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nStyle
Oct 30, 2012, 08:32 AM
I have to admit that it is two years later, but regardless, the competition is getting heated, which is only a good thing for consumers. I still love my iPad 3 and don't see a reason to upgrade just yet but Google has really upped the ante and had now shown consumers what is possible for the money.

Apple is safely hiding behind iOS and relying on consumer ignorance as far as "features". Like many of you know, the "features" Apple releases are things they think you should be able to do. They will have to revamp iOS eventually, and it is either going to be beautiful or ugly.

I really don't understand Apple's logic. They make a ton of money on the device AND on the consumption side of things (software). I mean this is OKAY as long as they can get away with it, but I feel that their grip on this high profits on everything will soon fade away as the competition pours from Microsoft and Google.

Now, to be fair, I don't feel that neither the Surface or the Nexus 10 are "iPad killers", but this is the first real true competitors we have seen so far.

Competition is a good thing.



mattopotamus
Oct 30, 2012, 08:37 AM
I agree the competition is great, but have you ever used a nexus tablet? I have, and personally it pales in comparison to an ipad in every way. App selection and hardware build.

sixteen12
Oct 30, 2012, 08:51 AM
Yeah I own a Xoom and Nexus 7...the 7 is better in that scaled phone apps work a lot better, but the app selection for android tablets is abysmal right now.

MonkeySee....
Oct 30, 2012, 09:04 AM
I think Apple will be quite content with the iPad and iOS are progressing.

Seeing my 2 year old interact with my iPad blows me away. Other tablets are not even close to having this usability.

PDFierro
Oct 30, 2012, 09:12 AM
I'm not interested in Android on a tablet, but the prices are amazing. $249 for a 32GB and only $50 more for mobile connectivity? Awesome.

onthecouchagain
Oct 30, 2012, 09:28 AM
I think the shakeup over at Apple is a clear sign iOS is in some dire straits. It'll be really interesting to see what Ive brings to the "Human Interface." Will we see a radical UI change? I don't think so. So what will Ive bring that Forestall didn't?

I'm excited, but personally, the boat has sailed for me. It'll take quite a bit of [gasp, dare I say it?] catching up on iOS' part to sway me away from Android.

Plus, I just like the humility and humbleness of the fellas over at Google better. :p

MikeAK
Oct 30, 2012, 10:06 AM
I think Apple will be quite content with the iPad and iOS are progressing.

Seeing my 2 year old interact with my iPad blows me away. Other tablets are not even close to having this usability.

That is your opinion and you're entitled to it but you obviously don't use or haven't used an Android device in the last year. They have come a long way. I use to dislike using Android for a number of reason but it has become a very stable alternative at a very respectable price.

mattopotamus
Oct 30, 2012, 10:12 AM
I think the shakeup over at Apple is a clear sign iOS is in some dire straits. It'll be really interesting to see what Ive brings to the "Human Interface." Will we see a radical UI change? I don't think so. So what will Ive bring that Forestall didn't?

I'm excited, but personally, the boat has sailed for me. It'll take quite a bit of [gasp, dare I say it?] catching up on iOS' part to sway me away from Android.

Plus, I just like the humility and humbleness of the fellas over at Google better. :p

couldn't agree more.

The Face
Oct 30, 2012, 10:24 AM
I agree the competition is great, but have you ever used a nexus tablet? I have, and personally it pales in comparison to an ipad in every way. App selection and hardware build.Have to agree and disagree. Whilst the Nexus 10 has a pretty hideous design, the hardware it runs including the screen is superior to that of the iPad 4's in every way.

matttye
Oct 30, 2012, 10:24 AM
I think the shakeup over at Apple is a clear sign iOS is in some dire straits. It'll be really interesting to see what Ive brings to the "Human Interface." Will we see a radical UI change? I don't think so. So what will Ive bring that Forestall didn't?

I'm excited, but personally, the boat has sailed for me. It'll take quite a bit of [gasp, dare I say it?] catching up on iOS' part to sway me away from Android.

Plus, I just like the humility and humbleness of the fellas over at Google better. :p

Same **** different suit.

Ive, Forstall, it doesn't matter. There's an entire team that all contribute towards iOS. It's not the product of one person's idea. Putting Ive in charge won't bring any radical changes I don't think.

MonkeySee....
Oct 30, 2012, 10:25 AM
That is your opinion and you're entitled to it but you obviously don't use or haven't used an Android device in the last year. They have come a long way. I use to dislike using Android for a number of reason but it has become a very stable alternative at a very respectable price.

