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MacRumors
Jun 13, 2013, 02:14 PM
http://images.macrumors.com/im/macrumorsthreadlogo.gif (http://www.macrumors.com/2013/06/13/apple-working-with-logitech-and-moga-on-upcoming-mfi-game-controllers/)


During Apple's WWDC keynote, the company revealed that a number of new APIs will be introduced with iOS 7 (http://www.macrumors.com/2013/06/12/upcoming-ios-7-apis-gaming-improvements-multitasking-support-airdrop-and-more/), including support for MFi (Made for iPhone) certified hardware game controllers, which will allow manufacturers to design and release dedicated iOS gaming peripherals.

Some new information on the controllers has been made available to us from a variety of sources, including Czech site Jablickar.cz (http://jablickar.cz/apple-controller-handheld-moga-logitech/), which reports that Apple will team up with both Logitech (http://www.mogaanywhere.com) and MOGA (http://www.mogaanywhere.com) to produce the upcoming controllers. While no details on design have been leaked, Apple did provide two reference images (http://www.macrumors.com/2013/06/12/upcoming-ios-7-apis-gaming-improvements-multitasking-support-airdrop-and-more/) to developers displaying a standalone handheld controller and an iPhone enclosure.

http://images.macrumors.com/article-new/2013/06/mogaprocontroller.jpgA MOGA Controller
Both of the aforementioned companies already produce gaming controllers for use with PCs and Android. Major gaming companies like Gameloft, Mad Finger Games, SEGA, and Rockstar Games all offer support for MOGA's Android controllers, suggesting that support for Apple's upcoming controllers is likely too.

Games that include support for the controllers will be required to support traditional touch-based gaming input as well. Though Apple has prototype controllers on-hand at WWDC, the company is expecting the third party controllers to debut in the fall.

Article Link: Apple Working with Logitech and MOGA on Upcoming MFi Game Controllers (http://www.macrumors.com/2013/06/13/apple-working-with-logitech-and-moga-on-upcoming-mfi-game-controllers/)



Shattentor
Jun 13, 2013, 02:19 PM
Now open the ATV for 3rd party apps and my gaming dream will come true :)

GSPice
Jun 13, 2013, 02:19 PM
All we're asking for is a legal NES emulator.

Speedy Gonzalez
Jun 13, 2013, 02:21 PM
They just need to come up with something like this http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/phonejoy/phonejoy-play-turn-your-phone-into-a-console

Sky Blue
Jun 13, 2013, 02:21 PM
Apple said during one of the WWDC videos that Logitech and MOGA controllers will be out in the fall.

jm001
Jun 13, 2013, 02:27 PM
Off da hook! Sweet!

Bathplug
Jun 13, 2013, 02:29 PM
Controller support is one of my favourite iOS 7 features.

knemonic
Jun 13, 2013, 02:53 PM
Though I agree something is cooking in the oven with the ATV and gaming, I am reluctant to say it will be coming this fall since Apple would have debuted it for their developers last week so they could bring their games to the ATV app store.

afawcett
Jun 13, 2013, 03:05 PM
I hope they make a controller that looks more like the reference images. The Moga is fugly.

donutbagel
Jun 13, 2013, 03:20 PM
All we're asking for is a legal NES emulator.

NES? Uh, no. GBA, GC, and N64 please!

Actually, there is an NES emulator (or at least there was recently) on the App Store disguised as something else. It's called Gridlee I think. It looks like a normal game, but it's an NES emulator with a built-in ROM that you can switch out with something like Diskaid for other ROMs... totally "legal", non-jailbreaking, sanctioned by Apple.

CReimer
Jun 13, 2013, 03:30 PM
Still waiting for Apple to support the original Atari joystick for those of us who only need ONE button on our joysticks. :rolleyes:

Eminemdrdre00
Jun 13, 2013, 03:32 PM
All we're asking for is a legal NES emulator.

