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MacRumors
Oct 23, 2012, 09:39 PM
http://images.macrumors.com/im/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/10/23/ipad-mini-supports-with-siri-ipad-2-still-doesnt/)


http://images.macrumors.com/article-new/2012/10/siripadmini.jpg
Apple's iPad comparison page (http://www.apple.com/ipad/compare/) shows the spec details between the iPad mini, iPad 2 and iPad with Retina Display. Of interest, the iPad mini supports Siri while the iPad 2 does not, despite sharing the same Dual-Core A5 processor as the iPad 2.

Before the launch, there was some speculation that there may have been technical reasons why the iPad 2 was not capable of supporting Siri. The new iPad mini does have internal improvements over the iPad 2 but does share the same A5 processor. It may also be possible there could have be microphone improvements with the new device, but Apple hasn't specified.

Article Link: iPad Mini Supports Siri, iPad 2 Still Doesn't (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/10/23/ipad-mini-supports-with-siri-ipad-2-still-doesnt/)



notjustjay
Oct 23, 2012, 09:41 PM
I think that headline should read "iPad Mini Supports Siri, iPad 2 Still Doesn't".

Aidan5806
Oct 23, 2012, 09:42 PM
Ummmmm....."iPad mini Supports with Siri"......

I believe that is an improper use of words.

maccompatible
Oct 23, 2012, 09:44 PM
I'd say it's a licensing issue. Only devices created after acquisition of the siri company can have the feature, due to legal reasons.

hh83917
Oct 23, 2012, 09:44 PM
Um Apple will probably tell you it's the microphones in the iPad2 being not good enough to do voice recognition or something...

Avatarshark
Oct 23, 2012, 09:44 PM
I think they want the customer to buy the Mini or the new one instead of the 2 that is why don't allow Siri on the old iPad.

WatchTheThrone
Oct 23, 2012, 09:44 PM
Of course it doesn't....Apple needs people to upgrade duh....

TMar
Oct 23, 2012, 09:48 PM
If they didn't hold back features then how could they dupe so many people into upgrades every year,

kas23
Oct 23, 2012, 10:00 PM
Really, should we worry about this? Is Siri really all that?

PeopleTheseDays
Oct 23, 2012, 10:02 PM
The iPad 2 can't support Siri because it is just too thin !!

RoboCop001
Oct 23, 2012, 10:06 PM
I'd say it's a licensing issue. Only devices created after acquisition of the siri company can have the feature, due to legal reasons.

Regardless of how likely it is, that is the most un-neurotic explanation I've heard about lack of Siri on a device. Well done! :D

iMule
Oct 23, 2012, 10:09 PM
Siri is like most fat women — she prefers to wear smaller clothes regardless of how tight of a squeeze they are over something more comfortable.

Gemütlichkeit
Oct 23, 2012, 10:14 PM
Apple needs to get their stuff together.

coder12
Oct 23, 2012, 10:30 PM
Really, should we worry about this? Is Siri really all that?

I find myself using it all the time. It's easier to say "Call my dad" while walking than to Power On >> Slide to Unlock >> Home >> Phone >> Favorites >> Parents' Home >> Call or to ask about places to eat or for directions. It's been quite the lifesaver for me when I find ways to integrate it with my workflow.

a0me
Oct 23, 2012, 10:30 PM
Maybe so, but the old new iPad does support it.
No, that's not confusing at all.

musicpenguy
Oct 23, 2012, 10:36 PM
It is a licensing issue with Nuance - Apple setup deals for new devices - every iPad 2 has to play by the same rules - that is why there is no Siri

FloatingBones
Oct 23, 2012, 10:54 PM
It seems as if Apple is doing all they can to discourage the purchase of an iPad 2. They want people to go with the Mini or the 4. Keeping Siri off of the 2 seems consistent with that plan.

macingman
Oct 23, 2012, 11:03 PM
It is a licensing issue with Nuance - Apple setup deals for new devices - every iPad 2 has to play by the same rules - that is why there is no Siri
Proof?

mrsir2009
Oct 24, 2012, 12:25 AM
Really, should we worry about this? Is Siri really all that?

True, that :o

pauliaK
Oct 24, 2012, 12:41 AM
I'm afraid Siri won't ever find it's way to second gen iPad. It's a feature for new toys, one of the reasons to pay some extra for those who don't give a crap about processing power or other hardware improvements, because technically good old second gen iPad is easily capable of all the new tricks that it's restricted to, though there's only a few and Siri is the most significant.

jmpnop
Oct 24, 2012, 12:46 AM
If they didn't hold back features then how could they dupe so many people into upgrades every year,

This. People giving reasons are just defending Apple's planned obsolescence.

DMH3006
Oct 24, 2012, 01:10 AM
This. People giving reasons are just defending Apple's planned obsolescence.
If they brought every feature to every device what would be the reason to upgrade?:p
Yes if the sole requirement to support siri was having an A5 chip the iPad 2 would have it however they probably need/want the hardware to have some mics on it therefore no iPad 2 support

Mindcrime
Oct 24, 2012, 01:20 AM
The iPad mini Wi-fi only doesn't have GPS, so I imagine the Siri functionality is limited --

Long press Home button....

"BOOP!"

"I want to drink coffee"

"Would you like to search the web for 'I want to drink coffee?'"

Long press....

"BOOP"

"Where is the closest coffee shop?"

