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iMacZealot
Aug 21, 2005, 02:12 AM
I was wondering if anybody could suggest a good font to use for school this year. All last year I did my papers in Helvetica 12 point in AppleWorks, but I'm getting rather tired of Helvetica. I was thinking about Lucida Grande, but it's a little too large for my needs. I also don't want anything that reminds me of PCs like Times New Roman. I don't really care if it's Sans-Serif or not. I just want a font that's on my computer already, or something free I can download.

Thanks in advance.



Stampyhead
Aug 21, 2005, 02:43 AM
Adobe Garamond or Myriad. I use those two fonts for everything.

Lacero
Aug 21, 2005, 03:04 AM
What the hell, use Comic Sans and Arial. :D

Second vote for Adobe Garamond.

irmongoose
Aug 21, 2005, 03:35 AM
Definitely Garamond. Sweet, simple, and beautiful.
Myriad is a more for design-related text... not ideal for reports, etc. Although it, too, is a beautiful font.




irmongoose

Chundles
Aug 21, 2005, 03:46 AM
Most of the unis I know specify Times, 12 point and double spaced. May as well start getting used to it now.

Mechcozmo
Aug 21, 2005, 03:48 AM
Zapfino.
:D

Lacero
Aug 21, 2005, 03:52 AM
Zapfino.
:D
http://www3.telus.net/poojja/zap.gif

irmongoose
Aug 21, 2005, 04:04 AM
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! My eyes, my eyes!
:eek: :eek:




irmongoose

Mechcozmo
Aug 21, 2005, 04:16 AM
http://www3.telus.net/poojja/zap.gif
Would you rather this hideous text?Or rather, this one?
Zapfino works nicely in larger sizes for letters that are supposed to be hand done but look better this way.

20rogersc
Aug 21, 2005, 02:29 PM
http://www3.telus.net/poojja/zap.gifI think we all know what font not to use now.

::20ROGERSC::

besler3035
Aug 21, 2005, 02:43 PM
If your school goes by following MLA guidelines, you'll probably have to use either Arial or Times New Roman. It's the typeface that 99% of the world uses on pretty much any formal document.

quackattack
Aug 21, 2005, 02:49 PM
Most of the unis I know specify Times, 12 point and double spaced. May as well start getting used to it now.

Yup, this has been my experiance as well.

wordmunger
Aug 21, 2005, 02:53 PM
I was a bit rebellious in college, so I submitted my papers in Palatino, even though Times was required. None of my professors ever noticed the difference.

CorvusCamenarum
Aug 21, 2005, 03:05 PM
I wrote most of my papers in 12 point Optima. It's nice and easy to read. Then again I also printed all of my essays and whatnot on resume paper. It feels nicer and it's easier to write commentary on it. Unless your professor is a standards nazi, chances are they won't care what font you use so long as it's not outrageous and they can read it easily.

superbovine
Aug 21, 2005, 03:56 PM
in my laters years in college, i had professor actually specifiy which font to use.

puckhead193
Aug 21, 2005, 04:07 PM
what about wingdings or whatever its called :eek: ;)

barneygumble
Aug 21, 2005, 04:55 PM
every report I ever wrote in uni specified times new roman 12 point, and they checked :eek:

ravenvii
Aug 21, 2005, 05:02 PM
For my school papers I actually used Helvetica all the time. It was the default font in TextEdit, and I never thought about it until now :eek:

:D

zelmo
Aug 21, 2005, 05:05 PM
I like Lucida Grande for my email, but usually go with either Palatino or Garamond for reports and such. Plain but elegant (and easy to read), and at least it isn't Times, Helvetica, or (gak!) Courier.

joepunk
Aug 21, 2005, 07:03 PM
I have not yet had a professor who specified what kind of font they required. So I used many different fonts. Not to sure that I can explain this properly but here goes. On some papers that I finished typing and it was in some way a little short in page length or I wanted to add another page to it I would just leave the size at 12pt and change the font to something that expanded the length.

Mechcozmo
Aug 21, 2005, 07:13 PM
Times New Roman or Garamond. Or Zapfino for special items like above.

