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MacRumors
Jul 17, 2012, 02:20 AM
http://images.macrumors.com/im/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/07/17/next-iphone-to-have-thinner-higher-quality-screen/)


The Wall Street Journal (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303754904577532121136436182.html) reports that the next generation iPhone will use "in-cell" technology to make the screen thinner. In fact, they claim that mass production of the screens has already started. Japanese liquid-crystal-display makers Sharp Corp. and Japan Display Inc.--a new company that combined three Japanese electronics makers' display units--as well as South Korea's LG Display Co. are currently mass producing panels for the next iPhone using so-called in-cell technology, the people said.The technology integrates touch sensors into the LCD thereby removing an separate component layer just for the touch-screen. Aside from reduced thickness, it would also improve the image quality. The Wall Street Journal also claims it will help reduce Apple's costs by eliminating separate suppliers for each component.

Reports of Apple's interest in "in-cell" technology is not new with the first reports back in April (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/04/20/next-generation-iphone-to-use-thinner-in-cell-technology-for-multi-touch-display/). KGI Securities Analyst Ming-Chi Kuo took a detailed look (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/04/23/in-cell-touch-technology-could-help-apple-reduce-next-iphones-thickness-by-15/) at the technology and suggested that the new iPhone could be at least 1.4mm slimmer than the iPhone 4S.

http://cdn.macrumors.com/article-new/2012/04/iphone_in_cell_thickness.jpg


While part of the thickness savings would come from the in-cell technology, Apple could also reduce the thickness of the battery and use a thinner metal back casing.

The next generation iPhone is widely expected to be launched this fall.

Article Link: Next iPhone to Have Thinner, Higher Quality Screen (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/07/17/next-iphone-to-have-thinner-higher-quality-screen/)



Macman45
Jul 17, 2012, 02:24 AM
I hope they don't use metal for the back....I've grown used to the glass, but I suppose it would make for a more robust device....The only thing that will prevent me from doing my usual upgrade on release day is the screen..If Apple do not substantially increase the size, then I see little point in buying a replacement for my 4S which will happily run IOS6 anyway. The images look fine, and the thickness although not that much of an issue for me, anything that increases the quality of the device is a good thing. But, no screen hike=no upgrade.

fatboyslick
Jul 17, 2012, 02:24 AM
some space will be made by being a little longer too, plus the use of new smaller SIM Cards

JoEw
Jul 17, 2012, 02:25 AM
I really hope the battery doesn't get smaller over making it "thinner". The iPhone is already thin, I just want improvement to battery life.

Reeebo
Jul 17, 2012, 02:27 AM
Metal for the back would be soo much better than glass.

ahireasu
Jul 17, 2012, 02:31 AM
So instead of using the extra space for an even bigger battery, apple goes for the "more thin" than the previous model crap, the classic apple way.

goobot
Jul 17, 2012, 02:32 AM
I really hope the battery doesn't get smaller over making it "thinner". The iPhone is already thin, I just want improvement to battery life.

They probably will just flatten it out since the next iPhone will also be taller.

gaximus
Jul 17, 2012, 02:33 AM
I don't care if they make it thicker. I just want a slightly bigger screen with the same ratio. I don't want to have to re program any if my apps.

Confuzzzed
Jul 17, 2012, 02:37 AM
Longer and thinner. Usually not a winning combination is some circles ;)

Uncle Ruckus
Jul 17, 2012, 02:38 AM
Just give us the phone Apple.

Uncle Ruckus no relations

RocketRed
Jul 17, 2012, 02:38 AM
My body is ready.

Nozuka
Jul 17, 2012, 02:41 AM
I really hope the battery doesn't get smaller over making it "thinner". The iPhone is already thin, I just want improvement to battery life.

yeah i really wish they would just make it the same thickness, but increase the battery size.

URFloorMatt
Jul 17, 2012, 02:42 AM
So instead of using the extra space for an even bigger battery, apple goes for the "more thin" than the previous model crap, the classic apple way.The larger surface area on the battery would suggest that it can store a lot more charge. But more than likely that would be off-set by the corresponding increase in screen-size.

Haven't we seen mock-ups of the new iPhone design? Did anything suggest it was thinner? I don't recall it being noticeably thinner, but maybe that was an illusion brought on by its bigger size.

I do think it's important that the device be thinner if it is indeed substantially larger. Ideally the new phone should have close to or the same volume as the iPhone 4/4s.

cclloyd
Jul 17, 2012, 02:42 AM
How would it improve the image quality exactly? Denser resolution or something?

nuckinfutz
Jul 17, 2012, 02:43 AM
Increasing the size of the battery isn't the only way to improve battery life people.

petsounds
Jul 17, 2012, 02:45 AM
Does anyone *really* need the iPhone to be thinner at this point? If it was any thinner, it would at least psychologically feel fragile. I think there's a balance between form and function with the slimness of the device, and Apple is already teetering on that edge.

macs4nw
Jul 17, 2012, 02:48 AM
Metal for the back would be soo much better than glass.

Agreed. And use the space gained for a slightly thicker battery; longer battery life is probably a much desired feature for a lot of people!!

nuckinfutz
Jul 17, 2012, 02:48 AM
Does anyone *really* need the iPhone to be thinner at this point? If it was any thinner, it would at least psychologically feel fragile. I think there's a balance between form and function with the slimness of the device, and Apple is already teetering on that edge.

People want the phone to be slim even in a case.

Jayomat
Jul 17, 2012, 02:50 AM
Does anyone *really* need the iPhone to be thinner at this point? If it was any thinner, it would at least psychologically feel fragile. I think there's a balance between form and function with the slimness of the device, and Apple is already teetering on that edge.

does an iPod Touch feel fragile to you? it does not to me, and it is substantially thinner than an iPhone

elie195
Jul 17, 2012, 02:52 AM
It's like the new retina MacBook Pro.

LastLine
Jul 17, 2012, 02:56 AM
I really hope the battery doesn't get smaller over making it "thinner". The iPhone is already thin, I just want improvement to battery life.

Agreed - I'd actually take a tad thicker to get a battery life - that'd be a killer feature in this day and age.

imola.zhp
Jul 17, 2012, 02:59 AM
They better fill that extra space with more battery, if not, I'm jumping to the Razor Maxx... I've been using iPhones since they came out, I'm tired of my 4 always being dead, always...

jonasen
Jul 17, 2012, 03:03 AM
I really hope the battery doesn't get smaller over making it "thinner". The iPhone is already thin, I just want improvement to battery life.

I totally agree, the phone shouldn't even be thinner than it is. You don't want the feeling that it might break in your pocket...

Keep going for the thinner components but let the battery take all the extra space I'd say...imagine a battery that lasts...two days? :)

pandamonia
Jul 17, 2012, 03:05 AM
Who Gives a CRAP about THIN!

Give me a battery that lasts!

ahireasu
Jul 17, 2012, 03:08 AM
The larger surface area on the battery would suggest that it can store a lot more charge. But more than likely that would be off-set by the corresponding increase in screen-size.
Exactly that + don't forget the LTE, I really hope that apple for once to do something about where the competition fails, aka to make a phone with a good battery life + latest technology.

Haven't we seen mock-ups of the new iPhone design? Did anything suggest it was thinner? I don't recall it being noticeably thinner, but maybe that was an illusion brought on by its bigger size.

I do think it's important that the device be thinner if it is indeed substantially larger. Ideally the new phone should have close to or the same volume as the iPhone 4/4s.
What most people don't realize is that the iPhone doesn't need to be made bigger to get a larger screen in width and height, all they need to do is the width of the 3GS and the height of ip 4 then you can get a 4" to 4.3" screen, ofc the Bessel will get smaller.
Anyway I find it a bit hard to believe that apple will go for the 16.9 ratio since this is ********ing up the ecosystem + if they do it they will be stuck to that screen for 2 to 4 year, you know ecosystem, fragmentation etc.

Reason077
Jul 17, 2012, 03:22 AM
Once again; Where is the down vote button?!

There is no vote down button. We have always had no vote down button.

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Keep going for the thinner components but let the battery take all the extra space I'd say...imagine a battery that lasts...two days? :)

The iPhone 5 will likely use a new A5 CPU variant built on 32nm lithography with reduced power consumption compared to the 4S. This means it should be able to get the same or better battery life than the 4S, even if the battery is slightly smaller.

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Anyway I find it a bit hard to believe that apple will go for the 16.9 ratio since this is ********ing up the ecosystem + if they do it they will be stuck to that screen for 2 to 4 year, you know ecosystem, fragmentation etc.

A 16:9 screen with the same pixel density and horizontal pixel count would actually make things pretty easy for developers. Most well-written apps using standard UIs should just work, taking advantage of the extra vertical space with little or no modification.

iMikeT
Jul 17, 2012, 03:26 AM
Longer and thinner. Usually not a winning combination is some circles ;)


Half the length, twice the width = More coverage in less steps, I know where I'm welcome. ;)

nickelt
Jul 17, 2012, 03:30 AM
There is no vote down button. We have always had no vote down button.

uuuhhhhhh???? :rolleyes: yeh we did.

malias4
Jul 17, 2012, 03:31 AM
i also dont mind if its thiner, but i think it will. i just want a little bigger screen and a new design, fed up 2 years with iphone 4 :D

ixodes
Jul 17, 2012, 03:33 AM
I'm not surprised. This is a very good new technology that simply illustrates Apples commitment to quality components.

Of greater concern is the persistence rumor of a long & narrow phone. Besides adding a row of apps I see no benefit of any significance. If true, then it means that we're only getting another mildly updated phone, not Apples best work.

When a good company like Apple begins to rest on it's laurels, true decline is not far off. Argue to the contrary all you want, but the facts of business support it.

The only difference is that Apple being the behemoth they are, can coast for years selling warmed over products before true decline sets in.

Reason077
Jul 17, 2012, 03:33 AM
uuuhhhhhh???? :rolleyes: yeh we did.

Sssssshhh! Such things should not be spoken of. We are all one happy community here. There is no room for negativity or dissent.

nickelt
Jul 17, 2012, 03:37 AM
Sssssshhh! Such things should not be spoken of. We are all one happy community here. There is no room for negativity or dissent.

No negativity, unless the new iphones battery doesnt last longer! :)

Dr McKay
Jul 17, 2012, 03:46 AM
Sooo thinner screen means it'll break easier?

KnightWRX
Jul 17, 2012, 03:59 AM
Once again; Where is the down vote button?!

It's gone, get use to having to reply to comments instead of hiding behind it. Now, what prompted this comment ? What do you disagree with and while you post to say you disagree, why not tell us why ?

You know... use the discussion forum to actually discuss ?

unlinked
Jul 17, 2012, 04:06 AM
It's gone, get use to having to reply to comments instead of hiding behind it. Now, what prompted this comment ? What do you disagree with and while you post to say you disagree, why not tell us why ?

You know... use the discussion forum to actually discuss ?

I disagree with this comment.

Monkeydude
Jul 17, 2012, 04:17 AM
I disagree with this comment.

:D me too:D

SchneiderMan
Jul 17, 2012, 04:21 AM
So Gorilla Glass 2?

Caliber26
Jul 17, 2012, 04:21 AM
It's gone, get use to having to reply to comments instead of hiding behind it. Now, what prompted this comment ? What do you disagree with and while you post to say you disagree, why not tell us why ?

