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vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 01:57 AM
Every time I stick in my Shuffle, iTUNES insists on replacing my current playlist with a random list of its own. There is NO way I can turn off this auto-update feature, so even if I want to listen to the same set of songs for the next few days, and I'm plugging it into my USB port only to charge the battery, NOT to change the current set of songs I am listening to, I have no choice in the matter. I have to listen to songs that iTUNES has decided for me!

I know the iPOD SHuffle was made with this function in mind, but surely Apple could have provided an easy one buton click to disable it?

I have Apple zealots arguing with me that this is what the Shuffle is meant for, and it is a fantastic feature, despite NOT having a button to switch the feature off.

Am I the ONLY one on the planet not to fall for this Apple hype? I can forgive this auto-update functionality if the USB port was not ALSO used to charge the damn thing. Do i run around looking for machines without iTUNES installed so I can simply charge my iPOD Shuffle without losing my current set of favourite songs which i HAVE NOT finished listening to??

Is there an easy way for me to tell Apple and iTUNES that what i listen to, when and where, is my choice?????



balamw
Nov 2, 2005, 02:08 AM
You should be able to turn autofill off in your iPod Preferences page. Same place you turn on disk mode access.

At least that's what is implied here: http://www.apple.com/ipodshuffle/autosync.html

B

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 02:13 AM
Nope it doesn't work. I use iTUNES on Win XP. As long as the iTUNES Helper module is running in the background it will go ahead and wipe out your music regardless.

I once put it into a friend's laptop's USB port to charge it and before I knew it, his iTUNES had not only replaced every precious song of mine with Bon Jovi, Bryan Adams and similar trash from his collection, it also renamed the iPOD to his name in his iTUNES without even a simple alert box warning me what it was doing.

I have to manually disable the iTUNES helper module - and even this is temporary. Next time I run iTUNES the helper module goes back into my start up and starts with the next boot - I cannot disable it permanently.

Is this the famed Apple ease of use in action? Do they think all listeners are morons, and should not be given simple options to preserve their own music on their own Shuffles??

cleanup
Nov 2, 2005, 02:25 AM
Errrh, I'm pretty sure there must be something else. Apple is not stupid. You don't have to use Autofill, and when you plug in an iPod to another computer, there should be a dialog box that says that the iPod is connected to someone else's library, and if you're sure you want to sync it to the current library or not.

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 02:29 AM
Try selecting "enable disk use" in the iPod preference pane. It's just a suggestion, my shuffle doesn't auto update so i don't know what's wrong with yours but the disk use thing might have something to do with it.

balamw
Nov 2, 2005, 02:36 AM
Prolly wouldn't hurt to use the iPod updater to take it back to factory conditions too. It really shouldn't sync to someone else's library without a warning as cleanup mentioned.

B

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 02:37 AM
Why is no one talking about providing a single click option to disable auto-update or synching? Why should I indulge in workarounds to do something which is my prerogative in the first place - ie deciding what i should listen to, for how long and when...??

Amazing how even a blatantly silly feature is treated as gospel by Apple zealots!

And no, iTUNES on my friend's machine did not open any dialog box. And even on my machine, if i as much as slip it into the USB port for charging, it starts the iPOD update process immediately, REGARDLESS of the fact that I want to CHARGE my Shuffle, NOT REPLACE my music.

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 02:44 AM
Why is no one talking about providing a single click option to disable auto-update or synching? Why should I indulge in workarounds to do something which is my prerogative in the first place - ie deciding what i should listen to, for how long and when...??

Amazing how even a blatantly silly feature is treated as gospel by Apple zealots!

And no, iTUNES on my friend's machine did not open any dialog box. And even on my machine, if i as much as slip it into the USB port for charging, it starts the iPOD update process immediately, REGARDLESS of the fact that I want to CHARGE my Shuffle, NOT REPLACE my music.

Because it's a feature of only your shuffle.

Nobody else is giving any suggestion as to how to fix it because the problem doesn't affect any of them. Stop whinging that it's an all-encompassing problem and give Apple a ring and see if you have a defective unit - yeah it happens when you're making millions of them a month.

Go to the source and get your problem fixed. We can't help you because none of us have the problem. The suggestion issued to you to restore your iPod to factory settings is a good one. Try that, it may be that some settings in your shuffle have become a bit wonky.

How about you try some of these things rather than ranting on?

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 02:47 AM
yes, I reset it to factory settings almost every time I plug it in so I can keep the same set of songs on from my collection.

I have now uninstalled iTUNES for good and use the Winamp plugin for iPOD. Sorry if this sounds like blasphemy, but this is the first time any hardware or software has tried making my decisions for me... and i DISLIKE that immensely.

One more problem I face: I keep all my music on varius drives, but used iTUNES as the player - ie I did not allow iTUNES to categorise or regroup my library. And yet, whenever I used ITUNES it pops up saying "Not enough memory in the selected drive to save the iTUNES library. Deleting files or emptying recycle Bin will create space. Don't show this message again."

Firstly, the drive/folder to which I have pointed iTUNES to save its library has over 900 MB of space. Secondly it isn't resorting the songs, only creating a library with shortcuts, so why isn't 900MB enough. Thirdly, what kind of dimwitted alert message is that. The alert should have an option for me to point to another drive for saving the library, and solve my problem instead of giving me an option to ignore the alert by not showing the message again!

The Apple zealots I am having an argument with here in Bangalore refuse to accept that Apple can do dumb things like this. Which is what is getting on my nerves too. I find too few Apple people who can be objective about problems when pointed out - the first thing they do is defend all things Apple.

I am not here to defend or put down anyones corporate philosophies, but if a piece of software doesn't work the way it should, then I am going to say so, regardless of which corporate house it comes from, or the accompanying hype...

nomad01
Nov 2, 2005, 02:47 AM
Amazing how even a blatantly silly feature is treated as gospel by Apple zealots!


If you read what's been written, you might get somewhere rather than just ranting.

This is NOT how the shuffle usually works.

The software restore might fix the problem permanently... not as a workaround. If it doesn't then I suggest you log a call with Apple. Both paths will be more productive than venting your spleen on here.

yellow5
Nov 2, 2005, 02:49 AM
I'm pretty sure if you call us apple zealots one more time I'ma gonna smack ya.

balamw
Nov 2, 2005, 02:51 AM
Do i run around looking for machines without iTUNES installed so I can simply charge my iPOD Shuffle without losing my current set of favourite songs which i HAVE NOT finished listening to??
You do also realize you can also buy a USB power brick from Apple or many other thrid parties that will recharge you shuffle without any fear of syncing to anything.

