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View Full Version : Apple Reverses Course on 30-Pin and Lightning Connector Guidelines




MacRumors
Dec 21, 2012, 04:39 PM
http://images.macrumors.com/im/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/12/21/apple-reverses-course-on-30-pin-and-lightning-connector-guidelines/)


A day after a Kickstarter project was killed (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/12/20/apple-nixes-pop-portable-power-kickstarter-project-over-lightning-connectors/) because of restrictions on Apple's MFi program (https://developer.apple.com/programs/mfi/) that prevented Lightning and 30-Pin connectors from appearing on the same device, Apple has changed its guidelines (http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-57560558-37/apple-tweaks-lightning-spec-following-kickstarter-project-gone-awry/) to allow third-party devices to have 30-pin and Lightning chargers on the same accessory, reports CNET.

http://images.macrumors.com/article-new/2012/12/NewImage29.png"Our technical specifications provide clear guidelines for developing accessories and they are available to MFi licensees for free," Apple spokesman Tom Neumayr told CNET. "We support accessories that integrate USB and Lightning connectors, but there were technical issues that prevented accessories from integrating 30-pin and Lightning connectors so our guidelines did not allow this."

The company added that the guidelines have since been updated to allow accessories to work with both types of connectors to charge devices.A number of MacRumors commenters (http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1511685) felt Apple's decision to prevent the Kickstarter project from moving forward was a poor one, both for consumers, and for the company behind the project.

There is no word from Edison Junior (http://edisonjunior.com) on whether the company will move forward with the POP portable power station now that Apple has reversed course.

Article Link: Apple Reverses Course on 30-Pin and Lightning Connector Guidelines (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/12/21/apple-reverses-course-on-30-pin-and-lightning-connector-guidelines/)



pubwvj
Dec 21, 2012, 04:50 PM
Yeah!

iMikeT
Dec 21, 2012, 04:50 PM
Nice that Apple can see the bigger picture on this one.

Two ports on the same device hmmm.... Could Apple be a little port-curious? ;)

Awjvail
Dec 21, 2012, 04:50 PM
"A technical issue" stopped them from allowing them on the same accessory?

Oh, so they fixed that "technical issue" overnight, then?

rmwebs
Dec 21, 2012, 04:54 PM
"A technical issue" stopped them from allowing them on the same accessory?

Oh, so they fixed that "technical issue" overnight, then?

AKA "We didnt want to allow it as we wanted to make more money from accessory makers....but this is bad publicity, and we've had enough of that recently....so lets cave and come up with an excuse".

GoCubsGo
Dec 21, 2012, 05:00 PM
AKA "We didnt want to allow it as we wanted to make more money from accessory makers....but this is bad publicity, and we've had enough of that recently....so lets cave and come up with an excuse".

Exactly.

On the other hand, I would love to see whether this project actually starts up again. My guess, the creator will walk away like a martyr claiming there was no way he could undo the hurt Apple caused. /emo

CWallace
Dec 21, 2012, 05:04 PM
My guess, the creator will walk away like a martyr claiming there was no way he could undo the hurt Apple caused. /emo

Which likely then would raise questions as to whether the real reason is with the product and they were just using Apple as a cover.

GoCubsGo
Dec 21, 2012, 05:10 PM
Which likely then would raise questions as to whether the real reason is with the product and they were just using Apple as a cover.

My initial thought was screw Apple. Then as I started reading online about it and seeing other reactions I started to think that maybe Apple's resistance was a small blessing to them.

charlieegan3
Dec 21, 2012, 05:11 PM
While I don't tend to like many 3rd accessories I hate the Idea that apple has this much control over them.

jm001
Dec 21, 2012, 05:25 PM
Well in Apple's defense it is their design and property so they have every right to control access to it. Is it good business sense to protect it to the degree Apple does? it can be in some instances but cmon for companies who are going to promote your technology/product Apple should keep the gates open.

SalsaShark
Dec 21, 2012, 05:38 PM
Keep in mind that if you're offering connectivity with data transfer, there may actually be technical difficulties involved. Don't know for sure, of course, but it's possible.