You know... use the discussion forum to actually discuss ?

Sometimes it's a lot more convenient to just down vote a [insert negative adjective here] post, as opposed to actually acknowledging someone you would otherwise NEVER, EVER even honor with a reply because you greatly dislike them and find the vast majority of their comments to be sarcastic and condescending. ;)

nick_elt
Jul 17, 2012, 04:38 AM
I just cant see why we can up vote something but not down vote. Thats so p.c (the irony)

Twixt
Jul 17, 2012, 04:45 AM
We can not judge iphone 5 battery before first reviews are out.
In the meantime Galaxy Note 2 will be out with a better battery life for sure.
Battery management software plays a role too!

----------

Sooo thinner screen means it'll break easier?

I can not down vote this one ;)

Stridder44
Jul 17, 2012, 04:49 AM
There is no vote down button. We have always had no vote down button.


And ironically, comments like this are the very reason we need down-vote buttons again.

Sensation
Jul 17, 2012, 05:00 AM
Will Apple finally be able to stop the increasing dominance of Android? I doubt it considering Apple are normally 2-3 generations behind the top Android devices.

SeaFox
Jul 17, 2012, 05:04 AM
Increasing the size of the battery isn't the only way to improve battery life people.
No, but it's one of the easiest. And since most people feel the iPhone is "thin enough", especially those concerned about it's durability to forces applied at odd angles, there's no reason to make it any thinner that benefits the consumer.

This whole thing has just turned into a big dick-waving competition amongst the cell phone makers over who has the biggest screen, highest resolution screen, thinnest phone, highest megapixel camera built-in, without any regards to if it is a positive change for the consumer. And in some cases it's actually detrimental to the consumer to continue these games to such extremes.

DennisD7
Jul 17, 2012, 05:05 AM
OK, since I haven't seen anybody mention this before: it seems that if the backside will be all metal, that it would also function as the antenna for the phone. The same way as the metal band is the antenna for iPhone 4/4s, except with a much bigger area, right?

I don't know a whole lot about antennas, but could it be that bigger antenna means that it is more effective? And that it would mean that it uses less power to do the same job? If so, then this design might work out well with a smaller battery.

Sedrick
Jul 17, 2012, 05:09 AM
The consensus is in: the rest if the world wants a bigger battery vs thinness (except of course nuckinfutz who swallows every thing Apple does without question... The ignore list is a wonderful thing)

Fraaaa
Jul 17, 2012, 05:13 AM
Increasing the size of the battery isn't the only way to improve battery life people.

I actually believe that the major reason for making it longer is to increase the battery size; however, if the battery is thinner, might have the same capacity.

Is the next gen arm going to be 32nm? That would improve battery life as they still using 45nm.

blackcrayon
Jul 17, 2012, 05:31 AM
Will Apple finally be able to stop the increasing dominance of Android? I doubt it considering Apple are normally 2-3 generations behind the top Android devices.

I agree. That iPhone 4S can't hold a *candle* to that amazing Nexus One or the Samsung Galaxy S! :rolleyes:

KnightWRX
Jul 17, 2012, 05:52 AM
Sometimes it's a lot more convenient to just down vote a [insert negative adjective here] post, as opposed to actually acknowledging someone

Down voting is ackwowledging though. The opposite of acknowledging would be to ignore.

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I just cant see why we can up vote something but not down vote. Thats so p.c (the irony)

Up votes are used to select comments to display under news stories on the main domain (www.macrumors.com (http://www.macrumors.com)) so that site visitors get a preview of the forums.

Puevlo
Jul 17, 2012, 05:53 AM
For a phone the iPhone is pretty thick. Anything to reduce the thickness is fine by me.

fhall1
Jul 17, 2012, 05:59 AM
I really hope the battery doesn't get smaller over making it "thinner". The iPhone is already thin, I just want improvement to battery life.

Totally agree....keep the battery the same thickness to give more usable life!

cdmoore74
Jul 17, 2012, 06:01 AM
Dumb idea!! If the screen is enlarged and the the glass is thinner wouldn't it be more prone to flex? And when you grip a phone you don't want it too thin. There is a point where you shouldn't continue to make a phone thinner.
What's funny is that this only benefits case users and I prefer otterbox anyway.

aziatiklover
Jul 17, 2012, 06:01 AM
From the leaks it doesnt even look stunning thin! Barely thin compare to a 4/4s smh!

Roller
Jul 17, 2012, 06:04 AM
Exactly that + don't forget the LTE, I really hope that apple for once to do something about where the competition fails, aka to make a phone with a good battery life + latest technology.


What most people don't realize is that the iPhone doesn't need to be made bigger to get a larger screen in width and height, all they need to do is the width of the 3GS and the height of ip 4 then you can get a 4" to 4.3" screen, ofc the Bessel will get smaller.
Anyway I find it a bit hard to believe that apple will go for the 16.9 ratio since this is ********ing up the ecosystem + if they do it they will be stuck to that screen for 2 to 4 year, you know ecosystem, fragmentation etc.

I used to think that the iPhone's screen was as large as I'd ever want it to be. But now I'm using my iPhone 4S in ways that I never imagined five years ago, so I'd welcome a larger display horizontally as well as vertically. But I don't want it at the expense of less battery life. Even now, I sometimes struggle to make it through the day on one full charge.

seron
Jul 17, 2012, 06:14 AM
This thinness race is the same bull as the megapixel race.

I read elsewhere that the retina MBP is extremely fagile. Another reason not to get it.

Thunderhawks
Jul 17, 2012, 06:16 AM
Alright Apple!

Only 7.9 mm to go until it's invisible!

miniroll32
Jul 17, 2012, 06:22 AM
This thinness race is the same bull as the megapixel race.

I read elsewhere that the retina MBP is extremely fagile. Another reason not to get it.

Sources.

KnightWRX
Jul 17, 2012, 06:28 AM
This thinness race is the same bull as the megapixel race.

What's bull about the megapixel race ? More pixels means more details. Sure it's not the only measure of image quality for cameras or screens (sensor quality and size, aperture, LCD technology, viewing angles, color gamut, etc..)

At the end of the day, thinness or mega pixels are both specs. A device is a combination of specs and no one should be choosing based on a single spec, but on the whole of them. None are really "bull"

RobertMartens
Jul 17, 2012, 06:32 AM
battery life people.

What are 'battery life people'?

nangariel
Jul 17, 2012, 06:36 AM
There is no vote down button. We have always had no vote down button.

We've always been at war with Eastasia :rolleyes:

RobertMartens
Jul 17, 2012, 06:38 AM
Once again; Where is the down vote button?!

Do what I do, just don't push the up button, a lot.

----------

There is no vote down button. We have always had no vote down button.

We've always been at war with Eurasia :rolleyes:

Microsoft is our friend, always has, ditto for IBM

Google is our enemy, from even before there was a Google.

seron
Jul 17, 2012, 06:43 AM
Sources.

Read this (http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1178314&p=23052338#p23052338).

What's bull about the megapixel race ? More pixels means more details. Sure it's not the only measure of image quality for cameras or screens (sensor quality and size, aperture, LCD technology, viewing angles, color gamut, etc..)

At the end of the day, thinness or mega pixels are both specs. A device is a combination of specs and no one should be choosing based on a single spec, but on the whole of them. None are really "bull"

The bull I refer to is the increase of camera sensor megapixels for marketing purposes that was going on for years. It did not make images better and mostly had detrimental effect to image quality, so you are wrong about details as those would usually get lost in the noise. It's known as the megapixel race and most people who know about it recognise it for what it is. Marketing bull. I argue that this thinness race belong to the same class of bull.

Sedrick
Jul 17, 2012, 06:45 AM
What's bull about the megapixel race ? More pixels means more details. Sure it's not the only measure of image quality for cameras or screens (sensor quality and size, aperture, LCD technology, viewing angles, color gamut, etc..)

At the end of the day, thinness or mega pixels are both specs. A device is a combination of specs and no one should be choosing based on a single spec, but on the whole of them. None are really "bull"

My take on a 'megapixel race' is the continued push for higher and higher ppi when the human eye can't even detect beyond 300ppi. This 'saber rattling', if you will, only leads to more and more drain on batteries - the weakest link in cell phones.

I wish the same effort that's being put into displays was being put into battery longevity.

Pivs
Jul 17, 2012, 06:47 AM
Didn't we already know this?

hickabob
Jul 17, 2012, 06:52 AM
I think it's a testament to apple that they are always putting innovation in their products. A lot of other companies just use industry norms for the innerds and the looks of their products. Apple's agenda might just be to be able to market it as the "thinnest phone ever", but they found an innovative way to make it that way.

gnasher729
Jul 17, 2012, 06:53 AM
How would it improve the image quality exactly? Denser resolution or something?

Less stuff between the LCD and your eyes.


What's bull about the megapixel race ? More pixels means more details. Sure it's not the only measure of image quality for cameras or screens (sensor quality and size, aperture, LCD technology, viewing angles, color gamut, etc..)

With the same sensor size in a camera, more pixels means less light per pixel, which means more noise, which means at some point less image quality. For the typical sensor size in cheap cameras, 6 Megapixels gives overall best image quality. Unfortunately it is easy to build a camera with the same tiny sensor but 12 Megapixels, which sells better while producing lower image quality.

rotax
Jul 17, 2012, 06:55 AM
Is this an IGZO display? or something different?

apolloa
Jul 17, 2012, 07:00 AM
While I couldn't care less about the half a millimetre saving this makes, it will be interesting to see what it does for the quality.

bartonlynch
Jul 17, 2012, 07:01 AM
I agree. That iPhone 4S can't hold a *candle* to that amazing Nexus One or the Samsung Galaxy S! :rolleyes:
This made me lol. Also, it is such a good argument to so many fandroids who say what this guy said

What's bull about the megapixel race ? More pixels means more details. Sure it's not the only measure of image quality for cameras or screens (sensor quality and size, aperture, LCD technology, viewing angles, color gamut, etc..)

Camera makers improved megapixels without improving other things, so the picture became worse.

JulianL
Jul 17, 2012, 07:03 AM
If this and other rumours are true then:

From Apple specs, iPhone 4S height x width = 115.2mm x 58.6mm

From this article, internal width for battery in iPhone 4S = 4.3mm

That gives a theoretical maximum internal battery volume of 29,028 cubic millimeters in the iPhone 4S.

From other rumours about the next iPhone the rumoured height x width = 58.47mm x 123.83mm (source: http://www.macrumors.com/2012/06/21/apples-smaller-ios-device-dock-connector-said-to-include-19-pins/). Note discrepancy in rumoured thickness vs this article by the way.

From this article, internal width for battery in next iPhone = 3.84 mm

That gives a theoretical maximum internal battery volume of 27,803 cubic millimeters for the next iPhone which is 95.8% of the iPhone 4S.

The above are theoretical maxima which could never be achieved because the electronics also needs to share that space but various other rumours point towards Apple taking aggressive steps to minimise the volume taken up by some of the electronics (rumours include a smaller docking connector and using nano-SIM). Higher levels of integration from the rest of the electronics plus a move to 32nm for the Soc should also help maximise the volume left over for the battery.

