PDA

View Full Version : Blackberry Q10 is here! So far so good ...




entatlrg
May 1, 2013, 10:44 AM
The keyboard is incredible, the screen is excellent, feels good in the hand. BB10 is going to be interesting to learn.

Too early to tell, only thing I'm sure of so far is that it's a nice change from typing on glass all day.

Will it replace my new HTC One? Possibly.



MacRumorUser
May 1, 2013, 11:13 AM
Please post more in depth thoughts and views. It looks like a really interesting device. Maybe a few photo snapshots to show camera quality of the 8mp camera and how big the phone is in your hand etc.

I liked my Bold 9900 but the lack of apps and pee poor regionalisation of blackberry app world (resulting in even fewer apps) tempered my enjoyment and stopped me from keeping the Blackberry Z10 I tried for 48 hours.

animalx
May 2, 2013, 09:42 AM
BB10 seems okay, but in the end I think it's too complicated for the average person. The average person cannot just pick up that phone and know how to operate it. At least with iOS and Android, even if you aren't familiar with it, you know how to use the home button or press back. On BB10, you have to know how to use a gesture just to go home or back. Though once you learn it, it is easy, many people will be put off by it. A person just playing with a phone in the store may not understand how to use it, and thus won't buy it.

Stuntman06
May 2, 2013, 02:29 PM
I am a fan of landscape slider keyboards. The BB keyboards are too narrow for my liking and the keys are too close together. I got too used to them to be able to type well on a BB keyboard.

The existence of a physical keyboard all the time does allow for keyboard shortcuts. However, you really have to learn what they are. It's not obvious that pressing T will take to the top. Once you learn them, I find keyboard shortcuts are nice.

martymcfly618
May 2, 2013, 10:08 PM
I have the Z10, my biggest gripe is the lack of push notifications (apps). There's no push for ml
B at bat, the score, pageonce, basically for all apps excluding fb, and twitter. The keyboard is awesome (probably if not the best touchscreen Kb), and so is the browser. The lack of apps as well as the 1.0 feeling the Os gave me, sent me back to my iPhone.

johnnnw
May 4, 2013, 10:23 PM
The biggest thing BB has going for it is those amazing keyboards.

I don't care how good you are at using a touchscreen, if you're sending 300 emails a day the keyboard is the stuff.

BB has always done their keyboards well, I appreciate that much about them.

ucfgrad93
May 4, 2013, 11:21 PM
How is the app store? That would be my only concern about getting the Q10.

Dr McKay
May 4, 2013, 11:39 PM
How is the android app emulator?

onthecouchagain
May 5, 2013, 12:36 AM
The biggest thing BB has going for it is those amazing keyboards.

I don't care how good you are at using a touchscreen, if you're sending 300 emails a day the keyboard is the stuff.

BB has always done their keyboards well, I appreciate that much about them.

Only on certain models. The current Curve keyboard is dreadful. Their Bold keyboards, however, are truly amazing and comfortable to type on.

johnnnw
May 5, 2013, 12:46 AM
Only on certain models. The current Curve keyboard is dreadful. Their Bold keyboards, however, are truly amazing and comfortable to type on.

Yes I agree with that for sure. The bolds are amazing. The curve is definitely built much cheaper (as it costs less) and you can tell the difference easily.

MacRumorUser
May 5, 2013, 12:57 AM
How is the android app emulator?

On the z10 poor and buggy. It only works with apps that aren't beyond Gingerbread and there is a big performance penalty too. I side loaded a number of apps onto mine (when I had it) to see if I could make up for the deficit of apps in blackberry world, but many didnt work and those that did were sluggish at best or broken at worse. It also made BBOS10 lag for hub etc.. When using an android app.

----------

How is the app store? That would be my only concern about getting the Q10.

If you have ever used windows phone marketplace, blackberry app world shares a lot of similarity (poor)...

Annyoyingly they don't mark apps which are poorly ported android apps on the store from the genuine BB apps either. I had number of bystanders here I downloaded a few apps and they were broken and forced me to battery pull.

Worse still BB app world recommended me them !!!

Blackberry made a lot of illy promises to developers to try and fill their App Store with content. Whilst it meant there is a good number of apps, the majority of big name ones are not there, and the thousands that are there are of highly dubious quality at best, utterly broken and worthless at worst.

I really liked the z10 hardware wise. I really like BB 10.

App section and App world destroyed any chance of me keeping the device. It was that much of an abomination. It screamed of a genuine lack of quality control and care for its users, it was as if BB thought lots of craptacular apps on the store = better choice for customers, when its actually quite the opposite.