Since all this thing is doing is charging, that potential hurdle doesn't exist.

moose.boy
Dec 21, 2012, 05:40 PM
*sigh*
The technical limitation relates to syncing. The guidelines have been changed to allow for *charging*, not syncing.

ritmomundo
Dec 21, 2012, 05:48 PM
Well, the company should move ahead with the project now. The reversal and the resulting news articles on media/tech sites (like MR) are basically free advertising for a product that most people hadnt heard about anyway. They probably couldn't have wished for more exposure or free publicity at this point.

SteveW928
Dec 21, 2012, 05:56 PM
The project wasn't killed by Apple's guidelines... it was killed by bad planning, as anyone with an ounce of investigation would have known this previously and not counted on approval. Or, (which I'd guess is the case) this was just grandstanding to get publicity and hopefully influence Apple. If the latter worked, then great.

Apple needs to do some serious work on Thunderbolt adoption, as the low quantity devices using it and their extreme cost are simply ridiculous. And, this is exactly one place Apple shouldn't be trying to hold their profit margins. Heck, sacrifice if you need to in order to get this connector in the mainstream. The way it is currently headed, it's going to turn out like FW 800 or worse.

foobarbaz
Dec 21, 2012, 06:09 PM
Wait, what??
An Apple spokesperson contacted the media to comment and then they revert their decision?

Strange things are going on in Cupertino. Bizarro-Apple? ;)

Don't panic
Dec 21, 2012, 06:11 PM
aside from the decision (now rescinded by apple) to not alow the hybrid charger, wouldn't it be much better from everyone if there was a disconnect between the power charger and the device.
by this i mean that you should be able to have a different combination of cables depending on the need.

let's say this has 8 cables out, 4 miniUSB, 2 30 pins and 2 lightning.
a costumer with 3 old iDevices that use 30 pins would not want it, nor a costumer with 3 new devices. basically for most people you just always have some of the cable s that are useless, and maybe not have some that you need.

just have the 8 USB sockets, and then people can plug in the cable that came with the device and use one charger with many devices 9or you can have optional cables of the make you like included as optional when purchasing.

the other question I have is how does it deal with different power requirements? do the devices self-adjust and only draw what's needed? can you fry one device?

petsounds
Dec 21, 2012, 06:20 PM
On the other hand, I would love to see whether this project actually starts up again. My guess, the creator will walk away like a martyr claiming there was no way he could undo the hurt Apple caused. /emo

Possibly. After all, he founded the Kickstarter competitor that he was going to refund all the money from. It's possible this whole thing was a publicity stunt, specifically designing a product that he knew would be rejected by Apple, which he could then shoutout his own company in which refunding is a differentiator from Kickstarter.

Of course, that's the cynical view. In any case, this product looks like some tacky piece of junk from a Sharper Image catalog.

rorschach
Dec 21, 2012, 06:28 PM
AKA "We didnt want to allow it as we wanted to make more money from accessory makers....but this is bad publicity, and we've had enough of that recently....so lets cave and come up with an excuse".

Heh. Yep. That right there is pretty much the reason any company reverses course on anything.

SnowLeopard OSX
Dec 21, 2012, 06:34 PM
This will benefit consumers greatly, IMHO.

nagromme
Dec 21, 2012, 06:34 PM
Sounds like a rule that had a genuine useful reason behind it. Now made better with an exception for charging. Did Apple think of every possible accessory idea when they wrote the rules? No. Do they have to jump instantly when some guy with an ideas says “jump”? No. But they did jump, and it doesn’t sound like it took all that long to happen. Good.

But Apple is Always Evil. Remember, boys and girls :p

AKA "We didnt want to allow it as we wanted to make more money from accessory makers....but this is bad publicity, and we've had enough of that recently....so lets cave and come up with an excuse".

That makes no sense. How does Apple make more money from accessory makers by NOT allowing them to make accessories? Apple loves selling third-party products, and gives out a logo to promote them—IF you follow guidelines for functionality, quality, and apparently worker conditions too.

What you say makes sense only if Apple said “you CAN combine the two connectors, if you pay a fee.” That’s not the case.

HadItWithWindow
Dec 21, 2012, 06:35 PM
It is death to me.

I have an iPhone5 that cannot connect to anything for charging except the charger provided. When in my auto it is useless if the battery is dead.

I also bought the new iPad when they came out with iPhone5 so that is a third connector that serves no purpose for me other than to carry around a bunch of cables to charge the iPhone5, new iPad and old iPad.

