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tori10love
Jun 22, 2012, 12:49 AM
i purchased MBA2012 CTO Corei 7 2.0GHz/ MEM 8GB / SSD 128GB.

core i7 3667U, it support turbo boost, max multiplier 3.2GHz (x32, 1core), or 3.0GHz(x30, 2core).
but check cpu-z 1.60.1.x64, it reports cpu multiplier x8 or x19. core speed does not reach 2.0GHz(x20).

https://discussions.apple.com/servlet/JiveServlet/showImage/2-18672366-125226/CPU-Z.png

proccesor score of windows 7 experience index. MBA2012 CTO model's score is very low:mad:.

MBA2011 CTO Core i7-2677M 1.8GHz(TB 2.9GHz) 6.9
MBA2012     Core i5-3317U 1.7GHz(TB 2.6GHz) 6.9
MBA2012 CTO Core i7-3667U 2.0GHz(TB 3.2GHz) 6.3

i think MBA2012 Core i5 is enabled turbo boost, but MBA2012 CTO Core i7 is disabled trubo boost, guess cpu max multiplier setting is wrong, and turbo boost is disabled in EFI to change boot windows.

--
workaround(method): use ThrottleStop 4.0 later

http://www.techpowerup.com/158795/TechPowerUp-Announces-ThrottleStop-4.0.html

TRL(Turbo Ratio Limits) set to Maximun Turbo Ratio Limits. 1 core active 32/ 2core active 30.
i have confirmed improvement that proccesor sore on windows7 experience index is up to 7.1.

https://discussions.apple.com/servlet/JiveServlet/showImage/2-18876849-132288/TRL.png

---
i guess this bug is a problem of setting the MSR (IA32_PERF_CTL:Target performance State Value) in EFI.

it is assumed in the model CTO in the initialisation of the MSR in EFI, is to set the Target P-State and 19 at the time of turbo boost, and the root cause of the bug (I originally set 32 ​​is correct).

MSR 0x00000199 0x00000000 0x00001300 (bad)
MSR 0x00000199 0x00000000 0x00002000

---
workaround(another method): use MSR Editor (CrystalCPUID)

http://crystalmark.info/software/CrystalCPUID/index-e.html

run CrystalCPUID.exe, Function->MSR Editor, set values and press WRMSR. repeat CPU1-CPU4.

MSR Number 0x00000199
WRMSR EDX-> 0x00000000 EAX-> 0x00002000

https://discussions.apple.com/servlet/JiveServlet/downloadImage/2-18905859-133957/450-382/MSR.png
---
fixed!!

MacBook Air EFI Firmware Update 2.5
http://support.apple.com/kb/DL1592

This update is recommended for MacBook Air (mid 2012) models. This update fixes an issue where Turbo Boost does not activate when using Boot Camp, and resolves an issue where NetBoot does not function properly when using an Ethernet adapter.



KPOM
Jun 27, 2012, 06:08 AM
I've noticed this, too and filed a bug report with Apple. I also alerted AnandTech in case he sees it in his review of the i7.

RodPinto
Jun 27, 2012, 06:26 AM
I've noticed this, too and filed a bug report with Apple. I also alerted AnandTech in case he sees it in his review of the i7.

Great! I hope they find us a sollution... Sad to see that!

KPOM
Jun 27, 2012, 10:08 AM
I'd suggest filing a bug report with Apple.
http://www.apple.com/feedback/macosx.html

anthdci
Jun 27, 2012, 10:20 AM
i purchased MBA2012 CTO Corei 7 2.0GHz/ MEM 8GB / SSD 128GB.

How did you do that, the i7 is only available on the 256gb version.

oxfordguy
Jun 27, 2012, 10:31 AM
How did you do that, the i7 is only available on the 256gb version.

I assume its the 11" MBA model

KPOM
Jun 27, 2012, 10:38 AM
I assume its the 11" MBA model

How did you do that, the i7 is only available on the 256gb version.

^This. On the 11" model you can get an i7 with 128GB, 256GB, or 512GB. On the 13" model the i7 is available only on the 256GB and 512GB models. It was the same last year (except there was no 512GB option).

oxfordguy
Jun 27, 2012, 10:50 AM
^This. On the 11" model you can get an i7 with 128GB, 256GB, or 512GB. On the 13" model the i7 is available only on the 256GB and 512GB models. It was the same last year (except there was no 512GB option).

Indeed, hope Apple fix this soon, have just (yesterday) ordered an i7/8Gb RAM/256Gb SSD 13" MBA...

tori10love
Jun 28, 2012, 02:06 AM
How did you do that, the i7 is only available on the 256gb version.

my macbook air is 11inch model. core i7 on mba 2012 11inch is avaiable on 128gb/256gb/512gb.

i confirmed that MBA2012 core i5 standard model is enabled turbo boost, but core i7 cto model is disabled turbo boost, and reported this bug to apple support.

apple support replied that apple also confirmed this bug, will plan to fix firmware in the future.

oxfordguy
Jun 28, 2012, 02:34 AM
apple support replied that apple also confirmed this bug, will plan to fix firmware in the future.

Good news, hopefully they will do this soon!

anthdci
Jun 28, 2012, 03:53 AM
I assume its the 11" MBA model

ah, my bad :o

Monkeyat
Jun 28, 2012, 04:09 AM
Hum... as Turbo Boost is a processor feature and depends directly to the EFI, can we assume that this is NOT enable at Mac OS X either ? Is there a way to verify that ?

KPOM
Jun 28, 2012, 04:23 AM
Hum... as Turbo Boost is a processor feature and depends directly to the EFI, can we assume that this is NOT enable at Mac OS X either ? Is there a way to verify that ?

Given that the published benchmarks so far indicate that the i7 MacBook Air is about 10-20% faster than the i5 models (see Macworld), it's a safe assumption that Turbo Boost is just fine in OS X.

The Air was released before the Boot Camp drivers were available. What Boot Camp does is "translate" the Mac's EFI into BIOS-type instructions. My guess is that something in the EFI firmware doesn't translate right in Boot Camp and will need to be updated.

On a side note. although Windows 7 and Windows 8 support UEFI, it's a newer implementation than Apple's EFI, and Apple is unlikely to switch to it in the near future since a customized EFI helps them keep OS X exclusive to the Mac.

goinskiing
Jun 28, 2012, 03:31 PM
I had suspected this as there's an emulator I use that is heavily CPU reliant and performed about as well as my older MBA, I though something like this may be the case, hope it's addressed soon.

Old MBA: 13" i5
New MBA: 11" i7

KPOM
Jun 28, 2012, 04:01 PM
I had suspected this as there's an emulator I use that is heavily CPU reliant and performed about as well as my older MBA, I though something like this may be the case, hope it's addressed soon.

Old MBA: 13" i5
New MBA: 11" i7

Tori10Love posted on the Apple Support Forum and another thread here that Apple has acknowledged the issue and will address it in a firmware update.

Also, Anand Lal Shimpi returned my e-mail and will look into it over the weekend, so it should get some coverage.

tfannon
Jun 28, 2012, 07:34 PM
i own both a 2011 air and a 2012 air with the top-end processors.

i can confirm through geekbench and wei scores that the turbo boost is not engaging under boot camp.

turbo boost appears to be working on the OS X side as Geekbench scores are noticeably faster than last year's model.

I am glad to see others have this issue and apple has confirmed. I guess I will patiently await a fix.

goinskiing
Jun 28, 2012, 08:01 PM
Wrote this on the other forum:

I can confirm this as well on my 11" i7 8GB/256GB. I get the same Windows score of 6.3 whereas my 13" i5 scored 6.9. I hope it dones't take to long to address as it's a fairly simple toggle in the EFI, they probably have to run some regressions first though to make sure nothing else breaks I'm sure. There are definitely applications I use that use the turboboost and one of the reasons I went with the i7 option.

goinskiing
Jun 28, 2012, 09:20 PM
This should probably be a page 2 or maybe page 1 things where users are reporting turbo mode on core i7 MBA's disabled.

oxfordguy
Jun 29, 2012, 02:34 AM
This should probably be a page 2 or maybe page 1 things where users are reporting turbo mode on core i7 MBA's disabled.

