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ixodes
Jul 22, 2012, 08:46 AM
Here's an excerpt from an interesting article for those who are thinking about a Nexus 7

"The Nexus 7 has only been in my hands for a few days, yet it has already changed my habits of using a tablet. That is the mark of a device that is a good fit for what I do. The 7-inch tablet is very comfortable to carry and use, and that is the big draw of the tablet from Google."

"The 7-inch tablet is perfect for consuming media, especially reading ebooks, and the Nexus 7 the best of the lot due to its light form. I use the Kindle app for reading, but there are several alternatives in Android for those who prefer those.

The Nexus 7 ships with the Chrome browser as the default browser, and it may be the best mobile browser on any platform. It works smoothly on the Nexus 7, and the ability to have all bookmarks at hand is priceless. I also find it useful to see the last web sites visited on every device on which I use Chrome."


source:http://www.zdnet.com/nexus-7-hands-on-form-and-function-meet-flash-and-panache-7000001332/



nishishei
Jul 22, 2012, 09:44 AM
Too bad the screen is so washed out and littered with problems such as flickering on autobright. You'd think that would be an important consideration on a tablet which is just a screen. Hard to read that ebook on the perfect form factor when your screen flickers like it's on acid on low brightness settings.

blackhand1001
Jul 22, 2012, 11:51 AM
Too bad the screen is so washed out and littered with problems such as flickering on autobright. You'd think that would be an important consideration on a tablet which is just a screen. Hard to read that ebook on the perfect form factor when your screen flickers like it's on acid on low brightness settings.

Those two issues are software related. They have to do with the tegra 3s gpu drivers. Expect an update pretty soon to solve it. The HTC one x tegra 3 version had similar issues at launch.

freudling
Jul 22, 2012, 12:30 PM
Those two issues are software related. They have to do with the tegra 3s gpu drivers. Expect an update pretty soon to solve it. The HTC one x tegra 3 version had similar issues at launch.

It's not that. The screen is washed out. It's the IPS LED they decided to use. Colour saturation is very poor and resolution is bad compared to the Retina. When you're surrounded by Retina screens like I am it's virtually impossible to downgrade to a screen like this.

nfl46
Jul 22, 2012, 12:33 PM
It's not that. The screen is washed out. It's the IPS LED they decided to use. Colour saturation is very poor and resolution is bad compared to the Retina. When you're surrounded by Retina screens like I am it's virtually impossible to downgrade to a screen like this.

You're comparing a $500 iPad 3 retina screen to a $200 IPS Led screen? They probably didn't put a high resolution and front facing camera to cut costs. And the screen isn't that bad at all. No tablet can compare to the iPad 3 screen right now.

batting1000
Jul 22, 2012, 12:54 PM
You're comparing a $500 iPad 3 retina screen to a $200 IPS Led screen? They probably didn't put a high resolution and front facing camera to cut costs. And the screen isn't that bad at all. No tablet can compare to the iPad 3 screen right now.

The Nexus 7 has both an HD 1280-by-800 display AND a front facing camera. Not saying it's better than the iPad, but it does have those two things which you said it didn't have.

ixodes
Jul 22, 2012, 01:14 PM
My what fertile imaginations from those who may not even know what a Nexus 7 is. Google search is one way to educate yourselves.

It's Apples fault anyway, if they weren't so late to wake up & see the light, I'd have bought a 7" iPad long ago.

Sadly it's still vaporware.

So if you're feeling insecure or angry, like your posts suggest, you might want to blame the company with the fruity logo. Go ahead, bash away :)

freudling
Jul 22, 2012, 03:57 PM
You're comparing a $500 iPad 3 retina screen to a $200 IPS Led screen? They probably didn't put a high resolution and front facing camera to cut costs. And the screen isn't that bad at all. No tablet can compare to the iPad 3 screen right now.

I paid $250 for the Nexus 7 in Canada. I paid $99 for my iPhone 4S.

I don't care about cheap stuff. I care about what works and what's available. I could go out a buy a really cheap car... the point is, is it any good?

Zillions of people are buying iPads. It's not the price: it's that it's a compelling piece of technology. If we're going to review a "competing" product, it can't just be based on price. It's about whether the product is any good.

TheMacBookPro
Jul 22, 2012, 04:05 PM
I paid $250 for the Nexus 7 in Canada. I paid $99 for my iPhone 4S.

Skipping the part about a mandatory contract vs no contract is always a great way to prove your point.

freudling
Jul 22, 2012, 04:23 PM
Skipping the part about a mandatory contract vs no contract is always a great way to prove your point.

Sure, but it's not $200. It's $250. That's half the cost of an iPad.

Reality: something could cost $1 and nobody may need it. It's irrelevant how much it costs. Is it USEFUL to people or is it a complete waste of money, no matter how cheap it is?

My view is it's a waste and sales will fall off of a cliff.

After a few months have past, I can't wait to see all of you make a bunch of excuses as to why it's not sticking.

blackhand1001
Jul 22, 2012, 09:26 PM
It's not that. The screen is washed out. It's the IPS LED they decided to use. Colour saturation is very poor and resolution is bad compared to the Retina. When you're surrounded by Retina screens like I am it's virtually impossible to downgrade to a screen like this.

Aree you kidding. The pixel density of the nexus 7 is very close to that if the retina ipad. Its only a little lower. It is much better than the ipad 2s. From a normal viewing distanc you can't make out pixels. Even when looking close you really have to look for them. The colors on the nexus are fine as well.

Technarchy
Jul 22, 2012, 09:34 PM
It's Apples fault anyway, if they weren't so late to wake up & see the light, I'd have bought a 7" iPad long ago.