I'm all for progress and I try to be patient but why couldn't they have come up with some type of adapters the day they intro new connectors?

KylePowers
Dec 21, 2012, 07:03 PM
It is death to me.

I have an iPhone5 that cannot connect to anything for charging except the charger provided. When in my auto it is useless if the battery is dead.

I also bought the new iPad when they came out with iPhone5 so that is a third connector that serves no purpose for me other than to carry around a bunch of cables to charge the iPhone5, new iPad and old iPad.

I'm all for progress and I try to be patient but why couldn't they have come up with some type of adapters the day they intro new connectors?
There are plenty of adapters made by Apple and not made Apple that will easily charge and sync your Lightning devices. Knockoff brands are super cheap on Amazon.

Mackan
Dec 21, 2012, 07:04 PM
AKA "We didnt want to allow it as we wanted to make more money from accessory makers....but this is bad publicity, and we've had enough of that recently....so lets cave and come up with an excuse".

Pretty much. It's a ridiculous world we live in.

Westacular
Dec 21, 2012, 07:33 PM
Apple needs to do some serious work on Thunderbolt adoption, as the low quantity devices using it and their extreme cost are simply ridiculous. And, this is exactly one place Apple shouldn't be trying to hold their profit margins. Heck, sacrifice if you need to in order to get this connector in the mainstream. The way it is currently headed, it's going to turn out like FW 800 or worse.

Thunderbolt != Lightning. Discussion of Thunderbolt has no relevance here.

(And if Apple could make Thunderbolt cheaper, they would. It's really up to Intel, and AFAICT products are expensive because, simply put, the chips and cables needed for Thunderbolt are still expensive to manufacture.)

dfs
Dec 21, 2012, 07:54 PM
So "technical issues" turn out to be nothing more than marketing issues. No surprise there. That's usually Apple's move when its in a monopolistic mood. Thankfullf, it rarely is able to get away with this sort of tactic for very long. There's always some free market and consumer-friendly developer who can figure out an end run around the restrictive policy of the moment. If Apple's senior management could gain some inkling of how much this sort of thing damages the company's credibility even in the eyes of its most loyal customers, the might re-think their policies.

ThunderSkunk
Dec 21, 2012, 08:19 PM
Why would anyone design a charger with fixed cables hard-wired in?
Makes no sense. Cable type, cable length, wear & tear, etc... this shouldn't have even been an issue, because the designers should have spec'd 6 USB ports for use with any cables the user desires.

samcraig
Dec 21, 2012, 09:57 PM
Sounds like a rule that had a genuine useful reason behind it. Now made better with an exception for charging. Did Apple think of every possible accessory idea when they wrote the rules? No. Do they have to jump instantly when some guy with an ideas says “jump”? No. But they did jump, and it doesn’t sound like it took all that long to happen. Good.

But Apple is Always Evil. Remember, boys and girls :p



On the flipside you have some people that will rationalize or believe everything Apple spits out of their PR machine as gospel. It goes both ways, doesn't it?

theBB
Dec 21, 2012, 10:42 PM
AKA "We didnt want to allow it as we wanted to make more money from accessory makers....but this is bad publicity, and we've had enough of that recently....so lets cave and come up with an excuse".
To make more money from accessory makers, they were planning reject licensing applications from the ones who would be the ones giving them a cut??? Sure, who says conspiracy theories need to be rational...

phoenixsan
Dec 22, 2012, 12:56 AM
little bit cynical thinks this decission helps Apple to make an argument for the exigence, said, for the FRAND licesing in the smartphone arena. Indeed, a company no too greedy to allow innovation within the limits of intellectual property can make a compelling case when the same company demands fair licensing terms to another....just my five cents....


:):apple:

ConCat
Dec 22, 2012, 05:10 AM
Why would anyone design a charger with fixed cables hard-wired in?
Makes no sense. Cable type, cable length, wear & tear, etc... this shouldn't have even been an issue, because the designers should have spec'd 6 USB ports for use with any cables the user desires.

These built-in cables must use USB for charging internally anyway, seeing as that's how Apple does charging on all of their iProducts. It really is strange.

