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MacRumors
Jul 19, 2012, 08:59 AM
http://images.macrumors.com/im/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/07/19/carriers-reportedly-testing-nano-sims-for-apple-ahead-of-next-generation-iphone-launch/)


Following a report (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/07/16/european-carriers-stockpiling-nano-sims-ahead-of-expected-upcoming-iphone-launch/) earlier this week claiming that European carriers have been stockpiling new nano-SIM cards in expectation of Apple using the smaller card in the next-generation iPhone, BGR now reports (http://www.bgr.com/2012/07/19/iphone-5-att-specs-nano-sim-carrier-testing/) that carriers are indeed testing the new cards in partnership with Apple. Multiple carrier sources have exclusively told BGR that Apple is supplying nano-SIM adapters so its carrier partners can test how nano-SIMs work on their networks in standard test devices before they are widely deployed when the new iPhone is introduced. This includes AT&T.http://images.macrumors.com/article-new/2012/07/gi_de_nano_sim.jpg


SIM card form factors with nano-SIM at left (Source: Giesecke & Devrient (http://www.gi-de.com/usa/en/about_g_d/press/press_releases/G%26D-Presents-World's-First-Nano-SIM-Card-g17024.jsp))
As we noted in the our report earlier this week, a part leak (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/05/01/claimed-iphone-5-sim-card-tray-appears-identical-to-iphone-4s/) back in early May suggested that Apple would continue to use micro-SIMs in the next-generation iPhone, but with the new nano-SIM standard backed by Apple having been approved last month (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/06/01/new-nano-sim-standard-approved-40-smaller-than-micro-sim/) the company may already be pushing forward to adopt it as a space-saving measure.

Article Link: Carriers Reportedly Testing Nano-SIMs for Apple Ahead of Next-Generation iPhone Launch (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/07/19/carriers-reportedly-testing-nano-sims-for-apple-ahead-of-next-generation-iphone-launch/)



ThatsMeRight
Jul 19, 2012, 09:02 AM
If Apple is supplying the nano-sim adapters, than I believe they'll adopt nano-SIMs in the next-generation iPhone (and perhaps in a 3G/4G 7.85"-iPad). :)

Mad-B-One
Jul 19, 2012, 09:04 AM
I suspected they would use a cascading card like the one in the picture. So, the stockpiling is just making sure that they have enough SIM regardless which phone will be bought. Since it is going towards Chrismas sales in that quater, it would be foolish to believe that the stockpile is only for the iPhone update. The above system would basically fit in all GSM, right?

lifeinhd
Jul 19, 2012, 09:07 AM
I understand the need for testing, but isn't a nano SIM just a micro SIM that's been literally cut down? So what exactly is the need for so many carriers to test it as though it's a brand new card?

autrefois
Jul 19, 2012, 09:10 AM
I'm waiting for the Invisa (http://chandaxi.posterous.com/the-ipod-invisa) SIM card.

appleguy123
Jul 19, 2012, 09:16 AM
Why does it need to be tested? Isn't it exactly the same as a microsim with less plastic?

Nahaz
Jul 19, 2012, 09:17 AM
I said this in a previous post that if you look closely at the nano SIM the gold contacts are close to the sides.

I'm guessing they might be looking at the nano SIM holder and whether it's causing the SIM to short out on the body of the phone. This could also be the case for other phone companies as well.

bartonlynch
Jul 19, 2012, 09:18 AM
I understand the need for testing, but isn't a nano SIM just a micro SIM that's been literally cut down? So what exactly is the need for so many carriers to test it as though it's a brand new card?

It's thinner too. .67 mm, while all before were .76 mm.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subscriber_identity_module#Formats

Apple Key
Jul 19, 2012, 09:22 AM
It makes sense to remove all the unnecessary plastic around it. Eventually all cell phone makers will benefit from the smaller size.

I wonder what actually needs testing though.

Diode
Jul 19, 2012, 09:28 AM
It makes sense to remove all the unnecessary plastic around it. Eventually all cell phone makers will benefit from the smaller size.