Autofill is a feature that is as easy to turn off as it is to turn on disk access mode. If you haven't found the switch you haven't been looking, or your shuffle is defective and needs to be reflashed or repaired.

Lots of people are using their shuffles in manual sync mode connected to multiple machines. Just Google it.

B

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 02:54 AM
Smacking me won't solve my problem. I have upraded to the latest iPOD software as well as iTUNES 6. Neither problem goes away.

By the way, uninstalling iTUNES does not do a clean uninstall. If you don't manually select and delete all traces, reinsalling a new verson results in exactly the same problems, including the 'No space to save library' message... when technically it should ask me afresh where to save the library and other settings.

nomad01
Nov 2, 2005, 02:59 AM
By the way, uninstalling iTUNES does not do a clean uninstall. If you don't manually select and delete all traces, reinsalling a new verson results in exactly the same problems, including the 'No space to save library' message... when technically it should ask me afresh where to save the library and other settings.

This isn't uncommon for Windows software though. MANY uninstalls leave ini files and other bits and pieces on your system that will get picked up with a reinstall.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 03:02 AM
LOL! Now its a Windows problem... What about giving me a reasonable option in the "Cannot save library" window, and allowing me to point to a different path, instead of asking me if I want to see this message again or not?

Windows effing up again??

tdhurst
Nov 2, 2005, 03:08 AM
Yes, it's either a Windows or your particular iPod problem, because many of us plug our shuffles into various machines without any synching happening. My shuffle won't even change the songs when plugged into my own machine until I tell it to.

Oh...it's iTunes and iPod...NOT iTUNES and iPOD...you don't have to capitalize the words just to make sure we are paying attention.

nomad01
Nov 2, 2005, 03:10 AM
Windows effing up again??

Jesus there really is no helping you is there??

You're blaming Apple for everything short of famine in Africa and I was just pointing out that uninstallers working that way wasn't an Apple only problem.

I didn't say it was a Windows problem!

If you're trying to get help from Apple with the same attitude you're using on this forum, you might as well toss the shuffle in the bin and go buy something else because they probably won't be taking you seriously.

People on here have made suggestions to help you fix the problem. You just moan in response.

You've been told that this is not how a Shuffle should usually work. You just moan in repsonse.

You've been advised to take it back to Apple for a repair/replacement. You just moan in response.

Were you expecting somebody to fix it by magic for you?

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 03:18 AM
The first thing that happens when i plug in my iPod is that the "Updating IPod, Do not Disconnect" thing starts immediately. Now, this could be related to the library not saving problem, but can't it have a one click option to enable/disable autosynching/updating, especially when autoupdate is the default setting for the Shuffle as Apple says themselves...

Surprising that the solution is to contact Apple - nobody seems to know how to correct a real but simple issue - and this is because iTunes simply doesn't have enough options for these functions - it does far too much decision making for my liking. What is preventing a simple pop up Alert as soon as you plug in your iPOD - "Do you want to aytosynch/update - Yes/No" and "Remember this setting till I choose to change it"???

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 03:22 AM
And by the way I have tried all the suggestions, from forums, Mac users in town and more. A MAc user came home too, and was flummoxed. The only thing that has worked is the Winamp plug in.

And don't get me wrong. I think the iPod rocks - whichever one it is, even the Nano with the screen problems. My problem is with iTunes, and with people who refuse to admit that it has scope for improvement. Just because it is from Apple does NOT make it perfect.

nomad01
Nov 2, 2005, 03:34 AM
If you want to just be able to plug the iPod in to charge without updating anything, can't you just turn off the option to open iTunes when the iPod is connected?

If the iPod is connected and iTunes isn't open, it should just charge the iPod. It can only update your songs when itunes is open.

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 03:36 AM
The first thing that happens when i plug in my iPod is that the "Updating IPod, Do not Disconnect" thing starts immediately. Now, this could be related to the library not saving problem, but can't it have a one click option to enable/disable autosynching/updating, especially when autoupdate is the default setting for the Shuffle as Apple says themselves...

Surprising that the solution is to contact Apple - nobody seems to know how to correct a real but simple issue - and this is because iTunes simply doesn't have enough options for these functions - it does far too much decision making for my liking. What is preventing a simple pop up Alert as soon as you plug in your iPOD - "Do you want to aytosynch/update - Yes/No" and "Remember this setting till I choose to change it"???


OK, that "updating iPod, do not disconnect" happens to mine, however this is just checking the current songs and songs I have added to the shuffle while it was not plugged in (selected "leave iPod in source list"). It does not change or move any songs at any time.

There is something wrong with your shuffle. We are offering advice on how to fix this quite complex problem. It is not a simple problem as none of us have seen it before and believe me a lot of us own shuffles. So stop your moaning and go get help.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 03:45 AM
Well, that is the point Nomad. As long as the iTunes Helper.exe module is running in the background, it takes it upon itself to start updating as soon as my iPod is plugged in. Now in Windows, i cannot permanently disable the helper. Every time I run iTunes it jumps back into my list of start up programs.

So if I remember to manually stop the Helper then I have some hope, but then by the time I plug in my iod the first reaction is 'Updating iPOD' and I can't even stop it, so I can disable the Helper module.

Now all these problems may be linked to the fact that iTunes can't save its library - but I won't know because when i uninstalled iTunes and reinstalled it, it remembered all the settings and repeated every single problem, s i no longer have iTunes on my machine - I use the Winamp plugin.

However, the alert message when I can't save my library is plain dumb by any standards, even Windows. "Don't Show this Message again" is NOT an option in my book when the problem is a critical application file that cannot be saved.

nomad01
Nov 2, 2005, 03:50 AM
Well I'm afraid I can't help. I don't have a shuffle anymore but mine would only ever update when iTunes was loaded and it only loaded when I loaded it. The helper does run all the time though so that shouldn't be an issue.

Something is not working right. Going back to what was said originally by several of us, your Shuffle/iTunes shouldn't be working like this.

I would hope that Apple would be able to give you some help though. Have you looked/posted on Apple's iPod shuffle forum to see if anyone has had the problem there?

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 04:11 AM
As Chundle said, the default setting is for iTunes to update the Shuffle as soon as it is plugged in - even if it isn't replacing songs, it is updating the playlist or whatever.

The only way to stop this is to stop the helper, which is as intrusive as the Quicktime updater used to be - it keeps coming back regardless.