Kludge420
Dec 22, 2012, 05:17 AM
Reminds me of when Sony said it was "impossible" to make a controller that vibrated.

macs4nw
Dec 22, 2012, 09:05 AM
Nice that Apple can see the bigger picture on this one.....

Good to know that they're willing to 'bend', when they realize that maybe they've been a little too inflexible/un-accommodating.

While I don't tend to like many 3rd accessories I hate the Idea that apple has this much control over them.

Alas, the price to pay for the walled garden. Everything just works. (most of the time) :)

numlock
Dec 22, 2012, 11:27 AM
Reminds me of when Sony said it was "impossible" to make a controller that vibrated.

obviously i know about their later controllers but can you expand on the story?

apple and their recent behavior of doing something quite pathetic only to see the uproar and change their mind is quite concerning i must say.

ZipZap
Dec 22, 2012, 11:57 AM
I feel like Apple should not have been able to kill the project nor should they have so much control over charging connectors and approaches.

I await the day that Apple finally gets killed for these proprietary practices.

Imagine if IBM had succeeded back in the early 80's. We'd have super expensive virtually unexpandable computers and there would not have been a "PC" nor the PC evolution.

Its the reason I think thunderbolt and lightning should be free and open specifications.

KnightWRX
Dec 22, 2012, 11:59 AM
Why would anyone design a charger with fixed cables hard-wired in?
Makes no sense. Cable type, cable length, wear & tear, etc... this shouldn't have even been an issue, because the designers should have spec'd 6 USB ports for use with any cables the user desires.

The goal of the product is not to have to carry around cables with it. It's a portable phone charger that can connect to multiple phones without any external accessories.

Have just USB ports on there defeats the whole purpose of the design behind this thing.

CWallace
Dec 22, 2012, 12:12 PM
The goal of the product is not to have to carry around cables with it. It's a portable phone charger that can connect to multiple phones without any external accessories.

Have just USB ports on there defeats the whole purpose of the design behind this thing.

And even then, the device does have two USB ports on the underside that would allow any USB-to-whatever charging cable to work with it...


...including Apple's USB-to-Lightning cable.

iChrist
Dec 22, 2012, 12:21 PM
It is death to me.

I have an iPhone5 that cannot connect to anything for charging except the charger provided. When in my auto it is useless if the battery is dead.

I also bought the new iPad when they came out with iPhone5 so that is a third connector that serves no purpose for me other than to carry around a bunch of cables to charge the iPhone5, new iPad and old iPad.

I'm all for progress and I try to be patient but why couldn't they have come up with some type of adapters the day they intro new connectors?



Sadly this is all proof that Apple is now run by a bunch of dime-a-dozen MBAs.

Customer loyalty and good press are priceless. For a company with untold billions, I really do not understand why they just don't throw in an adapter with every iphone and ipad. I bet it would cost less than one of these nauseating ad campaigns they have been putting on TV lately. A free adapter would have had a better effect than these stupid ads. :rolleyes:


:apple:

jkauff
Dec 22, 2012, 12:23 PM
It is death to me.

I have an iPhone5 that cannot connect to anything for charging except the charger provided. When in my auto it is useless if the battery is dead.
I guess you don't have what they used to call a cigarette lighter socket in your car. I bought a dual USB port adapter at Radio Shack for about $15 that I use to charge my iPhone 5. Works great.

Stella
Dec 22, 2012, 12:40 PM
Nice back down and U turn by Apple.

Nice work. It will only benefit the consumer and offer more choice.

TheMTtakeover
Dec 22, 2012, 04:39 PM
It is death to me.

I have an iPhone5 that cannot connect to anything for charging except the charger provided. When in my auto it is useless if the battery is dead.

I also bought the new iPad when they came out with iPhone5 so that is a third connector that serves no purpose for me other than to carry around a bunch of cables to charge the iPhone5, new iPad and old iPad.

I'm all for progress and I try to be patient but why couldn't they have come up with some type of adapters the day they intro new connectors?
They do have adapters.

somethingelsefl
Dec 22, 2012, 07:28 PM
Apple needs to do some serious work on Thunderbolt adoption, as the low quantity devices using it and their extreme cost are simply ridiculous. And, this is exactly one place Apple shouldn't be trying to hold their profit margins. Heck, sacrifice if you need to in order to get this connector in the mainstream. The way it is currently headed, it's going to turn out like FW 800 or worse.