Yes, this is quite a serious issue - at the moment it means users are paying more for a product that is potentially slower (albeit under a non Mac OS) than a cheaper model!

Mr. Retrofire
Jun 29, 2012, 03:55 AM
turbo boost is disabled in EFI to change boot windows
I see no EFI-problem. The OS kernel detects and enables hardware-specific features, so this is a Windows/Intel CPU driver problem. It is possible that your current version of Windows or your current version of Intels CPU drivers is not compatible with your new hardware. Make sure you install ALL available Windows-updates (autoupdate), Windows Service Packs (SP) and the newest Intel drivers. Do not use (older) Boot Camp drivers!

Btw:
Intel® Turbo Boost Technology Monitor (http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Detail_Desc.aspx?DwnldID=19105)

Another piece:

http://communities.intel.com/thread/11604

In Windows 7 / 2008, your power management should be set for balanced mode not preformance.
(sounds strange but performance mode can cause the the cpu to stay at its max rated frequency rather than clocking up to turbo boost mode)
.

KPOM
Jun 29, 2012, 05:42 AM
I see no EFI-problem. The OS kernel detects and enables hardware-specific features, so this is a Windows/Intel CPU driver problem. It is possible that your current version of Windows or your current version of Intels CPU drivers is not compatible with your new hardware. Make sure you install ALL available Windows-updates (autoupdate), Windows Service Packs (SP) and the newest Intel drivers. Do not use (older) Boot Camp drivers!



I'm using Apple's latest drivers. I think the issue is that for some reason the driver was updated for the i5 ULV CPU but not the i7. It appears to be on Apple to resolve this, and if it's a driver issue it should be an easy fix.

oxfordguy
Jun 29, 2012, 05:47 AM
BTW as far as I can tell, this (https://discussions.apple.com/thread/4035733) is the relevant thread on Apple Support Communities

oxfordguy
Jul 6, 2012, 07:21 AM
Does anyone know if there's been any more news on a fix for this? Thanks

KPOM
Jul 6, 2012, 08:19 AM
Does anyone know if there's been any more news on a fix for this? Thanks

Nothing yet. It wouldn't surprise me if this fix doesn't come out until Mountain Lion debuts.

tfannon
Jul 8, 2012, 06:53 AM
i doubt the apple service agent even knew what i was talking about but at least he wrote it in his notes.

now i am testing a macbook pro to see if the issue is present there.

i will respond again when i confirm.

oxfordguy
Jul 8, 2012, 07:25 AM
i doubt the apple service agent even knew what i was talking about but at least he wrote it in his notes.

now i am testing a macbook pro to see if the issue is present there.

i will respond again when i confirm.

Thanks

goinskiing
Jul 8, 2012, 10:58 PM
Does anybody know of some chipset drivers that enable the turboboost or any other workaround?

KPOM
Jul 9, 2012, 05:44 AM
Does anybody know of some chipset drivers that enable the turboboost or any other workaround?

Not yet. Intel hasn't posted the Ivy Bridge chipset drivers to its website yet.

tfannon
Jul 9, 2012, 06:22 AM
Turbo Boost works just fine on the rMBP.

Under BootCamp, Geekbench scored 14784 in 64-bit mode and I verified Turbo Boost was kicking in using Intel's Turbo utility.

I hope they get the issue fixed with the Air because that machine was noticeably faster in OS X than previous model yet noticeably slower in bootcamp.

wditters
Jul 9, 2012, 06:29 AM
Not yet. Intel hasn't posted the Ivy Bridge chipset drivers to its website yet.

Anyone tested these yet?

http://www.station-drivers.com/page/intel%20chipset.htm

goinskiing
Jul 9, 2012, 09:08 AM
I may test them out today if I get a chance. I would suppose well see some sort of fix that lines up with the release of ML.

KPOM
Jul 9, 2012, 09:24 AM
I'll give it a shot later on, as well. I also think we'll see a fix about the time Mountain Lion comes out.

goinskiing
Jul 9, 2012, 12:13 PM
So the intel management engine appears to be the most up to date with a July 5th date, this will be the one I will try...

oxfordguy
Jul 9, 2012, 02:27 PM
So the intel management engine appears to be the most up to date with a July 5th date, this will be the one I will try...

Would be interested to hear how you get on...

----------


i hope they get the issue fixed with the air because that machine was noticeably faster in os x than previous model yet noticeably slower in bootcamp.

+1

KPOM
Jul 9, 2012, 02:28 PM
So the intel management engine appears to be the most up to date with a July 5th date, this will be the one I will try...

What site are you going on to get the drivers? I didn't see it at the Intel site. Are you using the station-drivers page?

I should be able to try it this evening.

goinskiing
Jul 9, 2012, 03:38 PM
What site are you going on to get the drivers? I didn't see it at the Intel site. Are you using the station-drivers page?

I should be able to try it this evening.

I was referring to this post...

Quote:
Originally Posted by KPOM
Not yet. Intel hasn't posted the Ivy Bridge chipset drivers to its website yet.
Anyone tested these yet?

http://www.station-drivers.com/page/intel%20chipset.htm

----------

Also, in case you haven't seen, this may also be a related issue as well, wonder what it shows for the 8GB RAM i5 2012 MBA air folks...

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=15213125#post15213125

BlueOcean
Jul 9, 2012, 04:49 PM
I was referring to this post...

Quote:
Originally Posted by KPOM
Not yet. Intel hasn't posted the Ivy Bridge chipset drivers to its website yet.
Anyone tested these yet?

http://www.station-drivers.com/page/intel%20chipset.htm

----------

Also, in case you haven't seen, this may also be a related issue as well, wonder what it shows for the 8GB RAM i5 2012 MBA air folks...

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=15213125#post15213125

I've ordered the i7. I do hope they fix this entire Boot Camp issue, but I'll try out some of the driver stuff once I get mine.

goinskiing
Jul 9, 2012, 05:21 PM
I've ordered the i7. I do hope they fix this entire Boot Camp issue, but I'll try out some of the driver stuff once I get mine.

My bet is we'll see a bootcamp update in conjunction with the release of Mountain Lion (I think there's some EFI changes from Lion -> ML?, if true then there would likely be a bunch of bootcamp updates as well).

Has anyone tried Consumer Preview of Windows 8? I noticed there's some drivers from Intel that are more current for Windows 8 support (I think). I may try this tonight.

KPOM
Jul 9, 2012, 09:00 PM
I can't figure out how to install the updated drivers from the site. It installs the latest chipset installer, but doesn't appear to actually install updated drivers.

oxfordguy
Jul 10, 2012, 02:25 AM
Also, in case you haven't seen, this may also be a related issue as well, wonder what it shows for the 8GB RAM i5 2012 MBA air folks...

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=15213125#post15213125

That sounds even worse than the non-turbo boost issue, only 64Mb memory allocated for graphics, WTF! :-( One of the reasons I upgraded to the 8 Gb model was to be able to get 512Mb allocated to graphics instead of the 384Mb in thd 4Gb version...

KPOM
Jul 10, 2012, 06:35 AM
That sounds even worse than the non-turbo boost issue, only 64Mb memory allocated for graphics, WTF! :-( One of the reasons I upgraded to the 8 Gb model was to be able to get 512Mb allocated to graphics instead of the 384Mb in thd 4Gb version...

I think it may just be the dynamic memory throwing it off.

This is what Control Panel reports. I also ran GPU-Z and played an HD video. While I confirmed that the maximum GPU speed was 800MHz (meaning Turbo Boost wasn't on), it did use 100MB of memory. It was a CNet video, so I wasn't expecting it to use much. I don't have any Windows games so I couldn't check something that would use much more.

tori10love
Jul 10, 2012, 08:37 AM
use ThrottleStop 4.0

http://www.techpowerup.com/158795/Te...eStop-4.0.html

TRL(Turbo Ratio Limits) set to Maximun Turbo Ratio Limits. 1 core active 32/ 2core active 30.
i have confirmed improvement that proccesor sore on windows7 experience index is up to 7.1.

