so interesting how different people react to different medications.

iGary, have you had a chance to talk to "the quack" about getting some Tramadol?
or, have you tried drinking something with caffeine with your meds to see if it helps cut out the drowsiness? (I'm sure you have, but just in case you haven't, I thought I should mention it)

I feel bad that you're being tormented by these meds. Sure surgery is probably a good choice so long as you are prepared (well duh, not to relay the obvious) but in the meantime I sure hope you can find something that helps without the unwanted side effects.

cyber {{{hug}}}

No, not yet - I see the neurosurgeon on Tuesday, and hopefully he's game to go in there and get all these bits of discs that are floating around out of there. I'll stick with the Vicodin until then, but then ask him about something different. This guy works out of Johns Hopkins - very good neurosurgeon. At that point, I'll be dealing with a pain management doctor and the only thing I'll see the quack for is the usual stuff.

It could be worse. A dear friend of mine had a staph infection in his foot two years ago that he had three months of surgery and other therapies to get rid of. It just came back and they have to amputate half of his foot, so I have no real reason to whine. ;)