I was only talking from a child's perspective.

You can't say Android is easier to use than an iPad in the eyes of a child? Surely?

matttye
Oct 30, 2012, 10:26 AM
I was only talking from a child's perspective.

You can't say Android is easier to use than an iPad in the eyes of a child? Surely?

It's not - no way near.

mattopotamus
Oct 30, 2012, 10:32 AM
Have to agree and disagree. Whilst the Nexus 10 has a pretty hideous design, the hardware it runs including the screen is superior to that of the iPad 4's in every way.

sorry, I should have worded that better. I meant the actual build quality. The way it feels in your hand. The n7 feels cheap IMO.

MikeAK
Oct 30, 2012, 10:35 AM
sorry, I should have worded that better. I meant the actual build quality. The way it feels in your hand. The n7 feels cheap IMO.

What are you expecting for $199? You can buy 2 Nexus 7's for the price of one Mini. Cheaper might be a better word to use. You make the Nexus 7 sound like a piece of junk. I have one sitting right here and can tell you it is built very well. Much better then the price tag would lead you to believe.

The Face
Oct 30, 2012, 10:37 AM
sorry, I should have worded that better. I meant the actual build quality. The way it feels in your hand. The n7 feels cheap IMO.Absolutely, the Nexus 7 doesn't look too bad, but the Nexus 10 is in a whole different league of ugly.

mattopotamus
Oct 30, 2012, 10:39 AM
What are you expecting for $199? You can buy 2 Nexus 7's for the price of one Mini. Cheaper might be a better word to use. You make the Nexus 7 sound like a piece of junk. I have one sitting right here and can tell you it is built very well. Much better then the price tag would lead you to believe.

exactly...comparing $329 to $199....who would do such a thing :)

Rodster
Oct 30, 2012, 11:29 AM
I think the shakeup over at Apple is a clear sign iOS is in some dire straits. It'll be really interesting to see what Ive brings to the "Human Interface." Will we see a radical UI change? I don't think so. So what will Ive bring that Forestall didn't?

I'm excited, but personally, the boat has sailed for me. It'll take quite a bit of [gasp, dare I say it?] catching up on iOS' part to sway me away from Android.

Plus, I just like the humility and humbleness of the fellas over at Google better. :p

Well said and as an iPad and Android owner I want them both to thrive but IMO Apple has got rather annoying with their attitude that everyone sucks and they're perfect. Their lawsuits on the competition just piles on, then they grace us with iOS 6 with the atrocious Maps and removal of the Youtube app.

As far as Google goes, they are playing from behind so you'd expect some humility but like any company who's the leader will always feel they can slap their logo on a banana and it will sell. I remember when Sony who like Apple became full of themselves said prior to the Playstation 3 launch that it would sell even if they didn't have any games for it or how the HD era only starts when they say so. :rolleyes:

So as you can see it's not only Apple, they all do it until they get knocked back down to reality. It happens to all of them. I was concerned this would happen to Apple post Jobs and they've proven me right. They have basically alienated everyone even their loyal fanbase with some of their stupid and lazy decisions.

Yesterday Engadget posted an article which sums it up best:

Apple vs Everyone
http://www.engadget.com/2012/10/29/apple-vs-everyone/

And according to Bloomberg Google is closing in on 700K apps
http://www.engadget.com/2012/10/30/google-play-store-racks-up-700k-apps-says-bloomberg/

----------

What are you expecting for $199? You can buy 2 Nexus 7's for the price of one Mini. Cheaper might be a better word to use. You make the Nexus 7 sound like a piece of junk. I have one sitting right here and can tell you it is built very well. Much better then the price tag would lead you to believe.

And what's even better is that the N7 is designed for you to work on it. At least you can replace the battery without sending it off somewhere. ;)

I think the N7 looks good and the build quality has gotten real good after the initial batch which had screen lift issues. That has been corrected.

----------

Yeah I own a Xoom and Nexus 7...the 7 is better in that scaled phone apps work a lot better, but the app selection for android tablets is abysmal right now.

They're closing in on 700K per Bloomberg. :)

spinedoc77
Oct 30, 2012, 11:31 AM
I think Apple will be quite content with the iPad and iOS are progressing.

Seeing my 2 year old interact with my iPad blows me away. Other tablets are not even close to having this usability.

This is what scares me. Since when did we begin to gauge UI's and Operating systems on how easily a 2 year old can use them? I would hope that the brain had some kind of intelligence growth between the age of 2 and adulthood. I hear it all the time, how an OS is better because it is so simple a baby can understand it.