Dan8302
Aug 21, 2005, 07:25 PM
I hate to be the one who says this, but use Courier New. It looks like times new Roman but you get about an extra page from every 3 pages. Also Monaco is even bigger, most teacher's can't notice.

ham_man
Aug 21, 2005, 07:37 PM
Garamond. Awesome font. Very clean. Very Apple.

mad jew
Aug 21, 2005, 07:38 PM
I have to use Times New Roman, size 12 pt with double spacing. It always looks horrible. :(

Meh, I'm not the one reading it. :D

superbovine
Aug 21, 2005, 07:38 PM
I hate to be the one who says this, but use Courier New. It looks like times new Roman but you get about an extra page from every 3 pages. Also Monaco is even bigger, most teacher's can't notice.

i used new courier unless directed otherwise. the font gives a "type writer" impression to most people and they ignore the fact that it is larger.

barneygumble
Aug 21, 2005, 07:47 PM
wingdings are also good, unless of course somebody has to read it, i think times new roman is almost the standard in australia

20rogersc
Aug 22, 2005, 06:12 AM
Haven't used it myself for essays, but how about Chicargo, it is really easy to read, and has that 'modern' touch! However, havn't tried using it for a block of text.

::20ROGERSC::

Blue Velvet
Aug 22, 2005, 06:34 AM
Use a contemporary serif font with a large x-height on a single justified column, set generous margins & headers/footers on the page (1.25-1.6 inch for margins, more for footers), with ample leading (double-space if necessary).

The heavy leading is usually for the assessor to make notes and corrections.

Bembo, Palatino, Stone Serif, Galliard, Minion etc. 11/18-26 (11pt with 18-26pt lead) is the kind of thing you should be going for.

Larger point sizes are not necessarily more readable but try and keep average character length per line to anywhere between 40-70 max.

Also worth putting short running headers in with the papers' title, author and any section titles and misc details. Folios (page numbers) with page number/total are also useful if a page goes astray e.g. page 6 of 128

stevietheb
Aug 22, 2005, 07:50 AM
The bonus for Garamond is that it's the font used in the Harry Potter books!

I'm a fan of Cardo (http://scholarsfonts.net/cardofnt.html) and Gentium (http://scripts.sil.org/cms/scripts/page.php?site_id=nrsi&item_id=Gentium) -- both of them are free downloads, I believe. Plus, they're unicode, so if you need to crossover into another language, no problem! I use them for English, Hebrew, and sometimes Greek (though I'm a fan of Porson (http://www.geocities.com/greekfonts/) for Greek because it looks similar to the Loeb Classical Library font...any geek know what font Loeb uses?).

I'll take this moment to plug Mellel (http://www.mellel.com) as well. PLUG.

Shaun.P
Aug 22, 2005, 08:32 AM
See when you say double spacing do you mean: you hit the space bar twice when you type? Or there is double space between the lines?

Mechcozmo
Aug 22, 2005, 01:51 PM
Gentium (http://scripts.sil.org/cms/scripts/page.php?site_id=nrsi&item_id=Gentium)

Borked link...

Blue Velvet
Aug 22, 2005, 02:10 PM
See when you say double spacing do you mean: you hit the space bar twice when you type? Or there is double space between the lines?

Double space between the lines: set with whatever leading (line spacing) controls that you have in the app that you're using.

stevietheb
Aug 22, 2005, 02:10 PM
Borked link...I think it's an issue over at SIL. If you google "Gentium" that's where it wants to take you. And if you go through here (http://www.sil.org/computing/fonts/Lang/silfonts.html), clicking on "Gentium" doesn't work either...

Hopefully it'll be up again soon...

stevietheb
Aug 22, 2005, 02:12 PM
In fact, none of the SIL Fonts downloads seem to be working at the moment. Guess we just gotta wait it out.

Leareth
Aug 22, 2005, 02:20 PM
I second the Optima font.

It is much easier to read than times new roman, and looks sharper. use good paper and put the essay/report in a plastic cover and voila guaranteed B even if your paper is crap :rolleyes:
but seriously I use the optima font even when I am suppossed to use Times, which is the university standard. I have had only one complaint about my type face being different and I told the prof its because I am using a Mac versus everyone using a PC , she said OK and left it at that... :eek:

Arial and Arial Black are good for short attention getting notices but not papers.
get used to times new roman since it is the standard and if you ever submit a paper for publishing if it is not in times 12pt regular they will not even read it...

