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hui__lim
Dec 4, 2002, 01:08 PM
Guys, as I'm a recent swithcer and not really dwelled deep into the dark world of Macs, do you think you could name me some advantages of Apple over PCs??? Having this argument with this arrogant PC lover saying PCs are better, faster and cheaper (can't really argue about the cheaper and faster bit). And am I right saying that the graphics industry use Macs over PCs? What kinda software do they use as all I can recall is Quark? Help would be appreciated. Thanks

edesignuk
Dec 4, 2002, 01:29 PM
UNIX based = Stability, WORKING memory management, and each app is help within it's own memory space so that if it does crash it doesn't take the whole system down with it.
And the best thing?...You don't get these...;)

vniow
Dec 4, 2002, 01:39 PM
Originally posted by edesignuk

And the best thing?...You don't get these...;)


One thing that's great about Macs is, when they lockup it's much more colorful.

I much prefer a spinning rainbow beachball to a boring blue screen.http://img.ranchoweb.com/images/veronica/smiley.gif

Mr. Anderson
Dec 4, 2002, 01:48 PM
Peripheral devices just plug in, you don't need to add drivers, reboot, etc. Although PCs are getting better at this, they have a long way to go.

D

strider42
Dec 4, 2002, 02:06 PM
frankly, I'd ignore the argument. People should use what they like. I like apple, it suits my needs, its plenty fast for me and competitively priced when you consider the quality and everything included (I mean, if price and speed were the only cosiderations, we'd all drive a korean cars with big engines). Feel secure enough in liking your apple to ignore the argument, and if the PC user persists, ask him why he has to justify his computer choice. Its an impossible argument to win because there are no hard and fast answers, and much fo the comparison is not tangible. To each their own.

liven2
Dec 4, 2002, 02:43 PM
I used to laugh at you being a Mac (gag) user but not any more!!! I have a confession.. consider this being a way to say I am sorry! All I can say is I was so wrong about Apple computers! *please read below*

Why buy a Mac? Especially me, Iím a Network administrator, responsible for a large number of Windows servers on a daily basis. Certified in more Microsoft Certifications than I care to admit. And I am quite happy and content to go about my daily Windows routine.

I first noticed the iMac watching TV, an interview with Steve Jobs in early January. My first thought was, nice lamp! Then the DVD burner caught my attention. After a little research I considered it a possibility, but not seriously, after all Iím a MS guy. I looked seriously at both platforms and calculated what it would cost for both. With interest somewhat piqued, I called one of the local resellers. We arranged to have it delivered to the office. I was very apprehensive, with a bad case of post purchase stress syndrome. What have I done?

It arrived as promised, a Mac amongst a sea of Compaqs. It caused a commotion at the office, as the Windows guys started pouring out of the woodwork. Some joking and teasing took place, I found myself defending it. (Not that I had a leg to stand on, I havenít even turned it on yet) but what a crowd of curious people.

I managed to get it home and eagerly opened the box, and attached the various clear plastic devices and fired it up. For the first time in many years I looked somewhat puzzled at a GUI I knew nothing of. Refreshing. I configured the TCP/IP settings to become part of my little home network in no time at all, although it looked out of place sitting next to a couple of beige NT Clones. The OS automatically downloaded the latest OS X upgrade and the DVD upgrade too. In under 15 minutes from the box, iMovie was capturing its first set of DV clips from my Digital 8 Cam. It worked as advertised. (I know that sounds anti-climatic, but it really is a big deal)

As a Windows kind of guy, here are my impressions so far. (I donít have any horrible feelings towards Microsoft or Bill Gates, so no MS bashing here, sorry).

I like the over all performance with an 800 processor. We Windows types are hung up on CPU speeds.

I like not having to fart around, searching for fixes, comparing firmware versions, reading obscure Ďreadmeí files to find out it really isnít what was promised, downloading file after file of Services packs, Hot Fixes, Service Releases to get it to work. Hoping that the fix doesnít blow up the OS. (it happens all the time)

I love the display, it is gorgeous, as big as my 17-inch monitor. Wonders of flat panels

I love FireWire and how it handles my Digital Cameras. BTW, I tried adding a FireWire card to one of my Windows machines with little success. Not worth the effort. I was surprised that my Digital8 worked even when not listed in the compatibility list. Amazing

I like iPhoto - A nice app , It is So awesome to use with a camera!!!! WOW!!.

