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stevemgough
May 29, 2013, 02:40 PM
I have a 21.5 inch iMac, 2 x 3rd gen ATV's, 1 x ipad 3,1x iPhone 4 and 2x iPhone 5's that all currently connect to a windows 2008 media server.
Over the last 18 months or so I've been slowly filtering out my windows products and now it's time for the server to go.
I would love to get a new Mac mini server and use a thunderbolt HDD caddy but unfortunately I don't have that sort of money kicking about so I was thinking maybe a G5 power mac running leopard server and either buying 2 x 3TB HDD's or the G5 jive HDD caddy and putting my existing drives in that..
Is this a good/badd idea? Will leopard server and mountain lion get on okay?anyone got any other reasonably priced ideas?

Thanks Steve



Lil Chillbil
May 29, 2013, 02:48 PM
G5s do not make very good servers due to power consumption. you may want to consider a small 2 bay nas server.

stevemgough
May 29, 2013, 02:51 PM
I'm not really after a NAS, I like to do my downloading on the server and the plan is to have iTunes on there as well, would the G4 be any good or is she a tad bit too old?

Lil Chillbil
May 29, 2013, 03:01 PM
I'm not really after a NAS, I like to do my downloading on the server and the plan is to have iTunes on there as well, would the G4 be any good or is she a tad bit too old?

its not out of the question if you add a sata pci card. a g4 mdd can have about 4tbs of storage that can be accessed over a home network

stevemgough
May 29, 2013, 03:13 PM
Would there be any issues with leopard server and mountain lion talking to each other? Would I be right in thinking the latest iTunes won't work on leopard server

Lil Chillbil
May 29, 2013, 03:37 PM
Would there be any issues with leopard server and mountain lion talking to each other? Would I be right in thinking the latest iTunes won't work on leopard server

I don't know about that you'll have to wait for someone a bit more knowledgable on this subject to come along but I have heared of people using powerpc media servers in the past to communicate with snow leopard and maybe lion but i don't know about 10.8

The latest itunes requires 10.6.8

Wildy
May 29, 2013, 04:02 PM
Would there be any issues with leopard server and mountain lion talking to each other? Would I be right in thinking the latest iTunes won't work on leopard server
I'm not sure what else you use your server for, but for straight up media / file sharing you don't need any of the enterprise features of Leopard Server.

You can run iTunes 10 on Leopard. iTunes uses the DAAP protocol which is pretty standardized - it will work without hitch between your two machines. Same goes for all of the other services.

stevemgough
May 29, 2013, 04:52 PM
You can run iTunes 10 on Leopard. iTunes uses the DAAP protocol which is pretty standardized - it will work without hitch between your two machines. Same goes for all of the other services.

If I was running iTunes 10 would the ATV'S still work okay.
I use my server to do my downloading as well so nothing major.
Would like osx to be as upto date as my budget would let me.

Lil Chillbil
May 29, 2013, 05:36 PM
If I was running iTunes 10 would the ATV'S still work okay.
I use my server to do my downloading as well so nothing major.
Would like osx to be as upto date as my budget would let me.

your os if you are using powerpc based macs and not the current intel ones is limited to os x 10.5.8 no workarounds

it just will never never never never ever ever ever work 10.6 and above are built for intel based chips no emulation nothing.



glad we could get this part outta the way early

stevemgough
May 29, 2013, 05:44 PM
your os if you are using powerpc based macs and not the current intel ones is limited to os x 10.5.8 no workarounds

it just will never never never never ever ever ever work 10.6 and above are built for intel based chips no emulation nothing.



glad we could get this part outta the way early

So iTunes 10 running on osx 10.5.8 will NOT work with the ATV'S.

I currently run iTunes on the iMac which points to the windows server for media,so I will still have to do it this way with the power mac..

Thanks for all your help, I'll be watching eBay to grab a good one.

MisterKeeks
May 29, 2013, 06:11 PM
So iTunes 10 running on osx 10.5.8 will NOT work with the ATV'S.

I currently run iTunes on the iMac which points to the windows server for media,so I will still have to do it this way with the power mac..

Thanks for all your help, I'll be watching eBay to grab a good one.

No, he wasn't clear. I believe it would work. I would recommend a G4 as well. However, I don't know exactly what you are doing, and if it requires on-the-fly encoding, any PowerPC would not be suitable.