MonkeySee....
Oct 30, 2012, 11:42 AM
This is what scares me. Since when did we begin to gauge UI's and Operating systems on how easily a 2 year old can use them? I would hope that the brain had some kind of intelligence growth between the age of 2 and adulthood. I hear it all the time, how an OS is better because it is so simple a baby can understand it.

Why are you scared? The simplicity of iOS is remarkable and should never be used as a negative towards it.

rmhop81
Oct 30, 2012, 11:54 AM
This is what scares me. Since when did we begin to gauge UI's and Operating systems on how easily a 2 year old can use them? I would hope that the brain had some kind of intelligence growth between the age of 2 and adulthood. I hear it all the time, how an OS is better because it is so simple a baby can understand it.

majority of users don't have a clue how to navigate a windows computer or an android phone. Give them OS X and iOS and they can figure it out quickly. His point is the 2 year old probably knows exactly how to use the device, which is an awesome thing.

why do you think iPad's have expanded into Education and not androids?

ChazUK
Oct 30, 2012, 11:56 AM
majority of users don't have a clue how to navigate a windows computer or an android phone. Give them OS X and iOS and they can figure it out quickly.

Judging by the marketshare discrepancy there, surely you jest?

rmhop81
Oct 30, 2012, 11:59 AM
Judging by the marketshare discrepancy there, surely you jest?

i see it all the time man. look at all the BS steps you have to click through to find a setting in windows settings. my mom called me weekly asking how to do different things and same with her friends. They FINALLY broke down and bought Apple machines....I got a few questions right at the beginning but haven't gotten a call since. Has nothing to do with the market share at all. Ease of use is so much better with Apple products.

spinedoc77
Oct 30, 2012, 12:09 PM
Why are you scared? The simplicity of iOS is remarkable and should never be used as a negative towards it.

I can just see iOS in a couple of iterations.

spinedoc77
Oct 30, 2012, 12:11 PM
Why are you scared? The simplicity of iOS is remarkable and should never be used as a negative towards it.

I think what we've lost sight of is it's ok to have a stupid simple interface, especially for media consumption, but it's also ok to have a more robust system behind that also. If you never tap into that more complex thinking side then you really don't need much more than the ipad, just like that 2 year old, but it's nice to at least have the option.

ReanimationN
Oct 30, 2012, 12:16 PM
Since when did we begin to gauge UI's and Operating systems on how easily a 2 year old can use them?

What about lizards? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTpldq3myV0&feature=related) ;)

onthecouchagain
Oct 30, 2012, 12:23 PM
Google is definitely to be commended. I think, for the first time ever, they're starting to get their ducks in order for the Nexus line to take off. It started with the Nexus 7, and it's culminated to this. So, kudos to them for sure.

Having said that, Google still has miles to pave. They need to forge better relations with the carriers so they can get LTE versions out to those who want that. And at this point and time, Google just doesn't have that sort of clout to put a device on a carrier and be in control of its software updates (the debacle with Verizon and the Galaxy Nexus, for example). For Google, if they can't control their own software and updates, there's almost no point in releasing a Nexus device to said carrier. It'll just make customers who buy the Nexus precisely for Google updates angry.

People ought to blame the carriers more than Google, but there's no shying away from the responsibilities; Google must forge relations.

The Nexus brand is, finally, on the right path.

dkersten
Oct 30, 2012, 12:26 PM
I have been loyal to Apple with my laptops and mobile devices since I got my first iPod Nano about 6-7 years ago (would never consider them for a desktop when you can build a way better computer for half the money... and then install OSX on it if I really wanted to).

However they have just pissed me off lately. The constant petty lawsuits like the bounce back feature at the end of a page when scrolling is just dumb. And that ignorant "apology" on their British website just wreaks of pretentiousness. And I could have dealt with all that crap if iOS wasn't complete crap. Its just so boring and a lot of times unintuitive (like accessing any setting). I bought the original iPad and sold it shortly after because its so locked down that it is barely productive. I then gave them another chance and bought a 3rd gen and was completely disappointed again.

I'm really impressed with what Google has brought to the table recently. Reasonably priced hardware with an OS that is miles ahead of iOS in usability and customization. They're apps for phones are pretty comparable to the iOS market these days. As soon as they can get they're tablet optimized apps better in number and in quality, they will begin to catch up to Apple in marketshare of tablets.

