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MacRumors
Mar 5, 2013, 08:44 AM
http://images.macrumors.com/im/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2013/03/05/sapphire-previews-radeon-hd-7950-mac-edition-graphics-card-for-mac-pro/)


As noted by Accelerate Your Mac (http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/index.html#MacRadeon7950card) and tonymacx86 (http://www.tonymacx86.com/mac-pro/91541-amd-radeon-hd-7950-mac-pro-showcased-cebit-germany.html), German site PCGamesHardware.de reports (http://www.pcgameshardware.de/AMD-Radeon-Hardware-255597/News/Sapphire-zeigt-Radeon-HD-7950-Mac-Edition-auf-der-Cebit-1058864/) [Google translation (http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A//www.pcgameshardware.de/AMD-Radeon-Hardware-255597/News/Sapphire-zeigt-Radeon-HD-7950-Mac-Edition-auf-der-Cebit-1058864/&hl=en&langpair=auto|en&tbb=1&ie=UTF-8)] that Hong Kong-based company Sapphire Technology is previewing its new Radeon HD 7950 Mac Edition graphics card at CeBIT this week. The high-end card arrives following Apple's introduction of Radeon HD 7000-series drivers (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/11/27/os-x-10-8-3-beta-contains-drivers-for-amd-radeon-7000-series-graphics-cards/) in OS X 10.8.3 betas last November, although the update has yet to be released to the public.At Cebit we saw the Radeon HD 7950 Mac Edition for the first time live. The upper-class graphics card based on the original HD 7950, which uses dark brown board waived a boost function and is clocked at 800 MHz (GPU). The 3 GiByte GDDR5 memory, as well as its clock of 2,500 MHz, unchanged.Sapphire is reportedly planning to price the Radeon 7950 Mac Edition at $450.

http://images.macrumors.com/article-new/2013/03/sapphire_radeon_hd_7950.jpg
Mac Pro news and rumors are beginning to pick up steam following Apple's promise (http://www.macrumors.com/2012/06/12/apple-spokesperson-confirms-new-mac-pro-and-imac-designs-likely-coming-in-2013/) last June that "new designs" of the workstation would be arriving in 2013. Last month, Apple ceased European sales (http://www.macrumors.com/2013/02/18/mac-pro-now-unavailable-for-purchase-from-european-apple-online-stores/) of the current Mac Pro due to its non-compliance with new safety regulations, increasing the urgency of an update, while just yesterday a report surfaced about Apple-branded 2 TB solid-state drives (http://www.macrumors.com/2013/03/04/apple-building-2tb-solid-state-drives-for-next-mac-pro-release/) for the Mac Pro.

Article Link: Sapphire Previews Radeon HD 7950 Mac Edition Graphics Card for Mac Pro (http://www.macrumors.com/2013/03/05/sapphire-previews-radeon-hd-7950-mac-edition-graphics-card-for-mac-pro/)



cambox
Mar 5, 2013, 08:46 AM
Just need the new mac pro to go with it! Get it sorted Apple!!!!

Xenomorph
Mar 5, 2013, 08:48 AM
I just pre-ordered a bunch!

I'm going to have the most expensive, Mac-based Bitcoin mining system, ever!

eagandale4114
Mar 5, 2013, 08:54 AM
TWO Mac Pro based news items in under 24 hours?!?!:eek::eek:

blakey91
Mar 5, 2013, 08:56 AM
This new mac pro is going to cost silly money, the top spec now is already £15k+ :(

TallManNY
Mar 5, 2013, 09:00 AM
Yep. And it will be marketed as the biggest and best computer and made in America.

It will sell.

Spacedust
Mar 5, 2013, 09:06 AM
It won't fit in the current Mac Pro's in slot 1 ! Look at these large screws on the back.

Kissaragi
Mar 5, 2013, 09:17 AM
I want one! Bet it wont be compatible with a 2009 mac pro tho

mattlong1978
Mar 5, 2013, 09:23 AM
I was just about to buy a GTX 670 for my 2008 Mac Pro, is there any reason besides the EFI Boot screen that makes it's worth holding out for one of these? or should I just go for it.

kyjaotkb
Mar 5, 2013, 09:26 AM
Stop dreaming about the Mac Pro, folks.

This fantastic new product just needs a long-enough external Thunderbolt enclosure with 400W external power supply. It would be the most expensive and awkward MacBook Air accessory. I'm salivating.

wlossw
Mar 5, 2013, 09:35 AM
Question is what ports... thunderbolt confirmed?:confused:

ArtOfWarfare
Mar 5, 2013, 09:41 AM
TWO Mac Pro based news items in under 24 hours?!?!:eek::eek:

Not just that, but they're GOOD Mac Pro based news items!

In contrast to the third most recent Mac Pro news item from MacRumors:
February 18th: Mac Pro Now Unavailable for Purchase from European Apple Online Stores (http://www.macrumors.com/2013/02/18/mac-pro-now-unavailable-for-purchase-from-european-apple-online-stores/)

boccabella
Mar 5, 2013, 09:49 AM
Again, Apple DID NOT promise "new designs" of the Mac Pro in 2013.

jonnysods
Mar 5, 2013, 09:52 AM
Oh man, I miss my old Mac Pro.

Michael73
Mar 5, 2013, 09:59 AM
Come to papa! :D

BriSpe
Mar 5, 2013, 10:01 AM
It won't fit in the current Mac Pro's in slot 1 ! Look at these large screws on the back.