My question is, why can't this setting be changed in iTunes especially when the USB will be used for charging alone on many occasions? Why can't iTunes give me control over such basic things like whether it should update or not, and point me to another path to save the library file if one folder is full by any chance??

In any case my iPod rocks with the Winamp Plugin and my current set of songs which include fine artists like Iron & Wine, JJ Cale and Jack Johnson - as long as I don't use iTunes I am fine...

I was just hoping for one objective word from a Mac forum, instead of blind faith kind of replies about my 'moaning'.

nomad01
Nov 2, 2005, 04:22 AM
I was just hoping for one objective word from a Mac forum, instead of blind faith kind of replies about my 'moaning'.

I don't blindly worship Apple and I really don't think you've been met with blind faith in this instance. Apple make some great stuff but they also drop the ball a fair bit too. If you look at posts on this forum you'll find more than your fair share of people complaining about Apple and you can bitch to your hearts content if that's all you want.

In less than an hour since your first post on this matter, you started calling us zealots when all we were doing was making suggestions of things you could try.

Maybe in future you could give people a chance to understand exactly what your problem is before you start calling them names??

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 04:29 AM
As Chundle said, the default setting is for iTunes to update the Shuffle as soon as it is plugged in - even if it isn't replacing songs, it is updating the playlist or whatever.

The only way to stop this is to stop the helper, which is as intrusive as the Quicktime updater used to be - it keeps coming back regardless.

My question is, why can't this setting be changed in iTunes especially when the USB will be used for charging alone on many occasions? Why can't iTunes give me control over such basic things like whether it should update or not, and point me to another path to save the library file if one folder is full by any chance??

In any case my iPod rocks with the Winamp Plugin and my current set of songs which include fine artists like Iron & Wine, JJ Cale and Jack Johnson - as long as I don't use iTunes I am fine...

I was just hoping for one objective word from a Mac forum, instead of blind faith kind of replies about my 'moaning'.


DO YOU NOT READ?!?!

I said all it was doing is checking to see if YOU had changed anything. It takes 5 seconds to look at the iPod in the source list, compare it to the one you have plugged in and see what needs to be changed. It only updates if you have added songs to the source list. It's not doing anything out of the ordinary. If you haven't changed anything then it doesn't do anything.

I keep saying there is something wrong with your shuffle or you have inadvertently changed some setting or some file has been corrupted in Windows and to ring Apple but instead you seem to think that you can come onto a forum where people are offering their assistance free of charge and with good intention and get the same sort of help that the people who actually MADE the product can provide.

I find it extremely arrogant of you to come on here, ask a question of people who are just trying to help you enjoy your product and then whine because the help that these people provided free of charge was not good enough.

Go away and call Apple. We obviously can't satisfy you and I don't feel like helping you anymore anyway.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 04:30 AM
Point taken, Nomad. However, it doesn't change my opinion that iTunes has a fair distance to go.

I have over 50GB of music, and have been trying all sorts of media players since 1997 - But for the fact that iTunes has a store attached and makes buying online easy, it simply doesn't cut ice with me either as a player/library or as my iPod updating facility.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 05:31 AM
Chundle, if your iPod is full, then even if it is not replacing songs, iTunes does not take just 5 secs. Maybe that's a Windows problem again. But that is not the point either. If the USB port is ALSO used to charge the iPod, then why is the default setting "Update without asking until complicated changes are made in settings"?? Surely it should be intelligent enough to ask why you are plugging it in.

Anyways, why on earth should it update my playlist without asking me if I am simply recharging it and don't want it to touch my music? It's not as if the iPod won't play without crosschecking/updating the playlist. Besides, when it gives me the Update message i do not know whether it is simply refreshing the list or replacing songs, so I always lived in mortal fear of losing my iPod playlist every time I tried charging it. All it has to do is give ME the option to decide what i want to do, which iTunes doesn't.

Same with the library saving dialog. Why is that not in my control, such that it is going back to some default full disk regardless of my changing it manually under iTunes settings? And even if it must do that, when the alert message comes, why doesn't it let me point to an empty folder or disk? Surely I know my drives better than iTunes does!

The reason I started this thread sounding like a rant was because:

1) The only answers i got from people I spoke to were that i don't know how to use Apple software or that I am doing something wrong. This is the first place thankfully where someone told me there could be something wrong with the Shuffle itself. Although i am fairly sure there isn't. I use it just fine now with NO problems. "iTunes rocks. You are a poor Windows user!" was the normal refrain i heard, even from people who came home and saw it firsthand but could do nothing to solve the problem.

2) The problems I have outlined are not anything that needs an Apple tech team to sort out, or even unnecessary uninstalling, cleaningout the registry and reinstalling. All it needs are some under the hood options that leave some decisions to the user, while retaining the rest of its simplicity and what have you. One simple option to choose my library directory (which iTunes understands instead of ignores) and one even simpler option asking me whether I'm plugging in the Shuffle to charge or to update is all it takes. And yet no one can help me because these simple options do not exist under the hood or anywhere else...

I use lots of software from many sources, some Windows, many third party, many open source and some even Apple. My criterion is not the company from which it comes, but does it fulfil my requirements. And iTunes does not.

I'm all for simplicity and the Apple way, but NOT if it means wresting control from ME the user

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 06:06 AM
The shuffle does not update unless you have changed something. I have my shuffle in the source list, if I add a song to that when it is not plugged in then when I do plug it in I expect that change to be carried over to the shuffle.

If I have not made any changes then no changes are made on the shuffle.

The reason yours is doing this is because there is something wrong with it.

And it does take about 5 seconds. I plug it in, it looks at the source list to see if I have chosen to add any songs to the shuffle, checks the playcounts of the songs I have loaded on the shuffle and carries these over to the songs in my computer library. If I have made any changes it updates ONLY the songs I have added, it leaves the ones already on there alone - updating songs takes a little while but only if I have selected to do so.

In summary, the shuffle only updates if I want it to. Yours updates even if you don't tell it to. This means there is something wrong and you should call Apple. Your iTunes problems we cannot help you with so you should call Apple.

I have used iTunes on both PC and Mac and have never found any problems with it. Something has gone wrong on YOUR machine, it is not an intrinsic function of the software, just one of those things that happen and it is the reason Apple support exists.

That's it from me.

nomad01
Nov 2, 2005, 06:21 AM
"iTunes rocks. You are a poor Windows user!"

Nobody on here has told you that though so why kick off?