That's funny considering there would be no modern tablet revolution had it not been for the iPad.

freudling
Jul 22, 2012, 09:55 PM
Aree you kidding. The pixel density of the nexus 7 is very close to that if the retina ipad. Its only a little lower. It is much better than the ipad 2s. From a normal viewing distanc you can't make out pixels. Even when looking close you really have to look for them. The colors on the nexus are fine as well.

Really? YOU ARE WRONG.

iPad 3 ppi: 264 ppi
Nexus 7: 149 ppi

The iPad has 115 MORE ppi than the Nexus. The difference is substantial. And yes, you can see pixels. The Nexus is grainy, and I'm not the first who has said this on these forums.

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That's funny considering there would be no modern tablet revolution had it not been for the iPad.

This.

TheMacBookPro
Jul 22, 2012, 10:14 PM
Really? YOU ARE WRONG.

iPad 3 ppi: 264 ppi
Nexus 7: 149 ppi

The iPad has 115 MORE ppi than the Nexus. The difference is substantial. And yes, you can see pixels. The Nexus is grainy, and I'm not the first who has said this on these forums.

If you're going to make a claim as boldly as that, you really ought to check your numbers before making a complete fool of yourself.

The Nexus 7 has a PPI of approximately 216ppi.

YOU ARE WRONG.

Renzatic
Jul 22, 2012, 10:15 PM
Really? YOU ARE WRONG.

iPad 3 ppi: 264 ppi
Nexus 7: 149 ppi

The iPad has 115 MORE ppi than the Nexus. The difference is substantial. And yes, you can see pixels. The Nexus is grainy, and I'm not the first who has said this on these forums.

1280x800 at 7 inches is 216 PPI, guy. The iPad 3 only has 48 more PP's.

The Nexus 7 is hardly grainy, though not quite as sharp as the retina iPad. Not that a vast majority of people would notice.

It's not that. The screen is washed out. It's the IPS LED they decided to use. Colour saturation is very poor and resolution is bad compared to the Retina. When you're surrounded by Retina screens like I am it's virtually impossible to downgrade to a screen like this.

You do realize the iPad is also an IPS TFT display, right? Retina isn't a type of screen, rather a marketing term denoting it's high pixel density.

Deslock
Jul 22, 2012, 10:34 PM
It's not that. The screen is washed out. It's the IPS LED they decided to use. Colour saturation is very poor and resolution is bad compared to the Retina. When you're surrounded by Retina screens like I am it's virtually impossible to downgrade to a screen like this.

Though Android doesn't antialias text as nicely as iOS, the Nexus 7's resolution being lower than the iPad3 (and Transformer Pad Infinity) doesn't bother me. 1280x800 on a 7" screen means its DPI is low enough that stuff doesn't need to be double-pixelated, and its DPI is high enough that jagged edges aren't especially annoying.

The Nexus 7's screen quality in terms of vibrance and viewing angles is only slightly better than the iPod touch, which is to say it's inferior to the iPad, iPhone, and Galaxy Nexus (AMOLED), but is still usable.

At this price point I can't complain. GameStop had a promotion for 50% extra trade-in credit (I got $41 for ~6 old Wii games) and they gave me a $25 GameStop Giftcard (in addition to the $25 Google Play credit).

Because of the Nexus 7's weight and size, I prefer it for reading and portability. I look forward to trying out the upcoming iPad mini.

freudling
Jul 22, 2012, 10:58 PM
1280x800 at 7 inches is 216 PPI, guy. The iPad 3 only has 48 more PP's.

The Nexus 7 is hardly grainy, though not quite as sharp as the retina iPad. Not that a vast majority of people would notice.



You do realize the iPad is also an IPS TFT display, right? Retina isn't a type of screen, rather a marketing term denoting it's high pixel density.

Yes I know Retina is a marketing term, and I do stand corrected: the iPad 3 only has 48 more PPI than the Nexus 7. That is SIGNIFICANT and my point stands. You are wrong: it is a large jump in PPI from the Nexus 7 to the iPad 3.

Renzatic
Jul 22, 2012, 11:04 PM
Yes I know Retina is a marketing term, and I do stand corrected: the iPad 3 only has 48 more PPI than the Nexus 7. That is SIGNIFICANT and my point stands. You are wrong: it is a large jump in PPI from the Nexus 7 to the iPad 3.

Not that big. Anything over 200 PPI is going to be sharp. Maybe not quite retina sharp, but definitely clear.

freudling
Jul 22, 2012, 11:25 PM
Not that big. Anything over 200 PPI is going to be sharp. Maybe not quite retina sharp, but definitely clear.

48 PPI is a massive jump in pixel density. It's huge.

TheMacBookPro
Jul 22, 2012, 11:28 PM
48 PPI is a massive jump in pixel density. It's huge.

Not when the lower PPI is already fairly high. FWIW, I have 20/20 vision and I cannot see a difference in clarity between my MacBook Pro with Retina display, iPad 3rd generation and Nexus 7. They're all pin-sharp.
If you're really having issues with text being grainy, there is likely a hardware issue with your product and you should either get a replacement (or in your case, a refund sounds like the better choice?).

freudling
Jul 22, 2012, 11:48 PM
Not when the lower PPI is already fairly high. FWIW, I have 20/20 vision and I cannot see a difference in clarity between my MacBook Pro with Retina display, iPad 3rd generation and Nexus 7. They're all pin-sharp.
If you're really having issues with text being grainy, there is likely a hardware issue with your product and you should either get a replacement (or in your case, a refund sounds like the better choice?).

What is "fairly high"? And who determines what that is? Second, it is a fact that the images on a Retina display are noticeably more clear and sharper than than the Nexus 7. Anyone who says otherwise doesn't have very good vision.

Second, POST PICTURES OF YOUR NEXUS 7. Immediately, or else stop participating in these threads because we know that you're lying and don't actually own one.

Renzatic
Jul 22, 2012, 11:49 PM
48 PPI is a massive jump in pixel density. It's huge.