When all of the above is taken together I would expect, if the rumoured dimensions are accurate, that the charge capacity of the next iPhone's battery will be at least equal to that of the current iPhone 4S and possibly even a tiny bit bigger. That then leaves us to see what other tweaks Apple might be able to make to the electronics to reduce their power consumption although, when looking at this final piece of the jigsaw, LTE and the bigger screen are the big unknowns since they, especially LTE, could have a detrimental effect on power draw.

- Julian (who also cares a lot about battery life)

Rogifan
Jul 17, 2012, 07:05 AM
I'm not surprised. This is a very good new technology that simply illustrates Apples commitment to quality components.

Of greater concern is the persistence rumor of a long & narrow phone. Besides adding a row of apps I see no benefit of any significance. If true, then it means that we're only getting another mildly updated phone, not Apples best work.

When a good company like Apple begins to rest on it's laurels, true decline is not far off. Argue to the contrary all you want, but the facts of business support it.

The only difference is that Apple being the behemoth they are, can coast for years selling warmed over products before true decline sets in.
What the heck does scree size have to do with the quality of a phone? :rolleyes:

Jimrod
Jul 17, 2012, 07:05 AM
What's bull about the megapixel race ? More pixels means more details. Sure it's not the only measure of image quality for cameras or screens (sensor quality and size, aperture, LCD technology, viewing angles, color gamut, etc..)

At the end of the day, thinness or mega pixels are both specs. A device is a combination of specs and no one should be choosing based on a single spec, but on the whole of them. None are really "bull"

Some camera manufacturers are actually scaling down their megapixels in favour of larger sensors with fewer pixels for better quality (larger pixels can accept more light and produce less noise). Cramming as many pixels as possible onto a sensor isn't always the best way to go, sure you'll have a larger image but it doesn't mean it will be better! Nokia obviously don't believe this is the way to go with their new phone!


Edit: I started this reply before getting a phone call so it's been brought up already! :D

samcraig
Jul 17, 2012, 07:07 AM
I think it's a testament to apple that they are always putting innovation in their products. A lot of other companies just use industry norms for the innerds and the looks of their products. Apple's agenda might just be to be able to market it as the "thinnest phone ever", but they found an innovative way to make it that way.

Every company is putting innovation into their products. Let's not speak in hyperbole. And Apple will have to get behind Huawei for marketing the "thinnest phone ever" at 6.68 mm.

http://www.intomobile.com/2012/01/09/huawei-ascend-p1-s-say-hello-worlds-thinnest-dual-core-android-smartphone/

Piggie
Jul 17, 2012, 07:07 AM
I would love the consumer to be given the choice here.

iPhone 5 = 9mm thick = normal battery

iPhone 5 = 13mm thick (an extra 4mm) and double the life battery.

Juts to see which one people went for.
4mm thinner and half the battery or 4mm more.

Rogifan
Jul 17, 2012, 07:07 AM
It's gone, get use to having to reply to comments instead of hiding behind it. Now, what prompted this comment ? What do you disagree with and while you post to say you disagree, why not tell us why ?

You know... use the discussion forum to actually discuss ?

I'd rather be able to down vote a troll than have to respond to them.

iSlave
Jul 17, 2012, 07:10 AM
I don't give a **** about any of this.

KnightWRX
Jul 17, 2012, 07:16 AM
My take on a 'megapixel race' is the continued push for higher and higher ppi when the human eye can't even detect beyond 300ppi. This 'saber rattling', if you will, only leads to more and more drain on batteries - the weakest link in cell phones.

Hum, what race in PPI is taking place exactly ? The iPhone 4 still represents one of the highest PPI values out there (screen sizes have been growing, thus requiring more pixels to preserve high PPI).

Also, the human eye can detect beyond 300 ppi, it just depends on the viewing distance. Pixel size is not an absolute measure of what the human eye can and cannot distinguish.

samcraig
Jul 17, 2012, 07:16 AM
I'd rather be able to down vote a troll than have to respond to them.

No - you'd rather be passive aggressive and name call. Let's call a spade a spade.

KnightWRX
Jul 17, 2012, 07:18 AM
With the same sensor size in a camera, more pixels means less light per pixel, which means more noise, which means at some point less image quality. For the typical sensor size in cheap cameras, 6 Megapixels gives overall best image quality. Unfortunately it is easy to build a camera with the same tiny sensor but 12 Megapixels, which sells better while producing lower image quality.

Just means your camera is more sensitive to low-light operation. In bright light or with a very long exposure (requiring a stand for stability usually), you can compensate the smaller size and get more details from the added pixels.

That's why I say the spec is not bull. It's just that you shouldn't just buy a camera based on that single spec.

pear21
Jul 17, 2012, 07:18 AM
This just in, the iphone is gonna be thinner because it's not gonna have an antenna or be able to make phone calls!! Apple decided to take out the ability to make phone calls because they realized no one makes phone calls with their iPhone. However you will be able to buy an antenna similar to buying a disc drive for the new pro!!

KnightWRX
Jul 17, 2012, 07:22 AM
I'd rather be able to down vote a troll than have to respond to them.

You could also ignore them or report their posts, since trolling is against the rules :

Forum Rules (http://guides.macrumors.com/Help:Forum_Rules)
Inappropriate posting in a debate. The Rules for Appropriate Debate apply when users disagree with each other. We insist on a certain level of respect and civility toward other users, even when your viewpoints differ, and prohibit posts that attack posters personally or serve only to anger others (see "trolling" above).

No need to downvote since most downvoting is done based on disagreement. If you disagree enough to try to rate a post, respond and say why, contributing to the forum and discussion.

----------

This just in, the iphone is gonna be thinner because it's not gonna have an antenna or be able to make phone calls!! Apple decided to take out the ability to make phone calls because they realized no one makes phone calls with their iPhone. However you will be able to buy an antenna similar to buying a disc drive for the new pro!!

And what would this "phone" do without any radio support (no Wifi, no Phone, no 3G/LTE or other cellular data).

Sounds like a iPod Classic with a touch screen to me.

samcraig
Jul 17, 2012, 07:28 AM
You could also ignore them or report their posts, since trolling is against the rules :

Forum Rules (http://guides.macrumors.com/Help:Forum_Rules)


No need to downvote since most downvoting is done based on disagreement. If you disagree enough to try to rate a post, respond and say why, contributing to the forum and discussion.[COLOR="#808080"]



The problem with your suggestion, KnightWRX, is that some people believe anyone that doesn't agree with them or isn't 100% pro-Apple is a troll.

guzhogi
Jul 17, 2012, 07:29 AM
Does anyone *really* need the iPhone to be thinner at this point? If it was any thinner, it would at least psychologically feel fragile. I think there's a balance between form and function with the slimness of the device, and Apple is already teetering on that edge.

I agree. While the iPod Touch is thinner & feels fairly stable, much thinner and it will seem fragile. Besides, how thin does Apple want to go? Paper thin? If so, think how many cuts people will get? I get paper cuts somewhat often and they are not fun.

Plus, sometimes I need to use my phone one handed. My hands are just the right size and shape so using my iPhone one handed can be pretty tough.

hickabob
Jul 17, 2012, 07:38 AM
Every company is putting innovation into their products. Let's not speak in hyperbole. And Apple will have to get behind Huawei for marketing the "thinnest phone ever" at 6.68 mm.

http://www.intomobile.com/2012/01/09/huawei-ascend-p1-s-say-hello-worlds-thinnest-dual-core-android-smartphone/

"Every" is a strong word. Half the people I know have cheaply produced phones that were not built with quality materials or engineered for longevity, ergonomics, and/or comfortability. I tip my hat to Huawei and other companies along side Apple, not a fanboy here ;)

Macclone
Jul 17, 2012, 07:39 AM
It is amusing how worked up people get even though they know absolutely NOTHING about the new phone and it size or battery. Oh, by the way Apple doesn't come here for their design choices, because they will make what they think is best. So, either buy something else or stop whining until they release it.

Carlanga
Jul 17, 2012, 07:44 AM
Just keep it the same size & increase the battery inside; you can never have enough battery!

CJM
Jul 17, 2012, 07:48 AM
Not that excited for the iPhone 5; since getting an iPad I don't use my phone as much, but we'll see how it reviews. I may just wait for the next release.

sillypooh
Jul 17, 2012, 07:48 AM
Wouldn't this info nix the previously revealed glass screens??

devilbond
Jul 17, 2012, 07:52 AM
I suspect it may reduce Apple's cost, but not ours.

kdarling
Jul 17, 2012, 08:02 AM
How would it improve the image quality exactly? Denser resolution or something?

Excellent question.

The quality would be better because the touch circuitry is embedded in the LCD instead of being a layer on top.

Thus there's one less layer (two if you count glue) to refract and reflect light. Result: brighter output and less reflection in sunlight.

Here's a diagram I made showing the difference between now (left) and in-cell (right):

348483

Gemütlichkeit
Jul 17, 2012, 08:03 AM
For a phone the iPhone is pretty thick. Anything to reduce the thickness is fine by me.

No it really isn't.

grimmace
Jul 17, 2012, 08:04 AM
There has to be more than just stretching it ONE WAY a little bit longer than the current version. It could also be WIDER and still fit in my pocket! There has to be a totally different form factor, not just a little stretch. Oh yeah, and isnt this screen we have already "retina"? What difference will it make other than making US think its sooo much better? The software will most likely be the best thing about it which 4S will already be able to use. I guess I will start purchasing "S" versions of this phone.

racer1441
Jul 17, 2012, 08:06 AM
Please no. I can bairly hold on to this on with the thinness.

thekev
Jul 17, 2012, 08:06 AM
-1

They removed that for a reason. Type something other than a worthless passive aggressive gesture.

What's bull about the megapixel race ? More pixels means more details. Sure it's not the only measure of image quality for cameras or screens (sensor quality and size, aperture, LCD technology, viewing angles, color gamut, etc..)

At the end of the day, thinness or mega pixels are both specs. A device is a combination of specs and no one should be choosing based on a single spec, but on the whole of them. None are really "bull"

One of the things about digital cameras is that they resolve less detail than they claim, especially with primary colors. The pixels are laid out in an RGBG array, and pixel pitch is an issue as they must interpolate gaps. Pushing toward higher resolution allows some measure of oversampling and can often reduce the issue of moire or aliasing artifacts. This is especially relevant with saturated reds and blues which are effectively a fraction of the resolution of a more neutral object due to the sensor layout.

My take on a 'megapixel race' is the continued push for higher and higher ppi when the human eye can't even detect beyond 300ppi. This 'saber rattling', if you will, only leads to more and more drain on batteries - the weakest link in cell phones.

I wish the same effort that's being put into displays was being put into battery longevity.

You don't really resolve things as dots. You resolve them in terms of contrast, and your eyes do a lot of weird things. Basically it stops making a difference when you eye can no longer differentiate dark from light at that frequency and direction. It's a little different from how many dots can be crammed on screen.

samcraig
Jul 17, 2012, 08:08 AM
I truly miss it

Those cry babies got their way unfortunately.

Hyprocrisy? There seems to be a bunch of people who are no crying they can't downvote but instead have to either post their disagreement or - shudder the thought - deal with it let it go.

tbrinkma
Jul 17, 2012, 08:14 AM
What's bull about the megapixel race ? More pixels means more details. Sure it's not the only measure of image quality for cameras or screens (sensor quality and size, aperture, LCD technology, viewing angles, color gamut, etc..)

