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cheesemanpl
Jun 12, 2013, 02:00 PM
I was about do a clean install of 10.8 on my early 2011 15" MBP, but since 10.9 DP came out, I did an upgrade to try it out before wiping everything.

Turns out I can't downgrade now... When loading the installer from a USB stick, the :apple: logo above the spinning wheel changes into a prohibitive sign (slashed circle) after a while, and it never loads. I tried running the installer from the hard drive just to see if it runs, but got the "software cannot be installed on this computer" error. So I wiped my hard drive, but I still keep getting the prohibitive sign.

Any ideas why this could be happening? Could the 10.9 installer have changed the EFI somehow? Is there any way to force the 10.8 installer to load? I'm currently stuck with a largely non-functional system, as some critical apps don't run or keep crashing on 10.9...

EDIT: By downgrading I mean doing a clean install, not installing over the existing system.

daleski75
Jun 12, 2013, 02:07 PM
Try doing a PRAM reset

matt2053
Jun 12, 2013, 02:12 PM
I successfully erased my drive and installed 10.8 after having been on 10.9.

Do you have filevault enabled?

cheesemanpl
Jun 12, 2013, 02:12 PM
Tried resetting the PRAM, hasn't helped, unfortunately...

EDIT: I don't have FileVault enabled.

BaggieBoy
Jun 12, 2013, 02:31 PM
I successfully erased my drive and installed 10.8 after having been on 10.9.
Same here, restored from Time Machine backup on a Time Capsule without any problems.

Jovian9
Jun 12, 2013, 03:23 PM
Have you tried booting into recovery (cmd-r) and using disk utility to wipe the hard drive? After that reinstall Mountain Lion from the built-in recovery option.

cheesemanpl
Jun 12, 2013, 03:36 PM
The problem is I now have a 10.9 recovery partition instead of a 10.8 one...

I've found some more info on the prohibitive sign icon, and incompatible internal components could be the cause. I have swapped my SuperDrive for an Optibay and installed new RAM since the system was last installed. Do you think temporarily removing the Optibay or swapping the RAM could help?

digitalfx
Jun 12, 2013, 07:42 PM
This is correct . Same issue here.
I installed 10.9 on rMBP and had a flaky install where it would just loop to log in screen.

So I tried doing a clean install back to ML and I get the same symbol

I can restore a TM backup, but it won't let me do a clean install

I also have the 10.9 restore now, so no love returning to ML short of a TM restore

bibyfok
Jun 13, 2013, 01:54 AM
Before installing 10.9 you should have done a clone using CCC, which backups the recovery partition…
Now you have to use a USB/CD with 10.8 on it to boot, use diskutil to repartition (1 partition) and format (to break the 10.9 recovery)
Then you install 10.8 and restore from TimeMachine.

Never install a beta, especially OS, when you don't know how to restore…

(I managed to restore by formatting and restoring with CCC: Boot from the clone and copy from the clone to the internal)

cheesemanpl
Jun 13, 2013, 03:52 AM
Now you have to use a USB/CD with 10.8 on it to boot, use diskutil to repartition (1 partition) and format (to break the 10.9 recovery)

Thanks! It turns out it was the 10.9 recovery partition that prevented the installer from loading. I repartitioned the drive instead of just wiping the main partition and everything loads smoothly now.

maflynn
Jun 13, 2013, 05:06 AM
^^ That's good to know, I was wondering if the recovery partition was the cause.

When I'm messing with 10.8 and wanting a clean install I make sure the recovery partition is removed. I wish apple would show it, just so we know its there (or not).

bibyfok
Jun 13, 2013, 05:26 AM
^^ That's good to know, I was wondering if the recovery partition was the cause.

When I'm messing with 10.8 and wanting a clean install I make sure the recovery partition is removed. I wish apple would show it, just so we know its there (or not).

Just use the partition tool to do "1 partition" and the recovery will be removed ;)

maflynn
Jun 13, 2013, 05:39 AM
That's what I do, but since its a real partition it would be nice to see it. Apple should trust its customers a little more :)

lcmazza
Jun 13, 2013, 07:20 AM
That's what I do, but since its a real partition it would be nice to see it. Apple should trust its customers a little more :)

You can unhide this partition, but that's not so straightforward as opening Disk Utility like you always do. Anyway, if the user messes up the recovery partition, then Apple support gets a lot more complicated. :D

HenryDJP
Jun 13, 2013, 10:48 AM
That's what I do, but since its a real partition it would be nice to see it. Apple should trust its customers a little more :)

