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View Full Version : Do Toshiba SSD's Write Speed Slow Down Eventually?




ducatiti
Sep 8, 2012, 10:10 PM
Just bought a Base 2012 13" from Best Buy (Only $999). Opened it up to find that I have a Samsung display and Toshiba SSD. From what I have read, Toshiba is slower when filevault is enable or used.

However, from the write tests, lots of Samsungs go over 400 while the Toshiba range from 250-370. Mine is writing at around 360ish right now.

Is it true that given time, Toshiba SSD's have a tendency of slowing down?



plucky duck
Sep 8, 2012, 10:39 PM
Initial tests are not indicative of what long term numbers are, but they'll settle somewhere lower. How much lower, I can't tell you. I've seen it anywhere from 60-100MB/s slower, based on my Kingston HyperX SSD on my iMac that I've used for over a year now.

My Air has consistently benched 248MB/s write and 260MB/s read and I've had it for a couple of months thus far.

I used to care like you, but now meh, in the real world unless you're constantly doing large file transfers or work with large files it doesn't really really matter, at least not to me.

ducatiti
Sep 8, 2012, 10:44 PM
Thanks for your input. By any chance, do you have a Toshiba SSD?

Now that I have ran another test, I am getting 220ish.

Do the Samsung SSD's have this characteristic too? Just out of curiosity? Grass is always greener on the other side mentality....lol

Warhawk15
Sep 9, 2012, 12:30 AM
My 2011 has slowed down since I bought it, and yes its a Toshiba.

I'm pretty sure it was around 180 for the read speed when I first got it.
However it doesn't feel any slower, or maybe its been slowing down so slowly I can't really tell.

twintin
Sep 9, 2012, 03:16 AM
Anandtech have done an extensive test of both disks and and concluded they are pretty much same when it comes to performance, except if FileVault2 is used. In such case Samsung is to be preferred.

You can read more about it here.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6063/macbook-air-13inch-mid-2012-review/4

Wokis
Sep 9, 2012, 03:19 AM
My 2011 has slowed down since I bought it, and yes its a Toshiba.

I'm pretty sure it was around 180 for the read speed when I first got it.
However it doesn't feel any slower, or maybe its been slowing down so slowly I can't really tell.

Though the 2011 and 2012 toshiba are quite different. The 2012 one is a SATA 6Gbps drive and in order to get as fast speed as possible on only 128GB of NAND they've opted to use a sandforce controller.

OP, do you plan on using the drive to do real-time HD video capture? Otherwise, relax! Stop measuring! No real-life difference is to be found. Not to mention the SF controller usually does not like being stress tested. It will activate a temporary throttle if it suspects something is wearing it down on purpose.

Mrbobb
Sep 9, 2012, 08:54 AM
Since u bought the base model, why don't you enjoy what u got now, THEN a year from now when ur running out of space THEN u can upgrade with a bigger Sammy chip OK? Will be cheaper then too!

People are too consumed with numbers.

ducatiti
Sep 9, 2012, 11:32 AM
Is it possible to receive a Samsung SSD on the base config? Or they only come in 256 and above?

m.demian
Sep 9, 2012, 12:46 PM
I do believe it's possible to get the 128GB Samsung, but most reports seem to be of Toshibas. Unless, only people with Toshibas are reporting. Anyway, I don't think going for the larger-sized SSDs guarantees a Samsung anymore, since people were reporting Toshibas on the higher-capacity models.

If you're not using FileVault, it doesn't matter as the Toshiba is on par and scores higher on some benchmarks. If you do plan on using FileVault, the write speed of your drive will continually degrade. It's really unfortunate that there are these display and SSD lotteries and I'm surprised it's not more of a big deal.

Weaselboy
Sep 9, 2012, 02:55 PM
Anandtech have done an extensive test of both disks and and concluded they are pretty much same when it comes to performance, except if FileVault2 is used. In such case Samsung is to be preferred.

You can read more about it here.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6063/macbook-air-13inch-mid-2012-review/4

I do believe it's possible to get the 128GB Samsung, but most reports seem to be of Toshibas. Unless, only people with Toshibas are reporting. Anyway, I don't think going for the larger-sized SSDs guarantees a Samsung anymore, since people were reporting Toshibas on the higher-capacity models.

If you're not using FileVault, it doesn't matter as the Toshiba is on par and scores higher on some benchmarks. If you do plan on using FileVault, the write speed of your drive will continually degrade. It's really unfortunate that there are these display and SSD lotteries and I'm surprised it's not more of a big deal.

It is not going to continually degrade. Using FV2 with a Sandforce controlled SSD like the Toshiba will result in somewhat slower speeds as shown in the Anandtech tests linked in the above post, but using FV2 will not make the drive speed degrade further over time.

m.demian
Sep 9, 2012, 03:43 PM
My statement was a bit too broad, so I'll clarify. "Random" write performance will degrade over continuous use. I also wouldn't say performance is just somewhat lower as the max performance of incompressible data writes is half that of the Samsung's. Furthermore, continuous use degrades it by a factor of five.

I'm not just spouting this out my ass, take a look at Anand's benchmarks. After several runs of random writes (FileVault scenario), the random write rate degraded to ~60MB/s from ~250MB/s. Compare that with the Samsung's constant ~400MB/s random writes.

iAppl3Fan
Sep 9, 2012, 04:13 PM
Is it possible to receive a Samsung SSD on the base config? Or they only come in 256 and above?

