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pgwalsh
Nov 25, 2002, 01:39 PM
I was wondering if anyone involved in K12 has seen any movement to OS X? My girlfriend teaches ages 7 through 10 and she hasn't seen or heard a discussion regarding the move. I've heard Apple is offering teachers OS X for free, but what does that do for students? The School she works at has older Macs that are not G3's. So this makes switching to OS X a lot more difficult.

I see the elimination of OS 9 creating a migration problem in schools. They'll have to purchase all new equipment. The older computers will be useless. Granted they could use them with OS 9, but that's too confusing for the children. With 13 nieces and nephews, I have a little experience with switching OS's.


I was going to turn my G3 400 into an testing computer, but now I'm going to donate it to her school. I hope others will do the same.

Thirteenva
Nov 25, 2002, 01:55 PM
Be glad the school uses macs...

My girlfriend teaches at a school that uses IBM and dell, you want to talk about migration issues, more than half the computers run Windows 95 and the rest are windows 98.


The school my mom works at uses IBM, which is very odd considering that when i went there as a kid we had apple computers.

pgwalsh
Nov 25, 2002, 01:59 PM
Originally posted by Thirteenva
Be glad the school uses macs...

My girlfriend teaches at a school that uses IBM and dell, you want to talk about migration issues, more than half the computers run Windows 95 and the rest are windows 98.


The school my mom works at uses IBM, which is very odd considering that when i went there as a kid we had apple computers.
I'm very happy they use Macs. One issue they have is no support. She does the support for her classroom, but she know very little. It's sad really. I told her I would help if they ever needed it.

She is buying a new iBook. She saw them when I went to look at them and fell in love. So she'll dump her home PC for an iBook. Nice!

But I'm concerned with schools, I'd like to see them stick with Macs, but I think the whole migration thing will cause problems.

Rower_CPU
Nov 25, 2002, 02:08 PM
I'm in higher-ed and I've seen a pretty good migration rate. Many labs here on campus have adopted it, and ours will switch to X in January.

Maybe it's due to the Unix background many techs have on college campuses, or budgetary issues...who knows.

dhunwick
Nov 25, 2002, 02:31 PM
I work for a Schoold district in Suburban Chicago, we are in the process of migrating to X right now. The lab is running Jaguar and a couple of "satellite classrooms" are running Jaguar as well. Things get a little confusing but nothing that is a deal breaker. The response to the new machines runnning Jag is phenomenal! Kids wait in line when the choice is between OS 9 iMac and an emac running Jaguar!

shadowfax0
Nov 25, 2002, 04:04 PM
you may want to check out macosxlabs.com, it's all about using OS X in a lab environment

pgwalsh
Nov 25, 2002, 04:21 PM
Originally posted by shadowfax0
you may want to check out macosxlabs.com, it's all about using OS X in a lab environment Intereting site, macosxlabs.org. However, it's geared towards higher education. I'm thinking of public k12 schools.

me hate windows
Nov 25, 2002, 04:39 PM
my stupid high school in Utah uses Microns and Dells. I asked one of the techs why we dont use macs.
He said price.
That seems to be the main reason behind all of it. They can get "good" dells for $300 U.S., but cant get a mac for less than $999.
If apple wants schools to use macs......
LOWER THE FRICKING PRICE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

mnkeybsness
Nov 25, 2002, 06:21 PM
the high school i graduated from will be switching this next coming school year when they move to a new building. the servers are already on X and the graphics labs (pride and joy of the school) are running X...

as for the U of M...aside from the abundance of Dell machines all over campus, there are tons of imacs...every one of them runs os X...only saw classic start up once for MacMolecule

pgwalsh
Nov 26, 2002, 12:15 AM
Originally posted by mnkeybsness
the high school i graduated from will be switching this next coming school year when they move to a new building. the servers are already on X and the graphics labs (pride and joy of the school) are running X...

as for the U of M...aside from the abundance of Dell machines all over campus, there are tons of imacs...every one of them runs os X...only saw classic start up once for MacMolecule Well that's good to hear. What's U of M?

rjett
Nov 26, 2002, 02:12 AM
My school is still running OS 8.

benixau
Nov 26, 2002, 06:37 AM
Originally posted by rjett
My school is still running OS 8.