LOL, at least I think that was sarcasm. :D. Just a hunch, but I'll bet many of the MR members installing Mavericks and talking about it here are not Developers. ;)

blueroom
Jun 13, 2013, 09:22 PM
LOL, at least I think that was sarcasm. :D. Just a hunch, but I'll bet many of the MR members installing Mavericks and talking about it here are not Developers. ;)

It's what I hate about an OS never meant for anyone but software developers; the amount of chatter by impatient toadies who torrented it, buggered their devices and complain about it in the forums.

chown33
Jun 13, 2013, 09:33 PM
That's what I do, but since its a real partition it would be nice to see it. Apple should trust its customers a little more :)

For some time, Disk Utility has had a Debug menu. Enable it with this command-line in Terminal:
defaults write com.apple.DiskUtility DUDebugMenuEnabled 1

Then launch Disk Utility.app and look in the Debug menu.

In at least Mtn Lion and Snow Leopard (which I checked), there is a "Show every partition" menu-item. Choose it and it will gain a checkmark, and the list shows every partition. E.g. disk0s1 is the EFI partition.

One can also use the command-line to list every partition:
diskutil list

hoosier205
Jun 13, 2013, 10:02 PM
Any ideas why this could be happening?

I think I know why: http://www.tuaw.com/2013/06/13/psa-if-youre-not-a-developer-dont-install-developer-betas-on/

Tubamajuba
Jun 13, 2013, 10:54 PM
It's what I hate about an OS never meant for anyone but software developers; the amount of chatter by impatient toadies who torrented it, buggered their devices and complain about it in the forums.

Some people do complain... but I personally have no problem with people asking for help if they don't whine and act as if their problem is Apple's fault. The OP here was inquisitive, not demanding. I appreciate that kind of attitude, as it's sorely lacking on the internet.

Chairman Plow
Jun 14, 2013, 10:54 AM
I have a thumb drive set up as my backup ML installer. Powered up while holding the option key to boot from the USB stick, and used Disk Utility to erase the hard drive (getting rid of the 10.9 recovery in the process). Fresh install of ML and back in business. :cool:

SantaRosa2.2
Jun 14, 2013, 11:16 AM
I have a thumb drive set up as my backup ML installer. Powered up while holding the option key to boot from the USB stick, and used Disk Utility to erase the hard drive (getting rid of the 10.9 recovery in the process). Fresh install of ML and back in business. :cool:

That's how you do it. Then if you kept your last Mountain Lion Backup you simply use Migration Assistant to recover your previous state in Mountain Lion. :cool:

r0k
Jun 14, 2013, 11:28 AM
I downloaded Mavericks and decided to install it in a Virtualbox. I found out THAT wasn't going to work so I had to clean stuff off a "spare" USB drive I had sitting around so I could install it on that thing. But before I did anything else, I created a 10.9 install USB stick. I don't know why Apple is making it harder for us to make our own sticks. It's frustrating.

I had to go in and change finder's settings to show hidden files. I then had to go find "base system.dmg" and restore THAT to a usb stick instead of restoring the entire installESD.dmg. As if this wasn't enough, I had to go delete a sym link to the packages directory and drag and drop the real packages directory where the sym link had been. Sorry I'm not in front of my MBP so these steps are from memory. If you google for Mavericks USB I'm sure you'll find the real instructions.

Anyway, I bring this up to remind you a developer preview OS should NEVER be installed over your "real" OS. These things can be buggy and who knows, they might be time bombed and you'll be faced with trying to buy the real OS only to find the app store in the DP is broken and you can't buy it. :eek:

I'm glad I found this thread as sooner or later I'll want to wipe that "spare" drive and make it bootable for some other OS I want to play with. I'd much rather play with DP OSs in a Virtualbox than devote real hardware to them.

If anyone's thinking of tinkering with iOS 7, think twice as Apple warns you can NOT roll back to iOS 6. It probably has something to do with the new kill switch technology built into iOS7. Allowing a roll-back to iOS6 might provide a thief a back door to get the device in a sellable state.

bcaslis
Jun 14, 2013, 03:13 PM
You can roll back to iOS6 from iOS7. This is a standard disclaimer that Apple says with every iOS release. This is to the firmware being updated and there is chance it could make the previous OS not work. Apple doesn't guarantee rolling back to work, but they don't do anything to prevent it.

HenryDJP
Jun 14, 2013, 03:25 PM
I downloaded Mavericks and decided to install it in a Virtualbox. I found out THAT wasn't going to work so I had to clean stuff off a "spare" USB drive I had sitting around so I could install it on that thing. But before I did anything else, I created a 10.9 install USB stick. I don't know why Apple is making it harder for us to make our own sticks. It's frustrating.