I like iDVD - What can I say, Iíve been waiting for a solution for years. Works slick AN like better than anything on a PC.

I love iMovie - Finally I can organize my endless hours of home movies best App I have ever used took me 15 min to learn it.

I like iTunes - The nicest Music app Iíve seen to date.

Iím surprised with AppleWorks - Seems to be able to handle all of my MS Office documents. (Someone told me that the Mac wouldnít be able to read my MS Office files, he was wrong, I was surprised. Is this one of the myths I keep reading about?)

The OS, it all makes sense, and visually pleasing too. Powerful yet simple. Stable. Stable. Stable. 10 weeks of continuous use and not a single reboot. And thatís with me investigating and tinkering with everything.

Networking is a breeze.

I can see my desk again, Iíve regained more than half of my desk!

So why did I do it? Some had to do with pure numbers, the cost of the iMac was much cheaper than purchasing all the hardware and software components, to be fully DV and DVD-R compliant on a PC. What attracted me most was the single solution. The iMac was designed to do what I wanted, and was proven to work. Too often Iíve purchased PC components that donít work well together, I want to use my PC, I donít like troubleshooting problems in my spare time. I do that all day long, and get paid for it. Not to mention troubleshooting my friends and families PCís too.

My new iMac works, works better than I ever thought and as advertised, really. ohh and cost less than any PC i could configure with a DVD burner and all this software..... And faster than one would believe

edesignuk
Dec 4, 2002, 02:58 PM
WOW liven2! That's quite a story there...and a good one too! :)
It's great to see people like you (Wintel admins and alike) giving the mac platform a chance and loving it, it's a real good advert for Apple.
Glad you like your iMac :) ...and welcome to the 'cult' ;)

Mr. Anderson
Dec 4, 2002, 03:14 PM
Originally posted by liven2
My new iMac works, works better than I ever thought and as advertised, really. ohh and cost less than any PC i could configure with a DVD burner and all this software..... And faster than one would believe

Fantastic! - its great to see that the price of an Mac is really quite simillar or better than a PC, all you really see is the cheap ones advertised and not the ones that are outfitted the same as a the macs.

Have you sent your story to Apple, they have a section on the switch page for telling your own Switch Stories. You should do it.

D

jefhatfield
Dec 4, 2002, 03:48 PM
PC - faster and cheaper, yes

Macs - better hardware, maybe or maybe not, since a lot of components are shared between a lot of companies these days

1) but Macs require less maintenance and thus cheaper to run from day to day, month to month, etc (mostly due to OS)

2) the operating systems os 9 and os x are easier to use than windows xp/w2k/nt or windows 95/98/ME families of operating systems

that's all i can say that is really obvious and hard to debate against and if your friend can't see those two merits, then he/she is not being open minded

let your friend use your machine and get to know it...that is the best way to prove the good points of a mac

zimv20
Dec 4, 2002, 03:51 PM
hui__lim -- i simply tell people that i've used macs and pcs extensively and i prefer macs.

most people who challenge me on it haven't really used macs, which is really an indefensible position. and i make sure i mention that.

fleetwood
Dec 4, 2002, 04:01 PM
I would have to say that the IApps add value over the PC.
Not only are the IApps some of the best at what they do but they are free with evrey Mac.
Have you compared IMovie to the free PC counterpart or Itunes.
And IPhoto is the best app hands down for Photos.

DeadlyBreakfast
Dec 4, 2002, 04:05 PM
Originally posted by liven2
I do that all day long, and get paid for it. Not to mention troubleshooting my friends and families PCís too.



I feel your pain......


Cool story. I too am a recent switcher and Net Admin.

Welcome to the light side.

I picked up an iBook.....Now I just love to go to meetings and not have to fight with all the PC guys for a plug to power my laptop. These guys cant go a half hour.....LOL.....Gotta love it!!

loveshismac
Dec 4, 2002, 04:12 PM
its as simple as
with a mac i use all my energy in being creative, instead of why wont this thing print, scan, talk with digital devices, etc.