My iTunes library is on my new Dell PC. Before that, it was on my old Dell PC. My windows PC mainly only exists as a file/music server. I've had to sync a 2nd gen, 3rd gen, 4th gen, iPod photo, nano, shuffle and now a iPod with video with two different XP machines. The only problems I've had were:

1) the nano wasn't recognised by my PC and that was an issue with the nano, not iTunes and
2) When I had my first iPod, iTunes for PCs wasn't available. I had to slum it with X-Play and winMX.

iTunes was made for iPods and for me, it's a blessing. Not perfect, but pretty damn good.

Whatever problems you're having aren't typical otherwise you'd find other people on here with the same problems

As for the magical options you're requesting, the whole point is that if things were working properly, you WOULDN'T need this extra option. I'm guessing that's why the option isn't included.

My criterion is not the company from which it comes, but does it fulfil my requirements. And iTunes does not.

Like I said above, I had an iPod before iTunes was available on windows and I hated using WinMX and X-Play. iTunes really was a godsend. If my Apple experience hadn't been so good I wouldn't have gone back to using Apple computers.

I didn't just download iTunes because it had an Apple logo on it and you have no reason to assume that I did. I downloaded it because it did what I wanted it to do.

I'm sorry that iTunes isn't working exactly how you want it to work but I'm happy you've identified a product that is and wish you the best of luck using it.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 06:22 AM
I am not talking about updating my iPod by replacing my songs. If my iTunes is on and i'm listening to radio for example, then if I plug in my iPod the first thing it does is the update dialog - it may be just refreshing the list and NOT replacing my songs, but the default setting is to update/refresh. Why should this be if my purpose in pluggingin is to ONLY charge it. Even if that is the way it was done, why can't i change it under settings??

However, to say that a library saving dialog is a problem only on my machine is wrong. You haven't faced the problem so you have no idea how annoying it is. Try filling up the drive on which your library is stored and see if you have an easy way out in the settings. The ONLY way to solve it is to uninstall, clean out the registry and reinstall iTunes from scratch, so that it doesn't have any drive, full or otherwise, to go to until I define it during installation. But I am not going to do it until the next update, and hopefully they will sort it out.

Just because thousands of users don't face a particular problem does not mean that the problem doesn't exist, or that its any less real. Nor does it mean that the user is always at fault just because the software came from Apple.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 06:39 AM
Let me put it another way because i really want to understand this. Suppose you were a product developer and you developed product X. Let's forget names and companies altogether.

Now Product X does 2 things when plugged into a USB port

1) It recharges the unit
2) It refreshes/replaces a playlist

What would your default setting be when you plug product X into a USB hub? And would you give the user an option up front?

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 06:43 AM
I am not talking about updating my iPod by replacing my songs. If my iTunes is on and i'm listening to radio for example, then if I plug in my iPod the first thing it does is the update dialog - it may be just refreshing the list and NOT replacing my songs, but the default setting is to update/refresh. Why should this be if my purpose in pluggingin is to ONLY charge it. Even if that is the way it was done, why can't i change it under settings??

However, to say that a library saving dialog is a problem only on my machine is wrong. You haven't faced the problem so you have no idea how annoying it is. Try filling up the drive on which your library is stored and see if you have an easy way out in the settings. The ONLY way to solve it is to uninstall, clean out the registry and reinstall iTunes from scratch, so that it doesn't have any drive, full or otherwise, to go to until I define it during installation. But I am not going to do it until the next update, and hopefully they will sort it out.

Just because thousands of users don't face a particular problem does not mean that the problem doesn't exist, or that its any less real. Nor does it mean that the user is always at fault just because the software came from Apple.

Here's the process:

1. I have selected "Keep this iPod in the source list."
2. My shuffle is over on the couch, it is not plugged in but a representation of the shuffle is in the source list.
3. I purchase some songs on the iTMS and decide that I would like to load them onto the shuffle.
4. I drag these songs onto the shuffle icon in the source list.
5. I go over to the couch and get my shuffle and plug it in.
6. iTunes looks at the source list, looks at the songs on my shuffle and says "OK, so Chundles wants these three new songs to be added to his songs already on the shuffle" and goes about transferring over those songs.
7. It finishes loading those songs and leaves the shuffle to charge.

This is what happens if I don't make any changes:
1. I don't add any songs to the source list.
2. I plug in the iPod.
3. iTunes compares the source list and the songs on the iPod and says "OK, Chundles doesn't want to change anything there, I'll leave it alone, let me just check how many times he has played each song" so it updates playcounts and leaves it to charge.

I don't see what your problem is, if you choose not to change the songs then iTunes doesn't change the songs. It will always however check the playcount of the songs on your shuffle to ensure that they are represented accurately in your music library.

It's not removing any control, you control if it adds songs or not by adding the songs. The "updating" dialogue is just telling you it is checking to see if you do want to update. It doesn't copy songs over everytime if you have not chosen to copy any songs over. Why would you not want to apply any changes if you have made them? That's like saying "yeah I want to eat this sandwich but I don't want it to move down into my stomach until I tell it to."

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 06:46 AM
Let me put it another way because i really want to understand this. Suppose you were a product developer and you developed product X. Let's forget names and companies altogether.

Now Product X does 2 things when plugged into a USB port

1) It recharges the unit
2) It refreshes/replaces a playlist

What would your default setting be when you plug product X into a USB hub?

I would want it to charge AND reflect any changes that I have decided to make. Surprisingly, that's what the shuffle does.

As I have said, when you plug it in it is only checking to see if you have made any changes, that's what the "updating" dialogue means, if you have not changed anything, it won't change anything.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 06:50 AM
I would certainly want it to update stuff if I HAVE made changes. If I haven't, why can't I have just a Plug'n'Charge option - even if it isn't the default option why can't i choose such an option - More so because plugging it into someone elses machine results in chaos and me losing songs with the default option because it PRESUMES I have made changes!!!?

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 06:55 AM
I would certainly want it to update stuff if I HAVE made changes. If I haven't, why can't I have just a Plug'n'Charge option - even if it isn't the default option why can't i choose such an option - More so because plugging it into someone elses machine results in chaos and me losing songs with the default option because it PRESUMES I have made changes!!!?

But if you haven't made changes then it does just plug and charge, when you don't make changes it updates your library's play count and that's it.

When I plug it into another machine it gives me the option to associate the iPod with the library on that machine, if I select "No" then it just charges. It won't let you move any songs to it with iTunes on that machine but it won't wipe the music that's already there.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 06:56 AM
The answer I got to this from a friend was that this prevents piracy, so you can't transfer your songs from your iPod into someone elses machine.