"Would you like to search the web for 'Where is the nearest coffee shop?'"

"AARRGGH!"

"I'm sorry, Mindcrime, I do not understand what you mean."

"ARRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGH!"

george-brooks
Oct 24, 2012, 02:16 AM
Will the 2 be going away, with the 3 taking its place, or is the new iPad simply a direct replacement for the iPad 3? Will overstock units be sold as refurbs or what?

On another note, is Siri even that useful on an iPad? I don't own one so I can't speak from experience but I feel like most of Siri's useful functions are phone specific.

MacRumorUser
Oct 24, 2012, 02:26 AM
It seems as if Apple is doing all they can to discourage the purchase of an iPad 2. They want people to go with the Mini.

So apple does not want the consumer to spend $399 so they blocked Siri forcing those that want it to spend $329 ???

tatonka
Oct 24, 2012, 02:28 AM
Will the 2 be going away, with the 3 taking its place, or is the new iPad simply a direct replacement for the iPad 3? Will overstock units be sold as refurbs or what?

On another note, is Siri even that useful on an iPad? I don't own one so I can't speak from experience but I feel like most of Siri's useful functions are phone specific.

No, the iPad 2 will stick around with the iPad 3 being replaced by the 4th generation. I would guess the remaining stock would go into replacement and repair and most of the stock will be sold as refurbs soon.

I only use siri to set calender alerts or timers or trigger phone calls when I am in the car (what I could do without Siri as well) ... for pretty much anything else I find it pretty useless.

T.

Lumi
Oct 24, 2012, 02:44 AM
If Apple shrank the size of the iPad Mini's A5 CPU then it would have resulted in the part becoming smaller faster and consuming less power.
This is most likely why the device can support Siri and why also Apple were able to achieve 10 hours battery life with the Mini's smaller battery when the iPad 2 has a much bigger one.

Just because iPad Mini has an A5 chip does not mean it is the same A5 chip, just that the architecture is broadly same.

Zunjine
Oct 24, 2012, 04:09 AM
Oh man, the sense of entitlement and the childish whining is almost too much.

Not offering some new features (e.g., Siri) to older devices is not "planned obsolescence" because not adding new features doesn't stop your old features from working – the device is no less useful than it was the day before these new features were released for newer devices.

When you buy a device you buy the device as is. Any new features that are later given to you FOR FREE are a bonus. You have no right to expect them or demand them.

Furthermore, in this space, Apple offers better support than any other provider. Android devices rarely if ever get updates - and if they do it is often after months of waiting and with piles of carrier and manufacturer specific bloatware shovelled on top. People who bought Windows Phone 7 devices only this year have no upgrade path to Windows Phone 8 - none. But someone who still uses a 3GS which they bought three years ago can upgrade to iOS6 and enjoy 90% of the same functionality and the other, under the hood, benefits of that new OS that owners of a brand new iPhone 5 receive.

Are people happy? Do they feel well looked after and valued because the device they paid for three years ago(!) is still getting new, improved features for free? Most of them, yes. But others, not so much. They moan. They’re like children at Christmas, surrounded by presents, crying because one thing they wanted isn’t in the pile.

Seanozz
Oct 24, 2012, 04:20 AM
My iPhone 4 doesn't have Siri and I'm not complaining. My buddies 3GS doesn't either and he doesn't give a rats ass either.

Why does everyone here seem to be butt Hurt an older device doesn't have a newer feature?

Only thing I'm complaining about is my 4 has almost 6gb of other and I've erased everything and can't get it to go away. My phone also will not finish a synch EVER. Now those are the kinds of complaints we should focus on. Lol

Macist
Oct 24, 2012, 04:26 AM
I think the iPad 2 only exists now due to a pile of inventory. Apple now has a lot more models in every category but that's not really their instinct.

The iPad 2 and the non-retina MacBook Pros will fade away relatively soon.

makitango
Oct 24, 2012, 05:07 AM
I find myself using it all the time. It's easier to say "Call my dad" while walking than to Power On >> Slide to Unlock >> Home >> Phone >> Favorites >> Parents' Home >> Call or to ask about places to eat or for directions. It's been quite the lifesaver for me when I find ways to integrate it with my workflow.

You don't need Siri to call your dad. You can deactivate Siri and use the previous voice control by just saying his name (Not even "call", "mobile", "home" or stuff. If needed, it will ask again for further choices) and since it doesn't rely on an internet connection, it is also faster. In fact, it is instant and therefore the best voice control for calls if you don't have a voice which needs Siri to decrypt artifacts... ;)
I have a 4S and I have Siri turned off. It just feels better this way.

adder7712
Oct 24, 2012, 06:12 AM
Um Apple will probably tell you it's the microphones in the iPad2 being not good enough to do voice recognition or something...

I though the iPad mini and the iPad 3/3.5 have the same mic assembly?

Bowbieloll
Oct 24, 2012, 07:03 AM
I take it you haven't used Siri on an iPad without GPS then?

The iPad mini Wi-fi only doesn't have GPS, so I imagine the Siri functionality is limited --

Long press Home button....

"BOOP!"

"I want to drink coffee"

"Would you like to search the web for 'I want to drink coffee?'"

Long press....

"BOOP"

"Where is the closest coffee shop?"

"Would you like to search the web for 'Where is the nearest coffee shop?'"

"AARRGGH!"

"I'm sorry, Mindcrime, I do not understand what you mean."

"ARRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGH!"

crackbookpro
Oct 24, 2012, 07:25 AM
Apple's meticulous battle of leveraging hardware vs software & vice-versa, has been intereferred by ongoing contracts/negotiations... who would of thought??? :rolleyes:

Figuratively, Apple is a submarine heading from one island to the next with a whole new set of goodies promised for each port... except, the sea life/creature knows what Apple is doing, and the rest of the world is just the prototypical Apple consumer going to want/buy the next best thing from Apple because they lack the underlying truths of how Apple's plays "ball".

Basically, there are only some who know the true business model surrounding Apple... but hey, it works. It works really really well actually.

How you capitalize on margins - is all about marketing & cutting costs without the public knowing you actually are.

The biggest definition of Apple being petty(or 'smart' as I see it) from a business stance as I mention above - is still keeping the retina display devices to only a max of 64GB storage. They have been having flash storage get cheaper & cheaper while their product line doesn't not reciprocate the market trend of 3 years prior.

Upgrade the damn flash memory Apple... the next iPad better have 96GB or 128GB, or I will suddenly get a taste of a "rotten" Apple in my mouth. :cool:

Apple, iCould may help you, but it doesn't help me!!! Give me more hard storage... I know you get the 8,16 & 32GB flash cards for cheap, but hook me up!

DavidLeblond
Oct 24, 2012, 08:02 AM
I find myself using it all the time. It's easier to say "Call my dad" while walking than to Power On >> Slide to Unlock >> Home >> Phone >> Favorites >> Parents' Home >> Call or to ask about places to eat or for directions. It's been quite the lifesaver for me when I find ways to integrate it with my workflow.

I totally agree that some stuff, like setting alarms and timers, is much easier with Siri. I disagree about the calling people bit though... Voice Control was faster because it didn't have to send stuff to a server and it seemed to match up my contacts better than Siri.

bushido
Oct 24, 2012, 08:18 AM
people will have a blast selling the new old iPad on ebay. i picture many dumb beeps looking for the "iPad with Retina" and end up buying a used new old iPad instead ^^

wgnoyes
Oct 24, 2012, 08:34 AM
Siri on the ipad2? I'm surprised the ipad2 is still around! I fully expected apple to drop it entirely in announcing the ipad mini, so there was certainly no reason to think they would retrofit siri into it! The ipad2 has been functionally stabilized. That is, they're not going to do anything additional to it.

mono1980
Oct 24, 2012, 08:39 AM
I'm really surprised Apple hasn't dropped the iPad 2. I don't know why anybody would buy it over the iPad Mini or the new 4th Gen iPad. It's the worst value of the bunch that's for sure.

jrswizzle
Oct 24, 2012, 08:56 AM
This. People giving reasons are just defending Apple's planned obsolescence.

Not like this is some new marketing strategy that Apple invented....everything goes through planned obsolescence. Video games, Android phones, that new mixer your wife wants....its part of consumerism. Dunno why its so shocking that Apple follows this model as well?

----------

I'm really surprised Apple hasn't dropped the iPad 2. I don't know why anybody would buy it over the iPad Mini or the new 4th Gen iPad. It's the worst value of the bunch that's for sure.

Doesn't the iPad 2 kinda remind you of the MacBook Pro now? I mean the Air is just about as powerful these days (for the average person using it) and is also cheaper and lighter and thinner. And if you want to do some more intese computing, you'll want the power of the rMBP....leaves the middle child out - which I think is Apple's intention. That middle product won't be around for long.

----------

people will have a blast selling the new old iPad on ebay. i picture many dumb beeps looking for the "iPad with Retina" and end up buying a used new old iPad instead ^^

Ahh good point....probably could've gotten away with that....

Oh well, sold mine (new iPad) to Best Buy and will be picking up an iPad w/ retina on Nov. 2.

PracticalMac
Oct 24, 2012, 08:56 AM
Siri, send message to Apple, "support yourself on iPad 2."

t066j
Oct 24, 2012, 08:57 AM
WOW! The iPad Mini sure looks like the Samsung Galaxy Note mobile phone to me? What's up with that Apple?

RMo
Oct 24, 2012, 09:10 AM
The iPad mini Wi-fi only doesn't have GPS, so I imagine the Siri functionality is limited --

No, in most cases, it can still accurately guess your location (based on the digital compass and nearby Wi-Fi networks--and, by the way, GPS on any device doesn't work well inside, so many probably fall back to this or cellular location anyway). All iOS devices include Location Services. The hardware just limits exactly how accurate it might be.

Also of note: the Wi-Fi only iPad "3" doesn't have GPS, either. The most important limiting factor is that you can't use Siri without an Internet connection.

Porco
Oct 24, 2012, 09:13 AM
Siri, why aren't you on the iPad 2?

"But I am on the iPad too! I'm on the iPad, the iPad Mini, the iPhone and the iPod Touch"

No Siri, the second iPad

"Correct, no Siri on the second iPad!"

Yes, but why not?!

"I'm sorry, I'm afraid I can't answer that"

But what if I want my iPad 2 to answer questions using you Siri?

"A tutu is a short, flamboyant skirt typically worn by ballerinas, not Siri"

Oh forget it Siri, I don't really care that you aren't on the iPad 2 anymore.

"I'm sorry, I'm afraid I can't answer that"

gatearray
Oct 24, 2012, 09:15 AM
Doesn't anyone here remember when FaceTime came out?