I am much more productive therefore much more valuable as an employee.

you asked what creative people use in the print industry.

try photoshop
illustrator
indesign
screw quark
not x capitable yet


Macromedia MX product line for most web work
and the iapps everyday

and with a powermac in 10.2.2 i have it all running all the time.
even while emulating os9 to run lotus notes for my corp mail.

MacCoaster
Dec 4, 2002, 05:14 PM
Originally posted by edesignuk
UNIX based = Stability, WORKING memory management, and each app is help within it's own memory space so that if it does crash it doesn't take the whole system down with it.
And the best thing?...You don't get these...;)
Weird screen. Never seen anything like that specific message.

Ever since I upgraded my RAM to 1 GB of the absolute best DDR RAM (Corsair, mind ya :)), I have yet to see Windows XP blue screen. Even doing multiple things at ridiculous speeds taking up a good amount of RAM (Photoshop + web development apps + etc.).

Yes, Mac OS X's protected memory and UNIX base are great. They were much needed to catch up and even sometimes surpass the Windows NT family's stability.

What *I* think Macs are best for is the i-line of consumer hardware and software. They're great for beginners and people who don't want to waste time with extreme customizability. The Power-line of Macs are IMHO too overpriced and undervalued for the power they give. I wonder if it is possible to use FCP on the Macintosh networked to a high end PC that'd render the video. That'd be a great solution for creative users needing both the Mac familarity and the speed and performance of the PC.

If I know some people who will *never* understand simple concepts, I will tell them to use Macintosh. Otherwise, UNIX or Windows XP on PC.

But for power-users, especially when speed (and yes, high quality) is important, custom built PC running an UNIX variant or *gasp* Windows XP Professional.

daveg5
Dec 4, 2002, 05:29 PM
check out www.xlr8yourmac.com as they figured out how you can have a second independant display , not that you need one with a 17' flat screen.

Ifeelbloated
Dec 4, 2002, 05:59 PM
Tell the PC user that he is an ignorant jackass. Most are anyway. I am in an unforgiveable mood right now for some reason.

daveg5
Dec 4, 2002, 06:03 PM
Poor soul and then go back to having fun on your mac

DeKa
Dec 5, 2002, 05:02 AM
Originally posted by liven2


My new iMac works, works better than I ever thought and as advertised, really. ohh and cost less than any PC i could configure with a DVD burner and all this software..... And faster than one would believe

I look after a total of 9 PC's between our family business and home, and I bought a 17" iMac with the same price comparison in mind. If I speced up a PC with a 17" LCD, DVD writer and all the same stuff as my 17" iMac has got, it would have cost more than what I paid for the iMac. Considering a 17" iMac is $4395 in Australia, it's no small sum of money, but in the 3 months so far, it's definately been worth it :D

That price advantage sold me, along with the beautiful OS X.

Derek.

BenderBot1138
Dec 5, 2002, 05:41 AM
Originally posted by hui__lim
Guys, I'm... Having this argument with this arrogant PC lover ...

You should only argue with modest, self-effacing, humble, and unconceited PC lovers.

:cool:

PS... aren't you interested in what the Gals have to say as well?

hui__lim
Dec 5, 2002, 02:18 PM
lol guess you guys are right. should just let him have a try and see what he thinks of it. Unforunately, he is like a hard core gaming person, and as Macs do not have the cutting edge in the latest games, he still thinks windows is better. But what he does ADMIT is that OSX rocks due to the design and he LOVES the style of the Apple products :D

Durandal7
Dec 5, 2002, 06:01 PM
It is my experience that M$ zealots tend to make statements like "Mac can't go online, they're gay. I hate them." It is for this reason that I ignore PC users for the most part.

solvs
Dec 5, 2002, 06:42 PM
I've tried reasoning with my Stepmother. For what she does, a Mac would be perfect. But she refuses. She keeps telling me that it won't work with anything. Same old ignorance (and she doesn't want to be "weird"). "I can't access the internet with it" (she's got Earthlink dial-up. Duh).

Of course, she keeps asking me how to get "Ethernet" internet access.

I've tried explaining T1 Lines/DSL/Cable to her, but she still doesn't get it.

