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aPple nErd
May 3, 2013, 09:23 PM
when did apple ever say "ya johny I've has been making iOS a more flat looking interface."???? how can you hate iOS 7 when we have no idea of what it will be like until june??? thats my daily rant. :D

paulbennett95
May 4, 2013, 01:48 PM
when did apple ever say "ya johny I've has been making iOS a more flat looking interface."???? how can you hate iOS 7 when we have no idea of what it will be like until june??? thats my daily rant. :D
Agreed, people are already complaining off of speculation that literally has NO evidence at ALL.
The most evidence is "the WWDC logo is colorful obviously they're goin metro OMG apple is the new Microsoft, here comes the monopoly lawsuit"

aPple nErd
May 4, 2013, 01:58 PM
Agreed, people are already complaining off of speculation that literally has NO evidence at ALL.
The most evidence is "the WWDC logo is colorful obviously they're goin metro OMG apple is the new Microsoft, here comes the monopoly lawsuit"

wow. apple sucks. they r making iOS 7 ugly. it looks like windows 8..... just stop lol

Toltepeceno
May 4, 2013, 02:01 PM
when did apple ever say "ya johny I've has been making iOS a more flat looking interface."???? how can you hate iOS 7 when we have no idea of what it will be like until june??? thats my daily rant. :D

OK, let me get this straight. You are complaining about other people complaining?

bushido
May 4, 2013, 02:06 PM
70% of those people probably dont even know what "flat" means and simply bitch because all they "heard" is that windows 8 is apparently "flat" and they hate it

MarcBook
May 4, 2013, 03:01 PM
70% of those people probably dont even know what "flat" means and simply bitch because all they "heard" is that windows 8 is apparently "flat" and they hate it

Exactly. 'Flat' doesn't necessarily mean totally 2D like Windows 8 and Windows Phone. I'd call Mountain Lion's design pretty 'flat' with its mostly monochrome colour-scheme and narrow or non-existant borders.

Reach9
May 4, 2013, 05:35 PM
Sigh..anyone who wants to know what Flat UI really is should look at Google's UI on their various products, for example the new Google Now app on the App Store.

And how bad is that UI? It's much better than the glossy days of the past.

That's proper flat design. Windows Phone 8 UI is the flattest thing out there and Apple sure isn't going that far.

I believe Ive is doing the right thing. Please feel free to share this post with others who need to be educated on Flat UI.
(I would attach pics but I'm on the go)

johndallas999
May 4, 2013, 05:36 PM
when did apple ever say "ya johny I've has been making iOS a more flat looking interface."???? how can you hate iOS 7 when we have no idea of what it will be like until june??? thats my daily rant. :D

Do you even know what you're talking about? I think a flat design will suck as well but everyone going to have an opinion. Not everyone just by default loves everything Apple does.

Shrink
May 4, 2013, 05:45 PM
As always, I'm confused. How can anybody, like, dislike, hate, love or otherwise hold any opinion about something that no one has ever seen!??:confused:

Just asking...;)

Reach9
May 4, 2013, 05:48 PM
As always, I'm confused. How can anybody, like, dislike, hate, love or otherwise hold any opinion about something that no one has ever seen!??:confused:

Just asking...;)

As a hobbyist designer, I can tell you that I like Google's flat UI very much, and I believe an Apple's version of that design would look beautiful.

So I'm looking forward to iOS 7 with confidence in Ive.

paulbennett95
May 4, 2013, 07:57 PM
As a hobbyist designer, I can tell you that I like Google's flat UI very much, and I believe an Apple's version of that design would look beautiful.

So I'm looking forward to iOS 7 with confidence in Ive.
I agree, Googles flat UI on all their apps are beautiful, although some of their apps haven't been updated to it.
Google Maps, Search, and Google+ are all very beautiful apps and show "flat" design done correctly.

WishIWasHere
May 4, 2013, 08:18 PM
Maybe the complaints/concerns about flat design is just payback for the unending bitching about skeuomorphism the last couple of years.