At the end of the day, thinness or mega pixels are both specs. A device is a combination of specs and no one should be choosing based on a single spec, but on the whole of them. None are really "bull"

Judging a camera on mega-pixels makes about as much sense as judging a CPU on MHz. (If MHz were really so important, we'd all still be using Pentium IV CPUs.)

Actually, all else being equal, a higher-megapixel sensor gives you *worse* details because of increased noise. A smaller sensor cell picks up less light, giving less information for the camera to decide what color that pixel is supposed to be. You'll notice the mega-pixel race has pretty much stopped with DSLRs, mostly around the 10-14MP range (wherever each brand decided the image quality trade-off of going to a higher MP sensor got too bad) until you get to large format sensors.

Rocketman
Jul 17, 2012, 08:15 AM
I think they should use 120% of the thickness savings for an increase in the battery. LTE is a battery hog.

donrsd
Jul 17, 2012, 08:16 AM
theres going to come a point, in a few years, that the cell phone needs to be 'reinvented again'.

its like videogame systems, there will come a point that you just cant do anything more besides add even more RAM.

sure the new iphone will be better than the 4s.
yet if it werent for the screen size, i wouldnt consider upgrading at all.
that being said.....fast forward a year or 2. the iphone 5s or whatever comes out. whats the point of upgrading?

like the new ipad. sure i have one. what else can they do to get me to buy another one?
the screen is what i want. speed is there. what, apple will add more ram or bigger hard drive space or improve the battery when i already get 10 hours lol

its getting to the point of diminishing returns on my investment.

i still have my :apple: tv 2. no need to upgrade to the 3 as it cant be jailbroken.
sure ive thought about it, numerous times a week, but i just can shell out $$$ for something that wont perform for the $$$.

look at the android phones. they are 'speced out', yet nobody cares.
they all run the same with MAYBE a touch better speed on one to the next. the average customer wont even notice the speed difference.

guess as i get older, i dont like to waste my money as much.
sure i like to have the latest tech gadgets & toys, yet if its not 'worth it' ill be passing on such items.

though a 128gb or 160gb iphone 5, 5s, 6 lol would be sweet :)

ixodes
Jul 17, 2012, 08:17 AM
What the heck does scree size have to do with the quality of a phone? :rolleyes:

Thanks for asking a very appropriate question.

One of Apple's conventions, is "It just works". Another is "It's all about the user experience".

So when discussing any improvement to the phone like this proposed thinner screen, it's a contributing factor to ones experience.

For those of us who buy iPhones and use them as they were designed to be used, as a smartphone, display size is of great importance.

Conversely, some people buy smartphones because they are "trendy". Other cases where Apple is concerned people buy them because their friends and family have iPhones. The light use they see is so minimal that the shortcoming of a tiny 3.5" display is not even noticed by these users who in many cases don't even need a smartphone, but could do quite nicely with a feature phone.

Samsung has proven to me, based on my first hand experience with several of their handsets equipped with various sizes of displays, that the best most useful range of sizes is 4.3" at a bare minimum and 4.65" to 4.8" as the optimum size for composing email messages, text messages and working on the internet.

Just like choosing a laptop, screen size is everything. It's obvious to most people that the most important parts of any smartphone or computer is the size and usefulness of the keyboard and the quality and size of display that one stares at while using the device.

Hopefully I've help you understand what true Smartphone users experience.

basesloaded190
Jul 17, 2012, 08:24 AM
I don't give a **** about any of this.

Ironically nobody gives a **** what you think.

I haven't read all the pages on this thread, but is this the same technology in the current crop of SAMOLED screens?

kcamfork
Jul 17, 2012, 08:28 AM
So instead of using the extra space for an even bigger battery, apple goes for the "more thin" than the previous model crap, the classic apple way.

Apple doesn't care about you wanting better battery life. In fact, most iPhone 4 and 4S users are less impressed with battery life with iOS 5 than with iOS 4.

Apple can't advertise "best battery life ever!" So why would they actually give us something useful like better battery life? But they can, and probably will, brag about thinness. Thin being something WE DON'T CARE ABOUT!!! GIVE US BETTER BATTERY LIFE!!!

Blobs21
Jul 17, 2012, 08:28 AM
Does that mean if the screen cracks then both the lcd and the touch screen are broken cause now if you crack your screen the touch panel still works.

chrmjenkins
Jul 17, 2012, 08:42 AM
If it's made by Sharp, I'd bet it's an IGZO too. Both of these technologies save power, so even if the screen size grows, it could still end up using less power overall.

And even if they keep the battery the same thickness so the phone gets thinner, the battery can be taller by virtue of a taller phone. They'll want a bit more battery for heavy LTE users anyway. (and the 4s doesn't last as long as the 4)

edit: Forgot to mention Gorilla Glass 2. It will let them make the glass thinner for the same strength or make it stronger for the same thickness. They have a potential to really slim down the display with the combination of GG2 and in-cell and decrease the power with IGZO and in-cell.

sperry1988
Jul 17, 2012, 08:43 AM
Wont a thinner phone hurt the camera quality though? less depth of field?

Gjwilly
Jul 17, 2012, 08:45 AM
Regarding the worries about fragility and flex, I don't think the next iPhone is going to have any glass on the back at all.
I've seen the mockups and the "leaked" parts and I'm thinking that the back is a mix of metal and plastic.
Since the 4 and the 4S are glass I'll bet that people saw plastic and assumed it was glass.
We know that Apple received this patent for bonding metal and plastic and I'll bet that's what the mockups have been showing.
http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/12/03/15/apple_wants_to_improve_bonding_of_plastic_and_metal_in_building_new_iphones.html

If that's right then we'll essentially be seeing a metal unibody case with bonded plastic inserts to allow for signal transmission and antennae performance.
A bonded metal/plastic combo has got to be stronger and more rigid than metal and glass alone and certainly more than a metal/glass combo.

Mad-B-One
Jul 17, 2012, 08:49 AM
Will Apple finally be able to stop the increasing dominance of Android? I doubt it considering Apple are normally 2-3 generations behind the top Android devices.

I think they never will. For several reasons. Apple does not want to compete in the mass market for budget phones. Yes, they offer the 3GS and 4 still, but you don't catch the uninformed mass with a several years old device. They follow like lemmings the signs "New" and "Free" and especially a combination of both. But that is not to the disadvantage of Apple. These low-budget Androids help to fractionize the system even more because you can bet, they will never see an OS update (if the phone didn't get released just before a new Android OS iteration). Thus, the programers will be even more frustrated with every new cheap Android on the market. Not even mentioning alternating screen sizes. Also, look who gets the profits on the market: Apple almost all, Samsung most of the rest. That means for a company seeking financial gain from selling, as long as you have the same share of profit, you do good. If you have the biggest share of profit, you are the leader of the pack. Now, it does not matter what the percentage of market share is as long as the profit is high enough. Stupid example would be if you have 2% maket share and 90% of the profit, your investors would not really get disturbed if you drop to 1.5% as long as you still have 90% of the profit. It might just be that the market grew by 25% with competitors who just break even.

What do you mean that they are behind? In size? Well, you know the old saying: "Size does not matter, it's the technique(/ology)." They can be as advanced as they want to be. They are too big for just carrying in my pocket and they don't have iOS. Actually, I would rather prefer a budget Android because they are not as bulky at times compared to the "top dogs." If I want to use a tablet, I use my iPad. Everything below that shoud be small enough to not be a burden. These big Androids are - in my opinion.

HishamAkhtar
Jul 17, 2012, 08:53 AM
Thanks for asking a very appropriate question.

One of Apple's conventions, is "It just works". Another is "It's all about the user experience".

So when discussing any improvement to the phone like this proposed thinner screen, it's a contributing factor to ones experience.

For those of us who buy iPhones and use them as they were designed to be used, as a smartphone, display size is of great importance.

Conversely, some people buy smartphones because they are "trendy". Other cases where Apple is concerned people buy them because their friends and family have iPhones. The light use they see is so minimal that the shortcoming of a tiny 3.5" display is not even noticed by these users who in many cases don't even need a smartphone, but could do quite nicely with a feature phone.

Samsung has proven to me, based on my first hand experience with several of their handsets equipped with various sizes of displays, that the best most useful range of sizes is 4.3" at a bare minimum and 4.65" to 4.8" as the optimum size for composing email messages, text messages and working on the internet.

Just like choosing a laptop, screen size is everything. It's obvious to most people that the most important parts of any smartphone or computer is the size and usefulness of the keyboard and the quality and size of display that one stares at while using the device.

Hopefully I've help you understand what true Smartphone users experience.

Thank you for answering his question by being a condescending *****. If 3.5 inches is too small for you, do me a favour and consider doing the following:

1) Get your eyes checked
2) Buy an iPad
3) Buy a Samsung with said screen size

I really hope the iPhone doesn't go about 4 inches. Even the current 3.5 is fine. This is a phone and I don't want my pockets ripping at the seams trying to contain a 4.8 inch behemoth of a phone.

SpectatorHere
Jul 17, 2012, 08:57 AM
I'll take you back to the original leaks of the "long phone" and remind you of the glass that was with the case. Why would there be separate glass that wasn't fused to the LCD screen?

If the screens and glass are glued in Japan and possibly by LG in S. Korea, that means the leaked case and glass wouldn't come together until assembly in China. There is NO logical reason for someone to have both plain glass and plain case. It doesn't make sense for the supply chain, nor for replacement parts. Screen manufacturers in Japan don't need the case, and the assemblers in China would only have access to fused screens after manufactured in Japan. ....And there are more holes.

Apps wouldn't just scale to fit a new aspect ratio. If Apple wanted to make every app look work they'd have to provide black bars. Why would they ever want to do that instead of just design a phone around a screen of the same regular 3:2 ratio? Don't these guys hate fragmentation?

Here's how the landscape looks like for developers.

Currently there are only two aspect ratios to worry about, 3:2 for the phone and 4:3 for the pad. There are technically 4 resolutions currently supported, but they've gone to pains to simply double resolution for retinas--specifically so as NOT TO MESS UP APPS. So now you'd have a 3GS at one resolution and 3:2 aspect; the 4 and 4s both at double the resolution but same aspect; ; iPad 1 and 2 at another resolution and 4:3; and iPad 3 at double the iPad 1 and 2 res with the same 4:3 aspect ratio.

Now you really want me to believe they're going to 16:9 ratio and adding another resolution entirely just so they can have a 4" display? I ask again, since they've spent so much time maintaining relative resolution consistency and aspect ratios, why would they abandon this now?

The simplest answer is that the long phone is not the next iPhone.

Moonjumper
Jul 17, 2012, 08:59 AM
How would it improve the image quality exactly? Denser resolution or something?

The in-cell technology means the touch sensors will not be in front of the LCD, so not longer obscuring the image.

Dumb idea!! If the screen is enlarged and the the glass is thinner wouldn't it be more prone to flex? And when you grip a phone you don't want it too thin. There is a point where you shouldn't continue to make a phone thinner.
What's funny is that this only benefits case users and I prefer otterbox anyway.

It is the components behind the glass that are being combined to make them thinner, not the glass itself.

cdmoore74
Jul 17, 2012, 09:00 AM
Metal back yes.