Lucky bugger.

I am going to ramble for a bit and explain the sit at my school.

We stated with 2 pcs and 30 macs (performas).
Moved to 200 pcs and 20 imacs + 12 performas + 2 B+W G3s
Now sold all 266 imacs have a win2k network with stellite access for 350 pcs running win2k (some ts on win95) and have moved macs out of tech drawing into only music with 20 imacs and 10 performas with a d-u modem between them.

They all run OS8.6 and the newest imacs are 333s. i wish we had to consider the move to OSX but as you can see - no good reason (quote from sys admin)

Also

SA: "our new AMD (better than intel i guess) machines are so cheap and easy to use, macs cost too much"

ME: "macs wil let you (only sys admin(SA)) administer them easily, you will be close to the proper ratio of SAs to machines"

SA: "i know, but we are a gov' school and cant afford macs"

Our pc server total downtime = 100hrs per 30 EU
Our mac server total downtime = 5mins per 40 + 5 notebooks

that downtime was the u/g of the G3 450 serving them all to OS8.6 from OS8.

Our pc server is a DP 1Ghz intel w/2GB of RAM and a 80GB SCSI RAID 5 array.


Which is the cheaper solution????

jefhatfield
Nov 26, 2002, 07:16 AM
Originally posted by pgwalsh
I was wondering if anyone involved in K12 has seen any movement to OS X? My girlfriend teaches ages 7 through 10 and she hasn't seen or heard a discussion regarding the move. I've heard Apple is offering teachers OS X for free, but what does that do for students? The School she works at has older Macs that are not G3's. So this makes switching to OS X a lot more difficult.

I see the elimination of OS 9 creating a migration problem in schools. They'll have to purchase all new equipment. The older computers will be useless. Granted they could use them with OS 9, but that's too confusing for the children. With 13 nieces and nephews, I have a little experience with switching OS's.


I was going to turn my G3 400 into an testing computer, but now I'm going to donate it to her school. I hope others will do the same.

i have a couple of graphic design clients as an IT person with business and when i first saw os x in the beginning of 1999, i thought it would take two years

...now, almost four years since i have seen a working beta of os x and os x has been officially released and is now on 10.2...i see design firms in majority going to os x sometime in 2004, but some will start the migration to be fully os x next year sometime

my wife who works at a fortune 500 doing abobe based graphics said the migration, due to cost and slow os x development would take almost five years and that may actually be the case

Thirteenva
Nov 26, 2002, 11:05 AM
Originally posted by me hate windows
my stupid high school in Utah uses Microns and Dells. I asked one of the techs why we dont use macs.
He said price.
That seems to be the main reason behind all of it. They can get "good" dells for $300 U.S., but cant get a mac for less than $999.
If apple wants schools to use macs......
LOWER THE FRICKING PRICE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Where do you get $999 from? Apple has volume pricing plans that depend on amount purchased. Don't be naive and go by what you see in the education store, thats for individuals( teachers and students).

As far as $300 dells, I don't think they go that low even with volume pricing, they're about $600 a piece without monitors whereas the emac comes with the monitor, and remember...you get what you pay for.

pgwalsh
Nov 26, 2002, 11:27 AM
Originally posted by benixau


Lucky bugger.

I am going to ramble for a bit and explain the sit at my school.

We stated with 2 pcs and 30 macs (performas).
Moved to 200 pcs and 20 imacs + 12 performas + 2 B+W G3s
Now sold all 266 imacs have a win2k network with stellite access for 350 pcs running win2k (some ts on win95) and have moved macs out of tech drawing into only music with 20 imacs and 10 performas with a d-u modem between them.