I wonder what actually needs testing though.

It's standard practice when you introduce anything new into a system.

It's a newly manufactured and designed device - anything could go wrong from a design flaw to a manufacturing defect.

cvaldes
Jul 19, 2012, 09:30 AM
Why does it need to be tested? Isn't it exactly the same as a microsim with less plastic?
It's a rumor from BGR.

They're about as accurate and credible as Digitimes. Which means the rumor is likely wrong.

MacRumors is loathe to admit the credibility track record of its sources. They'd rather just have the page views without making any indication about the possible veracity of their sources.

Just read MacRumors as if it were science fiction. Most of the rumors here end up being false, so you should expect this site to be much more fiction than fact.

rmwebs
Jul 19, 2012, 09:34 AM
If Apple is supplying the nano-sim adapters, than I believe they'll adopt nano-SIMs in the next-generation iPhone (and perhaps in a 3G/4G 7.85"-iPad). :)

I assume you mean Nano-Sim to Micro-Sim adaptors as it's obviously not possible to adapt the other way. Why would Apple need to provide such an adaptor though?

Simplicated
Jul 19, 2012, 09:35 AM
It's a rumor from BGR.

They're about as accurate and credible as Digitimes. Which means the rumor is likely wrong.

MacRumors is loathe to admit the credibility track record of its sources. They'd rather just have the page views without making any indication about the possible veracity of their sources.

Just read MacRumors as if it were science fiction. Most of the rumors here end up being false, so you should expect this site to be much more fiction than fact.

I should start reading MacFacts :D

goosnarrggh
Jul 19, 2012, 09:44 AM
Do they really need to keep delivering the original, full-sized Smart Card form factor? How many phones based on that card layout are still in the wild at this point?

Couldn't they save a whole lot of waste plastic if they only mass-produced punch-outs for the form factors that are still widely used?

Radio
Jul 19, 2012, 09:46 AM
how exiting .. not!


why not get rid of the sim all together?

the damn cable companies and telephone companies are just too evil

amorya
Jul 19, 2012, 09:48 AM
how exiting .. not!


why not get rid of the sim all together?

the damn cable companies and telephone companies are just too evil

A SIM card is great for consumers.

It means that if you buy a phone outright, a carrier can have no say about whether you can use it on their network —*just put your SIM card in it and it works.

If SIM cards didn't exist, you wouldn't be able to do that, or borrow a friend's phone when your battery is low, or use a foreign network when you're abroad to avoid huge bills, unless you phoned your carrier each time and got their permission.

brock2621
Jul 19, 2012, 09:51 AM
Nope... not from these leaked parts

http://weekly.ascii.jp/elem/000/000/094/94659/20120622ACCN_001_cs1e1_480x.jpg

JHankwitz
Jul 19, 2012, 09:59 AM
I understand the need for testing, but isn't a nano SIM just a micro SIM that's been literally cut down?

If life were only that easy. I'm sure you know that anything that can go wrong will go wrong. Better safe than sorry, and have everyone double check to minimize problems.

Mad Mac Maniac
Jul 19, 2012, 10:19 AM
I should start reading MacFacts :D

exactly!

MacFacts: We tell you what the next Apple product will be... after it's been officially announced!

chrmjenkins
Jul 19, 2012, 10:23 AM
I understand the need for testing, but isn't a nano SIM just a micro SIM that's been literally cut down? So what exactly is the need for so many carriers to test it as though it's a brand new card?

No, or at least, not necessarily.

Look at this image (actually from a macrumors story)

http://cdn.macrumors.com/article-new/2012/05/nanosim-500x375.jpg

The contacts are different. Also, the mechanics are different. You have to make sure the trays operate properly, the cards don't get damaged, aren't prone to losing electrical contact because this one is thinner and getting errant "no SIM" messages (some customers have experienced this before on previous iPhones), etc.

Mad-B-One
Jul 19, 2012, 10:25 AM
Do they really need to keep delivering the original, full-sized Smart Card form factor? How many phones based on that card layout are still in the wild at this point?

