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View Full Version : [mobile OSs] Probably wrong here, but do you think Android 4.1 has made Apple reconsider?




gforce216
Jul 14, 2012, 08:26 AM
I was just thinking about this as I read a thread on here about someone switching from iOS to Android due to the number of great new features Android 4.1 has coming out. I have to agree. I think the operating systems have truly reached parity at this point with maybe Android possibly inching ahead in terms of number of features.

So I decided to do some digging and saw that Google I/O started June 27, which is two days after the June 25 release of iOS 6 Beta 2. Now granted the July 4 holiday could have something to do with this delay in the next beta being released or the rumored Safari memory leak from an unknown source. But just for a second go with this idea.

If Beta 3 was supposed to come out this past Tuesday and hasn't, is it possible that Apple has had an OS refresh in the works that they may be trying to push forward with now in order to breath some life into the OS? I love Apple and I understand that there are changes now to the UI and the iOS 6 features are fantastic. I think the blend of iOS 6 and Mountain Lion features is wonderful, but could Apple have possibly pushed back the next release?

It doesn't seem likely, I know, because a UI refresh would probably constitute a bigger announcement than just jamming it into Beta 3, but I figured since we have all been waiting so long for the next beta that this might just be a story to hold us over and keep us at peace.



Sh4wN
Jul 14, 2012, 08:33 AM
Not ever. :D

BuckeyeMac
Jul 14, 2012, 08:44 AM
That would be awesome

Defender2010
Jul 14, 2012, 08:51 AM
Waiting so long??? You make it sound like it's been months!! IF, people assumed the release schedule was every two weeks, it is only now 5 days over this, but, there has been times in the past when the betas have been longer than 2 weeks, so don't fret....when it's ready they will release it!

On a related note: both my devices running beta 2 have really been playing up over the past 3 days. iTunes Match was working perfectly - now it's not, Safari, App Store and iTunes too, along with more bugs affected smoothness. They were both working great up to now...and I changed nothing on the devices. Perhaps a restore will do the trick.

batting1000
Jul 14, 2012, 10:44 AM
No. Apple isn't going to change its software just because another company just updated theirs.

bgro
Jul 14, 2012, 10:47 AM
Waiting so long??? You make it sound like it's been months!! IF, people assumed the release schedule was every two weeks, it is only now 5 days over this, but, there has been times in the past when the betas have been longer than 2 weeks, so don't fret....when it's ready they will release it!

On a related note: both my devices running beta 2 have really been playing up over the past 3 days. iTunes Match was working perfectly - now it's not, Safari, App Store and iTunes too, along with more bugs affected smoothness. They were both working great up to now...and I changed nothing on the devices. Perhaps a restore will do the trick.

I've been noticing the same thing. And I haven't changed anything

gforce216
Jul 14, 2012, 10:48 AM
Believe me I know it's not realistic at all. I've been involved with the betas before so I'm aware of the infrequent scheduled releases. It's probably nothing, but sometimes I worry that Apple is getting a little stubborn nowadays with how they handle themselves. The UI is not similar throughout the OS right now and I understand that it's a beta, but I'm hoping to see some work on that.

cinek
Jul 14, 2012, 10:53 AM
maybe in ios8 or 9 not 6. Apple is doing the same thing as nokia a while ago. Look where nokia is now, that's where apple is heading if they don't change things up

Gjwilly
Jul 14, 2012, 11:05 AM
If Beta 3 was supposed to come out this past Tuesday and hasn't, is it possible that Apple has had an OS refresh in the works that they may be trying to push forward with now in order to breath some life into the OS?

Assuming that beta-3 is delayed is where your theory falls apart.
There was no delay because there is no beta schedule.
Yes, Apple puts in expiration dates but they're usually on month+ intervals giving the programmers plenty of time to reach some next milestone.
These milestones are when they release the next beta, not some date on a calendar.
When a certain problem has been fixed, or an api changed, or a new element requires testing is when the next beta will be released.
There simply is no pattern and there is no schedule.

gmanist1000
Jul 14, 2012, 11:29 AM
Why would they say... "hey oh it's Beta 3, and because of Beta 3... total redesign!"

They would have said something at the keynote.

Jagardn
Jul 14, 2012, 11:34 AM
Apple doesn't need to do anything. They are making a mobile platform for the average person. The iOS does pretty much anything the masses need it to do. Eventually Android will come to the point that revolutionary changes won't be coming out in every release because the OS will have matured. What will all of the Android fans do when all of the brand new "ooooooh's" and "aaaaaaah's" aren't being supplied with each release.