KPOM
Jul 10, 2012, 08:46 AM
use ThrottleStop 4.0

http://www.techpowerup.com/158795/Te...eStop-4.0.html

TRL(Turbo Ratio Limits) set to Maximun Turbo Ratio Limits. 1 core active 32/ 2core active 30.
i have confirmed improvement that proccesor sore on windows7 experience index is up to 7.1.

Thanks!

oxfordguy
Jul 10, 2012, 09:20 AM
use ThrottleStop 4.0

http://www.techpowerup.com/158795/Te...eStop-4.0.html

TRL(Turbo Ratio Limits) set to Maximun Turbo Ratio Limits. 1 core active 32/ 2core active 30.
i have confirmed improvement that proccesor sore on windows7 experience index is up to 7.1.


Is this safe to use?

goinskiing
Jul 10, 2012, 09:25 AM
A couple questions:

1. Does this force it in to constant turbo mode then?
2. Remember the other issue is the base frequency being 1.9 due to incorrect multipliers, what is now that base frequency and can that be changed using this method?

goinskiing
Jul 10, 2012, 04:19 PM
Quick update:

New Bootcamp
Windows 8 x65
Check CPU-Z (1.8GHz btw)
Install Bootcamp Drivers
Check Again (still 1.8)
Install Intel Windows 8 Drivers
Check Again (2.1 GHz wtf?)

Still running some other tests such as geek bench and such.

goinskiing
Jul 10, 2012, 04:35 PM
So the benchmarks are still sitting in the mid 4000s with the window 8 drivers apparently.

unclewebb
Jul 12, 2012, 05:40 PM
ThrottleStop 5.00
http://www.techinferno.com/downloads/

The latest version supports the new Ivy Bridge CPUs when running Windows.

ThrottleStop can not interfere with the thermal management built into these CPUs by Intel. No software can bypass Intel hardware from throttling if it truly needs to.

goinskiing
Jul 13, 2012, 01:26 AM
ThrottleStop 5.00
http://www.techinferno.com/downloads/

The latest version supports the new Ivy Bridge CPUs when running Windows.

ThrottleStop can not interfere with the thermal management built into these CPUs by Intel. No software can bypass Intel hardware from throttling if it truly needs to.

I wonder how the windows 8 comparability is, anybody tried this utility there yet?

tori10love
Jul 13, 2012, 03:10 AM
i think MBA2012 Core i5 is enabled turbo boost, but MBA2012 CTO Core i7 is disabled trubo boost, guess cpu max multiplier setting is wrong, and turbo boost is disabled in EFI to change boot windows.


I guess this bug is a problem of setting the MSR (IA32_PERF_CTL:Target performance State Value) in EFI.

It is assumed in the model CTO in the initialisation of the MSR in EFI, is to set the Target P-State and 19 at the time of turbo boost, and the root cause of the bug (I originally set 32 ​​is correct).

As a temporary workaround, in the application of the Throttle Stop, but it was confirmed that Turobo Boost working effectively, then, I tried to examine the state of the MSR at the before and after application of the Throttle Stop.

As a result, the following was found.

• The CTO model EIST, Turbo Boost is enabled.
• However, in the CTO model, Target P-State is closed when the Turbo Boost is set to 19-fold. Therefore, Current P-State can not be set to at least 19-fold magnification of the CPU.
• When you execute the Throttel Stop, so that can be set to 32 the Target P-State of Turbo Boost, will be able to raise up to max 32 also Current P-State magnification of the CPU.

In fact, before and after execution of the Throttle Stop, appears similar to the following and see the state of the MSR. (The value of the MSR, Save Report(.TXT) of the "About" → "Tools" of CPU-Z in the, you can see)

CPU Throttle Stop before) cpu multiplier 19 (max cpu multiplier 19)

MSR 0x000001A0 0x00000000 0x00850089
MSR 0x00000198 0x00001CD2 0x00001300
MSR 0x00000199 0x00000000 0x00001300
⇒ enable EIST, enable TurboBoost, the current P-State 19, the target P-State 19

CPU Throttle Stop after) cpu multiplier 30 (max cpu multiplier 32)

MSR 0x000001A0 0x00000000 0x00850089
MSR 0x00000198 0x000021A0 0x00001E00
MSR 0x00000199 0x00000000 0x00002000
⇒ enable EIST, enable TurboBoost, the current P-State 30 , the target P-State 32

From the above, CTO model, at the time of initialization when the switch to Windows, it would have been set to 19(0x00001300) is Target performance State Value is IA32_PERF_CTL of MSR in the BootCamp is a cause of trouble, 32(0x00002000) you can determine it because it does not, and has been a state that does not increase the magnification was also an attempt to invoke the turbo boost when under load.

MBA2012 Core i5 in the standard model, so go up 26 of cpu multiplier, probably should be the value of the following.

MSR 0x00000199 0x00000000 0x00001A00

<Reference>
· Intel64 and IA-32 Architectures Software Developer's Manual Combined Volumes1, 2A, 2B, 2C, 3A, 3B and 3C 
http://download.intel.com/products/processor/manual/325462.pdf
· CHAPTER 14 POWER AND THERMAL MANAGEMENT
 14.1 ENHANCED INTEL SPEEDSTEPR TECHNOLOGY
 14.3.2.2 OS Control of Opportunistic Processor Performance Operation
· CHAPTER 34 MODEL-SPEC IFIC REGISTERS (MSRS)
 34.7 MSRS IN INTELR PROCESSOR FAMILY (INTELR MICROARCHITECTURE CODE NAME SANDY BRIDGE)

1A0H IA32_MISC_ENABLE
 16 Enhanced Intel SpeedStep Technology Enable. (R/W)
 38 Turbo Mode Disable. (R/W)
198H IA32_PERF_STATUS
 15:0 Current performance State Value.
199H IA32_PERF_CTL
 15:0 Target performance State Value.
 32 IDA Engage. (R/W).

oxfordguy
Jul 13, 2012, 03:40 AM
I've downloaded Throttlestop 4.0. but still don't understand what I have to do to correct the CPU multiplier and enable the turbo boost feature - could someone walk me through this? Thanks

----------

I've downloaded Throttlestop 4.0. but still don't understand what I have to do to correct the CPU multiplier and enable the turbo boost feature - could someone walk me through this? Thanks

Also - is is actually beta to use the Throttlestop 5.0 beta (e.g. from here (http://www.techinferno.com/downloads/?did=29)) for the Ivy Bridge 2012 i7 MBA?

----------

I've downloaded Throttlestop 4.0. but still don't understand what I have to do to correct the CPU multiplier and enable the turbo boost feature - could someone walk me through this? Thanks

----------



Also - is is actually beta to use the Throttlestop 5.0 beta (e.g. from here (http://www.techinferno.com/downloads/?did=29)) for the Ivy Bridge 2012 i7 MBA?

and do I need to change the multiplier (from 19) or just turn Throttlestop "on"?

tori10love
Jul 13, 2012, 04:49 AM
and do I need to change the multiplier (from 19) or just turn Throttlestop "on"?

read ThrottleStopDocs.html.
check out "Do Not Reset FID / VID on Exit", and "Turn Off" and "Turn On".

KPOM
Jul 13, 2012, 06:19 AM
ThrottleStop 5.00
http://www.techinferno.com/downloads/

The latest version supports the new Ivy Bridge CPUs when running Windows.

ThrottleStop can not interfere with the thermal management built into these CPUs by Intel. No software can bypass Intel hardware from throttling if it truly needs to.

It works like a charm. I started it up, set the "Set Multiplier" setting to turbo (toggle it up to 32), and CPU-Z confirmed it was turbo boosting to the full level whenever I ran something intensive. I ran the WEI and it increased the CPU score from 6.3 to 7.1 and the memory score from 7.2 to 7.5.