With the way the Wii U is selling... Nintendo will have no choice but to release their games on iOS!

nagromme
Jun 13, 2013, 03:33 PM
Now open the ATV for 3rd party apps and my gaming dream will come true :)

Only for certain game types: even Lightning -> HDMI has a slight lag, and AirPlay (AppleTV) has even more (seems to vary depending on the type of action being transmitted). Fine for racing in my view, and puzzles and strategy... not so good for twitch shooters or ultra-precise platformers. (Although the game parameters could be tweaked to help hide the lag for some actions.)

I love gaming from iOS to TV, and would love a controller, but I'm realistic about the limitations. iOS is best on its own screen. (Which would make portable controllers for iPhone/iPad Mini very tempting.)

ikir
Jun 13, 2013, 03:42 PM
Only for certain game types: even Lightning -> HDMI has a slight lag, and AirPlay (AppleTV) has even more (seems to vary depending on the type of action being transmitted). Fine for racing in my view, and puzzles and strategy... not so good for twitch shooters or ultra-precise platformers. (Although the game parameters could be tweaked to help hide the lag for some actions.)

I love gaming from iOS to TV, and would love a controller, but I'm realistic about the limitations. iOS is best on its own screen. (Which would make portable controllers for iPhone/iPad Mini very tempting.)

Hi mate!
If AppleTV itself runs the game, the only little lag would be on the controller itself. For iOS most action games would be lag free only on its screens, but official joypad support would be cool imho.

ArtOfWarfare
Jun 13, 2013, 03:45 PM
With the way the Wii U is selling... Nintendo will have no choice but to release their games on iOS!

What makes you say that? Nintendo has enough cash on hand to run the company at a loss for several years. Nintendo and Apple are a lot alike - neither of them will ever compromise of having control of the entire system. If its their software, it's on their hardware, and if its on their hardware, it's been approved by them if it isn't by them.

portishead
Jun 13, 2013, 03:46 PM
Now open the ATV for 3rd party apps and my gaming dream will come true :)

I didn't even think about Apple TV, that would be awesome. iPad Mini would be an awesome portable gaming machine.

All we're asking for is a legal NES emulator.

I would die happy. But I don't think it will happen. I suspect some developers will release games on their own. Can I just get Tecmo Super Bowl please?

Controller support is one of my favourite iOS 7 features.

Yup, same here!

----------

Only for certain game types: even Lightning -> HDMI has a slight lag, and AirPlay (AppleTV) has even more (seems to vary depending on the type of action being transmitted).

Lightning HDMI connector has lag? That's VERY disappointing. Airplay is understandable as it's wireless, but there shouldn't be lag with a lightning connector to HDMI.

theelysium
Jun 13, 2013, 04:16 PM
I hope someone makes a controller like the Wii U Pro controller. I know sounds weird, but it's a great design. I want that one on my iOS devices.

Apex2206
Jun 13, 2013, 04:25 PM
Now open the ATV for 3rd party apps and my gaming dream will come true :)

ive been thinking this forever whats the hold Up!!!? Apple..:)

ArtOfWarfare
Jun 13, 2013, 04:30 PM
I don't understand anyone who says Apple needs an App Store or an SDK for the Apple TV. Both iOS and OS X already:

1 - Have app stores
2 - Have SDKs
3 - Can stream any content to an Apple TV

There's no need for the Apple TV to have an official App Store - all that Apple needs is for developers to start making more apps that can stream content to the Apple TV and to promote those apps.

iLilana
Jun 13, 2013, 05:00 PM
...the need for a controller for a handheld device. Now if this can be used on the mac I'm in.

Motawa
Jun 13, 2013, 05:04 PM
Apple said during one of the WWDC videos that Logitech and MOGA controllers will be out in the fall.

what video? didnt hear them saying that.

donutbagel
Jun 13, 2013, 05:06 PM
I don't understand anyone who says Apple needs an App Store or an SDK for the Apple TV. Both iOS and OS X already:

1 - Have app stores
2 - Have SDKs
3 - Can stream any content to an Apple TV

There's no need for the Apple TV to have an official App Store - all that Apple needs is for developers to start making more apps that can stream content to the Apple TV and to promote those apps.

Try streaming a game - or anything dynamic besides straight video - to the Apple TV.