Thinner glass no.

rafaltrus
Jul 17, 2012, 09:01 AM
I am a paid developer and my apps would, most likely, not natively support a taller screen (different aspect ratio). Wouldn't we, the developers, be notified beforehand about such changes?? When the new iPhone launches, I would like my apps to be ready on Day 1... :confused:

linux2mac
Jul 17, 2012, 09:01 AM
The best smartphone on the market just keeps getting better. No way Fragmentoid will keep up.

bad03xtreme
Jul 17, 2012, 09:05 AM
Thank you for answering his question by being a condescending *****. If 3.5 inches is too small for you, do me a favour and consider doing the following:

1) Get your eyes checked
2) Buy an iPad
3) Buy a Samsung with said screen size

I really hope the iPhone doesn't go about 4 inches. Even the current 3.5 is fine. This is a phone and I don't want my pockets ripping at the seams trying to contain a 4.8 inch behemoth of a phone.

So just becasue you don't want a bigger screen we all must suffer? :rolleyes:

Just buy a 4S then if you feel that way.

SpectatorHere
Jul 17, 2012, 09:05 AM
I am a paid developer and my apps would, most likely, not natively support a taller screen (different aspect ratio). Wouldn't we, the developers, be notified beforehand about such changes?? When the new iPhone launches, I would like my apps to be ready on Day 1... :confused:

Yes, you would. They sell a crap ton of these and I'm guessing they'd like not to be flooded with customer hate about existing apps not working.

The long phone is so much stupidity and just goes to show you the power of pictures.

People see photos that look nice and they assume it has to be real. Even though we had the same darn thing last release with another bogus design floating around (which happened to confirm a rumor, as this one did as well).

Fact is, there are counterfeiters galore in Asia...it's a big business. They're guessing and leaking. Maybe off of real prototypes, maybe just off of rumor sites.

KnightWRX
Jul 17, 2012, 09:07 AM
I am a paid developer and my apps would, most likely, not natively support a taller screen (different aspect ratio). Wouldn't we, the developers, be notified beforehand about such changes?? When the new iPhone launches, I would like my apps to be ready on Day 1... :confused:

If you're called Epic Games, Electronic Arts or Rovio ? Sure you would be notified ahead of time, with a proper NDA. Small time developer ? You'll learn about it when everyone else does.

That's just how Apple operates unfortunately.

bawbac
Jul 17, 2012, 09:07 AM
Thanks for asking a very appropriate question.

One of Apple's conventions, is "It just works". Another is "It's all about the user experience".

So when discussing any improvement to the phone like this proposed thinner screen, it's a contributing factor to ones experience.

For those of us who buy iPhones and use them as they were designed to be used, as a smartphone, display size is of great importance.

Conversely, some people buy smartphones because they are "trendy". Other cases where Apple is concerned people buy them because their friends and family have iPhones. The light use they see is so minimal that the shortcoming of a tiny 3.5" display is not even noticed by these users who in many cases don't even need a smartphone, but could do quite nicely with a feature phone.

Samsung has proven to me, based on my first hand experience with several of their handsets equipped with various sizes of displays, that the best most useful range of sizes is 4.3" at a bare minimum and 4.65" to 4.8" as the optimum size for composing email messages, text messages and working on the internet.

Just like choosing a laptop, screen size is everything. It's obvious to most people that the most important parts of any smartphone or computer is the size and usefulness of the keyboard and the quality and size of display that one stares at while using the device.

Hopefully I've help you understand what true Smartphone users experience.

You should preface your comment with IMO.

KnightWRX
Jul 17, 2012, 09:09 AM
Yes, you would. They sell a crap ton of these and I'm guessing they'd like not to be flooded with customer hate about existing apps not working.


Apps would still work fine in letterboxed mode, so no need to warn developers ahead of time, aside from a few big names to update their apps for a day 1 launch of a 16:9 device.

bawbac
Jul 17, 2012, 09:09 AM
Thank you for answering his question by being a condescending *****. If 3.5 inches is too small for you, do me a favour and consider doing the following:

1) Get your eyes checked
2) Buy an iPad
3) Buy a Samsung with said screen size

I really hope the iPhone doesn't go about 4 inches. Even the current 3.5 is fine. This is a phone and I don't want my pockets ripping at the seams trying to contain a 4.8 inch behemoth of a phone.
Older iPhones will still be available for those who do not want a bigger screen.
Remember, you have the power of choice to buy what meets your requirements.

Jynto
Jul 17, 2012, 09:10 AM
Do what I do, just don't push the up button, a lot.

Or you can upvote every other comment on the page.

rafaltrus
Jul 17, 2012, 09:10 AM
If you're called Epic Games, Electronic Arts or Rovio ? Sure you would be notified ahead of time, with a proper NDA. Small time developer ? You'll learn about it when everyone else does.

That's just how Apple operates unfortunately.

I begun developing after the newest iPad release so I did not know it. Meh... it sucks! :(

AppleBoyFreak
Jul 17, 2012, 09:12 AM
And if they made it the same thickness as the iPhone 4/4S everyone would complain that it is the same form factor. There's just no way to please all the Apple fanboys until the phone is actually out and then everyone will love it. :rolleyes: :apple:

KnightWRX
Jul 17, 2012, 09:13 AM
I begun developing after the newest iPad release so I did not know it. Meh... it sucks! :(

Well like I said, it's not like your apps wouldn't work on a new 16:9 iPhone as rumored. The horizontal resolution (in portrait mode) would still remain the same 640 pixel and thus you'd just get black bars on both sides.

SpectatorHere
Jul 17, 2012, 09:15 AM
If you're called Epic Games, Electronic Arts or Rovio ? Sure you would be notified ahead of time, with a proper NDA. Small time developer ? You'll learn about it when everyone else does.

That's just how Apple operates unfortunately.

What is this based off???? I understand Apple COULD do this with NDAs, but why leave 400,000 apps broken? It just doesn't make sense they would drop a new aspect ratio and resolution on developers with no lead time. Heck, it doesn't make sense to fragment things even more (Cook has commented that he knows their App Store's success is partly in its lack of this sort of fragmentation).

There is no super secret cabal with a new aspect ratio. The new phone will be 3:2 and probably maintain the same resolution as the retinas. People get obsessed over what retina means, when it's just a marketing term. That's far easier to change (see 220 something MBP display called retina) than breaking apps left and right.

KnightWRX
Jul 17, 2012, 09:23 AM
What is this based off???? I understand Apple COULD do this with NDAs, but why leave 400,000 apps broken?

This is based off every new iPhone/iPad feature introduced (including the original Retina display, compass, etc..). And broken what ? Letterboxed apps are not broken, they work fine.

fertilized-egg
Jul 17, 2012, 09:25 AM
The problem with your suggestion, KnightWRX, is that some people believe anyone that doesn't agree with them or isn't 100% pro-Apple is a troll.

I got the opposite reaction. Usually I got downvoted when I argued against obvious anti-Apple sentiment.

SpectatorHere
Jul 17, 2012, 09:26 AM
Well like I said, it's not like your apps wouldn't work on a new 16:9 iPhone as rumored. The horizontal resolution (in portrait mode) would still remain the same 640 pixel and thus you'd just get black bars on both sides.

They aren't going to throw in a fifth resolution with an entirely new aspect ratio.

There will be a 3:2 new iphone. It probably won't even change resolution, just have a dip in dpi that won't even be noticeable. If they do change things up, they'll still keep 3:2 and just do another multiple increase in screen res so things won't have to be changed. It seems to me keeping the 3.5" screen yet another year is even more likely than the long phone.

The crappy leaks with their inconsistent case designs (mic and camera differ depending on which leak), the ease at which a case can be created, the implausible stories (how does the case maker get the cut glass again?), the lack of any Apple legal action, the lack of any sort of reliable source confirming, the fact these leaks match pre-existing speculation in tech forums, and the previous history--just last year--of a bogus iPhone rumor, COMBINED with the fact it would bork every App....should lead you to disregard the long phone rumor.

The choice is yours, but seems a little implausible. :)

Whaditis
Jul 17, 2012, 09:44 AM
For a phone the iPhone is pretty thick. Anything to reduce the thickness is fine by me.

I'd like to down vote the above comment without commenting.:D

MecPro
Jul 17, 2012, 09:50 AM
I remember reading that Samsung combine the NFC chips in the battery and the back case HAS to be plastic.

So I think that rules out glass, don't know about metal

Navdakilla
Jul 17, 2012, 10:09 AM
Fall can't come soon enough

AaronEdwards
Jul 17, 2012, 10:11 AM
I really hope the battery doesn't get smaller over making it "thinner". The iPhone is already thin, I just want improvement to battery life.

Apple favors design above almost anything else.

Increasing the size of the battery isn't the only way to improve battery life people.

Just because the technology is improved doesn't mean that the battery can be made larger too. If they do both, we'd get a lot better battery life instead of just the same.

KnightWRX
Jul 17, 2012, 10:14 AM
They aren't going to throw in a fifth resolution with an entirely new aspect ratio.

Maybe they will, maybe they won't. This is all rumors at this point.

COMBINED with the fact it would bork every App....should lead you to disregard the long phone rumor.

It wouldn't break anything though. Letterboxing != broken. That's how they do phone apps on iPad already.

The choice is yours, but seems a little implausible. :)

The choice is Apple's, not mine to make.

ixodes
Jul 17, 2012, 10:16 AM
A) Thank you for answering his question by being a condescending *****.

B) If 3.5 inches is too small for you, do me a favour and consider doing the following:

C /1) Get your eyes checked
D /2) Buy an iPad
E /3) Buy a Samsung with said screen size

F) I don't want my pockets ripping at the seams trying to contain a 4.8 inch behemoth of a phone.
a) You're welcome, too bad you have to resort to calling names, it makes you look immature.

b) My preferences are not based on your values

c) My eyes are 20/20 as of two months ago.

d) I have an iPad 2, and an iPad 3, these are tablets not smartphones, you may or may not be aware of this difference.

e) I do have a fresh new Galaxy S III _as_well_ as my iPhone 4S.

Excuse me? A Behemoth of a phone... that's laughable.

It's apparent you have no clue. Let me help you out.

See the FACTS below:

136.6 x 70.6 x 8.6 mm Galaxy S III 4.8" display
115.2 x 58.6 x 9.3 mm iPhone 4S 3.5" display

Galaxy S III a mere 12mm wider (less than 1/2")
And a very modest 21.4mm taller (less than 1.0")

f) If that minor difference rips your pants, you have far more serious problems than your choice of phones.

Cheers :)

Mavelous
Jul 17, 2012, 10:20 AM
Always preferred the feel and practicality of the 1st iphone.
Despite the obvious improvements, the glass back was always dumb.
Eventually, Apple should continue to look to the unibody technology of their laptops for a sleek, strong enclosure for the iphone

TheMarc
Jul 17, 2012, 10:20 AM
I don't understand why everybody is dying for a battery that lasts longer..!?!
Doesn't it last you the day? If so, wouldn't a longer-lasting battery mean that the phone would die in the middle of the other day, when you're most likely out somewhere, not in measure to charge it?
To have a significant longer-lasting battery, it would have to be double the capacity, to last two days, which is not very likely.

ixodes
Jul 17, 2012, 10:21 AM
You should preface your comment with IMO.
You should remember that everything written in this forum is IMO. That's what a public forum is for.

AustinIllini
Jul 17, 2012, 10:24 AM
Increasing the size of the battery isn't the only way to improve battery life people.