:)

dops7107
Aug 22, 2005, 02:22 PM
If you have Utopia (serif), use that. er... ah, the OP wanted something already on his/her computer. I think Optima is a good choice, but then essays/papers I think are normally suited to serif typefaces. Garamond is good, a little formal perhaps, but I think for a decent typeface you have to pay for it - you can't be distinctive with stock typefaces.

rainman::|:|
Aug 22, 2005, 02:41 PM
any non-ornamental serif, but something named after a newspaper is always a good bet. that's if you want to deviate from TNR, which isn't a good idea in general. Palatino is a good font too, i like it's proportions. Arial Black is just too big nowadays, but we used to pull that crap on teachers who didn't understand different fonts...

rainman::|:|
Aug 22, 2005, 02:43 PM
See when you say double spacing do you mean: you hit the space bar twice when you type? Or there is double space between the lines?

You shouldn't put two spaces in between words, and don't do it between sentences either (a common mistake, I still make it!). Computer fonts are designed not to need this. If your teachers argue, slam them in the head with a typewriter, and exclaim "this thing IS still good for something" besides monospaced text.

</anal about fonts>

Shaun.P
Aug 22, 2005, 02:45 PM
Omg! You shouldn' put a double space starting a new sentence? About 7 years ago I never, then I started studying computing at school and was told too. I don't think I could break this habit now!

Applespider
Aug 22, 2005, 03:10 PM
http://www3.telus.net/poojja/zap.gif

I like using Zapfino just to watch it change as you type different letter combinations. It's great when you're showing a Windows bod that Macs can change fonts in Textedit ;)

I'd also agree that very few non-design/art professors can tell the difference between Times New Roman and other relatively standard serif fonts. The standards are mainly there to stop people writing papers in Comic Sans or other hard to read fonts.

CubaTBird
Aug 22, 2005, 10:18 PM
*sniff... geneva sits in the corner alone :( :p :D

iMacZealot
Aug 23, 2005, 12:38 AM
Thanks for the help everyone. I've looked at every font you've suggested, and I prefer Garamond for these reasons:

My school has specific guidelines. Margins can only be 1 inch thick, but I still use 1.25, must be double-spaced, and size 10-14. Oh, and once, someone turned their paper in bold print, and that wasn't pretty. Anyways, I like Garamond for my lesser papers because it's small, and I tend to overdo my answers by writing too much. It also stands out from Times or Arial. I like Lucida Grande, but I'm afraid it was too large for my needs.

And for you people who use Courier New, don't. Geneva has a much better feel and look, plus It's actually larger than Courier New.

Once again, thanks!

TheMonarch
Aug 23, 2005, 12:46 AM
I hate to be the one who says this, but use Courier New. It looks like times new Roman but you get about an extra page from every 3 pages. Also Monaco is even bigger, most teacher's can't notice.

OH NO! My secret! :p :D

Sparky's
Aug 23, 2005, 08:11 AM
All I hear in this post is people how have no clue as to what "Fonts" even are! People Lucida Grande is a system font installed in the OS that is required for Mac OS to even function, yes you can use it for other things but it was never meant to be used by anything other than your computer to diplay text. Also most system fonts are "Monospace" in that the amount of space each letter uses is the same (an em space) the width of an "M" so an "i" and a "w" will be spaced the same as on a manual typewriter.

Move on to fonts that were designed for use in typesetting. the serif family -Garamond (they are all the same, Adobe, Stemple, etc>) Palatino, Baskerville, Antiqua, Bodoni, Caslon, Century, and many more... and the san serif - Arial, Akzidenz Grotesk, Antique Olive, Avant Garde, Classical Sans, Helvetica, Futura, Frutiger, Stone Sans, Univers, etc. I have a font collection of over 750 type families, and wish I could afford the "Adobe Font Folio" collection of over 2,200 type faces http://www.adobe.com/products/fontfolio/main.html

Try a little research on one of my favorites "Goudy"
http://www.linotype.com/7-396-7/fredericwgoudy.html

I have been in commercial printing for over 30 years and 15 of it in Desktop Publishing, I just recommend doing a bit of searching first, then decide. ;)

Nspace
Aug 26, 2005, 09:49 AM
If money was not an issue I would use Peter Bilak's Fedra Serif B, the book weight. Fedra is one of the most beautiful type familes IMO, top notch example of great dutch contemporary typography. It has a fairly large x height, very readable and legible. It also has longer stems than its counterpart, Fedra Serif A, which helps with reability in a long text like a paper.

As for all the Garamond's being the same :S I wouldn't go so far to say that. Have you ever seen ITC Garamond, that type is a disaster. They all have their own subtlies of how they have been interpreted. I personally like the Adobe version the best, but some have said that Granjon is quite nice, and more true to the original Garamond.

I can't say I have ever been a fan of Goudy's work for the most part, especially after Copperplate (ugh).