They all run OS8.6 and the newest imacs are 333s. i wish we had to consider the move to OSX but as you can see - no good reason (quote from sys admin)

Also

SA: "our new AMD (better than intel i guess) machines are so cheap and easy to use, macs cost too much"

ME: "macs wil let you (only sys admin(SA)) administer them easily, you will be close to the proper ratio of SAs to machines"

SA: "i know, but we are a gov' school and cant afford macs"

Our pc server total downtime = 100hrs per 30 EU
Our mac server total downtime = 5mins per 40 + 5 notebooks

that downtime was the u/g of the G3 450 serving them all to OS8.6 from OS8.

Our pc server is a DP 1Ghz intel w/2GB of RAM and a 80GB SCSI RAID 5 array.


Which is the cheaper solution????

That's a good story. It should be posted somewhere. People need to be educated on the benefits of Mac's in situations like this. This isn't the first time I've heard of a story about lowering costs in a network by using Macs.

Roger1
Nov 26, 2002, 12:10 PM
FYI UofM is University of Michigan

We are primarily a Mac district, with pc's mixed in for good measure. Almost all of our Macs run 9 right now, because almost every program we have uses 9 or below. Yeah, we could use classic, but why run 2 OS if the vast majority of the time is spend in classic? We are slowly migrating over, however. With the teacher program that Apple is offering, almost every teacher has a copy of X. We will soon be holding training/installation sessions, so we can get the teachers up and running.
The biggest issue is cost. If we switch all our labs to X, we have to buy all new software, or run it in classic.
BTW, I was the second person in my district to run X(beta). My boss was the first, but didn't like it. Me? Well I'm hooked. I hate downgrading to 9 when people call me with problems, and I have to figure them out in 9. Ah well, the tribulations of being on the bleeding edge:D

BTW: GO BLUE!!! (Even though they lost this weekend to Ohio):rolleyes:

mnkeybsness
Nov 26, 2002, 12:49 PM
Originally posted by Roger1
FYI UofM is University of Michigan


no....minnesota...actually both...well technically it's U of MN...but NO one says U of MN...it's always U of M... www.umn.edu

funkywhat2
Nov 26, 2002, 12:55 PM
My school is presently switching from Macs to PCs. When I asked the head tech guy why they were doing such a thing, he said that no one can use OS 9, and half the machines can't run OS X. Then he said that they could have spent the money on new Macs that can run OS X, but "UNIX isn't secure", he called it grbage compared to WinXP Pro.

One month later, they still can't get half the Dells that they bought to print to the right printer. Plus, it takes between 5 and 15 minutes to log on to the machines, and just as much time to log off. That leaves between 30 and 10 mins per period to do work.

pgwalsh
Nov 26, 2002, 01:54 PM
Originally posted by crazy_will
My school is presently switching from Macs to PCs. When I asked the head tech guy why they were doing such a thing, he said that no one can use OS 9, and half the machines can't run OS X. Then he said that they could have spent the money on new Macs that can run OS X, but "UNIX isn't secure", he called it grbage compared to WinXP Pro.

One month later, they still can't get half the Dells that they bought to print to the right printer. Plus, it takes between 5 and 15 minutes to log on to the machines, and just as much time to log off. That leaves between 30 and 10 mins per period to do work. That's sad. What does the SA have to say now?

funkywhat2
Nov 27, 2002, 09:26 AM
Originally posted by pgwalsh
That's sad. What does the SA have to say now?

SA? I'm not quite sure what that means.

Doctor Q
Nov 27, 2002, 10:25 AM
In Los Angeles, Apple Education is of course recommending that K-12 schools move to Mac OS X, but there is a major roadblock. The Los Angeles Unified School District (LAUSD) is recommending that schools stick to Mac OS 9 because LAUSD's own technical specialists are not yet up to speed on X.

This last summer, a middle school near me went against the tide and installed (with my help as a volunteer) a new computer classroom with iMacs running Mac OS X and a Mac OS X Server, replacing a Mac OS 8-based classroom. It took many calls to Apple experts before we could get network login (with home directories on the server) to work under Mac OS 10.1, we had to contact a number of software vendors for help with use of X-based applications on the network, and we had various other problems that we had to research and solve ourselves. LAUSD provided help with the room's electrical upgrade, but no computer help.