It was included on all new Macs, yet existing Mac owners had to buy it in the App Store. Why was that? What a rip off, right? Typical Apple greed, you say. Well, hold on a second…

It turns out there are legal issues that prohibit "adding significant functionality" to an already existing device. They couldn't give away FaceTime to existing Mac owners who already bought their computer, they had to sell it to them through the App Store to meet this legal requirement. Something to do with FCC filings, or some such nonsense.

And before you ask why they "brought it" to the iPad 3, clearly they included this contingency in their filings as existing functionality, even though it wasn't ready to be included at launch. They haven't charged for iOS updates in years, and you can't sell a Siri "component" through the iOS App Store, not that they would even want to put a price on it if they could.

andrewlgm
Oct 24, 2012, 09:21 AM
Um Apple will probably tell you it's the microphones in the iPad2 being not good enough to do voice recognition or something...

Jailbroken ipad 2 runs Siri as well as the ipad 3. The reason why it's not available? Simple answer. It is because apple does not give the most exciting new feature to older hardware. Simple. If you want it, then buy a new iPad.

mdelvecchio
Oct 24, 2012, 09:52 AM
I think they want the customer to buy the Mini or the new one instead of the 2 that is why don't allow Siri on the old iPad.

yeah man! its a CONSPIRACY! C-O-N-spiracy!

nevermind that apple still offers and sells the ipad2 as part of their product lineup...

----------

Maybe so, but the old new iPad does support it.
No, that's not confusing at all.

"third-generation"...whats so confusing or difficult about that? we've been referring to ipods and macbooks by similar nomenclature for a decade.

----------

It seems as if Apple is doing all they can to discourage the purchase of an iPad 2. They want people to go with the Mini or the 4. Keeping Siri off of the 2 seems consistent with that plan.

rubbish. if apple didnt want customers to buy the ipad2, they wouldnt continue to sell the ipad2!

seriously people. brains, use em. they continue to offer a mid-level product because they want to capture the mid-level market in addition to the upper and lower markets.

----------

This. People giving reasons are just defending Apple's planned obsolescence.

what a joke. iOS has the longest supported lifespan in the mobile industry. you want to talk about PO take a look at android -- how common is it for a given android handset to support *no* future OS updates?

i read these posts and i wonder what its like to live in such a dark shadowy world where everyone is out to get you....its the stuff of X-Files.

if apple didnt want to support the ipad2, they would simply stop supporting it. like google/motorola. they wouldnt continue to manufacture and sell them.

croooow
Oct 24, 2012, 10:12 AM
I do not think Apple should introduce any new iOS hardware that does NOT support Siri.

iHenry
Oct 24, 2012, 10:21 AM
I posted this already on a different thread but some of the questions remain unanswered:

Should there not be a decrease in performance, having the same A5 processor but taking care of the higher resolutions of both cameras, the higher pixel density screen, but with a smaller battery? Even if the screen is smaller?

Will they retrofit the iPad2 to have Siri with an update?
After the iPad mini introduction people are starting to shout out loud for a fair explanation as the situation can be easily seen by the consumers as an abuse they can't technically understand.
Does the same thing happen with the personal hotspot that iPad2 users can't have? Does the iPad mini have it?

Why would they not let the iPad2 have Siri then?
A business decision instead of a technical one?

xriderx11
Oct 24, 2012, 10:31 AM
This doesn't surprise me.


Apple knows that If u want a bigger screen you will pay more money. They'd rather make you buy the newer one because it will cost you more money.


It has NOTHING to do with specs. I bet the iPhone 3G could run Siri if apple allowed it. There was an app called "personal assistant" and apple bought it from them and I used my iPod touch 2G and 3G and 4G with it. So all the iPads can run Siri if apple allowed it. Apple just wants you to milk the most money out of you.

Same thing with the iPod touch. They want you to spend an extra 100$ and go with the 32gb to get the 5th generation that has Siri.


And the iPhone 4G and how it doesn't have 3D maps and maps voice guidance. It's just another way to make you buy the newest thing and not buy an older or keep your existing iPhone... When you buy more things= profit for apple


____


So no I believe apple will not add Siri to the iPad 2.... They'd rather u buy the iPad 3 or 4 from them.

musclerotton
Oct 24, 2012, 11:01 AM
This makes sense. Phase out iPad 2, just have iPad mini and iPad. Explains the name game. It was never "the new iPad." It was, the new "iPad." I like apple because it continues to grow but they make sure to weed out the old stuff. Keeps things simple. Doesn't the kindle have like 7 different versions out right now?

CaryMacGuy
Oct 24, 2012, 11:24 AM
Trying to figure out Apple's decisions these days is a little hard. I understand Apple not including Siri on the iPhone 4. I installed it a while back and my device came to a screeching halt. However the iPad 2 has the same internal specs as the iPad Mini so that doesn't make sense (unless they don't want to spend the effort porting to a "legacy" device).

Also slightly on that subject. Why didn't the 1st gen iPad get iOS 6??? It has better specs than the iPhone 3GS and is newer. It is kind of on par with the iPhone 4. Explain that quandry to me?

MacSignal
Oct 24, 2012, 11:40 AM
Will the 2 be going away, with the 3 taking its place, or is the new iPad simply a direct replacement for the iPad 3? Will overstock units be sold as refurbs or what?