Chubypig
Sep 15, 2005, 04:20 PM
*sniff... geneva sits in the corner alone :( :p :D

I'll admit it, I use geneva. :)

MontyZ
Sep 16, 2005, 02:32 AM
.

iMacZealot
Sep 17, 2005, 01:04 AM
For the love of god, whatever you do, do NOT use Comic Sans!

http://www.bancomicsans.com/

Well, duh!




My girlfriend sadly LOVES that font. She uses it everywhere on everything. I've tried to get her on Lucida Grande, Helvetica, now Garamond, or even Times, but she won't change. It's sad. :(

desenso
Sep 17, 2005, 11:10 PM
Another vote for Times New Roman 12.

Double space it, 1 inch margins. At University, I have yet to find that accepts anything different. Sure, there are tricks to getting around page count requirements (whether it be less or more), but these are generally bad practice and don't prepare you for the real world, or at least the real world of academics.

mac-er
Sep 17, 2005, 11:55 PM
i used new courier unless directed otherwise. the font gives a "type writer" impression to most people and they ignore the fact that it is larger.


Ahh, the old New Courier trick that makes a 7 page paper a 10 page paper. :rolleyes:

I think its standard that teachers/professors expect either Times, Times New Roman, or Arial (which is my preference)

neocell
Sep 18, 2005, 12:06 AM
I was wondering if anybody could suggest a good font to use for school this year. All last year I did my papers in Helvetica 12 point in AppleWorks, but I'm getting rather tired of Helvetica. I was thinking about Lucida Grande, but it's a little too large for my needs. I also don't want anything that reminds me of PCs like Times New Roman. I don't really care if it's Sans-Serif or not. I just want a font that's on my computer already, or something free I can download.

Thanks in advance.
Verdana. It's nice, clean, similar to Helvetica

1st=helvetica 2nd=verdana

**EDIT** after I looked at the post with the pics side by side, they're basically the same thing. Forget Verdana and go with the lavish Zapfino

iMacZealot
Sep 18, 2005, 12:24 AM
Verdana. It's nice, clean, similar to Helvetica

1st=helvetica 2nd=verdana

**EDIT** after I looked at the post with the pics side by side, they're basically the same thing. Forget Verdana and go with the lavish Zapfino

Helvetica and Veranda are the same, only Veranda is way too huge.

Thanks for the advice, although I've decided on Garamond a little earlier on in this thread and things have been working very well with garamond.

balamw
Sep 18, 2005, 02:01 AM
Helvetica and Veranda are the same, only Veranda is way too huge.
Actually, Verdana was designed for on screen readability particularly at small point sizes, and for that it truly excels. (IMHO). Should probably also point out that it comes from Microsoft. http://www.microsoft.com/typography/fonts/font.aspx?FID=1&FNAME=Verdana.

Although you've settled on Garmond, let me cast another vote for Palatino. I typset my Ph.D. thesis with it in LaTeX so many years ago...

B

EricNau
Sep 18, 2005, 02:50 AM
Originally Posted by iMacZealot
I don't really care if it's Sans-Serif or not.

It really is important that you use a Sans-Serif font, it makes long reports much easier to read for the instructor, which are easier on thier eyes (and brains), which makes thier jobs easier, which makes them happier, which makes your grade higher.

EDIT: You want to use Serif Fonts, not San-Serif. Sorry. San-Serif should reserved for titles, headings, etc.

EricNau
Sep 18, 2005, 03:02 AM
I have Garamond, but I don't have Myriad. Aren't they both Adobe fonts? I have Adobe Creative Suite CS, wouldn't it come with that? I was looking at my fonts in Microsoft Word, will that show me all of my fonts or do I have to "teach" Word what fonts I have that may have come with differnt programs?

Blue Velvet
Sep 18, 2005, 03:43 AM
It really is important that you use a Sans-Serif font, it makes long reports much easier to read for the instructor, which are easier on thier eyes (and brains), which makes thier jobs easier, which makes them happier, which makes your grade higher.

Completely wrong. Serif fonts are far more legible for long sections of text which is why they're used in newspapers and books.

Loge
Sep 18, 2005, 04:06 AM
Although you've settled on Garmond, let me cast another vote for Palatino. I typset my Ph.D. thesis with it in LaTeX so many years ago...


If using LaTeX for anything mathematical, then I think Computer Modern is the best choice.

jrober
Sep 18, 2005, 08:18 AM
For such a report I used Bookman at University. My Father who was old style print school trained said the serif font was easy on the eye and Bookman is an excellent font to read.