BUT, it just replaced all my songs with pirated copies of someone elses music didn't it??

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 07:02 AM
And no, i plugged it into my friend's machine with his iTunes not even being the default media player. We were doing some work, so we were not even PLANNING to open iTunes for anything. However, I did plug in my iPod to charge it in his USB port. And by the time we finished our work and I unplugged my iPod, I had lost all my music and got a whole lot of Bon Jovi in return...no dialogs, no warnings, NOTHING. Just the fact that the iTunes Helper module was lurking in the background. Finally when I opened iTunes in disgust to see what the settings were, my iPod even showed up in his iTunes with a new name - Praveen Bhat's iPod - that's my friends name. And his settings were all bang on. Do NOT start iTunes when iPod is plugged in and all the rest of it...

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 07:10 AM
And no, i plugged it into my friend's machine with his iTunes not even being the default media player. We were doing some work, so we were not even PLANNING to open iTunes for anything. However, I did plug in my iPod to charge it in his USB port. And by the time we finished our work and I unplugged my iPod, I had lost all my music and got a whole lot of Bon Jovi in return...no dialogs, no warnings, NOTHING. Just the fact that the iTunes Helper module was lurking in the background. Finally when I opened iTunes in disgust to see what the settings were, my iPod even showed up in his iTunes with a new name - Praveen Bhat's iPod - that's my friends name. And his settings were all bang on. Do NOT start iTunes when iPOD is plugged in and all the rest of it...

iTunes may not be the default media player but if you have it selected to open when the shuffle is plugged in it will open. The fact that it associated the shuffle automatically without giving you any options (I ALWAYS get the "do you want to associate this iPod with xxx's library" whenever I plug my shuffle into someone else's machine) suggests that there is something wrong with your shuffle and you need to call Apple.

Just so you can check this, my settings are:

Open iTunes when this iPod is attached: YES
Keep this iPod in the source list: YES
Only update checked songs: NO
Convert to 128kbps: NO
Sound Check: NO
Disk Mode: YES

My Autofill settings are:

All boxes unchecked.

Reflect these settings then try plugging into another machine, if you still don't get the "Do you want to associate this iPod with xxx's library?" then that means something is wrong and you should call Apple.

lucas
Nov 2, 2005, 07:12 AM
best troll ever... i cant believe he has so many of you in such a state

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 07:13 AM
I don't know about the Source list part of it, but his setting was definitely NOT to start iTunes when the iPOD is plugged in.The pointis a Plug n charge option would effectively prevent all this, especially if the plug n charge setting is saved in the iPOD itself and leaves iTunes outof the picture

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 07:15 AM
I don't know about the Source list part of it, but his setting was definitely NOT to start iTunes when the iPOD is plugged in.The pointis a Plug n charge option would effectively prevent all this, especially if the plug n charge setting is saved in the iPOD itself and leaves iTunes outof the picture

HIS setting on HIS iPod?

What about YOUR setting on YOUR iPod. This is carried in the individual iPod, not the iTunes software.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 07:21 AM
My setting on my iPOD was to leave iTunes out of the picture COMPLETELY because of the library save problem which was forcing iTunes to mindlessly replace all my iPod songs whenever i plugged it in to MY machine.

The point is, one simple option can prevent all of this. And one more simple option for allowing me to point to a free folder intead of asking whether I want to see this message again or not, when I try to save my library - can completely prevent the other problem from ever occurring even if no one wants a simple plug n charge option, except ole lunatic Me!

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 07:30 AM
My setting on my iPOD was to leave iTunes out of the picture COMPLETELY because of the library save problem which was forcing iTunes to mindlessly replace all my iPod songs whenever i plugged it in to MY machine.

Which is a problem inherent in YOUR machine and as such is well beyond a "simple option" iTunes has had something corrupted on your machine and to sort it out you need to call Apple support.

I am not denying that this problem exists as you obviously have it, I am saying that it is a function of your machine because it is only affecting you. Apple software, as with any software, suffers from bugs every now and then, I am not saying that Apple is perfect, I am saying that your machine is most likely at fault, whether you have done something or not there is probably some setting deep within iTunes or even the *shudder* registry that has changed and you will need to reapply some things. Apple can help you with this, so call them.

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 07:33 AM
My setting on my iPOD was to leave iTunes out of the picture COMPLETELY because of the library save problem which was forcing iTunes to mindlessly replace all my iPod songs whenever i plugged it in to MY machine.

The point is, one simple option can prevent all of this. And one more simple option for allowing me to point to a free folder intead of asking whether I want to see this message again or not, when I try to save my library - can completely prevent the other problem from ever occurring even if no one wants a simple plug n charge option, except ole lunatic Me!

What do you mean when you say "save your library?" I have never seen this option. I keep all my music on the one HDD and let iTunes organise it, I haven't touched the file system in nearly a year because I haven't needed to.

If you are talking about using multiple libraries then the option is there to point iTunes to another one by selecting it in the Advanced preference pane.

If you are using multiple libraries in this way then iTunes looks at the shuffle and sees that the songs on there are no longer in your library (if you have switched between syncing) and says that you don't want them on your iPod either, it won't add any songs though.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 07:41 AM
1) Apple support is notoriously poor here in India especially if the product is not the usual Apple Mac computer. The official Apple showroom in Bangalore the so called IT capital of India didn't even have an iPod headphone in stock when i lost mine and wanted to buy another - this despite the fact that the iPOD is selling like hot cakes all over.

2) I uninstalled 5 and reinstalled 6 and the problems persisted,when they should have gone - the uninstall is NOT clean.

3) Simple options that give me some control can prevent such drastic outcomes even if my iTunes gets corrupt or whatever.

4) I will reinstall iTunes with their next release after cleaning out my registry once more just to make sure... right now I am blissfully happy with the Winamp plug in, it even updates the songs into the iPOD much faster when I choose to replace songs.

5) I will try and replicate this whole process the next time, after I get a clean install - and see what happens - I will perform a full and valid test.

6) i still think JUST a plug n charge option without any refreshing or checking is worth it for power users.

7) Many thanks to all of you for your help and suggestions

Ciao

gekko513
Nov 2, 2005, 07:43 AM
My question is, why can't this setting be changed in iTunes especially when the USB will be used for charging alone on many occasions?
That setting can be changed in iTunes. The other posters have tried to tell you that. However, it doesn't seem to work on your iTunes install.