But it certainly does work.

chrmjenkins
Jul 17, 2012, 10:27 AM
Does that mean if the screen cracks then both the lcd and the touch screen are broken cause now if you crack your screen the touch panel still works.

It should still work. The touch panel has been moved a layer down, into the display itself.

AustinIllini
Jul 17, 2012, 10:28 AM
Excuse me? A Behemoth of a phone... that's laughable.

Exactly. People think the SGIII is so big. The screen just takes up more of the front. Can you imagine if the SGIII had the iPhone front design. It would be enormous.

Funkymonk
Jul 17, 2012, 10:29 AM
Hmm so this sounds like they're implementing Samsung's SAMOLED technology into LCD. Very interesting indeed.

I think it's a testament to apple that they are always putting innovation in their products. A lot of other companies just use industry norms for the innerds and the looks of their products. Apple's agenda might just be to be able to market it as the "thinnest phone ever", but they found an innovative way to make it that way.

doesn't sound so innovative to me

Reason077
Jul 17, 2012, 10:32 AM
I'll take you back to the original leaks of the "long phone" and remind you of the glass that was with the case. Why would there be separate glass that wasn't fused to the LCD screen?


In-cell does not mean that the LCD screen is fused to the glass. It means that the touch sensor panel is combined into the LCD panel.

olegandbuster25
Jul 17, 2012, 10:34 AM
Will Apple finally be able to stop the increasing dominance of Android? I doubt it considering Apple are normally 2-3 generations behind the top Android devices.

Hahah you're so dumb.
Apple doesn't need to stop the "android" dominance, because it's impossible considering android is selling on numerous models from HTC, Samsung, Motorola, and whatever other little phone makers there are... That's hundreds of phones VS two, and then 3 iPhone models,
So considering apple held it off for a while, and are still not too far behind, it shows exactly how strong and popular the iPhone really is.

HishamAkhtar
Jul 17, 2012, 10:35 AM
Older iPhones will still be available for those who do not want a bigger screen.
Remember, you have the power of choice to buy what meets your requirements.

Couldn't the same apply to you? If you want a bigger screen, buy an Android.

Wicked1
Jul 17, 2012, 10:36 AM
Not one person has a mock up image of what they think the new phone will look like Shocker :eek:

nuckinfutz
Jul 17, 2012, 10:37 AM
Is this an IGZO display? or something different?

Not it'll be like the iP4[s] and use an IPS LTPS screen.

I think they should use 120% of the thickness savings for an increase in the battery. LTE is a battery hog.

It's interesting that it's hard to find the power consumption numbers for LTE chipsets like the Qualcomm MDM9615. It will be better than current hardware which is a good thing.

But it certainly does work.

I suspect Apple will do both. If the phone is larger they can squeeze in a couple of hundred mAh but most of the battery life improvements will be made in component choices and smarter power management.

HishamAkhtar
Jul 17, 2012, 10:44 AM
d) I have an iPad 2, and an iPad 3, these are tablets not smartphones, you may or may not be aware of this difference.

e) I do have a fresh new Galaxy S III _as_well_ as my iPhone 4S.

Excuse me? A Behemoth of a phone... that's laughable.

It's apparent you have no clue. Let me help you out.

See the FACTS below:

136.6 x 70.6 x 8.6 mm Galaxy S III 4.8" display
115.2 x 58.6 x 9.3 mm iPhone 4S 3.5" display

Galaxy S III a mere 12mm wider (less than 1/2")
And a very modest 21.4mm taller (less than 1.0")

f) If that minor difference rips your pants, you have far more serious problems than your choice of phones.

Cheers :)

Are you serious? Refer to the attached image:

http://1.androidauthority.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/iphone-vs-Samsung-galaxy-S31.jpg

That is QUITE a large difference in the sizes of the phones. In a phone that's 115 mm tall, a 21.4 mm difference is quite large!

What differentiates a phone from a tablet? The only real difference is A) size and B) cellular networking

With "phones" like the Samsung Galaxy Note, those lines are being blurred even more. Refer to the following image:

http://www.cellularism.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/samsung-galaxynote-vs-iPhone4.jpg

So in summary, I'll stick to my original argument. I do NOT want Apple to partake in the screen size warfare and would rather they improved processing, battery, overall design and software.

3bs
Jul 17, 2012, 10:44 AM
I don't understand why everybody is dying for a battery that lasts longer..!?!
Doesn't it last you the day? If so, wouldn't a longer-lasting battery mean that the phone would die in the middle of the other day, when you're most likely out somewhere, not in measure to charge it?
To have a significant longer-lasting battery, it would have to be double the capacity, to last two days, which is not very likely.

No it doesn't last a day and I would charge it at night even if it wasn't close to being empty.

chrmjenkins
Jul 17, 2012, 10:51 AM
Not it'll be like the iP4[s] and use an IPS LTPS screen.

I doubt that. Why wouldn't it be IGZO? Why else would they be switching to Sharp? You think Sharp is the only one that can do in-cell?

SpyderBite
Jul 17, 2012, 11:00 AM
But, no screen hike=no upgrade.

I feel the opposite. I prefer the current size of the screen. As such, I used one of my upgrades last week to get a 4s just in case they do in fact increase the screen size and possibly lengthen the device. Should the overall length of the device remain the same, then I'll just use another upgrade and my mother will get my 4s just like she's getting my 4 this week.

I am fine with a screen size increase as long as it doesn't compromise the compact size factor of the phone. I figure I'm covered on both sides of the outcome with multiple upgrades available. ^^

RBR2
Jul 17, 2012, 11:03 AM
Has anyone ever been into the Apple store and looked at the modified iPhones that the employees use to scan a bar code and charge card to complete a purchase? They are thicker than the consumer iPhone and have a curved back to them that rests in the hand well. They also have a big enough battery that the charge lasts all day (according to the employees I have asked about it). (If you have not, you really should take a look at those things next time you go to the Apple store.)

When is Apple going to wake up and provide a more useful phone rather than challenging the absurdity of making the device thinner and more slippery so that the use of a case is all but mandatory so that it does not slip out of the user's hand so easily...aside from needing protection for those "oops" occasions which can easily result in expensive damage.

I have no qualms about using a newer technology touch screen which probably reduces cost and could provide a tiny bit of increased internal volume, but come on Apple, make a more ergonomic device that has a greater capacity battery.

Rocketman
Jul 17, 2012, 11:03 AM
It's interesting that it's hard to find the power consumption numbers for LTE chipsets like the Qualcomm MDM9615. It will be better than current hardware which is a good thing. Power consumption for current features will be better due to better power saving algorithims, new software routines and die shrink. LTE is a new feature which was not even possible at all in an iDevice largely to the substantially higher power consumption of the technology inherently.

All those advances combined only makes LTE barely possible in an Apple ecosystem. It in no way improves battery life. It hurts it. I simply have been advocating increasing battery capacity fairly substantially and forsake a bit of "thinness'. The fact iPad3 went this route gives me hope iPhone5 may as well.

If not, people like me will simply wait for iPhone 5S or whatever, and hold our breath for the inclusion of Li-Air battery technology.

Rocketman

Confuzzzed
Jul 17, 2012, 11:08 AM
uuuhhhhhh???? :rolleyes: yeh we did.

There is no vote down button. We have always had no vote down button.

----------



The iPhone 5 will likely use a new A5 CPU variant built on 32nm lithography with reduced power consumption compared to the 4S. This means it should be able to get the same or better battery life than the 4S, even if the battery is slightly smaller.

----------



A 16:9 screen with the same pixel density and horizontal pixel count would actually make things pretty easy for developers. Most well-written apps using standard UIs should just work, taking advantage of the extra vertical space with little or no modification.

Sssssshhh! Such things should not be spoken of. We are all one happy community here. There is no room for negativity or dissent.

It's gone, get use to having to reply to comments instead of hiding behind it. Now, what prompted this comment ? What do you disagree with and while you post to say you disagree, why not tell us why ?

You know... use the discussion forum to actually discuss ?

I disagree with this comment.

:D me too:D

We can not judge iphone 5 battery before first reviews are out.
In the meantime Galaxy Note 2 will be out with a better battery life for sure.
Battery management software plays a role too!

----------



I can not down vote this one ;)

I just cant see why we can up vote something but not down vote. Thats so p.c (the irony)

And ironically, comments like this are the very reason we need down-vote buttons again.

What do we want? We want it now!!!!

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=15266622#post15266622

2IS
Jul 17, 2012, 11:12 AM
Thinner battery = bad idea

----------

For a phone the iPhone is pretty thick. Anything to reduce the thickness is fine by me.

How many smart phones can you name that are thinner? This should be good.

mex4eric
Jul 17, 2012, 11:13 AM
does an iPod Touch feel fragile to you? it does not to me, and it is substantially thinner than an iPhone

Agreed, an iPod touch sized iPhone would feel just fine. Would want an iPhone battery life though.

nuckinfutz
Jul 17, 2012, 11:17 AM
All those advances combined only makes LTE barely possible in an Apple ecosystem. It in no way improves battery life. It hurts it. I simply have been advocating increasing battery capacity fairly substantially and forsake a bit of "thinness'. The fact iPad3 went this route gives me hope iPhone5 may as well.

Rocketman

Prepare to be amazed. Apple's LTE implementation should be amazing.

gman27
Jul 17, 2012, 11:17 AM
I'm still curious how they're going to tweak the OS for that larger screen.

nuckinfutz
Jul 17, 2012, 11:18 AM
I doubt that. Why wouldn't it be IGZO? Why else would they be switching to Sharp? You think Sharp is the only one that can do in-cell?

I thought the same. LTPS screens are double the cost. IGZO delivers solid price savings but then I wonder if Sharp could keep up with demand for the panels for a global shipment of iPhones and the reality sunk in that IGZO iPhone displays may have to wait until 2013 (WAG)

Intarweb
Jul 17, 2012, 11:23 AM
So instead of using the extra space for an even bigger battery, apple goes for the "more thin" than the previous model crap, the classic apple way.

How about a better battery overall also? I really enjoy charging my phone everyday with very minimal use. :rolleyes:

----------

I'm still curious how they're going to tweak the OS for that larger screen.

Another row of icons and apps will run windowed, i.e. black bars on top and bottom when held vertically and black bars left and right when held horizontally is my guess.

chrmjenkins
Jul 17, 2012, 11:23 AM
How many smart phones can you name that are thinner? This should be good.

HTC One X. (equal)
Droid Razr.
Oppo Finder.
ZTE Athena.
Huawei P1 S.
Motorola Atrix HD.
Samsung Galaxy Nexus (equal)


This list is not exhaustive.

RBR2
Jul 17, 2012, 11:24 AM
Power consumption for current features will be better due to better power saving algorithims, new software routines and die shrink. LTE is a new feature which was not even possible at all in an iDevice largely to the substantially higher power consumption of the technology inherently.

All those advances combined only makes LTE barely possible in an Apple ecosystem. It in no way improves battery life. It hurts it. I simply have been advocating increasing battery capacity fairly substantially and forsake a bit of "thinness'. The fact iPad3 went this route gives me hope iPhone5 may as well.

If not, people like me will simply wait for iPhone 5S or whatever, and hold our breath for the inclusion of Li-Air battery technology.

Rocketman

First generation LTE chip sets were rather power hungry, but the main problem is Apple's fixation on making the iPhone smaller. At some point, and in my view we have passed it, making the device smaller makes it less useful, not more.