It's like a 23% difference in PPs. That's not massive at all. If you were to hover both tablets 3 inches in front of your face and stare at it for a few, you'd probably be more likely to notice the pixels in the Nex before the ipad. But at regular viewing distance? The difference is practically nil.

I'm with Macbook above. If the text looks grainy and unreadable, you've probably got a faulty tablet. Or you went out and spent $200 just so you could come on here and say "I know it sucks! I bought one and it BLOOOOOWWWWWSSS".

TheMacBookPro
Jul 23, 2012, 12:07 AM
What is "fairly high"? And who determines what that is? Second, it is a fact that the images on a Retina display are noticeably more clear and sharper than than the Nexus 7. Anyone who says otherwise doesn't have very good vision.

I have 20/20 vision. Good enough for you?

Unfortunately, when talking about clarity, it's never a fact, whether or not you like it.

Second, POST PICTURES OF YOUR NEXUS 7. Immediately, or else stop participating in these threads because we know that you're lying and don't actually own one.

Nooo! You totally caught me out with your incredible knowledge of how I don't actually own one! :eek:

http://i1190.photobucket.com/albums/z451/yamanote/IMAG0316_2.jpg

I bet you feel dumb now. Don't worry, I would if I made stupid accusations like that too.

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 12:10 AM
It's like a 23% difference in PPs. That's not massive at all. If you were to hover both tablets 3 inches in front of your face and stare at it for a few, you'd probably be more likely to notice the pixels in the Nex before the ipad. But at regular viewing distance? The difference is practically nil.

I'm with Macbook above. If the text looks grainy and unreadable, you've probably got a faulty tablet. Or you went out and spent $200 just so you could come on here and say "I know it sucks! I bought one and it BLOOOOOWWWWWSSS".

There are other people on here saying it looks grainy too. This is NOT just me. And 23% pixel density is what separates Apple between others: they consistently outclass their competitors by offering more advanced, better technology with as good or better battery life. 23% is a massive engineering feat with the display technology they're dealing with. And yes, the Sexus DOES look grainy.

And I won't even get into the fact that in order for the Sexus to qualify as Retina, you'd need MORE PPI than the iPad 3 because you naturally hold the smaller device, the Sexus, closer to your face. It'd be closer to 300 ppi to qualify as a Retina.

----------

I have 20/20 vision. Good enough for you?

Unfortunately, when talking about clarity, it's never a fact, whether or not you like it.



Nooo! You totally caught me out with your incredible knowledge of how I don't actually own one! :eek:

http://i1190.photobucket.com/albums/z451/yamanote/IMAG0316_2.jpg

I bet you feel dumb now. Don't worry, I would if I made stupid accusations like that too.

It is a fact and it is reality. There is no denying it. Apple's Retina screens offer some of the best clarity out of any screen because at the distance a user holds it from their face they CANNOT reliably discern individual pixels on the screen.

TheMacBookPro
Jul 23, 2012, 12:11 AM
And yes, the Sexus DOES look grainy.

Faulty product for sure. Please exchange it, I'm sure Asus would be very interested to see the issue with your product.

It is a fact and it is reality. There is no denying it. Apple's Retina screens offer some of the best clarity out of any screen because at the distance a user holds it from their face they CANNOT reliably discern individual pixels on the screen.

Why are you avoiding the fact that I've just proven your baseless accusation about me not actually owning a Nexus 7 to be completely wrong? Were you expecting me to leave this thread and never return? :D

I cannot discern individual pixels on the screen on the Nexus 7, or my Retina Display MacBook Pro, or my iPad 3, or my HTC One X. That is a fact. Maybe your eyes are much better than mine?

kylera
Jul 23, 2012, 12:12 AM
Times like now, I'm kinda glad the 7 isn't available in Korea yet, so these issues can be ironed out first.

Renzatic
Jul 23, 2012, 12:24 AM
There are other people on here saying it looks grainy too. This is NOT just me. And 23% pixel density is what separates Apple between others: they consistently outclass their competitors by offering more advanced, better technology with as good or better battery life. 23% is a massive engineering feat with the display technology they're dealing with. And yes, the Sexus DOES look grainy.

It's 23%, man! It's like if the Nexus 7 were 4 PPI, the iPad would be 5. It isn't the difference between a pixelated mess of blah and gloriously clear like a sunrise on a fresh spring morning. IT'S 23%!

You're basically arguing Apple computers outclass the competition because they're marginally better. And that's exactly what the difference between the two are PPI-wise: marginal.

And Sexus? Really? That sounds less like you're making fun of it, and more like you're going to slap on some Berry White and tell it to put on that pair of leopard print panties you bought it last week. Seriously. Call it Suxus. It's less creepy.

----------

And I won't even get into the fact that in order for the Sexus to qualify as Retina, you'd need MORE PPI than the iPad 3 because you naturally hold the smaller device, the Sexus, closer to your face. It'd be closer to 300 ppi to qualify as a Retina.

It would have to be a higher PPI rating for it to classify as true retina, but not quite 300. 1680x1050 for a 7" device would probably suffice.

AND QUIT CALLING IT SEXUS! It's creepy.

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 12:32 AM
Faulty product for sure. Please exchange it, I'm sure Asus would be very interested to see the issue with your product.

Why are you avoiding the fact that I've just proven your baseless accusation about me not actually owning a Nexus 7 to be completely wrong? Were you expecting me to leave this thread and never return? :D

I cannot discern individual pixels on the screen on the Nexus 7, or my Retina Display MacBook Pro, or my iPad 3, or my HTC One X. That is a fact. Maybe your eyes are much better than mine?

Wrong, wrong, wrong. The reason the text is grainy is because of a fact:

Because the ppi are too low, the average human eye can see individual pixels, a problem that is not present with Retina screens.