Rogifan
May 5, 2013, 05:58 AM
Can someone explain why glossy is good? All these apps with the glossy effect seem so dated compared to their non glossy counterpart. The letterpress app icon os an example of losing the ugly bits of iOS but not going completely flat. The icon has a textured background and has an element of 3D, but it still looks great and not cartoonish. And no glossy lacquer over it.

http://geeksunion.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Letterpress_icon_1.png

Compare that to the phone icon
http://softclub.com.ua/img/pics/videos/4564841257_e3cd13af18_o.jpg

Or the App Store icon
http://www.iportal.com.hr/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/app_store.jpeg

They both look really outdated. Like going in to a house and seeing brass hardware everywhere.

theking79
May 5, 2013, 06:47 AM
Can someone explain why glossy is good? All these apps with the glossy effect seem so dated compared to their non glossy counterpart. The letterpress app icon os an example of losing the ugly bits of iOS but not going completely flat. The icon has a textured background and has an element of 3D, but it still looks great and not cartoonish. And no glossy lacquer over it.

http://geeksunion.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Letterpress_icon_1.png

Compare that to the phone icon
http://softclub.com.ua/img/pics/videos/4564841257_e3cd13af18_o.jpg

Or the App Store icon
http://www.iportal.com.hr/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/app_store.jpeg

They both look really outdated. Like going in to a house and seeing brass hardware everywhere.

That letterpress app icon is exactly what Apple are being reported to move away from, its fake analog and has become very outdated.

Flat design takes away all the unnecessary effects and gloss and isn't made to look like analog, like a lot of the fake calendars/clocks Apple does.

Here's an example from Google of flat design, there are no drop shadows or unnecessary effects, its all made in block colours:

http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h93/joe8979/ScreenShot2013-05-05at124309_zpsc9b8d815.png (http://s62.photobucket.com/user/joe8979/media/ScreenShot2013-05-05at124309_zpsc9b8d815.png.html)

http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h93/joe8979/ScreenShot2013-05-05at124520_zpsc005596c.png (http://s62.photobucket.com/user/joe8979/media/ScreenShot2013-05-05at124520_zpsc005596c.png.html)

Rogifan
May 5, 2013, 09:12 AM
Personally I think the letterpress app icon looks ok. But maybe that's because its in small doses and the app itself is quite flat.

teknikal90
May 7, 2013, 01:14 PM
flat makes sense.
My dream:
if every graphic is a vector, which is a lot easier if all buttons and assets are flat, that would mean very little need for texture packs (buttons would no longer be a .png file that is loaded and stored in the RAM, but rather a set of instructions sent to the GPU to render a square with a blue background.)

eventually...eventually.....resolution independence (no .png file to stretch, just a GPU to be told to draw the square bigger.)

eventually....
different sized iphones that arent fragmented.

Renzatic
May 7, 2013, 01:30 PM
flat makes sense.
My dream:
if every graphic is a vector, which is a lot easier if all buttons and assets are flat, that would mean very little need for texture packs (buttons would no longer be a .png file that is loaded and stored in the RAM, but rather a set of instructions sent to the GPU to render a square with a blue background.)

eventually...eventually.....resolution independence (no .png file to stretch, just a GPU to be told to draw the square bigger.)

eventually....
different sized iphones that arent fragmented.

It's a nice idea, but the problem with vectors is that they're not very performance oriented, and the CPU/GPU having to redraw them all the time would likely take a toll on the battery. By how much, I'm not sure. Probably not that much in the grand scheme of things. But in a mobile environment, everything has to be as efficient as possible, and vectors do draw more power than bitmaps.

It's usually much more efficient just to make your icons and UI elements a decently large bitmap, and downscale them to the size you need them to be on the UI. As long as you're scaling down by powers of 2, and don't go too extreme with the resolution (like use a 2048x icon that's gonna be as large as a fingertip onscreen), you can make a good looking, resolution independent UI without falling back on vectors.

rtomyj
May 7, 2013, 02:43 PM
If you want to know how Apple is going to design iOS 7, look at the passbook app on iOS. The sample card is flat and beautiful!

GoCubsGo
May 7, 2013, 02:49 PM
Wait until the OS is official released.