Simply put - BB App world is infuriating.

cnev3
May 5, 2013, 05:24 AM
Did I fall into a time warp and wake up in 1999?

Blackberry lol

0dev
May 6, 2013, 01:13 PM
Since my app needs are fulfilled nicely by my Nexus 7, I may get a Q10. I've always liked BlackBerries but I could never tolerate them for long because the OS was so primitive. With BB10 that's no longer a concern. Very tempting indeed.

samab
May 6, 2013, 05:54 PM
How is the android app emulator?

It is NOT an emulator --- Dalvik engine is open source and RIM just ported it to QNX. This is like java on windows pc vs. on mac computers --- they both came from SunMicro's original java source code and they should have the same speed.

LIVEFRMNYC
May 6, 2013, 06:21 PM
It is NOT an emulator --- Dalvik engine is open source and RIM just ported it to QNX. This is like java on windows pc vs. on mac computers --- they both came from SunMicro's original java source code and they should have the same speed.

"Dalvik is the process virtual machine (VM) in Google's Android operating system."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalvik_%28software%29

Sounds like a emulator to me but then again not in the stereotypical sense.

0dev
May 6, 2013, 06:56 PM
It is NOT an emulator --- Dalvik engine is open source and RIM just ported it to QNX. This is like java on windows pc vs. on mac computers --- they both came from SunMicro's original java source code and they should have the same speed.

It specifically emulates Android 2.3.3 within BB10. It is an emulator.

MacRumorUser
May 7, 2013, 09:51 AM
It is NOT an emulator --- Dalvik engine is open source and RIM just ported it to QNX. This is like java on windows pc vs. on mac computers --- they both came from SunMicro's original java source code and they should have the same speed.

Its s an emulator.... Even blackberry dev world call it an emulator.

ugahairydawgs
May 7, 2013, 10:03 AM
YES, it is the best QWERTY keboard phone no doubt about that.

The Verge had a great quote on it in their Q10 review...."the best horse cart in the age of the automobile"

0dev
May 7, 2013, 10:06 AM
The Verge had a great quote on it in their Q10 review...."the best horse cart in the age of the automobile"

That's a stupid quote. There's nothing about physical QWERTYs that makes them old fashioned. In fact they are in many ways superior to touchscreen keyboards for people who do a lot of typing because they're a lot more accurate.

ugahairydawgs
May 7, 2013, 10:10 AM
That's a stupid quote. There's nothing about physical QWERTYs that makes them old fashioned. In fact they are in many ways superior to touchscreen keyboards for people who do a lot of typing because they're a lot more accurate.

Well....that's a bit subjective. Physical keyboards, for me at least, are a hindrance because the actual act of pressing the key is not as smooth as tapping the glass. So the (obviously minimal) extra effort makes the process of typing something up last longer.

To each his own for sure....but the line is still funny.

0dev
May 7, 2013, 10:21 AM
Well....that's a bit subjective. Physical keyboards, for me at least, are a hindrance because the actual act of pressing the key is not as smooth as tapping the glass. So the (obviously minimal) extra effort makes the process of typing something up last longer.

To each his own for sure....but the line is still funny.

I think we can certainly agree it's subjective, but again, my point is there's nothing about physical QWERTYs that makes them old fashioned. It's simply a case of which type of keyboard you prefer.

The line isn't funny IMO because it's just recycling the same tired stereotypes about BlackBerry that are no longer relevant since the release of the new OS. It's also reflective of the Verge's extremely biased reporting which is set out to slam anything that isn't made by Apple, Samsung or their beloved HTC.

mikeo007
May 7, 2013, 11:33 AM
The keyboard is absolutely fantastic. I've been using it for a few weeks and really enjoy typing on a BB keyboard again. The OS is also not that difficult to learn for basic stuff. It just comes with time.

But...

I can't see myself using the phone as a daily driver. BB10 is still just too immature. Pretty much all the reasons I disliked BB10 on the z10 also exist on the Q10. Plus the addition of another issue: wasted space. Blackberry 10's UI makes use of some huge UI elements, which really crunches the available screen space on the Q10. And then there's the lack of apps. There is a huge deficit to fill in terms of apps.

The keyboard is fantastic, and it alone could make up for a huge chunk of BB10s shortcomings in my eyes, but it's still not enough to make up for everything.