I have not seen Samsung SSD in base model Air and I've looked through a lot of display models over many vendors including . This is true for 2012 models but not true for 2011 models. My base air I picked up today is toshiba as well. If you want a Samsung SSD, you'll need to get 256. It's not worth it if you don't need the space.

Weaselboy
Sep 9, 2012, 05:05 PM
My statement was a bit too broad, so I'll clarify. "Random" write performance will degrade over continuous use. I also wouldn't say performance is just somewhat lower as the max performance of incompressible data writes is half that of the Samsung's. Furthermore, continuous use degrades it by a factor of five.

I'm not just spouting this out my ass, take a look at Anand's benchmarks. After several runs of random writes (FileVault scenario), the random write rate degraded to ~60MB/s from ~250MB/s. Compare that with the Samsung's constant ~400MB/s random writes.

To be clear, I am not accusing you of making things up. I think you are misinterpreting what those test results mean. the 60MB/s speed is after hammering the drive with repeated writes to measure the effectiveness of garbage collection and TRIM. If you look at the test you will see drive performance returns to normal a time.

I am not disputing the Samsung drive is faster under FV2. What I am disagreeing with you on is the comment that the Toshiba with FV2 will have continuously reduced write speeds over time. There is no evidence this is the case.

ducatiti
Sep 9, 2012, 05:23 PM
I have not seen Samsung SSD in base model Air and I've looked through a lot of display models over many vendors including . This is true for 2012 models but not true for 2011 models. My base air I picked up today is toshiba as well. If you want a Samsung SSD, you'll need to get 256. It's not worth it if you don't need the space.

Thank you for clarifying this. I haven't seen anyone in this forum with a base 128gb with Samsung SSD as well.

Is it true that no matter what SSD you have, a 128gb one will be slower than a, let's say 512gb SSD?

m.demian
Sep 9, 2012, 05:31 PM
To be clear, I am not accusing you of making things up. I think you are misinterpreting what those test results mean. the 60MB/s speed is after hammering the drive with repeated writes to measure the effectiveness of garbage collection and TRIM. If you look at the test you will see drive performance returns to normal a time.

I am not disputing the Samsung drive is faster under FV2. What I am disagreeing with you on is the comment that the Toshiba with FV2 will have continuously reduced write speeds over time. There is no evidence this is the case.

Ah yeah, I was talking about random write speeds as was mentioned in the Anand review.

iAppl3Fan
Sep 10, 2012, 01:00 AM
Thank you for clarifying this. I haven't seen anyone in this forum with a base 128gb with Samsung SSD as well.

Is it true that no matter what SSD you have, a 128gb one will be slower than a, let's say 512gb SSD?

I had a 128gb Samsung SSD but for 2011 MBA. With the 2012 models since they change the connectors for the blade SSD I haven't seen Samsung in 128gb.

No, it's not true. If the 128 and 512 are from the same vendor, benchmark wise it should be relatively the same speed. You're probably thinking of traditional hard drives where the spinning disk needs to rotate more and might have a higher seek time to find the data.

throAU
Sep 10, 2012, 01:39 AM
My 2011 has slowed down since I bought it, and yes its a Toshiba.

I'm pretty sure it was around 180 for the read speed when I first got it.
However it doesn't feel any slower, or maybe its been slowing down so slowly I can't really tell.

reason it doesn't feel slow is that most general desktop use is not sequential streaming. it is fairly random IO and in that case SSD is so much faster than a spinning disk even when degraded.

Wokis
Sep 10, 2012, 03:22 AM
I had a 128gb Samsung SSD but for 2011 MBA. With the 2012 models since they change the connectors for the blade SSD I haven't seen Samsung in 128gb.

No, it's not true. If the 128 and 512 are from the same vendor, benchmark wise it should be relatively the same speed. You're probably thinking of traditional hard drives where the spinning disk needs to rotate more and might have a higher seek time to find the data.
Inside an SSD there is essentially a smart striping set up between the memory chips. The more memory, the better speed as read/write can be shared on more cells at the same time. This usually means that you get greater speeds with a bigger SSD.

ducatiti
Sep 10, 2012, 03:33 AM
Inside an SSD there is essentially a smart striping set up between the memory chips. The more memory, the better speed as read/write can be shared on more cells at the same time. This usually means that you get greater speeds with a bigger SSD.

Given your comment above, would this be the reason the that base Toshiba SSD only averages at mid 200's and doesn't reach the higher 300's?

kdum8
Sep 16, 2012, 11:33 PM
Does Apple let you choose from Toshiba & Samsung when buying an air in the Apple Stores?

I plan to use FV2 so Samsung would seem the better choice for me.

Weaselboy
Sep 17, 2012, 05:17 PM
Does Apple let you choose from Toshiba & Samsung when buying an air in the Apple Stores?

I plan to use FV2 so Samsung would seem the better choice for me.

No you don't have a direct choice as far as brand, but from user reports it seems the 128GB are Toshibas and the 256GB are Samsungs, so if you want a Samsung you are stuck paying for the 256GB upgrade.

How do you use your computer? How much of what you do daily relies on write speeds? Unless you are doing a lot of intense write activity to the SSD I don't think you are going to even be able to tell the difference.

Having the Toshiba with FV2 on drops your write speed only from around 500MB/s to 250MB/s, which is still quite fast.

I have a 2012 13" MBA with the 128GB Toshiba drive and I am quite happy with the speed.

IMO, unless you are doing video editing or something that requires frequent large writes to the disk, this whole thing is a non-issue. If you need the 256GB for capacity, that is fine, but I would not pay for the 256GB over the 128GB just to get the Samsung drive.