What I can't tell is whether it has any impact on the GPU turbo boost.

oxfordguy
Jul 13, 2012, 06:22 AM
It works like a charm. I started it up, set the "Set Multiplier" setting to turbo (toggle it up to 32), and CPU-Z confirmed it was turbo boosting to the full level whenever I ran something intensive.


If doing this, does it only kick into turbo mode when needed, or does it run in turbo mode all the time?


I ran the WEI and it increased the CPU score from 6.3 to 7.1 and the memory score from 7.2 to 7.5.

What I can't tell is whether it has any impact on the GPU turbo boost.

Did it improve your "Windows Experience Index" for Gaming Graphics?

KPOM
Jul 13, 2012, 06:38 AM
If doing this, does it only kick into turbo mode when needed, or does it run in turbo mode all the time?

Only when necessary. What it does is increase the maximum step up from 19x to 32x.



Did it improve your "Windows Experience Index" for Gaming Graphics?

No. It is still 6.5. Do you know what the i5 MacBook Airs are scoring?

wditters
Jul 13, 2012, 06:42 AM
Did it improve your "Windows Experience Index" for Gaming Graphics?

It will not improve the WEI for Gaming Graphics. Simply put, that WEI is for 99% percent dependent on the GPU and RAM, not the CPU. Turbo Boost has almost no influence there. My T430s with a true i7 at 2.9Ghz (3.5Ghz) also has a WEI of 6.5 on Gaming Graphics.

oxfordguy
Jul 13, 2012, 07:01 AM
Only when necessary. What it does is increase the maximum step up from 19x to 32x.


Okay, great. I presume this is safe to use from a thermal management perspective?


No. It is still 6.5. Do you know what the i5 MacBook Airs are scoring?

Well (without Throttlestop) - I only got a "Gaming Graphics" score of 5.3 when I last ran the Windows Experience thing with my 2012 i7 8Gb MBA, which is worse than on my early-2008 MBP,which scored 6.1 for its Nvidia 8600 GT 512Mb GPU... :(

oxfordguy
Jul 13, 2012, 07:11 AM
BTW these are the full Windows Experience figures I got with my 2012 i7 8Gb Macbook Air (without Throttlestop) last time I ran this:

CPU - 6.4
RAM - 7.2
Computing (Windows) Graphics - 5.9
Gaming Graphics - 5.3 (seems very low?)
Disk - 7.9

KPOM
Jul 13, 2012, 08:00 AM
BTW these are the full Windows Experience figures I got with my 2012 i7 8Gb Macbook Air (without Throttlestop) last time I ran this:

CPU - 6.4
RAM - 7.2
Computing (Windows) Graphics - 5.9
Gaming Graphics - 5.3 (seems very low?)
Disk - 7.9

I got 6.5 for both graphics scores, with and without Throttlestop. I am using the Boot Camp drivers as the Intel HD4000 drivers from Intel's web site wouldn't load.

oxfordguy
Jul 13, 2012, 08:25 AM
I got 6.5 for both graphics scores, with and without Throttlestop. I am using the Boot Camp drivers as the Intel HD4000 drivers from Intel's web site wouldn't load.

That's odd, I'm using the Boot Camp drivers too. Is this with the same spec machine (i7/8Gb RAM)? Windows 7 64 bit?

KPOM
Jul 13, 2012, 08:49 AM
That's odd, I'm using the Boot Camp drivers too. Is this with the same spec machine (i7/8Gb RAM)? Windows 7 64 bit?

Yes. Did you migrate the Boot Camp partition from an old machine (such as by using Winclone)? If so, check to make sure that the old drivers aren't still there.

oxfordguy
Jul 13, 2012, 08:53 AM
Yes. Did you migrate the Boot Camp partition from an old machine (such as by using Winclone)? If so, check to make sure that the old drivers aren't still there.

No, it was a fresh install, though after much pain (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1400089)...

tori10love
Jul 13, 2012, 09:10 AM
use MSR Editor (CrystalCPUID)

http://crystalmark.info/software/CrystalCPUID/index-e.html

run CrystalCPUID.exe, Function->MSR Editor, set values and press WRMSR. repeat CPU1-CPU4.

MSR Number 0x00000199
WRMSR EDX-> 0x00000000 EAX-> 0x00002000

https://discussions.apple.com/servlet/JiveServlet/downloadImage/2-18905859-133957/450-382/MSR.png

see my post
http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=15240228&postcount=50

goinskiing
Jul 13, 2012, 10:32 AM
So, it appears you have to run the MSR editor every time you boot into windows as that register clears the new value at startup.

I didn't have luck with throttle stop because I wasnt clear on how to use it, the MSR editor worked for me however, I wonder if there's a CLI for the MSR editor to change at startup?

Btw this appears to work for Windows 8 as well with a large boost in CPU and RAM score in WEI. CPU-Z shows turboboosting working well too.

KPOM
Jul 13, 2012, 10:36 AM
I didn't have luck with throttle stop because I wasnt clear on how to use it, the MSR editor worked for me however, I wonder if there's a CLI for the MSR editor to change at startup?


Just unzip it to a folder and click on the Throttlestop icon. A dialog box will pop up. The "Set Multiplier" setting is about halfway down the box. Set that to its maximum setting (32, which will display as "Turbo").

oxfordguy
Jul 13, 2012, 11:03 AM
Just unzip it to a folder and click on the Throttlestop icon. A dialog box will pop up. The "Set Multiplier" setting is about halfway down the box. Set that to its maximum setting (32, which will display as "Turbo").


Is there a way to get this to run automatically on starting Windows, or at least to save settings, so you don't have to reset the multiplier each time? Thanks

goinskiing
Jul 13, 2012, 11:13 AM
Just unzip it to a folder and click on the Throttlestop icon. A dialog box will pop up. The "Set Multiplier" setting is about halfway down the box. Set that to its maximum setting (32, which will display as "Turbo").

I just wasn't sure if there was anything beyond that like a button I need to click to save or turn on is all.

----------

Also, wasn't sure what the persistence was for each method.

oxfordguy
Jul 13, 2012, 11:20 AM
I just wasn't sure if there was anything beyond that like a button I need to click to save or turn on is all

I assume you have to also click the "Turn On" button in Throttlestop

unclewebb
Jul 13, 2012, 11:21 AM
Keep in mind that ThrottleStop 4.00 does not correctly support Ivy Bridge CPUs. If your CPU model number starts with a 3 then do not use ThrottleStop 4.00 or 4.10.

ThrottleStop 5.00 beta is identical to ThrottleStop 4.00 except that it correctly recognizes the new Ivy Bridge CPUs. Don't let the beta word scare you. ThrottleStop 4.00 and 4.10 have been used for months on Sandy Bridge CPUs without any complaints. When new CPUs arrive, old software needs to be updated. I released version 5.00 as a beta because during the summer I don't have time to work on this project.

ThrottleStop 5.00 should allow you to adjust the Turbo Power Limits for your CPU as well. Apple was nice enough not to lock this feature like some PC manufacturers have been doing. Can someone post a screen shot of the window that pops up when you click on the TPL button? Does increasing these limits get you a higher Turbo Boost multiplier when fully loaded? Try doing some testing with wPrime.

oxfordguy
Jul 13, 2012, 11:23 AM
ThrottleStop 5.00 should allow you to adjust the Turbo Power Limits for your CPU as well. Apple was nice enough not to lock this feature like some PC manufacturers have been doing. Can someone post a screen shot of the window that pops up when you click on the TPL button?

Do you mean the TRL button? Also, how do you do a screenshot in Windows on a MBA?

oxfordguy
Jul 13, 2012, 11:33 AM
Okay using Throttlestop 5 (beta3) from Tech Inferno and setting the Multiplier to 32/Turbo I get these Windows Experience rating figures ("normal" figures in brackets:

CPU 7.1 (6.4)
RAM 7.5 (7.2)
Graphics 6.4 (5.9)
Gaming Graphics 6.5 (5.3)
Primary Disk 7.9 (7.9)

That's quite a difference! Was surprised to see even the RAM figure change a little.

unclewebb
Jul 13, 2012, 11:35 AM
The TRL button should show you the Turbo Ratio Limits or the Turbo multipliers available for your CPU.