I have thought about getting an Android phone, but my main concerns are my Music(I Love iTunes Match), Updates(Nexus is the only one who gets them consistently), and my biggest concern "Google Play". The nature of the Android platform with fragmentation and so many versions running on all of the devices makes it difficult for developers to make stable apps for the system. Second of all, not many Android users buy a lot of apps, they look for free ones. The way the platform is designed, quality apps being written for it will grow at a snail's pace. The Apple app store is designed to make money(yes greedy corporate America). Developers have kids to feed and bills to pay, so until the Android platform changes it's direction, I will probably never use it for my phone.

On the other hand, I did buy a Nexus 7, mostly for an E-Reader/Research tool. It will serve me fine for what I need it for, and unless it really "Wow's" me I don't see myself changing my phone.

Gjwilly
Jul 14, 2012, 11:36 AM
They're also not going to reveal a new UI in a (more or less) public beta.
They'll test it internally and reveal it at product launch like they did with Siri.
With all of the 16:9 iPhone rumors, a new UI, or at least some new UI features. may very well be in the works but the rumors still predate 4.1.

nuckinfutz
Jul 14, 2012, 11:42 AM
No

Apple isn't reacting to what Google's doing. They are moving on their own defined path. There's nothing in Jelly Bean that Apple needs to crib. Apple's developer tools have gotten to the point where they are so good that the plan is to empower developers to create great apps.

If you're a developer that wants to stick to iOS only you've got the ability to leverage so many features and tools. It's a great spot to be.

I think Beta 3 comes out next week but it could be two weeks before we see it. I'm not expecting a lot of new features but I am expecting some good iterations because much ground needs to be covered before launch.

PlaceofDis
Jul 14, 2012, 11:46 AM
iOS 6 isn't going to be released until the fall. its not like the ML GM needing to come out because its going to be released this month. Apple have the time to work on iOS 6, polish it up and fix any bugs they find. There is no rush for the different betas to come out quickly. there might only be a third beta for all we know. Apple reacting to Jelly Bean? doubt it. they're doing their own thing and probably trying to fix any bugs that were found with the first and second betas before trying to put out 3.

faroZ06
Jul 14, 2012, 11:50 AM
I think the operating systems have truly reached parity at this point with maybe Android possibly inching ahead in terms of number of features.

Android has always had more features than iOS, but there are other reasons (including the quality of the features) why use iOS. The 1080p video on the Nexus is lower-quality than the 720p video on my iPhone 4 :D, and the sound recording quality sucks on the Nexus.

Answering your question, whenever the competition gets new features, Apple adds them. It's part of their "go slow" strategy. Apple can make a lot of noise by adding features that should have been there from the start (video recording!), but it's never a surprise when an Android phone gets new features. Anything Google releases makes Apple respond.

----------

No. Apple isn't going to change its software just because another company just updated theirs.

If there weren't any competitor smartphones that had video recording, Apple would have taken their sweet time getting it onto the iPhone. I think they would have added it in 2012.

shawnwich
Jul 14, 2012, 03:28 PM
I don't think its right to say that Apple wouldn't change their OS based on what's happening in the industry. I think they probably do, and that's very normal for a business, whether or not they're as trend-setting as Apple.

But, if they decided on any new features or overhauls because of another OS, it wouldn't pop up in a beta - it would be revealed during the iPhone release, or more likely the iOS7 announcement next year.

So, in short - no.

gforce216
Jul 14, 2012, 04:26 PM
It was just something fun to think about that crept into my mind today. I do believe that there is a set schedule for beta releases in my opinion. Even if the update releases do seem staggered at times it is all done for a reason. My hope is just that Apple gets this UI stuff figured out right now. I like the polished silver look and I hope they can carry that over throughout the entire OS in 6, but it hasn't been the case yet.

MattInOz
Jul 14, 2012, 05:03 PM
There would seem to be enough developer churn between apple and google that both would have enough awareness of the other to not be surprised and just stick to thier own game plan.

Morrus
Jul 14, 2012, 05:06 PM
No. Companies the size of Apple and Google lock in strategies months in advance. They are unable change direction quickly; htey are just too big and too much is invested in current projects and infrastructure. Anything either are doing now was planned two years ago and can't be changed without losing millions of dollars.

There's no "instantaneous reaction" development cycle. The same infrastructure which gives you access to hundreds of markets and manufacturers and retailers across a planet is an infrastructure which takes years to change direction. It's a gigantic aircraft carrier, not a one-man speedboat. It sets its course, and hopes for the best (well, it tries not to rely on hope - it spends millions on market research and competitor analysis before committing to its multi-year trajectories).

cvam1985
Jul 14, 2012, 05:38 PM
No. Companies the size of Apple and Google lock in strategies months in advance. They are unable change direction quickly; htey are just too big and too much is invested in current projects and infrastructure. Anything either are doing now was planned two years ago and can't be changed without losing millions of dollars.