Exactly. Apple is hung up on this Lightning adapter, when they need to be focused on Thunderbolt!

SteveW928
Dec 23, 2012, 12:15 AM
Thunderbolt != Lightning. Discussion of Thunderbolt has no relevance here.

(And if Apple could make Thunderbolt cheaper, they would. It's really up to Intel, and AFAICT products are expensive because, simply put, the chips and cables needed for Thunderbolt are still expensive to manufacture.)

Good catch... sorry about that! I've got Thunderbolt on the mind, as I've been dealing with that lately.

Possibly there is some licensing issue, but I'm pretty sure the parts aren't making it that expensive. But even if that is the case, LOSE money until you get some market penetration if you're trying to establish something like this. It isn't just the 3rd parties (assuming some controller chip is expensive), but Apple is still charging $50 for a cable. Is that chip really $45?

----------

Exactly. Apple is hung up on this Lightning adapter, when they need to be focused on Thunderbolt!

Yes, this was an accidental off-topic slip-up (see above)... but I still stand by what I said.

tbrinkma
Dec 23, 2012, 12:24 AM
"A technical issue" stopped them from allowing them on the same accessory?

Oh, so they fixed that "technical issue" overnight, then?

Please at least read the whole article before getting your panties in a wad.

"Our technical specifications provide clear guidelines for developing accessories and they are available to MFi licensees for free," Apple spokesman Tom Neumayr told CNET. "We support accessories that integrate USB and Lightning connectors, but there were technical issues that prevented accessories from integrating 30-pin and Lightning connectors so our guidelines did not allow this."

The company added that the guidelines have since been updated to allow accessories to work with both types of connectors to charge devices.

See the bolded portion of the statement. In all likelyhood the technical specification was written to disallow both connectors because of technical issues involving allowing devices to *communicate* over either/both connectors. Charging doesn't have to do that, so when this reached the attention of someone in a position to tweak the MFi licensing terms, it was tweaked to allow *charging* devices with both connectors.

tl;dr: Apple does the right thing, people blast them for it anyway. :rolleyes:

----------

Why would anyone design a charger with fixed cables hard-wired in?
Makes no sense. Cable type, cable length, wear & tear, etc... this shouldn't have even been an issue, because the designers should have spec'd 6 USB ports for use with any cables the user desires.

I'm with you on that. It simply doesn't make any sense to permanently attach charging cables to the charger. (It made *some* sense back in the day when not everything was 5W/500-1000mA at the wall-wart, but not these days).

Westacular
Dec 23, 2012, 12:52 AM
It isn't just the 3rd parties (assuming some controller chip is expensive), but Apple is still charging $50 for a cable. Is that chip really $45?

Well, there's 3rd party Thunderbolt cables available now ... and they start at $50. If a 3rd party could profitably undercut Apple on the cable price, I think they would -- as it stands, why not just buy the Apple cable? -- which says to me that it really is a damn expensive cable to license and manufacture.

JAT
Dec 23, 2012, 10:26 AM
The goal of the product is not to have to carry around cables with it. It's a portable phone charger that can connect to multiple phones without any external accessories.

Have just USB ports on there defeats the whole purpose of the design behind this thing.
Sure. But at the same time, there are many people who think it is a stupid product and would never buy it.

akatsuki
Dec 23, 2012, 11:30 AM
I'd rather get a 30 pin Airplay adapter.

KnightWRX
Dec 23, 2012, 12:05 PM
Sure. But at the same time, there are many people who think it is a stupid product and would never buy it.

That's your perogative. I personally think the iPod Shuffle is a stupid product and wouldn't buy it, I don't actively go into threads about it and say "Good riddance to this garbage" though, because that's frankly just trolling.

If you aren't interested in the product, don't comment. Obviously, from the money they raised on Kickstarter, quite a few folk are interested.

JAT
Dec 23, 2012, 12:50 PM
That's your perogative. I personally think the iPod Shuffle is a stupid product and wouldn't buy it, I don't actively go into threads about it and say "Good riddance to this garbage" though, because that's frankly just trolling.

If you aren't interested in the product, don't comment. Obviously, from the money they raised on Kickstarter, quite a few folk are interested.
Thought you didn't like strawman arguments? Nobody said that. Except you.