The TPL button should open up a Turbo Power Limits window which will show you how much time and how many watts your CPU can use before maximum Turbo Boost is reduced.

On a PC I use the Print Screen button on the keyboard. Not sure what you can use on a Mac to get a screen shot.

Just tell me what numbers are in that window if you can't post a screen shot then try increasing them and see what happens to your WEI scores.

Most CPUs have a fixed maximum value set by Intel at the factory. Unfortunately I don't have access to this data at the moment so these values are wide open in ThrottleStop.

goinskiing
Jul 13, 2012, 11:43 AM
Here are my results (Windows 8 CP x64):

Geekbench 2.3.4
Before: 4367
After: 5764

WEI
Bef. -> Aft.
6.4 -> 7.1
7.2 -> 7.5
5.7 -> 5.7
6.3 -> 6.3
8.1 -> 8.1

I'd be interested to see what other peoples' Geekbench scores are.

KPOM
Jul 13, 2012, 11:52 AM
Is there a way to get this to run automatically on starting Windows, or at least to save settings, so you don't have to reset the multiplier each time? Thanks

Not that I know of, but I can look. Unfortunately, I don't think Windows 7 has an automated script routine like OS X.

Okay using Throttlestop 5 (beta3) from Tech Inferno and setting the Multiplier to 32/Turbo I get these Windows Experience rating figures ("normal" figures in brackets:

CPU 7.1 (6.4)
RAM 7.5 (7.2)
Graphics 6.4 (5.9)
Gaming Graphics 6.5 (5.3)
Primary Disk 7.9 (7.9)

That's quite a difference! Was surprised to see even the RAM figure change a little.

Those are pretty consistent with my 11" i7, except that I was getting graphics scores of 6.5 both with and without Throttlestop, and was getting 6.3 on the processor before. I also noticed the bump in the RAM score (perhaps since it is able to access it at 1600MHz instead of being limited by the processor.

oxfordguy
Jul 13, 2012, 12:28 PM
The TRL button should show you the Turbo Ratio Limits or the Turbo multipliers available for your CPU.

The TPL button should open up a Turbo Power Limits window which will show you how much time and how many watts your CPU can use before maximum Turbo Boost is reduced.

On a PC I use the Print Screen button on the keyboard. Not sure what you can use on a Mac to get a screen shot.

Just tell me what numbers are in that window if you can't post a screen shot then try increasing them and see what happens to your WEI scores.


With Turbo Boost enabled its says:
Package Power Limit: 25 (for both Limit 1 and Limit 2)
Turbo Limit time(S): 28 and 0
Package Current Limit(A): 112

The "Lock" checkboxes are unchecked

Is this what you mean? Are these the correct values to use?



Most CPUs have a fixed maximum value set by Intel at the factory. Unfortunately I don't have access to this data at the moment so these values are wide open in ThrottleStop.

Is this potentially dangerous?

unclewebb
Jul 13, 2012, 03:49 PM
By default, Intel suggests that the Turbo Boost time limit should be set to 28 seconds.

They recommend that Turbo Power Limit #1 should be set to the TDP of the CPU and they suggest that Limit #2 be set to 25% more than Limit #1.

17W X 1.25 = 20W
25W X 1.25 = 31W
35W X 1.25 = 44W

Increasing these values beyond the default values will allow your CPU to use more Turbo Boost when fully loaded. You should see an increase in Geekbench scores.

Mobile 3rd Generation Intel® Core™ Processor Family
Datasheet – Volume 1 of 2
http://www.intel.com/content/dam/www/public/us/en/documents/datasheets/3rd-gen-core-family-mobile-vol-1-datasheet.pdf

The 17W Dual Core Ultra CPUs (Core i7-3667U) have maximum limits of 24 and 44 watts.
The 35W Dual and Quad Core CPUs have maximum limits of 48 and 56 watts.
The 45W Quad Core CPUs have maximum limits of 60 and 72 watts.

You can search for your Intel CPU TDP rating here.
http://ark.intel.com/

If you use ThrottleStop and set these values sky high, your request will be ignored. Intel has set the above limits in the CPU and these limits can not be bypassed by any software like ThrottleStop so your CPU will be safe. ThrottleStop can not over ride the thermal throttling built in by Intel. If your CPU gets too hot when using ThrottleStop, it will still be able to thermal throttle no matter how you have ThrottleStop setup.

Edit: The Dual Core Ultra CPUs have a minimum Turbo TDP setting of 0 watts. This might be handy when trying to maximize battery life. The minimum Turbo Boost power setting for the 35W TDP CPUs is 24 watts and the minimum for the 45W TDP CPUs is 36 watts.

If ThrottleStop is not able to save and restore your settings after you exit and restart, make sure you have full read write access to the ThrottleStop.INI file.

If you are an Administrator on your account, you should be able to drag and drop a link to ThrottleStop into your Windows StartUp folder. You can also use the Windows Task Scheduler method. Check out the second post in the ThrottleStop Guide Thread.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/hardware-components-aftermarket-upgrades/531329-throttlestop-guide.html

oxfordguy
Jul 15, 2012, 09:04 AM
By default, Intel suggests that the Turbo Boost time limit should be set to 28 seconds.

They recommend that Turbo Power Limit #1 should be set to the TDP of the CPU and they suggest that Limit #2 be set to 25% more than Limit #1.

17W X 1.25 = 20W

.....

The 17W Dual Core Ultra CPUs (Core i7-3667U) have maximum limits of 24 and 44 watts.

So for a (17w) i7-3667U Macbook Air would these settings be best/safest in TPL?

With Turbo Boost enabled its says:
Package Power Limit: 17 (for both Limit 1) and 20 (for Limit 2)
Turbo Limit time(S): 28 and 0 (should the latter be longer than 0? Otherwise will Limit 2 ever be used?)
Package Current Limit(A): 112

The "Lock" checkboxes are unchecked

I'm getting the same Windows Experience Scores as recorded before when the Multipier is set to "Turbo" and its Throttlestop is turned on (when I had Pacakage Power Limit as 25/25), so seems just as fast i.e. (non Throttlestop in brackets)

CPU 7.1 (6.4)
RAM 7.5 (7.2)
Graphics 6.4 (5.9)
Gaming Graphics 6.5 (5.3)
Primary Disk 7.9 (7.9)

unclewebb
Jul 15, 2012, 10:49 AM
The Windows Experience Index is not a great benchmark when fine tuning the Turbo Power settings. You need to use a benchmark program that can fully load your CPU like wPrime does. wPrime does a better job than the built in TS Bench when testing the Turbo Power Limits. With a fully loaded CPU, the ThrottleStop average multiplier that is reported will show you if the Turbo Boost multiplier is being throttled back. Set a power limit of zero while the test is running and you should be able to see what happens to the multiplier if the Turbo Power Limits are not set high enough.

The 28 second and 0 second limits are the standard time limits recommended by Intel. What this means is that your CPU can go over limit #1 and use Limit #2 for up to 28 seconds. After your CPU operates above Limit #1 for 28 seconds, Turbo Boost is reduced so power consumption automatically gets scaled back under Limit #1. The 0 seconds for Limit #2 means that your CPU can not go beyond Limit #2 for any significant length of time. The actual time limit is something like 10 milliseconds that your CPU can go beyond Limit #2. Basically the CPU will reduce Turbo Boost almost immediately to keep your CPU under Limit #2.

You keep mentioning the "Safe" word when you really don't have to. There are no settings that are going to put your CPU in some sort of wild and crazy unsafe mode. Intel CPUs do a great job of looking after themselves and will ultimately remain within the maximum power and temperature limits set by Intel no matter what you do with ThrottleStop.

oxfordguy
Jul 15, 2012, 04:55 PM
Okay, thanks for clarifying

SoIsays
Jul 15, 2012, 07:14 PM
I hope this problem gets taken care of very soon. My i7 is coming soon and I'll be working in Windows for half the time.

