PDA

View Full Version : NI Electrik Piano




quigleybc
Aug 5, 2005, 07:56 PM
So, I just got NI's Electrik piano and though it sounds fantastic, it is almost unuseable because of the amount of memory it eats...

I have 1.25 gigs of RAM, and Electrik piano eats way more memory than Reakor.

I would have thought that Reaktor would be much harder on the memory.

What's the deal? :confused:



pulsewidth947
Aug 6, 2005, 09:50 AM
So this is the type of question I envisioned would be in the Digital Audio forum.

The reason is the Electrik Piano plugin uses samples to produce the sounds. These samples are stored in the computers RAM to enable them to be used instantly. Reaktor on the other hand usually has to use lots of CPU to generate sounds (as it is actually synthesising the signal as opposed to playing back samples). Unless of course you are using a sampler in Reaktor, then there will be little difference.

Man I'm going to have to get Reaktor on the Mac. Does it run well?

A way to increase the performance of Electrik Piano would be to lower the sample rate while you play as this usually reduces strain. Of course bump it back up when you go to render your track.

WinterMute
Aug 6, 2005, 11:08 AM
So this is the type of question I envisioned would be in the Digital Audio forum.

The reason is the Electrik Piano plugin uses samples to produce the sounds. These samples are stored in the computers RAM to enable them to be used instantly. Reaktor on the other hand usually has to use lots of CPU to generate sounds (as it is actually synthesising the signal as opposed to playing back samples). Unless of course you are using a sampler in Reaktor, then there will be little difference.

Man I'm going to have to get Reaktor on the Mac. Does it run well?

A way to increase the performance of Electrik Piano would be to lower the sample rate while you play as this usually reduces strain. Of course bump it back up when you go to render your track.

Yes Reaktor runs fine. All big sample-dased instruments are RAM hungry, take a look at the BFD drum system.... :eek:

Oddly the Logic emulated electric piano sounds excellent in a mix but not so good by itself, and it takes far less resources to operate.

pulsewidth947
Aug 6, 2005, 05:06 PM
Yes Reaktor runs fine. All big sample-dased instruments are RAM hungry, take a look at the BFD drum system.... :eek:

Oddly the Logic emulated electric piano sounds excellent in a mix but not so good by itself, and it takes far less resources to operate.
Thats what I like to hear.. I love Reaktor. The best thing is creating a complex granular synth with randomisation, then load in a sample of anything hit play and record an ambient album while you go do something else :D

Logic Piano sounds excellent in a mix but rubbish on its own?! So its completely opposite of most patches - which sound fanastic on their own (usually with loads of effects, reverb and delay) then they eat all the bandwidth of your mix! Well done Logic... still wont tempt me to use it though :P

:EDIT: You werent kidding about reaktor were you!? It runs awesome on my Powerbook. Even something as complex as the new SpaceDrone synth uses on average 50% cpu. This is the first time I've ever used Reaktor on a Mac, and I must say v. 5 looks absolutely stunning on it. The whole floaty windows works really well under OSX. Right enough talking back to playing :D

faintember
Aug 6, 2005, 09:27 PM
:EDIT: You werent kidding about reaktor were you!? It runs awesome on my Powerbook. Even something as complex as the new SpaceDrone synth uses on average 50% cpu. This is the first time I've ever used Reaktor on a Mac, and I must say v. 5 looks absolutely stunning on it. The whole floaty windows works really well under OSX. Right enough talking back to playing :D
Yar, it runs fine on my Ti PB in my sig..with 512 mb ram.

Although one of my Max/MSP patches eats cpu, then my audio gets all choppy, then it goes back to normal. I guess that is what i get when doing real-time grain-cloud processing, phase vocoding, pitch shifting, and sample playback all at the same time, in eight channels. I need to write less complicated patches i guess. :rolleyes:

-cameron

WinterMute
Aug 7, 2005, 12:48 PM
Yar, it runs fine on my Ti PB in my sig..with 512 mb ram.