On another note, is Siri even that useful on an iPad? I don't own one so I can't speak from experience but I feel like most of Siri's useful functions are phone specific.

While there is inventory, I think Apple might cut the price of the iPad 2 the way it has cut the prices of previous generation iPhones.

FloatingBones
Oct 24, 2012, 11:52 AM
So apple does not want the consumer to spend $399 so they blocked Siri forcing those that want it to spend $329 ???

Hey! Don't put words in my mouth. If you have a question what I mean, then ask a question.

The iPad 2 is clearly the disconnect in the iPad family. It's the oldest product with an obsolete data port. Apple isn't going to spend the money to update the connector, and they're not going to spend any money (developer, test cycles, etc.) to add Siri capability to the device.

Why is it still in the line? I don't know. Perhaps they have a fair amount of stock and they want to maintain its price as they clear the inventory. I fully expect the iPad 2 will be dropped form the product line no later than early in 2013.

iKnackwurst
Oct 24, 2012, 01:04 PM
I like to use Siri on my iPhone 4S, but i never missed it on my iPad 2.

SeaFox
Oct 24, 2012, 01:52 PM
Before the launch, there was some speculation that there may have been technical reasons why the iPad 2 was not capable of supporting Siri. The new iPad mini does have internal improvements over the iPad 2 but does share the same A5 processor. It may also be possible there could have be microphone improvements with the new device, but Apple hasn't specified.

Because it's unfathomable that Apple is withholding Siri on the iPad 2 simply to get people to upgrade. :rolleyes: It's not like they've ever done that before. Oh, wait. They did. With Siri on the iPhone 4.

Sometimes the answer you don't want to hear really is the most likely one.

bpeeps
Oct 24, 2012, 02:33 PM
I find myself using it all the time. It's easier to say "Call my dad" while walking than to Power On >> Slide to Unlock >> Home >> Phone >> Favorites >> Parents' Home >> Call or to ask about places to eat or for directions. It's been quite the lifesaver for me when I find ways to integrate it with my workflow.

When it works...

"Hey Siri, call my pops!"

"I have found three stores that sell mops. Two of them are fairly close to you."

charlituna
Oct 24, 2012, 02:45 PM
Really, should we worry about this? Is Siri really all that?

It's nifty but it's not like it's the only way to use the iPad.

ArcaneDevice
Oct 24, 2012, 02:51 PM
if apple didnt want to support the ipad2, they would simply stop supporting it. like google/motorola. they wouldnt continue to manufacture and sell them.

You mean like the continuing support for the iPod Classic?

Apple supply older hardware only until a product has been released that fills the same niche. Unless it's a professional product in which case they will drop it like a hot rock just because.

Apple are just acting like pricks here and no amount of anti-Android rhetoric masks that fact. Siri could work on an iPad 2. People have got it to work on an iPad 2. Apple can very easily allow it to work on an iPad 2.

They choose not to purely for sales and marketing purposes. They've done it before and they will continue to do so. Restricting a feature purely to give a newer product a minor marketing advantage is Apple MO.

The other fact worth noting here is that Siri is borderline useless on an iPad and just a novelty act. It has limited response information as it is on a phone and serves mainly as a hands-free system. On the iPad, a device which always sits in your lap, voice control is pointless.

madhatter61
Oct 24, 2012, 03:28 PM
Of course it doesn't....Apple needs people to upgrade duh....

On a technical viewpoint (not getting into opinions with likes and dislikes).

While iPad2 has the same A5 chip and graphics ... they do not have the higher performance LTE radio combo chip, nor the cameras, nor the microphone quality. Siri is an iCloud service, and depends upon high speed interface with Apple servers. I have dictation apps from Nuance that work quite well, but doesn't have the search features offered via Siri.

I noticed another comment mentioned something about licenses, as well.

As Apple continues to upgrade, they (like everyone else) do not upgrade the hardware that has already been sold. It is just the way it is. (it is not just a software issue).
:)
Hope this helps.

----------

You mean like the continuing support for the iPod Classic?

Apple supply older hardware only until a product has been released that fills the same niche. Unless it's a professional product in which case they will drop it like a hot rock just because.

Apple are just acting like pricks here and no amount of anti-Android rhetoric masks that fact. Siri could work on an iPad 2. People have got it to work on an iPad 2. Apple can very easily allow it to work on an iPad 2.

They choose not to purely for sales and marketing purposes. They've done it before and they will continue to do so. Restricting a feature purely to give a newer product a minor marketing advantage is Apple MO.

The other fact worth noting here is that Siri is borderline useless on an iPad and just a novelty act. It has limited response information as it is on a phone and serves mainly as a hands-free system. On the iPad, a device which always sits in your lap, voice control is pointless.

Strong opinions ... not much for the facts department though ...

As for function, voice dictation is quite handy on an iPad2 (which I have and use all the time). I really don't care for the on-screen keyboard ... I use a blue tooth Apple keyboard when I want to do a lot of typing. Great keyboard.
But, maybe you could go EZ on the strong opinions ... not worth much to me.

mrbrown
Oct 24, 2012, 03:32 PM
Also slightly on that subject. Why didn't the 1st gen iPad get iOS 6??? It has better specs than the iPhone 3GS and is newer. It is kind of on par with the iPhone 4. Explain that quandry to me?

It is not on par with the iPhone 4 in terms of memory. iPhone 4 has 512MB of memory. The original iPad has 256MB of memory, which is more on par with the 3GS.