Sol
Jun 13, 2013, 05:41 PM
At the rate that iOS devices get hardware upgrades, an iPhone could be more powerful than a PS4 before the next generation of consoles is over.

Namjins
Jun 13, 2013, 05:52 PM
I would die happy. But I don't think it will happen. I suspect some developers will release games on their own. Can I just get Tecmo Super Bowl please?



Not trolling with this, but I just never saw the appeal of Tecmo Super Bowl. I bought it at a yard sale when i was young and never got more than 5 minutes into it.

portishead
Jun 13, 2013, 06:04 PM
Not trolling with this, but I just never saw the appeal of Tecmo Super Bowl. I bought it at a yard sale when i was young and never got more than 5 minutes into it.

troll harder. http://espn.go.com/espn/playbook/story/_/id/9233144/jon-robinson-ranks-best-sports-video-games-all

Some guy
Jun 13, 2013, 06:17 PM
Only for certain game types: even Lightning -> HDMI has a slight lag, and AirPlay (AppleTV) has even more (seems to vary depending on the type of action being transmitted). Fine for racing in my view, and puzzles and strategy... not so good for twitch shooters or ultra-precise platformers. (Although the game parameters could be tweaked to help hide the lag for some actions.)

I love gaming from iOS to TV, and would love a controller, but I'm realistic about the limitations. iOS is best on its own screen. (Which would make portable controllers for iPhone/iPad Mini very tempting.)

He was saying that he wanted apps on his Apple TV, not that he wanted more games to be AirPlay enabled.

They could easily make the controllers work, with no lag, for Apple TV the same way they're going to do with iOS (mobile) devices: by using bluetooth.

Bill Killer
Jun 13, 2013, 06:56 PM
At the rate that iOS devices get hardware upgrades, an iPhone could be more powerful than a PS4 before the next generation of consoles is over.

Laughably wrong.

mslide
Jun 13, 2013, 07:05 PM
Come on, Nintendo. Just give up on mobile gaming hardware and make your games for the iPad.

smellalot
Jun 13, 2013, 07:15 PM
I'm sure this settles it. Apps are coming to Apple TV! Only question is: will it be for existing ATVs too or will the next iteration be bigger, more expensive and get apps exclusively?

Casiotone
Jun 13, 2013, 07:17 PM
Come on, Nintendo. Just give up on mobile gaming hardware and make your games for the iPad.

Considering that the 3DS is selling reasonably well and is way more profitable than the Wii U, I don't see why they would do that.

WilliamLondon
Jun 13, 2013, 08:44 PM
I don't understand anyone who says Apple needs an App Store or an SDK for the Apple TV. Both iOS and OS X already:

1 - Have app stores
2 - Have SDKs
3 - Can stream any content to an Apple TV

There's no need for the Apple TV to have an official App Store - all that Apple needs is for developers to start making more apps that can stream content to the Apple TV and to promote those apps.

I've just recently (for some silly reason) tried the AirPlay Mirroring with a few games, and though a couple of quite good, some don't do well at all. With a controller that'll fix a lot of the issues with some of the games that don't AirPlay mirror well.

However, with these new controllers, which is great and I'm very excited, what Apple requires in their certification programme is that these controllers are *optional* for games to use, that the touch interface will remain the primary way to interact with and control any game or app.

If games were able to run on the ATV, that restriction would obviously be removed, and I'm sure games would be very different if they didn't have the legacy tether to touch to worry about.

It's a first step, it's big and it's exciting - can't wait till autumn to see the first certified controllers and the game that can use them running on iOS 7. :-)

ifij775
Jun 13, 2013, 08:53 PM
If I were to bet on Apple's forthcoming new product category, it would have to be an Apple TV with an App store, but I've been waiting for that for a few years now. It is probably more wishful thinking than anything else.

gorskiegangsta
Jun 13, 2013, 09:12 PM
I don't understand anyone who says Apple needs an App Store or an SDK for the Apple TV. Both iOS and OS X already:

1 - Have app stores
2 - Have SDKs
3 - Can stream any content to an Apple TV

There's no need for the Apple TV to have an official App Store - all that Apple needs is for developers to start making more apps that can stream content to the Apple TV and to promote those apps.

iOS and OS X having "app stores" and SDKs does nothing for Apple TV, since the latter is closed down to all of the above. Additionally, needing an extra several hundred dollar device to "airplay content over" to ATV is a case of asking customers to needlessly bend over backwards and is pretty much the antithesis of "it just works". Apple TV needs its own SDK and a 3rd party app store in order to become its own thing, rather than being a glorified accessory, albeit a well positioned one.