Some people never will.

mdouglas
Dec 5, 2002, 10:34 PM
I actually posted the following in a separate discussion but thought I'd copy it here as it seems appropriate to do so:


I'm a recent switcher - replaced a 1 year old Dell desktop and a practically new Windows laptop with an iMac and iBook, respectively. I'm sure that some of the members of this forum have tired of my fairly remedial questions, but I'm very happy with the switch. As an example, I paid about 3K for my "movie studio" Dell PC about a year ago. I dreamed of having a digital workstation to burn movies for grandparents, download music, etc. Well, after numerous hours on the phone with Dell and various software companies trying to get the bundled software, firewire, etc. on that computer to (unsuccessfully) work, I ended up using the machine for internet perusing and the occassional Powerpoint presentation. In other words, I could've spent about $1000 for a Windows machine that would've accomplished the same crap.

Then....... I bought in to the Apple ads and purchased an iMac / digital hub. At the same time, I rid myself of most vestiges of my former PC world (even ditched AOL for a .Mac account). Other than buying Microsoft office for Macs, I've completely left Microsoft (still have an Xbox, though). Eventually got an iBook / Airport / etc. - all in the past 6 weeks. Incidentally, the IT people at my office said that an Apple laptop would "crash" our network and that I wasn't to hook it up. Well, I didn't listen to them (they indirectly work for me), and I've had no trouble integrating my iBook in to the office system.

Am I happy? Very! Heck, they could put me in an Apple ad - I'm burning DVD's, saving music to my iPod, and built my website on my .Mac account in an hour one Sunday.

Sincerely,
Mark Douglas (new convert to the faith)

P.S. Now that I've done my part to contribute to the longevity of the Apple system, when do y'all teach me the secret handshake?

pnz999
Dec 10, 2002, 10:13 AM
I notice that alot of artists, musicans, graphic designers all uses a Mac computer so,

Are there any specific difference between say between Adobe Photoshop 7 on Mac and a PC? or Macromedia Studio MX on Mac and PC?

or is it just OS X is more stable, so people like it?

SilvorX
Dec 10, 2002, 10:35 AM
only 2 days after owning a mac, i already experienced my very first kernel panic, right when i started up too :S...kinda strange tho

solvs
Dec 10, 2002, 04:26 PM
Those programs just seem easier to use on a Mac than a PC IMO. Sometimes faster too. And more stabilty, at least for me. You still get problems, but MOST OF THE TIME it's not the OS. Everyone's experiances may vary, of course.

No secret handshake. In this club, everyone is welcome. Even stupid people.

(note: I was NOT implying you were stupid BTW. And no offense to stupid people, some of my best friends are stupid)

Skandranon
Dec 10, 2002, 05:41 PM
Originally posted by solvs
No secret handshake. In this club, everyone is welcome. Even stupid people.

What a stupid thing to say. :p

Jaykay
Dec 10, 2002, 06:12 PM
I have to say i find it funny walking into college.I walk past these computer rooms full fo pcs on this massive network containing thousands of pcs all over the network(of the college).

Now that not really that funny, but i recently took a look down in the media suite in the college and what did i find but a room full of macs, what else, all running photoshop and the like. As it turns out, pcs are only used for simple fuctions like browsing the internet or making up a word document and the macs are used for the important stuff.

So ive found out that out of the seven people heading up the computer services section of my college that five of them use a mac at home or at the office.

Now thats funny..

Doctor Q
Dec 10, 2002, 06:42 PM
I've set up over one hundred Macs for other people (I do a lot of volunteer work). It almost always goes smoothly and has never left me bleeding and disgusted.

Today I set up a brand new Toshiba notebook PC with Windows XP, purchased yesterday. A protruding staple sliced my finger as I took it out of the box. :eek: I cleaned up the blood, connected the cables, and turned it on. It displayed a message about a checksum error and told me to go into SETUP and correct the problem. :confused: I straightened that out and got it to boot. It launched Norton AntiVirus and told me that I had a 90 day free subscription, ending March 2000! The system had the wrong date, and Norton AntiVirus set the trial period before I got to set the system date and time. :mad:

The reason I prefer Macs is that the total experience is better, from packaging to design to instructions to operating system to application design and integration to support. No one factor is the advantage; the combination is what makes them tops.

mmmdreg
Dec 11, 2002, 02:39 AM
Originally posted by SilvorX
only 2 days after owning a mac, i already experienced my very first kernel panic, right when i started up too :S...kinda strange tho

you got a mac finally? maybe i'm behind the times...when did you get it? what is it?