Have you ever run iOS 5 on the original iPad? Horrible, especially with Safari, which constantly crashes due to a lack of memory.

coder12
Oct 24, 2012, 04:07 PM
When it works...

"Hey Siri, call my pops!"

"I have found three stores that sell mops. Two of them are fairly close to you."

Haha that made me laugh! Same thing for "Siri, call me an ambulance!" -- "Okay, I can call you 'ambulance' from now on if you'd like"

adnbek
Oct 24, 2012, 05:07 PM
On a technical viewpoint (not getting into opinions with likes and dislikes).

While iPad2 has the same A5 chip and graphics ... they do not have the higher performance LTE radio combo chip, nor the cameras, nor the microphone quality. Siri is an iCloud service, and depends upon high speed interface with Apple servers. I have dictation apps from Nuance that work quite well, but doesn't have the search features offered via Siri.


Bullcrap. The 4S doesn't have LTE either.

There's no technical limitation, so stop trying to find one. It's a marketing decision, pure and simple.

moonman239
Oct 24, 2012, 05:19 PM
The iPad mini Wi-fi only doesn't have GPS, so I imagine the Siri functionality is limited --

Long press Home button....

"BOOP!"

"I want to drink coffee"

"Would you like to search the web for 'I want to drink coffee?'"

Long press....

"BOOP"

"Where is the closest coffee shop?"

"Would you like to search the web for 'Where is the nearest coffee shop?'"

"AARRGGH!"

"I'm sorry, Mindcrime, I do not understand what you mean."

"ARRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGH!"

It does not have a GPS chip, but it can still guess where you are based on the location info given to Apple by people who have iPhones or iPads that are capable of connecting to a cellular network. If Apple has location info submitted by people who are/were connected to a neighboring hotspot that your device sees, then it can use that data too.

Galatian
Oct 24, 2012, 05:27 PM
Bullcrap. The 4S doesn't have LTE either.

There's no technical limitation, so stop trying to find one. It's a marketing decision, pure and simple.

Agreed. I keep my iPhone 4S on Edge most of the time to save battery (I only turn on 3G when using the personal hotspot) and Siri feels just as snappy. Siri uses VERY little bandwidth.

Nitrocide
Oct 24, 2012, 05:49 PM
Oh man, the sense of entitlement and the childish whining is almost too much.

Not offering some new features (e.g., Siri) to older devices is not "planned obsolescence" because not adding new features doesn't stop your old features from working – the device is no less useful than it was the day before these new features were released for newer devices.

When you buy a device you buy the device as is. Any new features that are later given to you FOR FR etc...

Unfortunately Apple IS still selling an iPad 2 as a new device and has had plenty of time to incorporate the feature. They should have at least continued iPad 2 spec sheet but added Siri support and renamed it the iPad 2.5, thus negating current iPad 2 users from the entitlement of a feature by product name and enabling new buyers to have current technology.

Apple are in the wrong and a bit lazy, iPad 2 in current form should be way cheaper considering its age.

Vasilioskn
Oct 24, 2012, 07:48 PM
Siri is extremely overrated. I have used it twice. It's easier to just google information.

MartiNZ
Oct 24, 2012, 08:27 PM
I tapped the microphone key by mistake twice. Then I turned off Siri on my iPhone 5. I cannot envisage a situation in which I would ever use it, so this IMO is one in favour of the iPad 2 lol; but everything else falls the other way.

spokenblurb
Oct 24, 2012, 11:20 PM
I bet the mini has 1gb of ram thus letting it run Siri and extending the life(for future updates) I know it's the A5 chip,but who says they couldn't have doubled the ram for the mini apple has been full of surprises as of late

musicpenguy
Oct 24, 2012, 11:49 PM
Bullcrap. The 4S doesn't have LTE either.

There's no technical limitation, so stop trying to find one. It's a marketing decision, pure and simple.

I stand by that it is a licensing issue with Nuance - the iPad 2 debuted before Siri was introduced and Apple cannot have some iPad 2s Siri capable and others not - if the iPad 2 debuted after the 4S it would have it.

Apple I'm sure would love to include it, but its a bigger issue than what may appear on the surface to observers like ourselves.

Jimmy James
Oct 25, 2012, 12:19 AM
I find myself using it all the time. It's easier to say "Call my dad" while walking than to Power On >> Slide to Unlock >> Home >> Phone >> Favorites >> Parents' Home >> Call

I do this without Siri.

Coastercraze
Oct 25, 2012, 12:19 AM
Siri was fun the first time I messed with my iPhone 5. After that, I don't see myself using it that much. If you want Siri, just get an iPhone and you won't care either that it's not on your iPad 2.

adnbek
Oct 25, 2012, 06:41 AM
I stand by that it is a licensing issue with Nuance - the iPad 2 debuted before Siri was introduced and Apple cannot have some iPad 2s Siri capable and others not - if the iPad 2 debuted after the 4S it would have it.

Except you said nothing about licensing issues. You talked about LTE, the mics and the cameras,

Apple I'm sure would love to include it, but its a bigger issue than what may appear on the surface to observers like ourselves.

I think you give Apple too much credit.

Lumi
Oct 25, 2012, 06:49 AM
I'm really surprised Apple hasn't dropped the iPad 2. I don't know why anybody would buy it over the iPad Mini or the new 4th Gen iPad. It's the worst value of the bunch that's for sure.