You say you get an error message when you install iTunes. I would suggest that you concentrate on finding a solution to fix that first. If you're able to fix it all the other problems may go away with it.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 07:54 AM
I DO not and DID not get any error messages while installing iTunes. And just to explain, You do not HAVE to let iTunes decide how you store your music. You can have a collection that is years old in many familiar directories, and make iTunes ONLY act as library without reordering or reshuffling your music drives. In this case, it saves the library file that it creates (called library.xml or some such in Windows) somewhere and shows you all your music as one seamless library even though your storage may be in multiple drives all over yr system.

In essence, I DID NOT move all my music into the iTUNES folder and rearrange all my familiar paths to my music. When you have 50 GB of music collected over 10 years you will realise it is not the best thing to do.

One fine day, the secret drive where it stored this file got full (I presume) because it started showing me this message every 10 seconds.

"The iTunes Music Library File cannot be saved. The disk you are attempting to use is full." And then very stupidly it continues "Removing files and emptying the recycle bin will free up additional space." And then a check box saying "Don't warn me again."

I am telling you the exact phrasing, word for word in the dialog I got.

Firstly, when it is as critical as saving the library file, it should give me an option to point to another drive with free space immediately. It simply does not. And there are no options in settings to change this manually either. I tried changing it to the empty iTunes folder that it creates by default, presuming you would want it to resort and rearrange your music - this is possible in Settings, under Advanced - Itunes Music Folder location. No such luck. Every time I put on my iTunes, this message would pop every 10 seconds or so. i uninstalled and resinstalled iTunes, and NO change.

Assuming such a problem is possible, and the solution not built into the settings, a simple plug n charge option would have saved me no end of heartache...

rjphoto
Nov 2, 2005, 08:02 AM
Why is no one talking about providing a single click option to disable auto-update or synching? Why should I indulge in workarounds to do something which is my prerogative in the first place - ie deciding what i should listen to, for how long and when...??

Amazing how even a blatantly silly feature is treated as gospel by Apple zealots!

And no, iTUNES on my friend's machine did not open any dialog box. And even on my machine, if i as much as slip it into the USB port for charging, it starts the iPOD update process immediately, REGARDLESS of the fact that I want to CHARGE my Shuffle, NOT REPLACE my music.

I haven't used the Shuffle on a Windows machine, so help me out with some info.

First, what version of Windows and iTunes are you using.

When you disconnect the Shuffle does it stay in the Source list? If not this should be able to be set in the Prefs.

In the Win. iTunes (while connected or left in the Source list) can you choose which Playlist to Autofill from? If so, make a playlist that you want loaded and choose "Autofill From".

However, your main problem should (as you say) be a simple fix in the Prefs. Us ZEALOTS are trying to help, but since most of use only Apple computers we don't have anything to compare too. (Any of you Win guys want to step in and help?)

Personally, I do exactly what you are wanting to do between an OLD G4 TiBook and an eMac. The TiBook loads the songs, but since it is USB1 I use the eMac to charge on USB2 with no reloading required. When I connect to the eMac it ALWAYS ask if I want to associate the Shuffle with the eMac's iTunes. I just click "No" and it starts charging.

Give me a day or 2 to "borrow" my son's shuffle and I'll see if I can recreate your problem at work.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 08:07 AM
AND, you can change the setting and tell iTunes not to update the iPOD. But even if you have made no changes at all, it first DOES do the playlist check or refresh or what you called checking the playcount or whatever, BEFORE it starts charging

All I am saying is give me the option to decide whether it should start doing anything at all when i plug my iPOD in. thats what I like about the Winamp plug in. It presumes I am intelligent enough to decide what I should do with my music and simply opens up the iPOD and shows me the songs in it currently. Any updating or ANYTHING else I want to do, is only when I decide to tell it to do so.

Sure, make it a default option to autoupdate or refresh playcounts if you want, but also give me the option to disable it if I choose, because more often than not I will be simply charging the iPOD, not updatingit and refreshing the playcount just then is of no consequence to me.

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 08:10 AM
I DO not and DID not get any error messages while installing iTunes. And just to explain, You do not HAVE to let iTunes decide how you store your music. You can have a collection that is years old in many familiar directories, and make iTunes ONLY act as library without reordering or reshuffling your music drives. In this case, it saves the library file that it creates (called library.xml or some such in Windows) somewhere and shows you all your music as one seamless library even though your storage may be in multiple drives all over yr system.

In essence, I DID NOT move all my music into the iTUNES folder and rearrange all my familiar paths to my music. When you have 50 GB of music collected over 10 years you will realise it is not the best thing to do.

One fine day, the secret drive where it stored this file got full (I presume) because it started showing me this message every 10 seconds.

"The iTunes Music Library File cannot be saved. The disk you are attempting to use is full." And then very stupidly it continues "Removing files and emptying the recycle bin will free up additional space." And then a check box saying "Don't warn me again."

I am telling you the exact phrasing, word for word in the dialog I got.

Firstly, when it is as critical as saving the library file, it should give me an option to point to another drive with free space immediately. It simply does not. And there are no options in settings to change this manually either. I tried changing it to the empty iTunes folder that it creates by default, presuming you would want it to resort and rearrange your music - this is possible in Settings, under Advanced - Itunes Music Folder location. No such luck. Every time I put on my iTunes, this message would pop every 10 seconds or so. i uninstalled and resinstalled iTunes, and NO change.

Assuming such a problem is possible, and the solution not built into the settings, a simple plug n charge option would have saved me no end of heartache...

So what you want is a tonne of cure because you won't call Apple for an ounce of prevention?

You want them to build an option into iTunes on the odd chance that a problem occurs that a user won't seek help for - riiight...

Wouldn't you rather the big problem fixed?

gekko513
Nov 2, 2005, 08:11 AM
OK, so it wasn't an error message during installation, but why don't you free up some space on the drive that's full?

Here's something that shows how the Autofill can be configured from Apples support pages link (http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=165244):
To prevent Autofill from replacing any of your manual changes to the iPod shuffle playlist, make sure the "Replace all songs when Autofilling" checkbox at the bottom of the iTunes window is not checked. When this checkbox is not checked, clicking Autofill adds new songs that meet the criteria set at the bottom of the window without replacing any songs you've added to the list by dragging.
You can also turn off autofill entirely according to this other Apple page link (http://www.apple.com/ipodshuffle/autosync.html):
Transfer Your Music Automatically

Once you connect iPod shuffle to your Mac or PC, iTunes automatically updates its contents. iTunes becomes aware that you’ve connected iPod shuffle and displays it in the Source column. You can see your music and playlists at a glance. For the ultimate exercise in uncertainty, let iTunes randomly Autofill your iPod shuffle. iTunes creates a playlist that fits your style — and your iPod shuffle’s capacity. For finer control over your portable music collection, set Autofill to add specific playlists or add higher-rated songs first. Or turn Autofill off and manually select the songs you want to tote on your iPod shuffle.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 08:14 AM
I am a power user (well as much power as Windows allows me), and I use all kinds of software from stuff like google Earth all the way up to Photoshop and Dreamweaver for my work, with no problems, no crashes. I use Win XP with SP2 and all other service updates installed - a fairly new P4 machine with 512 MB RAM. My problem started with iTunes 5. Continued with iTunes 6. I uninstalled and reinstalled 6, and the problem stayed.