KPOM
Jul 15, 2012, 07:38 PM
I hope this problem gets taken care of very soon. My i7 is coming soon and I'll be working in Windows for half the time.

Agreed, but Throttlestop works in the interim.

oxfordguy
Jul 26, 2012, 06:45 AM
So, does anyone know if the Mountain Lion release actually fixes the i7 turbo boost issue under Windows? I'm assuming not, as no one has said anything about this :-(

darthjones
Jul 26, 2012, 02:05 PM
So, does anyone know if the Mountain Lion release actually fixes the i7 turbo boost issue under Windows? I'm assuming not, as no one has said anything about this :-(

I want to know as well. I was actually planning on picking one up tomorrow for development work. If Windows does in fact perform better with an i5 processor, I may have to go with that instead...

oxfordguy
Jul 26, 2012, 02:07 PM
I want to know as well. I was actually planning on picking one up tomorrow for development work. If Windows does in fact perform better with an i5 processor, I may have to go with that instead...

Well, even now, Windows *is* faster if using ThrottleStop, but its ridiculous that you have to use a third party utility to "unleash" the i7...

KPOM
Jul 26, 2012, 04:11 PM
So, does anyone know if the Mountain Lion release actually fixes the i7 turbo boost issue under Windows? I'm assuming not, as no one has said anything about this :-(

No. I tried it yesterday, and I still need ThrottleStop. Otherwise, it is the same as before.

goinskiing
Jul 26, 2012, 04:13 PM
Well, even now, Windows *is* faster if using ThrottleStop, but its ridiculous that you have to use a third party utility to "unleash" the i7...

Even with Throttlestop, it still doesn't feel quite right as it seems to manage the heat by throttling down to 800MHz after heavy load, something my 2011 i5 had no problem doing was managing the heat /performance tradeoffs. Sure wish my fancy i7 would do that.

oxfordguy
Jul 27, 2012, 02:58 AM
Even with Throttlestop, it still doesn't feel quite right as it seems to manage the heat by throttling down to 800MHz after heavy load, something my 2011 i5 had no problem doing was managing the heat /performance tradeoffs. Sure wish my fancy i7 would do that.

I agree we need a proper fix for this, come on Apple!

goinskiing
Jul 27, 2012, 11:32 AM
I agree we need a proper fix for this, come on Apple!

I haven't checked the drivers in a while from Intel, I'll see if there's any changes on that end of things...

mike95
Jul 29, 2012, 12:56 AM
I'm concerned about moving up to the i7 now because of all these issues. I was about to take the leap given the performance boost of about 15-20% from the i5. I purchased the 2012 11" i5 8GB/256GB thinking it would be better with heat & battery than the 11" i7 8GB/256GB.

Assuming the issue with the i7 and Bootcamp is resolved (Is it yet???) since so many of you have i7's...what's your take on the battery life & heat when compared to the 2011 11" i5? (that's the one I had previously).

Thanks.

KPOM
Jul 29, 2012, 06:17 PM
I'm concerned about moving up to the i7 now because of all these issues. I was about to take the leap given the performance boost of about 15-20% from the i5. I purchased the 2012 11" i5 8GB/256GB thinking it would be better with heat & battery than the 11" i7 8GB/256GB.

Assuming the issue with the i7 and Bootcamp is resolved (Is it yet???) since so many of you have i7's...what's your take on the battery life & heat when compared to the 2011 11" i5? (that's the one I had previously).

Thanks.

It isn't yet resolved. ThrottleStop still works as a workaround in the interim

mike95
Jul 30, 2012, 01:18 AM
I just finished taking home an i7 to compare and make a final decision before my 14 days were up. A loose key (the 'y' key) fell off twice and triggered the desire to confirm the i7 and if so return the i5 (the key was pressed on firmly and hasn't fallen off any more).

I did confirm the i7 has a lower cpu score under bootcamp as many have reported, however my goal was to finally get some concrete numbers from the i7 vs i5 on an identically configured machine except for cpu and sharing here in case any of the i7 people on this thread are considering going i5 or vice versa.

To make the test as realistic as possible, I cloned my i5's HD to the i7 straight out of the box, ran through a 30 min encoding keeping track of cpu temp, encoding time left, fan speed. I additionally re-ran the encoding while on battery monitoring the battery of both machines periodically to compare one with the other. I'm now performing the light load test and the results will be posted shortly in an update.

The full results can be found here:
http://michael.olivero.com/post/2012/07/29/Macbook-Air-2012-i5-vs-i7-Heat-Fan-Battery-Speed-analysis.aspx

Wokis
Jul 30, 2012, 03:52 AM
I just finished taking home an i7 to compare and make a final decision before my 14 days were up. A loose key (the 'y' key) fell off twice and triggered the desire to confirm the i7 and if so return the i5 (the key was pressed on firmly and hasn't fallen off any more).

I did confirm the i7 has a lower cpu score under bootcamp as many have reported, however my goal was to finally get some concrete numbers from the i7 vs i5 on an identically configured machine except for cpu and sharing here in case any of the i7 people on this thread are considering going i5 or vice versa.

To make the test as realistic as possible, I cloned my i5's HD to the i7 straight out of the box, ran through a 30 min encoding keeping track of cpu temp, encoding time left, fan speed. I additionally re-ran the encoding while on battery monitoring the battery of both machines periodically to compare one with the other. I'm now performing the light load test and the results will be posted shortly in an update.

The full results can be found here:
http://michael.olivero.com/post/2012/07/29/Macbook-Air-2012-i5-vs-i7-Heat-Fan-Battery-Speed-analysis.aspx I guess by the pictures that this is concerning the 11" model which has a slower i5 than the 13", and also somewhat worse cooling due to the smaller size.

mike95
Jul 30, 2012, 11:36 PM
I guess by the pictures that this is concerning the 11" model which has a slower i5 than the 13", and also somewhat worse cooling due to the smaller size.

Yes, I realized I did not specify that anywhere. I have since then updated it to indicate the 11" throughout.

SoIsays
Aug 1, 2012, 09:07 AM
Still no updates from Apple on this turbo boost :( I did a windows experience test this morning using Parallels and my score went from 6.3 to 4.7. The processor and video both dropped down to 4.7. I was hoping that by avoiding bootcamp, I could get a higher score. Oh well.

oxfordguy
Aug 2, 2012, 04:28 AM
Still no updates from Apple on this turbo boost :( I did a windows experience test this morning using Parallels and my score went from 6.3 to 4.7. The processor and video both dropped down to 4.7. I was hoping that by avoiding bootcamp, I could get a higher score. Oh well.

I think a firmware update from Apple is going to be necessary, hope this arrives soon, now that Apple have got Mountain Lion out.

oxfordguy
Aug 26, 2012, 03:25 PM
Has there been any update on a proper fix for this from Apple? Thanks

SoIsays
Aug 26, 2012, 05:19 PM
I think Apple's abandoned us 2012 i7'ers. We're of no priority and they're waiting for people to be defeated and the complaints to disappear.

oxfordguy
Aug 27, 2012, 03:37 AM
I think Apple's abandoned us 2012 i7'ers. We're of no priority and they're waiting for people to be defeated and the complaints to disappear.

It beggars belief that Apple still haven't released a fix for this major fundamental flaw with the i7 MBA, nor even issued a statement about it! Surely they must know its an issue?

wditters
Aug 27, 2012, 05:00 AM
I am currently using this fix, and it works fine, without using Throttlestop

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/4035733?start=15&tstart=0

SoIsays
Aug 27, 2012, 08:50 AM
I am currently using this fix, and it works fine, without using Throttlestop

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/4035733?start=15&tstart=0

Boy I'd hate to mess around with the hardware since I'm knowledge limited in that area, but is this relatively easy? Just those quick changes using CPUID and the turbo boost will be activate in windows? Do you have to make the changes everytime you log into windows or is it once you make the changes they are permanent? I'd like to be able to bring it back to stock settings if/when Apple issues a fix.

wditters
Aug 27, 2012, 01:27 PM
Do you have to make the changes everytime you log into windows or is it once you make the changes they are permanent? I'd like to be able to bring it back to stock settings if/when Apple issues a fix.