What are you talking about? It's the same as the current HD 5870

snberk103
Mar 5, 2013, 10:19 AM
What the heck is a ... dark brown board waived a boost function ...? :confused:
(In the quote in the news item)

dtremit
Mar 5, 2013, 10:34 AM
Great, $450 for a Mac version, but the PC version lists at $320. Uh, thanks, Sapphire?

Navdakilla
Mar 5, 2013, 10:49 AM
Can it play crysis? :confused: :p

cal6n
Mar 5, 2013, 10:53 AM
What the heck is a ... dark brown board waived a boost function ... :confused:
(In the quote in the news item)

No idea. The quote is from google translate, so it could mean anything...

Rampage Dev
Mar 5, 2013, 10:55 AM
Great, $450 for a Mac version, but the PC version lists at $320. Uh, thanks, Sapphire?

Cost of licensing with Apple. Do not blame Sapphire for Apple's high cost of Business.

lucasfer899
Mar 5, 2013, 10:59 AM
TWO Mac Pro based news items in under 24 hours?!?!:eek::eek:
PRAISE THE LORD AND HIS WONDERFUL WAYS.

It won't fit in the current Mac Pro's in slot 1 ! Look at these large screws on the back.
Seriously?

I want one! Bet it wont be compatible with a 2009 mac pro tho
I'm pretty sure it is. As long as you have OSX 10.8

Question is what ports... thunderbolt confirmed?:confused:
No. No graphics cards have thunderbolt. IMO it should be kitted out with Mini Displayport, which can be adapted to anything.

Again, Apple DID NOT promise "new designs" of the Mac Pro in 2013.
Tim Cook himself said there was a Mac Pro redesign imminent for this year.

Great, $450 for a Mac version, but the PC version lists at $320. Uh, thanks, Sapphire?
Ripping off the Mac users. You can just stick the PC version in a MP anyway -.-

----------

For the people wondering THE PORTS:
http://videocardz.com/images/2013/03/Sapphire-HD-7950-Mac-Edition-6.jpg

1x Dual Link DVI; 1x HDMI; 2x Mini Displayport

snberk103
Mar 5, 2013, 11:01 AM
....
Tim Cook himself said there was a Mac Pro redesign imminent for this year.

...

I'm pretty sure if you look at his quote, he simply said that there was something coming for pro users in response to a question about a Mac Pro. I don't think you will find he every used the words "Mac Pro". But I could be wrong...

lucasfer899
Mar 5, 2013, 11:03 AM
I'm pretty sure if you look at his quote, he simply said that there was something coming for pro users in response to a question about a Mac Pro. I don't think you will find he every used the words "Mac Pro". But I could be wrong...

I know he didn't specifically say Mac Pro, but something along the lines of a Mac Pro for Pro end users. Basically the same thing but sure :p

Giuly
Mar 5, 2013, 11:03 AM
We saw the Radeon HD 7950 Mac Edition for the first time in person at the CeBit. The high-end graphics card is based on the reference design of the HD7950 and uses the same brown circuit board, foregoes the speed boost and clocks the GPU cores at 800MHz. Both the 3GiByte of GDDR5 and it's clock of 2.500MHz remain unchanged.

Something like that, I guess.

milbournosphere
Mar 5, 2013, 11:05 AM
Shiny. The aging 5770 in my Pro is ready to be put to pasture. Can't wait for a decent replacement.

lucasfer899
Mar 5, 2013, 11:11 AM
Shiny. The aging 5770 in my Pro is ready to be put to pasture. Can't wait for a decent replacement.

And to think some people are only just upgrading to 5770's from things like GT120's! :eek:

snberk103
Mar 5, 2013, 11:19 AM
Something like that, I guess.

That makes a whole lot more sense. And in hindsight it is easy to see how it got morphed...

Thanks...

----------

I know he didn't specifically say Mac Pro, but something along the lines of a Mac Pro for Pro end users. Basically the same thing but sure :p

We will just have to wait and find out. I took delivery of a brand new refurbished Mac Pro a few months ago, so I'm good for 3 or 4 years. So this interest is mostly academic for me.

george-brooks
Mar 5, 2013, 11:38 AM
Again, Apple DID NOT promise "new designs" of the Mac Pro in 2013.

"Our pro customers are really important to us...don't worry as we're working on something really great for later next year."

So what are you suggesting then, a completely new model?

----------

And to think some people are only just upgrading to 5770's from things like GT120's! :eek:

I only recently upgraded to a 5870 from a 2600. 256MB?!? Couldn't deal with that anymore.

DELTAsnake
Mar 5, 2013, 11:58 AM
Well looks like I have an option to update my Mac Pro this year that isn't buying a new system. Very happy to see this card.

thedarkhorse
Mar 5, 2013, 11:58 AM
"Our pro customers are really important to us...don't worry as we're working on something really great for later next year."

So what are you suggesting then, a completely new model?

----------




I think he's suggesting that there is no real indication they are planning to redesign the case/look of the machine. "something really great" could mean just a powerful machine with modern hardware in the same package.

Kissaragi
Mar 5, 2013, 12:02 PM
Great, $450 for a Mac version, but the PC version lists at $320. Uh, thanks, Sapphire?

It will probably be £450 here.....