Now I got the solution, which is clear up the registry before reinstalling because the uninstall is NOT clean - but I am so pissed off that I will wait for the next release before trying it. I like the Winamp plug in - the whole process is in my control from the moment I see the iPOD appearing in the menu to when I finish updating or refreshing or whatever.

Sure, iTunes has taken that headache off your chest and does it automatically, but is it too much to ask to at least let me decide which way i want to do it??

gekko513
Nov 2, 2005, 08:20 AM
AND, you can change the setting and tell iTunes not to update the iPOD. But even if you have made no changes at all, it first DOES do the playlist check or refresh or what you called checking the playcount or whatever, BEFORE it starts charging

All I am saying is give me the option to decide whether it should start doing anything at all when i plug my iPOD in. thats what I like about the Winamp plug in. It presumes I am intelligent enough to decide what I should do with my music and simply opens up the iPOD and shows me the songs in it currently. Any updating or ANYTHING else I want to do, is only when I decide to tell it to do so.

Sure, make it a default option to autoupdate or refresh playcounts if you want, but also give me the option to disable it if I choose, because more often than not I will be simply charging the iPOD, not updatingit and refreshing the playcount just then is of no consequence to me.
:eek: Now I'm really confused :confused:
You say that you have been able to disable Autofill all along and that your only complaint is that iTunes updates the playcounts and stuff of your songs. If that's the case I think it's fair to say that you're just trolling.

Secondly, if Winamp works the way you like, why don't you just stick to Winamp. :confused:

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 08:24 AM
Gekko, if there is one thing that was turned off from the day i got my iPOD it was autofill. Deciding what I want to listen to, when and for how long is MY CHOICE as far as I am concerned, not that of any software even from God.

Obviously it was not turned off by Itunes despite my changes because of the library save problem.

Now you've brought out another point. As a result of this, any new playlist that i created would not stay in the iPOD. The moment I plugged it in, the autorefresh would start and it would replace it with whatever was in the iPOD before the save library problem started, and delete all the stuff I put into it manually alter on.

Presuming that this is a logical thing to do, then why didn't it get stuck looking for this original playlist when I plugged it into my friends drive.

Like i keep saying, all I want is an option to change this autorefresh thing. If an iPod isbeing plugged in for charging as well as for refreshing or updating or replacing I think I should make the choice of what it should do first - not iTunes

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 08:26 AM
Yeah, it's weird, and the thing is, as soon as you plug the shuffle in it charges, the playcount check occurs while the shuffle is charging but as soon as iTunes opens.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 08:27 AM
Gekko, my complaint is NOT that iTunes updates playcounts - it should do it. My complaint is that I should make the choice to let it do so, ESPECIALLY because plugging it into a USB port has 2 fucntions - charging AND updating.

"Do you want to update your iPOD? Yes/NO. Remember this setting till I change it"

Assume I am listening to radio on iTunes and it is by chance on Autofill. I have made some changes in the songs I have on my iPod but I WANT those songs to stay for just a while longer. However, I need to plug it in for charging WITH my iTunes open and my radio on. Now what? Lose the songs I've painstakingly filled manually??

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 08:30 AM
All of your problems are being caused by iTunes' little hiccup. I had a problem with iTunes Helper not recognising my iPod on my parent's PC when I installed iTunes 5.

But instead of saying "waaa, why won't iTunes give me an option to change this?" I went to Apple, found the solution to the problem, applied these things (involved trashing some things from the iPod folder on the Hardrive) and all worked well.

Have you even looked at Apple.com's support pages? They have a lot of info there.

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 08:31 AM
Gekko, my complaint is NOT that iTunes updates playcounts - it should do it. My complaint is that I should make the choice to let it do so, ESPECIALLY because plugging it into a USB port has 2 fucntions - charging AND updating

But you have already made that choice, by listening to the song you have changed the playcount, all that happens then is iTunes updates the number of times that song has been played so that your library and smart playlists are up to date. Surely this isn't a bad thing?

balamw
Nov 2, 2005, 08:33 AM
best troll ever... i cant believe he has so many of you in such a state
I was thinking the same thing when I went to bed last night.

B

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 08:46 AM
Sure it can update the playcounts and SURE it is a good thing, but when I WANT to do it, not when iTunes wants to do it. All I am saying is if I am simply charging the iPod, then it should make no changes until I ask it to.

Also because then, any other problem like the library saving one will simply not have any effect on the Shuffle till i rectify the issue with iTunes.

I repeat:
Assume I am listening to radio on iTunes and it is by chance (or choice) on Autofill. I have made some changes in the songs I have on my Shuffle but I WANT those songs to stay for just a while longer. However, I need to plug it in for charging WITH my iTunes open and my radio on. Now what? Lose the songs I've painstakingly filled manually??

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 08:59 AM
All I am saying is if I am simply charging the iPod, then it should make no changes until I ask it to.

It doesn't.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 09:09 AM
It does. It changes the playcounts as you yourself said. All i am saying is when I plug in the iPOD, iTunes should do nothing until I tell it to - or at least give me an option to enable such an action (or non action if you prefer).

This way no iTunes problem or Windows problem can screw up my iPod. If for example, I did have a setting like this, then library problem or no library problem my Shuffle wouldn't go through hell and high water trying to preserve the music that i filled manually.

balamw
Nov 2, 2005, 09:11 AM
Gekko, if there is one thing that was turned off from the day i got my iPOD it was autofill. Deciding what I want to listen to, when and for how long is MY CHOICE as far as I am concerned, not that of any software even from God.

Obviously it was not turned off by Itunes despite my changes because of the library save problem.

Like i keep saying, all I want is an option to change this autorefresh thing. If an iPod isbeing plugged in for charging as well as for refreshing or updating or replacing I think I should make the choice of what it should do first - not iTunes

vinieux, no offense, you appear to be they type of "power user" that I have encountered many times in my travels through windows land.