Trius
May 7, 2013, 04:39 PM
As always, I'm confused. How can anybody, like, dislike, hate, love or otherwise hold any opinion about something that no one has ever seen!??:confused:

Just asking...;)

Welcome to Macrumors...

WhackyNinja
May 7, 2013, 09:43 PM
when did apple ever say "ya johny I've has been making iOS a more flat looking interface."???? how can you hate iOS 7 when we have no idea of what it will be like until june??? thats my daily rant. :D

I welcome the new design. Heck I welcome ANY new design thats good and makes iOS look sexy.

ThisIsNotMe
May 7, 2013, 10:18 PM
Apple's website has more or less been a combination of current iOS/Mac OS GUI and flat design for a while.

MUBiomed
May 8, 2013, 12:13 AM
Flat just has bad connotations. We will love or hate it when we see it. I prefer a "flatter" design like the google icons posted above but others will complain. June isn't that far away guys!

aPple nErd
May 8, 2013, 05:47 PM
either way, i will stay on 5.1.1 :) just tire of the complaining.

jt2020
May 9, 2013, 12:48 PM
I'm ok with either design.

KdParker
May 9, 2013, 12:59 PM
ok, let me get this straight. You are complaining about other people complaining?

411569

subsonix
May 9, 2013, 01:16 PM
Agreed, people are already complaining off of speculation that literally has NO evidence at ALL.

People aren't complaining about iOS7, as you rightly observe, no one has seen it. People are complaining about blanket statements about "skeumorphism" and "flat design"

whocaresit
May 9, 2013, 02:18 PM
Flat design is tasteless and doesn't require much creativity or effort on part of the designer.
Everything will look more shoddy. :(

Rogifan
May 9, 2013, 04:12 PM
Flat design is tasteless and doesn't require much creativity or effort on part of the designer.
Everything will look more shoddy. :(

According to who?

PBF
May 10, 2013, 09:55 AM
http://youtu.be/ESivYZXYqYE

What comes to mind: ugly, uninspiring, windowsy, gay...

Please no! :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

AlbertEinstein
May 10, 2013, 10:39 AM
Flat design has already been done, I expect something glossy and rounded.

Rogifan
May 10, 2013, 10:58 AM
Here's a great blog posting about iOS not going completely flat.

https://medium.com/thoughts-and-words/5ccef7b3e1fc?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+uarrrblog+(UARRR.org)

And a good example of what an app looks like when it loses its gloss.

http://i39.tinypic.com/25i94j7.png

It will be intersting to see if Apple's changes are more radical or are simply getting rid of the gloss and unnecessary textures/gradients.

AQUADock
May 10, 2013, 11:30 AM
Here's a great blog posting about iOS not going completely flat.

https://medium.com/thoughts-and-words/5ccef7b3e1fc?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+uarrrblog+(UARRR.org)

And a good example of what an app looks like when it loses its gloss.

http://i39.tinypic.com/25i94j7.png

It will be intersting to see if Apple's changes are more radical or are simply getting rid of the gloss and unnecessary textures/gradients.

That looks so much better, this is what i have in mind in what i think iOS 7 will look like but with Ive in charge he could surprise us with something else.

Prototypical
May 10, 2013, 12:22 PM
According to who?

Not the design leads of the other two major competitors, apparently.

PinoyAko
May 10, 2013, 12:27 PM
As always, I'm confused. How can anybody, like, dislike, hate, love or otherwise hold any opinion about something that no one has ever seen!??:confused:

Just asking...;)

My fried who doesn't own any Apple products bashes Apple products even though he doesn't own one. My face is like - :confused:

Alx9876
May 10, 2013, 05:37 PM
That letterpress app icon is exactly what Apple are being reported to move away from, its fake analog and has become very outdated.

Flat design takes away all the unnecessary effects and gloss and isn't made to look like analog, like a lot of the fake calendars/clocks Apple does.

Here's an example from Google of flat design, there are no drop shadows or unnecessary effects, its all made in block colours:

Image (http://s62.photobucket.com/user/joe8979/media/ScreenShot2013-05-05at124309_zpsc9b8d815.png.html)

Image (http://s62.photobucket.com/user/joe8979/media/ScreenShot2013-05-05at124520_zpsc005596c.png.html)

The Apple icons look light years better than those disgusting kindergarten tiles.

watchthisspace
May 11, 2013, 09:49 AM
The Apple icons look light years better than those disgusting kindergarten tiles.