TheMacBookPro
Jul 23, 2012, 12:33 AM
Wrong, wrong, wrong. The reason the text is grainy is because of a fact:

Because the ppi are too low, the average human eye can see individual pixels, a problem that is not present with Retina screens.

Using that logic, the Nexus 7's screen is a 'Retina display' too, because I cannot see the individual pixels on mine, and text appears perfectly sharp.

I hope you don't mind me asking- what is your visual acuity?

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 12:39 AM
It's 23%, man! It's like if the Nexus 7 were 4 PPI, the iPad would be 5. It isn't the difference between a pixelated mess of blah and gloriously clear like a sunrise on a fresh spring morning. IT'S 23%!

You're basically arguing Apple computers outclass the competition because they're marginally better. And that's exactly what the difference between the two are PPI-wise: marginal.

And Sexus? Really? That sounds less like you're making fun of it, and more like you're going to slap on some Berry White and tell it to put on that pair of leopard print panties you bought it last week. Seriously. Call it Suxus. It's less creepy.

----------



It would have to be a higher PPI rating for it to classify as true retina, but not quite 300. 1680x1050 for a 7" device would probably suffice.

AND QUIT CALLING IT SEXUS! It's creepy.

The Retina has noticeably better colour saturation and has virtually indiscernable individual pixels. Review after review and users attest to the fact that the Retina screen is noticeable in terms of its sharpness and these attributes. To try and argue that a Retina screen is only marginally better than non-Retinas ignores science and objective reality.

Renzatic
Jul 23, 2012, 12:43 AM
Wrong, wrong, wrong. The reason the text is grainy is because of a fact:

Because the ppi are too low, the average human eye can see individual pixels, a problem that is not present with Retina screens.

It's like you're suffering from...I dunno...suggested thinking or something. There's a specific phrase for it, but hell if I can remember what it is. But anyway, to you, because the screen falls below the standards of what's considered retina, it's just flat out awful. There's no comparison. It's horrible. It doesn't match up to this arbitrary standard, and therefore it's trash.

That doesn't mean it is, you just believe it to be. In your head, the potential to see the pixels means means you force yourself to see them. Notice every little flaw.

But also, 20/20 vision is the nominal. There are actually people out there who might be able to see the individual pixels on an iPad 3. Not that it matters much to them, because high res is high res, regardless if one is more high res than the other.

----------

To try and argue that a Retina screen is only marginally better than non-Retinas ignores science and objective reality.

It is marginally better because it is. It's 23% more pixels. It's not a big difference. NOT. A. BIG. DIFFERENCE.

Why am I even arguing this with you? You're splitting hairs over absolutely nothing, and trying to back it up with something you really don't completely understand. Other than "well science has determined blah blah blah it's COLD HARD FACTS, MAN. YOU CAN'T ARGUE SCIENCE".

TheMacBookPro
Jul 23, 2012, 12:44 AM
The Retina has noticeably better colour saturation and has virtually indiscernable individual pixels. Review after review and users attest to the fact that the Retina screen is noticeable in terms of its sharpness and these attributes. To try and argue that a Retina screen is only marginally better than non-Retinas ignores science and objective reality.

As do reviews of the Nexus 7!

Budget tablets typically make the biggest sacrifices on the display front, and certainly the 1,024 x 600 resolution on the Kindle Fire feels a bit constricting at this point. Not so with the Nexus 7, which is fronted by a very nice 1,280 x 800 IPS panel rated at 400 nits of brightness. While more pixels is always better -- the new iPad and its Retina display having made us yearn for ridiculously high resolutions in all our devices -- WXGA feels perfectly adequate here. Text is rendered very well and 720p videos look great.

Much of that, though, is thanks to the other, less quantifiable aspects of the screen. Viewing angles are top-notch, with contrast staying strong regardless of which side you're coming from. And, it's plenty bright, too, a properly nice screen that, like everything else here, is just a little nicer than you'd expect given the cost.

The Nexus 7 has a 7-inch, back-lit IPS display at 1280x800 resolution. That checks in at 216 pixels per inch, compared to the 264 of the "retina" display on the new iPad and 132 ppi on the previous model iPads. It's also covered with "Scratch-resistant Corning glass" which certainly sounds like Gorilla Glass. The viewing angle is wide, with the screen seeming bright and easy to see at almost a full 180-degrees. The only real drawback is the glossy finish, which makes viewing it outdoors difficult. You'll have to crank the brightness the whole way up and shade it with your hand if you want to use the Nexus 7 poolside. But it's not like every other tablet out there doesn't have this problem, too.
Video and gaming looks great on the device, with vibrant color and crisp text. The Nexus 7 makes for a great e-reader if you're the type who likes to curl up with a good book. Everything you'd want to do on an entertainment-consumption device is done well on the Nexus 7, and you'll be more than happy while using it.

Again, it’s really hard to believe we’re looking at a $200 priced tablet because it’s sporting one pleasant looking 7” WXGA (1280 x 800) IPS display with Gorilla Glass to give it strength. Indeed, it’s not the most cutting-edge thing we’ve seen out there, but for a 7-inch tablet, it’s something head above water from most of the pack. For starters, its resolution is rarely seen in the 7-inch form factor, which delivers a respectable pixel density of 216 ppi. Therefore, it’s able to produce sharp details that make even the tiniest and faintest of text exquisitely legible to the eye.

In fact this is a tablet that is ruthlessly functional – its screen is excellent (1280x800 is passable HD), its battery life an implausible nine hours that kept me entertained from London to San Francisco, its speed powered by an advanced quad-core processor that seems at 1.3GHz to respond more intuitively than ever to the touch of an impatient user’s fingers.

It may not be best-in-class, but it's better than what you should expect from a tablet of this price and it's certainly better than what your claims would suggest.