Hakone
Mar 5, 2013, 12:04 PM
Great, $450 for a Mac version, but the PC version lists at $320. Uh, thanks, Sapphire?

White paint, bro! :eek:

bedifferent
Mar 5, 2013, 12:21 PM
Fantastic. Now work on OpenGL Core 4+ support, Windows and other OS's have been dusting OS X for a long while now.

Cannot wait for a new Mac Pro! :D

I'd love a system similar to the ill-fated G4 Cube

- Compact for easy placement
- Thunderbolt and USB 3.0
- 1-2 Processors (Xeon and perhaps i7 for base models allowing PowerMac G4/5 costs for those who want upgradability unavailable in iMac's and Mac Mini's)
- 2-3 PCIe slots
- 2-3 SATA III Internal Bays
- RAM (of course)
- Perhaps an external Thunderbolt graphics box

Run a Thunderbolt cable to a workstation for display(s), HID's, and attach external HDD/SSD's, Optical, etc via Thunderbolt. Small form factor, more BTO options, better range of processors, and open the system up to those who have jumped ship to Windows or Linux. I'm sold.

Spacedust
Mar 5, 2013, 12:28 PM
What are you talking about? It's the same as the current HD 5870

The back of HD5770 and HD5870 is completely flat, this one is having very long screws near the core.

http://imageshack.us/a/img26/3717/bbbbbyd.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img407/2528/aaaaslw.jpg

Setmose
Mar 5, 2013, 01:10 PM
Other than Apple, I think only ASUS has a Thunderbolt display out there. I think this is what really hung up Apple on the Mac Pro refresh. They just couldn't get Nvidia and AMD on board the Thunderbolt train. Will the next generation of Apple displays have MiniDisplayPort as a cable option? :apple:

Edit: Since Thunderbolt has the same physical connector as MiniDisplayPort, maybe one of the two ports is Thunderbolt?

DevoAtari
Mar 5, 2013, 01:16 PM
I hope it will run cooler than my 2GB 6870. It took a lot of work to keep the fan noise low... I might jump for this if it does run quieter.

Larry-K
Mar 5, 2013, 01:25 PM
Great, $450 for a Mac version, but the PC version lists at $320. Uh, thanks, Sapphire?
Considering what the sad little 5780 costs, this is a bargain.

----------

"Our pro customers are really important to us...don't worry as we're working on something really great for later next year."

It's the same as being stuck on the phone: "Your call is important to us, please stay on the line and our next representative will be with you shortly. Estimated wait time is... (in another voice) 'four years'".

Anytime somebody tells you that you are important, they're just trying to not hurt your feelings.

DELTAsnake
Mar 5, 2013, 01:37 PM
The back of HD5770 and HD5870 is completely flat, this one is having very long screws near the core.


First, this is pre-production hardware.

Second, the 5xxx cards for the Mac Pro have heat sinks on the back, this 7950 has no heat sink. If you look at the 5xxx cards in person the heat sink adds thickness to the card.

dannyp1996
Mar 5, 2013, 02:12 PM
Since Thunderbolt has the same physical connector as MiniDisplayPort, maybe one of the two ports is Thunderbolt?

I would say that that is somewhere between very unlikely and not at all. For this, Sapphire would have had to work some way of taking the Thunderbolt signal from the Logic Board (where the chips live), and pushing this through the graphics card. Unfortunately, this just looks too much like every other reference designed 7950 I have ever seen. This will not have Thunderbolt.

If Apple do include Thunderbolt in their next Pro workstation, it would likely use the same technology that ASUS uses on its Z77 boards for Thunderbolt (the board takes the output from the GPU through the PCIe slot and then pushes the video signal through a Thunderbolt port on the Motherboard.

Here is one of the aforementioned boards: http://uk.asus.com/Motherboards/Intel_Socket_1155/P8Z77V_PROTHUNDERBOLT/

bergert
Mar 5, 2013, 02:15 PM
First, this is pre-production hardware.

Second, the 5xxx cards for the Mac Pro have heat sinks on the back, this 7950 has no heat sink. If you look at the 5xxx cards in person the heat sink adds thickness to the card.

My HD4870 has the exact same 4x heat-sink screws on the back (rises exactly 4mm from the PCB); in fact even the 2x 6-pin cables are the same.

The card will likely not be supported on the 2008 MacPro (3,1) because of MiniDisplay ports: http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1000475&page=2 DVI will work.

MagnusVonMagnum
Mar 5, 2013, 02:33 PM
It won't fit in the current Mac Pro's in slot 1 ! Look at these large screws on the back.

What's the point in having a Mac with a replaceable graphics card if almost every new graphics card that comes out for it (spaced years apart it seems) doesn't work in the previous generation machines? :confused:

Kissaragi
Mar 5, 2013, 02:58 PM
I think he's suggesting that there is no real indication they are planning to redesign the case/look of the machine. "something really great" could mean just a powerful machine with modern hardware in the same package.

Honesty, what more could anyone want? The current enclosure still looks great and has excellent cooling. All it really needs is new faster internals and for apple to keep spec bumping it as new components are released.

Ye that last wish is a bit of a slim chance....

deconstruct60
Mar 5, 2013, 03:04 PM
I would say that that is somewhere between very unlikely and not at all. For this, Sapphire would have had to work some way of taking the Thunderbolt signal from the Logic Board (where the chips live), and pushing this through the graphics card.