If the new iPhone (whatever Apple may call it) is not 4G/LTE capable I will be in the market for something else. AT&Ts 3G is so slooooooow in many areas.

Don't even start me on the subject of iOS. It is crude and has many flaws that should not have been present in iOS 1.0 and here we are at iOS 6 Beta, not the least of which is poor memory management with plenty of "leaks" which can result in crashing of Safari (or other apps) and sometimes apps, especially the native/default apps will crash continuously in the background killing the battery in nothing flat. The native apps (Safari & etc) are a part of iOS and so you have to do a complete reinstallation (direct firmware update) thereby losing app organization if restored from iTunes (because keeping the app organization reinstalls the corrupt version of the native apps). There is some indication that a restore from iCloud may restore data, but not the prior version of the native apps and no clear answer about app organization.

Evidently the iOS developers never heard of Keychain. Where the heck is an integrated password manager?

Tim needs to make some major changes in the management of iOS.

2IS
Jul 17, 2012, 11:32 AM
HTC One X. (equal)
Droid Razr.
Oppo Finder.
ZTE Athena.
Huawei P1 S.
Motorola Atrix HD.
Samsung Galaxy Nexus (equal)


This list is not exhaustive.

Out of hundreds you found 5 ;)

Moonjumper
Jul 17, 2012, 11:38 AM
Agreed, an iPod touch sized iPhone would feel just fine. Would want an iPhone battery life though.

An iPod touch sized iPhone would be fine. It just needs to be shaped properly.

The current touch has too much of a taper, and to sharp an edge to be comfortable. The first generation touch is much more comfortable, although the edges could be more rounded for comfort (I have both for app development).

Shape is more important than thickness, something Apple did better with the iPhone 3G / 3GS.

Rennir
Jul 17, 2012, 11:40 AM
It is also important to note that Android phones generally have bigger screens and therefore surface area than the iPhone in order to make space for the battery.

newyorksole
Jul 17, 2012, 11:41 AM
I'm still curious how they're going to tweak the OS for that larger screen.

Just like they did with the iPad. Same size icons, bigger screen.

I think they should make things smaller tho.

chrmjenkins
Jul 17, 2012, 11:44 AM
Out of hundreds you found 5 ;)

Out of excuses you found 1.

How many smartphones do you think have been released since the iphone 4? (since it would be pointless to consider phones prior to a phone that was the thinnest. Also ignorant given technology progresses forward). If you don't count carrier variations of the same phone, I'd bet it's only barely higher than 100.

Rogifan
Jul 17, 2012, 11:46 AM
You could also ignore them or report their posts, since trolling is against the rules :

Forum Rules (http://guides.macrumors.com/Help:Forum_Rules)


No need to downvote since most downvoting is done based on disagreement. If you disagree enough to try to rate a post, respond and say why, contributing to the forum and discussion.

----------



And what would this "phone" do without any radio support (no Wifi, no Phone, no 3G/LTE or other cellular data).

Sounds like a iPod Classic with a touch screen to me.
I have no problem reporting trolls. But sometimes I'd rather not waste my time doing so, or responding to their post because most trolls are just looking for attention. Responding to them gives them more attention than a down vote. Anyway these days it seems as though the comments that get most up votes are those that are anti-Apple. They might as well just rename MR Engadget or CNET.

deannnnn
Jul 17, 2012, 11:48 AM
A larger screen is still a huge negative for me.

utahman130
Jul 17, 2012, 11:49 AM
A larger screen is still a huge negative for me.

Deal breaker for me is same size screen. I would love a bigger screen. It would be so much easier to get more done on my iPhone with a larger screen.

KnightWRX
Jul 17, 2012, 11:53 AM
I have no problem reporting trolls. But sometimes I'd rather not waste my time doing so, or responding to their post because most trolls are just looking for attention. Responding to them gives them more attention than a down vote.

Down votes are also attention. Ignoring not an option ?

ixodes
Jul 17, 2012, 11:55 AM
Are you serious? Refer to the attached image:

http://1.androidauthority.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/iphone-vs-Samsung-galaxy-S31.jpg

That is QUITE a large difference in the sizes of the phones. In a phone that's 115 mm tall, a 21.4 mm difference is quite large!

A two dimensional image doesn't reveal the true "look and feel" of any object.

When dealing with comparisons as such, there's no denying the factual and very specific size measurements I provided.


With "phones" like the Samsung Galaxy Note, those lines are being blurred even more. Refer to the following image:

http://www.cellularism.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/samsung-galaxynote-vs-iPhone4.jpg
Now you've diverted attention from the original subject and introduced another class of devices which are totally irrelevant to the topic at hand.

At the end of the day, why not just be honest? If you don't like a larger display, that's your choice. It's only a phone.

chrmjenkins
Jul 17, 2012, 12:07 PM
A larger screen is still a huge negative for me.

I'm sure at least the 4S will continue to exist. However, it's hard to imagine this new phone not selling well and dissuading apple from that form factor.

bawbac
Jul 17, 2012, 12:16 PM
You should remember that everything written in this forum is IMO. That's what a public forum is for.

Wrong.
You can make a statement and back it up with scientific or a respected source.

Everything you posted was an opinion with no evidence to back up your single myopic claims.

----------

Couldn't the same apply to you? If you want a bigger screen, buy an Android.

Does an Android allow access to the iTunes store for apps I use? ;)

Rocketman
Jul 17, 2012, 12:20 PM
Yes the LTE chips Apple will use will be substantially better. Fine. But LTE itself is a power hog independent of chip consumption. It does tx/rx at higher wattage.

The comments about memory leaks is another sore spot. A portion of that is installing half the memory needed based on actual results and experience. That was a resource decision with actual user experience problems added for no good reason. If I understand it correctly a device with double the memory doesn't have less leaks, they just impact the experience less frequently. Since this issue impacts both battery life and user experience, I for one would rank it very high on the to do list.

It's truly amazing and cool what an iPhone can do at all, but some of the compromises Apple chooses, to save a couple of bucks in cost, have such a large and uncomfortable trade off, I question the judgment on it.

For example you can make the "same or better" display thinner, the "same or better" case thinner, but with battery you cannot make the "same" battery thinner because chemistry is a harsh mistress. Mechanical and Electrical engineers tend to be confused by that. :( Moore's law not installed . . .

Rocketman

HishamAkhtar
Jul 17, 2012, 12:23 PM
A two dimensional image doesn't reveal the true "look and feel" of any object.

When dealing with comparisons as such, there's no denying the factual and very specific size measurements I provided.

Of course it does. You can visually SEE the difference in size. And I already addressed your "facts." And I've held an S3 and it feels like a large phone.



Now you've diverted attention from the original subject and introduced another class of devices which are totally irrelevant to the topic at hand.

At the end of the day, why not just be honest? If you don't like a larger display, that's your choice. It's only a phone.

I'm not diverting attention. I'm trying to show you the different classes of smartphones that are on the market. There's a general trend with larger displays coming out for phones and devices like the Note show how ridiculous it's become. OF COURSE this has everything to do with MY opinion. This is a rumors site and the majority (if any) people here DO NOT work for Apple.

NikeTalk
Jul 17, 2012, 12:51 PM
Apple is gonna have to skimp some where. I'm curious as to where that will be though. They normally hide it pretty well. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the new iPhone is just HSPA+ (highly doubt it will be). Also, no way the battery will be on par with the newer Androids which it needs to be at a minimum. In other words, looks like i'll be picking up a white S3 :D.

easy4lif
Jul 17, 2012, 12:51 PM
i wonder if this tech will hit the next iPod touch as well. I mean the damn device is already pretty damn thin to begin with.

saturn79
Jul 17, 2012, 01:04 PM
I think we can also assume that the next iPhone will contain the same color accuracy and contrast improvements present in the current iPad.

Gasu E.
Jul 17, 2012, 01:24 PM
yeah i really wish they would just make it the same thickness, but increase the battery size.

So you want it to be heavier?

----------

You should preface your comment with IMO.

In your opinion.

KdParker
Jul 17, 2012, 01:38 PM
I disagree with this comment.

Nice...see we don't need a down button :rolleyes:

----------

This thinness race is the same bull as the megapixel race.

I read elsewhere that the retina MBP is extremely fagile. Another reason not to get it.

if by fagile you mean awesome!...then yes it is.

nagromme
Jul 17, 2012, 01:56 PM
There is no vote down button. We have always had no vote down button.

I always like a good 1984 reference, so thank you. I think it went over the heads of many people :p

ixodes
Jul 17, 2012, 01:59 PM
Wrong.
You can make a statement and back it up with scientific or a respected source.

Everything you posted was an opinion with no evidence to back up your single myopic claims.
Oh my, someone's awfully upset over nothing.
This will help you avoid using your favorite search engine
****************IzTbF

unlinked
Jul 17, 2012, 02:26 PM
Nice...see we don't need a down button :rolleyes:







Sure we do. I won't always be around to reply and help speak for all the people who agree with me but are a little too lazy to post or don't want to litter the forum with you are wrong posts.

bushido
Jul 17, 2012, 02:28 PM
HTC One X. (equal)
Droid Razr.
Oppo Finder.
ZTE Athena.
Huawei P1 S.
Motorola Atrix HD.
Samsung Galaxy Nexus (equal)


This list is not exhaustive.

you forgot the "biggest" > galaxy s3 is also thinner

Sedrick
Jul 17, 2012, 02:32 PM
Out of hundreds you found 5 ;)
It only takes one to send Apple back to the drawing board. :D

So you want it to be heavier?
They'll save a ton of weight by losing that heavy-ass glass back. They can then increase the size of the battery and keep the same weight. You'd have to be a fool to argue with that (no doubt many will).

uknowimright
Jul 17, 2012, 02:41 PM
Thank you for answering his question by being a condescending *****. If 3.5 inches is too small for you, do me a favour and consider doing the following:

1) Get your eyes checked
2) Buy an iPad
3) Buy a Samsung with said screen size

I really hope the iPhone doesn't go about 4 inches. Even the current 3.5 is fine. This is a phone and I don't want my pockets ripping at the seams trying to contain a 4.8 inch behemoth of a phone.

surprised you didn't go all the way irrational and tell him to go buy a TV instead

cclloyd
Jul 17, 2012, 02:41 PM
Down voting is ackwowledging though. The opposite of acknowledging would be to ignore.

----------



Up votes are used to select comments to display under news stories on the main domain (www.macrumors.com (http://www.macrumors.com)) so that site visitors get a preview of the forums.

Why is there all this talk of voting up/down anyway? Even if it was removed, I was just able to vote down a post by editing the source on chrome.

chrmjenkins
Jul 17, 2012, 02:42 PM
you forgot the "biggest" > galaxy s3 is also thinner

For some reason when I checked the spec I thought I saw higher. But yeah, it's .34 vs. .37 on the iphone.

DOWNSIDEUP
Jul 17, 2012, 03:09 PM
0.92 millimetre gap? Oh, I'm sure Apple will fill it up with glue. :rolleyes:

StormBlade
Jul 17, 2012, 04:03 PM
Excellent:cool: I have an iPhone 4 and ready to upgrade!

kemo
Jul 17, 2012, 04:03 PM
Metal for the back would be soo much better than glass.

Definitely, I hope we also get metal for the front part of the phone as well in the next version!:p

Now seriously, apple could use thicker (and more durable Gorilla glass), but they (if the statement above is based on real informations..) used metal, why did they? Maybe next chip will have more heat to get rid of?