Without expert help from volunteers, the school would not have been able to make this transition. I hope LAUSD gets their Mac OS X support in place soon because not many schools will take the "pioneer" approach without school district support.

Thirteenva
Nov 27, 2002, 10:39 AM
Originally posted by crazy_will


SA? I'm not quite sure what that means.

S.A. is a systems administrator.

SilvorX
Nov 27, 2002, 10:50 AM
our school still uses os 8.1/8.6 :(, even on the new macs they set it to os9 instead of osx
they wont be switching any time soon
yikes...most of the macs in the school are either old "all in one" powermac g3s or pre g3 all in one powermacs...:eek:

pgwalsh
Nov 27, 2002, 10:55 AM
Originally posted by crazy_will


SA? I'm not quite sure what that means.

System Admin - Maybe not the proper term for the technical person at your location.

Originally posted by Doctor Q
Without expert help from volunteers, the school would not have been able to make this transition. I hope LAUSD gets their Mac OS X support in place soon because not many schools will take the "pioneer" approach without school district support.

I'm a little surprised that your school jumped in at X.1. I would have waited until I heard that the OS was up to snuff. I imagine OS X.2 would solve many issues, but I'm not sure if it does or not.

It would be great if someone in LA with OSX experience and very technical minded could offer their expertise. How would you find such a person? Maybe ask for volunteers through a school newsletter or the paper. If my child were at a school that had computer issues, I'd gladly lend my services.

pgwalsh
Nov 27, 2002, 10:58 AM
Originally posted by SilvorX
our school still uses os 8.1/8.6 :(, even on the new macs they set it to os9 instead of osx
they wont be switching any time soon
yikes...most of the macs in the school are either old "all in one" powermac g3s or pre g3 all in one powermacs...:eek: You can throw OS X on the old G3's, but nothing before that. Same problem at my girlfriends school. Her students are on performa's etc. I don't see an upgrade for some time and that's why I think donations are important. Also people getting involved with the schools. A great way to show our support for our favorite OS.

Doctor Q
Nov 27, 2002, 11:08 AM
Originally posted by pgwalsh
I'm a little surprised that your school jumped in at X.1. I would have waited until I heard that the OS was up to snuff. I imagine OS X.2 would solve many issues, but I'm not sure if it does or not.
Even with Mac OS X 10.1, we were eventually able to set it up so each student logged into a home directory on the server, to automate the creation of user IDs for students using shell scripts, to get two network printers working, and to get about 10 major applications installed and running.

Because we didn't have Jaguar, we could not do netbooting - booting each iMac off the server so it gets a fresh machine image each time. We plan to switch to netbooting once we upgrade to Jaguar, but we have to wait for a school break (probably winter break at the end of the year) since the upgrade is not going to be a one-evening effort.

jefhatfield
Nov 27, 2002, 11:16 AM
Originally posted by pgwalsh


System Admin - Maybe not the proper term for the technical person at your location.





old school terminology:

network technician...client side and LAN person sometimes

network administrator...everything...in other words, GOD

new school terminology:

network engineer...once called a network technician

network administrator...still GOD

systems administrator and systems engineer are rarely used terms and he or she eventually end up being called the network administrator anyways...even if they are only a network engineer

i call myself a network engineer since i have tons of stuff to learn before i can be the captain of my ship...some say being the head of a network for two or three years in a pdc/bdc network gives one the right to call themselves a network administrator...not just having a server and a single client at home...but that's always a good way to learn the super basics

learn to deal with overly important secretaries and overly important office people on some world changing deadline and then you become a network administrator...you have to have the god label to be feared as well as hated

if you want to be liked, do not be a network person or computer desktop support person since it does not go with the territory...unlike us on this techie forum, 99.99% percent of the rest of the computer using population do not consider cpu's and networks the least bit fun

i use a toilet because i need to but i don't spend time on forums about it rumoring about the next great model

i have a client who got one of those squirting toilets and that is all she talks about...she is in love with the darn thing:p

pgwalsh
Nov 27, 2002, 11:31 AM
Originally posted by jefhatfield


old school terminology:

Thanks for clearing that up for me, thread highjacker.

bigizzy
Nov 27, 2002, 12:00 PM
Originally posted by crazy_will
My school is presently switching from Macs to PCs. When I asked the head tech guy why they were doing such a thing, he said that no one can use OS 9, and half the machines can't run OS X. Then he said that they could have spent the money on new Macs that can run OS X, but "UNIX isn't secure", he called it grbage compared to WinXP Pro.