Couldn't they save a whole lot of waste plastic if they only mass-produced punch-outs for the form factors that are still widely used?

This is just to print all the information on it. Some carriers probably have docking stations for that one as well - plug it in and you can copy contacts on it and so on before you crack it into pieces.

Also: Not everyone has such a good eye sight that they can read all the stuff on the back of the nano SIM.

cube
Jul 19, 2012, 10:44 AM
So, touching the contacts does not matter?

david803sc
Jul 19, 2012, 10:44 AM
Does anyone know if there are any Sim Card Collectors out there? :) with all this buzz about the new Apple Nano-Sim Cards, it just got me to thinking I have two original Sim Cards from the now defunct Omnipoint in New York City, these are the full credit card sized from the 1990's, I had to slide the entire card into the phone, one card has a picture of the statue of liberty and one has the WTC, I will have to scan them in and add them to my post. This is a great way to show how technology is changing and getting smaller!

JayTruth
Jul 19, 2012, 10:46 AM
So how do I use my current T-Mobile Sim on the new iphone?

chrmjenkins
Jul 19, 2012, 10:46 AM
So, touching the contacts does not matter?

Why would they exist if it didn't matter if you touched them?

Starship77
Jul 19, 2012, 10:48 AM
I'm waiting for the Invisa (http://chandaxi.posterous.com/the-ipod-invisa) SIM card.

I wish they called this SIM card the "Pequeño SIM"! :D:D

cvaldes
Jul 19, 2012, 10:49 AM
No, or at least, not necessarily.

Look at this image (actually from a macrumors story)

Image (http://cdn.macrumors.com/article-new/2012/05/nanosim-500x375.jpg)

The contacts are different. Also, the mechanics are different. You have to make sure the trays operate properly, the cards don't get damaged, aren't prone to losing electrical contact because this one is thinner and getting errant "no SIM" messages (some customers have experienced this before on previous iPhones), etc.
The cards are the same thickness which is why a nano-SIM, micro-SIM, or mini-SIM can all be punched out of the original standard SIM card.

The contact placement is always the same, it's just that different manufacturers vary the way they cover the contact area. There's a precise target area, plus a radius of variance that the contact needs to support, because individual cards and slots will vary a bit once they are inserted.

Trust me, I have about six SIM cards (one from T-Mobile, maybe three from AT&T, two from Truphone, and my Straight Talk SIM) and all of them look a little different.

If you get a "no SIM" error, pull out the tray and card, reseat, then re-insert.

mex4eric
Jul 19, 2012, 10:55 AM
So, touching the contacts does not matter?

That gold looking plating may actually be gold, which should be impervious to body oils and acids, being a "noble" metal.

DanielCoffey
Jul 19, 2012, 10:59 AM
But sweat, being a good conductor, will bridge the contacts... for the same reason you shouldn't touch button batteries.

cube
Jul 19, 2012, 11:00 AM
That gold looking plating may actually be gold, which should be impervious to body oils and acids, being a "noble" metal.

I was not even going that far, but just thinking about ESD.

It looks like the ESD protection is continuously improved.

chrmjenkins
Jul 19, 2012, 11:02 AM
The cards are the same thickness which is why a nano-SIM, micro-SIM, or mini-SIM can all be punched out of the original standard SIM card.

It's thinner too. .67 mm, while all before were .76 mm.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subscriber_identity_module#Formats


The contact placement is always the same, it's just that different manufacturers vary the way they cover the contact area. There's a precise target area, plus a radius of variance that the contact needs to support, because individual cards and slots will vary a bit once they are inserted.

Trust me, I have about six SIM cards (one from T-Mobile, maybe three from AT&T, two from Truphone, and my Straight Talk SIM) and all of them look a little different.

If you get a "no SIM" error, pull out the tray and card, reseat, then re-insert.