Of course, it is ultimately up to Apple to decide what they want Apple TV to be. IMO, they have a golden opportunity to capture lion's share of living room entertainment devices (incl. consoles) and I believe them expanding APIs to include 3rd party "controllers" as well as Tim Cook's "area of intense interest" comments makes me believe Apple is thinking of moving in that direction.

Taustin Powers
Jun 13, 2013, 11:41 PM
If I can use this to play games like GTA on my iPad, it is an instant buy. Great for long flights!! Just pop up the iPad on a stand on the tray table, and game away!

Touch screen controls are the worst, I've been waiting for decent controller support for years!

charlituna
Jun 14, 2013, 12:00 AM
All we're asking for is a legal NES emulator.

I'd rather have official ports

APlotdevice
Jun 14, 2013, 12:31 AM
Lightning HDMI connector has lag? That's VERY disappointing. Airplay is understandable as it's wireless, but there shouldn't be lag with a lightning connector to HDMI.

Unfortunately the lighting connector cannot handle a raw video signal. To get around this they use the airplay protocol to send a compressed signal to a processor inside the HDMI adapter, which then outputs a proper signal. This naturally introduces a slight lag.

technowar
Jun 14, 2013, 12:42 AM
Unlock the aTV SDK naooooo!

SvenSvenson
Jun 14, 2013, 02:37 AM
I don't understand anyone who says Apple needs an App Store or an SDK for the Apple TV. Both iOS and OS X already:

1 - Have app stores
2 - Have SDKs
3 - Can stream any content to an Apple TV

There's no need for the Apple TV to have an official App Store - all that Apple needs is for developers to start making more apps that can stream content to the Apple TV and to promote those apps.

Because if the ATV had it's own App Store,you could play games directly on the ATV with the new iOS7-supported games controllers without having to run the game on your iPad, iPod or iPhone and stream it to the ATV, with all the potential for lag.

You could even go out and buy an ATV and an iOS7 game controller and play iOS games without even having to have an iPad, iPhone etc.

Supa_Fly
Jun 14, 2013, 02:54 AM
Apple is a bit late in these specific API's .


Apple should also consider working with Unity along with Moga - like BlackBerry is doing.

http://devblog.blackberry.com/2013/06/blackberry10-gamepad-unity3d/

Some videos here:
http://devblog.blackberry.com/2013/02/blackberry-10-gamepad-support/

BlackBerry is baking in direct 3rd party game controller support in Unity.

And there internal developers have already demonstrated a few times connecting a BB10 device via MicroHDMI=HDMI using Bluetooth for MOGA controllers.

Still this is VERY good for the industry as a whole - not just the developers and manufacturers of both phones and controllers, but also for us the end users of various platforms.

Man ... I remember the days of S60 Symbian with that Zeemote JS1 Controller (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIDBq-88wtc). I still like that 1 handed controller of old.

Cheers guys and lets hope Apple speeds this development up before mid summer 2013.

----------

Come on, Nintendo. Just give up on mobile gaming hardware and make your games for the iPad.

Nintendo is not simply a software/hardware company like Sega was ... and it took Sega a LONG time to open up even 1/4 of their library to other platforms, so I don't wish this for Nintendo. Their still a toy company at heart to be honest but their going way to wild innovate.

donutbagel
Jun 14, 2013, 03:21 AM
OK, please not a knockoff of the XBOX controller. Not that it's a bad design, but that's so unoriginal.

----------

Considering that the 3DS is selling reasonably well and is way more profitable than the Wii U, I don't see why they would do that.