Although one of my Max/MSP patches eats cpu, then my audio gets all choppy, then it goes back to normal. I guess that is what i get when doing real-time grain-cloud processing, phase vocoding, pitch shifting, and sample playback all at the same time, in eight channels. I need to write less complicated patches i guess. :rolleyes:

-cameron

You Reaktor Max/MSP boys do love caning the old processor don't you? :D

Whatever happened to an SM58 and a TEAC 4-track?

Now, where'd I put that WASP....?

faintember
Aug 7, 2005, 02:50 PM
You Reaktor Max/MSP boys do love caning the old processor don't you? :D
Yep. :)
Whatever happened to an SM58 and a TEAC 4-track?

Now, where'd I put that WASP....?
Most of ours are in the storage closet, but one of our TEAC 4-tracks is currently used as a great door-stop/dust catcher. :p

pulsewidth947
Aug 7, 2005, 04:08 PM
You Reaktor Max/MSP boys do love caning the old processor don't you? :D

Whatever happened to an SM58 and a TEAC 4-track?

yeah why not? Thats what its there for. Whats the point in a dual-2.7 if your just gonna look at it :).. not that i have one or anything

Whats a 4-track?





just kidding :) ahh not-so-fond memories of recording with a '58 and a tascam 4-track.. bouncing the tracks down every 5 mins to squeeze one extra guitar track out of the tape. All the while degrading the quality of the recording.. top notch :D.. still it worked for the beatles

WinterMute
Aug 7, 2005, 05:36 PM
just kidding :) ahh not-so-fond memories of recording with a '58 and a tascam 4-track.. bouncing the tracks down every 5 mins to squeeze one extra guitar track out of the tape. All the while degrading the quality of the recording.. top notch :D.. still it worked for the beatles

It bloody did work for the Beatles, have you listened to Sergeant Pepper lately? Try doing that with plug-ins Reaktor-boy... :D ;)

I had a Yamaha MT2X sync'd to an Atari 1040STF, running an early sequencer called Iconix and then the early Notator.

Damn, that was hard work... :rolleyes:

I'm afraid I'm not a big fan of plug-ins unless I can't get hold of the original units, a Fender Rhodes sounds better than any plug-in sampled or modeled.

Still, NI's stuff is usually pretty usable, I like the B4.

pulsewidth947
Aug 8, 2005, 03:28 AM
Theres not a lot I cant do with Reaktor, but accurate Analogue processes is impossible. You can get pretty damn close though, and I would actually rather have Reaktor than a few hardware synths. Theres no way I'd swap the flexibility and instant recall for something that I had to warm up for an hour, constantly drifts out of pitch etc. Not that I dont have fun spending a couple of hours playing with a Moog of course :)

Ahh synching tape to sequencers... dreadful process! Losing that track on your 4-track, which is essentially taking up 1/4 of the available tracks! Then you get problems with bleed, and actually getting it to work! Luckily computer audio was taking off when I started getting serious about recording, so my worst experiences have been synching programmes (Acid and Fruity Loops, back in the day). Which was a pain in the arse on my 300mhz 32mb ram PC :D

I really love plugins and software. I'd be lost without Reason, Cubase and Reaktor. Life really is too short to spend time getting a nice acoustic recording of old gear. Besides, not much point in having a powerbook if I've gotta lug round a Hammond B3 is there (no you cant lug them round - 132kg!) :)

Of course stringed instruments/brass/most acoustic instruments are a whole different ball game - thats something thats immediately noticeable synthesised. Although it probably doesnt matter anymore with the trash that gets into the charts :)

quigleybc
Aug 8, 2005, 01:18 PM
So this is the type of question I envisioned would be in the Digital Audio forum.


Nice my thread has yielded some excellent responses...

I for one love my plug ins, the only thing I don't love about them is that I don't seem to have enough time in the day to focus on just one of them and really dig deep into it's possiblities.

Reaktor by itself could consume a lifetime. To answer your question, yes Reaktor runs like a dream on my PM G5 dual 1.8. I've only had it for about three weeks so calling myself a Reaktor Newb would probably be flattering myself. It is an intimidating program, but extremely exiting.