There's no "instantaneous reaction" development cycle. The same infrastructure which gives you access to hundreds of markets and manufacturers and retailers across a planet is an infrastructure which takes years to change direction. It's a gigantic aircraft carrier, not a one-man speedboat. It sets its course, and hopes for the best (well, it tries not to rely on hope - it spends millions on market research and competitor analysis before committing to its multi-year trajectories).

True-ish. Remember a year or so ago when Samsung showed off their Galaxy Tab and then the iPad 2 was revealed?

They made a very quick change of strategy and released a much thinner, lighter version.

Fresh Pie
Jul 14, 2012, 05:51 PM
As improbable as it is, it would be awesome if Apple did overhaul—or at least add more features to—the iPhone/iPad's UI. I don't want to say that Apple is falling behind because, honestly, they've made a pattern of holding out features until the very end. But when they finally implement them, they're usually perfect. I'm just perturbed by their reluctance to add Notification Center toggles; I see no reason not to.

32KFJ
Jul 14, 2012, 06:06 PM
i think apple will announce some new features for iOS 6 with the new iphone introduction (they said it would be more than 200 functions...) and the UI will stay the same as in the betas.

ixodes
Jul 14, 2012, 06:10 PM
A few thoughts, not complaints, but rather a reflection on what Apple has apparently chosen to do with the "look" of the upcoming iPhone.

If what we have been repeatedly seeing over the last week (the longer black form factor) is indeed the next iPhone, I believe one of the reasons that Apple chose to keep it almost exactly the same is that a tremendous amount of people like that look. So on a positive note, that makes sense for them to simply duplicate it, and make it a bit longer.

After giving it much consideration, I'm thinking the real priority may have been to achieve the 16:9 aspect ratio, which just happened to end up being 4.0" due to the decision to keep the phone the same width. Originally I thought perhaps the goal was nothing larger than 4.0" but when the prototypes kept appearing as the same width, then it occurred to me it's the 16:9, and maintaining the same width they were focused on, especially since that's a popular aspect ratio for other smartphones.

Another huge advantage of doing what Apple has chosen to do, is the advantage of keeping the costs very low. This will be the third year the phone looks exactly the same. I'm sure some will argue it looks different due to the length, but at a glance and from a short to long distance, the extra length will be unnoticeable.

Finally by repeating the same old design, it will give them a wonderful opportunity to make a very triumphant announcement at the next earnings call about how they've set yet another record for revenue.

Let's face it, the more money Apple makes, the happier the company is. There's a lot of people who will pay handsomely for that Apple Logo, no matter what.

blackhand1001
Jul 14, 2012, 06:27 PM
Android has always had more features than iOS, but there are other reasons (including the quality of the features) why use iOS. The 1080p video on the Nexus One is lower-quality than the 720p video on my iPhone 4 :D, and the sound recording quality sucks on the Nexus.

Answering your question, whenever the competition gets new features, Apple adds them. It's part of their "go slow" strategy. Apple can make a lot of noise by adding features that should have been there from the start (video recording!), but it's never a surprise when an Android phone gets new features. Anything Google releases makes Apple respond.

----------



If there weren't any competitor smartphones that had video recording, Apple would have taken their sweet time getting it onto the iPhone. I think they would have added it in 2012.

The nexus one never had 1080p video. In fact it only did 480p if I recall. The verizon HTC droid incredible did 720p at the time and had an 8mp camera. The nexus one only had a 5mp camera without 720p.

faroZ06
Jul 14, 2012, 08:18 PM
The nexus one never had 1080p video. In fact it only did 480p if I recall. The verizon HTC droid incredible did 720p at the time and had an 8mp camera. The nexus one only had a 5mp camera without 720p.

Oh, my mistake. It wasn't the Nexus One. It was just the latest Nexus.

blackhand1001
Jul 14, 2012, 11:14 PM
Oh, my mistake. It wasn't the Nexus One. It was just the latest Nexus.

You sure it wasn't the nexus s. One of the only truely great things about the galaxy nexus's camera is its 1080p recording is very good and one of the few phones that record it without dropping frames (omap 4460 has a dedicated video encoding chip). The camera itself is only average in low light, although its pretty respectable for outdoor shots.

applerepairs
Jul 15, 2012, 02:16 AM
Apple is still Ahead, Android giving a good Competition, But still Apple is doing very well as far as market capture is considered.

faroZ06
Jul 15, 2012, 10:09 AM
You sure it wasn't the nexus s. One of the only truely great things about the galaxy nexus's camera is its 1080p recording is very good and one of the few phones that record it without dropping frames (omap 4460 has a dedicated video encoding chip). The camera itself is only average in low light, although its pretty respectable for outdoor shots.