Pfft, 3DS games? The only good one is Mario Kart 7. I'd love to see GameCube and N64 games for iPad and GBC, GBA, and maybe DS games for all iOS devices.

Look at Pokémon Crystal. Nothing that Nintendo makes can play it, but it's still a good game (best Pokémon game IMO). Why don't they release it for iOS?

----------

At the rate that iOS devices get hardware upgrades, an iPhone could be more powerful than a PS4 before the next generation of consoles is over.

Maybe if this next generation takes a very long time. Battery power consumption is a big problem.

Zerilos
Jun 14, 2013, 06:05 AM
There are so many games I refuse to play with virtual controls. This device would make Apple so much money it's redonk.

Sol
Jun 14, 2013, 06:05 AM
Laughably wrong.

Laugh all you want but the iPad and iPhone get updated annually while consoles are updated at least every five years; longer if the current generation is a precedent. When you consider that the iPad renders comparable (to current gen) 3D graphics on a display that is higher resolution than 1080p and that consoles typically render 720p upscaled to 1080p, you can see how quickly portable graphics caught up.

NYhaven
Jun 14, 2013, 07:19 AM
I see what you did there.... Copy the best gaming controller on the market.

JaySoul
Jun 14, 2013, 08:12 AM
If Apple just put:

1) A decent processor in the Apple TV

2) Work with a few games powerhouses (e.g. Ubisoft & EA)

3) Make the system work physically (games controllers)

4) Allow online play with friends

They could literally take an entire segment of the video games industry. It could happen SO easily, c'mon :apple: do it!!

PS - Just let me play FIFA, that's all I ask. And buy out Nintendo for a laugh.

Namjins
Jun 14, 2013, 11:41 AM
troll harder. http://espn.go.com/espn/playbook/story/_/id/9233144/jon-robinson-ranks-best-sports-video-games-all

No need to be rude. You have your opinion and I have mine.

portishead
Jun 14, 2013, 11:53 AM
No need to be rude. You have your opinion and I have mine.

Yes, it's just that your opinion is wrong. Don't take it personally, I sure don't.

Bill Killer
Jun 14, 2013, 01:03 PM
Laugh all you want but the iPad and iPhone get updated annually while consoles are updated at least every five years; longer if the current generation is a precedent. When you consider that the iPad renders comparable (to current gen) 3D graphics on a display that is higher resolution than 1080p and that consoles typically render 720p upscaled to 1080p, you can see how quickly portable graphics caught up.
Rendering an image is in no way, shape, or form indicative of a device's processing possibilities. The iPhone and iPad are behind the PS4 and Xbox One by substantial margins in terms of sheer hardware power.

Namjins
Jun 14, 2013, 04:24 PM
Yes, it's just that your opinion is wrong. Don't take it personally, I sure don't.

:rolleyes:

.Asa
Jun 14, 2013, 06:28 PM
I'd love to see GameCube and N64 games for iPad and GBC, GBA, and maybe DS games for all iOS devices.

Jailbreak it, and you can do all that.

donutbagel
Jun 14, 2013, 06:53 PM
Jailbreak it, and you can do all that.

I did. The GBA and GBC jailbreak emulators work well, but the N64 one is terrible, and the GC one doesn't exist. And I'd prefer for it to be in the App Store, not a jailbreak thing.

memorabilia561
Jun 15, 2013, 07:52 AM
"They can start developing right away. The tools are very simple, intuitive, I don't think they will have any issues," Vassaux said. "There's a way of combining a hybrid of controller with a touchscreen. I think that's a perfect way of differentiating from other games that are out there, because there's going to be a period of time before everybody starts adapting the controller functionality."

blasto2236
Jun 15, 2013, 03:01 PM
Only for certain game types: even Lightning -> HDMI has a slight lag, and AirPlay (AppleTV) has even more (seems to vary depending on the type of action being transmitted). Fine for racing in my view, and puzzles and strategy... not so good for twitch shooters or ultra-precise platformers. (Although the game parameters could be tweaked to help hide the lag for some actions.)