One month later, they still can't get half the Dells that they bought to print to the right printer. Plus, it takes between 5 and 15 minutes to log on to the machines, and just as much time to log off. That leaves between 30 and 10 mins per period to do work.

Where is your "head tech guy"'s brain located???? In his ass??? and he sure has been sitting on it for too long!! "UNIX isn't secure" well thats why they use it everywhere where security is a top priority and "WinXP" well does anybody use if for anything serious at all???

Roger1
Nov 27, 2002, 12:30 PM
learn to deal with overly important secretaries and overly important office people on some world changing deadline and then you become a network administrator...you have to have the god label to be feared as well as hated


Oh yes, Those overworked secretaries can really hate you:D

Especially when their HD takes a dump, and they haven't done a backup in 6 months (if at all):D. BTW, It's always the techs fault it they forget to do a backup.

Then they totally freak if you tell them it's going to be a few days before it's fixed.:D

After all, we are merely their servants:rolleyes:

bobindashadows
Nov 27, 2002, 01:29 PM
My prep high school just got about a dozen new iMacs, low end, and they're forced to run them in OS 9 since the network runs Novell Netware, and that hasn't been made (beyond beta) for OS X yet. Though, me and a friend still run a few in OS X, which all the kids love.

funkywhat2
Nov 27, 2002, 02:24 PM
Speaking of my districts SA, I haven't really spoken to him since our one encounter. We have had a few issues with each other (I needed to use my digital camera for a presentaation, one machine installed the driver, and then stopped working. He said I could, but noooooo. It was all my fault.) I assume he is still sitting on his ass, though.

Doctor Q
Nov 27, 2002, 03:09 PM
Originally posted by pgwalsh It would be great if someone in LA with OSX experience and very technical minded could offer their expertise. How would you find such a person? Maybe ask for volunteers through a school newsletter or the paper. If my child were at a school that had computer issues, I'd gladly lend my services.
Skilled volunteers are great for one-time events (like planning/brainstorming meetings, computer setup days, installing network wiring, or holding bake sales so schools can afford lots of Macs), but a school's computers also need ongoing support/supervision/maintenance for both software and hardware. That requires expertise on a continuous basis over many years.

In my experience, it is rare for a K-12 school to get consistent long-term volunteer help, especially during school hours, so existing or specially hired members of the school staff must be given responsibility over school computers. Volunteers and the school district might provide support, but somebody at the school has to be in charge.

Schools that start with a few computers here and there and gradually build up their collection sometimes don't notice when they have reached this point.

Raiden
Nov 27, 2002, 06:39 PM
Well I goto henrico county public schools, where we all have iBooks. We all use OS9. Last year, they had OSX.0 on them, and they were extremely slow. This year they have been blocked (along with everything else) from going into OSX.0. To even think these things could go Jag would be laughable. These things are slow enough running OS9. The biggest problem would be the teachers, as they have already had to learn to make websites, grade exporting, internet worksheets, and then they would have to learn a new OS? They would probly strike or something.

Anyway, hope this adds to the discussion. bye

rice_web
Nov 27, 2002, 07:28 PM
The school district that I work for--I'm a tech guy--has steadily been moving to OS X, with three or four labs of eMacs running OS X only. While many of the teachers will use OS 9 until more software is converted (specifically our grading software), no switch to OS X will be made. However, all other machines (libraries, etc.) will be making the switch the moment new machines are purchased--each purchase that we make stays with OS X.

pgwalsh
Nov 27, 2002, 09:05 PM
Originally posted by rice_web
The school district that I work for--I'm a tech guy--has steadily been moving to OS X, with three or four labs of eMacs running OS X only. While many of the teachers will use OS 9 until more software is converted (specifically our grading software), no switch to OS X will be made. However, all other machines (libraries, etc.) will be making the switch the moment new machines are purchased--each purchase that we make stays with OS X. Must be nice in North Dakota. Here we are near Apple headquarters and nothing a doing. Ha ha.