You have a very strong opinion against tiles eh?

Open up the app store on your phone and search for Skype. What do you think of that icon?

Shrink
May 11, 2013, 09:52 AM
Sick of people complaining about "flat design!"

Actually, if you had stopped your title at..."Sick of people complaining" you might have received a record number of up votes.;)

chrisvee
May 11, 2013, 01:29 PM
"Sick of people complaining about people complaining about flat design."

:rolleyes: lulz

bugzii
May 11, 2013, 05:13 PM
A lot of people love to complain because of their negative lives. Just ignore/avoid them and live your life positively without them ;) If anyone knows good design it is Johnny Ive so there is nothing to even worry about.

----------

"Sick of people complaining about people complaining about flat design."

:rolleyes: lulz

I see what you did there XD

lolwatpear
May 11, 2013, 09:52 PM
they should keep it as it is

adildacoolset
May 17, 2013, 09:23 AM
As a hobbyist designer, I can tell you that I like Google's flat UI very much, and I believe an Apple's version of that design would look beautiful.

So I'm looking forward to iOS 7 with confidence in Ive.

How do you know if someone on the internet is a designer?

Don't worry. They'll tell you.

thekev
May 17, 2013, 10:07 AM
Can someone explain why glossy is good? All these apps with the glossy effect seem so dated compared to their non glossy counterpart. The letterpress app icon os an example of losing the ugly bits of iOS but not going completely flat. The icon has a textured background and has an element of 3D, but it still looks great and not cartoonish. And no glossy lacquer over it.




I think people get used to thinking of it as 3D-like. They emulate very specific things. In all of the examples you posted including later ones in the thread, the implied lighting is the same. It's a round light source in front of the icon slightly high up while aimed downward. The colimated reflections are indicative of a coated surface like you mentioned or just a non - metallic object with a very smooth surface, basically any level of faceting would have to be small enough that its impact on reflections could not be perceived when viewing. The letterpress is more about a different surface material than more or less volume. It has slight bumps. The edge of the phone has a slight bevel and a drop shadow like it's sitting slightly off the background along the edges. Completely flat to me would be like if they went to solid colors, removing the implication of a lit object. Gradients can be that way too, but right now they're following an extremely specific lighting model across all of those icons. I don't know that they'll go that way. I think people get too hung up on these things.



It's a nice idea, but the problem with vectors is that they're not very performance oriented, and the CPU/GPU having to redraw them all the time would likely take a toll on the battery. By how much, I'm not sure. Probably not that much in the grand scheme of things. But in a mobile environment, everything has to be as efficient as possible, and vectors do draw more power than bitmaps.

It's usually much more efficient just to make your icons and UI elements a decently large bitmap, and downscale them to the size you need them to be on the UI. As long as you're scaling down by powers of 2, and don't go too extreme with the resolution (like use a 2048x icon that's gonna be as large as a fingertip onscreen), you can make a good looking, resolution independent UI without falling back on vectors.

It may happen as mobile Soc packages become increasingly efficient. They are very powerful today when examined by how the number of years they trail similar functionality in other form factors.

Flat design is tasteless and doesn't require much creativity or effort on part of the designer.
Everything will look more shoddy. :(

Blah I disagree with your sentiment, and I think you guys are way too hung up on the word "flat".

Rogifan
May 17, 2013, 09:11 PM
I think people get used to thinking of it as 3D-like. They emulate very specific things. In all of the examples you posted including later ones in the thread, the implied lighting is the same. It's a round light source in front of the icon slightly high up while aimed downward. The colimated reflections are indicative of a coated surface like you mentioned or just a non - metallic object with a very smooth surface, basically any level of faceting would have to be small enough that its impact on reflections could not be perceived when viewing. The letterpress is more about a different surface material than more or less volume. It has slight bumps. The edge of the phone has a slight bevel and a drop shadow like it's sitting slightly off the background along the edges. Completely flat to me would be like if they went to solid colors, removing the implication of a lit object. Gradients can be that way too, but right now they're following an extremely specific lighting model across all of those icons. I don't know that they'll go that way. I think people get too hung up on these things.