That approach has about zero chance of working. The gap between the Thunderbolt controller and the physical ports has to be around an inch or two.

this is also backwards! The output from the GPU must be feed through the Thunderbolt controller and then out to the physical port.

The thunderbolt controller would have to be on the GPU card itself. That still leaves the problem of how the PCI-e x4 througput gets to the controller (can "steal"/"share" it with the GPU put you've chopped down its bandwidth to rest of system) and powering the TB controller and delivering power to TB sockets, since the are modest power producers. (Again you can steal/borrow from the GPU infrastructure but that too will mean compromises. )

Intel has said since Thunderbolt was intially release that it is aimed at the motherboard and there aren't any PCI-e solutions on the horzion.

Putting Thunderbolt on a GPU card isn't likely going to be certified any time soon. It is mainly an idea advocated by those who want to position that discrete cards can solve every problem. They don't.



If Apple do include Thunderbolt in their next Pro workstation, it would likely use the same technology that ASUS uses on its Z77 boards for Thunderbolt (the board takes the output from the GPU through the PCIe slot and then pushes the video signal through a Thunderbolt port on the Motherboard.


Not! That solution takes the iGPU from the CPU socket and hooks it to the TB controller which is connected to the TB ports on the edge of the motherboard.

Any PCI-e graphics card is only virtually connected by copying its frame buffer over to the iGPUs. (on web you reference see the "LucidLogix Virtu MVP " section of the page. )


Apple is likely to use Xeon E5 1600 and 2600 solutions. Those have no GPU. The solution that exists that Apple has already deployed is to use an embedded GPU just like on the iMac. A GPU and VRAM soldered to the motherboard will provide DisplayPort output to the TB controller. That controller will connect to two ports ( probably on the back. Perhaps where the two analog auido ports are now. Or Apple tossing something else off the back. )

It isn't really necessary to virtually map a second GPU's output. All that is necessary for TB is just one. A discrete card could function in a new Mac Pro just like a second one does in the current Mac Pro. That card's outputs are hooked to a different set of monitors. There is no good rational reason why all the GPUs in a Mac Pro must output only through TB ports. Makes no sense at all.

dannyp1996
Mar 5, 2013, 04:23 PM
this is also backwards! The output from the GPU must be feed through the Thunderbolt controller and then out to the physical port.

If you see the rest of my post, I go on to explain exactly that.

Lone Deranger
Mar 5, 2013, 04:48 PM
Again, Apple DID NOT promise "new designs" of the Mac Pro in 2013.

I'm pretty sure if you look at his quote, he simply said that there was something coming for pro users in response to a question about a Mac Pro. I don't think you will find he every used the words "Mac Pro". But I could be wrong...

I know he didn't specifically say Mac Pro, but something along the lines of a Mac Pro for Pro end users. Basically the same thing but sure :p


Apple Says New Models, Designs for Mac Pro In Works, Due in 2013 (Update) (http://www.forbes.com/sites/connieguglielmo/2012/06/12/apple-says-new-models-designs-for-imac-mac-pro-in-works-due-in-2013/)

deconstruct60
Mar 5, 2013, 05:03 PM
If you see the rest of my post, I go on to explain exactly that.

But that too was wrong. The output from the PCI-e card is not connected to the TB input. Only the iGPU is. Software copies over the data but is like saying the GPU is hooked to the system's RAM.

The core issue is there need an embedded GPU on the main motherboard ( either GPU mounted on logical board or CPU/GPU combo ) to be aligned with what Thunderbolt is primarily designed for.

Classic form factor discrete PCI-e GPU boards are not the motherboard so not an aligned fit.

Thunderbolt inside of a personal computer device has to be equally both a displayPort and PCI-e source/sink. Both equally as much. Cards skewed toward just one of those are not a good match and so likely not a solution that will make it to market.

nzalog
Mar 5, 2013, 05:08 PM
So I've built hackintoshes in the past using "PC" video cards... things like the entire nVidia 600 series worked out of the box... is it the boot loader that makes it possible? Is it the Mac EFI that is blocking non-"mac" cards?

lwapps
Mar 5, 2013, 05:19 PM
I just pre-ordered a bunch!

I'm going to have the most expensive, Mac-based Bitcoin mining system, ever!

Is that actually profitable or is it just for the challenge?

----------

Apple Says New Models, Designs for Mac Pro In Works, Due in 2013 (Update) (http://www.forbes.com/sites/connieguglielmo/2012/06/12/apple-says-new-models-designs-for-imac-mac-pro-in-works-due-in-2013/)

Why would Apple reveal what they are up to?

dannyp1996
Mar 5, 2013, 05:23 PM
But that too was wrong. The output from the PCI-e card is not connected to the TB input.

I actually only mentioned the passing of the video signal via the PCIe to be then integrated into the thunderbolt port.

snberk103
Mar 5, 2013, 06:06 PM
Apple Says New Models, Designs for Mac Pro In Works, Due in 2013 (Update) (http://www.forbes.com/sites/connieguglielmo/2012/06/12/apple-says-new-models-designs-for-imac-mac-pro-in-works-due-in-2013/)

You will note that Tim Cook never said it was a Mac Pro. " .... we’re working on something really great for later next year. "

The email sent to clarify what Pogue at the NY Times simply clarified that it was not an iMac.