It damn well is on topic to discuss the efficacies of a product. Hardwiring the cords is not a good plan. I hope these people go back to the drawing board and make themselves a useful product.

razmal
Dec 24, 2012, 12:44 AM
Just like the tittle, lightning is a mess. We couldn't use the standard connector from a previous iDevices again.

http://www.razmaldjamal.com
http://razmal.blogspot.com

dfs
Dec 24, 2012, 11:11 PM
"Just like the tittle, lightning is a mess. We couldn't use the standard connector from a previous iDevices again." Now just suppose you were the manufacturer of something to which an iOS device docks (could be anything ranging from a charging station to high-end medical equipment) and you woke up one day to read in the newspaper that by Apple's fiat your product was now obsolescent, even if you might happen to have three warehouses full of the damn things, and that to stay in business you needed to redesign your product and retool your assembly line. If you think the sudden switch to Lightning is bad news for individual consumers like us, consider how awful it is for developers! Yeah, I know about adapters, but I also know of a lot of products where an adapter just flat won't work, and anyway that thirty-five bucks you have to pay to get one could be called a special "pay Apple to be able to keep on using your stuff" tax. It would have taken a bit of the edge off for us end users if Apple included a free adapter with every new iOS device sold, but I guess all those billions being held in corporate reserve aren't enough for them.

jakeruston
Dec 25, 2012, 06:54 PM
There's nothing wrong with lightning, but they seriously need to get a move on with allowing companies to use it.

So little devices available right now.

kd5jos
Dec 26, 2012, 11:09 AM
Now just suppose you were the manufacturer of something to which an iOS device docks (could be anything ranging from a charging station to high-end medical equipment) and you woke up one day to read in the newspaper that by Apple's fiat your product was now obsolescent, even if you might happen to have three warehouses full of the damn things, and that to stay in business you needed to redesign your product and retool your assembly line.

Problems in this sentence:
1) Every iOS device in the marketplace didn't just suddenly convert to a lightening adapter

2) You assume that no manufacturer has ever heard of JIT manufacturing.

3) You assume every manufacturer that makes everything is in every market. This may encourage them to go into a new foreign market where the lightening connector doesn't exist (as a possible solution to the problem).

4) You assume that companies that manufacture don't have strategies to deal with this.

The fact is, if this is a problem, it can cause interesting solutions, or what we in the tech community call INNOVATION. And for the record, a manufacturing company that doesn't expect things like this, deserves to die off. It's a BAD THING to not have a strategy to deal with change, and be a tech company.

If you think the sudden switch to Lightning is bad news for individual consumers like us, consider how awful it is for developers!

It was GREAT news for me and for several developers I know. Faster data speeds means more data in real time, and less waiting for transfers. I (and the developers I know) are willing to pay a price for better. I think MANY people are.

Yeah, I know about adapters, but I also know of a lot of products where an adapter just flat won't work, and anyway that thirty-five bucks you have to pay to get one could be called a special "pay Apple to be able to keep on using your stuff" tax.

Let me correct this for you

"pay Apple to be able to keep on using your stuff because technology has moved on and you now have more data moving through a MUCH faster cable/connector"

It would have taken a bit of the edge off for us end users if Apple included a free adapter with every new iOS device sold, but I guess all those billions being held in corporate reserve aren't enough for them.

So they should pay for you to get more/better/faster? How entitled are you?

albusseverus
Dec 27, 2012, 02:24 AM
There's nothing wrong with lightning, but they seriously need to get a move on with allowing companies to use it.

So little devices available right now.

Thunderbolt has been a disaster in terms of adoption. And what has come out, has been pretty poor and expensive.

Lightning seems to be going down the same road. None to poor. And no wonder, if even charging becomes such an issue!

Gods forbid anyone tries to tangle with case specific pin assignments for data, and D-A converters and the like being required to convert this data outside the Apple device.

It's even worse than FireWire !! At least hardware in the device took care of that…

Really enjoying my simple/reversible connector - so far…

dfs
Dec 27, 2012, 04:45 AM
[QUOTE=kd5jos;16556066]Problems in this sentence:


"It was GREAT news for me and for several developers I know. Faster data speeds means more data in real time, and less waiting for transfers. I (and the developers I know) are willing to pay a price for better. I think MANY people are."