Yes, and they have thousands of usage scenarios and seating attempts to collect data from if they deploy to carriers early. Plus damage could manifest differently. Having tight target areas and tolerances isn't an open and shut case when you have so many usage scenarios and possibilities for error or defect.

cvaldes
Jul 19, 2012, 11:08 AM
It's thinner too. .67 mm, while all before were .76 mm.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subscriber_identity_module#Formats
That's interesting, I was erroneously under the assumption that the nano SIM was the same thickness as the three previous SIM formats.

For some devices, a trimmed down mini SIM or micro SIM card wouldn't work. I've trimmed down mini SIM cards to micro SIM size and used the altered SIM in mini SIM devices with adapters, but those devices have sloppier tolerances than the iPhone or iPad SIM card tray.

Thus, it is unlikely that a nano SIM trimmed down from a large (and thicker) card could work in a device designed for the nano SIM, but a micro SIM or mini SIM device could use the nano SIM with the proper adapter.

Westyfield2
Jul 19, 2012, 11:12 AM
Why does it need to be tested? Isn't it exactly the same as a microsim with less plastic?

This.

Nightarchaon
Jul 19, 2012, 11:19 AM
Nope... not from these leaked parts

Image (http://weekly.ascii.jp/elem/000/000/094/94659/20120622ACCN_001_cs1e1_480x.jpg)

From those parts it would appear they are going back to a full size sim, so i unbelieve these are accurate.

chrmjenkins
Jul 19, 2012, 11:25 AM
This.

Read the thread. It's not the same. It has a different thickness.

lostngone
Jul 19, 2012, 11:42 AM
Why does it need to be tested? Isn't it exactly the same as a microsim with less plastic?

It may look very simple when you think about it. However in reality as soon as you don't test something as stupid as this is when you have the worst issues.

tbrinkma
Jul 19, 2012, 12:34 PM
No, or at least, not necessarily.

Look at this image (actually from a macrumors story)

Image (http://cdn.macrumors.com/article-new/2012/05/nanosim-500x375.jpg)

The contacts are different. Also, the mechanics are different. You have to make sure the trays operate properly, the cards don't get damaged, aren't prone to losing electrical contact because this one is thinner and getting errant "no SIM" messages (some customers have experienced this before on previous iPhones), etc.

The contacts on the micro- and nano-SIM cards in that picture are electrically identical. There are many stylistic changes which can be made to the contact which have absolutely no impact on it's functionality. If you find SIMs from several different manufacturers, you'll already find differences like these on the contacts, even on the same size SIM card.

----------

From those parts it would appear they are going back to a full size sim, so i unbelieve these are accurate.

None of those parts look *anything* like what you'd need to support a full-size SIM card, which is roughly the size of a credit card.

chrmjenkins
Jul 19, 2012, 12:44 PM
The contacts on the micro- and nano-SIM cards in that picture are electrically identical. There are many stylistic changes which can be made to the contact which have absolutely no impact on it's functionality. If you find SIMs from several different manufacturers, you'll already find differences like these on the contacts, even on the same size SIM card.

Yes, and as I pointed out, the potential problems are mechanical in nature, causing electrical problems.

Colpeas
Jul 19, 2012, 04:09 PM
Good. I never really understood the presence of that useless plastic piece surrounding the actual chip.

iSayuSay
Jul 19, 2012, 08:45 PM
Question is: Why Apple didn't make this jump from the start?
It's the same SIMcard minus the card part, nothing new really. So why bother with microSIM in the first place ... just save the space already from the beginning?

MicroSIM is PITA enough, I have to cut SIM myself when travel abroad and use local carrier since it's a bizzaro standard already. Now this?

Oopps .. didn't read about thickness .. scrap it already

markie
Jul 20, 2012, 01:29 AM
Do they really need to keep delivering the original, full-sized Smart Card form factor? How many phones based on that card layout are still in the wild at this point?

Couldn't they save a whole lot of waste plastic if they only mass-produced punch-outs for the form factors that are still widely used?

VERY few, that's why NOT all carriers still use a full size form factor - example, Orange in the UK it comes on a half-credit card size piece of plastic :p