Renzatic
Jul 23, 2012, 12:50 AM
You want the Nexus 7 to be true retina? Hold it a couple of inches farther out from you face than you would an iPad. BAM! RETINA LIKE A FLAT OUT MOFO!

...which kinda proves how truly vague the retina classification is.

Edit: Actually, I take that back. Hold it at the EXACT SAME AVERAGE DISTANCE from your face you would an iPad 3, because it's a smaller device. You'll have your retina display.

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 12:56 AM
it's like you're suffering from...i dunno...suggested thinking or something. There's a specific phrase for it, but hell if i can remember what it is. But anyway, to you, because the screen falls below the standards of what's considered retina, it's just flat out awful. There's no comparison. It's horrible. It doesn't match up to this arbitrary standard, and therefore it's trash.

That doesn't mean it is, you just believe it to be. In your head, the potential to see the pixels means means you force yourself to see them. Notice every little flaw.

But also, 20/20 vision is the nominal. There are actually people out there who might be able to see the individual pixels on an ipad 3. Not that it matters much to them, because high res is high res, regardless if one is more high res than the other.

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it is marginally better because it is. It's 23% more pixels. It's not a big difference. Not. A. Big. Difference.

Why am i even arguing this with you? You're splitting hairs over absolutely nothing, and trying to back it up with something you really don't completely understand. Other than "well science has determined blah blah blah it's cold hard facts, man. You can't argue science".

23% is. A. Big. Difference.

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As do reviews of the Nexus 7!

It may not be best-in-class, but it's better than what you should expect from a tablet of this price and it's certainly better than what your claims would suggest.

Or you can cherry pick reviews and choose to see whatever you want to see:

Originally Posted by PhoneArena
Again, itís really hard to believe weíre looking at a $200 priced tablet because itís sporting one pleasant looking 7Ē WXGA (1280 x 800) IPS display with Gorilla Glass to give it strength. Indeed, itís not the most cutting-edge thing weíve seen out there, but for a 7-inch tablet, itís something head above water from most of the pack. For starters, its resolution is rarely seen in the 7-inch form factor, which delivers a respectable pixel density of 216 ppi. Therefore, itís able to produce sharp details that make even the tiniest and faintest of text exquisitely legible to the eye.

The screen is grainy compared to a Retina. This is a fact.

Renzatic
Jul 23, 2012, 01:00 AM
Only if you're attempting to win a lame ass argument.

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Therefore, itís able to produce sharp details that make even the tiniest and faintest of text exquisitely legible to the eye.

The screen is grainy compared to a Retina. This is a fact.

...that's you're quoted review. Which only proves us right, and proves you wrong. There is no mention in that block of text that does anything to strengthen your argument.

This is getting dumb. Actually, it got dumb about a page ago. You have no point. You do not know what you're talking about. Quit while the quitting's good. Save some face.

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 01:07 AM
Only if you're attempting to win a lame ass argument.

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...that's you're quoted review. Which only proves us right, and proves you wrong. There is no mention in that block of text that does anything to strengthen your argument.

This is getting dumb. Actually, it got dumb about a page ago. You have no point. You do not know what you're talking about. Quit while the quitting's good. Save some face.

Post pictures of it next to a Retina using the same Webpages. I'll do it if you want me too. Oh wait, I already did it.

http://s675.photobucket.com/albums/vv116/freudling/Suck%20It/

TheMacBookPro
Jul 23, 2012, 01:12 AM
Or you can cherry pick reviews and choose to see whatever you want to see:

I think you're the one cherry picking reviews here- I posted several reviews and you're the one picking on one.

Originally Posted by PhoneArena
Again, it’s really hard to believe we’re looking at a $200 priced tablet because it’s sporting one pleasant looking 7” WXGA (1280 x 800) IPS display with Gorilla Glass to give it strength. Indeed, it’s not the most cutting-edge thing we’ve seen out there, but for a 7-inch tablet, it’s something head above water from most of the pack. For starters, its resolution is rarely seen in the 7-inch form factor, which delivers a respectable pixel density of 216 ppi. Therefore, it’s able to produce sharp details that make even the tiniest and faintest of text exquisitely legible to the eye.

The screen is grainy compared to a Retina. This is a fact.

Nobody was denying that it's not best-in-class, so I'm not sure why you found it necessary to bold that. I even said it in my post. Good to see that you've learned to bold/italicize, rather than just capitalizing everything.

Now you're changing your story. First it's grainy, and now it's grainy compared to a RD. Two very different things. Which is it?

I also find it interesting how you're ignoring some pertinent questions and information posted here... e.g. the image I posted to prove that I have a Nexus 7, the fact that you were completely wrong about the PPI, and the question about your visual acuity. Goes to show what type of poster you are :) (hint: not a good one)

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 01:15 AM
I think you're the one cherry picking reviews here- I posted several reviews and you're the one picking on one.



Nobody was denying that it's not best-in-class, so I'm not sure why you found it necessary to bold that. I even said it in my post. Good to see that you've learned to bold/italicize, rather than just capitalizing everything.

Now you're changing your story. First it's grainy, and now it's grainy compared to a RD. Two very different things. Which is it?

I also find it interesting how you're ignoring some pertinent questions and information posted here... e.g. the image I posted to prove that I have a Nexus 7, the fact that you were completely wrong about the PPI, and the question about your visual acuity. Goes to show what type of poster you are :) (hint: not a good one)

It's grainy period. Not compared to anything. It's grainy. The iPad 3 has a HUGE 48 ppi more than the Sexus and it would take close to 300 ppi for the Sexus to qualify as Retina.

The Retina display is BETTER than the screen on the Nexus because the average person cannot discern the individual pixels on the iPad screen. The ppi on the Sexus is not enough to qualify as a Retina therefore the average person CAN discern individual pixels. Period. End of story.