I love gaming from iOS to TV, and would love a controller, but I'm realistic about the limitations. iOS is best on its own screen. (Which would make portable controllers for iPhone/iPad Mini very tempting.)

I think you're missing the point of the poster you quote. If there were an App Store on the Apple TV, then Lightning to HDMI or Airplay would no longer be needed. Which is why it would be gaming heaven for him.

Supa_Fly
Jun 16, 2013, 08:08 PM
OK, please not a knockoff of the XBOX controller. Not that it's a bad design, but that's so unoriginal.

----------



Pfft, 3DS games? The only good one is Mario Kart 7. I'd love to see GameCube and N64 games for iPad and GBC, GBA, and maybe DS games for all iOS devices.


Odd how you say "that's so unoriginal" about the controller layout then you mention GameCube in the next paragraph. If you played both systems GameCube originated that layout before XBox ... but its the most efficient for components and thickness/weight for mobile controllers. I'd hope for a flatter PS1/2/3 controller using analog sticks like the PSP but doubtful they'd have good longevity in such a small design.

I still hope they work with the Unity engine.

the8thark
Jun 16, 2013, 08:46 PM
What makes you say that? Nintendo has enough cash on hand to run the company at a loss for several years. Nintendo and Apple are a lot alike - neither of them will ever compromise of having control of the entire system. If its their software, it's on their hardware, and if its on their hardware, it's been approved by them if it isn't by them.

And this is why both Apple and Nintendo are a great platform for software/games. In Nintendo's case the WiiU was never going to be a hit like the Wii was unless it was another waggle waggle stick affair like the Wii was. I am actually baffled why Nintendo moved away from the waggle waggle stick the Wii had for the WiiU. I feel it might be to compete with MS etc. But bad move. Nintendo was never a competition for them. They were in their own semi hardcore/semi casual place.

Anyway having MFI is just like the Nintendo seal of quality. You know it's going to be good cause Apple have been over it and authorised it. And I'll give a thumbs up to the first person who hacks a MFI controller to run with games on OS X.

And I am glad Apple is letting 3rd party deal with anything gaming. Apple have tried it in the past and they stunk at it. Really stunk. And hope they never do it again.

SILen(e
Jun 17, 2013, 06:03 AM
And I'll give a thumbs up to the first person who hacks a MFI controller to run with games on OS X.

The Bluetooth controller is also meant to be used with OS X, no need to hack it.


It's quite obvious that this all is meant to be the first step towards games running on the AppleTV, because having a controller is the most important thing for running games that the AppleTV is lacking at the moment.

And adding support for controllers is also probably the most time consuming step to bring games to the aTV.

I think we can expect a new revision of the AppleTV in fall, with more onboard memory and probably an A6 or even A7 SoC.

I don't think it would take developers who already added support for controllers more than two-three weeks to also add support for the new resolution/aspect ratio of a HDTV.

Earlier AppleTVs (3rd Gen) would be limited to games that can also run on an iPhone 4, due to having only a single CPU core.
2nd Gen AppleTVs will probably not be supported, the GPU is just too slow to support the FullHD resolution.

As earlier models also have only 8GB of storage, people would be playing 2D games with lower storage requirements on them.

The new model will probably a bit more expensive (but i'd doubt it will cost 200$) and have more storage and will support better looking games, due to having an A6 or even a PowerVR Rogue-based A7 SoC.

The perfect gift for Christmas^^

Carlanga
Jun 17, 2013, 11:42 AM
http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/18r2ubdp9d2a0jpg/k-bigpic.jpg

Here you go from kotaku; logitech leaked controller.

Cougarcat
Jun 17, 2013, 12:03 PM
Is it me or is having a controller built into a case a silly idea? It's too bulky to carry round all the time, annoying to get in/out, and useless once you upgrade. I'd much rather have a separate controller like in the first post.

SILen(e
Jun 17, 2013, 12:20 PM
1. Two generations of the iPhone will look the same, so a controller will work up to two years with the most recent iPhone.
2. This way, you can use buttons AND the touchscreen, which would be more difficult if you were using a standalone controller.


But i prefer standalone controllers myself, due to problems with controllers also being cases when you are already using a case.