My wife worked in government for many years, and we talked about politics over dinner many times. Still do. Tim Cook's wording was very deliberately chosen. It may mean he didn't want to confirm a new Mac Pro - 'cause a confirmed new Mac Pro in the works would kill current sales. Or it may mean that it isn't a Mac Pro and he isn't prepared to share what it is.

We will know when one of two things happen. Apple actually officially announces it, or there is a photo of it in an elevator. Until then... we have no idea. Though I will be the first to admit speculating is fun.

mozumder
Mar 5, 2013, 07:07 PM
You will note that Tim Cook never said it was a Mac Pro. " .... we’re working on something really great for later next year. "

The email sent to clarify what Pogue at the NY Times simply clarified that it was not an iMac.

My wife worked in government for many years, and we talked about politics over dinner many times. Still do. Tim Cook's wording was very deliberately chosen. It may mean he didn't want to confirm a new Mac Pro - 'cause a confirmed new Mac Pro in the works would kill current sales. Or it may mean that it isn't a Mac Pro and he isn't prepared to share what it is.

We will know when one of two things happen. Apple actually officially announces it, or there is a photo of it in an elevator. Until then... we have no idea. Though I will be the first to admit speculating is fun.

Yah it's a new Mac Pro. Thanks.

jenzjen
Mar 5, 2013, 08:35 PM
The back of HD5770 and HD5870 is completely flat, this one is having very long screws near the core.

Image (http://imageshack.us/a/img26/3717/bbbbbyd.jpg)

Image (http://imageshack.us/a/img407/2528/aaaaslw.jpg)

Assuming this is the final design (and see no reason why it wouldn't be), Spacedust is right - this card will not fit in slot 1.

I have a 7870 eyefinity 6, which has the exact same 4 screws, height, etc that prevent it from fitting into #1. It does need to be completely flush like the 5870, 5770.

MacVidCards
Mar 5, 2013, 10:57 PM
Assuming this is the final design (and see no reason why it wouldn't be), Spacedust is right - this card will not fit in slot 1.

I have a 7870 eyefinity 6, which has the exact same 4 screws, height, etc that prevent it from fitting into #1. It does need to be completely flush like the 5870, 5770.

Think for a moment.

Are these people REALLY going to toss out 1000's of sales because they overlooked this?

If it doesn't work in 1,1s it will be because it is EFI64 or UEFI GOP, it won't be because Stan in Hardware Procurement forgot to see if it actually fit in the machines it was designed for.

The screws holding it together aren't going to be a problem.

DELTAsnake
Mar 5, 2013, 11:29 PM
Think for a moment.

Are these people REALLY going to toss out 1000's of sales because they overlooked this?

If it doesn't work in 1,1s it will be because it is EFI64 or UEFI GOP, it won't be because Stan in Hardware Procurement forgot to see if it actually fit in the machines it was designed for.

The screws holding it together aren't going to be a problem.

Sapphire is not a newbie to the video card industry, they know what they are doing, it will fit in a Mac Pro.

Besides, even if the screws are a problem, which I doubt they will be, on the 2009, 2010 and 2012 Pro's both slot 1 and 2 are X16 PCIE slots. For those of you that don't know about PC hardware, that means both slot 1 and 2 are built for video cards.

http://support.apple.com/kb/ht2838

Drinahn
Mar 6, 2013, 02:13 AM
Ooh hope the 2009 Mac Pro supports it. This would breath a bit of life into it.

cal6n
Mar 6, 2013, 03:09 AM
Assuming this is the final design (and see no reason why it wouldn't be), Spacedust is right - this card will not fit in slot 1.

I have a 7870 eyefinity 6, which has the exact same 4 screws, height, etc that prevent it from fitting into #1. It does need to be completely flush like the 5870, 5770.

As I've pointed out to you in the other thread, you are completely wrong.

The backplane of the 5XXX series cards that you claim "needs to be completely flush" is stood off from the circuit board by the same distance that the screws on the 7950 protrude.

szw-mapple fan
Mar 6, 2013, 03:17 AM
TWO Mac Pro based news items in under 24 hours?!?!:eek::eek:

boy people are getting desperate:p

iBug2
Mar 6, 2013, 08:16 AM
You will note that Tim Cook never said it was a Mac Pro. " .... we’re working on something really great for later next year. "

The email sent to clarify what Pogue at the NY Times simply clarified that it was not an iMac.

My wife worked in government for many years, and we talked about politics over dinner many times. Still do. Tim Cook's wording was very deliberately chosen. It may mean he didn't want to confirm a new Mac Pro - 'cause a confirmed new Mac Pro in the works would kill current sales. Or it may mean that it isn't a Mac Pro and he isn't prepared to share what it is.

We will know when one of two things happen. Apple actually officially announces it, or there is a photo of it in an elevator. Until then... we have no idea. Though I will be the first to admit speculating is fun.

I also think his wording was carefully chosen. Apple may actually release a new Mac Pro or they could dump the line entirely and introduce a new line instead aimed at professionals. In any case I think we are going to hear some news about it at WWDC.

chrisrosemusic1
Mar 6, 2013, 01:55 PM
This is some good news for the Pro's - I'm hoping they don't let them down for much longer.

Makes no difference for me though :P

snberk103
Mar 6, 2013, 02:44 PM
I also think his wording was carefully chosen. Apple may actually release a new Mac Pro or they could dump the line entirely and introduce a new line instead aimed at professionals. In any case I think we are going to hear some news about it at WWDC.