I use a 1.83GHz Core Duo Mini as my server. It works well, and can be upgraded to a Core 2 Quad if necessary.

stevemgough
May 29, 2013, 06:24 PM
No, he wasn't clear. I believe it would work. I would recommend a G4 as well. However, I don't know exactly what you are doing, and if it requires on-the-fly encoding, any PowerPC would not be suitable.

I use a 1.83GHz Core Duo Mini as my server. It works well, and can be upgraded to a Core 2 Quad if necessary.

I will be downloading files on the server and storing media, films, TV shows, music etc on there, the ATV's, iPad and iPhones would connect to iTunes to access the media so all the powermac will be doing is acting as a file share as all the encoding will be done at the ATV'S etc. hope that makes sense..

Lil Chillbil
May 29, 2013, 06:35 PM
I will be downloading files on the server and storing media, films, TV shows, music etc on there, the ATV's, iPad and iPhones would connect to iTunes to access the media so all the powermac will be doing is acting as a file share as all the encoding will be done at the ATV'S etc. hope that makes sense..

Then a g4 with dual processors 2 gigs of ram a decent graphics card and a sata card and such should work just fine for your needs

stevemgough
May 29, 2013, 06:37 PM
Then a g4 with dual processors 2 gigs of ram a decent graphics card and a sata card and such should work just fine for your needs

Thank you.

MisterKeeks
May 29, 2013, 07:06 PM
Then a g4 with dual processors 2 gigs of ram a decent graphics card and a sata card and such should work just fine for your needs

I don't think all of those should be needed. Processing power is not an issue, it is just moving files over a network. No graphics card is needed at all. SATA is not needed- read/write speeds do not need to be high at all.

Lil Chillbil
May 29, 2013, 09:42 PM
I don't think all of those should be needed. Processing power is not an issue, it is just moving files over a network. No graphics card is needed at all. SATA is not needed- read/write speeds do not need to be high at all.

Sata is not needed but if this guy wants more than 1tb or storage then hes gonna want to get an actual new drive for his server. At this point I would only use ide drives in computers that absolutely don't support anything else.

Wildy
May 30, 2013, 03:16 AM
If I was running iTunes 10 would the ATV'S still work okay.
I use my server to do my downloading as well so nothing major.
Would like osx to be as upto date as my budget would let me.

iTunes 10 has home sharing which will work perfectly with ATV.

wobegong
May 30, 2013, 06:05 AM
I use one of these NAS drives http://www.techradar.com/reviews/pc-mac/networking-and-wi-fi/network-attached-storage-nas/d-link-dns-320l-1095589/review

It has a built in iTunes server, torrent client and supports AFP, works great for me, I plugged in two large drives and have them configured on RAID 1 mirroring. Good power save setup as well.

MrPilot
May 30, 2013, 06:11 AM
Then a g4 with dual processors 2 gigs of ram a decent graphics card and a sata card and such should work just fine for your needs

That setup should be able to do the actual decoding as well... my single G4 does that.(720p limit. 1080p not fluid enough) Outputs straight to HDMI to the screen.

The fileserver shouldn't use more than 1-5% of a single G4 capacity.

stevemgough
May 30, 2013, 08:53 AM
iTunes 10 has home sharing which will work perfectly with ATV.

Would the ATV'S have issues with iTunes not being the latest versions?

----------

I use one of these NAS drives http://www.techradar.com/reviews/pc-mac/networking-and-wi-fi/network-attached-storage-nas/d-link-dns-320l-1095589/review

It has a built in iTunes server, torrent client and supports AFP, works great for me, I plugged in two large drives and have them configured on RAID 1 mirroring. Good power save setup as well.

I'm not a big fan of NAS drives, I would prefer a server as IMO they work better and more efficiently at serving files, I rarely use torrents I prefer to use newsgroups.

Thank you for your input and idea though, it was appreciated.

seveej
May 30, 2013, 05:14 PM
I run a G4 MDD as a multipurpose server. It runs 10.5.7 server (10.5.8 was creating trouble in my LAN, so I rolled it back a bit, but YMMV)

I have no experience with ATV, nor with ML, but I know Lion works fine, so I'd assume no problems with ML...