0dev
May 7, 2013, 12:03 PM
The keyboard is absolutely fantastic. I've been using it for a few weeks and really enjoy typing on a BB keyboard again. The OS is also not that difficult to learn for basic stuff. It just comes with time.

But...

I can't see myself using the phone as a daily driver. BB10 is still just too immature. Pretty much all the reasons I disliked BB10 on the z10 also exist on the Q10. Plus the addition of another issue: wasted space. Blackberry 10's UI makes use of some huge UI elements, which really crunches the available screen space on the Q10. And then there's the lack of apps. There is a huge deficit to fill in terms of apps.

The keyboard is fantastic, and it alone could make up for a huge chunk of BB10s shortcomings in my eyes, but it's still not enough to make up for everything.

What issues have you found with the OS? I'm curious just because I'm planning on a Z or Q or my next phone.

mikeo007
May 7, 2013, 12:50 PM
What issues have you found with the OS? I'm curious just because I'm planning on a Z or Q or my next phone.

I've made quite a few posts about it, but to sum up my biggest gripes:

The lack of apps is #1. Take a quick look online at blackberry world and search for a few of your must-have apps. You'll see what I mean. Even the apps that do exist tend to be much lower quality or missing many features.

You can also only have a maximum of 8 apps open, and settings apps like the ones that change your wallpaper or LED colour count towards this 8 total. So does the phone, weather, etc. When you hit the 9th app, your first one closes, whether or not you want it to.

Hub is a mess and not well thought out.
I'm ok with the universal inbox concept, but want to be able to organize it my way. With BB10, it's either in the hub, or nowhere at all. The fact that it jumps back to your last message whenever you pull up the hub is also a big downer for me.

The notifications are terrible (see virtually non-existent). Say you get an email while using the phone. All you get is a tone and a blinking light. No popup, no banner. You need to do a "peek" just to see what type of message it was, and need to swipe all the way into the hub to see a preview of the message. Also no option to display messages on the lock screen or access them with a swipe from the lock screen.

You also lose your clock/battery/network info while in an app. You need to do a "peek" geature just to check the time.

Speaking of notifications, there are no push notifications either. So if you're used to an app like the Score that sends you sports score updates or game reminders, you're out of luck. Similarly, 3rd party email apps won't be able to send you push notifications when you receive new messages.

Native apps are functional, but not polished and don't offer a great experience. I give BB kudos for including things like Word and excel type apps as standard, but they're only barely functional. Yes apple charges me $5- $10 for their first party apps like pages, numbers, keynote and iMovie, but they are just so incredible to use compared to the BB offerings. Maps are functional at best, with no decent alternative.

The browser, probably one of the biggest advances for BB is good, and it loads quickly. It has some issues rendering certain pages though, has rather poor javascript performance, and the UI is extremely sparse, yet manages to waste a good chunk of the screen. It also has issues properly fitting text to the screen width and has some strange visual design choices, like drawing boxes around links ala 1995 Netscape style. It's definitely usable though, even if its still not up to Safari/Chrome quality.

Those are the major issues for me. I could go on with little nit-picky things, but they're more personal preference issues.

I still think the Q10 is a good phone, and I'm anxiously waiting to see what blackberry comes up with to improve it. They've got a pretty solid foundation, but they've still got a ways to go. They're also lacking a killer feature for anyone who isn't a physical keyboard junkie. But I do believe they'll continue to improve things. Their next big step needs to be to offer more options for how the phone functions. At this point, you basically do everything one way, with little or no variation. They need to offer options for things that don't fit into everyone's workflow.

0dev
May 7, 2013, 01:04 PM
I've made quite a few posts about it, but to sum up my biggest gripes...

Fair complaints. Most of those are things I personally could get used to so I'll be trying out BB10 regardless. And like you I'm looking forward to seeing what updates they're bringing out in the future.

mikeo007
May 7, 2013, 01:14 PM
Fair complaints. Most of those are things I personally could get used to so I'll be trying out BB10 regardless. And like you I'm looking forward to seeing what updates they're bringing out in the future.

Yup, everyone's gripes and praises will be slightly different. I have gripes with my current iPhone as well, and had issues with my Galaxy before it, and Blackberry before that.

Unfortunately the BB10 problems are show-stoppers for me at this point, but there are obviously some people who are not bothered by the issues I mentioned. They are selling phones, not a huge amount of them, but it's a start. The more they sell, the more feedback they get, and the more they improve the OS, resulting in more sales :)

0dev
May 7, 2013, 01:16 PM
Yup, everyone's gripes and praises will be slightly different. I have gripes with my current iPhone as well, and had issues with my Galaxy before it, and Blackberry before that.