All I can say is Apple, you had your chance to recreate your dominance in the tablet market as you did in the mp3 market but your ignorance is turning it into the smartphone market

spinedoc77
Oct 30, 2012, 12:44 PM
What about lizards? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTpldq3myV0&feature=related) ;)

That was pretty awesome, thanks for making my day !

Lindenhurst
Oct 31, 2012, 01:28 PM
That is your opinion and you're entitled to it but you obviously don't use or haven't used an Android device in the last year. They have come a long way. I use to dislike using Android for a number of reason but it has become a very stable alternative at a very respectable price.

This....This....This

Android does not suck anymore!!!!

tech4all
Oct 31, 2012, 02:01 PM
I agree the competition is great, but have you ever used a nexus tablet? I have, and personally it pales in comparison to an ipad in every way. App selection and hardware build.

App selection and hardware built is not "every way." In fact the Play store and Apple store both have about 700,000 apps now. So that argument is becoming moot.

Nexus 7 still beats the iPad mini in storage capacity and for the less money. Double the storage in fact.

I think Apple will be quite content with the iPad and iOS are progressing.

Seeing my 2 year old interact with my iPad blows me away. Other tablets are not even close to having this usability.

I'm not two years old, but I'm pretty sure your average person could use Android. :rolleyes:

I think the shakeup over at Apple is a clear sign iOS is in some dire straits. It'll be really interesting to see what Ive brings to the "Human Interface." Will we see a radical UI change? I don't think so. So what will Ive bring that Forestall didn't?

I'm excited, but personally, the boat has sailed for me. It'll take quite a bit of [gasp, dare I say it?] catching up on iOS' part to sway me away from Android.

Plus, I just like the humility and humbleness of the fellas over at Google better. :p

I'm really hoping iOS get mass overhaul. They need to stop having it be so limited. Let users do things the way they want and not the way Apple wants you to have it. That just makes consumers zombies rather than end users.

Have to agree and disagree. Whilst the Nexus 10 has a pretty hideous design, the hardware it runs including the screen is superior to that of the iPad 4's in every way.

Specs...Nexus > iPad all the way. I like a nice looking product, but that doesn't cut much anymore.

Same **** different suit.

Ive, Forstall, it doesn't matter. There's an entire team that all contribute towards iOS. It's not the product of one person's idea. Putting Ive in charge won't bring any radical changes I don't think.

If they didn't think having Ive in charger over Forstall wouldn't be a mass change, then why do it? Surely not signing that letter was the sole reason for his departure. I think, well at least I hope, we'll start seeing real change to iOS in the coming versions.

majority of users don't have a clue how to navigate a windows computer or an android phone. Give them OS X and iOS and they can figure it out quickly. His point is the 2 year old probably knows exactly how to use the device, which is an awesome thing.

Unless you have actual proof from studies, that point is moot. I love OS X, but that statement makes you sound like a *cough*fanboy*cough*.

A two-year-old using an iPad doesn't count as a 'study.' ;)

why do you think iPad's have expanded into Education and not androids

The same reason why Macs were popular in schools...Apple gave them discounts.

I can just see iOS in a couple of iterations.

Great now they don't even give you icons for the home screen. :p

marc11
Oct 31, 2012, 04:02 PM
I think Apple will be quite content with the iPad and iOS are progressing.

Seeing my 2 year old interact with my iPad blows me away. Other tablets are not even close to having this usability.

Dude a two year old will learn and interact with any OS, they are not like us where we go in with notions and bias before hand. Plus they learn differently from us. My son had a laptop with XP on it when he was 3 and he used it sometimes better than me in a day or two.

That has nothing to do with the OS, it is how young kids can learn and adapt far easier and faster than adults.

Plus your statement can only be valid if your 2 year old was given both OS's to try side by side and you took measurements over the interaction.

onthecouchagain
Oct 31, 2012, 04:03 PM
I'm really hoping iOS get mass overhaul.


Don't see that happening, but I'm excited about Ive at the helm of iOS' future.

marc11
Oct 31, 2012, 04:05 PM
I agree the competition is great, but have you ever used a nexus tablet? I have, and personally it pales in comparison to an ipad in every way. App selection and hardware build.

When was the last time you spent serious time, by that I mean several days with Android 4.1 and actually spent time in the Google Play Store or the Amazon Android Market and used apps? I am guessing not recently. Oh and the DISASTER that the new iOS app store is makes the Play Store layout look amazing.

lol, "in every way" another person hitting the dead dog with the apps stick.

nuckinfutz
Oct 31, 2012, 04:23 PM
I really don't understand Apple's logic. They make a ton of money on the device AND on the consumption side of things (software). I mean this is OKAY as long as they can get away with it, but I feel that their grip on this high profits on everything will soon fade away as the competition pours from Microsoft and Google.