The machine is a Dual 1 Ghz, has a sonnet SATA card and works fine otherwise, but:
- the power requirements are far beyond optimal (min. 100 W)
- the thing is noisy (even though I've done a reasonable job taming the wind tunnel) (Idle noise level currently three times of my Mac Pro, but only a third of the original - all subjective measurements by my ears)
- It produces too much heat, which is a problem as I've stored it in a big cupboard (3 m3)

If these are no problem with you an MDD would fit the bill, but I'd seriously consider one of the last batch, an MDD2003 (http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/powermac_g4/specs/powermac_g4_1.25_mdd.html) if you can find one. They run way cooler and many of the problems burdening the original batch have been remedied...

Personally, I'm looking hard at supplanting that rig with a mini using a large external storage. I know FW800 is not the speediest of buses, but even with the current setup, I typically only get 60-80 MBps transfer speeds, and the mini+FW800 will hardly be much worse...

RGDS,

stevemgough
May 30, 2013, 05:36 PM
I run a G4 MDD as a multipurpose server. It runs 10.5.7 server (10.5.8 was creating trouble in my LAN, so I rolled it back a bit, but YMMV)

I have no experience with ATV, nor with ML, but I know Lion works fine, so I'd assume no problems with ML...

The machine is a Dual 1 Ghz, has a sonnet SATA card and works fine otherwise, but:
- the power requirements are far beyond optimal (min. 100 W)
- the thing is noisy (even though I've done a reasonable job taming the wind tunnel) (Idle noise level currently three times of my Mac Pro, but only a third of the original - all subjective measurements by my ears)
- It produces too much heat, which is a problem as I've stored it in a big cupboard (3 m3)

If these are no problem with you an MDD would fit the bill, but I'd seriously consider one of the last batch, an MDD2003 (http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/powermac_g4/specs/powermac_g4_1.25_mdd.html) if you can find one. They run way cooler and many of the problems burdening the original batch have been remedied...

Personally, I'm looking hard at supplanting that rig with a mini using a large external storage. I know FW800 is not the speediest of buses, but even with the current setup, I typically only get 60-80 MBps transfer speeds, and the mini+FW800 will hardly be much worse...

RGDS,


Noise and heat are not really an issue as it will be sat in the attic,
I would love a mini but spare money isn't something I have a lot of at the minute.

seveej
May 31, 2013, 12:49 AM
Noise and heat are not really an issue as it will be sat in the attic,


Good plan. Keep in mind, that the MDD's CPU cooler is not what you could call high tech, so ambient temperature should definitely stay below 40c, preferably below 30c for the cooler to have any significant affect.

RGDS,

Lil Chillbil
May 31, 2013, 01:24 AM
Good plan. Keep in mind, that the MDD's CPU cooler is not what you could call high tech, so ambient temperature should definitely stay below 40c, preferably below 30c for the cooler to have any significant affect.

RGDS,

The cpu won't reach above 27% I would imagine just doing server work so I think that the ambient temp won't make that big of a difference

seveej
May 31, 2013, 02:26 AM
The cpu won't reach above 27% I would imagine just doing server work so I think that the ambient temp won't make that big of a difference

Based on my limited (but hands on) experience, I'd still tend to disagree...

True, server work is hardly is CPU intensive. My server's average utilization (as reported by uptime) is around 30-35% (file serving, web serving, torrents).

At those stress levels, the CPU diode reports temperatures, which closely follow the following equation:
CPUA = Ambient + Ambient*1,25

When ambient is 15c, CPUA reports 35c
When ambient is 20c, CPUA reports 45c
When ambient is 30c, CPUA reports 66c (like right now)

And these figures are with nap enabled through CHUDtools. Without Nap, you can add 10-20 degrees to those readings...

Like I said, crappy heat sink...

RGDS,

Lil Chillbil
May 31, 2013, 10:56 AM
Based on my limited (but hands on) experience, I'd still tend to disagree...

True, server work is hardly is CPU intensive. My server's average utilization (as reported by uptime) is around 30-35% (file serving, web serving, torrents).

At those stress levels, the CPU diode reports temperatures, which closely follow the following equation:
CPUA = Ambient + Ambient*1,25

When ambient is 15c, CPUA reports 35c
When ambient is 20c, CPUA reports 45c
When ambient is 30c, CPUA reports 66c (like right now)

And these figures are with nap enabled through CHUDtools. Without Nap, you can add 10-20 degrees to those readings...

Like I said, crappy heat sink...

RGDS,


yes the mdd does have a crappy heat sink but fussying around with ambient temp in an attic is a lot like trying to smoke a cigarette on hoth