Unfortunately the BB10 problems are show-stoppers for me at this point, but there are obviously some people who are not bothered by the issues I mentioned. They are selling phones, not a huge amount of them, but it's a start. The more they sell, the more feedback they get, and the more they improve the OS, resulting in more sales :)

And the more apps developers will release for the platform too, and they are coming, slowly but surely :)

samab
May 7, 2013, 01:46 PM
"Dalvik is the process virtual machine (VM) in Google's Android operating system."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalvik_%28software%29

Sounds like a emulator to me but then again not in the stereotypical sense.

That's like saying Android is an emulator because it is Dalvik VM running on top of the linux kernel.

We don't call Dalvik VM on top of linux kernel an emulator. So we also don't call Dalvik VM on top of the QNX kernel an emulator.

It specifically emulates Android 2.3.3 within BB10. It is an emulator.

It doesn't emulate anything. Emulation means you try to duplicate something without the original source code --- a whole lot of guess work and performance suffers. When you have the original source code, it is called a port --- and it will have the same performance because it came from the same identical source code.

Its s an emulator.... Even blackberry dev world call it an emulator.

Blackberry specifically stated that it is NOT an emulator.

QUOTE:
"One misconception I hear a lot is that the BlackBerry Android runtime is an “emulator”. This isn’t the case. Our Android runtime is a pure port of the open source Dalvik VM directly onto QNX."

http://devblog.blackberry.com/2013/02/port-app-to-blackberry-10/

aerok
May 11, 2013, 01:38 PM
Only on certain models. The current Curve keyboard is dreadful. Their Bold keyboards, however, are truly amazing and comfortable to type on.

Although the Bold keboards are better, I don't find the Curve one to be dreadful, they just seem to stop working very fast.

I just wish they had the trackpad again on the Q10

Vegastouch
May 11, 2013, 06:04 PM
I tried one out in the T-Mobile store. Now i know it was only 10 minutes but i stopped messing with it because there is no back button and i couldnt figure out how to get out of the calender for example and go back to the home screen. I had to reboot it. I know i didnt know what i was doing so i just stopped messing with it because i couldnt go back.

Needless to say i didnt get a good sample out of it.

0dev
May 11, 2013, 06:13 PM
I tried one out in the T-Mobile store. Now i know it was only 10 minutes but i stopped messing with it because there is no back button and i couldnt figure out how to get out of the calender for example and go back to the home screen. I had to reboot it. I know i didnt know what i was doing so i just stopped messing with it because i couldnt go back.

Needless to say i didnt get a good sample out of it.

Swipe up to exit apps. To go back there's a button at the bottom left corner. It's not hard.

GR33NIE
Jun 17, 2013, 04:19 AM
I keep looking at this for my next phone too, I know if I leave iOS though I will probably regret it immediately! :rolleyes:

sviato
Jun 17, 2013, 07:16 AM
Does it click and creak like the 9900 keyboard?

Dontazemebro
Jun 17, 2013, 08:43 AM
I might be the only one who hates the BBstyle qwerty, always had a problem with the keys being spaced too close together. Best physical keyboard I ever used was my old school winmo HTC Touch pro 2. Now this is a keyboard that's worthy of being remade.

http://www.phonekade.com/uf/classifieds/2534-classifieds-htc-touch-pro2-russia-hands-on-rm-eng.jpg

sentinelsx
Jun 17, 2013, 10:02 AM
If a Z10 is remade with a sliding out keyboard, i might consider a keyboard phone again.

I am not interested in a permanent keyboard taking up precious screen real estate.

Peterg2
Jun 17, 2013, 11:24 AM
If a Z10 is remade with a sliding out keyboard, i might consider a keyboard phone again.

I am not interested in a permanent keyboard taking up precious screen real estate.

Such versatility makes for a thick phone. The current trend as you know is thinner and thinner. It would only appeal to a very small sub-set.

sentinelsx
Jun 17, 2013, 11:33 AM
Such versatility makes for a thick phone. The current trend as you know is thinner and thinner. It would only appeal to a very small sub-set.

Yeah, that makes me sad. People want more cosmetics than functionality :(

ReallyBigFeet
Jun 17, 2013, 11:49 AM
I owned almost every iteration of Blackberry devices from my first 850 Messenger to the Bold. I think I liked the 7200 and the Curve the best, although the Pearl was fun for rollerball hacking.

My how the once mighty has fallen. The Z10 isn't going to revive this company.