Well, kd5jos, I find it interesting that you are making claims for Lightning that Apple doesn't appear to have made itself. When Apple announced the introduction of Lightning I don't remember it offering any explanation what if any advantages it has over the old 30-pin connection. Perhaps it did to developers, but it sure didn't to us end users. Very possibly it does offer faster data speeds, as you say and as the word Lightning might suggest. But if this is true, Apple should have told the world this from Day One. The way it was shoved at us without any justification, so that the disadvantages of this change were painfully visible and the advantages, if any, not visible at all, was a lousy exercise in public relations, and if you take the time to read all the posts in this thread you can't avoid seeing the customer resistance expressed by quite a few contributors. Sure, I can accept change. What computer user doesn't? But there's gotta be some kind of visible payoff that makes the bitter pill of obsolescence easier to swallow, and so far I, for one, can't see any. And I'm far from the only person in the world who thinks that Apple charging thirty-some bucks for an adapter makes the pill taste all the worse.

BruceEBonus
Dec 27, 2012, 10:14 AM
The lightning adaptor wasn't one of Apples greatest moments and you didn't have to be a medium to realise that pointless adaptor that offered no extra features than the old one would be an unmitigated disaster.

Lets hope post-Jobs Apple tone it down next year. Get the old innovation bones working again and stop the rot in 2013. The competition is increasing. 2013 won't tolerate the cock ups like 2012 did.

We shall see ....

KnightWRX
Dec 27, 2012, 11:15 AM
Thought you didn't like strawman arguments? Nobody said that. Except you.

It damn well is on topic to discuss the efficacies of a product. Hardwiring the cords is not a good plan. I hope these people go back to the drawing board and make themselves a useful product.

It is useful in that it doesn't require you having the device + the necessary cords. All of it is integrated. Stop spouting your opinion as fact on this. You don't see the advantage in an integrated solution with no disconnectable parts, fine, move along.

JAT
Dec 27, 2012, 04:33 PM
It is useful in that it doesn't require you having the device + the necessary cords. All of it is integrated. Stop spouting your opinion as fact on this. You don't see the advantage in an integrated solution with no disconnectable parts, fine, move along.
Read the rules, again, Knight. You quote them often enough. Every statement here is opinion, by definition. What, you can read my mind to know that's not what I meant??!@!

And of course, you never admit to your ****ing wrongdoing. Why do you even come here just to rip on people in a questionable way??

KnightWRX
Dec 27, 2012, 07:20 PM
Why do you even come here just to rip on people in a questionable way??

I don't, you made a statement of fact :

I hope these people go back to the drawing board and make themselves a useful product.

The product is useful. It might not be what you need, but to people who want an integrated solution with no disconnectable parts, it is rather useful.

The product's usefulness is not a "matter of fact", that is simply your opinion. I'm not riping on you in a questionnable way, I'm asking you to refrain stating your opinion as a fact, since I for one do not share it.

I have to ask, why do you feel the need to rip on anything and everything not branded Apple I might ask ? If you don't like it, don't come here and state facts that are simply your opinion disguised as such. If you're going to state facts, stick to actual factual information.

princigalli
Dec 28, 2012, 12:10 AM
what's wrong with micro USB used on Android devices?

JAT
Dec 29, 2012, 09:09 PM
I don't, you made a statement of fact :



The product is useful. It might not be what you need, but to people who want an integrated solution with no disconnectable parts, it is rather useful.

The product's usefulness is not a "matter of fact", that is simply your opinion. I'm not riping on you in a questionnable way, I'm asking you to refrain stating your opinion as a fact, since I for one do not share it.

I have to ask, why do you feel the need to rip on anything and everything not branded Apple I might ask ? If you don't like it, don't come here and state facts that are simply your opinion disguised as such. If you're going to state facts, stick to actual factual information.

I FIGURED IT OUT!! That dude in China was chatting on here with you. Took twice, but he finally escaped. Lucky bastard.

Dunkrag
Jan 2, 2013, 10:57 PM
what's wrong with micro USB used on Android devices?

Quite. Or even USB three - it's no thicker.

Lightning has been the most cynical Apple move I can remember.

Lil Chillbil
Jan 3, 2013, 09:24 PM
Typical apple not getting it right before release