It's possible that when he wrote that Apple had not yet decided on which way to go. That there were a couple of teams.... one designing the next version of the Mac Pro that evolves from the current version, and a 2nd team designing a new Pro System that is completely different than what we know. Perhaps there was a 3rd or 4th team that were exploring whether they could offer versions oft the Mini and/or iMac that would attract Pro users.

Certainly Apple is keeping their options open. There are reports here at MR that 10.8.3 betas contain video drivers for new video cards - indicating that they are spending resources to keep Mac Pros up-to-date-ish. On the other hand Apple doesn't bother to certify Mac Pros to comply with a new EU regulation, thus temporarily putting a halt to sales in the EU.

Too many tea leaves to read.

I would be interesting to get a Tim Cook to comment now, eh?

adder7712
Mar 7, 2013, 08:19 AM
I have a Sapphire HD 7950 installed in my PC. Paid $310 for it. :)

Setmose
Mar 7, 2013, 09:35 AM
The back of HD5770 and HD5870 is completely flat, this one is having very long screws near the core.

Image (http://imageshack.us/a/img26/3717/bbbbbyd.jpg)

Image (http://imageshack.us/a/img407/2528/aaaaslw.jpg)

Look at your pics again. The Apple parts have a long black tray/carrier that slots in next to the PCI intake fan in Mac Pro. The depth of that tray is about equal to the protrusion of the screws, which is why there is a cutout in the tray to accommodate them. The Sapphire part, at least as shown so far, does not include the tray. Probably the PCI connector and the attachment to the backplane is enough and the card doesn't dip down to touch the aluminum of the CPU compartment. The tray is just Apple's great over-kill engineering which allows the Mac Pro to be tossed about without the video card stressing the PCI connector. :apple:

Setmose
Mar 7, 2013, 09:55 AM
That approach has about zero chance of working. The gap between the Thunderbolt controller and the physical ports has to be around an inch or two.

this is also backwards! The output from the GPU must be feed through the Thunderbolt controller and then out to the physical port.

The thunderbolt controller would have to be on the GPU card itself. That still leaves the problem of how the PCI-e x4 througput gets to the controller (can "steal"/"share" it with the GPU put you've chopped down its bandwidth to rest of system) and powering the TB controller and delivering power to TB sockets, since the are modest power producers. (Again you can steal/borrow from the GPU infrastructure but that too will mean compromises. )

Intel has said since Thunderbolt was intially release that it is aimed at the motherboard and there aren't any PCI-e solutions on the horzion.

Putting Thunderbolt on a GPU card isn't likely going to be certified any time soon. It is mainly an idea advocated by those who want to position that discrete cards can solve every problem. They don't.




Not! That solution takes the iGPU from the CPU socket and hooks it to the TB controller which is connected to the TB ports on the edge of the motherboard.

Any PCI-e graphics card is only virtually connected by copying its frame buffer over to the iGPUs. (on web you reference see the "LucidLogix Virtu MVP " section of the page. )


Apple is likely to use Xeon E5 1600 and 2600 solutions. Those have no GPU. The solution that exists that Apple has already deployed is to use an embedded GPU just like on the iMac. A GPU and VRAM soldered to the motherboard will provide DisplayPort output to the TB controller. That controller will connect to two ports ( probably on the back. Perhaps where the two analog auido ports are now. Or Apple tossing something else off the back. )

It isn't really necessary to virtually map a second GPU's output. All that is necessary for TB is just one. A discrete card could function in a new Mac Pro just like a second one does in the current Mac Pro. That card's outputs are hooked to a different set of monitors. There is no good rational reason why all the GPUs in a Mac Pro must output only through TB ports. Makes no sense at all.

Well, going forward Mac Pro must be able to be hooked to an Apple Thunderbolt monitor so that they can be sold together as a solution. Currently Apple has gotten itself out on a limb, which is why they uncharacteristically have continued both MDP and Thunderbolt ACDs. :apple:

----------

Ooh hope the 2009 Mac Pro supports it. This would breath a bit of life into it.

Another vote. :apple:

deconstruct60
Mar 7, 2013, 01:44 PM
Well, going forward Mac Pro must be able to be hooked to an Apple Thunderbolt monitor so that they can be sold together as a solution.

That is really a kool-aid drinking solution. The Thunderbolt docking station ( cough Display) is an odd-ball mix for the Mac Pro. The dangling MagSafe power adapter and the relatively short Thunderbolt cord that limits "display"/Mac Pro distance are not well designed.

Apple isn't in the monitor business anymore even as they continue to use the word on their docking station product.


Currently Apple has gotten itself out on a limb, which is why they uncharacteristically have continued both MDP and Thunderbolt ACDs.


This is just about a non issue as the fact that Apple doesn't sell printers anymore. There are a number of high quality monitor vendors out there. All of them have products that work even better with a Mac Pro than Apple's docking station.

It would be a sign that the inmates had taken over the asylum if the Mac Pro was only useful with a integrated monitor docking station. I don't think the clueless have taken over Apple just yet.

ActionableMango
Mar 11, 2013, 01:05 PM
Well, going forward Mac Pro must be able to be hooked to an Apple Thunderbolt monitor so that they can be sold together as a solution. Currently Apple has gotten itself out on a limb, which is why they uncharacteristically have continued both MDP and Thunderbolt ACDs.