Stuntman06
Jun 17, 2013, 03:31 PM
I might be the only one who hates the BBstyle qwerty, always had a problem with the keys being spaced too close together. Best physical keyboard I ever used was my old school winmo HTC Touch pro 2. Now this is a keyboard that's worthy of being remade.

Image (http://www.phonekade.com/uf/classifieds/2534-classifieds-htc-touch-pro2-russia-hands-on-rm-eng.jpg)

I also hate the BB keyboard. I have one for work and I don't like it at all. My previous personal phone was the HTC Desire Z which is also a landscape slider. My only criticism of the DZ is that the keys are too stiff. It requires a bit of effort to press. The phone I had before the DZ was the Nokia N97. That keyboard I really like because it doesn't require much effort to press the keys.

Such versatility makes for a thick phone. The current trend as you know is thinner and thinner. It would only appeal to a very small sub-set.

I don't mind a phone that is thicker if it helps me type more accurately. I also don't mind a thicker phone if it has a larger battery. This trend towards thinner phones is causing a lot of trade-offs to be made that many people don't like. Unfortunately, thin phones sell better than thick phones with longer battery life.

0dev
Jun 26, 2013, 05:34 AM
If a Z10 is remade with a sliding out keyboard, i might consider a keyboard phone again.

I am not interested in a permanent keyboard taking up precious screen real estate.

That very thing is said to be in the works right now. It'll be a new version of the Torch series.

0dev
Jun 26, 2013, 05:38 AM
My how the once mighty has fallen. The Z10 isn't going to revive this company.

It doesn't need reviving. It's shrunk because it now serves a smaller niche than it once did, but they're still very successful outside of the US, especially in the UAE and the UK.

In fact over the past year, while Apple and now even Samsung have seen sharp drops in their stock, look at BlackBerry's:

419967

Steady growth over the past 12 months.

BlackBerry isn't going anywhere.

Fireblade
Jun 26, 2013, 05:47 AM
I highly doubt BlackBerry will survive in long term.
The company I work for will ditch BlackBerry devices next month, and we will get HTC devices instead, round about 1500.
I know these are not that much, but I know from family and friends that the company they work for also leaving BlackBerry.
And I don't know one single person owning a BlackBerry device as a private device.

0dev
Jun 26, 2013, 06:03 AM
To all those who doubt BlackBerry...

q3nBYU7J3ks

That is their brand new store in the Dubai Mall, one of the largest, busiest, and most profitable malls in the world.

As I said, they have lost favour in the US but they are still thriving in other international markets. They aren't going anywhere.

mikeo007
Jun 28, 2013, 07:50 AM
To all those who doubt BlackBerry...

YouTube: video (http://youtube.com/watch?v=q3nBYU7J3ks)

That is their brand new store in the Dubai Mall, one of the largest, busiest, and most profitable malls in the world.

As I said, they have lost favour in the US but they are still thriving in other international markets. They aren't going anywhere.

Sooo...anything new with Blackberry today?

0dev
Jun 28, 2013, 08:00 AM
Sooo...anything new with Blackberry today?

Yeah they just announced their Q1 results (http://crackberry.com/press-release-blackberry-reports-q1-2014-earnings) and they're now making more money and ****. They even upped their revenue in North America while selling another few million phones, sales of which actually increased.

Waiting again for someone to tell me how BlackBerry is dead :rolleyes:

Peterg2
Jun 28, 2013, 08:02 AM
Yeah they just announced their Q1 results (http://crackberry.com/press-release-blackberry-reports-q1-2014-earnings) and they're now making more money and ****. They even upped their revenue in North America while selling another few million phones, sales of which actually increased.

Waiting again for someone to tell me how BlackBerry is dead :rolleyes:

I fully agree. Stock must be doing very well today.

mikeo007
Jun 28, 2013, 08:25 AM
I fully agree. Stock must be doing very well today.

Ya, it must be doing quite well. I mean, missing all expectations can't be that bad, right?

0dev
Jun 28, 2013, 08:29 AM
One quarter of loss while they're still rolling out their BB10 line isn't the end of the world. The fact that sales went up shows there is demand for the product. Surely no one expected massive BB10 sales when the Q10 and Q5 - the QWERTY phones which BB is known for - weren't even on the market just a couple of weeks ago?

Give it another quarter with the full range on the market and they'll turn it around easy because the demand is clearly there if sales went up.

Edit: and they only lost money (http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost.php?p=17506615&postcount=3) because of a bad currency market in Venezuela.