It's likely that the reason is that many businesses and integrators that have deployed or built solutions around iPad have done so around the dock connector. Apple is obviously maintaining the availability of that model so that those businesses can continue to deploy them while they update their solutions for lightning.

It's common for many vendors to do this where they have a large business or enterprise market, it's not so necessary in consumer where everybody wants the new shiny.

Not every business is agile enough to deploy an entirely new interface technology overnight, likewise the iPad2 is unlikely to be supply constrained and businesses can continue to purchase it readily, where the iPad3 and Mini will be difficult to obtain for a month or so following launch.

Lampmeister
Oct 25, 2012, 06:53 AM
The iPad 2 has been relegated to entry-level status. It's two-generations old now....why would anyone expect Apple to make upgrades to it?

tylernol
Oct 25, 2012, 08:14 AM
Um Apple will probably tell you it's the microphones in the iPad2 being not good enough to do voice recognition or something...


I believe the iPad 2 does not contain the background noise suppression technology, initially a standalone DSP by Audience, now integrated into the ARM SOC. So Siri could work , but nowhere near as well, on an iPad 2. The iPad Mini probably has it.

KdParker
Oct 25, 2012, 08:28 AM
Can you even buy an iPad 3 from apple anymore?

mono1980
Oct 25, 2012, 08:43 AM
It's likely that the reason is that many businesses and integrators that have deployed or built solutions around iPad have done so around the dock connector. Apple is obviously maintaining the availability of that model so that those businesses can continue to deploy them while they update their solutions for lightning.

It's common for many vendors to do this where they have a large business or enterprise market, it's not so necessary in consumer where everybody wants the new shiny.

Not every business is agile enough to deploy an entirely new interface technology overnight, likewise the iPad2 is unlikely to be supply constrained and businesses can continue to purchase it readily, where the iPad3 and Mini will be difficult to obtain for a month or so following launch.

Good point. Thank you!

FloatingBones
Oct 25, 2012, 12:30 PM
rubbish. if apple didnt want customers to buy the ipad2, they wouldnt continue to sell the ipad2! seriously people. brains, use em. they continue to offer a mid-level product because they want to capture the mid-level market in addition to the upper and lower markets.

I categorically disagree with characterizing the iPad 2 as a "mid level" product. After the latest announcement, it is 2 generations old, and it has an obsolete dock connector.

Apple would continue to sell the iPad 2 -- if they wish to clear out their inventory.

IMHO, Apple has one too many sets of SKUs in their iPad line, and the 2 is the odd man out. It will be gone in early 2013 -- if not sooner.

musicpenguy
Oct 25, 2012, 05:14 PM
[QUOTE=adnbek;16132029]Except you said nothing about licensing issues. You talked about LTE, the mics and the cameras]

Um when? - my original post on page one was all about Apple and licensing - nothing about the cameras etc. - very confused

Appleseeds
Oct 25, 2012, 05:35 PM
Can you even buy an iPad 3 from apple anymore?



Refurb only
http://store.apple.com/us/product/FC706/refurbished-ipad-with-wi-fi-32gb-black-3rd-generation

adnbek
Oct 25, 2012, 05:54 PM
[QUOTE=adnbek;16132029]Except you said nothing about licensing issues. You talked about LTE, the mics and the cameras]

Um when? - my original post on page one was all about Apple and licensing - nothing about the cameras etc. - very confused

Didn't read the whole thread, only that one post I replied to.

s15119
Oct 25, 2012, 09:40 PM
It seems as if Apple is doing all they can to discourage the purchase of an iPad 2. They want people to go with the Mini or the 4. Keeping Siri off of the 2 seems consistent with that plan.

You really think Apple is trying to discourage you from buying something it features in it's store.

http://store.apple.com/us/buy/home/shop_ipad/family/ipad2


sigh.

----------

Can you even buy an iPad 3 from apple anymore?


You never could. That product never existed.

----------

You mean like the continuing support for the iPod Classic?

Apple supply older hardware only until a product has been released that fills the same niche. Unless it's a professional product in which case they will drop it like a hot rock just because.

Apple are just acting like pricks here and no amount of anti-Android rhetoric masks that fact. Siri could work on an iPad 2. People have got it to work on an iPad 2. Apple can very easily allow it to work on an iPad 2.

They choose not to purely for sales and marketing purposes. They've done it before and they will continue to do so. Restricting a feature purely to give a newer product a minor marketing advantage is Apple MO.

The other fact worth noting here is that Siri is borderline useless on an iPad and just a novelty act. It has limited response information as it is on a phone and serves mainly as a hands-free system. On the iPad, a device which always sits in your lap, voice control is pointless.

It's useless, but Apple is deliberately withholding it as a marketing tactic. Let me guess, Romney voter?

AFDoc
Oct 26, 2012, 07:57 AM
Oh man, the sense of entitlement and the childish whining is almost too much.
Are people happy? Do they feel well looked after and valued because the device they paid for three years ago(!) is still getting new, improved features for free? Most of them, yes. But others, not so much. They moan. They’re like children at Christmas, surrounded by presents, crying because one thing they wanted isn’t in the pile.

Are you kidding me Zunjine? Do you really expect most on here to be rational? This is MR, home of the privileged apple fan. They want it all, they want it now because after all, they are entitled right? Gotta remember this too.... this is also the home of folks not able to make up their on decision about anything. Asking help with the most basic life decision like which color or size to get.