I had to go in and change finder's settings to show hidden files. I then had to go find "base system.dmg" and restore THAT to a usb stick instead of restoring the entire installESD.dmg. As if this wasn't enough, I had to go delete a sym link to the packages directory and drag and drop the real packages directory where the sym link had been. Sorry I'm not in front of my MBP so these steps are from memory. If you google for Mavericks USB I'm sure you'll find the real instructions.

Anyway, I bring this up to remind you a developer preview OS should NEVER be installed over your "real" OS. These things can be buggy and who knows, they might be time bombed and you'll be faced with trying to buy the real OS only to find the app store in the DP is broken and you can't buy it. :eek:

I'm glad I found this thread as sooner or later I'll want to wipe that "spare" drive and make it bootable for some other OS I want to play with. I'd much rather play with DP OSs in a Virtualbox than devote real hardware to them.

If anyone's thinking of tinkering with iOS 7, think twice as Apple warns you can NOT roll back to iOS 6. It probably has something to do with the new kill switch technology built into iOS7. Allowing a roll-back to iOS6 might provide a thief a back door to get the device in a sellable state.

Maybe it would be to your benefit if you were a real developer rather than tormenting and living to tell us about it here. :rolleyes:

alexking93
Jun 15, 2013, 11:59 AM
Alright - I did it.

I installed the DP of Mavericks on my system and now I can't downgrade. It's so incompatible right now and my machine is running slower.

How can I go about downgrading this?

I have Mountain Lion in the Mac App Store as well is Disk Images of Mountain Lion.

Really appreciate any help!

fhall1
Jun 16, 2013, 05:53 AM
Re-read this thread...the solutions are posted above

inselstudent
Jun 16, 2013, 10:12 AM
If anyone's thinking of tinkering with iOS 7, think twice as Apple warns you can NOT roll back to iOS 6. It probably has something to do with the new kill switch technology built into iOS7. Allowing a roll-back to iOS6 might provide a thief a back door to get the device in a sellable state.

I've read from (apparently ex-)beta users who were able to return to iOS 6. That backdoor you're describing won't work anyway. As soon as iOS 7 goes public, Apple will stop signing iOS 6 restore requests. As long as iOS 6 is still the latest public version of iOS, restore requests to that FW are being signed, which means you can go back to it any time you like. You might have to enter DFU or something, but it should be possible nonetheless.

ArtOfWarfare
Jun 16, 2013, 11:33 AM
It's what I hate about an OS never meant for anyone but software developers; the amount of chatter by impatient toadies who torrented it, buggered their devices and complain about it in the forums.

But if it's out in the open like this, it means someone who should have known better leaked it.

Or not, I guess all you have to do is pay $99, so you just need to have $99 in disposable income and a desire to leak it for whatever reason.

RJCP
Jun 16, 2013, 11:42 AM
Alright - I did it.

I installed the DP of Mavericks on my system and now I can't downgrade. It's so incompatible right now and my machine is running slower.

How can I go about downgrading this?

I have Mountain Lion in the Mac App Store as well is Disk Images of Mountain Lion.

Really appreciate any help!

Question 1: Do you have a bootable installation USB drive of the Mountain Lion? If the answer to this is "yes", then restart your computer, press alt to bring up the boot menu and boot into ML's installation system on your pen. From there, bring up the disk util and wipe your entire hard drive, then go back to initial installer menu, and install ML on your HDD.

If you don't have a ML installation USB, you'll need to create one under Mavericks. You find how to do that in google (just google "creating mountain lion USB recovery).
The important thing is that you DON'T TRY TO DO ANYTHING FROM 10.9'S RECOVERY PARTITION as it will detect that whatever you're trying to install is older and it won't allow you to do it.

PM me if you need more advice.

P.S. to other OP's. If you're so bothered with people making mistakes and don't want to help them, then don't. But please refrain from being sarcastic and shoving in their faces how stupid they are and how you hold the key to the secrets of the universe. If you need to humiliate people in these forums to ascertain your skills, you're a very sad person and I feel very sorry for you. It must be difficult being stuck on a mental age of 9.

modymalay
Jun 16, 2013, 04:13 PM
Question 1: Do you have a bootable installation USB drive of the Mountain Lion? If the answer to this is "yes", then restart your computer, press alt to bring up the boot menu and boot into ML's installation system on your pen. From there, bring up the disk util and wipe your entire hard drive, then go back to initial installer menu, and install ML on your HDD.

If you don't have a ML installation USB, you'll need to create one under Mavericks. You find how to do that in google (just google "creating mountain lion USB recovery).
The important thing is that you DON'T TRY TO DO ANYTHING FROM 10.9'S RECOVERY PARTITION as it will detect that whatever you're trying to install is older and it won't allow you to do it.