Of these two app examples which do you prefer? To me the first one looks more dated almost like a house that has brassy hardware everywhere. Some would argue the first is better because it makes the buttons look clickable/tapable. But I don't think it's hard to figure out what to tap in the second example.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2042135/Apple/AppleUI.png

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2042135/Apple/flatUI.png

thekev
May 18, 2013, 09:38 AM
Of these two app examples which do you prefer? To me the first one looks more dated almost like a house that has brassy hardware everywhere. Some would argue the first is better because it makes the buttons look clickable/tapable. But I don't think it's hard to figure out what to tap in the second example.


I like the second one. You're likely to see it change back and forth. It's really more stylistic than anything, but the first was probably helpful in the infancy of mass market touchscreen devices. The sense of depth arguably provided communication that is no longer needed as people have become acclimatized to that method of interaction. They make it very obvious at first, then tone it down as strong visual cues are no longer needed by a fair number of users. I'm personally a fan of subdued design work. I haven't researched it in depth, and I'm not really an expert on graphic design. Some of these things just seem apparent when looking through various icons Apple has used. Things like the implied lighting model I mentioned are extremely consistent.

Just looking at the twitter logos a bit longer, I'd add that part of the reason I strongly prefer the second there is that implied lighting and dimension don't add much to the first. It's more of an occlusion effect that anything in that you have slightly beveled highlights on lit edges and shadowed crevices. I don't find that terribly interesting. The second is plain, but displayed on a phone I would still know it was an icon for twitter without the words there, and telling people touch here starts to become patronizing when practically everyone owns a smartphone.

Rogifan
May 18, 2013, 10:22 AM
I like the second one. You're likely to see it change back and forth. It's really more stylistic than anything, but the first was probably helpful in the infancy of mass market touchscreen devices. The sense of depth arguably provided communication that is no longer needed as people have become acclimatized to that method of interaction. They make it very obvious at first, then tone it down as strong visual cues are no longer needed by a fair number of users. I'm personally a fan of subdued design work. I haven't researched it in depth, and I'm not really an expert on graphic design. Some of these things just seem apparent when looking through various icons Apple has used. Things like the implied lighting model I mentioned are extremely consistent.

Just looking at the twitter logos a bit longer, I'd add that part of the reason I strongly prefer the second there is that implied lighting and dimension don't add much to the first. It's more of an occlusion effect that anything in that you have slightly beveled highlights on lit edges and shadowed crevices. I don't find that terribly interesting. The second is plain, but displayed on a phone I would still know it was an icon for twitter without the words there, and telling people touch here starts to become patronizing when practically everyone owns a smartphone.
Jony Ive has said he doesn't like it when designers are wagging their tail in his face. To me that's what the first example does, as do many of the skeuomorphic designs in iOS. It's as if the designers want to show you how good they are at graphic design. I actually find it a bit patronizing. These days most people are familiar with touch devices and know how to use them. I don't need an element designed like a physical button on a remote to know I can click on it.

thekev
May 19, 2013, 01:21 PM
Jony Ive has said he doesn't like it when designers are wagging their tail in his face. To me that's what the first example does, as do many of the skeuomorphic designs in iOS. It's as if the designers want to show you how good they are at graphic design. I actually find it a bit patronizing. These days most people are familiar with touch devices and know how to use them. I don't need an element designed like a physical button on a remote to know I can click on it.