Renzatic
Jul 23, 2012, 01:19 AM
A huge 48 PPI more!

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 01:20 AM
A huge 48 ppi more!

Look at how crisp this nice big text looks on my iPad 3 and how crap it looks on my Sexus!

TheMacBookPro
Jul 23, 2012, 01:27 AM
Look at how crisp this nice big text looks on my iPad 3 and how crap it looks on my Sexus!

Indeed!

http://i1190.photobucket.com/albums/z451/yamanote/IMAG0318.jpg

It proves that... the iPad's screen is unnaturally yellowish and there's light leaking on the right. Oh well, time for another replacement.

Renzatic
Jul 23, 2012, 01:28 AM
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/3018396/grainy.jpg

...Nexus 7. Those 48 PPs do make a difference.

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 01:33 AM
Indeed!

http://i1190.photobucket.com/albums/z451/yamanote/IMAG0318.jpg

It proves that... the iPad's screen is unnaturally yellowish and there's light leaking on the right. Oh well, time for another replacement.

The Retina display is BETTER than the screen on the Nexus because the average person cannot discern the individual pixels on the iPad screen. The ppi on the Sexus is not enough to qualify as a Retina therefore the average person CAN discern individual pixels. Period. End of story.

Renzatic
Jul 23, 2012, 01:43 AM
The Retina display is BETTER than the screen on the Nexus because the average person cannot discern the individual pixels on the iPad screen. The ppi on the Sexus is not enough to qualify as a Retina therefore the average person CAN discern individual pixels. Period. End of story.

You know Saturn is bigger than Jupiter, right? Does that make Jupiter the better planet?

NO! Because Jupiter has those kick ass rings!

SCIENCE! It's objective as hell.

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 01:46 AM
You know Saturn is bigger than Jupiter, right? Does that make Jupiter the better planet?

NO! Because Jupiter has those kick ass rings!

SCIENCE! It's objective as hell.

The Retina display is BETTER than the screen on the Nexus because the average person cannot discern the individual pixels on the iPad screen. The ppi on the Sexus is not enough to qualify as a Retina therefore the average person CAN discern individual pixels. Period. End of story.

Renzatic
Jul 23, 2012, 01:52 AM
The Retina display is BETTER than the screen on the Nexus because the average person cannot discern the individual pixels on the iPad screen. The ppi on the Sexus is not enough to qualify as a Retina therefore the average person CAN discern individual pixels. Period. End of story.

I got a question for you, man. Serious question this time. I want to see if you can actually count the pixels in these two icons I'm about to post up. See if you can tell me which one is the higher resolution.

Of these two, which one has more pixels...

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/3018396/google_chrome_1.png

or...

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/3018396/google_chrome_2.png

Which one is more crisp? Which one is more....retina?

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 01:56 AM
I got a question for you, man. Serious question this time. I want to see if you can actually count the pixels in these two icons I'm about to post up. See if you can tell me which one is the higher resolution.

Of these two, which one has more pixels...

Image (https://dl.dropbox.com/u/3018396/google_chrome_1.png)

or...

Image (https://dl.dropbox.com/u/3018396/google_chrome_2.png)

Which one is more crisp? Which one is more....retina?

The Retina display is BETTER than the screen on the Nexus because the average person cannot discern the individual pixels on the iPad screen. The ppi on the Sexus is not enough to qualify as a Retina therefore the average person CAN discern individual pixels. Period. End of story.

The pixels are substantially smaller on the Retina screen therefore it's images are sharper and crisper.

Renzatic
Jul 23, 2012, 01:58 AM
You haven't answered my question. Quit repeating the same tired spiel, and answer if you know.

Which of those two icons are more crisp?

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 02:03 AM
You haven't answered my question. Quit repeating the same tired spiel, and answer if you know.

Which of those two icons are more crisp?

They seem to be exactly the same in sharpness. I'll guess and say that the smaller one has half the number of pixels but the bigger one is double the size.

The smaller the pixels the sharper the image is.

The Retina display is BETTER than the screen on the Nexus because the average person cannot discern the individual pixels on the iPad screen. The ppi on the Sexus is not enough to qualify as a Retina therefore the average person CAN discern individual pixels. Period. End of story.

Renzatic
Jul 23, 2012, 02:06 AM
And why are they exactly the same in sharpness, despite one being smaller than the other?

Okay, I'll help you out a bit. Look at it on your Nexus 7. Since it's lower res, you should be able to discern the individual pixels, right?

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 02:08 AM
And why are they exactly the same in sharpness, despite one being smaller than the other?

The Retina display is BETTER than the screen on the Nexus because the average person cannot discern the individual pixels on the iPad screen. The ppi on the Sexus is not enough to qualify as a Retina therefore the average person CAN discern individual pixels. Period. End of story.

Renzatic
Jul 23, 2012, 02:13 AM
I win. You don't know what you're talking about.

Thanks for playing, and good night. :D

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 02:16 AM
I win. You don't know what you're talking about.

Thanks for playing, and good night. :D

I know exactly what you're trying to do, but your assumptions and what you think your conclusions are are flawed, which is why nobody needs to play your game.

Good luck with your life, you'll need it.

Renzatic
Jul 23, 2012, 02:18 AM
Good luck with your life, you'll need it.

I think I'll start by ending this incredibly pointless argument with you.

Look! Things are already improving! The grass looks greener, and the air is...sniff...oh so much sweeter! Ahh. Life is good.

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 02:20 AM
I think I'll start by ending this incredibly pointless argument with you.

Look! Things are already improving! The grass looks greener, and the air is...sniff...oh so much sweeter! Ahh. Life is good.

Life is good.

TheMacBookPro
Jul 23, 2012, 02:26 AM
The Retina display is BETTER than the screen on the Nexus because the average person cannot discern the individual pixels on the iPad screen. The ppi on the Sexus is not enough to qualify as a Retina therefore the average person CAN discern individual pixels. Period. End of story.