Yeah, it's just the "Galaxy Nexus", my friend's phone. We were using our phones for video recording, so we compared the video quality. By "higher quality", I mean that the iPhone's video both looked better and had a higher bitrate when both were compressed with H.264. The audio in the video from the Nexus severely lacked bass, too.

applefanDrew
Jul 15, 2012, 03:19 PM
A few thoughts, not complaints, but rather a reflection on what Apple has apparently chosen to do with the "look" of the upcoming iPhone.

If what we have been repeatedly seeing over the last week (the longer black form factor) is indeed the next iPhone, I believe one of the reasons that Apple chose to keep it almost exactly the same is that a tremendous amount of people like that look. So on a positive note, that makes sense for them to simply duplicate it, and make it a bit longer.

After giving it much consideration, I'm thinking the real priority may have been to achieve the 16:9 aspect ratio, which just happened to end up being 4.0" due to the decision to keep the phone the same width. Originally I thought perhaps the goal was nothing larger than 4.0" but when the prototypes kept appearing as the same width, then it occurred to me it's the 16:9, and maintaining the same width they were focused on, especially since that's a popular aspect ratio for other smartphones.

Another huge advantage of doing what Apple has chosen to do, is the advantage of keeping the costs very low. This will be the third year the phone looks exactly the same. I'm sure some will argue it looks different due to the length, but at a glance and from a short to long distance, the extra length will be unnoticeable.

Finally by repeating the same old design, it will give them a wonderful opportunity to make a very triumphant announcement at the next earnings call about how they've set yet another record for revenue.

Let's face it, the more money Apple makes, the happier the company is. There's a lot of people who will pay handsomely for that Apple Logo, no matter what.


I figured they couldn't make it wider with the external antennae band b/c that would cause the length of the bands to change. With antennae, the length is extremely important in order to get it to tune to different bands

ixodes
Jul 15, 2012, 08:43 PM
I figured they couldn't make it wider with the external antennae band b/c that would cause the length of the bands to change. With antennae, the length is extremely important in order to get it to tune to different bands

The length of the antenna has no bearing on frequency. In fact the longer the antenna the better.

If one wanted the best possible reception the Antenna should be put back inside the phone like every other feature phone or smartphone has since the very first cellular phone.

Using an external antenna that you cannot avoid touching unless covered up is a testimony to Apples stubborn desire to cling to styling over performance.

Call quality, connectivity, and noise cancellation is so much better on my SGS III you've got to hear it to believe it.

MythicFrost
Jul 15, 2012, 09:43 PM
The length of the antenna has no bearing on frequency. In fact the longer the antenna the better.

If one wanted the best possible reception the Antenna should be put back inside the phone like every other feature phone or smartphone has since the very first cellular phone.

Using an external antenna that you cannot avoid touching unless covered up is a testimony to Apples stubborn desire to cling to styling over performance.

Call quality, connectivity, and noise cancellation is so much better on my SGS III you've got to hear it to believe it.
It uses two antennas and switches between them for the best signal, it doesn't matter that it's on the outside. In fact, I seem to remember it being able to connect to a network as low as -121dBM compared to -113dBM for other smartphones.

nfl46
Jul 15, 2012, 09:48 PM
maybe in ios8 or 9 not 6. Apple is doing the same thing as nokia a while ago. Look where nokia is now, that's where apple is heading if they don't change things up

Sad but true. But at least Apple is listening...SORT OF. I'm referring to the hardware side of it. It looks like everything is pointing towards 4", but if they stay with 3.5" then, YIKES, Apple.

ixodes
Jul 15, 2012, 10:00 PM
It uses two antennas and switches between them for the best signal, it doesn't matter that it's on the outside. In fact, I seem to remember it being able to connect to a network as low as -121dBM compared to -113dBM for other smartphones.
You're close.

If you look at the phone once it's apart (I have), there's _three_ antennas.

You can even see that from the outside if you look closely.

One is for the phone, one for wifi, and the third for Bluetooth 4.0. If you learn about antennas, you'll understand that touching them impairs performance.

MythicFrost
Jul 15, 2012, 11:00 PM
You're close.

If you look at the phone once it's apart (I have), there's _three_ antennas.

You can even see that from the outside if you look closely.

One is for the phone, one for wifi, and the third for Bluetooth 4.0. If you learn about antennas, you'll understand that touching them impairs performance.
I was talking only about cellular antennas. And yes it does, but you're not going to be holding both the top and bottom antennas at the same time, so one of them is going to be fine.