I don't see what's wrong with continuing to sell two monitors. It has worked for years now and can continue to work.

If they had to only sell one ACD I bet they could simply make the ACD accept an MDP signal. It's the same physical connector as the MDP anyway. I know it's not a perfect solution because the hub won't work, but having read through the threads discussing the ways the MP could be made into Thunderbolt, I can say those solutions usually have much more significant problems.

george-brooks
Mar 13, 2013, 06:19 PM
I think he's suggesting that there is no real indication they are planning to redesign the case/look of the machine. "something really great" could mean just a powerful machine with modern hardware in the same package.

The basic mac pro design has been around for 10 years now. I think its time for a refresh by any measure.

MikBe
Mar 17, 2013, 12:00 AM
I'm pretty sure if you look at his quote, he simply said that there was something coming for pro users in response to a question about a Mac Pro. I don't think you will find he every used the words "Mac Pro". But I could be wrong...

You're wrong; as are all the other people that went off on a tangent without verifying the full quote. Ironically the partial quote removes the very words "Mac Pro" because they are understood. Here is the full email:


Franz,

Thanks for your email. Our Pro customers like you are really important to us. Although we didn’t have a chance to talk about a new Mac Pro at today’s event, don’t worry as we’re working on something really great for later next year. We also updated the current model today.

We’ve been continuing to update Final Cut Pro X with revolutionary pro features like industry leading multi-cam support and we just updated Aperture with incredible new image adjustment features.

We also announced a MacBook Pro with a Retina Display that is a great solution for many pros.

Tim


With the inclusion of the full quote it's obvious he's talking about a new Mac Pro.

snberk103
Mar 17, 2013, 08:35 AM
You're wrong; as are all the other people that went off on a tangent without verifying the full quote. Ironically the partial quote removes the very words "Mac Pro" because they are understood. Here is the full email: [Cook's Email]

With the inclusion of the full quote it's obvious he's talking about a new Mac Pro.

Nope, not wrong. I had the full quote in front of me while writing. Was saving some space.

In that sentence Tim Cook Says.
1) Thanks.
2) "[Apple's] 'Pro customers' are really important...." Please find the definition that Apple uses when it says 'Pro customers'. Do they mean people who use Mac Book Pros & Mac Pros? Or do they mean people who are a professional in some field? Which could mean everybody except the unemployed, students, retirees, and children?
3a) Then a statement of historical fact. Apple did not talk about Mac Pros at that event.
3b) Then that though ends, and a new topic is introduced. "...don’t worry as we’re working on something really great...." Tim Cook merely said "something". The Mac Pro reference ended with that comma. He uses the word 'something' instead of 'Mac Pro' - or - 'Desktop', 'Tower', 'Computer', 'System', 'Hardware', or just about any other word that would have narrowed thing down even a little bit. It might mean new Mac Pro - or it might mean that Apple is creating a new cloud service for people who call themselves professionals.

That 'something' was chosen very carefully. I have experience writing like that.... so I recognize a good waffle when I see it. So keep your ho es up... but don't bet any money you can't afford to lose on a new Mac Pro that is like the current system.

imho, of course.

Garamond
Mar 18, 2013, 01:06 PM
So… where to pre-order this thing?

MikBe
Mar 23, 2013, 08:02 PM
Nope, not wrong...
[snip]
imho, of course.

I hope I'm not mischaracterizing you but you appear to be asserting that there is some kind of conspiracy. Is that what you are saying?

snberk103
Mar 24, 2013, 12:31 AM
I hope I'm not mischaracterizing you but you appear to be asserting that there is some kind of conspiracy. Is that what you are saying?

Conspiracy? No. Can you expand on that thought?

MikBe
Mar 26, 2013, 02:12 PM
Conspiracy? No. Can you expand on that thought?

It seems like you're saying Apple is conspiring to misinform us about the Mac Pro. That they are purposefully misleading us into thinking there will be a new Mac Pro when there will not be.

Seems to me Tim was just being the typical Apple spokesperson.

billdone7
Mar 26, 2013, 02:34 PM
Good one, like it thanks

snberk103
Mar 26, 2013, 03:42 PM
It seems like you're saying Apple is conspiring to misinform us about the Mac Pro. That they are purposefully misleading us into thinking there will be a new Mac Pro when there will not be.

Seems to me Tim was just being the typical Apple spokesperson.

I did not explicitly or implicitly say that Apple was trying to "misinform" us. I very clearly stated that, imo, Tim Cook's statement was very non-specific about what Apple may or may not release in 2013. This was a direct response to someone who, in their opinion, thought a very specific product had been announced.

Though, I agree that Tim's non-specifivity is a long-held Apple PR tradition.

And while I'm quibbling, a conspiracy requires more than one actor. So Apple and ......, or Tim Cook and ..... Since I was specifically talking about a statement by Tim Cook, it could not be a "conspiracy."

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MikBe
Mar 27, 2013, 03:21 PM
I don't think you will find he every used the words "Mac Pro". But I could be wrong...

You were wrong, which was what I pointed out, he did use the words. You were wrong again when you said you weren't wrong because he very specifically said the words "Mac Pro." Now you want to say that that doesn't matter when before it seemed to be a vital part of your argument.

I did not explicitly or implicitly say that Apple was trying to "misinform" us.