Your tired and old copy-and-paste job was rendered irrelevant due to my extremely useful and high resolution image (which you demanded) proving otherwise. Try your spiel another day on another person, because it isn't working here :)

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 02:45 AM
Your tired and old copy-and-paste job was rendered irrelevant due to my extremely useful and high resolution image (which you demanded) proving otherwise. Try your spiel another day on another person, because it isn't working here :)


The Retina display is BETTER than the screen on the Nexus because the average person cannot discern the individual pixels on the iPad screen. The ppi on the Sexus is not enough to qualify as a Retina therefore the average person CAN discern individual pixels. Period. End of story.

jeffe
Jul 23, 2012, 03:39 AM
The only thing that isn't working is your constant personal attacks because you lack a basic understanding of computers and have nothing meaningful to contribute.

The Retina display is BETTER than the screen on the Nexus because the average person cannot discern the individual pixels on the iPad screen. The ppi on the Sexus is not enough to qualify as a Retina therefore the average person CAN discern individual pixels. Period. End of story.

Retina is a better screen but the Nexus does the job well and this is not really an issue for most people.

freudling
Jul 23, 2012, 05:00 AM
Retina is a better screen but the Nexus does the job well and this is not really an issue for most people.

Show the data to support your claim.

Renzatic
Jul 23, 2012, 05:34 AM
Show the data to support your claim.

The countless reviews that have been posted, and the comments concerning the quality of the screen on the device therein?

And please don't post that big block of text you've been firing off every time someone replies to you. If you really want to discuss the issue, rather than give a canned response that means absolutely nothing, you won't do it.

Chundles
Jul 23, 2012, 05:46 AM
You know Saturn is bigger than Jupiter, right? Does that make Jupiter the better planet?

NO! Because Jupiter has those kick ass rings!

SCIENCE! It's objective as hell.

Screw all you guys, THIS is where I take umbridge with this thread.

I couldn't care less about the iPad screen and the Nexus screen (the correct answer is "they're totally different so who cares?" by the way) but when somebody mixes up Saturn and Jupiter on the Internet then I gotta throw down.

You. Yes YOU. Saturn is smaller and has the kick arse rings. It would also float on a sufficiently large enough body of water. Now fix it. FIX IIIITTT....

:D:D;)

Renzatic
Jul 23, 2012, 05:54 AM
Get off Uranus and fix it yourself :P

...I've always wanted to say that.

ixodes
Jul 23, 2012, 05:55 AM
The only thing that isn't working is your constant personal attacks because you lack a basic understanding of computers and have nothing meaningful to contribute.

The Retina display is BETTER than the screen on the Nexus because the average person cannot discern the individual pixels on the iPad screen. The ppi on the Sexus is not enough to qualify as a Retina therefore the average person CAN discern individual pixels. Period. End of story.

By observation, it appears that you're highly attached to being right.

So... You're Right :)

Personally, I find "retina" nice, yet just another brilliant stroke of marketing genius on Apples part.

It's their same old tried and true Apple technique. It's made them billions.

Decide on an existing technology to polish up & use, then give it a cute name to appeal to both sexes. If the name is clever enough, Apple worshipers & the general public will assume Apples invented it and made it "cool". Like "gotta have it" cool.

Continue with cute TV commercials & you've got them hooked.

It's all so "Magical & Revolutionary" :)

Chundles
Jul 23, 2012, 05:56 AM
Get off Uranus and fix it yourself :P

...I've always wanted to say that.

That was good...

Renzatic
Jul 23, 2012, 06:03 AM
Hey, I try my best. :D

ixodes
Jul 23, 2012, 06:07 AM
Hey, I try my best. :D

Nicely played mate :)

wallpaper01
Jul 23, 2012, 10:43 AM
Too bad the screen is so washed out and littered with problems such as flickering on autobright. You'd think that would be an important consideration on a tablet which is just a screen. Hard to read that ebook on the perfect form factor when your screen flickers like it's on acid on low brightness settings.

Sorry have you actually used one? None of that is happening to the 2 that I have purchased...

freudling
Jul 26, 2012, 05:24 PM
The countless reviews that have been posted, and the comments concerning the quality of the screen on the device therein?

And please don't post that big block of text you've been firing off every time someone replies to you. If you really want to discuss the issue, rather than give a canned response that means absolutely nothing, you won't do it.

I'd really like to see the data that supports the claim that the Nexus 7 screen is really good. Or basically equivalent to a Retina screen.

----------

By observation, it appears that you're highly attached to being right.

So... You're Right :)

Personally, I find "retina" nice, yet just another brilliant stroke of marketing genius on Apples part.

It's their same old tried and true Apple technique. It's made them billions.

Decide on an existing technology to polish up & use, then give it a cute name to appeal to both sexes. If the name is clever enough, Apple worshipers & the general public will assume Apples invented it and made it "cool". Like "gotta have it" cool.

Continue with cute TV commercials & you've got them hooked.

It's all so "Magical & Revolutionary" :)

Explain specifically why Apple's Retina screens are not yards better than their previous screens? Explain why it's more marketing... more imaginary than real.

Renzatic
Jul 26, 2012, 06:06 PM
I'd really like to see the data that supports the claim that the Nexus 7 screen is really good. Or basically equivalent to a Retina screen.

Hey! Welcome back! :D

I never said they were equivalent. It's obvious the retina screen is better than what's on the Nexus 7. It's higher res, and sports a heavier pixel density. What I'm arguing is that the Nex screen isn't a grainy, pixelated mess in comparison. While one might be technically better, there still isn't a huge amount of difference between the two.

And data that supports the claim? Well, we've got all the countless reviews of the thing that talk about how nice the screen is. Hell, you've posted a few quotes from them stating as much yourself.