Never underestimate the need of the reader to feel comfortable with the item they are reading. Use quality paper c. 100g +, a good font and when you are constructing a page prop it up 10-15 ft away and see at how it looks. A messy page from far away becomes uncomfortable to read up close.

My final dissertation was OK work but with 100% correct spelling and grammar, 110g paper, Bookman and good layout was well worth the effort and I got top grading in the year for my dissertation.

Best of luck with the report what ever font you use.

John

uaaerospace
Sep 18, 2005, 09:10 AM
You shouldn't put two spaces in between words, and don't do it between sentences either (a common mistake, I still make it!). Computer fonts are designed not to need this. If your teachers argue, slam them in the head with a typewriter, and exclaim "this thing IS still good for something" besides monospaced text.

</anal about fonts>

Every paper I've ever written has been required to be double spaced...even in high school.

Also, I was taught to use two spaces after a period and colon.

EricNau
Sep 18, 2005, 11:56 AM
Originally Posted by Blue Velvet
Completely wrong. Serif fonts are far more legible for long sections of text which is why they're used in newspapers and books.

Ya, you're right, sorry, I don't know what I was thinking, I guess I forgot what what "San" meant. Oh, well, thanks for paying more attention in computer class than I did ;)

EricNau
Sep 18, 2005, 12:09 PM
Originally Posted by rainman::|:|
You shouldn't put two spaces in between words, and don't do it between sentences either (a common mistake, I still make it!). Computer fonts are designed not to need this. If your teachers argue, slam them in the head with a typewriter, and exclaim "this thing IS still good for something" besides monospaced text.

I was told in like the First Grade that there are supposed to be 2 spaces after a period between two sentances. So I'm only supposed to use one?

leftbanke7
Sep 19, 2005, 03:51 PM
I was told in like the First Grade that there are supposed to be 2 spaces after a period between two sentances. So I'm only supposed to use one?

I remember learning this too and it's never been an issue with the bazillions of papers I have written for school. I am so confused now. *head explodes*

Blue Velvet
Sep 19, 2005, 04:00 PM
I was told in like the First Grade that there are supposed to be 2 spaces after a period between two sentances. So I'm only supposed to use one?


Yes. The Mac is not a typewriter.

Two spaces = indisputable typographical heresy (with a proportional font).

It makes me extremely cross. You don't want to see that, do you? ;)

notjustjay
Sep 19, 2005, 04:08 PM
I second Computer Modern, having just written my Master's thesis in LaTeX. :)

iMacZealot
Sep 19, 2005, 05:13 PM
I was told in like the First Grade that there are supposed to be 2 spaces after a period between two sentances. So I'm only supposed to use one?

I was, too. I think it is to be two spaces, as that's what every grammar teacher has ever told me; but it probably doesn't make that much of a difference.

Blue Velvet
Sep 19, 2005, 05:34 PM
I was, too. I think it is to be two spaces, as that's what every grammar teacher has ever told me; but it probably doesn't make that much of a difference.

Believe it or not, it makes a huge amount of difference when setting type.
Your grammar teachers were and continue to be wrong.

iMacZealot
Sep 19, 2005, 07:08 PM
Believe it or not, it makes a huge amount of difference when setting type.
Your grammar teachers were and continue to be wrong.

Whilst I double space, and so do have my grammar teachers in the past, you are correct. I did some research and the monospace thing on the typewriter and found that you are correct, and I have noticed that if you were to double space in iChat, it automatically removes one spacing. It's going to be rather hard for me to change, but I would like to thank you for opening my eyes. It makes sense now.

thequicksilver
Sep 23, 2005, 12:44 PM
I wrote most of my papers in 12 point Optima. It's nice and easy to read. Then again I also printed all of my essays and whatnot on resume paper. It feels nicer and it's easier to write commentary on it. Unless your professor is a standards nazi, chances are they won't care what font you use so long as it's not outrageous and they can read it easily.

Entirely. Optima is an absurdly elegant sans serif font whose usage is suitable for almost any occasion.

If you're willing to splash out the cash however for a font, consider Frutiger (http://www.linotype.com/469/frutiger-family.html). Along the same lines as Optima.

Plymouthbreezer
Oct 10, 2005, 12:12 AM
This is indeed a nice font, but so is this.

(Optima and Gill Sans)

I use Gill Sans for AIM, E-mails, and most school papers. Optima gets use for more "official documents."