Thanks for answering the RAM question about Elektrick piano, I should probably get more RAM anyway. One thing is that I can load the same sounds from Electrick piano into Kontakt and the RAM seems to remain stable.
So that seems to be a workaround until I get more RAM.

All in all, the NI plugs are on a whole different level it would seem. Someone mentioned BFD also being a RAM eater, is it worse than Elektrik Piano? I had BFD on my list of future purchases, would 1.25 GB RAM keep it moving smoothly?

Thanks for the great posts! :D

WinterMute
Aug 8, 2005, 01:27 PM
Nice my thread has yielded some excellent responses...

Someone mentioned BFD also being a RAM eater, is it worse than Elektrik Piano? I had BFD on my list of future purchases, would 1.25 GB RAM keep it moving smoothly?

Thanks for the great posts! :D

BFD not only likes RAM, but it eats processor cycles, I can't run it in its full mode on my PowerBook, it makes a dual 2Ghz G5 look pedestrian... :eek:

I tend to program using a Reason kit for the basic track then bounce over to the G5 to put the nuance into the BFD track, then bounce the separate drums into 24-bit audio and slap it back into Protools...

It's easier to get a drummer to play it!

quigleybc
Aug 8, 2005, 01:56 PM
BFD not only likes RAM, but it eats processor cycles, I can't run it in its full mode on my PowerBook, it makes a dual 2Ghz G5 look pedestrian


Wow...that is a bummer, BFD looks so cool, I'm a drummer first, computer music nut second, so BFD seemed like a perfect way to meet in the middle.


I totally agree with using reason for drums, I assume you are referring to the Reason drum kit refill, because that is what I currently use. The sounds are so close to the real thing that even my drummer ear has a hard time telling the differance. I was looking for an alternative like BFD because Rewiring Reason to Logic can be a pain. I for one love everything about Logic except the way it handles Rewire. Now I use Live when I want to do rewire stuff.

How would you compare BFD to something like Battery 2? Or even the studio kits in the Rhythm Section Jam Pack?

:D

WinterMute
Aug 8, 2005, 02:05 PM
Wow...that is a bummer, BFD looks so cool, I'm a drummer first, computer music nut second, so BFD seemed like a perfect way to meet in the middle.


I totally agree with using reason for drums, I assume you are referring to the Reason drum kit refill, because that is what I currently use. The sounds are so close to the real thing that even my drummer ear has a hard time telling the differance. I was looking for an alternative like BFD because Rewiring Reason to Logic can be a pain. I for one love everything about Logic except the way it handles Rewire. Now I use Live when I want to do rewire stuff.

How would you compare BFD to something like Battery 2? Or even the studio kits in the Rhythm Section Jam Pack?

:D

ReWire in Logic isn't too bad, but it's much better in Protools...

BFD is the only digital system I have difficulty in picking in a mix if its been sensitively programmed, the level of control of the hi-hat alone is worth the price of admission.

BFD will work on a powerbook if you don't use all the samples in every drum, but it's a beast, no messing. I'd give it a go but be prepared to drop the kick, snare and hi-hat to audio before working on toms etc.

It sounds much better than the Reason kits or the Jam pack stuff, just from the controllability, Battery can sound great depending on the samples, but even then you don't get the subtlety.

You do know what BFD stands for don't you?

quigleybc
Aug 8, 2005, 02:12 PM
be prepared to drop the kick, snare and hi-hat to audio before working on toms etc.


You do know what BFD stands for don't you?



Does it stand for "Better Friggin Drop" the kick, snare and hi-hat to audio before working on toms etc. :D

Ya I can guess what it stands for.

quigleybc
Aug 8, 2005, 02:27 PM
It sounds much better than the Reason kits or the Jam pack stuff, just from the controllability


So, I still really want to try BFD, it seems as though BFD is the way to go, does anyone know if you can download a demo or anything?

Thanks :)

quigleybc
Aug 8, 2005, 02:51 PM
Woops

I thought I posted this thread in the digital audio section, guess i messed that up..Sorry, thanks for moving it to the right spot :)