2IS
Jul 17, 2012, 04:19 PM
Out of excuses you found 1.

How many smartphones do you think have been released since the iphone 4? (since it would be pointless to consider phones prior to a phone that was the thinnest. Also ignorant given technology progresses forward). If you don't count carrier variations of the same phone, I'd bet it's only barely higher than 100.

So what you're saying is, if you only include new phones, less than 5% are thinner than the IP4... and if you do include older phones, the number is much much lower. Numbers don't like "for a phone" the iPhone is rather thin, not thick. Calling it thick or fat is like calling someone who earns an income in the top 5% poor. Doesn't really make sense does it?

Mad-B-One
Jul 17, 2012, 04:28 PM
Definitely, I hope we also get metal for the front part of the phone as well in the next version!:p

Now seriously, apple could use thicker (and more durable Gorilla glass), but they (if the statement above is based on real informations..) used metal, why did they? Maybe next chip will have more heat to get rid of?

Well, they could use the new translucent metals: Chain link fence! :D

bawbac
Jul 17, 2012, 04:40 PM
Oh my, someone's awfully upset over nothing.
This will help you avoid using your favorite search engine
****************IzTbF

Upset?:p

You're the one posting distaste for the new larger iPhone and posting your statements like they are facts.

It's ok to have small hands. :D

----------

Why is there all this talk of voting up/down anyway? Even if it was removed, I was just able to vote down a post by editing the source on chrome.

I think some tried this but their mac would lock up when they used chrome.

KnightWRX
Jul 17, 2012, 05:14 PM
Why is there all this talk of voting up/down anyway? Even if it was removed, I was just able to vote down a post by editing the source on chrome.

You're right, it works. Mister -199. ;) (too bad it doesn't update the MacRumors database, as there is a check server side, but it does locally update the display dynamically before a refresh...).

ixodes
Jul 17, 2012, 05:17 PM
Upset?:p

You're the one posting distaste for the new larger iPhone and posting your statements like they are facts.

It's ok to have small hands. :D
Nice try but you just revealed yourself. Instead of reading, you just pick out a random post, then launch into some nonsensical irrelevant rant. Nearly every post I've made, talks about my preference for large displays....

KnightWRX
Jul 17, 2012, 05:18 PM
I think some tried this but their mac would lock up when they used chrome.

The Chrome developer tools are essentially the same thing as Firebug for Firefox, which provides the same in-line source editing functionality. Anyway, Chrome works fine on this Mac, Apple needs to get to releasing new drivers for those new Macs to prevent those panics...

chrmjenkins
Jul 17, 2012, 05:19 PM
So what you're saying is, if you only include new phones, less than 5% are thinner than the IP4... and if you do include older phones, the number is much much lower. Numbers don't like "for a phone" the iPhone is rather thin, not thick. Calling it thick or fat is like calling someone who earns an income in the top 5% poor. Doesn't really make sense does it?

I'm saying it's utterly pointless to include older phones because the ip4 was undisputed as thinnest when it debuted.

I only responded to your post because you posted as if there are almost no phones thinner than the ip4 or 4s. 6 have been brought to light fairly easily. I have no interest in the debate about whether being that thin has merit.

rotax
Jul 17, 2012, 05:22 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1wRivEeIU8

KnightWRX
Jul 17, 2012, 05:24 PM
I always like a good 1984 reference, so thank you. I think it went over the heads of many people :p

No, we all got the reference, I just don't think anyone really found what parellel the guy was trying to draw between the removal of "too lazy to voice a disagreement" and "total state control over individual thought".

cclloyd
Jul 17, 2012, 07:03 PM
You're right, it works. Mister -199. ;) (too bad it doesn't update the MacRumors database, as there is a check server side, but it does locally update the display dynamically before a refresh...).

I meant I refreshed and it worked. A post was at -1 until I voted it back up.

thehatisonfire
Jul 17, 2012, 07:51 PM
I rarely log in - mostly just read the forums. I logged in to say that I really miss the down votes. Often someone writes a post that is just wrong/false. As in: "the iPhone 2G has quad core cpu." or some other random stuff.

If a statement got -177 votes it was easy to see that something might be wrong here. Now it might even get a few upvotes and its much harder to find out if what is written is true/false.

So... again - please bring back the down votes, Even though I won't use it much myself.

vampireszombies
Jul 17, 2012, 08:03 PM
It only takes one to send Apple back to the drawing board. :D

Originally Posted by Gasu E.
So you want it to be heavier?

They'll save a ton of weight by losing that heavy-ass glass back. They can then increase the size of the battery and keep the same weight. You'd have to be a fool to argue with that (no doubt many will).

Is weight really an issue with people?
It's not like their 5lb phones.
To me, I like the weight of the iPhone 4/4S. I like phones that have a "heft" to them. It makes it more quality feeling.
Sure I've had android phones that had great build quality but I did not like their lightweight empty feeling when you held them. Weight feels expensive.

kulimer
Jul 17, 2012, 08:43 PM
Anyway I find it a bit hard to believe that apple will go for the 16.9 ratio since this is ********ing up the ecosystem + if they do it they will be stuck to that screen for 2 to 4 year, you know ecosystem, fragmentation etc.

why is this related to the econsystem? more glass produced?

Thunderhawks
Jul 17, 2012, 09:01 PM
Is weight really an issue with people?
It's not like their 5lb phones.
To me, I like the weight of the iPhone 4/4S. I like phones that have a "heft" to them. It makes it more quality feeling.
Sure I've had android phones that had great build quality but I did not like their lightweight empty feeling when you held them. Weight feels expensive.

Yes it is!

If everybody was as obsessed with thinness as Apple, we would not have an obesity problem in the US.

Phones would fit into pockets, vibration mode would be recognized instead of
being muffled by fat flash and maybe that lightweight empty feeling is what all the
high fructose addicted people should consider.

And, it wouldn't be necessary for Apple to reinforce the back of the phone with metal.

Everybody should watch the movie "Supersize me" and they will learn that bigger is not always better.

.......but I digress!

What about we all wait, watch the sales numbers, wondering what happened (again)

StyxMaker
Jul 17, 2012, 11:16 PM
And ironically, comments like this are the very reason we need down-vote buttons again.

You don't like '1984' references?

silroc
Jul 17, 2012, 11:31 PM
Who Gives a CRAP about THIN!

Give me a battery that lasts!

The phone should be as thin as the ip4 metal band IMO

cocky jeremy
Jul 18, 2012, 12:03 AM
I don't want it thinner. I don't want the screen bigger than 4". And i definitely don't want that ugly two toned BS. If they end up doing that, i'll be using a case on my iPhone for the first time. The "leaks" are so ridiculously ugly. :mad:

2IS
Jul 18, 2012, 02:13 AM
I'm saying it's utterly pointless to include older phones because the ip4 was undisputed as thinnest when it debuted.

I only responded to your post because you posted as if there are almost no phones thinner than the ip4 or 4s. 6 have been brought to light fairly easily. I have no interest in the debate about whether being that thin has merit.

The point was there are very few phones that are thinner. The comment I responded to said that "for a phone" the iPhone is thick. Implying that most phones are thinner. Your own guesstimates put that number at or under 5%

Bako-MacAddict
Jul 18, 2012, 02:39 AM
I'm excited ! I sold my iPhone 4s 32 gig for $650 ! so I'm thinking of buying a samsung just for now, and resell it of course to get the new iPhone. Will hold more value than a iPhone 4s since GSIII is newer.:D

pandamonia
Jul 18, 2012, 03:00 AM
The phone should be as thin as the ip4 metal band IMO

Yes cus that is way more useful than a 10 hour battery on 3G.

MagnusVonMagnum
Jul 18, 2012, 07:57 AM
Does anyone *really* need the iPhone to be thinner at this point? If it was any thinner, it would at least psychologically feel fragile. I think there's a balance between form and function with the slimness of the device, and Apple is already teetering on that edge.

The ghost of Steve apparently will haunt Apple for many years to come. Apple will not be happy until all their devices are 1 atom thick, impossible as it may be. :D

These devices need a good hand feel. If they get too light and thin, they will start to feel like they might blow away in the wind or something. Apple just doesn't know when to stop. They act like they're in a battle for the world record for thin or something. Thin doesn't offer any features at all. It's a 'so what' thing at this point. I'd much rather see new features or extended battery life on ANY of their products than size reduction.

If anything, the iPhone needs a larger sized screen and the Retina Macbook Pro needs several more ports (not to mention a BD drive which at least some of us would like an option for). WTF is the point of a portable notebook if you have to plug in a boat load of dongles and hubs to get functionality restored? Apple just doesn't seem to get it anymore. :(

(This is the point where all the fracking fanboys chime in with the "they're making money so they must be right BS")

usptact
Jul 18, 2012, 09:39 AM
What is "Battery" doing in the middle of what is supposed to be a screen?

----------

I'm excited ! I sold my iPhone 4s 32 gig for $650 ! so I'm thinking of buying a samsung just for now, and resell it of course to get the new iPhone. Will hold more value than a iPhone 4s since GSIII is newer.:D

Poor addict.

mdunlap
Jul 18, 2012, 10:51 AM
Please keep the battery the same size. I don't want thinner devices if it means lesser or comparable battery life. I would rather a thicker smart phone that doesn't have to be charged for 2 days.

saturn88
Jul 18, 2012, 02:32 PM
This is still LCD requiring backlit and it can not get as thin as AMOLED. Due to a simple construction, AMOLED screens don’t require backlight and can be extremely thin and flexible.

charlituna
Jul 22, 2012, 05:07 PM
It's gone, get use to having to reply to comments instead of hiding behind it. Now, what prompted this comment ? What do you disagree with and while you post to say you disagree, why not tell us why ?

You know... use the discussion forum to actually discuss ?

I have to disagree. Down votes were not about discussion and taking them away won't led to discussion. They will led to folks replying to insult users even more than already happens.

----------

I just cant see why we can up vote something but not down vote. Thats so p.c (the irony)

i know, the up vote opinions have the greater chance of being something that might promote discussion. But folks will be lazy and just click that little area

KnightWRX
Jul 22, 2012, 05:24 PM
I have to disagree. Down votes were not about discussion and taking them away won't led to discussion. They will led to folks replying to insult users even more than already happens.

So the mods will clean up the forums even more promoting more intelligent discussion around here rather than goalpost moving/insults/allusions to trolling for disagreements. If what you say is true, then the downvotes were even more useless than we thought : they served only to insult ? Good riddance.

RBR2
Jul 23, 2012, 10:54 AM
So the mods will clean up the forums even more promoting more intelligent discussion around here rather than goalpost moving/insults/allusions to trolling for disagreements. If what you say is true, then the downvotes were even more useless than we thought : they served only to insult ? Good riddance.

Based upon what I have seen about upvote/downvote use on other sites, the downvotes were to...well, vote some comments "off the island". Once a comment hit a certain level, it was obscured where one had to click on a few things to see it.

I suppose it might serve some purpose from a mod's perspective in that the posts with high downvotes might get attention more often than waiting to report some of the more egregious flames that do not forward the discussion process.

Upvotes, on the other hand, probably save space compared to everyone doing a "+1" to various comments and serves as a mini-opinion survey.

Hey, nothing is perfect.