This is a simple batchfile that runs out of the startup folder. Deactivating it only requires deleting it from the same startup folder :-)

hajime
Aug 27, 2012, 07:52 PM
Hello, I am considering to buy a 13" MBA and upgrade it to i7 2.0GHz. I want to clarify the following:

1. Does the turbo boost issue affect all the 13" MBA with the i7 upgrade?
2. In another thread, some people mentioned that a maxed model of the
13" MBA is faster than my 2010 i7 MBP 17". Without the turbo boost
in Windows under Bootcamp, does the MBA 13" still perform faster than
my MBP 17"?
3. If I run Windows using Fusion on the MBA, is the system still perform
better than my MBP 17" running Windows via Fusion?
4. Does the Turboboost problem affect MBA running Windows 8?
5. Is it fixable? It seems that by using a script file posted by somebody
on the support forum on Apple's website, the problem can be fixed?

Thanks.

KPOM
Aug 27, 2012, 07:56 PM
Hello, I am considering to buy a 13" MBA and upgrade it to i7 2.0GHz. I want to clarify the following:

1. Does the turbo boost issue affect all the 13" MBA with the i7 upgrade?
2. In another thread, some people mentioned that a maxed model of the
13" MBA is faster than my 2010 i7 MBP 17". Without the turbo boost
in Windows under Bootcamp, does the MBA 13" still perform faster than
my MBP 17"?
3. If I run Windows using Fusion on the MBA, is the system still perform
better than my MBP 17" running Windows via Fusion?
4. Does the Turboboost problem affect MBA running Windows 8?
5. Is it fixable? It seems that by using a script file posted by somebody
on the support forum on Apple's website, the problem can be fixed?

Thanks.

1) Yes
2) Likely not, as without the Turbo Boost, the i7 is limited to a top speed of 1.9GHz.
3) For CPU tasks it is likely a wash. Note that your 17" MBP has a discrete GPU, so graphics tasks will be faster on your MBP than the Air.
4) I believe yes, since it is a firmware matter, and not an issue with the software, but I don't know for sure.
5) Hopefully Apple will release a permanent fix, but the scripts, and the ThrottleStop software provide a temporary workaround. It is possible that battery life will be worse with the workarounds than the permanent fix, since the workarounds may interfere with the power management features.

hajime
Aug 27, 2012, 08:40 PM
1) Yes
2) Likely not, as without the Turbo Boost, the i7 is limited to a top speed of 1.9GHz.
3) For CPU tasks it is likely a wash. Note that your 17" MBP has a discrete GPU, so graphics tasks will be faster on your MBP than the Air.
4) I believe yes, since it is a firmware matter, and not an issue with the software, but I don't know for sure.
5) Hopefully Apple will release a permanent fix, but the scripts, and the ThrottleStop software provide a temporary workaround. It is possible that battery life will be worse with the workarounds than the permanent fix, since the workarounds may interfere with the power management features.

So, with the temporary fix, the answer to Q2 is yes. The battery just runs out faster? If not, does the maxed out 11" MBA perform better under Windows than the 13" MBA and my 17" MBP? I mean in general, non 3D-intensive applications.

Apple is making it difficult to buy their products these days. I wanted an iPhone 5, they released the 4S. I wanted to buy the Mac Pro, the hardware is out of date and the maxed model is more expensive and slower than the HP Workstation. I wanted to buy a 15" rMBP, there are some applications that look bad on the new display (I know it is the problem with the software but if they have a 15" non retina display the same weight as the rMBP, I would have bought it already.) Now, I want to buy a MBA and there is a problem with the turbo boost...

SoIsays
Aug 28, 2012, 07:11 AM
This is a simple batchfile that runs out of the startup folder. Deactivating it only requires deleting it from the same startup folder :-)

Cool, thanks. I tried it and it took mine from 2.0ghz to a fixed 2.49ghz and bumped my cpu score to 7.1. The lowest value I had was 5.5 and was for ram. The other scores went up incrementally like graphics.

I really hope the official fix comes to give the full turbo boost of 3.2ghz.

Edit: Ah, so using CPUID only works in Bootcamp mode. I tried using it in Parallels and I'm limited to one cpu and it doesn't change from the 2.0ghz value.

wditters
Aug 29, 2012, 12:24 PM
Cool, thanks. I tried it and it took mine from 2.0ghz to a fixed 2.49ghz and bumped my cpu score to 7.1. The lowest value I had was 5.5 and was for ram. The other scores went up incrementally like graphics.

I really hope the official fix comes to give the full turbo boost of 3.2ghz.

Odd .. in my case in Bootcamp I see turbo boost spiking at 3.2ghz just the way it should (measured by latest Intel Turboboost Monitor)

Calot
Aug 29, 2012, 12:35 PM
Odd .. in my case in Bootcamp I see turbo boost spiking at 3.2ghz just the way it should (measured by latest Intel Turboboost Monitor)

So it's fixed?

SoIsays
Aug 29, 2012, 12:43 PM
Odd .. in my case in Bootcamp I see turbo boost spiking at 3.2ghz just the way it should (measured by latest Intel Turboboost Monitor)

Interesting, what did you use to display 3.2ghz? In my case, it was showing as fixed in the real time clock speed in CPUID and the Windows info showed 2.49ghz alongside 2.0 ghz in the system properties.

I used the exact numbers you had posted for CPUID (0x00000199, 0x00000000, 0x00002000). At the same time, how do you set it back to stock? It shows as 2.49ghz even if I move the CPUID folder to the trash can and restart the MBA. Could it be because I am on Mountain Lion?

When I use Parallels, the changes don't register at all. It just shows 2.0ghz.

KPOM
Aug 29, 2012, 01:15 PM
Odd .. in my case in Bootcamp I see turbo boost spiking at 3.2ghz just the way it should (measured by latest Intel Turboboost Monitor)

When did you download the Boot Camp drivers?

wditters
Aug 29, 2012, 03:54 PM
When did you download the Boot Camp drivers?

No not Bootcamp drivers but a fix as posted on https://discussions.apple.com/thread/4035733?start=15&tstart=0
My turboboost now works exactly as it should (albeit triggered by batch file on the startup folder, exactly as instructed below)


--- THIS WORKAROUND IS FOR THE MACBOOK AIR 2012 with i7 CPU ONLY ---

This is a scripted (one-click) approach to implement the MSR fix that tori10love found.

1. Download and install the latest version of the program RW-Everything, v1.4.9 at this time:
http://jacky5488.myweb.hinet.net/download.html

By default it installs to C:\Program Files (x86)\RW-Everything\

2. Create a text file which is the script, that has this:

>cpu 1
>wrmsr 0x00000199 0 0x00002000
>cpu 2
>wrmsr 0x00000199 0 0x00002000
>cpu 3
>wrmsr 0x00000199 0 0x00002000
>cpu 4
>wrmsr 0x00000199 0 0x00002000
>rwexit

For example, I created this file as C:\Temp\MacbookAir2012_i7_Fix.rw

3. Create a CMD/DOS batch file which runs this script:

cd C:\Temp\
"C:\Program Files (x86)\RW-Everything\RW" /Command=MacbookAir2012_i7_Fix.rw /Logfile=rw-logfile.txt

--- DONE ---

Note that the MSR value is reset to the default (wrong) values after every SLEEP or BOOT. So if you want this to be always fixed, it has to be run after every wakeup or boot.

SoIsays
Sep 6, 2012, 02:17 PM
Just want to bump this up since the turbo boost problem hasn't been resolved yet by Apple/Intel.

Maven1975
Sep 7, 2012, 06:44 PM
No not Bootcamp drivers but a fix as posted on https://discussions.apple.com/thread/4035733?start=15&tstart=0
My turboboost now works exactly as it should (albeit triggered by batch file on the startup folder, exactly as instructed below)


--- THIS WORKAROUND IS FOR THE MACBOOK AIR 2012 with i7 CPU ONLY ---

This is a scripted (one-click) approach to implement the MSR fix that tori10love found.