SilvorX
Nov 27, 2002, 10:15 PM
Originally posted by rice_web
The school district that I work for--I'm a tech guy--has steadily been moving to OS X, with three or four labs of eMacs running OS X only. While many of the teachers will use OS 9 until more software is converted (specifically our grading software), no switch to OS X will be made. However, all other machines (libraries, etc.) will be making the switch the moment new machines are purchased--each purchase that we make stays with OS X.
which part of north dakota? minot?
up here in western mb only a few schools are using macs, half the schools in our division are using pcs, and our half the division are using macs, since there's 2 different sets of computer admin people for the division (since it was formerly 2 school divisions)

mmmdreg
Nov 28, 2002, 01:18 AM
my school doesn't even use macs but at the university of sydney i think it was, I went to some science department for a music gig to open some garden or something and they had a lab of powermacs running X which was pretty cool...

benixau
Nov 28, 2002, 07:06 AM
guys you are lucky. i want to move to america where there is a chance of seeing an apple ad on tv. in aussie, the only apple advertising we get nowa days is from people like me who just today (2002/11/29) convinced a person to buy a mac.

ps. he was truly suprised to here macs ran MS office. come on apple aussie, give us something we are sinking here.

jefhatfield
Nov 28, 2002, 09:55 AM
Originally posted by pgwalsh


Thanks for clearing that up for me, thread highjacker.

i guess i got off the thread's topic;)

sorry 'bout that one...but i just had to take a jab against secretaries

when i go to this one large corporation that is a client of mine, the IT secretary forgets who i am (computer repair guy) and sees that i am a minority carrying around expensive equipment and calls the cops/security on me:p :eek: :confused: :p

jefhatfield
Nov 28, 2002, 10:02 AM
i invented hijacking on this website back when there were just a few hundred members

and now that i have confessed that sin, i also invented double posting;)

Les Kern
Dec 1, 2002, 10:02 PM
Here (www.mchs.net) or (www.mchs.net/technology/tech.html) or (laptops.mchs.net) I planted the seed by introducing a few machines with Jaguar in one lab and letting the students have at it. (And giving laptops to the superintendent and school board with Jag) They love it. I know migration will be easy for the syudents. The faculty? I suppose I'll have the same number of power-users, and the same number of computer-challenged, so it's a wash. I will up the training hours though! Almost all of my 23 servers are OSX, and we are ready. As far as apps go, I'm not worried. MS Office is great, but viruses are tiring for everyone, so we'll go over to the free Appleworks and keep the 800 licenses for Office and just use Powerpoint for all the old documents. Actually iMovie is quickly supplanting Powerpoint anyway. As for specialty software, well, we have to make the decision to upgrade, but all of what we use has a pretty good price schedule for OSX upgrades... like GoLive and Photoshop, that the financial hit will be somewhat small. However, my mantra is "Got Web?", and I am doing EVERYTHING possible to go to web-based apps where ever we can. We're working on laptops for every student next year, and they WILL be Jag. Older machines that are Jag-challenged will be sold back to Apple and replaced where needed... not a big deal as laptops are going to impact a few labs!
My only big concern? I make my own disk images, and I can't in X... yet. (Or you can but I don't know how!) Imaging has been my biggest time-saver.