.

You don't understand the logic that a company must make money to pay for future product development, payroll and someone please shareholders?

I don't know if you're in the US or not but the Americans purchase items at cost the more production needs to remain or move overseas and that has a deleterious effect your ability to be gainfully employed or your offspring.

There is no free lunch...just $4 coffee.

nStyle
Oct 31, 2012, 05:13 PM
I don't know if you're in the US or not but the Americans purchase items at cost the more production needs to remain or move overseas and that has a deleterious effect your ability to be gainfully employed or your offspring.

I have no idea what you are trying to say.

From a shareholder point of view - yes - maximize profits. Though I didn't specifically acknowledge it in my original post, I never argued with the fact that a company, in general, should maximize profits. All I am saying is it doesn't take a genius (no pun intended) to see that Apple is obviously screwing the customer in a sense - they admit to enormous profits on their hardware that anyone who researches knows is sub-par compared to competition.

Apple is holding on to iOS and their build quality; without it, they wouldn't be able to get away with such high profit margins on their hardware in comparison to other companies.

nuckinfutz
Oct 31, 2012, 05:22 PM
I have no idea what you are trying to say.

From a shareholder point of view - yes - maximize profits. Though I didn't specifically acknowledge it in my original post, I never argued with the fact that a company, in general, should maximize profits. All I am saying is it doesn't take a genius (no pun intended) to see that Apple is obviously screwing the customer in a sense - they admit to enormous profits on their hardware that anyone who researches knows is sub-par compared to competition.

Apple is holding on to iOS and their build quality; without it, they wouldn't be able to get away with such high profit margins on their hardware in comparison to other companies.

True but few people really take in where those profits go. If I buy a Nexus 7 I don't have the ability to walk into a Google store...get help, get training or servicing.

Apple sells product at a higher margin because they're got a superior support infrastructure and their products are built to higher standards.

nStyle
Oct 31, 2012, 05:34 PM
Arguably, Apple doesn't need the profits they currently have to maintain good customer service, considering they are sitting on 80+ billion in cash

onthecouchagain
Oct 31, 2012, 06:49 PM
Arguably, Apple doesn't need the profits they currently have to maintain good customer service, considering they are sitting on 80+ billion in cash

Not to mention Jobs' yacht.

The Face
Oct 31, 2012, 07:57 PM
Saying Apple maximises their profits and scews over the customer for their own greed is an understatement. They're making over 426 profit on every iPhone 5 16gb, even more with the other models.

onthecouchagain
Oct 31, 2012, 08:59 PM
http://www.droid-life.com/2012/10/31/wednesday-poll-what-would-it-take-to-get-you-to-buy-the-lg-nexus-4/#disqus_thread

This is by no means a representation of the entire market, but Google will need to forge those relationships with the carriers...

G51989
Nov 1, 2012, 12:27 AM
I think Apple will be quite content with the iPad and iOS are progressing.

Seeing my 2 year old interact with my iPad blows me away. Other tablets are not even close to having this usability.

Thats a good thing? I would never judge an OS on how a 2 year old car use it. I like features. Lack of features is why I left iOS for Android, give me options and features.

roxxette
Nov 1, 2012, 01:22 AM
I will say the os is rather primitive and in no means "mind blowing"

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/11/01/a6uzatup.jpg

marc11
Nov 1, 2012, 01:41 AM
I will say the os is rather primitive and in no means "mind blowing"

Image (http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/11/01/a6uzatup.jpg)

That made me lol in the office. Gotta hide the browser now...

mattopotamus
Nov 1, 2012, 05:34 AM
When was the last time you spent serious time, by that I mean several days with Android 4.1 and actually spent time in the Google Play Store or the Amazon Android Market and used apps? I am guessing not recently. Oh and the DISASTER that the new iOS app store is makes the Play Store layout look amazing.

lol, "in every way" another person hitting the dead dog with the apps stick.

Pretty recently. I even had the current nexus with JB a few months ago. It is good and smooth, but just didn't feel nearly as polished as IOS. Obviously everyone has their own opinions, but that is the way I felt and ultimately why I went back to apple. I tried the nexus q/nexus/nexus tablet set up....it can't even hold a torch to the iphone/ipad/appletv equivalent.

ReanimationN
Nov 4, 2012, 08:38 AM
That was pretty awesome, thanks for making my day !
No worries! I like this one too (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlEzvdlYRes). ;)