Sure you did. When you said, "He uses the word 'something' instead of 'Mac Pro' - or - 'Desktop', 'Tower', 'Computer', 'System', 'Hardware', or just about any other word that would have narrowed thing down even a little bit. It might mean new Mac Pro - or it might mean that Apple is creating a new cloud service for people who call themselves professionals."

I inferred your implied meaning to be that since he used the vague word "something" on purpose while specifically addressing the next Mac Pro he was not just being coy but was talking about something other than a Mac Pro. That's being deceptive. You implied it.

I'm not even going to touch your efforts to alter the English language so that you can have multiple topics in a single sentence.


And while I'm quibbling, a conspiracy requires more than one actor. So Apple and ......, or Tim Cook and ..... Since I was specifically talking about a statement by Tim Cook, it could not be a "conspiracy."

Tim Cook works for Apple, Tim was making a statement about Apple, not Tim Cook's person, therefore it can be a conspiracy.

And finally an elipse has three dots...

snberk103
Mar 27, 2013, 03:50 PM
You were wrong, which was what I pointed out, he did use the words.
Yes. You are correct. He did use the words Mac Pro in his message. I will point that in the 1st post I made I did note I could be wrong about the words he used. I also acknowledged he used "Mac Pro" later on, and then noted that it was just an historical reference. They did not talk about the new Mac Pros. Nor did they talk about the new G5 PowerBooks. Or the new Volkswagen. Which does not change the meaning of the 2nd part of the sentence.

....
Sure you did. When you said, "He uses the word 'something' instead of 'Mac Pro' - or - 'Desktop', 'Tower', 'Computer', 'System', 'Hardware', or just about any other word that would have narrowed thing down even a little bit. It might mean new Mac Pro - or it might mean that Apple is creating a new cloud service for people who call themselves professionals."
I was using examples of what he did not inform us about. To "misinform" he would have had to "inform" of us something. If Tim "informed" us of a new iCube, and then released a G6 iTower - then that would be a "misinform". He "informed" us of nothing that Apple doesn't "inform" us of at every "informing" - that something 'great' is coming soon. Therefore there is no "misinformation".

I inferred your implied meaning to be that since he used the vague word "something" on purpose while specifically addressing the next Mac Pro he was not just being coy but was talking about something other than a Mac Pro. That's being deceptive. You implied it.
It is hard to be implying something so subtle when I was explicitly stating that he was explicitly not informing us.

I'm not even going to touch your efforts to alter the English language so that you can have multiple topics in a single sentence.
You haven't seen my nephew write. He is going for his Masters in PoliSci, then of course there is the idea that often a comma is used to separate distinct thoughts.

Tim Cook works for Apple, Tim was making a statement about Apple, not Tim Cook's person, therefore it can be a conspiracy.
Did you miss the bit in my post where I mentioned that?

And finally an elipse has three dots...

No..... You don't say? Who knew...... :eek:

MikBe
Mar 27, 2013, 04:45 PM
Yes. You are correct.

Wooo hooo! I knew if I opined for long enough eventually I'd be right about something.


I was using examples of what he did not inform us about. To "misinform" he would have had to "inform" of us something. If Tim "informed" us of a new iCube, and then released a G6 iTower - then that would be a "misinform". He "informed" us of nothing that Apple doesn't "inform" us of at every "informing" - that something 'great' is coming soon. Therefore there is no "misinformation".


I was riding my bike the other day and this crazy old man just pulled out in front of me! Without even looking! He was driving a car. Cars are made in Korea. There are lots of beautiful country roads in Korea. Cat fish have been seen swimming next to country roads. I like catfish.

We were just rambling off non-relevant statements right? Did I win? I hope I won. What's the prize? I hope it's a new Mac Pro. Tim Cook says they're coming out with a new one this year.


It is hard to be implying something so subtle when I was explicitly stating that he was explicitly not informing us.


Yep, but you're just that good. :D


You haven't seen my nephew write. He is going for his Masters in PoliSci, then of course there is the idea that often a comma is used to separate distinct thoughts.

Yep, but not totally different topics, e.g. "There was once a red ball, cars are fast!" or "Now I'm talking about the Mac Pro, now I'm not."

snberk103
Mar 27, 2013, 05:07 PM
...
I'm glad to see you have a sense of humour.

Yep, but not totally different topics, e.g. "There was once a red ball, cars are fast!" or "Now I'm talking about the Mac Pro, now I'm not."
And what is hilarious is that your second example is perfectly correct, and is exactly what Tim said. Or didn't say. He may or may not have been talking about a new Mac Pro. Whatever it is, it's supposed to "really great" though!

We won't know what he was talking about until that "really great" something is officially announced and/or released. Until then, all we can do is speculate and have some fun and tease each other occasionally.

For the record, I am really curious about Apple will release.

MikBe
Mar 28, 2013, 11:37 AM
And what is hilarious is that your second example is perfectly correct, and is exactly what Tim said.

I'm glad you got the joke. :)


We won't know what he was talking about until that "really great" something is officially announced and/or released.

I think if you look at Tim Cooks quote he says something about a Platinum Plated Special Edition Mac Pro Plus...

snberk103
Mar 28, 2013, 11:42 AM
...

I think if you look at Tim Cooks quote he says something about a Platinum Plated Special Edition Mac Pro Plus...

It's true! I've seen the elevator photos. Though why they had a bar stool in the elevator beats me. :)