Rower_CPU
Dec 1, 2002, 10:59 PM
Originally posted by Les Kern
Here (www.mchs.net) or (www.mchs.net/technology/tech.html) or (laptops.mchs.net) I planted the seed by introducing a few machines with Jaguar in one lab and letting the students have at it. (And giving laptops to the superintendent and school board with Jag) They love it. I know migration will be easy for the syudents. The faculty? I suppose I'll have the same number of power-users, and the same number of computer-challenged, so it's a wash. I will up the training hours though! Almost all of my 23 servers are OSX, and we are ready. As far as apps go, I'm not worried. MS Office is great, but viruses are tiring for everyone, so we'll go over to the free Appleworks and keep the 800 licenses for Office and just use Powerpoint for all the old documents. Actually iMovie is quickly supplanting Powerpoint anyway. As for specialty software, well, we have to make the decision to upgrade, but all of what we use has a pretty good price schedule for OSX upgrades... like GoLive and Photoshop, that the financial hit will be somewhat small. However, my mantra is "Got Web?", and I am doing EVERYTHING possible to go to web-based apps where ever we can. We're working on laptops for every student next year, and they WILL be Jag. Older machines that are Jag-challenged will be sold back to Apple and replaced where needed... not a big deal as laptops are going to impact a few labs!
My only big concern? I make my own disk images, and I can't in X... yet. (Or you can but I don't know how!) Imaging has been my biggest time-saver.

You should be able to continue using ASR (that is, if you use it currently) and Disk Copy for OS X images.

The interesting thing will be to see what new steps we'll have to take when we can't boot into 9 anymore. There are utilities for creating OS X bootable CDs but they're not all that great in their current forms.

Les Kern
Dec 3, 2002, 07:42 AM
Originally posted by Rower_CPU


You should be able to continue using ASR (that is, if you use it currently) and Disk Copy for OS X images.

The interesting thing will be to see what new steps we'll have to take when we can't boot into 9 anymore. There are utilities for creating OS X bootable CDs but they're not all that great in their current forms.


You're correct! My feeble mind would rather be confused before it has to. I do use ASR, and since I can boot to 9 images are not an issue. Thanks for the reality check!

macmax
Dec 3, 2002, 09:36 AM
Change is a big problem, but then again , if you don't do it , you become obsolete.

Teachers should know this and everyone involved in edu.

Apple should find a way of making some seminars and teach and give assistance.

I think that Apple should know that if they can get the kids, then they can have a big share of the future.

Kids love playing, Apple should try to hook them up with games too.

When people where pirating windows in china , that horrendous man , gates, let them kept on doing it for about 2 years, then he went to the law and started demanding actions, but then , after 2 years , why would you want to change from windows if that is what you were acostumed to?

Maybe apple should follow some kind of approach and invest in the needs of the youngsters and then they will be hooked.

It seems that people would migrate from winblows machines to macs easier than from macs to winblows.

In my thesis i work closely with 3 people,two of them are switching soon,they have already told me they will.

The 3 of them have had some kind of major problem with their pc's , to the point that 2 of them are without a machine at this point because they are not working.'
The other one has to be rebooting the thing almost every 2 to 3 hours.??? don't ask me why, i don't know.

As for the whole thesis it is been done in an iBook,with jag, no data loss no rebooting, no loosing time, just been working and doing what she is told to do all the time.
:)

pgwalsh
Dec 3, 2002, 10:21 AM
I agree that Apple should do more to push OS X in the education market. There's the issue of educational software that hasn't been written for OS X. If they could get the eMac to price that's more appealing with schools they'd be better off.

As for educating teaches, maybe they could get the people at Total Training to put something together. I've found there video's very helpful.

I can't get my brother-in-law to buy his kids a Mac and they use it in school. Even when my mother and father offered to buy them one he told them not to. The poor kids tell me they could get more work done if they had one at home. Too bad there father is a big Windows guy. What makes me laugh more is that he works for Mark Andreesen, which you'd think he'd be anti-Microsoft.

daniel77
Dec 3, 2002, 07:17 PM
I am so happy! My school finally upgraded their snow imacs to OS X over Thanksgving break! Yeah me! I hate IE already from what everyone says (right now i CANT afford to buy an ibook. well yet)
so I downloaded Chimera on a 1.7mbps DSL line (SCHWEET!), and it only crashed once on me when I went to anandtech.com. no clue as to that though. Although IE couldnt even download my email page without basically freezing! I think I will be going into my school library, a bit more now that they run a usable OS (they ahd 9.2.) I will have to ask if it's Jaguar or just OS X. :D