PM me if you need more advice.

P.S. to other OP's. If you're so bothered with people making mistakes and don't want to help them, then don't. But please refrain from being sarcastic and shoving in their faces how stupid they are and how you hold the key to the secrets of the universe. If you need to humiliate people in these forums to ascertain your skills, you're a very sad person and I feel very sorry for you. It must be difficult being stuck on a mental age of 9.

Thanks for the help! What I ended up doing just before you posted was I created a new partition, installed ML with no issue, then I am going to delete the old partition and make the new partition my main one. Do you see any issue with that and would you recommend your method of a total wipe and installing off a USB instead?

RJCP
Jun 16, 2013, 04:56 PM
Thanks for the help! What I ended up doing just before you posted was I created a new partition, installed ML with no issue, then I am going to delete the old partition and make the new partition my main one. Do you see any issue with that and would you recommend your method of a total wipe and installing off a USB instead?

That should do it too. My thing with partitions is that I generally dislike doing them, so I avoid it whenever possible. I much prefer having a solid Time Machine backup, wipe everything and then have my computer up and running where I've left it. Especially since OS X introduced recovery partitions I started disliking them even more, especially when you have 2 copies of OSX installed and a recovery partition for each. It's my Virgo nature. I like things simple and organised. :)

modymalay
Jun 16, 2013, 06:05 PM
That should do it too. My thing with partitions is that I generally dislike doing them, so I avoid it whenever possible. I much prefer having a solid Time Machine backup, wipe everything and then have my computer up and running where I've left it. Especially since OS X introduced recovery partitions I started disliking them even more, especially when you have 2 copies of OSX installed and a recovery partition for each. It's my Virgo nature. I like things simple and organised. :)

I may just do that. I usually don't partition but I didn't think of your alternative so I didn't see any other way. I haven't really done anything on my system yet so I might just wipe it again lol. Thanks!

jykim0806
Jun 16, 2013, 09:53 PM
I have 2 questions from this thread:
1. If you restore from the Bootable installation file, does it keep your files from Mavericks?
2. If you do a internet restore (command option r when boot) , does it keep your files from Mavericks?

blueroom
Jun 16, 2013, 11:45 PM
But if it's out in the open like this, it means someone who should have known better leaked it.

Or not, I guess all you have to do is pay $99, so you just need to have $99 in disposable income and a desire to leak it for whatever reason.

Regardless of the source its purpose is to provide a hardware platform for software development. It's not designed for the end user and many features are still in testing, missing or broken.

r0k
Jun 17, 2013, 11:11 AM
Maybe it would be to your benefit if you were a real developer rather than tormenting and living to tell us about it here. :rolleyes:

You seem to have missed the point of my post so I'll create a separate thread. As for my not being a developer, when did I say that?

seekis
Jul 23, 2013, 04:45 AM
I have found the answer, if you are using a June 2013 MacBook Air.

Today after installing the DP4, I noticed a large chunk of drive space missing (89gb free down to 50gb free). So I started nosing around and eventually found over 222k .tmp files holding almost 50gb of data in /var I didn't know what it was, but when I opened the tmp folder Finder would get really sluggish. Attempting to delete these files proved to be damn near impossible so decided I wanted to reload ML.

Anyways, I have been searching too for a way to downgrade and I accidentally found a way.

Prerequisites:

Power: Plug your ish in
WiFi: Make sure you are connected to a decent wireless network before starting

Step 1: Reboot into Recovery mode (cmd + R at boot)

Step 2: Open Disk Utility

Step 3: Select your SSD NOT the partition the OS is installed on

Step 4: Select the Partition function (its over to the right)

Step 5: Under "Volume Scheme" click on the menu where it says "Current"

Step 6: Select "1 Partition" and then hit Apply

Step 7: Exit Disk Utility

Step 8: Reboot your computer

Step 9: When the computer boots the screen will stay grey for a while and then a small white folder with a question mark on it will appear and begin to blink. (the moment I almost ***** myself)

Step 10: Hold down the power button until the machine shuts off

Step 11: Boot into recovery (command + r) and relax as Apple's servers automatically push a restore image onto your MacBook

Step 12: At some point your MacBook will reboot back into Resore Mode and that's where you will be given the option to Reinstall OS X ML

kylerholland
Jan 3, 2014, 10:49 PM
Here is the link to the YouTube video i created that shows you step by step how to go from OS X Mavericks 10.9 to OS X Mountain Lion 10.8. This tutorial took me a long time to figure out so your support will be appreciated! Also, this does not use time machine. All you need is a 8gb usb. THANKS!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWwfx-HK0_M