I lost the prior response I was typing to this. I don't think it's so much designers showing off. I disagree that it's designers showing off, but it may be somewhat of a vestigial function. It probably served to bring more people on board initially. Even old people could use one without holding it 8 inches from their face and slowly scanning line by line. The goal is likely to ensure that the vast majority of users can still read things at a peripheral glance without taking it any further than that. One thing I don't understand is why (correct me if I'm wrong but I haven't seen it) iOS doesn't offer much in the way of options for the colorblind. Red/Green colorblindness isn't that atypical. It doesn't seem bad for that overall, but I thought they could do more at a base level. I don't have it personally, so I don't know how much mixed hues are affected visually compared to high chroma values.

ppeyton1143
May 19, 2013, 02:16 PM
when did apple ever say "ya johny I've has been making iOS a more flat looking interface."???? how can you hate iOS 7 when we have no idea of what it will be like until june??? thats my daily rant. :D

yep, many people (even on macrumors) are complaining about the flat design, how can hold any opinion about it when you havent seen it.

rsnapeuk
May 19, 2013, 02:29 PM
If the flat design is anything like Google's I'm all for it. If its going to be like a Microsoft thing then I'm not interested haha

iOSRegister
May 19, 2013, 03:34 PM
Google's designs are great. I think the more 'modern' of the two is Google - certainly the direction Apple is going to head in with iOS 7 we believe.

Am3r1ca16
May 19, 2013, 08:32 PM
i'll be laughing when the GUI is not even flat. lol

darster
May 20, 2013, 02:07 AM
Flat will become boring and outdated in less than 2 years. Apple switching to flat now, will only prove they are chasing history, instead of making it.

jonnyb098
May 20, 2013, 08:52 AM
That letterpress app icon is exactly what Apple are being reported to move away from, its fake analog and has become very outdated.

Flat design takes away all the unnecessary effects and gloss and isn't made to look like analog, like a lot of the fake calendars/clocks Apple does.

Here's an example from Google of flat design, there are no drop shadows or unnecessary effects, its all made in block colours:

Image (http://s62.photobucket.com/user/joe8979/media/ScreenShot2013-05-05at124309_zpsc9b8d815.png.html)

Image (http://s62.photobucket.com/user/joe8979/media/ScreenShot2013-05-05at124520_zpsc005596c.png.html)

The Letterpress game looks amazing but the icon looks like someone just discovered photoshop. Its horrible. Anyone who thinks that is a good looking icon need not be commenting on design. Thanks ;)

beaniemyman
May 20, 2013, 09:52 AM
Flat will become boring and outdated in less than 2 years. Apple switching to flat now, will only prove they are chasing history, instead of making it.

well if they keep making tweaks to the flat design, i dont think this issue will rise. most google services have a flat look, i dont think they look outdated.

sexiewasd
May 20, 2013, 06:33 PM
Of these two app examples which do you prefer? To me the first one looks more dated almost like a house that has brassy hardware everywhere. Some would argue the first is better because it makes the buttons look clickable/tapable. But I don't think it's hard to figure out what to tap in the second example.

Image (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2042135/Apple/AppleUI.png)

Image (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2042135/Apple/flatUI.png)

I would only change the selected icon's blue smudge to a realistic inner glow. I think that the first set looks much more interesting and professional. I guess I just like UI to have an element of artistic expression even if it's mostly not necessary. I like apps and interfaces that have a certain "mood" like an interesting painting gives a sense of emotion and atmosphere to it's subjects.

bozzykid
May 20, 2013, 06:50 PM
Flat will become boring and outdated in less than 2 years. Apple switching to flat now, will only prove they are chasing history, instead of making it.

But if they don't update the UI (whether using flat elements or not), then they will become farther behind. The style they use for backgrounds/gradients/icons is unimportant to the overall user interface improvements that are needed.

darster
May 20, 2013, 08:22 PM
But if they don't update the UI (whether using flat elements or not), then they will become farther behind. The style they use for backgrounds/gradients/icons is unimportant to the overall user interface improvements that are needed.

I agree that they need to update UI. ios 7 has to be a significant upgrade. Something that will push both Apple and it's users out of their comfort zone.

otismotive77
May 21, 2013, 06:48 AM
just some haters saying bad things about apple, nothing else. they think of the flat look as windows 8 and how ugly it looks, they should look at gmail, dropbox, rdio etc. how flat they are, and everyone them.

Kissaragi
May 25, 2013, 11:37 AM
70% of those people probably dont even know what "flat" means and simply bitch because all they "heard" is that windows 8 is apparently "flat" and they hate it

70% of them have never used windows 8 either. its just windows = bad in their heads.