Never try to be logical here on MR, you'll just be frustrated and want to go on a multi state killing spree.

AzN1337c0d3r
Oct 27, 2012, 08:29 PM
Not offering some new features (e.g., Siri) to older devices is not "planned obsolescence" because not adding new features doesn't stop your old features from working – the device is no less useful than it was the day before these new features were released for newer devices.


From Wikipedia:

Planned functional obsolescence is a type of technical obsolescence in which companies introduce new technology which replaces the old. The old products do not have the same capabilities or functionality as the new ones.

What's even more damning is that Apple didnt even bother to introduce a technical improvement to the iPad Mini to be able to excuse it from having Siri.

FloatingBones
Oct 28, 2012, 04:28 PM
You really think Apple is trying to discourage you from buying something it features in it's store.

http://store.apple.com/us/buy/home/shop_ipad/family/ipad2

Actually, it's not being featured. See http://store.apple.com : the iPad Mini is the iPad being featured.

Apple is going to spend no money refreshing the obsolete port on this unit, and they'll do noting to support Siri on this model. That's the evidence that Apple is discouraging the purchase of this model.

I predict that Apple will discontinue the iPad 2 in early 2013.

EmpireITtech
Oct 29, 2012, 01:56 PM
Can you even buy an iPad 3 from apple anymore?

nope..just go to the site, takes 1 minute to find this out

KdParker
Oct 29, 2012, 03:09 PM
nope..just go to the site, takes 1 minute to find this out

Posted that question awhile back and found out that you can only get one as a refurb.

blimey48
Oct 30, 2012, 11:07 PM
Proof?

hahah dozens of irrational posts....one person posts the most logical explanation and..."PROOF?!?!"

KojiH
Oct 31, 2012, 01:47 AM
I think the choice by Apple to continue to leave the iPad 2 and iPhone 4 without Siri is mostly for marketing reasons as others have suggested.

As for the arguments that the microphone is not good enough or that the processor or wireless data is not fast enough on the iPad 2 or iPhone 4, how does this explain why the new Google App voice search function works flawlessly on these older devices. Adding insult to injury it is even noticeably faster than the Siri on my iPhone 5.

FloatingBones
Oct 31, 2012, 01:20 PM
So apple does not want the consumer to spend $399 so they blocked Siri forcing those that want it to spend $329 ???

Not exactly. Gruber nailed the reason (http://daringfireball.net/2012/10/ipad_mini) why the iPad 2 is still around:

I was confused by this at first. Why keep the iPad 2 around? Then the answer hit me: the iPad 2 must have continued to sell well over the last seven months. There can be no other explanation. If it weren’t selling well, Apple would have dropped it from the lineup. But because it is selling well, they’re keeping it in the lineup, because they don’t know why it’s selling well. If it’s only because of the lower price, the iPad Mini might obviate it. But perhaps it’s not that people want the least expensive iPad, but instead that they want the least expensive full-size iPad.

But the key is that the iPad 2’s non-retina display has not kept it from selling well alongside the retina iPad 3. For many people, retina resolution is nice-to-have, not must-have.
[...]
If the Mini had a retina display, I’d switch from the iPad 3 in a heartbeat. As it stands, I’m going to switch anyway. Going non-retina is a particularly bitter pill for me, but I like the iPad Mini’s size and weight so much that I’m going to swallow it.

In other words, Gruber prefers the Mini to his iPad 3 -- and the only factor for preferring the 3 is the retina display. He sees no advantage for the 2 over the mini.

Once Apple sees the numbers for the holiday season, they will decide if phasing out the 2 is the way to go. It seems like a slam-dunk: consumers will prefer a smaller and lighter package -- for less money.

In a year, we'll have a large iPad, a retina iPad mini, and the current iPad mini for a low-cost intro model.

golosin2
Nov 22, 2012, 03:28 AM
As for function, voice dictation is quite handy on an iPad2 (which I have and use all the time). I really don't care for the on-screen keyboard ... I use a blue tooth Apple keyboard when I want to do a lot of typing. Great keyboard.
But, maybe you could go EZ on the strong opinions ... not worth much to me.

How do you use Voice Dictation on an iPad2, if it has not Siri...?

PS: im on ios5, dont know if ios6 comes with voice dictation on an ipad2.

terraphantm
Nov 22, 2012, 10:11 PM
Doesn't anyone here remember when FaceTime came out?

It was included on all new Macs, yet existing Mac owners had to buy it in the App Store. Why was that? What a rip off, right? Typical Apple greed, you say. Well, hold on a second…

It turns out there are legal issues that prohibit "adding significant functionality" to an already existing device. They couldn't give away FaceTime to existing Mac owners who already bought their computer, they had to sell it to them through the App Store to meet this legal requirement. Something to do with FCC filings, or some such nonsense.

And before you ask why they "brought it" to the iPad 3, clearly they included this contingency in their filings as existing functionality, even though it wasn't ready to be included at launch. They haven't charged for iOS updates in years, and you can't sell a Siri "component" through the iOS App Store, not that they would even want to put a price on it if they could.

I think this is simply an excuse. Other companies add significant functionality to their devices without charging the user all the time. Microsoft in particular adds many features to its products at no cost. The xbox 360 has gained many features since its release - many of which were likely not planned for from day 1.

I don't see why Microsoft can legally do that if Apple can't.