NutsNGum
Jul 26, 2012, 06:16 PM
While one might be technically better, there still isn't a huge amount of difference between the two.

This is true. I got to play with one today for the first time and was pleasantly surprised. Screen is very sharp, it will be interesting to see what the iPad Jr is packing.

Renzatic
Jul 26, 2012, 07:59 PM
This is true. I got to play with one today for the first time and was pleasantly surprised. Screen is very sharp, it will be interesting to see what the iPad Jr is packing.

If I were a betting man (and I am, got a dollar right here), I'd guess the smaller iPad would be sporting a 1600x1200 screen. It's a step down from 1024x768 to 800x600 to compensate for the smaller size, then doubled up to retina resolutions.

It's 4:3, and gives it the same PPI as the iPad 3.

Spectrum Abuser
Jul 27, 2012, 02:05 AM
That 'retina' junkie is crazy! I guess he can't get over the simple fact that some people would rather save $300 and still get a brand new tablet. I bought my Samsung Galaxy Tab 7.0 Plus back in February for $350. I've had it long enough to not feel remorse about the Nexus 7 and its cheaper price, but it's still an amazing offer!

Southernboyj
Jul 30, 2012, 12:09 AM
Oh my, I read the whole thread to hear that "Retina" kids pointless arguments, good to know he is banned.

monty77
Jul 30, 2012, 11:36 AM
I jumped on the Nexus 7 bandwagon at the weekend. Like others here I wanted a smaller tablet .. the iPad3 was too close in size / portability to the MBA and quite frankly I didn't want another £500+ tied up in a device that wasn't used all that much.

Initial impressions

- Android JB is quite nice really, nice eye candy. Still a bit clunky in areas (settings for example) but a massive improvement since I last had an Android device
- Hardware, for the price, is impressive. There are no 2 ways about it. Display is crisp, clear and colours are spot on. It's no iPad3 granted but it's 1/2 the price and the iPad's screen sure isn't 2x better
- Google play store is pretty nice, good to have everything in once place
- The end to end experience still isn't there .. I miss iCloud (although some apps are there to solve that) and Photostream lots. I yearn for Airplay too!

..so all in I'm impressed, Google might just have this cracked some day soon, for me Airplay/iCloud/Photostream will be a draw back to iOS when/if they come out with a smaller iPad but for now I'm happy enough.

Carlanga
Jul 30, 2012, 11:59 AM
...Still a bit clunky in areas (settings for example) but a massive improvement since I last had an Android device.
I agree w/ you on the clunkiness of settings for android devices, but iOS settings is also a mess IMO. I don't understand something so simple that most people use has not been properly done in both of them.

If it wasn't for the :apple: app store I could see Android dominating the tablet market since it lets you do way more things and is a step closer to having a 'replacement' to a computer than an iPad. I still like webOS for a tablet than any of the others. If it had been released today & way more polished it might have had a better chance.

nickn
Jul 30, 2012, 12:39 PM
Haha this thread is full of win! Freudling doesnt know how to have a debate with anyone to say the least .

nerdpov
Jul 30, 2012, 03:44 PM
Aree you kidding. The pixel density of the nexus 7 is very close to that if the retina ipad. Its only a little lower. It is much better than the ipad 2s. From a normal viewing distanc you can't make out pixels. Even when looking close you really have to look for them. The colors on the nexus are fine as well.

I would have to agree, the screen on the nexus 7 is surprisingly nice.

nilk
Jul 30, 2012, 04:07 PM
I own a Nexus 7 and an iPhone 4S. I don't have an iPad to compare to, so I don't know about that. My subjective opinion:

I find that the text looks pixelated and it's taking some time to get used to it. I'm not sure how much of it has to do with Android's font rendering or how much has to do with PPI. One thing is that since I can hold the Nexus 7 easily with one hand, I often ended up holding it as close to my face as I do my iPhone. It's a bit unfair as the iPhone has a PPI of 326 and Nexus 7 is 216. So of course text on the iPhone will look better.

My other issue is that the screen is too bright, even at it's lowest brightness setting. Using the Nexus 7 in low light or a dark room is uncomfortable due to this. I don't know if this can be fixed in software or not.

That said, for a $250 device, I think the hardware is great. My issues are more with the user experience of the software, but that's another thread.

cynics
Jul 31, 2012, 09:03 AM
I own a Nexus 7 and an iPhone 4S. I don't have an iPad to compare to, so I don't know about that. My subjective opinion:

I find that the text looks pixelated and it's taking some time to get used to it. I'm not sure how much of it has to do with Android's font rendering or how much has to do with PPI. One thing is that since I can hold the Nexus 7 easily with one hand, I often ended up holding it as close to my face as I do my iPhone. It's a bit unfair as the iPhone has a PPI of 326 and Nexus 7 is 216. So of course text on the iPhone will look better.

My other issue is that the screen is too bright, even at it's lowest brightness setting. Using the Nexus 7 in low light or a dark room is uncomfortable due to this. I don't know if this can be fixed in software or not.

That said, for a $250 device, I think the hardware is great. My issues are more with the user experience of the software, but that's another thread.

I used to have a screen dimming app I would use on night flights with my Xoom so I wouldn't bother the person next too me. I'm sure there are a lot off app you can use....

Dimorphic
Aug 1, 2012, 07:18 AM
Well I have a retina iPad and a Nexus 7 and love them both. The iPad is the premium device that you do heavy browsing/work on and the Nexus is the one that you throw in your bag on the way to work.

The issue that I have is since my job doesn't allow for outside devices to be used on their network I'm essentially using the two for the same thing. In my experience the Nexus is better for reading and playing games due to the form factor but the iPad is faster and smoother for heavy web browsing, photo/movie editing, etc.

You dont have to own just one and with the price point of the Nexus 7 you don't have too.