1. Download and install the latest version of the program RW-Everything, v1.4.9 at this time:
http://jacky5488.myweb.hinet.net/download.html

By default it installs to C:\Program Files (x86)\RW-Everything\

2. Create a text file which is the script, that has this:

>cpu 1
>wrmsr 0x00000199 0 0x00002000
>cpu 2
>wrmsr 0x00000199 0 0x00002000
>cpu 3
>wrmsr 0x00000199 0 0x00002000
>cpu 4
>wrmsr 0x00000199 0 0x00002000
>rwexit

For example, I created this file as C:\Temp\MacbookAir2012_i7_Fix.rw

3. Create a CMD/DOS batch file which runs this script:

cd C:\Temp\
"C:\Program Files (x86)\RW-Everything\RW" /Command=MacbookAir2012_i7_Fix.rw /Logfile=rw-logfile.txt

--- DONE ---

Note that the MSR value is reset to the default (wrong) values after every SLEEP or BOOT. So if you want this to be always fixed, it has to be run after every wakeup or boot.

WOW!

Thanks alot! This make all the difference in the world.

Now if we can only figure out hou to disable the internal termal throttling at its default set temperature.

Also, has anyone sucessfully updated the HD 4000 drivers? The latest I see on Intels site will not install. Says no compatible hardware found. I tried to extract the package ith uniextract and manually install, only to be given the same message.

SoIsays
Sep 15, 2012, 08:34 PM
workaround(another method): use MSR Editor (CrystalCPUID)

http://crystalmark.info/software/CrystalCPUID/index-e.html

run CrystalCPUID.exe, Function->MSR Editor, set values and press WRMSR. repeat CPU1-CPU4.

MSR Number 0x00000199
WRMSR EDX-> 0x00000000 EAX-> 0x00002000

Image (https://discussions.apple.com/servlet/JiveServlet/downloadImage/2-18905859-133957/450-382/MSR.png)

I think I need a little help. I tried the settings in crystalcpuid on my 32bit windows 7 in bootcamp. The settings changed from 2.0 ghz to 2.49 ghz. And it is fixed at 2.49 ghz according to crystalcpuid. Even when I restart windows, the cpu comes back fixed at 2.49 ghz. It makes the fans run from 3500rpm to 4000rpm after 10min of just web surfing.

How can I reset back to 2.0 ghz or the stock settings? Here is the screenshot of my windows system info showing 2.49ghz:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8179/7990261367_69f03a692c.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/30156812@N00/7990261367/)

Crystalcpuid says I'm running at 2.49ghz but cpuz says I'm running at 2.095ghz with the multiplier at 21 instead of the stock 19. I don't know what's going on but I'm hoping the i7 isn't running continuously at 2.095 or 2.49ghz.

goinskiing
Sep 19, 2012, 01:53 PM
There's an EFI update 2.5 that has the fix for TurboBoost! I have not downloaded yet but it's there, can someone confirm performance?!

KPOM
Sep 19, 2012, 02:30 PM
There's an EFI update 2.5 that has the fix for TurboBoost! I have not downloaded yet but it's there, can someone confirm performance?!

That's great to hear! I have been waiting for this. I've got a lot to download tonight (iOS 6, 10.8.2, Office 2011 for Mac Update, EFI update).

goinskiing
Sep 19, 2012, 06:09 PM
Works on Windows 8 Consumer Preview as well!

----------

Here are my results (Windows 8 CP x64):

Geekbench 2.3.4
Before: 4367
After: 5764

WEI
Bef. -> Aft.
6.4 -> 7.1
7.2 -> 7.5
5.7 -> 5.7
6.3 -> 6.3
8.1 -> 8.1

I'd be interested to see what other peoples' Geekbench scores are.

With EFI Update:
Geekbench (32): 6256

isrefel
Sep 19, 2012, 06:18 PM
Confirmed this is now fixed under 10.8.2 and the associated firmware update. Turboboost multiplier is now correct under bootcamp.

yensteel
Sep 19, 2012, 08:25 PM
It's great that they fixed it in today's update!

oxfordguy
Sep 20, 2012, 03:52 AM
Confirmed this is now fixed under 10.8.2 and the associated firmware update. Turboboost multiplier is now correct under bootcamp.

Hurrah! I'd almost given up on this being fixed, the EFI firmware update seems to work great, though :-)

KPOM
Sep 20, 2012, 06:11 AM
Works on Windows 8 Consumer Preview as well!

----------



With EFI Update:
Geekbench (32): 6256

Oddly enough, in Windows 7 64-bit I could tell using CPU-ID that it was turbo boosting all the way, but the WEI still only registered 6.3 (up from 6.2) on the CPU score. I'll check to make sure that Throttlestop isn't still out there in the background messing with things. I didn't do any of the other workarounds.

In any case, it's good to see that Apple got around to fixing the issue with the EFI.

wditters
Sep 21, 2012, 10:32 AM
Oddly enough, in Windows 7 64-bit I could tell using CPU-ID that it was turbo boosting all the way, but the WEI still only registered 6.3 (up from 6.2) on the CPU score.

My WEI for CPU registered 7.2 (i7 2.0 w/8Gb ram). Works flawlessly now.

nmr600
Sep 24, 2012, 05:36 PM
So its sept 24th. almost exactly 3 months to the day that I received this new top of the line MBA, and TODAY, apple FINALLY released the firmware update that corrects a SIMPLE CPU configuration error that allows turbo boost in windows, so computer performs as its supposed to . They know about it in early July at least (I and others sent bug reports). Work arounds using a gamers over-clocking utilities or other options were available, but it was very annoying that the "upgraded" processor only had the problem (2.00GHz, vs 1.6GHz). Apple's official line was it a windows issue. NOT TRUE, it was in the Apple EFI. Anyway, its all about the money. it just wasn't a top priority for the 20% of the people who bought new MBA's with the 2.0 GHz 3667U Ivy Bridge CPU. After all they have IOS 6, their cash cow and Mountain Lion to keep there best coders. Oh well, its still and awesome Lappy in a 2.5 lb form factor, and I only use Windows when necessary. USB3, 8GB RAM, IB CPU's processors, more. Sold my precious rev and never looked back .

wilycoder
Sep 24, 2012, 06:13 PM
So its sept 24th. almost exactly 3 months to the day that I received this new top of the line MBA, and TODAY, apple FINALLY released the firmware update that corrects a SIMPLE CPU configuration error that allows turbo boost in windows, so computer performs as its supposed to . They know about it in early July at least (I and others sent bug reports). Work arounds using a gamers over-clocking utilities or other options were available, but it was very annoying that the "upgraded" processor only had the problem (2.00GHz, vs 1.6GHz). Apple's official line was it a windows issue. NOT TRUE, it was in the Apple EFI. Anyway, its all about the money. it just wasn't a top priority for the 20% of the people who bought new MBA's with the 2.0 GHz 3667U Ivy Bridge CPU. After all they have IOS 6, their cash cow and Mountain Lion to keep there best coders. Oh well, its still and awesome Lappy in a 2.5 lb form factor, and I only use Windows when necessary. USB3, 8GB RAM, IB CPU's processors, more. Sold my precious rev and never looked back .

thanks for sharing with the class timmy.

hajime
Sep 29, 2012, 03:07 AM
May I reconfirm that the 2012 MBA maxed version (i7 2.0GHz) can now get turbo boost to 3.2GHz under Windows?

wilycoder
Sep 29, 2012, 09:25 AM
May I reconfirm that the 2012 MBA maxed version (i7 2.0GHz) can now get turbo boost to 3.2GHz under Windows?

it will turbo boost a single core to 3.2ghz.

if both cores are used 100% then they both get turbo boost and will turbo to 3.0ghz

hajime
Sep 29, 2012, 05:16 PM
it will turbo boost a single core to 3.2ghz.

if both cores are used 100% then they both get turbo boost and will turbo to 3.0ghz

This is tricky.