One guy I know insisted on setting up his Win2K systems with a 512MB C:\ partition, and a dedicated swap partition, a programs partition and a data partition, because that's the way he did all his NT 3.5.1 boxes, and that's the way HE wanted it. unfortunately many windows programs make assumptions about where they MUST be installed (on C: of course), so he quickly ran into trouble filling up C:\ and corrupting his registry.

Or the "power user" who overclocked his machine to the minimum requirements for an app and then wonders how they coulr release such an underperforming/unstable app. Actually, that was the same guy. :rolleyes:

You insist on control, change everyting in the software and don't give it essential resources (free space) and then you turn around and blame the hardware. :confused:

B

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 09:20 AM
I am a power user by virtue of what i do. My machine is not overclocked, nor do I have fancy partitions.

However, if I use Photoshop, I use it for both print and web graphics, making me utilise it much more. Similarly, i have 50GB of music, and I sometimes broadcast music on Shoutcast, and when I use music related software I use it to the full as an advanced user.

I certainly don't blame the hardware either. I think iPods rock and rule. iTunes is the problem - and iTunes for Windows if that makes any of you happier.

The control I am asking for seems to me to be logical. If a USB port has two completely divergent purposes for the iPOD, i think simply plugging it in should NOT necessarily mean it has to update anything - playcounts or otherwise. I think I should make that choice.

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 09:31 AM
I am a power user by virtue of what i do. My machine is not overclocked, nor do I have fancy partitions.

However, if I use Photoshop, I use it for both print and web graphics, making me utilise it much more. Similarly, i have 50GB of music, and I sometimes broadcast music on Shoutcast, and when I use music related software I use it to the full as an advanced user.

I certainly don't blame the hardware either. I think iPods rock and rule. iTunes is the problem - and iTunes for Windows if that makes any of you happier.

The control I am asking for seems to me to be logical. If a USB port has two completely divergent purposes for the iPOD, i think simply plugging it in should NOT necessarily mean it has to update anything - playcounts or otherwise. I think I should make that choice.

So, have you set it to not open iTunes when attached yet or what?

snowmoon
Nov 2, 2005, 10:34 AM
vinieux,

I have to ask since it has been talked about over and over again..

Why won't you contact apple? And don't give me the line that support in India sucks since you obviously have internet access and can interact with them over email.

balamw
Nov 2, 2005, 10:34 AM
For future reference, and not necessarily aimed at vinieux:

The tutorial on controlling your shuffle's sync behavior is quite good IMHO.

http://www.apple.com/support/ipod/tutorial/ip_gettingstarted_t7.html
http://www.apple.com/support/ipod/tutorial/ip_gettingstarted_t3.html

As Chundles pointed out make sure the "start iTunes when this iPod is connected" (or whatever the phrasing is)enable disk mode and manually manage songs and playlists, keep the iPod in the sources list and you bascially have a USB memory stick that you can add/remove tracks frominiTunes and still use as a flash drive. You will have to manually eject it just like any other memory stick.

B

balamw
Nov 2, 2005, 10:36 AM
And don't give me the line that support in India sucks since you obviously have internet access and can interact with them over email.
Wait a second! You mean that US support isn't in India? :p ;) :rolleyes:

B

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 12:58 PM
I didn't mean US support isn't in India, just that I presumed since no forum has helped me yet, or any of the reading I have done, it would involve a person coming home, not just online help - and that wouldn't be any good here for sure. I did have a Mac user come home and he could do nothing with any of the settings. In fact I demonstrated the problem to him right in front of his eyes.

And why must I keep repeatng myself? My settings are all ok, they were getting buggered up by the fact that iTunes had nowhere to save those settings once the library problem started.

Which is why i keep saying, if I had that one little option, none of the other problems would have mattered. iTunes inability to save my Shuffle setting onto the iPod or onto itself is what made it go into a loop. The option to auto update my playcounts whenever i plugged it in is what caused the problem to begin with.

Because each time I manually transferred songs onto the Shuffle, and iTunes couldn't save those settings wherever it wanted to, every time I stuck my iPod in it would start the playcount update, assume on its own that changes had been made (NOT realising that those changes were not changes actually but the playlist it could not save the last time) and then presume my iPod needed updating and replace the songs anyways.

And if this same problem could be responsible for my friends laptop assuming that it was his own iPod when he doesn't even own one, and replacing my songs with his, all the more reason i think I should have the ability to prevent any autoupdate of songs or playcounts - at least in the advanced settings if not up front.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 01:11 PM
The other problem is that if the iPod isnt in the USB port, one can't see the iPod settings at all or make any changes to them.

So assuming my settings were all wrong, by the time I plugged in the iPOD and went as fast as I could to the iPod settings, it would have already started the update and begun updating my songs. There was no way I could have won that battle without having a clear option NOT to start anything till I specifically told iTunes to.

Chundles
Nov 2, 2005, 01:14 PM
You're having these problems because you won't get the library problem fixed. You are complaining that Apple don't provide an option to workaround a problem the end-user refuses to fix.

Go get the big problem fixed instead of hanging around here whinging. The next time you post something bemoaning the shuffle due to your unwillingness to repair the cause of the problem I will be reporting you to the mods.

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 01:26 PM
And Chundels, the first thing i did when i got my ipod even before the problem started with the library saving was to disengage auto filling and NOT to start iTunes when the shuffle was plugged in.

Now however, I have given up on experiments, I tried enough of them - I now use the Winamp Plugin.

I will try reinstalling iTunes only after the next release, and then if you wish I can let you know how it works out if and when I try to recreate the problem. I can tell u for sure that even if there is NO problem whatsoever, I would still prefer iTunes not update ANYTHING from playcounts to playlists without my express permission.

Till then I'm out of here...

vinieux
Nov 2, 2005, 01:33 PM
And I did try to fix the library problem by reinstalling. It didn't work cos the uninstall is not clean, which was when I decided to forget the whole thing and go for the winamp plugin, rather than uninstall yet again, clean out the registry, an then reinstall all over again.

This is my last post folks. And thanks. At least i understood the problem better.

snowmoon
Nov 2, 2005, 02:00 PM
Contact APPLE SUPPORT!

I am beginning to believe you won't contact apple because your shuffle was obtained through less than savory channels.

bousozoku
Nov 2, 2005, 02:23 PM
I think this thread has run its course. If you really wanted it to work, you would do something about it instead of typing and complaining. Please don't consider opening another thread about this same issue.